Jump to content

User talk:Legacypac/Archive 7

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Archive 1←Archive 5Archive 6Archive 7Archive 8Archive 9Archive 10

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:00, 12 May 2018 (UTC)


Draft:Daniel Liam Glyn]] - please help

(talk) Hi, I'm not sure if this is the correct place to post comment. Please am I able to edit my page 'Daniel Liam Glyn' which you have speedily deleted? I didn't have any time to see this notification so that I could edit the page and make it more wiki friendly. Is my work completely lost? I don't want it to appear like an advert, it's meant to be a page about composer / musician 'Daniel Liam Glyn', the work I listed for 'Changing Stations' is actually from nearly 2 years ago, so it's not an advertisement or promotion.

You'll need to discuss with the Admin who deleted it. Click the link to the page and see who that was Legacypac (talk) 18:13, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

Speedy deletion declined: Draft:Badli Shah bin Alauddin

Hello Legacypac. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of Draft:Badli Shah bin Alauddin, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: Not so promotional it can't remain in the draftspace. Thank you. GorillaWarfare (talk) 21:41, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

IMO borderline. Classic example of where a 3 Strike rule would be effective. Where did discussions on that get to? Was it ever put up for RfC? Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 00:46, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
Kudpung, it was, and it was closed as no consensus. Primefac (talk) 03:38, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
Also pinging TonyBallioni, since we were discussing this the other day and I couldn't remember where I had seen it. Primefac (talk) 03:39, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
5 declines by 3 different reviewers who gave very clear custom messages. Legacypac (talk) 03:59, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
After the 4th decline send to MfD. The expected result is either Delete or Send to mainspace as notable. None of this "we can't consider notability on drafts" nonsense. If the creator can't get the page up to standard in 4 submissions either they need help or it is impossible. Legacypac (talk) 07:41, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
Notability of drafts is currently being discussed at the Village Pump, so that might not be an issue in a month. Primefac (talk) 14:01, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

15:46:11, 13 May 2018 review of submission by 111.40.50.8


I think that socialist consultative democracy is a political system in and of itself and should exist as its own article separate from the Politics of China (it is likely you are going to reject my attempt to add it to the Politics of China page, simply because I suspect you people have biases that you are trying to maintain, i.e., that China does not have democracy). Further, your system needs to be able to accommodate the .cn in some of my website citations. Otherwise, the links will not work. 111.40.50.8 (talk) 15:46, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

I don't control all or any of wikipedia. Anyone is welcome to contribute. I have no idea about any issue with .cn Legacypac (talk) 02:52, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:00, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Response to your comments on Kopparapu Poets

Regarding your comment declining above submission, I humbly submit that your observation--'that these poets were not famous when they were alive and their works were not published during their life time. Some one brought out their works later in a volume and wanted to promote it on wikipedia---is not correct for the following reasons:

1. As mentioned in the text itself, these poets were legends during the short time they lived and were contemporary rivals of another duo poets, namely Tirupati Venkata Kavulu which is also available on wikipedia. As editors of wikipedia, you might have visited this page several times and I as a contributor to wikipedia wonder why such doubts did not arise in respect of Tirupati Venkata Kavulu given the style of writing and referencing pattern being same. In fact, I have given more citations for Kopparapu Poets including Pottisriramulu Telgu University (Hyderabad) Compilation on these poets in page 118 published in 2005 as Luminaries in Telugu.

2. Secondly, there is a Telugu post, namely Kopparapu Sodara Kavulu or కొప్పరపు సోదర కవులు in regional language wikpedia.[1]. Moreover, there is a call from Wikipedia urging Indian contributors to translate Telugu or other language wikiposts in to English. Viewed from this point, this post may kindly be accepted though my English text is an independent text, not a true translation of Telugu regional version available on Telugu wikipedia. However, citations and references are same and more also in English version.

3.Publishing industry, both in Telugu and English, was very poor in interior India during the times when the poets lived and performed Avadhanams.Hence, whatever manuscripts were available, they were published later by their admirers. Lately all such scattered works have been compiled and edited and published in a single volume. Hence non-publishing of the works of these poets during their life time has nothiing to do with their notability and reputation at that time as one can understand from the Telugu version of same poets in wikipedia.

4. I am not a paid contributor and have no interest to promote dead/living poets. As I mentioned there is a Telugu post in Telugu wikipedia on these poets. Similarly there is a post in English on their rival poets in English Wikipedia. Hence, this post. Therefore, I request you to kindly review the submission and accept it.

