Talk:Kenya Airways Flight 431

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Kenya Airways Flight 431 article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on January 30, 2012, January 30, 2016, January 30, 2018, January 30, 2019, and January 30, 2020.

Africa: Ivory Coast / Kenya Low‑importance

	Africa portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Africa, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Africa on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.AfricaWikipedia:WikiProject AfricaTemplate:WikiProject AfricaAfrica articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Ivory Coast (assessed as Low-importance).
	Kenya portal This article is supported by WikiProject Kenya (assessed as Mid-importance).

Aviation: Accidents

This article is within the scope of the Aviation WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see lists of open tasks and task forces. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.AviationWikipedia:WikiProject AviationTemplate:WikiProject Aviationaviation articles

This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
Referencing and citation: criterion met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion not met Supporting materials: criterion met

This article is supported by the Aviation accident project.

Death Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Death, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Death on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DeathWikipedia:WikiProject DeathTemplate:WikiProject DeathDeath articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Disaster management Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Disaster management, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Disaster management on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Disaster managementWikipedia:WikiProject Disaster managementTemplate:WikiProject Disaster managementDisaster management articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

International relations Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject International relations, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of International relations on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.International relationsWikipedia:WikiProject International relationsTemplate:WikiProject International relationsInternational relations articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Nigeria

	Nigeria portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Nigeria, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Nigeria on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.NigeriaWikipedia:WikiProject NigeriaTemplate:WikiProject NigeriaNigeria articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Untitled[edit]

Who were the survivors? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.16.151.77 (talk)

I do not know - I would have to check the Kenya Airways archives WhisperToMe (talk) 23:10, 9 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
- One of the survivors, a Frenchman, was named.

Stuff[edit]

http://web.archive.org/web/20020220084617/http://www.biblesociety.org/latestnews/latest78.html says "Kenya Airways will transport the bodies of the dead Nigerians to Lagos."

I'd like to see if a newspaper article says this...

English front page archive:

http://www.webcitation.org/5zlrfLFQW

French front page archive:

http://www.webcitation.org/5zlreKFMw

WhisperToMe (talk) 05:13, 24 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Degrees of burn[edit]

The article talks about people being killed or seriously injured by 'first degree burns'. On pretty much any first aid course, you get told about how the burns degree system is counter intuitive- first and third degree burns are both annoying- it's just that first degree burns annoy you, third degree burns lead to your survivors being disappointed that more wasn't done to protect you. A translation check'd be helpful. Nevard (talk) 22:38, 15 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

That is potentially confusing, yes. To clarify matters, these people weren't scorched by burning jet fuel, since there was no fire. Rather, they were bathed in jet fuel which had not ignited. This fuel was causing first-degree burns due to its chemistry, which can strongly irritate the skin. The statements about first degree burns come from the source, the official translation of the accident report. However, this source never claims that these burns killed or seriously injured anyone; it merely mentions that the victims had them. (The article previously claimed that the pilots' deaths were partly due to these burns; I've just fixed this.) --Colin Douglas Howell (talk) 02:33, 30 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Archived references not used in the article[edit]

"Cote d'Ivoire: Scores die in Kenya Airways crash off Abidjan". AllAfrica.com. 31 January 2000. Archived from the original on 26 October 2013.
Mugonyi, David (13 February 2000). "Kenya: KQ body search to be halted". AllAfrica.com. Archived from the original on 27 October 2013.
"Cote d'Ivoire: FBI agents fly to Abidjan as experts ask...Was it a bomb?". AllAfrica.com. 6 February 2000. Archived from the original on 27 October 2013.
"'Plane had no snags'". The Hindu. 1 February 2000. Archived from the original on 27 October 2013.

--Jetstreamer ^Talk 13:41, 27 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Not A CFIT?[edit]

I don't see why the CFIT category was removed. After all, it certainly meets the definition-there were no malfunctions other than the erroneous stall warning, the pilots remained in control of the plane, and their control inputs led to the plane hitting the sea.76.6.158.127 (talk) 22:33, 4 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

You're right. I've reinstated the category.--Jetstreamer ^Talk 10:42, 5 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Pilots[edit]

Jetstreamer: what exactly do you want an explanation of? The section on the pilots is lacking important information: their names, and their experience. I added those. I happened to read Korean Air Flight 801 just before, so I modeled the section on that page, which I thought was well-written.

"He qualified as an A310 pilot on 20 July 1999" is clearly wrong as the cited source states "A310 type rating obtained on 10 August 1986". 20 July 1999 is when he was upgraded to captain. I don't know that the yearly renewal date of his pilot's license is of any relevance, it would only be notable if he didn't hold one. The excess of uselessly detailed information is making the paragraph hard to read. 147.8.183.28 (talk) 05:24, 26 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Copyvio issue[edit]

Regarding this [1], please see text supported by source number 8. You may also want to take a look at my talk [2]. Thanks.--Jetstreamer ^Talk 23:46, 1 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I have removed the copyvio template after carefully checking the source and making large changes to the two added passages (including combining them). I also note that the article was citing the report under three different reference names, plus several instances of simply repeating the citation. I've combined all except the separate citation of the English; I suspect this is exactly the same, but it has a slightly different URL so it may be a different version of the translation. This is my edit. Yngvadottir (talk) 05:22, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks!--Jetstreamer ^Talk 18:27, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]