Talk:List of military engagements during the Russian invasion of Ukraine/Archive 3

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 September 2022

"Kharkiv" is spelled wrong in the "Kharkiv Counteroffensive" row, that should be fixed. Ian Lautert da Costa (talk) 13:44, 15 September 2022 (UTC) Ian Lautert da Costa (talk) 13:44, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

 Done Madeline (part of me) 17:45, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

Battle of Izium Status Suggestion

I think the Battle of Izium should be changed to Russian Victory and subsequent withdrawal just like previous battles such as Konotop, Slavytuch, Ivankiv, etc given that the article for the Battle of Izium does say that the Russian army withdrew due to the Kharkiv counteroffensive. DeepCriticalThinking (talk) 20:43, 16 September 2022 (UTC)

However, there was subsequent combat in an around Kharkiv with Russian troops that did not escape in time. This is different from the more organized retreats in the North. I would however be in favor of referring to the original capture of Izyum as a separate battle with Russian victory, and the more recent one having its own page as “The Second Battle of Izyum.” This would be more correct. Wolf359Locutus (talk) 11:29, 20 September 2022 (UTC)

Already being discussed at that article's talk page and so far, editors mostly agree that there are no sources confirming a "second" battle took place (which is required per WP guidelines). As for the "Battle of Izium" article, its subject is the March-April battle for the town. Unlike the other battles where the Russian withdrawal took place a mere few weeks later, this withdrawal took place almost six months later. As per discussions/suggestions at the article's talk page, the recent recapture of the town by Ukrainian forces is mentioned in the article's aftermath section. EkoGraf (talk) 15:55, 20 September 2022 (UTC)

Battle of Lyman

Second battle of Lyman is a Ukrainian victory, RIA News (a russian news agency) confirmed that russian troops had to retreat SawRunner (talk) 14:25, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Indeed. Several articles have now confirmed that Russian troops have withdrawn from Lyman, making the Second Battle of Lyman a Ukrainian victory. Even the article on the battle says that the second engagement in Lyman is a Ukrainian victory. As such, someone with the proper editing permissions should change it. TheSaneWriter (talk) 16:09, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Battle of Davydiv Brid

I believe it's fair to say it shouldn't still be considered a russian victory. It should be changes to russian victory and subsequent withdrawal. Multiple sources are reporting that Davydiv Brid got captured by Ukraine on the 4th of October 79.131.141.179 (talk) 22:06, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 27 September 2022

In the table of battles, in the line "Southern Counteroffensive", the second row should name Kherson Oblast and Mykolaiv Oblast, but not Zaporizhzhia Oblast, as it incorrectly does. See the linked article 2022 Ukrainian southern counteroffensive, which correctly names Kherson Oblast and Mykolaiv Oblast as the theater of that campaign. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:cb:2f0c:858d:48e4:186b:3d6f:f3d5 (talk) 11:42, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

 Already done ~~ lol1VNIO (I made a mistake? talk to me) 16:17, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 October 2022

Change end date of Battle of Lyman to 1 October and result to Ukrainian victory. Source: https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-business-kidnapping-government-and-politics-cce973f2c43dc0d85883d46642fc970c Matthewberns (talk) 14:14, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

 Already done ~~ lol1VNIO (I made a mistake? talk to me) 16:24, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 3 October 2022

Replace Battle of Kremmina with Battles of Kremmina and add ongoing for second battle started on October 2nd. Aridium (talk) 01:56, 3 October 2022 (UTC)

 Already done: It was split into the first and second Battle of Kreminna. ~~ lol1VNIO (I made a mistake? talk to me) 16:25, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

Kherson counteroffensive

"Ukrainian victory" in the Kherson counteroffensive shows with the wrong color, it should be yellow instead of red (which is used to showcase russian victories as opposed to yellow for ukrainian victories) SawRunner (talk) 09:45, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 14 November 2022

In the "Kherson Counteroffensive" line, they used the wrong colour. Red, instead of yellow. Ian Lautert da Costa (talk) 14:13, 14 November 2022 (UTC)

 Already done Actualcpscm (talk) 18:06, 17 November 2022 (UTC)

