Talk:List of armed conflicts involving Poland against Turkey

Military history: European / Polish CL‑class

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This article has been rated as CL-class on the project's quality scale.

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Referencing and citation: criterion met Coverage and accuracy: criterion not met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met

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	Polish military history task force

Poland

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Turkey

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International relations

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European history

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Lists

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Class

Hello @Aszx5000, sorry to bother you, but may I know what I need to do to get this up to BL-class? The problem seems to be coverage and accuracy, although I don't understand how I could particularly make this better? Setergh (talk) 16:14, 19 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You could be there already. I am not fully familiar with the MH B-grading system. I would ask at the MH talk page and they should be able to do it for you? Great series of articles you are making, but I would think about using slightly lighter shades of primary colours and your colour might not show up correctly on all devices. Well done. Aszx5000 (talk) 17:11, 19 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Alright, I'll be sure to ask the MH page then.

As for the colours, they're the recommend ones for people that are colourblind (as in, people who are colourblind will not have a problem with these colours), therefore I won't be changing the colours. And what do you mean my colour won't show up correctly on all devices? If this really is true, how do I fix it? Setergh (talk) 17:26, 19 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Removal of 1497-1499 Moldavian campaign

Hello @Setergh, you removed the Moldavian campaign (1497–1499) from the article adn your reasoning was that it was part of a war. So was Jan Zamoyski's expedition to Moldavia and Potocki's expedition, why did you include them? Personally, I support including those expeditions since they could be considered as separate wars. You can't remove a similar expedition from the Ottomans just because it brings the stats of Polish victories down. In the article of the Moldavian campaign, you can see that it is considered a separate war (war of 1497-1499) which is part of the prolonged Polish–Ottoman War (1485–1503).

With this logic, you would remove, for example, the War of the First Coalition from the list of wars between France and Britain just because it part of the French Revolutionary Wars and Coalition Wars. Perast (talk) 17:59, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What war are Jan Zamoyski's expedition to Moldavia and Stefan Potocki's raid part of exactly? Your campaign is part of the entire 1485-1503 war, these two are their own seperate wars (or well expedition/raid).

"With this logic, you would remove, for example, the War of the First Coalition from the list of wars between France and Britain just because it part of the French Revolutionary Wars and Coalition Wars."

No, I would not as those are a series of multiple wars, hence the word wars.

And I'm perfectly fine with you adding wars, but in this case you cannot seperate this campaign from the whole entire war it is part of. That's like me adding the Great Turkish War along with the 1683-1699 war. Setergh (talk) 18:06, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, however I just wanted to highlight that the Moldavian Magnate Wars are very messy and consisted of many separate events, so if you're going to include an article that has not been created (Potocki's raid), I suggest including all other separate small-scale conflicts of the Moldavian Magnate Wars which do not have an article. Otherwise, I would suggest removing Potocki's raid. Thanks. Perast (talk) 19:25, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I only added Stefan Potocki's raid because I was certain it existed and knew about its result.

Tomorrow I'll try and find out some information about the other ones as well, although I just personally don't know a single thing about them.

"Otherwise, I would suggest removing Potocki's raid."

This is just nonsense though, you can't just remove this raid because others aren't added, and well, you're always free to add them yourself. Setergh (talk) 19:30, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'll research too. One I know is a failed raid of Potocki in 1612. I'll add this later if I can find a source. Perast (talk) 19:39, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That failed raid in 1612 is just the Battle of Cornul lui Sas which is already on here. Setergh (talk) 19:41, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, I see. The Moldavian Magnate Wars article didn't mention that as far as I know, so I thought it was missing. Thanks for including it. Perast (talk) 19:45, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It does, but for some reason it has the Polish name, Battle of Sasowy Róg. Setergh (talk) 19:47, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm trying my hardest to find the other raids, although I'll probably quit trying as there is not a single mention anywhere of the other Moldavian Magnate Wars. Setergh (talk) 16:03, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Removal of the death of Wladyslaw III from Crusade of Varna box

Hello @Setergh, you removed the death of Wladyslaw III from the Crusade of Varna box. How exactly is this unnecessary information? It's a war between Poland and the Ottomans and the king was killed by the Ottomans. How is that not something that should be stated in an article about conflicts between Poland and Turkey? Seems like a WP:NOV issue to me at first glance. Perast (talk) 18:01, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I personally don't think it is worth mentioning things like this, although if you are going to then also add about Abaza Pasha in 1633-1634. My mistake though, I just didn't think it was worthy of mentioning. Setergh (talk) 18:04, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well Abaza Pasha was not the ruler of the country during that war, he was a commander who was executed by the Sultan. In Varna, on the other hand, the King of Poland was killed. That is pretty major. Perast (talk) 18:09, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well, yes, although they were the both the main leaders in the war, so I figured you might as well just add both? Setergh (talk) 18:11, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, you can make that change. "Abhaz Pasha executed by the Sultan" in the 1633 war and in the Crusade of Varna box, "Wladyslaw III of Poland killed in action". Perast (talk) 18:17, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yup, seems perfect to me. Setergh (talk) 18:21, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

By the way, I read Abaza Mehmed Pasha's article in multiple languages (including English) and contemporary sources state that he was killed because he took bribes, not because of the Polish campaign^[1]^[2]

The 1633 war article states he was killed because of his role in the war, but it does not give a citation for that claim. I'm going to look into this further and add Abaza Pasha's execution accordingly if it really was due to the Polish campaign (though contemporary sources disagree). I will add Wladyslaw III's killing for now, as we agreed. Perast (talk) 19:12, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Go for it. Setergh (talk) 19:15, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

^ Peçevi İbrahim Efendi, Peçevi Tarihi, (nşr: Bekir Sıtkı Baykal), Kültür ve Turizm Bakanlığı Yayınları, Ankara, Vol. 2, 1982, p. 376.
^ Kâtip Çelebi, Fezleke (Osmanlı Tarihi, (1000-1065/1591-1655)), (nşr: Zeynep Aycibin), Çamlıca Yayınları, İstanbul, Vol. 2, 2016, p. 753

[1] Peçevi İbrahim Efendi, Peçevi Tarihi, (nşr: Bekir Sıtkı Baykal), Kültür ve Turizm Bakanlığı Yayınları, Ankara, Vol. 2, 1982, p. 376.

[2] Kâtip Çelebi, Fezleke (Osmanlı Tarihi, (1000-1065/1591-1655)), (nşr: Zeynep Aycibin), Çamlıca Yayınları, İstanbul, Vol. 2, 2016, p. 753

[1]

[2]