User talk:Barbara Haws

Welcome!

Hello, Barbara Haws, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 18:02, 3 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

External links[edit]

Please read the Wikipedia guidelines regarding external links: WP:ELNO, WP:SPAM and WP:SOAP. There is advice about relevance at WP:TOPIC. Old Moonraker (talk)

June 2009 (http://spam.history.nyphil.org)[edit]

This is the only warning you will receive for your disruptive edits.
The next time you insert a spam link, you will be blocked from editing Wikipedia. Spammers may have their websites blacklisted as well, preventing their websites from appearing on Wikipedia. MER-C 04:03, 24 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A valuable research tool[edit]

Hello Barbara, I'm sorry to see the keruffle over the additions of the links to the NYPhil archives. The addition of links to non-specific pages like that to articles is against Wikipedia policy on external links, as is the addition of links by editors affiliated to the web site(s) in question. However, it's a very valuable research tool! I've added the link to WikiProject Opera's Guide to online research. I'll also let the Classical Music and Composers projects know about this facility. Best wishes, Voceditenore (talk) 10:29, 24 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This is disappointing, but thank you for letting us know that you think the site is valuable. I'm not sure how to engage in a larger discussion of the issues, but possibly you'll pass this along if that's what is needed.

In retrospect, I do understand, based on the strict definition of spam, why our attempts to link certain Wikipedia entries to the Philharmonic's new Performance History database were blocked. But maybe its time to rethink or revise the spam definition or at least allow certain exceptions (which I do realize may be a slippery slope). Wikipedia's external links provide access to some of the richest and many times, least-known resources available. To prohibit a direct link to these seems to go against one of the basic tenents of Wikipedia; to extend reliable information to a broad public.

For instance, would it have been acceptable to link Toscanini's performance history to Toscanini's Wikipedia entry if we could have made our URL Toscanini specific? Or if a fact in Toscanini's entry was verified through the Philharmonic's Performance History site, would it be unacceptable to link to the Performance History site as a citation? At the very least, why is the Philharmonic's own Performance History data blocked from its Wikipedia entry? Wikipedia allows the Metropolitan Opera to link to its Performance database.

I wish it were possible to create URL specific links to a particular artist or composer's performance history, but technically we don't currently have that ability. So in lieu of that, we intentionally decided not to link to the Philharmonic's home page, but to the search site only. As well, our site has no advertisements and is for scholarship only (it does not in any way have a commercial purpose or does it sell tickets). To be able to link such an invaluable research site to the various people that the Performance History documents, would only be a service to the reader who is attempting to validate the information in the Wikipedia entry and thereby learn more.

I look forward to reading your thoughts about this. Thank you,

Barbara Haws (talk) 20:18, 26 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, sorry it's taken a while to get back to you. The link can be used as an inline citation by other editors to reference premiere dates, or specific performances by artists, even if it doesn't link directly to the exact data. However, no one connected with the NYPhil should add it, even as a reference. In these cases, it's best to make a note on the article's talk page saying that the reference is available for the particular piece of information in the article, and let another editor add it. Wikipedia:Spam is pretty strict about the addition of links to articles themselves by anyone associated with the web site. I have argued at WikiProject Spam for them to be aware that some sites are actually very beneficial, and that many new editors add them in good faith, unaware of all the restrictions. The latest organization to suffer their wrath was the Prince of Asturias Foundation! See: [1]. So it's better to be safe than sorry. You might also want think about making contact with or even joining WikiProject Classical music. I'm sure they'd be grateful for your expertise. Best wishes, Voceditenore (talk) 10:29, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]