Wrong sorting of "Battles" table

"Kherson counteroffensive" is in the table before "Battle of Bakhmut" and "Battle of Soledar", but probably should be after them 5.31.5.245 (talk) 13:14, 2 December 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 26 December 2022

This page is missing the Battle for Svatove Ian Lautert da Costa (talk) 09:11, 26 December 2022 (UTC)

 Done Lemonaka (talk) 13:00, 26 December 2022 (UTC)

Outdated results

Some of the results are outdated, from what I noticed at a glance Izium should be reclassified from Russian Victory to Russian Victory and subsequent Ukrainian Reconquest, and Battle of Davydiv Brid should be Russian Victory and subsequent withdrawal — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.65.87.199 (talk) 07:45, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

Battle of Soledar

Battle of Soledar should be changed to Russian Victory since even Ukraine has admitted it. Since you guys only care about sources as long as it Pro-West/Ukraine. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 16:01, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

Adding several more entries to the list

Battle of Huliaipole, Battle of Bilohorivka etc should be added Also it would be good if article was split theatre of operations wise Kapitan Siddharth (talk) 14:52, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

"X victory and subsequent withdrawal"

I don't really see the point of adding "and subsequent withdrawal"/"subsequent Ukrainian reconquest" to all the results of battles where things changed later. That's not part of the battle themselves, it's part of the aftermath, sometimes months later, which can be misleading. What's going to happen if a location changes hands multiple times? Are we going to add "and subsequent Russian withdrawal, then subsequent Ukrainian withdrawal" to the result? I think it makes most sense to just get rid of anything after the word "victory" in most of these. HappyWith (talk) 15:38, 16 February 2023 (UTC)

HappyWith, you're right and I agree, but I think that for now it's okay because it's not really bothersome and it provides more information. If Russia invades these territories again, I think it would be reasonable to list them like you said. — Nythar (💬-❄️) 09:49, 25 February 2023 (UTC)

"ongoing" should probably have RED instead of GREEN background color

using green for "Result of the battle" "ongoing" does not seem right. Thanks. 92.75.208.188 (talk) 92.75.208.188 (talk) 12:23, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

That would be problematic because there are other colors similar to red in the table, which would make it more difficult to read. — Nythar (💬-❄️) 20:17, 25 February 2023 (UTC)

Battles of Bilohorivka

There have been two battles of Bilohorivka. The article on the battles records them as two separate battles as well. And elsewhere on this same list we have separate battles in the same city listed separately, like the two Battles of Lyman. For the time both links could redirect to the same article but the two different sections of it.

Anyways, I tried fixing it but I couldn't figure out how to without messing it up badly, so I'll leave it to someone who knows what they're doing.

Also another issue is that the Battle of Bilohorivka are not in chronological order, even if it does just remain one item on the list. GramCanMineAway (talk) 02:15, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

2022–2023 Dnieper campaign

Should this be counted as a battle, or should the individual skirmishes be listed? Scu ba (talk) 14:51, 4 May 2023 (UTC)

Battle of Bakhmut still Ongoing

In the Battle of Bakhmut wiki page, it still lists the battle as ongoing, which should be fixed here, as Ukraine is still conducting counter attacks around the city. 72.229.242.36 (talk) 14:27, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

 Done. HappyWith (talk) 16:47, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

Internal Russian-Russian armed conflict

Sooner or later, the Russian vs Russian armed conflict may start becoming notable with sufficient WP:RS. What existing or new talk page is appropriate for discussing that and considering whether to start an article? The aim is to focus discussions in one place. Boud (talk) 14:12, 22 May 2023 (UTC)

I'd do it at Talk:Russian invasion of Ukraine, since there will probably be the most engagement there. HappyWith (talk) 14:14, 22 May 2023 (UTC)

Fair enough for a "central" pointer. Over there I've put a pointer to 2022–2023 Western Russia attacks and Talk:2022–2023 Western Russia attacks. Boud (talk) 14:27, 22 May 2023 (UTC) Which point to 2023 Belgorod Oblast attack. Boud (talk) 18:14, 22 May 2023 (UTC)

What about the naval engagement with the Ivan Khurs?

A day and a half ago, many reliable source media report, that a naval attack occurred on the Russian Navy ship Ivan Khurs by three Ukrainian Navy autonomous surface vessels. Russia military confirmed the attack. But Russian, Ukrainian, and various media sources differ on the outcome. Russia says they destroyed all three. Ukraine says one of them struck Ivan Khurs and exploded.

