Template talk:N/a/Archive 1

comment

The font for this template should be smaller and perhaps in a grey colour. In the current form it is distracting and it makes tables look very ugly if used more than once or twice. --Cambrasa confab 16:12, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

rowspan=2

Request an a additional option for this template eg. "rowspan=2", for when it is used on a column of a table. For example: Comparison of programming languages (basic instructions)#Integers

NevilleDNZ (talk) 02:36, 10 May 2010 (UTC)

<small> tags

I was wondering if there was any chance that the <small> tags could be moved to outside the parameter to become "<small>{{{1|N/A}}}</small>"? I would like to use this template to display "TBA" but unfortunately it does not appear in small font link "N/A" does. Thanks to any administrator who can perform the change. Themeparkgc  Talk  00:03, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

I found the proper process on how to do this - see below.

{{Edit protected}}

I was wondering if this page could be changed to the following:

<noinclude>{| class="wikitable"
|-
|</noinclude>style="background: #ececec; color: grey; vertical-align: middle; text-align: {{{align|center}}}; {{{style|}}}" class="table-na" | <small>{{{1|N/A}}}</small><noinclude>
|}
{{documentation}}
</noinclude>

Basically there's only a slight difference which allows any other text (i.e. parameter 1, already in the template) to be displayed in the same way that N/A is displayed. Currently any text that is passed in is displayed full size. This change moves <small>...</small> to the outside of the parameter rather than only around N/A (the hard coded text). Thanks Themeparkgc  Talk  01:48, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

 Question: What would happen if the small is already specified using the parameter? How would this affect these existing uses? I guess it would appear even smaller which might be unreadable? Like this Should such uses be found and replaced before this change is made? — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 17:41, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, I never thought of that. I didn't know that nesting the tags would make it smaller. I thought <small>...</small> would just set it at a specific size and that was it. We would definitely need to replace all occurrences of it then. I have permission to use AWB and I could run through the transclusions and remove any small tags. In saying that though, it would still be quite a task to go through the 949 articles that it is transcluded on. Maybe it should a brief task for a bot? If I get support from an admin to make the change I'd be willing to use AWB to get the small tags removed. Themeparkgc  Talk  22:27, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

I'll make the change whenever you're ready. I'll disable the request for now, but just reactivate or post on my talk page when you're ready. — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 09:13, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I've ran through the list of transclusions using AWB and have removed the <small>...</small> from 10 pages (7 of which I have contributed to). The template should be good to make the change now. Themeparkgc  Talk  22:51, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I've implemented the change, and it appears to be working fine. Please report any issues found. — Huntster (t @ c) 00:37, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Huntster and Martin for your assistance. I've checked a few articles myself and it appears to be working perfectly. Themeparkgc  Talk  00:57, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Adding a hidden sort parameter

Presently, if you use this template in a sortable table, it will sort any n/as in the column in alpha order with "N", which can make some sorting look weird. I propose adding the hidden sorting text "..." (likely through {{sort}}) within the displayed text to automatically make these entries sort to the end of the table. The actual hidden text could be a parameter but it should be something that sorts after alphanumeric characters. --MASEM (t) 18:10, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Could you stick your proposed code in Template:N/a/sandbox and check it works correctly? — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 11:38, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Apparently at some point this was already implemented, however, I updated the sandbox (and tested via the testcases) to use the new method as per WP:SORT (from class sortkey to attribute data-sort-value; refer to WP:SORT#Specifying a sort key for a cell vs. WP:SORT#Sorting with a hidden key). I wonder if {{n/a}} should default to sorting like an empty cell though as per discussion #Sort to bottom (that would actually be easier to implement just removing the {{#if:}} and defaulting {{{sort|}}}). Thank you. 50.53.1.33 (talk) 11:28, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

That seems like a reasonable approach.  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  01:07, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

Sorting as blank sounds like a good idea. I added a default blank data-sort-value attribute at the similar template {{BLACK}}, and it sorts together with blank cells as expected. Matt Fitzpatrick (talk) 04:29, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

