User talk:Bbobjs

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idle threats on 666 Satan Similarities

im sorry, but i WILL NOT respond to idle threats to edit stuff or have it removed, if you see flaw with the similarities with a section of an article then fix it your self, but going around leaving threats such as removing sections because they don't meet your standards is ridiculous and will never be meet with warm greetings

all i am sayin in a nut shell is that if you see flaw with a section, then fix it, but dont go into a talk page saying "fix this stuff by said date or i will remove it" its wrong to do and does nothing but annoy other editors when they are being told what to do... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 15:30, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Problem with your statement

There is one small and yet, very big problem with your statements toward the Similarities to Dragon Ball section, "Consensus". If you're adamant about it, put it forth before the WikiProject which works to maintain the article, 666 Satan. That project happens to be WP:666 Satan. Although, given the precedent established, I highly doubt it would be removed. You giving an ultimatum as such placed is entirely out of accordance with the principles established by Wikipedia and as per such, isn't even worth honoring. It is no better than all those who sought to remove the section because it was unsourced or because some of the sources were from forum topics (Which, by precedent once more, have been proven to be valid sources). So since you seem to be in the business of putting forth baseless ultimatums, I'd like to present one of my own: Please cease your pointless snipe hunt upon the article 666 Satan. If you do find it in your mind to remove the section mentioned herein, I will have no choice but to re-establish it as appointed by consensus (There's that precedent again) and to call upon an official Moderator. Thank you and have a good day. ⒺⓋⒾⓁⒼⓄⒽⒶⓃ② ^talk 15:37, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

copya pasta

refurin to the beautiful copya pastea you did into the wikiproject i wonder what you feel would be a good way to make the section more valid and better improve the section, and also wondering if your aware that the naruto section is also no longer cited anymore as teh citations were recently removed... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 15:33, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

also, have you considered the fact that in certain sections at the end of narutos early chapters where he claims that both him and his brothers artwork was heavily influenced by Akira Toriyama's work.... check the ends of the first few volumes (or possibly chapters) to see what i mean... just some advice, Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 04:44, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

and for future reference when conversations are made in talk pages, its usually a better idea to keep those conversations in the talk page...

that is actually very cool, but we are not discussing the similarities between 666 and naruto right now, you feel that the 666 dbz section has no merit and it is just not true, if you really want to convince me then give me examples of other series to prove that the stuff we have shown is more common in series then it is claimed to be.... but untill then im going to have to disagree with you, im sorry... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 14:09, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

no no no no no no no, i said if you really want to convince me that the section does not belong on the page then show me evidence that the stuff mentioned is found in ALOT of series... example, i would not put "in both 666 Satan and DBZ many male characters have big spikey hair" the reason i would not put something like that in there is b/c 1, its written @ about the level of a 4th grader, and 2 because it is found in almost EVERY series...

in summary, PROVE to me that things such as hermit teachers, training with weighted backpacks, catching animals, and serpent road(the idea not the location in dbz) are found in a broad variety of series, not just one.... if that doesn't make sense let me kno and i'll try to dumb it down some more for ya... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 22:29, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

I hate to point this out but you still have yet to point out any other anime with more similarities than what are described as with DBZ. And I do mean the EXACT same similarities listed. Likewise, as you are the only one arguing this, this statement is not justifiable at all: "Unless you can make a damn good counter argument as to why this section should stay, then I believe the only justifiable thing to do is remove it". Wikipedia requires consensus. Making puppet accounts to act on your behalf does not count so lets cut that off at the pass. Now then, as I stated before, if you do see fit to play Mr.I-Want-To-Violate-Policy-By-Imposing-My-Own-Ideas-On-Articles (I've seen it before. It doesn't end to well), I will do the only thing justifiable by reverting your edits, moving to have that specific edit locked (Consensus, my friend) and bringing in a moderator to settle the issue. That is justifiable. ⒺⓋⒾⓁⒼⓄⒽⒶⓃ② ^talk 14:43, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Please stop using terms like "ORLY" and things like that. It's quite childish, immature, and does not contribute to a conversation in any meaningful form. The point is that no other anime has every single similarity mentioned that can compare with Dragon Ball Z. You can point out other animes that have hermits which have contributed to the series. In example, you pointed out Tōtōsai from InuYasha. Great. Was there also a Snake Way in InuYasha? Did InuYasha have to catch an animal to receive training? Was InuYasha made to wear weighted materials during training? No, No, and No once more. As for you setting down an Ultimatum, I'm glad to see you interpreted that as the wrong thing to do. I have not side stepped your argument in any form or manner and have adressed it quite to the point. If you still wish to continue this, I'll more than happily address the matter. Although, if you look at the history (and it is a long history indeed), you will notice that many an edit has been removed because it is just plainly pointless. In example: "Both animes have women who are prominent"; "Both animes feature women who travel with the main character"; "Both animes have characters with spikey hair"; "Both animes have a world tournament". These are some of the pointless things and if those were still up and hadn't been removed on the spot, I could see why someone might not like the Dragon Ball Z comparison section. I can think of no less than 100 animes which featured a tournament of some type at some point. I'll just end on that note. ⒺⓋⒾⓁⒼⓄⒽⒶⓃ② ^talk 16:04, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

