Talk:Mean Girls (musical)

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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 4 February 2019 and 3 May 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Adrianaah25.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 00:46, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Draft:List of Mean Girls characters

Contribute to this article here: Yours Sincerely, HarrisonSteam (talk) 22:43, 26 December 2017 (UTC)

Song lists

Per WP:MT article structure: "Multiple song lists (i.e. in the case of a musical which had several re-writes between productions) should be avoided: short-running tryout productions should not have a separate list, unless significantly different versions have each had multiple revivals and/or major, long-running productions." The DC song list is virtually identical to the Broadway list (except for some reprises), I believe that the DC song list should NOT be in this article and have deleted it.Flami72 (talk) 16:59, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

@Flami72: I agree with this. Do you think it's alright if I remove them now? Apathyash (talk) 14:20, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

Cast lists

Per article structure at WP:MT: "The names of non-notable (i.e., non-bluelinked) ensemble and chorus members, understudies and non-notable production team members (other than directors and choreographers) should be deleted. Only the actors playing principal (significant speaking and singing) roles should be mentioned. For the original Broadway or West End production, there may be a cast list, with notable actors bluelinked, or the casting may be described in prose."

Today I have deleted such cast lists for the second time. I remind editors (perhaps new) of the WP:EDIT WAR policies. I write this to avoid an edit war situation per WP:AVOIDEDITWAR. Thank you. Flami72 (talk) 10:54, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

Once again, various editors have added non-notable lists including swings, non-notable characters, etc. I will no longer edit this article, given the guidelines in edit war WP:EDITWAR. Just for the record.Flami72 (talk) 21:06, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

There has been a replacement to the second national tour. Justin Phillips has left the 2nd National Tour. Tym Brown is the replacement. Please update.

You can find info at meangirlsontour.com Calypsogene (talk) 09:54, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

Tym Brown is not a notable (bluelinked) person, so the information is not WP:NOTEWORTHY and should not be mentioned. Such links, btw, inevitably go dead after the tour is over, so it is much better to reference information about musicals to articles, reviews, IBDB, and books about musicals. -- Ssilvers (talk) 17:17, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

Original Creative Team section

Resolved

 – section removed

@Theatrepeople: I'm inclined to remove this section, since most of these people are mentioned in prose in § Productions. The roles not already mentioned (from Hair Design down) seem like they might not be noteworthy, though I don't have a strong opinion on this. But if we are going to mention them, I'd still rather add their names to the text in § Productions rather than have this new section. It seems more in line with the article structure suggested by WikiProject Musical Theatre at WP:WPMT/AS. Any objections? Colin M (talk) 17:17, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

You raise an interesting point. I do agree they are covered elsewhere but a lot of people are significant in making a show and all deserve due credit. I would argue it is information of substantial importance to the original production and if we are to credit the first actors to play the role we should give the creative team who realised the production equal courtesy as the information is of equal importance. What do you think? Theatrepeople (talk) 17:57, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

The principle cast are listed, including any notable replacements. However the ensemble are not. I'd be inclined to say the extended production team is too much and doesn't conform to the WPMT guidelines. If any of them are notable in their own right, then I see no issue in mentioning them in the prose.Mark E (talk) 18:20, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

I'm not going to give my opinion as to the usefulness/appropriateness for a table for creatives at this time. I do want to say 2 things that quickly come to mind: 1) any good wikipedia article will have, in prose, as appropriate per the guidelines, the creatives; sometimes it will be useful to add addional creatives not specifically listed in the guidelines for a particular show (puppets in Avenue Q or special effects in Aladdin for example); 2) wikipedia is not for "Advertising, marketing or public relations" (see WP:NOTPROMOTION).