5. Each time a new editor is raising new volley of questions (despite several such posts existing both in English and Telugu wikipedia) which are making it increasingly tough for new contributors like me to respond to such volleys of rejections.MUMACHA2203 (talk) 09:05, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Eti (company) has a new comment

I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission comment, which can be viewed at Draft:Eti (company). Thanks! GlobSec (talk) 15:24, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Kopparapu poets

Regarding your comment declining above submission, I humbly submit that your observation--'that these poets were not famous when they were alive and their works were not published during their life time. Some one brought out their works later in a volume and wanted to promote it on wikipedia---is not correct for the following reasons:

1. As mentioned in the text itself, these poets were legends during the short time they lived and were contemporary rivals of another duo poets, namely Tirupati Venkata Kavulu [1] which is also available on wikipedia. As editors of wikipedia, you might have visited this page several times and I as a contributor to wikipedia wonder why such doubts did not arise in respect of Tirupati Venkata Kavulu given the style of writing and referencing is same. In fact, I have given more citations for Kopparapu Poets. 2. Secondly, there is a Telugu post, namely Kopparapu Sodara Kavulu in regional language wikpedia.<ref> https://te.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B0%95%E0%B1%8A%E0%B0%AA%E0%B1%8D%E0%B0%AA%E0%B0%B0%E0%B0%AA%E0%B1%81_%E0%B0%B8%E0%B1%8B%E0%B0%A6%E0%B0%B0_%E0%B0%95%E0%B0%B5%E0%B1%81%E0%B0%B2%E0%B1%81</ref/>. Moreover, there is a call from Wikipedia urging Indian contributors to translate Telugu or other language wikiposts in to English. Viewed from this point, this post may kindly be accepted though my English text is an independent text, not a true translation of Telugu regional version available on Telugu wikipedia. However, citations and references are same and more also in English version.3. Publishing industry, both in Telugu and English, was very poor in interior India. Hence whatever manuscripts were available, they were published later by their admirers. 4. I am not paid contributor and have no interest to promote dead poets.Hence, I request you to kindly review the submission. Each time a new editor is raising new questions and it is becoming increasingly tough for new contributors like me to face these repeated volleys of rejections. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MUMACHA2203 (talk • contribs) 14 May 2018 (UTC)

User:MUMACHA2203 it is very hard for users who do not understand the language of the sources to evaluate such pages. AfC is an optional process so lomg as your account has at least 10 edits and exists 4 days. I'd suggest you post your comments on the article talk and move the page yourself. Legacypac (talk) 11:37, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
User:MUMACHA2203 - I have read your draft again, having read an earlier version of it three weeks ago. It is very hard to understand. I see that you are having difficulty in expressing yourself in English, and that you think that there is a need to translate more articles into English. I don't like to criticize your efforts to express yourself in English, but they are not very successful. If you are specifically writing for the English Wikipedia, and not for Telugu or any other encyclopedia, you might do well to find another author to help you. I don't like to criticize your efforts, but it is very hard to read either your post here or your draft. Robert McClenon (talk) 18:19, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tirupati_Venkata_Kavulu

Moving Questionable Drafts to Mainspace ?

I will take the discussion from Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:Behavioral Signals here. I genuinely cannot understand the idea that a questionable draft that has been nominated for deletion at MFD should be taken to mainspace. Apparently you think that such drafts belong in mainspace because draft space isn't appropriate for them, or something. I really don't understand. If there are doubts about whether something belongs in draft space, it definitely doesn't belong in mainspace. It is true, as DGG says, that moving it to mainspace will not damage mainspace, and will only be useless and inappropriate, because in its current state it will be deleted at AFD. So why take it to article space? The idea that you seem to be displaying is that questionable stuff doesn't belong in draft space. Some of us think that is one of the purposes of draft space. I don't understand. Can you explain? Robert McClenon (talk) 10:43, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