Either way, seems a notable naval engagement in the Black See, and worthy of being added to improve the article. N2e (talk) 23:25, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

You should maybe include Crimean attacks to battles

You should include tha Crimean attacks to battles epecially since theres Reports saying Special forces landed on the western shore of Crimea, near the settlements of Olenivka and Mayak, Ukrainian sabotage and reconnaissance group landed in the area of Cape Tarkhankut, shelled the camping on the seashore and fled in the direction of Odesa, Special units on watercraft landed on the shore in the area of the Olenivka and Mayak settlements,” HUR said, it is unknown what Ukraine goals was but it is said to be achieved,Unofficial Russian social media accounts have spoken of firing near a campsite at Cape Tarkhankut – the westernmost point in Crimea – before dawn on Thursday, also Ukraine has flew it flag over Crimea once again, HuntersHistory (talk) 06:35, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 September 2023

change battle of orikhiv to "Ukrainian victory" Slimebor (talk) 20:33, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Lightoil (talk) 07:23, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Sloviansk Offensive colored incorrectly

The Sloviansk Offensive outcome box is colored incorrectly, it should be yellow instead of pink. 72.229.242.36 (talk) 17:46, 15 October 2023 (UTC)

Change Bakhmut to reflect wiki-page for Battle of Bakhumt?

On the wiki-bo for Bakhumt, it states that in the city it was a Russian victory, while the battle 'around the city' is still ongoing. For the sake of consistency, we should probably reflect this in some way? Maybe by saying Russian victory but with a little footnote that says [fighting around the city still ongoing]? Genabab (talk) 11:32, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 12 December 2023

I request that the status of 2023 Ukrainian counteroffensive be change from ongoing to a Russian Victory or at least a Ukrainian failure as many sources have stated the counteroffensive as a failure especially the commander in chief of the Ukrainian military Valerii Zaluzhnyi. I will put my sources below so you can verify it yourselves, Also the Wikipedia page for the counteroffensive has it's status as a failure. Sources: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/11/us/politics/us-ukraine-war-strategy.html https://themessenger.com/politics/us-ukraine-officials-privately-say-counteroffensive-against-russia-has-failed-exclusive https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/12/04/ukraine-counteroffensive-stalled-russia-war-defenses/ https://www.businessinsider.com/how-the-ukrainian-counteroffensive-ran-into-trouble-2023-11 https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/11/12/ukraine-counteroffensive-failed-russia-putin-war-plan/ LegendaryChristopher (talk) 23:37, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Shadow311 (talk) 14:09, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

I was cleared, I requested that the status of the 2023 Ukrainian counteroffensive be changed from ongoing to a Russian Victory or at least a Ukrainian failure. I also provide not just once source but multiples which verified my request. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 15:24, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit extended-protected}} template. Lightoil (talk) 03:27, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

What consensus? I link my sources to prove my claims and used the "change x to y" format to have the status of the 2023 Ukrainian Counteroffensive change from ongoing to Russian Victory or Ukrainian Failure. What else do I need to do? Even the main page for the counteroffensive doesn't have the status as ongoing but just has a "see results" because unfortunately the editors who have control of the page are pro Ukraine and can't admit the many sources has the counteroffensive as a failure. Please make changes that I requested. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 20:32, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 22 December 2023

I request that the status of the Battle of Bakhmut be changed from ongoing to Russian Victory as the city had been captured by the Russian Forces for 7 months ago now. It doesn't make sense to have the battle as ongoing just because there is fighting still ongoing outside the city. It's called the Battle of Bakhmut not the Battle around Bakhmut. I hope that my requested changes are made LegendaryChristopher (talk) 20:41, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. M.Bitton (talk) 15:27, 23 December 2023 (UTC)

sources:

https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-may-21-2023

https://kyivindependent.com/russia-takes-bakhmut-taking-stock-of-the-wars-bloodiest-battle-so-far/

https://www.wsj.com/articles/brutal-battle-for-bakhmut-leaves-russia-with-an-uncertain-victory-29b56da7 LegendaryChristopher (talk) 17:16, 23 December 2023 (UTC)

