Template talk:Zig Zag Railway Route

Major re-edit

Over the past few days, I completely re-drew the diagram to show all stations, sidings etc. on all present and past layouts in a correct relation to each other. The main sources were the maps on the NSWrail.net and zigzagrailway.com.au sites, with Google Earth satellite views for additional confirmation. Many thanks to Useddenim for hands-on help in BSicon wizardry, and to Dave Rave, who gave lots of advice on the actual layout of the former lines (on my own Talk page). Rontombontom (talk) 14:22, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

After lots of further input from Dave Rave and after checking further maps, I yesterday I changed several more details around the Newnes Junction stations and around Bottom Point. A question/request to Useddenim who again streamlined the result: is there a nice way to put more distance between the original route and the other tracks at the height of Newnes Junction? At that point, the separate track groups of the Balloon Loop and the main line and the former right-of-way of the Dargans Deviation are side-by-side, but the original line is 2-300 m away on a completely separate alignment (if you check on Google Maps, the present B59 road was built atop the original railway right-of-way). Rontombontom (talk) 09:51, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

I'd not bother with that trifle, considering the large balloon of the ten tunnels v the orig v dargans re: Clarence station Dave Rave (talk) 11:24, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

But for distance, I'd try to get 2/4 and 1 Clarence onto the same line Dave Rave (talk) 11:25, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

 Done. Useddenim (talk) 13:20, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

Why shouldn't the connection between Zig Zag and Bottom Points stations be on the diagram? The relevant catalogue page literally says, "These icons can be used to represent connections between adjacent stations". And why is the lower Dargans Deviation pointer better placed higher? Rontombontom (talk) 20:58, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

Additional question: what was the rationale for replacing all station symbols with halt symbols? Rontombontom (talk) 21:20, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

a) It's a matter of scale: the diagram covers a distance of just under 20km, so a walkpath of what? at best a few hundred metres is just a speck. Yes,  (BL) shows "connections between adjacent stations", but it's primary use is for metro (and other transit) stations in urban areas.

b) The Dargans Deviation pointer got moved while accommodating Dave Rave's request to reposition Clarence_2/4 with respect to Clarence₁.

c) It would be a great stretch of imagination to consider any of the stations on this diagram as "major". (And  (pBHF) is meant to depict stations that are bypassed by express services.)

I hope this answers your questions satisfactorily, Rontombontom. Useddenim (talk) 04:27, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanations, here are my views on these.

Re a): What I think matters is not the length of the walkways, but to indicate the possibility of transfer between nearby stations, whatever the distance (especially as BSicons don't indicate true distance, so the viewer doesn't know if two stations one icon apart are at walking or driving distance). The only reason for the existence of Zig Zag halt is transfers from main line special trains to Zig Zag trains at Bottom Points or visits to Bottom Points Depot, while the only other access to Bottom Points is a dirt road, that's why I thought the relationship is significant here. While indeed the BL icons are mostly used for urban rail interchanges, I found one use very similar to mine (connection between mainline railway and adjacent heritage railway stations): in the diagram for Bala and Festiniog Railway. Admittedly, that's just one.

Re b): I don't mean the lift alongside your earlier re-arrangement of the Clarences, I mean changing POINTERf@rgq in my last edit back to POINTERf@gq. The latter icon doesn't touch the line and isn't perpendicular.

Re c): When you speak about "major" stations in relation to BHF icons, are you referring to some (Australia-specific?) convention different from the broader usage across Wikipedia (BHF for proper stations of any size with points and extra tracks and HST for halts)? If so, is there some manual somewhere? As for Zig Zag, it is a very non-standard stop with single-car-length platforms where only special trains stop, but if that sense of limited service stretches the standard usage of pHST, OK let's return to plain HST. Rontombontom (talk) 22:34, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

Festiniog is probably not the best example, as it is the same same station on adjacent lines, quite literally across the road from each other. b) was probably due to a cut 'n' paste reuse of code. For c), my understanding is that pHST can apply to any minor (secondary) station that sees less service than most on the (same) line. And, applying BHF to "stations of any size with points and extra tracks" does seem to be Australia-specific. Useddenim (talk) 00:44, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Top Points was a halt, is now a station. Could/should the stn be extended to show as a stn with lines leading around the corner to the buffer stops ? Dave Rave (talk) 07:38, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

"Around the corner", do you mean curling up into a 180 degree turn, like in real life? Rontombontom (talk) 22:51, 18 February 2019 (UTC)

I'd be happy if the old halt and the stn and the current buffer halt weren't curved at all on this map (already even), Doesn't require accuracy for 20km of nothing matches real life topography anyway. Dave Rave (talk) 08:51, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Top Points
Current
No. 2 Viaduct Top Points
Option 1
No. 2 Viaduct Top Points
Option 2
No. 2 Viaduct Top Points
Option 3
No. 2 Viaduct Top Points

Dave Rave: Do any of these look better? Useddenim (talk) 23:29, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Put a buffer stop after the station, I'll let it be ;) Dave Rave (talk)