What needs explaining is the stupid insistence by some editors that we can't decide notability on any draft. AfC decline templates clearly say there are not enough RS but of course we can't rule out the existence of RS. The only clear way to tell a submitter that the topic is not notable is to delete it via discussion. However non-AfCers insist we can't do that. A submission to AfC is a request to mainspace and an assertion the page is ready for mainspace. If deletion is not achieved at an MfD than we should accept the request to mainspace and then apply mainspace rules to the page, sink or swim style. Legacypac (talk) 11:45, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
I partly agree and understand. That doesn't change the point. I share your annoyance of non-AFCers (busybodies, bystanders) at the stupid insistence that we can't discuss possible notability of a draft. I agree that a submission to AFC is a request to move the page to mainspace and an assertion that the page is ready for mainspace. That doesn't change my point that moving a questionable draft to mainspace is a terrible idea. If one isn't sure about a draft, draft space is a better (less bad) place than article space. Article space is the purpose of Wikipedia; draft space is merely a holding bin. You seem to be implying that draft space is precious and that stuff that doesn't belong in it should go to mainspace. I don't understand that, but, to the extent that I do understand, I think it is a terrible idea. Just because you are annoyed at the busybodies doesn't warrant holding your breath while cursing at them in sign language. That is the opposite of User:SmokeyJoe, who is annoyed (with good reason) at the stupid saccharine wording of the decline template and so holds his breath while cursing in sign language rather than deleting. Robert McClenon (talk) 17:10, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
No, I'm saying if the page does not warrant deletion in a discussion it must be suitable for mainspace - or at least given a chance there - because that is what the creator has requested. Legacypac (talk) 17:13, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
No, no, no. Certainly you don't believe that just because the creator thinks it belongs in mainspace, we, the reviewers, should defer to their judgment, because we are expected to use judgment. As to the busybodies and bystanders saying not to delete a draft, again, we certainly know that there are drafts that do not need deletion but are not ready for mainspace, and we, the reviewers, have agreed to use judgment. We know that there are some drafts that should not be promoted but should not be deleted, because they need more work. The idea that if the page does not warrant deletion from draftspace, it must be suitable for mainspace, is absurd. I know that you are frustrated at the busybodies and bystanders. So am I. That doesn't warrant holding your breath while cursing in sign language, and that doesn't warrant moving the work of flacks into mainspace. No, no, no. Robert McClenon (talk) 18:44, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Speedy Deletion of Allen Small

Hello, thank you for your feedback on my first Wikipedia article. I wish to write educational content regarding Ontario's election this year, and wanted to start by filling in information holes. Can you please restore the draft to my user, so I can improve it with more sources to meet Wikipedia's acceptable criteria, and make it sound less like an advertisement (apparently). I have no connection to the party, and do not intend to vote for the party either, so the last thing I want is for it to sound like an ad. My only goal is to be informative across different aspect's of this year's election.

In regards to sourcing, there are many more reputable newspapers available that cover his biography, platform, and views that I can add to help beef up the viability of the page.

In regards to the reasoning for deletion, the party is not a minority party, as they are 1 of 5 parties running a full slate of candidates in this year's election, and received about 1% of the popular vote last election. The next closest party in size don't have enough candidates to even win a majority if all were elected, and received a fraction of the popular vote. The party, and their candidates are among the 5 listed on the official Ontario 2018 election Wikipedia page.

Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by OntarioElection2018 (talk • contribs) 19:31, 14 May 2018 (UTC)


AfC conflicting reasons for creation and previous deletion... need help to finalize

Hello Legacypac. In regards to the AfC for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Up_on_High_Ground_(TV_series) I kindly ask that the use of notability on Wikipedia solely as the inclusion criteria be carefully examined in this case. As you said "I'm not convinced this is notable but it may well be." This is based upon human opinion and of course that's what engages the process of an article for creation accordingly in the raw sense. Over the course of the last several months I've seen editors and admins use the term "notability" loosely from it's meaning to define what they want or don't want on Wikipedia. Notability is increasingly fame driven by how many websites cover or can be used as independent references, but that is based on notoriety rather than notability. In this case the Up on High Ground written article is documenting a verifiable syndicated TV series that was also a streaming series and has been up on Wikipedia for well over two years. Prior to my AfC request here an agenda driven administrator and editor took down a very similarly written article calling it "marketing driven" with no mere mention of notability. This so called marketing material was removed and edited properly by advice, however given the fact to delete it or keep or create it by being too "marketing driven" is not even in your criteria or subject matter to deny it as an AfC. Clearly there are holes in the Wikipedia process an this is not consistent at all with simply placing this article where it belongs in the main space.

I'm definitely open to you being kind and willing to edit this to a point where it is a more solid article in the realm of inclusion, even if it is stubbed down a bit. If you would be so kind to assist in editing or place it there?

All the sections correspond to the desired format of MOS on TV Shows, particularly after reviewing this administrator recommended MOS on TV Shows. This administrator said this "The best way to combat this (and this was the primary reason for deletion) is to follow the MOS on TV Shows. After months of editing, getting advice from an editor, admins, and conforming with the other policies this should be enough to build and maintain an encyclopedia entry for a verifiable TV series. The article is sourced, well written, and well presented material that follows the guidelines of TV series articles already on Wikipedia. Finally just because some references are short or of some peoples opinion are not independent for example, doesn't mean they're not notable. My best regards and ask that you please assist. Techform (talk) 19:53, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

AfC is an optional process. Nothing stops you from moving the page to mainspace yourself and taking your chances. Legacypac (talk) 17:56, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:00, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Copy/paste

This was absolutely terrible advice. Copy/pasting is never the right solution. Please don't ever give blatantly incorrect advice again. If something needs moved, then have them request either a technical move or a HISTMERGE. Primefac (talk) 14:56, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

RFC ?