If someone wants to sandbox it, here, I'll be happy to implement it if we're certain it does what is desired (I might SB it myself, but have some other stuff to do today).  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  06:07, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

Sandboxed. Matt Fitzpatrick (talk) 12:07, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

Done Request unopposed, synced to sandbox — Andy W. (talk · ctb) 17:07, 8 September 2016 (UTC)

Problems

I just tried to add the template on the One Tree Hill article. It works in the ratings sections, but doesn't in the home release section. Can anybody help? Jayy008 (talk) 13:46, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

 Fixed I presume you were trying to add the template like so:

| style="text-align:center" | {{N/A|TBA}}

You actually needed to either remove the pipe:

| style="text-align:center" {{N/A|TBA}}

Or remove the styling all together:

| {{N/A|TBA}}

I have implemented the latter (diff) because the style to align it to the center makes no difference whatsoever (since the template is already center-aligned). Themeparkgc  Talk  23:20, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Thank you. That's a great help. Jayy008 (talk) 14:27, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

Sort to bottom

Is there a way to make these {{N/a}} cells sort to the bottom whenever the sort button is clicked in sortable tables? See: List of countries by income equality. Click the sort button above any column a few times.

I know how to get rows of titles to sort to the bottom. But I don't know what to do to get the {{N/a}} cells to sort to the bottom each time. I have been experimenting here: User:Timeshifter/Sandbox12.

Have things improved since this discussion:

• Help talk:Sorting/Archive 3#Sorting empty cells always last/first - is this possible? --Timeshifter (talk) 11:47, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 20 January 2013

Change

-->| <small>{{#if:{{{sort|}}}|{{ntsh|{{{sort}}}}}}}{{{1|N/A}}}</small></onlyinclude>

to

-->| <small>{{#if:{{{sort|}}}|{{ntsh|{{{sort}}}}}}}{{{1|[[wikt:n/a|N/A]]}}}</small></onlyinclude>

because not all English speakers will know what "N/A" stands for. Proposed edit is currently in sandbox. NE Ent 13:33, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

 Not done: WP:OVERLINK? I'm not sure that optimising for non-English speakers is necessary on the English Wikipedia anyway. Declining for now, though if consensus is established that this is appropriate feel free to ping me and I'll sync. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 10:10, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

This would definitely be overlinking, since it might show up in a table 100 times. Ideally, it would use {{abbr}}, but only do it on the first occurrence. And we couldn't do that without some fancy Lua, or some JS built into MW itself. So, I think this just needs to be done manually on the first "N/a" entry. This could be done with a |abbr=y that enabled that coding for that first use of this template in a table. It's not super-mega-perfect, in that if you re-sort the table the markup may not stay in first position, but this is a non-concern in my view, since it will be where it belongs when the table is first rendered and first seen.  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  01:07, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

Protected edit request on 15 July 2015

Update the deprecated HTML formatting syntax <small>...</small> to <span style="font-size: small;">...</span> instead, as was proposed in a separate discussion. – voidxor ^{(talk | contrib)} 01:08, 15 July 2015 (UTC)

Done In the end I used font-size: smaller, as font-size: small made the text a little bigger than the output of the current template. — Mr. Stradivarius ^{♪ talk ♪} 08:03, 15 July 2015 (UTC)

Good call! Thank you! – voidxor ^{(talk | contrib)} 19:24, 15 July 2015 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 16 July 2015

For simpler code, eliminate the span tags (<span style="font-size: smaller;">...</span>), and add font-size: smaller; to the wikitable's |style= parameter instead. This change was initially proposed at Template talk:Table cell templates#Less busy-looking templates, so I'll credit Dsimic with the idea. – voidxor ^{(talk | contrib)} 19:45, 16 July 2015 (UTC)

Actually, it should be credited to Crissov. :) — Dsimic (talk | contribs) 23:01, 16 July 2015 (UTC)

Done Alakzi (talk) 00:04, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

Edit Request

This template fails to be WCAG 2 AAA Compliant (Colour Contrast Check), but changing the text colour to #2C2C2C to match {{Unknown}}, {{Dunno}} and {{TableTBA}} would satisfy the compliancy (Colour Contrast Check). Alex|The|Whovian 00:39, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

