Talk:Vuvuzela

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Disputed information[edit]

Information in the "Origin" section of this article about plastic vuvuzelas is disputed. I have a yellow one which was purchased from a souvenir stand at Chicago's Soldier Field prior to a United States men's national team match against AC Milan in June 1991. The manufacture & mass-marketing of plastic vuvuzelas predates the 1990s and didn't begin either in that decade or the next one as currently implied in this article. There is a good chance that the information in the reference sources are really inaccurate. Much more research is needed for this piece to attain acceptable Wikipedia standards. The Ink Daddy! (talk) 23:09, 1 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Agreed. I have been using these in soccer matches (and sports events in general) in Brazil for decades (at least the 80's). In Brazil they are called "Corneta" (horn), and the construction and design is pretty much identical to what is shown in the article picture. Maybe a case of local pride prior to the world cup, trying to credit the creating of this iconic soccer instrument to the host country? Quase (talk) 13:49, 3 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Can you find a reference? I did find a picture on an internet shop, but that's not really suitable as a reference. http://ciudadcotillon.com.ar/eshop/index.php?page=shop.product_details&product_id=413&flypage=flypage.tpl&pop=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=53 Zaian (talk) 19:56, 3 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
These plastic horns have been at American football and baseball games since at least back to when I was a kid in the 1970s. Hard to find a quotable reference via google though (might actually have to go to a library... gasp). If you do a Google Book search for '"long plastic horns" fans' you will find a hint of references in the book The year I owned the Yankees: a baseball fantasy written in 1990 and a 1975 Time Magazine article about a Reagan political rally, however, neither have enough preview text available. It would be really hand to find a sports souvenir catalog from the 70s or 80s. —Noah 06:43, 10 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
These things are likely as old as plastic itself. A high school friend of mine had one in the 1980s, I think from a Toronto Argonauts game. No proof because I didn't think a plastic horn was noteworthy enough to photograph - but in North America they definitely predate 2001 by several decades. Even the South African manufacturer claims an American origin: http://www.boogieblast.co.za/#truthvuvu 99.230.231.234 (talk) 20:12, 10 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I am still in possession of a red plastic vuvuzela purchased during first night festivities in Boston, MA, USA in the mid-1980's. While it has no year markings, it is marked with "Made in the U.S.A." on its side.Zclone (talk) 16:06, 1 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have attached a link to an image available for purchase at getty images http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/81452390/Sports-Illustrated showing fans at the 1964 World series blowing these plastic horns. These were banned at most major league parks, because of the noise. These could be purchased in Woolworth stores and 5 and dime stores. 69.121.122.126 (talk) 14:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC) 14:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC)14:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC)14:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC)~[reply]

Nice find! Unfortunately, we cannot add copyrighted images to Wikipedia, but this is useful information. Do you have a reference for the horns being banned in major league parks in the 1960s? That would be a great thing to add to the article. Tim Pierce (talk) 16:35, 12 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia cannot add the image (although it may be that Getty will give permission to use a reduced-resolution version if somoene asks nicely) but we certainly can use it as a reference and remove the clams that it was invented (or that the first plastic version was introduced) after 1964. Guy Macon 16:24, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"...and emits a loud monotone B-flat" is a little misleading, as other harmonics are easily played with a reasonably strong embouchure. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.68.36.123 (talk) 15:55, 13 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm, but only a little misleading. Most of the fans playing them do not seem terribly interested in exploring the upper reaches of this (ahem) wonderful instrument's wide range, so actually the monotone Bb is pretty much what we hear. I am note being greatly troubled by harmonics numbered =>2 when I hear it on the televisual apparatus. So if its, er, emissions need characterising for the purposes of this article, I honestly think that does it pretty well. People wanting to read about the physics of trumpet playing, lip-vibrated aerophones in general and performing Bach on plastic instruments may well want to click on a few links to get them out of SA football stadia! :) Best wishes DBaK (talk) 16:55, 13 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Couldn't that fact be made clearer at some point in the article? I've been trying to find out, out of curiosity, if the vuvuzela can be played as a natural horn or if, for some reason (length/construction/limitations of human embouchure) it could only produce a B♭3. Laogeodritt [ Talk | Contribs ] 22:30, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
yes maybe it should. I did make these recordings available:
- but they've not really caught anyone's interest on en.wiki much. The other problem is that while the recordings speak for themselves I can't, because that's WP:OR so we'd need a citeable source talking about it. But, just so you know, even if we can't find a source, yes it works like a natural trumpet but it is too much of a mess and starts too high to do much with it. Harmonics 1, 2 and 3 are OK but from 4 on (please see above) you start to lose it a bit - certainly on the one I was playing! I think I bang on about this somewhere else on this page too (oh yes, under the subhead "do re mi") ... best wishes DBaK (talk) 22:56, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

