Talk:List of current United States National Guard major generals

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Title[edit]

@SmartyPants22:, I'm sure your aware of the other list articles, such as

and the new pages created for all the two-star ranks for each service, also with "active duty" in the titles. (I believe there may even be one-star in the works). Any objections to changing "serving" to "active duty"...?

Also, with regard to the "four-star" and "three-star" titles mentioned above, I wanted to ask why you went with "major generals" instead of "two-star generals"...? Was that by choice? Cheers - wolf 04:15, 23 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Thewolfchild: Nope, no objections. No particular reason why I chose it either to be fair. – SɱαɾƚყPαɳƚʂ22 (Ⓣⓐⓛⓚ) 12:59, 23 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the reply - wolf 14:41, 23 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@SmartyPants22: and @Thewolfchild: Here's my concern about this article title. When you use United States you're assuming that all of them are federally recognized two-stars, which some of them are actually not. Take for example Major General (NJ) Jemal J. Beale. Notice that there is a state in abbreviation next to his rank. That means that the New Jersey state governor appointed him to that rank in the New Jersey National Guard. National Guard Regulation 600-100 places all appointment of National Guard general officer ranks in the sole control of the state governors or territorial equivalent. The President appoints National Guard officers of Washington DC. The regulation allows an officer of a State National Guard who is appointed to a higher rank by the state governor (or in most cases a delegated state official) to apply for federal recognition via 10 U.S.C. § 12203 and 10 U.S.C. § 12211 (Army)/10 U.S.C. § 12212 (Air Force). In some cases, like the TAGs (11-3 within the regulation), they are required to wait one year after state appointment before they can apply for federal recognition in rank. From Beale's bio, he was federally recognized as a brigadier general on 23 May 2019 but he is not federally recognized as a major general. It leads me to believe that he hasn't served in grade long enough as a state two-star to apply for federal recognition. There has been cases where the Senate has rejected federal recognition ie Major General Matthew T. Quinn here in 2013. He was eventually renominated here in 2016 and confirmed. Second, active-duty is a misnomer. Many of them on this list have full-time jobs outside of the National Guard and only serve in "active-duty" part-time in their National Guard assignments. Once their active-duty is done (usually a few days to two weeks), they are deactivated and return to their civilian jobs until they are called back up again. Now that doesn't mean that many of them aren't on permanent active-duty assignment; it just doesn't apply to all of them. I would recommend replacing "active-duty" in the article title with "current" instead. Neovu79 (talk) 04:46, 20 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Neovu79: Thewolfchild actually contacted me about this matter a while ago, and I was neutral on it owing to lack of specific knowledge on what terminology was more official and/or advisable. This never crossed my mind. On that topic, what final title should this page have in your opinion, and should such precedent be applied to my set of lists (or leave my titles as is)? SuperWIKI (talk) 05:21, 20 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Given the info and sourcing provided by Neovu79, it would seem that changing this page to List of current United States National Guard two-star generals would be appropriate. As for the group of two star lists created by Superwiki, they are currently titled: List of active duty United States Army/Marine Corps/Air Force/Space Force major generals/rear admirals, I had suggested changing the "major generals" and "rear admirals" part to "two star officers", to be in line with the current "four and three star officers" list pages, as well as the other similarly titled pages seen here. - wolf 15:50, 20 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I would concur with Thewolfchild on this for this article. As for your other articles... I mean, you're not wrong either by listing the actual rank names, but if we're looking for uniformity through all articles, changing them to be two-star generals and two-star admirals would probably be the way to go. Neovu79 (talk) 02:56, 21 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Ah! Now I know why Major General (NJ) Jemal J. Beale never applied for federal recognition. He resigned as adjutant general in October 2020 as stated HERE. It's strange why the governor of New Jersey would select a colonel (Lisa J. Hou) to be acting adjutant general, when the deputy adjutant general and adjutant general are brigadier generals back then. Well, it doesn't matter now since she was nominated by the governor in May 2021 and confirmed by the state Senate... Ah ha, I do see that she was nominated for federal recognition to the rank of brigadier general on 20 July 2020 and confirmed on 30 July 2020 HERE. Funny how she wasn't officially promoted until 21 June 2021, when she assumed the office of adjutant general permanently, but it kind of makes sense. As acting adjutant general, she was still technically serving as joint surgeon in the rank of colonel. She isn't allowed to be promoted when she technically isn't holding a permanent brigadier general billet/assignment. Neovu79 (talk) 04:27, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Because brigadier general at the federal level is supposed to be the second-highest permanent Army rank one can hold, correct? Thus, to qualify, she couldn't apply until she actually held the adjutant general's position, which at the lowest is a one-star general's billet? SuperWIKI (talk) 04:36, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Correct. The rank of brigadier general is the second highest permanent rank in the Army. "Apply" would be the wrong word to use. In order to be promoted to the next rank, after she was confirmed by the U.S. Senate, she would first have to occupy an assignment that bares that rank, or currently be occupying an assignment that allows her to be promoted into that rank. The military calls this making "head-room" for an officer's promotion. Since brigadier general is a permanent rank, is she were to be reassigned to another one-star position, she would not have to go through senatorial confirmation again, since they already confirmed her at that rank, to assume her next one-star assignment. Since she was "acting" as adjutant general, her job was thus considered temporary and short-term, and she would have reverted back to her original (O-6) job if a different person was appointed as adjutant general. In this case, she would still have to wait to be appointed to a one-star position before she would have been officially promoted (date-of-rank) aka "head-room". Neovu79 (talk) 06:59, 24 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Title redux[edit]

@Jdaloner: Just above was a recent discussion regarding the page title and a move, but you've just moved the page again. Any comment? Thanks - wolf 13:10, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

He's done page moves on related lists that I don't mind, because I was planning to do them anyway but feared it might muddy my numberd-heavy work. I should have spoken up immediately in the case of this page though, since there was a discussion. SuperWIKI (talk) 13:56, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I hadn't seen this discussion when I moved the page, but I believe "[X]-star" is only appropriate in list titles that would be ambiguous otherwise (such as List of United States Army four-star generals) or are broad enough in scope that they encompass Army and Navy officers (such as List of active duty United States three-star officers). I moved several other pages as well, and moving this one seemed consistent with those moves. If there is an issue specific to the National Guard that causes "major generals" in the title to be problematic, then the page should probably be moved back. Jdaloner (talk) 14:56, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Peter Nezamis[edit]

Peter Nezamis retired in 2022. 37.169.159.67 (talk) 01:22, 23 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Mark A. Weber[edit]

Mark A. Weber was promoted Major General since June 1, 2022. 37.170.225.52 (talk) 10:29, 7 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Steven S. Nordhaus[edit]

Major General Nordhaus is now Special Assistant to the Director, Air National Guard since September 2022. 37.167.86.146 (talk) 09:42, 11 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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