Talk:Kvitel

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Good articleKvitel has been listed as one of the Philosophy and religion good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
January 11, 2011Good article nomineeListed

GA Review[edit]

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Kvitel/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Redtigerxyz Talk 16:13, 7 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for criteria)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
    The "clear and concise" part of this criterion is a problem.
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:
  • In Origin, where history of the kvitel is discussed, dates need to be added. Dates of Ari, Baal Shem Tov, the commentators ...
  • It was very difficult to read the article as there is too much jargon and I had to click each time to read about the jargon. There is much more jargon like Shabbbat, gabbai, tzadik, tzadikim, cherem, Hasidim, pidyonos, tzaddik (inconsistency of spelling???) ... incomplete list. Please scan the entire article again and Write a short description for the jargon. For eg. pidyon (redemption), Rebbe (Hasidic Jewish leader), the holy day (festival) of Yom Kippur, Hasidic courts of Europe -> European courts of the Hasidic branch of Judaism, The scripture Zohar ...
    • Thanks for your observation. The reason I submitted this to GA and not FA is because of the narrow focus of the article to a topic associated with Hasidic Judaism. I went ahead and translated a lot of Hebrew terms, but left the more common ones (Rebbe, tzadik, pidyon) with translations, as you suggested. Yoninah (talk) 22:23, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • the Western Wall para 1 needs references.
  • Give relevant page numbers for even Google books: give the publisher info, ISBN, author and year of the book.
  • Numbers 1:45 is a primary reference. Give a secondary reference like an English translation of the same.
    • I was just citing the verse, not the source. I put a Bible link in regular parentheses; the source is at the end of the paragraph. Yoninah (talk) 22:23, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

--Redtigerxyz Talk 16:57, 7 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

    • Thank you for reviewing my article. I addressed each of your points, above. Please let me know if there's anything else I need to do. I'm unclear as to why I didn't get a good grade on #2: "factually accurate and verifiable", as the article is liberally sourced. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 22:23, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Criterion 2: The [citation needed] tags that you referenced. --Redtigerxyz Talk 04:38, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I have completed my second read. Following are the things to do:

  • "Some Rebbes demonstrate an otherworldly ability to "read between the lines" of a kvitel and assess the petitioner's current and future situations." Not neutral. Reword to say it is a belief, rather it is a fact.
    • I removed this statement from the lead. Yoninah (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Is upper worlds heaven? Link it suitably. Use heaven if they are the same
  • "It was said of great Rebbes ..." who exactly? Names..
    • I removed this paragraph until I can find specific names and sourcing. Yoninah (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Checked online ref: it says "great Rebbes", so it is OK. No need to remove. --Redtigerxyz Talk 15:23, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Still some jargon remains:
    • Hasidim
    • Shabbat
    • tzadikim
    • ohel: grave???
  • Inconsistent use ???:
    • Belz / Belzer
    • Ropshitz / Ropshitzer
      • Done. I understand that a GA article must be accessible to a broader audience, and I hope I made the terms understandable. Yoninah (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Rabbeinu Gershom: add date and significance
Why was it removed??? --Redtigerxyz Talk 15:26, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
      • I just thought that maybe the section didn't flow. But it is important information about kvitelach in the Western Wall, so I'm glad you put it back. Yoninah (talk) 21:07, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

--Redtigerxyz Talk 04:38, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

  • Kvitel is principally a Jewish practice needs to be established in the lead sentence.
  • It seems tzadikim is a plural of tzadik. Establish that with an bracketed explanation.
  • Is Commentary on the Torah the proper name of Nahmanides's work???
    • It is in Hebrew, but I'll leave it lowercase in the article. Yoninah (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref 9: Shu"t Maharsham III, 225; 15: Taamei Haminhagim II, 90.; 16: Avir Haro'im (1935), 60.; 25: Israel, Rescuing the Rebbe of Belz, p. 221. Add publisher, author, year, ISBN
    • Regarding the Hebrew books, they do not have ISBN numbers, nor can I locate the books easily, so I simply cited the works which quote them. Regarding Rescuing the Rebbe of Belz, footnote 22 was referring back to all the source information in footnote 18. I went ahead and cited the book reference in full on each footnote; each link connects directly to the page number in question. Yoninah (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
When using a secondary source like Law and Custom in Hasidism, quote it as the reference. Not the primary source like Shu"t Maharsham III (read WP:PRIMARY).--Redtigerxyz Talk 15:42, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

--Redtigerxyz Talk 15:26, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

    • Thank you for the corrections you put in the article and your efforts to improve the article in general. Best, Yoninah (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Everything looks good. But before I pass the article, I will completely read it once again as a whole, but tomorrow with a fresh mind. Please bear with me. --Redtigerxyz Talk 15:42, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA PASS: Congrats. It was a good interesting read. --Redtigerxyz Talk 17:43, 11 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! Yoninah (talk) 17:47, 11 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
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