Battle of Marinka

Is there a possibility of changing status of the Battle of Marinka from ongoing to Russian Victory or do we need to wait for Western or Ukrainian sources to confirm it? LegendaryChristopher (talk) 15:59, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

We would need some reliable sources, not necessarily Western or Ukrainian - Al Jazeera is a good example of a non-Western one. Also generally. we change the status at the battle article itself before changing it here, so you might want to take this up at Battle of Marinka (2022–present) instead. HappyWith (talk) 16:38, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Al Jazeera isn't a western source but it is Pro-West. It's also heavily funded by the Qatari government so it's basically state media. I would rather wait until an actual independent sources without biasness towards either side of the conflict confirm it. But I was just asking because anytime I try to edit something it gets revised because the sources isn't Western or Ukrainian. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 16:52, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Done.Mr.User200 (talk) 01:22, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

Undone, per my comments on the Battle of Marinka (2022–present) page itself. We should do further discussion there. HappyWith (talk) 20:35, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Status of the Battle of Bakhmut

I believe the Battle of Bakhmut should be considered a complete Russian Victory since the battle for the city itself ended on May 21 that means the battle is over ignoring what is ongoing outside the city. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 19:58, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

According to ISW's Ukraine map, Ukrainian forces still control a small area within the Bakhmut city limits, which means that fighting is ongoing in the city itself. I personally think that the Battle for Bakhmut should be labeled as ongoing, or at least (as Genabab suggested) stating that fighting is ongoing near the city. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 00:49, 1 January 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 2 January 2024

Remove the duplicate of the Battle of Marinka, and shade the Sloviansk offensive into yellow, as it is listed as a Ukrainian victory yet is shaded light red (symbolising Russian victory and subsequent withdrawal) Destructor of Capitalism 24 (talk) 06:27, 2 January 2024 (UTC)

 Done ARandomName123 (talk)^{Ping me!} 01:29, 3 January 2024 (UTC)

Orikhiv & Huliapole

Fighting is ongoing in neither settlements, with Russian shelling being the only thing to note. According to ISW's Ukraine map, the current front line is approximately 5-7 miles away from either settlement. Both should be labeled as Ukrainian victories, as the initial Russian assaults on both settlements were repelled. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 07:39, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

Unless you have any sources to prove that both battles are over, the status of both battles will continue to be as ongoing. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 20:29, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

This should be brought up on the talk pages of those respective articles. I've actually proposed in the past that those articles be drastically cut down or deleted altogether. HappyWith (talk) 20:52, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

No it shouldn't as fighting is still ongoing nearby each of these settlements. Same reason why the Battlr of Bakhmut was considered ongoing because there was still fighting ongoing l near the city even though the city itself had been captured by the Russian forces, the same should apply for these two battles unless there is sources specifically saying that the battle for these settlements are over it will continue to be considered as ongoing and the articles should stay as they are. LegendaryChristopher (talk) 21:38, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

In the case of Orikhiv we lack a source saying the battle began in the first place. SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 10:47, 23 January 2024 (UTC)

Where's Belgorod?

Incursions into Belgorod were small, but notable for being on the Russian side of the internationally recognised boarder. If was covered in Meduza English edition (Latvia based Russian language news outlet) and many others. Irtapil (talk) 22:02, 22 January 2024 (UTC)

I have added 2023 Belgorod Oblast incursions, 2023 Bryansk Oblast raid, and ongoing 2024 western Russia incursion to the list, on the grounds that they are military engagements in this war with their own articles. Some work is still needed to define precise start/end dates and "results". SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 13:22, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

Battle of Chasiv Yar

IMO it should be added 37.73.202.186 (talk) 17:37, 27 February 2024 (UTC)

You are welcome to create a page for Battle of Chasiv Yar based on reliable sources, after which it can be added here. SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 13:24, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

Results of 2023 Bryansk Oblast raid should be a Russian separatist forces failure

TheMilitaryHistorian1939 (talk) 22:35, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