 Done. Be prosperous! Paine  03:30, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

Undo Edit Request

I preferred to change back to the original color (from #2C2C2C to gray), to be special, looks much more better. 333-blue 11:47, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

@333-blue: Please read the reason for the above edit request to change the colour from grey to #2C2C2C - the original background/text colours failed to be WCAG 2 AAA Compliant, and hence were not accessible colours, which is must be as per WP:COLOR. Your request disregards those with sight issues, merely for what you think is "special" and "looks much more better". Tell that to those who can't read it. Alex|The|Whovian

Not done per Alex. But feel free to propose alternatives that satisfy WCAG AA/AAA. Alakzi (talk) 13:27, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

Undo edit request on 10 November 2015

May I change the color of the n/a label? Thanks! Raymarcbadz 12:11, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

Please read the above two edit requests. Alex|The|Whovian 12:17, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes, and as Alakzi mentions in the previous ER, feel free to propose alternatives that satisfy WCAG AA/AAA. And please discuss any changes here before deploying them in the live template. Be prosperous! Paine  23:22, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

I would discourage changing this away from an AAA-compliant grey (this is the "not applicable" template after all, and using a grey for "null" data is typical and well understood).  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  01:10, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

Neutralizing background colour

This template is useful in tables that don't use colours, e.g. at Matt LeBlanc#Film. In such cases leaving the mid-grey background colour intact is inappropriate since it makes the cell stand out. This template should support |color=inherit to reset the background colour to whatever the it is for the surrounding context. You can already do it with |style=background-color:inherit but my proposal would be simpler to use. Hairy Dude (talk) 09:35, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

Accessibility

Are these tags properly accessible? Should a template like N/A have a tooltip or something else to explain that it means "Not Applicable"? -- 109.78.252.80 (talk) 23:35, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

I still wonder about this. I don't like unexplained acronyms. We might know that N/A stands for Not applicable or Not Available but it won't as be clear as it should be to all encyclopedia readers. -- 109.76.201.89 (talk) 05:23, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Some suggested consistency changes

I wondered if we could consider the following changes:

• Removing <small> per MOS:SMALLTEXT, the {{non-album single}} in particular is used in discography articles and renders text small when no other text in that column is small.
• Could we also revert the dark grey formatting back to the standard grey that tables render in? For similar reasons, it looks bizarre in discographies and again for our non-visual editors/users this doesn't render anyway. → Lil-℧niquԐ1 - (Talk) - 09:15, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

 Partly done: I have removed the small formatting per MOS:FONTSIZE, for accessibility. I have no opinion on the color, and it appears to be part of a series, so I am reluctant to change that. It looks like there is some additional discussion above about how to allow custom colors in child templates. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:32, 17 April 2020 (UTC)

Hello Jonesey95, I have a major concern. Why did you remove the font size of the template? It looks too big and confusing for me. Sorry, I've decided to create a separate template for the Olympic results displaying the n/a template. Raymarcbadz (talk) 12:44, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

Did you read MOS:SMALLTEXT, which is linked above? Accessibility is a core policy of Wikimedia. If normal-sized text, which is what this template uses, is too big and confusing for you, there are many ways to reduce the font size that your browser renders. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:14, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

• I'm going to mark this request as answered; I think changing the colour of the box is something that should be discussed before implementing. Primefac (talk) 23:43, 21 April 2020 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 20 April 2020

Changing the font-size from 100 to 95%. Raymarcbadz (talk) 01:44, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit template-protected}} template. -- /Alex/₂₁ 07:00, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Hey, why don't you let me access to edit the template? I want the n/a template to render a small size. I'm editing the Olympic articles now. Raymarcbadz (talk) 07:05, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Raymarcbadz, your disruptive removals of the TFDs and spamming edit requests can and will be reported to administration if they continue. -- /Alex/₂₁ 07:20, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

All of the other templates in this series render at 100%, as far as I know. Inconsistency in a series like this is hostile to readers. – Jonesey95 (talk) 17:12, 20 April 2020 (UTC)