On the early history: These things existed in this form at least in 1966. In high school we bought pretty much exactly what's shown in the picture (orange plastic straight horn about 3 ft long), at nearby college's (American) football games. (Amherst College in Mass.) They sounded just like we hear on TV now, though we only blew them when it was appropriate to cheer. Since I moved from there in the summer of '67, they at least were there in the fall of '66. Urbanaokie (talk) 04:42, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I owned one of these in the early 1970's in the USA. I am pretty sure I got it at a high school football game. It was virtually identical to the red one in the picture. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.231.17.190 (talk) 12:29, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

On the comment under 'Critism' saying "A vuvuzela manufacturer began selling earplugs to spectators" with reference to article 29. Please note that the article in itself is flawed, and that Masincedance Sport, the manufacturer, partnered with a South African development agency, Uthango Social Investments, to add earplugs to the vuvuzelas. The initiative is detailed at http://www.vuvuzelaunplugged.com - So it may be more accurate to say, "A vuvuzela manufacturer partnered with a South African development agency to provide earplugs to spectators". —Preceding unsigned comment added by MetaMeerkat (talk • contribs) 07:33, 26 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I thought about deleting that sentence because I don't see where it fits anywhere. That sentence doesn't specify the manufacturer, so I don't see why the proposed text should be included in article. It's also best to keep it as simple as possible. Here's my question: does Masincedance Sport sell earplugs? Yes or no? Or perhaps the word sell should be changed to distribute? What are your thoughts? Thanks,  Davtra  (talk) 08:05, 26 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Will revert with an answer as soon as possible. At the moment, it is widely reported in the media that Masincedance Sport sells earplugs. Believe it is part of the vuvuzela story in South Africa. —Preceding unsigned comment added by MetaMeerkat (talk • contribs) 12:03, 27 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"Kudu horn instruments"[edit]

Is there verfiable information that clearly links kudu horn instruments with vuvuzelas? The current citation seems to be a throwaway reference in a medical journal. Especially since vuvuzelas became popular in the 1990's and the use of these kudu horn instuments probably ceased long before. On the other had the "Saddam" Maake story seems well attested. While I would trust a medical journal for information on medicine, its use as a citation for musical history or anthropology seems shaky.Park3r (talk) 14:03, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I see what you mean. The journal doesn't go into depth about its origin and connection. I can't find any published sources regarding this issue. A book Get Kick Out of Read: It's a Funny Game by Sean Fraser and Hilton Sarukunda (available on Google Books) says many people believe that the vuvuzela was started as a kudu horn. And the first modern version was created out of tin (I think this is where Maake's story now comes in). However, its origin and connection is still unclear. I think the word believe should be used in article. For example, It is believed that the vuvuzela was inspired by the kudu horn that was traditionally used ...  Davtra  (talk) 00:16, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
This idea just popped into my head. We could email the corresponding author where he got this information from. His email address is published on those papers.  Davtra  (talk) 03:00, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

You also marked this sentence Many types of vuvuzela, made by several manufacturers, may produce varying intensity and frequency outputs as an inaccurate statement. What is your concern? Thanks,  Davtra  (talk) 00:31, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have removed that tag (the other one remains). Park3r (talk) 12:04, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"Neutrality disputed"?[edit]

Is this template at the top of the article, dated July 2012, still justified? I see one single sentence "Traditionally made and inspired from a kudu horn, the vuvuzela was used to summon distant villagers to attend community gatherings" tagged with "[dubious – discuss]". That's hardly an entire article, is it? Martinevans123 (talk) 20:42, 3 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

NPOV[edit]

The "Reception" part is clearly written by people who dislike the vuvuzela; event organizers and broadcasters and the like. The popularity of the vuvuzela should also be addressed in order to maintain a neutral point of view. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.73.138.241 (talk) 05:56, 3 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

This article appears to contradict itself[edit]

Citation for monotony - uncited claim in section on music that it is not monotonousEugene-elgato (talk) 16:03, 31 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The typical sports fan is only going to be able or willing to produce one note with one of these. I had one which I bought at and used at a local minor league hockey team's games. Possibly a trained brass instrument player could produce other tones, but I never could. They are thus used as a monotonous noise maker rather than as a melody maker. Wschart (talk) 16:00, 26 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Stadium horn[edit]

In 1967 or 1968 these horns were used at univ of Missouri football games. They were such a distraction because of their numbers that they were banned. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.250.171.172 (talk) 00:32, 11 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Musical instrument?[edit]

The article refers (in the sidebar and categories) to the vuvuzela as a 'brass instrument' however never actually provides any examples of it being used as a musical instrument, instead only explaining its usage as a general noisemaker for sports games, protests and attracting attention, without any musical/melodious purpose. Also, giving its extremely loud nature and that the article mentions that frequency varies depending on manufacturer, it doesn't seem very practical for music making. Given that, does anyone have any examples of it being used in music and, if not, is it really accurate to call it a musical instrument? Baqeua (talk) 10:53, 6 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

[1]? Martinevans123 (talk) 12:25, 6 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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