Template:Did you know nominations/Alice Bird Babb

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: withdrawn by nominator, closed by SL93 (talk) 15:27, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

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Alice Bird Babb

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Alice Bird Babb
Alice Bird Babb

Created by SL93 (talk). Self-nominated at 02:48, 23 December 2022 (UTC).

General: Article is new enough and long enough
Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems

Hook eligibility:

  • Cited: Yes
  • Interesting: No - Doesn't strike me as being particularly interesting; lots of people are portrayed in plays long after their deaths. Is there anything else from their article that you'd fancy using as a hook?
Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Article is new and long enough (even when discounting the direct quote), no copyvio concerns, image is good, and sourcing looks good. QPQ is done. Hook interesting-ness is my only concern, see above. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 04:37, 23 December 2022 (UTC)

PCN02WPS I can't think of lots of people being portrayed in a play long after their death unless it's that person's acting style that is being portrayed. Here's a second hook though - ALT1 ... that Alice Bird Babb (pictured), co-founder of the P.E.O. Sisterhood in 1869, was the first to take the organization's oath and was the first president? SL93 (talk) 06:58, 23 December 2022 (UTC)
If that is too repetitive, I can go for a quirky hook with what I added to the article. ALT2: that Alice Bird Babb, co-founder of the P.E.O. Sisterhood, wrote its oath in the "Holy of Holies"? SL93 (talk) 07:36, 23 December 2022 (UTC)
@SL93: Approving ALT1. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 17:22, 23 December 2022 (UTC)
  • @SL93 and PCN02WPS: Very sorry but I don't feel confident that this article is ready for the main page, and think it needs more work. At the moment, the article relies heavily on primary sources, and a biographical entry in the 1914 Iowa Blue Book. I'm not able to view the Wyoming News article about the P.E.O. Sisterhood (is it a picture gallery?), but I'm concerned that it might not offer much information about Alice Bird Babb herself if it is focusing on the play, although it's great to show that the P.E.O. Sisterhood continues to have current relevance. Historical biographies are hard, and I worry that pushing this out to the main page without more secondary sources would generate a lot of complaints. I do see that she was frequently mentioned in newspapers of her time, and it's possible that she is discussed in books, magazines, and/or journal articles. Another option might be to focus more on her portrait, if it is notable, and discuss what is known about it: who painted it when, etc., and how the portrait is described by secondary sources. If you need help in doing research, you could post a query to the Women in Red Talk page, where people are often helpful with sources and advice, and quite candid if a subject doesn't seem notable enough for a standalone Wikipedia article. (But if others disagree, please go ahead and restore the green tick, and/or help by working on the article some more.) I realize this is disappointing, but thought I should tell you now, rather than wait for someone else to say it in a less helpful way later. Cielquiparle (talk) 08:06, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
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