Talk:Mumble rap

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This article was nominated for deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:

Keep, 6 February 2019, see discussion.
keep, 5 October 2017, see discussion.

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Requested move 1 October 2022[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Clear concensus to Not Move (non-admin closure) >>> Extorc.talk 06:00, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

New proposal Mumble rap → SoundCloud rap – while "mumble rap" is a common descriptor, it's also (pretty clearly) not a neutral term, as it's primarily used by detractors. "SoundCloud rap" works just fine as a WP:NPOV name. The lead sentence could be formatted something like this:

SoundCloud rap (also called melodic rap or EDM rap, and often pejoratively referred to as mumble rap) is a loosely defined microgenre of hip hop that largely spread on the online audio distribution platform SoundCloud in the 2010s.

would that work? — DJ (talk) 06:28, 1 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose The article's sources (especially recent ones) seem to use "mumble rap" more than "SoundCloud rap", and OP has presented no evidence that it isn't the common name. I'll also note that article titles don't have to be NPOV (WP:NPOVNAME); there's no policy-based reason to move the title. — 162 etc. (talk) 17:19, 1 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment: Would like to politely mention that I never said it wasn't a common name, as it clearly is. I was trying to gauge what people thought about moving it to a more neutral name. How successful that is depends on what the consensus opinion is. — DJ (talk) 17:47, 1 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  - Comment: The suggested name is less neutral in a different way, since it is a brand name. How do practitioners of the genre refer to themselves? Arlo James Barnes 12:05, 2 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose I actually got to this page through looking for a rapper that uploaded to Soundcloud, such as Yung Gravy or bbno$, both of who aren't mumble rappers. Plenty of Soundcloud rappers aren't mumble rappers. Mumble rap is an easier descriptor of the genre rather than Soundcloud. Naihreloe (talk) 13:13, 5 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Wiki Education assignment: Black American Music 209[edit]

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 23 October 2022 and 15 December 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): 4evafly, Mo.saeed11 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Sanjuuuurattu (talk) 00:33, 11 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Several issues[edit]

This article has major issues with claiming that "mumble rap" is interchangeable with other distinct terms that only have some overlap.

SoundCloud rap: The main source of this claim in the article is an opinion piece stating: "Also dubbed emo rap or SoundCloud rap, this is an offshoot of mainstream hip-hop characterised by quietly mournful or noisily distorted production, rapped over by pan-racial MCs whose aesthetic is of a skate punk given an unlimited budget for accessories at Claire’s."[1] This is not a valid reliable source but an opinion by a reviewer. Or should we add to the article that mumble rap is "rapped over by pan-racial MCs" too? SoundCloud rap should be a separate article, like emo rap is. More objective sources from XXL [2] and Pitchfork [3] include rappers such as 6ix9ine, Ski Mask the Slump God, Post Malone, Rico Nasty, Denzel Curry, Bryson Tiller, and A Boogie wit da Hoodie as SoundCloud rappers, alongside other rappers who have been derided as "mumble rappers". There is overlap, but they are distinct terms.

EDM rap and melodic rap: The main source of this claim in the article is a listicle stating: "Some call it EDM rap or melodic rap. But you probably know it best as mumble rap, a genre characterized by melodic flows and lyrics that are mostly indecipherable."[4] It's not clear who this "some" is because EDM rap is not a commonly used term. There is overlap between EDM and rap (See: Electronic_dance_music#Hip_hop) and there is EDM trap, a distinct genre. But looking up "EDM rap", I have not found any other reliable source use the exact term, let alone as an interchangeable with mumble rap.

Melodic rap has it's own category in the Grammy Awards. Looking at the recent nominees: there is some overlap; musicians such as Future and Lil Baby could be considered within mumble rap. But the majority are clearly not: Anderson .Paak, Kanye West, The Weeknd, Drake, Tems, J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Tyler, the Creator, etc. I think the Grammy's definition of "melodic rap" is more authoritative than some listicle.

मल्ल (talk) 08:08, 23 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"SoundCloud rap" listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]

The redirect SoundCloud rap has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 3 § SoundCloud rap until a consensus is reached. मल्ल (talk) 20:59, 3 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Education assignment: Hip Hop 50[edit]

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 31 January 2024 and 4 May 2024. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Egna389 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by KING162 (talk) 16:31, 2 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]