Clear evidence of Wikipedia's bias

The fact that Wikipedia documents a huge number of battles in 2022, and then fails to document more than a handful in all of 2023, is clear evidence that Wikipedia wants to misrepresent the war in Ukraine's favour. Ukraine was clearly losing the war throughout 2023 and all the military engagements were Russian victories, such as each of the individual engagements in the Ukrainian counteroffensive and all engagements in Ukraine's Dnipro campaign including Krynky. Wikipedia editors appear to be trying to conceal battles that Ukraine lost from readers by no longer creating articles about each military engagement as in 2022, they are misrepresenting 2023 as containing almost no battles in the war but rather vague offensives and vectors of ongoing attack - an absurdity resulting from bias and manipulation. What kind of war contains a year full of battles deserving an article for each one, and then the rest of the war consists of almost no battles that deserve an article each? If Hostomel was a battle, then Krynky was a battle, so was Rabotino and the "Vremevka Ledge" all of which are catastrophic Ukrainian defeats and Russian decisive victories in the war. Every failed Ukrainian incursion attempt against Russia should also have an article listing it as a distinct battle Ukraine lost and their failed objectives. Redro7203 (talk) 12:09, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

User:Redro7203: You are welcome to draft separate articles for each of the engagements that currently make up sections of the 2023 Ukrainian counteroffensive article, and there may be a strong justification to do so, based on the fact that that article has grown to a size where WP:TOOBIG advises it probably should be divided or trimmed.

In addition to what you have rightly noticed regarding the 2023 battles, the discrepancy can also be explained by the overabundance of standalone articles that exist for the February–March 2022 stage of the war, including some that should probably be merged into other articles; these include a number of the supposed battles in the northern provinces, but also in the south. This is something I plan to take a close look at soon, so you are welcome to participate in the discussions that will be opened in the weeks ahead. Regards SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 13:43, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @Redro7203: — To add onto what SaintPaulOfTarsus said: You are welcome to create other battle articles if you think they need an article. What you think is a bias may, in fact, be just a lack of people writing stuff. You can write about it. If you have questions regarding a specific battle location or want help in writing any of these missing battle articles, feel free to reach out to me on my talk page. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 13:45, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

I completely agree with everything you said, the funny thing is they will tell you to make an article about the specific battles and yet when I try to do that they denied my article because they said it didn't have reliable sources even though I was using sources they they use to support any claims that Ukraine's winning the only reason they denied it was because I was writing a article about a battle that Ukraine ended up losing. Basically the only allowed articles about battles that Ukraine won or is ongoing even early during the war they were also making up battles that never happened just to make it it look like Ukraine was winning the war they only tookthose articles down afterwards because they didn't actually have any reliable source. It's also a hassle for them to even consider Russia winning any battle as you could tell by the reluctance to consider the battle of Bakhmut over or even a Russian Victory and the same goes for the 2023 Ukrainian counteroffensive that was obviously a failure but they tried to downplay it. TheMilitaryHistorian1939 (talk) 22:54, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

@TheMilitaryHistorian1939: Forgive me if this question seems dumb, but why did you say yet when I try to do that they denied my article? Based on your contributions, you haven't worked to create a battle article? Besides this discussion, you have a single talk page message on Talk:Battle of Bakhmut. You just had two editors, both who work in the modern military history realm directly with the Russia-Ukraine war say we are willing to assist you if you have a specific battle you think should get an article. I'm not sure why you think we are lying about helping you. For reference, both myself and SaintPaulOfTarsus worked extensively on the Battle of Kherson and have it as a current good article nomination. Note, that is a battle which Russia won. I'm not working to be rude here or anything like that, but I just want to ask the blunt question: Would you like assistance with creating a specific battle article (with the idea to create more after the first one), or do you want to just say Wikipedia has bias and not accomplish anything? Again, I'm not asking the bluntness with any rude intents. I'm honestly just confused why you seem to think we are lying. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 23:14, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

To answer your first question regarding my contribution I had another account before this one where I made attempts to write articles of specific battles where I was denied and in many cases I kept getting banned from contributing anything and afterwards my account was totally banned only because I criticize the biasness that many editors with administration power. I don't need help because I followed all the guidelines when making the article and yet it was denied for supposedly not having reliable source even though my source were acceptable by Wikipedia standards,when I asked for a follow up they just ignore me. I have no interest in writing another article after wasting all my time writing the one I wrote and it was denied for no reasonable reason TheMilitaryHistorian1939 (talk) 23:40, 28 March 2024 (UTC)