There is mention of an RFC about drafts. Is it the one authorizing the deletion of drafts that are repeatedly resubmitted, or is there also another RFC about drafts that I am not aware of?

Thanks. Robert McClenon (talk) 19:53, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

The only current one is User:TonyBalloni's one. Maybe we need another one - framed to fail. (Is that allowed?) that clearly lays out the purpose of Draftspace according to some.

1. Draft space is for indefinitely hosting encyclopedia articles on topics where notability can not be established.

2. Users are not permitted to consider notability at WP:MFD.

3. Users are permitted to resubmit their unsuitable drafts to AfC repeatedly forever in the hopes that some AfC reviewer will accept the page other reviewers have rejected. It is like a free play lottery. AfC reviewers should not have deletion discussions available as a tool to delete unsuitable submissions. It is of no consequence that AfC reviewers waste time wading through the same resubmitted pages over and over until the SPA holder gets tired of playing the submit/reject/submit/reject/submit again game.

4. Promoting businesses, bands, and people with no established notability is fine in Draftspace. Wikipedia exists to ensure everyone everywhere can get SEO link juice and the thrill of having a Wikipedia draft about their business/band/self.

When shall we post it? Legacypac (talk) 20:11, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:00, 16 May 2018 (UTC)



AfD Mimi Elsa

Greetings. I mentioned you in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/MIMI ELSA, and not very kindly. Have a look, please. Tapered (talk) 07:13, 4 May 2018 (UTC)

I apologize without reservation for my incivility. Please keep up your good work. Tapered (talk) 09:26, 5 May 2018 (UTC)
Ok thanks Legacypac (talk) 07:16, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

07:56:49, 16 May 2018 review of submission by Shultzc


I wasn't using the proper citation format for references, so it may have been unclear that there multiple independent secondary sources (newspaper and television news) had content specifically about this company.

shultzc (talk) 07:56, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Flowcharts

If you need help making one, if it's not as complicated as ICPH's, I'd be happy to help. See this one I made: File:New Page Review Flow Chart.jpg. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 08:29, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Deleting non-notable drafts

I finally tracked down what I think is the RfC you referred to. That provides a bit more context on why it seems we were at such opposite ends on WP:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:Abdul Quadir Amin. It's going to take me a while to read through all of that discussion, but I'm beginning to see better where you are coming from. Thanks for your patience. — jmcgnh(talk) (contribs) 08:26, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

There is a big gap between "A draft must show notability at all stages of development" and "notability can't be considered on a draft at anytime." Hope that helps. Legacypac (talk) 08:34, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

00:19:40, 17 May 2018 review of submission by Mike Kitchen


Hello Legacypac and thank you again for reviewing my submission! I've vetted the citations further, and I've fleshed out my case for the main citations proving notability in the Draft talk:Student Loan Hero If you have time, I'd be grateful if you could take another look. As I mention on the talk page, I realize I could move the article to Wikipedia on my own, but I have a lot of respect for the site and want to consult with experienced editors on it to make suitable for Wikipedia. Thank you again for your time on this Mike Kitchen (talk) 00:19, 17 May 2018 (UTC) Mike Kitchen (talk) 00:19, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

John Paul Fauves

Hello, I would highly appreciate if you can undelete this article, I want to include extra review from Paulette Magazine written by Juliette Minel ( CODIF 04919 - 40 ). John Paul Fauves is well known internationally, been published in various publications, and exhibited all over the globe! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Julia mji (talk • contribs) 02:39, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

I just saw that it was mentioned that my new submission is substantially identical to the deleted version, but its not, its 100% rewritten from scratch. There is similarity with cities and shows because it is John Paul's professional history — Preceding unsigned comment added by Julia mji (talk • contribs) 02:54, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

User:Julia mji I'm not an Admin yet so I can't undelete. Check with the admin who deleted it or go to the correct notice board Legacypac (talk) 07:15, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Hello and thank you for your response. Yes, I found person who removed my article, for some reason it was not showing in my notifications. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Julia mji (talk • contribs) 02:03, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:01, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

06:31:00, 17 May 2018 review of submission by Narwaro


Hello, I read notability guidelines again and I think that those are met. There are 3 independent sources with significant coverage of the subject and no original research in the references. For details such as version dates, there is no meaningful source other than the subject itself which is common for software topics.

