Talk:Michelle Fowler

Michelle...

There is no problem about mentioning this. She was an original character who is often mentioned: In 1996, Michelle is unable to return to Arthur's funeral because she was giving birth to her son, Mark Fowler Jr. She sends Vicki back to Walford in 2003 because she cannot cope with Vicki's bad behaviour. In 2004, she was unable to attend her brother Mark's funeral but sent her regards. Later on that year, Martin and Sonia visit Michelle in Florida for their honeymoon. In 2006, Sharon goes to live with Michelle in Florida after the death of Dennis Rickman (Nigel Harman). In 2007, Michelle could not attend Pauline's funeral, but she inherits all of her life savings. Later that year, Martin, Sonia and Rebecca go to live with Michelle for a while before returning to the UK. In 2012, Ian rings up Michelle to inform her about the death of their relative Pat Butcher (Pam St. Clement). — Preceding unsigned comment added by AngieWattsFan (talk • contribs) 14:47, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

The article currently reads "She gives birth to her son, Mark, in 1996, gets married and lives in Florida. She sends Vicki back to Walford in 2003 because she cannot cope with Vicki's bad behaviour. When Pauline dies, Michelle inherits her life savings." The information you want to add is that she did not return for Mark's funeral, she was visited by family, she was joined by Sharon, she didn't return for Pauline's funeral, family lived with her, she was telephoned about a death. We should generally state what the character did, not what she didn't do, so the fact that she did not return does not need to be mentioned. It may be notable that she did not return, as I seem to remember lots of mentions of this, but it should go in a relevant real-world section, not a storyline section. The fact that people visited her isn't important, nor is the fact that she was told about a death. Pat's not ever their relative, and she's not mentioned in the article so it doesn't need to be mentioned here. Martin and Sonia aren't mentioned either. She clearly had no notable storylines involving Martin - Martin didn't really become notable until after his recast, after Michelle had left. So I don't see why we need to mention them. That just leaves Sharon living with her. Again I don't think this is important. Off-screen events should be kept to a minimum, since they don't really happen, they're just usually throw-away mentions or some excuse to give another character somewhere to go when they leave. –anemoneprojectors– 16:50, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

I agree and have simplified the off-screen summary. Michelle not attending Mark's funeral is notable; Michelle getting a phone call about her uncle's ex-wife dying is not. Smurfmeister (talk) 10:47, 16 February 2017 (UTC)

Off-screen events

Michelle was an important original character and still has influence over storylines. She was a part of the Sharon and Phil storyline because she sent Ian to stop Sharon marrying Phil. Absence at the various Beale and Fowler funerals are important because she has been conspicuous by her absence. Also, involving Martin - she was regularly mentioned by Martin and Sonia as well as Vicki during the 2000s. It would be improper not to mention offscreen events - which DO happen and are relevant to storylines on the Square. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.246.133.253 (talk) 21:21, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

See the section above. anemoneprojectors 18:57, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

Main Image

Jenna Russell should definitely be the main image for this article. Regardless of if you prefer her or not. Going by the recent edit here, why don't we change the images of other recast characters to our preferred actor?

--TommyGiffen (talk) 13:52, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

I disagree that she should be the main image. Tully played Michelle for 10 years and is better known for playing her. Most notable should be first, not most recent. Nothing to do with actor preference. — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 14:47, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

It's a bit confusing though then. I get in this case, yes, Tully is the better known actress as Michelle. But if this is the case for here, what about other characters? Take Martin Fowler's recent 2 portrayers - James Alexandrou and James Bye. Bye has comfortably slotted into the role and is now viewed and accepted by Martin and has been chucked into big storylines in his 4 years: relationship with Stacey, supporting Stacey with her postpartum psychosis, parental problems, his and Stacey's split and currently, Ruby's rape. And then Alexandrou was central to many high profile stories too: his gang story in 1997, Sonia's teenage pregnancy and Bex's adoption and regaining custody of her, being stalked by Sarah Cairns, Mark's illness that lead to his exit and death, Pauline's exit and the aftermath. For some, it's impossible and there needs to be maintained consistency with layout, right? Grangehilllover (talk) 19:31, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

Well, for Martin it's tricky but for Michelle it's clear-cut. Martin can be discussed separately if anyone thinks the images should be swapped. There's also Peter Beale, Lucy Beale and maybe Shabnam Masood where the most recent actor did not play the character for the longest time, whereas the other recasts (with articles that have infobox images) are probably most recent = most notable. But for Michelle it's ~11 years of Tully vs ~3 years of Russell. — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 18:25, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

(Actually Shabnam's probably fine, and Peter has a different way of presenting his first three actors further down the page. Lucy's most notable storyline is probably her death!) — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 18:37, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

For a lot of newer viewers Jenna will be the only Michelle they remember. If we're going to do whoever has played the character for the longest then it has to be consistent. She played Michelle for three years.TommyGiffen (talk) 12:51, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

I'd say to keep Jenna as the main image. Yes, she has portrayed the character for the least length of time but if we change it for this character only then we really need to do it for the likes of Lucy Beale etc as well. If we only change it for this character then it's going to get confusing for other readers. Plus Susan Tully is never going to return, she hasn't acted in nearly 20 years! Therefore if the character returns in the future it may well be Jenna that returns to the role.-- 5 albert square (talk) 13:16, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

I personally think the most notable portrayal should be the main image and the second most notable should be the second image. That's why I keep reverting "updated" images when someone makes a one-off return, like Colin Russell (EastEnders). It just leaves Martin Fowler as a grey area. I also disagree with Sam Mitchell (EastEnders) having a 2016 image for the same reason, but I actually didn't revert that because it's the right actress, it's a promo image and I couldn't decide which of the other images would be better, plus the others were all deleted anyway. But, we could always do what The Doctor (Doctor Who) does and have all the actors as the main image. — anemoneprojectors 14:02, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

I'd be willing to settle for that AP. After all we have done something similar to that before.-- 5 albert square (talk) 16:46, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

Well, we didn't do it for the main image but it's an option. However, if the majority want Russell as the main pic instead of Tully I'll go with that. — anemoneprojectors 18:19, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

I would say that main photo should be Tully, but failing that, it should be a Tully/Russell combintion similar to Ben. Soaper1234 - talk 22:24, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

I think Jenna is the most notable actress to the current generation of fans, she should be the main image imo. Connorguy99 (talk) 00:58, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

Notability takes the whole character's time into consideration, so new fans vs old fans is not really a good argument to make. Besides, many people still watching now have watched EastEnders since Tully was in it and many who didn't have been watching Classic EastEnders with Tully in the role. Tully will always be the more notable actress for this role. — 🌼📽️AnemoneProjectors💬 23:24, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

Infobox images revisted

Bringing this to the talk page again after Adavid299 reverted my edit. Which actor's portrayal of Michelle should be the main image in the infobox? My view is Susan Tully, for two reasons: 1) she appeared as the character for significantly longer, and 2) the majority of the article (and its sources) concerns her portrayal. If the character as played by Russell was still on screen it would be a different matter, but she is not. U-Mos (talk) 06:11, 8 October 2022 (UTC)