Talk:Stop sign/Archive 1

Rather amusing that Quebec uses arrêt and France uses stop. knoodelhed 12:23, 2 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Yeah, I get a kick out of that too. If you dive deeper into the differences between the French of Quebec and France, there's lots of funny things like that how one has adopted the English and another has in a different way, or came up with something else. Mr Minchin 02:59, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Just out of curiosity, am I the only one who's called a rolling/California stop a "stoptional"? Azure Haights 09:15, Dec 4, 2004 (UTC)

I've sure never heard that term even after living 40+ years in the US Mid-Atlantic region. Spalding 15:17, Dec 4, 2004 (UTC)

I've heard them jokingly referred to as "sushi stops" (i.e. California roll). Triskele Jim 18:14, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Huh. Well, that's why I didn't bother adding it. Azure Haights 08:57, Dec 8, 2004 (UTC)

i've failed a driving test because of a california stop.::

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Before I edit: " Stop signs are most commonly found at intersections and crosswalks, and prevent collisions by creating a timed, sequenced flow of traffic. " Would someone like to explain how a stop sign creates a timed sequence? In the UK a STOP sign causes a car to stop. It will proceed when the road approached is clear. There is no timing or sequencing here. -- SGBailey 09:17, 2005 Jan 7 (UTC)

If you are close enough down the road after a stop sign, there will be space between cars, useful if you want to turn into the traffic stream or cross it (either on foot or in a car) Mr Minchin 02:59, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

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And again: " Stop signs are not generally required at any intersection, but often help to control traffic at some relatively quiet but dangerous intersections. " What does this mean? I assume: " Stop signs are generally installed where a minor road meets a more major road or at otherwise potentially dangerous intersections. " --- SGBailey 09:24, 2005 Jan 7 (UTC)

A stop sign will force you to stop, and give you a moment to then figure out what's going on before you enter the intersection. Sometime you run across intersections where it isn't until you're right upon them that you realize you can see what coming on the other road, or that they can't see you until you're almost at the stop sign. Mr Minchin 02:59, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

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Changed caption Stop sign used in the UK prior to c. 1980
The sign illustrated is that formerly used in most European countries. A similar sign was used in the UK 1964 - 1975, but was different from the continental version in that the word STOP was much larger and interrupted the triangle. -- Picapica 11:11, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

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Removed stuff about ships and planes -- not really relevant to road traffic signs.

Isn't it relevant to the history of the stop sign? I'm almost certain that's where the "yield to the car on your right" rule comes from. I didn't add it because it is similar, I added it to show the root of the rule.--Ben 01:44, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Well, it's a theory, but I am sceptical that there is any more than a coincidental connection between stand-on/give-way rules at sea, navigation-light codes, the stop/go meanings of red and green, and the rules for driving on the highway -- especially since international navigation rules are basically those laid down in the 19th century by the major seafaring nation at the time, Great Britain, where the rule of the road was "keep left"! (see [1]). -- Picapica 17:17, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

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Article needs sorting out to indicate more clearly what are the features peculiar to US/Canada practice, e.g. 3-/4-way stops (unknown in most of the world) and the proliferation of stop signs (in Europe, at least, stop signs are used far more sparingly -- at dangerous junctions where a real stop is essential -- on the good principle that "familiarity breeds contempt").

Also agree with points made above by SGBailey.

Another one for my to-do list! -- Picapica 12:30, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

OK. Done it. -- Picapica 13:45, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Well, now you're generalizing a bit more in the other direction. "Europe" doesn't use stop signs sparingly: some parts of Europe do. In Greece, usage is more similar to the US/Canadian usage. --Delirium 09:25, May 27, 2005 (UTC)

Interesting historical article to check to see if anything pertinent can be added here: Happy Birthday Stop Sign!

Thanks for the tip, Ben. Some of the facts are misleadingly telescoped in places, though (e.g. G. Morgan did indeed patent a traffic signal in 1923, but not the 1913 Cleveland signals: those were invented and patented by J. Hoge). And I think the skull-and-crossbones theory for RR crossings is pushing it a bit: why not just "a cross to represent a crossing"? (The St Andrews cross shape to warn of rail crossing road has a very long history in Europe too.) -- Picapica 09:18, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Why is the word "Alto" used in spain and mexico when the word "alto" is translated to high?

Alto also means "halt" or "stop". I'm not an expert in Spanish, so I couldn't tell you the reason/origin, but there are plenty of homonyms in English as well: bat & bat come to mind.

Uhm... in Spain, as in the whole European Union, «STOP» is used now and ever. Never saw an «ALTO» signal in Spain, neither hear about them. And, yes... «alto» means "halt", and is used, for example when a policeman wants you to "freeze". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.39.125.16 (talk) 18:25, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

uturns?

Can you u-turn at a four-way stop? It seems like kind of a dangerous thing to do with other cars at the stop since other drivers might not expect it.