More at a later time, but I do not, at this writing, see the value of a table over prose.Flami72 (talk) 18:29, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

I agree with Mark E's points. Whether to mention any particular member of the production team should, I think, involve a balancing test that weighs factors like: 1) Is the person notable in their own right? 2) Were they (or their work) mentioned in reviews or other press coverage? 3) Were they nominated for any awards for their work on the show?. In general, I think only a few major creative roles (book, music, lyrics, director) should be automatically included as noteworthy. Colin M (talk) 19:47, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

Broadway Cast Replacements Section

In the section for the Broadway replacements, all of the replacement actors/actresses are listed, though shouldn't only the notable actors/actresses (i.e. the ones who have pages) be listed, or are there different rules that apply here? Also, should the characters who have been or will be replaced be listed in order of who was replaced first or the importance they have to the plot? -Redandsymmetry (talk) 18:59, 17 February 2020 (UTC)

I was judging “notable” by how important the character is to the plot (so not putting ensemble replacements). We could ask in the musicals wikiproject to clarify if needed, but by blue link is probably correct. They’re currently in order of who was replaced first, which I think makes sense but we could change if there’s official rules stating otherwise.

Apathyash (talk) 22:11, 17 February 2020 (UTC)

Broadway Cast Replacements

Per WP: Musical Theatre's Article Structure guideline and the above discussions, non-notable (meaning no blue link/no wikipedia page of their own) actors are not to be mentioned as cast replacements in the cast list. Please stop trying to add them to the cast list. Future edits of that nature will be removed and directed to this note. Apathyash (talk) 14:18, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

Tour Cast Replacement

Shouldn’t someone add the the tour cast replacements? Such as Nadina Hassan, English Bernhardt, Lindsay Heather Pearce, Morgan Bryant, and many more? 2600:1017:B01E:CE35:EC73:D8A9:C052:D9C5 (talk) 04:32, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

Casting tables

As a reminder to anyone who reads this, casting MUST stay off the tables until the production in question officially begins performances. Many things can happen, the production could be cancelled, postponed, or recasted. Please read WP:CRYSTAL for further information. Smitty1999 (talk) 19:27, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

There is no official policy on that and you are the only one enforcing it even amongst multiple people who've tried to add it.

Either get consensus on a page by page level or discuss it on the project level. DeputyBeagle (talk) 07:02, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

@DeputyBeagle Oh, nice to see you again! Been about a year since the last dispute you created. You planning to fight this as well? Smitty1999 (talk) 15:40, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

I agree strongly with Smitty's statement above. In the Productions section, however, you can name notable stars cast in upcoming productions. -- Ssilvers (talk) 17:51, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

If you insist on pushing your way, yeah I'm gonna fight it. Get consensus. You've been reverted several times by different people so either get consensus here or on a project level. That's not an unreasonable ask. DeputyBeagle (talk) 10:15, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

@DeputyBeagle You almost got in serious trouble the last time you pulled this kind of stunt. This is not "MY WAY," it's what other users have done as well. Ssilvers agrees with my statement as well. Smitty1999 (talk) 13:49, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

That's not a fair reading of this. It's not a stunt and I agreed to leave the discussion on no consensus there, but you apparently took that as implied consensus to run with it. You seem to be single-handedly enforcing it - yes with support from Ssilvers who was the one who brought you into this discussion when we discussed it for BttF, so that's hardly surprising.

All I'm asking is for you to get consensus for this before enforcing it. I don't care if you want to get consensus individually for each page you want to enforce it on, or on a project-level, but either way get consensus. DeputyBeagle (talk) 18:09, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

@DeputyBeagle I am not the only one enforcing this. Ssilvers is the one who made it clear to me that we do not add casting columns UNTIL the production in question officially opens. After they explained it to me, I understood why and wanted to help implement and enforce this rule to make pages like this one better. That is why I brought Ssilvers to the BTTF chat because you gave me no other choice when proving the reasoning behind implementing this rule. Smitty1999 (talk) 18:09, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

• This is already covered in policy with WP:CRYSTAL. It hasn't happened yet, and anything can happen with the cast before opening night. There's no rush to publish this before opening night, so just hold off for a short period until the cast makes it to opening night. - SchroCat (talk) 20:27, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Right. As I have pointed out to you before, DB, the Productions section is the appropriate place for WP:NOTEWORTHY information about upcoming productions. -- Ssilvers (talk) 20:32, 7 April 2024 (UTC)