honestly though gohan has a good point... and to be honest, i will not dig through almost 75 chapters of a monthly manga just to prove to one guy who can not even make a worthy argument that he is wrong.... and dont worrie... i hadn't forgotten about you (or your worthless argument), i just dont care.... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 03:48, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

you sad excuse for a human being, you dont get what gohan is sayin

WE ARE WAITING FOR YOU TO SHOW US ONE(IF NOT MORE) SERIES THAT HAS ALL OF THESE THINGS IN COMMON THIS LIST INCLUDES BUT IS NOT LIMITED TOO:

• THE ANIMALS
• THE HERMIT
• THE WEIGHT

AND WHAT THE HELL IS THE POINT OF SAYING "Master Roshi and King Kai were the same person" IT MAKES NO SENSE!!!!! UNTILL YOU CAN FIND SOME WAY TO OBTAIN AN OUNCE OF BRAIN MATTER, DONT TALK..... I MEAN YOU ARE UNABLE TO THINK OF ANYTHING NEW BUT USING THE SAME DAMN ARGUMENT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER, ITS THE DEFINITION OF INSANITY (TO DO THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER AND EXPECT DIFFERENT RESULTS), FIND A NEW FUCKIN ARGUMENT!!!!! Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 07:18, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Whoa, lets not get personal here. My plan was to bring in a moderator to solve the issue with the edits, not to solve personal attacks name calling. This goes for both of you. ⒺⓋⒾⓁⒼⓄⒽⒶⓃ② ^talk 17:32, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

re: 'bull shit'

no ya see, thats where you have it wrong.... you think that because you can pull examples from the far reaches of the world we call multimedia that you have some amazing and completely unheard of point.... but the fact is that you do not, as gohan has stated the reason all of those things are posted is due to the fact that every single one of those is in dragonball (z), and every single one of them are in 666 satan so when you try to prove a point by pulling sources from all over the place and saying "see there not so uncommon" it only proves the fact that you dont have any argument AND ANOTHER THING, this is a topic which im sure you have over looked or just refused to accept because it has been stated many times by the two brothers (if you cant read these words then maybe i'll find you a picture to look at) that there drawings and other ideas have heavily been influenced by Akira as dragoball was very very very very popular when they were growing up and just starting to draw/write manga.... so until you are able to understand that then stop telling us there is no connection AND ANOTHER THING i talk in all caps because the internet is serious business and i was bored and felt like chewin someone out... AND ANOTHER THING my comment of i hadn't forgotten about you (or your worthless argument), i just dont care.... is a quote from a flash cartoon i saw in which he was refuring to forgetting about his friends birthday, me and a buddy say it to people alot and i felt like using it.... so i did, personally i found it quite funny.... but meh AND ONE FINAL THING i am not here to impress you or gain your approval in what i do here or anywhere else... my reasons for being so adimate about the 666 Satan article is due to the fact that i basically single handedly re wrote it from the crap of an article like soul eatter into what it slightly resembles today... peace out yall Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 15:48, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

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my argument

ok man, idk how much simpler i can make this so i guess im going to have to break this down even simpler then before, and no.... im sorry but i will not take hours upon hours upon hours out of my day compileing pictures from 666 Satans manga, and DBZs manga/anime... mainly because i have never read DB or DBZs manga nor do i own any of the series.... so please stop asking me to do so...

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your statement:

the similarities between 666 Satan and DBZ section is "extremely weak and, unlike the "Similarities to Naruto" section, is uncited." due to the main fact that many of the similarities are a lot less uncommon as we lead the readers of the page to believe.

you go on to cite the section by making the point that:

• Although the first two points are valid, they're not strong.
  • The similarities between Kirin and Roshi end at the fact that they're both hermits.
  • Training with weighted backpacks isn't an idea unique to Dragon Ball and the training methods used with the backpacks aren't similar.
• The next two points aren't even valid.
  • Catching an animal is a common training method, even in America. In Rocky II Mickey has Rocky catch a chicken to increase his speed. The point of catching Jajamaru was mainly to force Jio and Ball to use team work where as catching Bubbles was a solo task.
  • Saying that Serpent Road resembles the path to Kirin's is something that must be cited or elaborated to have any validity. As it stands I fail to see how they resemble each other.
• The final point is valid although since Kirin is noted as the parallel to Roshi and not King Kai, it's weakened.