Theoretically, there should be only one vehicle in the intersection at a time, so I don't see that there'd be a problem with a u-turn. Having said that, I don't recall ever seeing anybody making one. Woden325 17:25, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Rules like that vary by juristiction. In Alberta, I believe the rule is that you can preform a U-turn at any intersection, unless it's signalized (i.e. it's at a set of lights) or there's a sign prohibing the manouver. Mr Minchin 02:59, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Argentina

The ignore bit doesn't seem all that neutral...

Agreed. I removed the following sentence due to that: "(Stop signs are almost universally ignored in Argentina; at best, drivers slow down a bit.)" --JoeTrumpet 02:47, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

ALL WAY and 4-WAY are both allowed, 4-way is actually the primary standard

Please see the MUTCD: [2]. --Coolcaesar 21:31, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Bulgarian/Serbian variant

I removed the Bulgarian variant since we use the English one and we have used it as far back as I can remember. Also I'm not sure about the Serbian, but at least in Bulgarian the word may have initially been just a transliteration, but has long since become a common word in the language and there is even a verb derived from the noun. --Dedd-morozz 12:37, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

For how long has "STOP" been used in Bulgaria and other eastern European countries? What was used during the communist era? -- BIL 11:00, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

two-way stop sign

What is the right-of-way rule in this situation?

• intersection of an east-west highway and smaller north-south cross streets.
• The north south cross streets have stop signs (a 2-way stop)
• Driver1, approaching from the south, arrives first. He wants to make a left turn
• Driver2, approaching from the north, arrives next. He wants to go straight through.
• Traffic on the highway finally clears out and it is safe for the north-south traffic to proceed.
• Who gets to go first, Driver1 or Driver2? Some argue Driver1 can go first because he got there first. Some argue that Driver1 must yield to Driver2 because Driver1 is making a left turn.

Is this the right place to ask this question? Anyway, New York State traffic law says left turns must yeild to throught or right-turning traffic. Check the traffic law where you live. Triskele Jim 18:09, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

NB - Two-Way STOP above; On a prima facie basis, the vehicle turning should wait for the other driver to proceed. One does not turn in front of other traffic generally. (LHD or RHD in your locale?). Not knowing where you are, I suggest you visit the transport website in your jurisdiction and download its "driver manual"; this will or should impart the regulations applying your-end, and are typically Pdf. The regulations in turn will 'mirror' the UN Convention on Road Traffic, if your country is a contracting party. -JP, Mot Adv-NSW, AUS

Again, rules change by juristiction. In Alberta, the rule I was taught was the first one to pull up to the stop sign is the first one to go, so in your case, Driver 1, because he pulled up first. But in any case, having the right of way won't help you much if you ignore what the traffic around you is REALLY doing, and you get hit... Mr Minchin 02:59, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

In relation road traffic signs

Scribes need reminding sometimes that most road traffic signs are described in both legal meaning and physical design parameter in the "United Conventions on Road Traffic, Road Signs and Signals".

Contracting states parties are then required to use signs with the same lawful intent and physical design on their road network. Obviously, some signs are 'optional' for use, but that would be blindingly obvious!

As we appreciate, countries and states within nations usually manage and implement road traffic signs via "MUTCD", "Standards", or "Road Design Guidelines".

Regardless, international road traffic signs belong to the international community, and therefore national legislation governing their use *must* conform to the meaning held in the Convention.

This Convention is constantly being updated.

Stop War/Bush

"Stop signs are often vandalized in protest-related ways. For example, the words "War" and "Bush" have been spray-painted on them, giving the meaning "Stop Bush" or "Stop War".[citation needed]"

FWIW, I have seen this numerous times around Minneapolis, Minnesota. Don't know if I can come up with a citable reference, though. --Strait 21:37, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

They also appear in Michigan and Ohio. --Anonymous 12:10, 22 September 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.93.53 (talk)

I've also seen "conforming" added to stop signs in Colorado Springs, Colorado. At one point the local ran some stories about the criminal nature of tampering with the signs, but I don't have a reference to hand. Even with one, this seems unnecessarily anecdotal for an encyclopedic entry on the traffic control device.--Woden325 21:23, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

The usual stop sign addition in Australia a few years ago was a "US Aggression" sticker. FiggyBee 07:18, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

While "Stop Bush" might be new, "Stop War" certainly isn't. Abbie Hoffman advocated adding "War" to stop signs in Steal This Book. Kingadrock (talk) 07:55, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

HALT!

Curious that there isn't a picture of a stop sign that reads "halt."

things your not allowed to do at a stop sign is not to cross it without stopping, removing it where it should be, drawing graffiti on it, putting it where it does not belong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.12.0.130 (talk) 21:45, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

phonetics

Should the phonetical pronunciation of non-Roman-alphabet signs be added? For example, the Japanese is pronounced tO-ma-ray (romanized spelling would be tomare).