Talk:Murray Edwards College, Cambridge

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Nickname[edit]

Should we make some reference to New Hall's nickname of "Virgin Megastores"?

I've never heard of that nick-name - only the dome being called "The Breast". On another note, the university had more female than male students in the year 2004 as far as I know, so the claim that there are substantially more men than women may not hold true. --Wee Jimmy 02:12, 7 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No, quite common it appears. An all-female building at St Andrews has also acquired the nickname. Philip Cross (talk) 14:45, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Change of name[edit]

We have a new name!!!!! Murray Edwards College, hot off the press... President just announced it this afternoon. Will add a reference once they got some press releases Selkie upsilon (talk) 16:19, 17 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

They will have the new website up tomorrow Selkie upsilon (talk) 17:56, 17 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

N. Murray Edwards[edit]

Is the Murray Edwards of the name the same person as N. Murray Edwards? That article does say he has a son. Percy Snoodle (talk) 18:01, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Unrelated, the new college name comes from the surnames of the founder and donors. Philip Cross (talk) 18:07, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The only UK institution with colleges discriminating on the grounds of gender?[edit]

My editorial colleague Shakehandsman (talk · contribs) would like the Background section to say "...thus leaving Cambridge University as the only UK institution with colleges discriminating on the grounds of gender." S/he cites this 2006 news story in support. I've reverted this—here's why:

  • Actually the news story says "Three Cambridge colleges, Newnham, New Hall and Lucy Cavendish, continue to offer female-only education."
  • It doesn't say Cambridge is the only UK institution that offers female-only education. Maybe there are others?
  • It's wrong to call this "female-only education", since Newham College has male teaching staff [1] and so does Murray Edwards [2]. Students from all three women-only colleges probably attend lectures given by males, too.
  • So what we're really talking about is female-only residential and pastoral arrangements. I'm not an expert on this, but I doubt that counts as "discrimination".

I'm happy to discuss this here but please don't restore the statement until we have a consensus. Thanks - Pointillist (talk) 23:34, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There are no other Universities practicing sexism in their entry policies, but the source doesn't explicitly state that, so yes you are correct in that ideally we need a better source. I've found this: http://www.hero.ac.uk/uk/studying/archives/2007/single_sex_colleges__a_dying_breed__Jun.cfm Not only does it state the facts far more clearly, but it also puts all the issues into context far better than the Telegraph article and in much greater detail so seems perfect to me. I also agree with regards to making the distinction between sexist admission policies and compared with the total ban on men studying and working at Lucy Cavendish - the article needs to be clearer on that so my apologies there but I didn't actually realise any institutions actually banned male staff as well. The only item I disagree on is the discrimination issue - it seems pretty blatant discrimination to me and I'm not aware of any places being reserved for males at other Cambridge colleges in order to compensate. No doubt they call it positive discrimination or some nonsense like that but discrimination is discrimination regardless of how you dress it up and I think it is particularly notable if one of our leading academic institutions so oversubscribed and with limited places recruits many students on basis of their gender. I'll try to use a different term if people really insist on it but would rather not. Anyway thanks for your advice and input i think we pretty much agree on the main issues, this is a useful discussion to have as it has implications for several articles.--Shakehandsman (talk) 01:06, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It would be interesting to follow up on the admission numbers question. I might be barking up completely the wrong tree here, but weren't Cambridge's undergraduate numbers frozen by the government (or the UGC) at some point, while other Universities continued to expand? New Hall grew from almost nothing pre-1964 to its current size. Did it consume admissions places from other colleges (to keep Cambridge's total constant) or was it an exception (i.e. it added places that didn't exist before)? I'll look into it when I have time. - Pointillist (talk) 23:23, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm sure that is interesting but not exactly essential information. The places exist at the University and are not open to men, thus it is discrimination. Knowing how such a situation arose might be useful, but the main thing is just to get the basic facts right. I.e that they are the only University practicisng sex discrimination in the country.--Shakehandsman (talk) 02:22, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, I was just reflecting on your previous comment "so oversubscribed and with limited places", you know! - Pointillist (talk) 11:20, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Ok no problem. Anyway I'm going try writing the paragraph again using the new source now everyone has had a chance to discuss things. Once again, thanks for pointing out the problems with the previous source.--Shakehandsman (talk) 15:00, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It's an excellent source, well done for finding it. I'd emphasise that it is the admissions discrimination which is unique—the article doesn't explicitly claim that all universities have mixed halls of residence (maybe that's not tracked centrally). BTW, the full syntax for the citation is <ref>{{cite web |url=http://www.hero.ac.uk/uk/studying/archives/2007/single_sex_colleges__a_dying_breed__Jun.cfm |title=Single-sex colleges: a dying breed? |publisher=HERO |month=June |year=2007 |accessdate=2009-04-20}}</ref>. - Pointillist (talk) 15:22, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks I really should start formatting my reference properly though was hoping to find a way to automate it - by the way the article shows that Durham has a single sex accommodation block , and I'd be pretty surprised if other universities didn't have such divisions in terms of accommodation also.--Shakehandsman (talk) 15:34, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I've just tweaked that sentence slightly to keep the pace brisk. For simple references like that I tend to use my memory for the fields and Notepad as an editing buffer, but there are citation tools for more complex references, e.g. Diberri's citation tool and Magnus' MakeRef. - Pointillist (talk) 16:06, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Removed that the College was renamed legally on 1st May[edit]