you then proceed to show the section in question for reference, which i also have below:

As per the aforementioned, 666 Satan inherently shares aspects of its story with the manga series, Dragon Ball. Examples of such include, but are not limited to:

• Jio Freed and Ball were trained by someone whom was considered to be a hermit (Kirin), much like Son Goku and Kuririn were trained by the turtle hermit, Muten-Rôshi.
  • As an extension to the above, during training with Kirin, Jio Freed and Ball wore weighted backpacks on their backs, much in the same way as Son Goku and Kuririn wore weighted turtle shells while training with Muten-Rôshi.
  • In addition, Jio and Ball's first training exercise was to catch the pet of their trainer, Jajamaru, whom was very fast. This is very much in the same way Goku had to catch North Kaiō's pet monkey, Bubbles, as the first part of his training.
• On their way to see kirin, Jio and Ball had to travel along a path that resembles serpent road
• When Jio first saw Jajamaru, he mistook him for Kirin. Similarly, Goku mistook Bubbles for North Kaiō.

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first off, in my own personal opinion, my reasons for feeling that your previous statements are inaccurate is due to the fact that you feel these similarities are a lot less common then we let on, and that these 5 points can be all found together in other series, yet when we ask you to prove this to us, instead of saying (im just using names for the sake of having names, not saying they share these similarities), "well inuyasha has hermits, serpent roads and mistaking animals for trainers, as does D Gray Man and Bleach." you state that "inuyasha has hermits, D gray Man has serpent road and Bleach has mistaking animals for trainers"... due to you saying this i feel that it hurts your argument in the sense that you are only proving that certain series have little bits here and there in common instead of a wealth of similarities, i also feel that if you really look into your statements you would also find that some of the aspects you claim as weak may even be able to be expanded to show that they do have some merit and while not stating a source they still prove a valid point.

My Point Being

• Although the first two points are valid, they're not strong.
  • The similarities between Kirin and Roshi end at the fact that they're both hermits.

while Kirin and Roshi are both hermits, there similarities do not end at that. you could also look so far as to say that while some of there exercises and training techniques seem to be pointless at the time being, they do have importance in the long run

for example, Roshi having Goku plant crops and till(spelling?) the soil with only his hands to work on the conditioning of his hands while also making them stronger, and Kirin having Jio and Ball doing the baseball hitting game which had them work on strength and timing

• • Training with weighted backpacks isn't an idea unique to Dragon Ball and the training methods used with the backpacks aren't similar.

while training with weighted anything is not unique to DB or anything there is also the fact that backpacks/turtle shells share a some what striking similarity in apperance, and also due to the fact that they were required to wear them for almost (if not the) entire time.

• The next two points aren't even valid.

• • Catching an animal is a common training method, even in America. In Rocky II Mickey has Rocky catch a chicken to increase his speed. The point of catching Jajamaru was mainly to force Jio and Ball to use team work where as catching Bubbles was a solo task.

again, while being required to catch an animal is not uncommon in various media outlets you also need to look into the fact that not only was it was the first task required by both King Kai and Kirin for there student to do, but they were also required to catch the animal before they really even considered training them

• • Saying that Serpent Road resembles the path to Kirin's is something that must be cited or elaborated to have any validity. As it stands I fail to see how they resemble each other.

they are very similar due to the fact that both paths were the only way for the soon to be students to be able to get to the location that they would be trained at

and also due to the fact that they were normally long winding paths that seemed to go on forever at first glance

• The final point is valid although since Kirin is noted as the parallel to Roshi and not King Kai, it's weakened.

why is it weakened?

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i hope that some of this clears up my reasoning into some of my argument against your opinion and i look forward to hearing your rebuttal... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 19:44, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

response

only half-ish done reading.... BUT with bleach you see Kisuke Urahara as a hermit in the sense that he has isolated his self from soul society (or kicked out i forget:P) for a yet to be explained reason... Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review —Preceding comment was added at 19:50, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

to be honest i agree with most of your points... and i would respond in greater detail but im due to head off to work in a moment.... but ya, just a tip for future editing.... when you find things you do not agree with it is normally a better idea to do as much possible to make the changes inorder to make it better then it was before then going straight to the decision to delete... @ least thats how i look at things.... but ya if you have AIM, YIM or MSN then we can get on and quickly/easily discuss what to put in and what to leave out... my contacts are on my userpage... peace, Ancientanubis, talk Editor Review 21:02, 15 November 2007 (UTC)