Talk:Kostrad

Military history: Asian / Southeast Asia

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Indonesia Mid‑importance

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Indonesia cannot be said to have "liberated" Western New Guinea in 1960. It had never owned it before and the Dutch were arranging a peaceful transfer of the area to the Papuans. Whatever the rights or wrongs of Indonesian control of Western New Guinea, the terminology should reflect that it hadn't previously controlled it. Grace Note (talk) 04:58, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Takeover" won't do either. This implies that the Indonesians took over control of Western New Guinea from the Dutch. They did not. They did not peacefully acquire control. They invaded and dispossessed those who were in control of it. They would not have needed this particular paramilitary organisation is they did not, after all. This is described as a "conquest" in English. Any replacement term must include this concept. One can dispute the rights and wrongs of Indonesian control of Western New Guinea, but one cannot dispute that it took it by force. Grace Note (talk) 06:01, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Force was a component of the take over. But, there was also adminstration, politics, and international diplomacy involving other powers (to use my words). Was it all ethical, moral, just or legal? maybe or maybe not, it's not for us as wikipedians to judge, and our editing should reflect this. The point being that it wasn't force alone as the edit suggested (nor was it the same as the East Timor situation as many like to make out. For these reasons, this is indeed an improvement on "conquest" and "liberation", but not completely sufficient in my opinion. I will think of further refinement, if you don't do so in the meantime. :-) kind regards --Merbabu (talk) 06:14, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

On 15 September 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Army Strategic Reserve Command to Kostrad. The result of the discussion was moved.

Orbat as at 1999[edit]

KEKUATAN PASUKAN LETJEN TNI DJADJA SUPARMAN

SATUAN INFANTERI DI BAWAH DIVISI INFANTERI 1: 1. Brigif Linud 17/Kujang I (Cijantung, Jakarta Timur),

  membawahi 3 Yonif Linud:
  - Yonif Linud 305/Tengkorak (Karawang);
  - Yonif Linud 328/Dirgahayu (Cilodong, Bogor);
  - Yonif Linud 330/Tri Dharma (Cicalengka, Bandung)

2. Brigif Linud 3 (Makasar, Sulawesi Selatan), membawahi:

  - Yonif Linud 431;
  - Yonif Linud 432;
  - Yonif Linud 433

3. Brigif 13/Galuh (Tasikmalaya, Jawa Barat), membawahi:

  - Yonif 303/Setia Sampai Mati (Garut);
  - Yonif 321/Buaya Putih (Ciamis);
  - Yonif 323/Galuh Taruna (Majalengka)

4. Selain satuan infanteri, juga didukung satuan lain

  seperti:
  - Yonkav1/Tank (Cijantung, Jaktim);
  - Yon Armed 9/Pasopati (Sadang, Purwakarta);
  - Yon Armed 10/Nanggala (Sukabumi);
  - Yon Zipur 9/Para (Ujungberung, Bandung);
  - Yon Bekang (Cibinong, Bogor);
  - Yonkes (Ciluar, Bogor), dll.

SATUAN INFANTERI DI BAWAH DIVISI INFANTERI 2: 1. Brigif Linud 18/Trisula (Malang, Jawa Timur),

  membawahi:
  - Yonif Linud 501/Bajra Yodha (Madiun);
  - Yonif Linud 502/Ujwala Yodha (Malang);
  - Yonif Linud 503/Mayangkara (Mojokerto)

2. Brigif 6 (Mojolaban, Solo, Jawa Tengah), membawahi:

  - Yonif 411 (Salatiga);
  - Yonif 412 (Purworejo);
  - Yonif 413 (Solo)

3. Brigif 9 (Jember, Jawa Timur), membawahi:

  - Yonif 514 (Situbondo);
  - Yonif 515 (Tanggul);
  - Yonif 516 (Jember)

4. Selain satuan infanteri, juga didukung:

  - Yon Zipur 10 (Pasuruan);
  - Yonkav (Kepanjen, Malang);
  - Yon Armed (Singosari, Malang);
  - Yon Bekang (Malang), dll.

Source: [INDONESIA-L] SiaR-->XPOS: KUDETA S, From: apakabar@Radix.Net, Date: Tue Dec 28 1999 - 11:13:00 EST —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.63.247.68 (talk) 13:09, 10 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 15 September 2023[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. Per consensus. (closed by non-admin page mover) – robertsky (talk) 16:39, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Army Strategic Reserve Command → Kostrad – Eventhough current article name is comply to WP:ENGLISHTITLE. However the name of "Kostrad" is more commonly known, even in the English language sources, as shown in Google Trends data. Therefore WP:COMMONNAME should take precedence to WP:ENGLISHTITLE. Furthermore, WP:ENGLISHTITLE also states If a word or phrase (originally taken from some other language) is commonly used by English-language sources, it can be considered to be an English-language word or phrase, so this should also applies. Finally, please also look up, similar cases such as: Kopassus (not "Special Forces Command"), KOPASKA (not "Frogman Forces Command"), or Denjaka (not "Jala Mengkara Detachment" Ckfasdf (talk) 03:52, 15 September 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky (talk) 15:41, 27 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'm personally fine with it, though similar questions would need to be asked regarding other pages/articles such as the Kodam, KorMar, Koopsudnas, etc.

- EvoSwatch (talk) 04:04, 15 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@EvoSwatch: That's fair questions. based on google trend data: Kodam is more commonly used than Military Regional Command, Indonesian Marine Corps is more commonly used than KorMar, Koopsudnas is more commonly used than National Air Operations Command. Interestingly, for last one, Indonesian National Air Defense Command (pre-cursor of Koopsudnas) is more commonly used than Koopsudnas or Kohanudnas. And personally, I'd prefer existing those article names on WP, so I will not propose name changes for those three. Ckfasdf (talk) 05:40, 15 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Indonesia has been notified of this discussion. – robertsky (talk) 15:41, 27 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Military history has been notified of this discussion. – robertsky (talk) 15:42, 27 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support move as in this case the Indonesian portmanteau word (or whatever you call those short forms) seems to be more distinct and commonly recognized in English. As said above this may be true or not true in a case by case basis for other organizations. --Dan Carkner (talk) 15:50, 27 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Support Kostrad, based upon what I have seen, seems to be the more common name. Buckshot06 (talk) 04:01, 30 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.