This is still awaiting confirmation from the Privy Council.--Developmentmec (talk) 09:59, 22 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The infobox states that its Full name is "New Hall (until confirmation of name change by the Privy Council); The President and Fellows of Murray Edwards College, founded as New Hall, in the University of Cambridge (future name of the college, once confirmed)". On its website, the link formal name leads to an article stating, "...the final approval expected in about Spring 2011." Has it been approved? cmɢʟee☎✉ 23:42, 22 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

From what I understand the name change has now been approved by Privy Council. http://www.murrayedwards.cam.ac.uk/about/news/murrayedwardsnews/view/444 Selkie upsilon (talk) 07:20, 10 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

A supplemental charter was published adopting the new name - not sure of the date. http://www.murrayedwards.cam.ac.uk/about/newhallpublicationscheme/publicationscheme/who/statutes 131.111.16.191 (talk) 17:13, 18 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move[edit]

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Arbitrarily0 (talk) 01:49, 22 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

New Hall College, Cambridge → Murray Edwards College, Cambridge — This institution has never been called "New Hall College", though it was until recently known as "New Hall". It is now known in pretty much all day-to-day contexts as "Murray Edwards College" (including in all the college and university's literature). There are still some legal technicalities being sorted out regarding the name change, but these are adequately covered in the article. I'd therefore recommend that the article title be change to "Murray Edwards College". (But if anyone objects to that, it should at least be changed to "New Hall" rather than "New Hall College".) Govanoman (talk) 11:56, 14 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The official name of the college, at the moment, as seen on its website at http://www.murrayedwards.cam.ac.uk/about/history/briefhistory/ is "Murray Edwards College founded as New Hall" This version of the name, the result of considerable head scratching and consultation with alumnae, is the version that is presently being considered by the Privy Council. At no time, ever, was the college referred to as New Hall College (see, for example, "New Hall 1954-1972, the Making of a College" by the first President, Rosemary Murray (published in 1980 by Cambridge University Library for the college). Annmaltmanphd (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 11:49, 16 July 2010 (UTC).[reply]

  • Comment You can't seriously be suggesting we move to Murray Edwards College Founded as New Hall (which would be the version we would use per our Manual of Style)? We don't automatically use official names. We use the most common form in English. That would be either Murray Edwards College or New Hall. Skinsmoke (talk) 03:54, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • I would strongly suggest that the article title be "Murray Edwards College, Cambridge", as that is the name that is currently in regular day-to-day use. All technical details relating to the official name of the college can then go into the text of the article. This page title would also keep it in line with other Cambridge University college pages. (For example the official name of "Jesus College, Cambridge", is actually "The College of the Blessed Virgin Mary, Saint John the Evangelist and the glorious Virgin Saint Radegund, near Cambridge", but the name in day-to-day use is "Jesus College, Cambridge", and that's what the article title is. Similarly the full official name of "St John's College, Cambridge", is "The Master, Fellows and Scholars of the College of St John the Evangelist in the University of Cambridge", but the page is simply titled "St John's College, Cambridge".) Govanoman (talk) 07:04, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It is clear that “Murray Edwards College, Cambridge” is the common name for the college nowadays. Bluap (talk) 15:01, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment To clarify, I also Support a move to Murray Edwards College, Cambridge, as detailed on 14 July 2010. Skinsmoke (talk) 00:57, 20 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Qualified support. Is "Cambridge" part of the actual title of the college? If not, since there is no need for disambiguation of the location since there is no other article by the title Murray Edwards College, drop Cambridge from the title, and move to just Murray Edwards College (which already redirects here), per WP:PRECISION.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:58, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Alumnae[edit]

These women were blanked out in the list of alumnae: if there is evidence of notability any of them could be included.

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