Cheers, Narwaro

Narwaro (talk) 06:31, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

You have a well established account User:Narwaro so you can just move the page yourself. Legacypac (talk) 06:32, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

William Arkle

Morning Legacy, We're conflicting at "Very old". Should I leave it to you for now? KJP1 (talk) 06:45, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

No I'm working other dates. Legacypac (talk) 06:47, 17 May 2018 (UTC)
Fine - I'll take a look at the very olds. KJP1 (talk) 07:01, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

Declined publication, Miss Progress International

Hello! Thank you for taking some time to review the Draft page of Miss Progress International. The last reason why you declined its publication is "Wikipedia requires significant coverage (not just mere mentions) about the subject in published, reliable, secondary sources that are independent of the subject". After the previous refusal to publish for the same reasons I have added some articles published by reliable and independent sources. Some are beauty pageant portals, different from each other for each edition even if they wrote about the event also more than once, some are Italian national newsportals, a couple are institutional websites such as the one of the Municipality of Alberobello, UNESCO world heritage. Also, and mostly, those were not just mentions but articles written only about the event I propose. Honestly I cannot understand what is wrong with those sources I found. There are several thousands of articles about it and I could add their links but I am afraid it will be useless. Thank you in advance for your explaination. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Joeitalia (talk • contribs) 15:19, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

Cuban drafts

Hello Legacypac. Today I am seeing a lot of drafts for Cuban artists, all promotional in tone, all by different users. This involves :

There may be more, I haven't found out. Will add if I find more. I suspect these are socks, should I go to SPI?

Regards, -- » Shadowowl | talk 14:36, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

(swerve) shadowowl. Given the entry at User:Kjhagen and the confirmation at User:Nkell1479, I'm fairly sure this is for an Art History class at University of Minnesota, Duluth. rather than socks.Naraht (talk) 15:22, 17 May 2018 (UTC)
@Naraht: Ok. I did not look at userpages. Thanks for explaining. -- » Shadowowl | talk 15:29, 17 May 2018 (UTC)
shadowowl Not sure any of them reach "Do not resubmit", but they are really going to have to come at this from a different angle.Naraht (talk) 15:44, 17 May 2018 (UTC)
If the subjects are notable the rest can be fixed with editong. Legacypac (talk) 17:51, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:00, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

Reason for rejection of my Ray Carr article

Respectfully, Legacypac, the reason you rejected my resubmission is the VERY REASON it was resubmitted in the FIRST PLACE. We had a FEATURE ARTICLE that appeared this past Friday in The Cleveland Plain Dealer. It is reference number 4. You can check the link out here: http://www.cleveland.com/ministerofculture/index.ssf/2018/05/ray_carr_a_cleveland_renaissan.html

That is the second article strictly about Ray since this page has been submitted. Ray's show is known outside the US. In fact, we just heard from Petula Clark's current tour manager this morning, asking if he could share her current interview with Ray (aired last Tuesday, May 8) on social media.

So, the reason you rejected it is in the article. MULTIPLE reasons are in the article. WILL YOU PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IN HELL I HAVE TO DO TO GET THIS DAMN THING INCLUDED ALREADY??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by CVActor1 (talk • contribs) 08:08, 15 May 2018 (UTC)


Respectfully, Legacypac, the reason you rejected my resubmission is the VERY REASON it was resubmitted in the FIRST PLACE. We had a FEATURE ARTICLE that appeared this past Friday in The Cleveland Plain Dealer. It is reference number 4. You can check the link out here: http://www.cleveland.com/ministerofculture/index.ssf/2018/05/ray_carr_a_cleveland_renaissan.html

That is the second article strictly about Ray since this page has been submitted. Ray's show is known outside the US. In fact, we just heard from Petula Clark's current tour manager this morning, asking if he could share her current interview with Ray (aired last Tuesday, May 8) on social media.

So, the reason you rejected it is in the article. MULTIPLE reasons are in the article. WILL YOU PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IN HELL I HAVE TO DO TO GET THIS DAMN THING INCLUDED ALREADY???

Here's the link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Ray_Carr

JUST TELL ME WHAT TO WRITE, INCLUDE, I DON'T CARE. I AM SICK OF THE REJECTIONS. AND CONSIDERING SOME OF THE OTHER SUBJECTS INCLUDED ON THIS WEBSITE, I SEE NO REASON NOT TO PUT THIS ONE LITTLE PAGE ON IT. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CVActor1 (talk • contribs) 08:11, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

User:CVActor1 - Stop SHOUTING. It is rude, and is not likely to get your article accepted. I suggest that you ask for the opinions of other experienced editors at the Teahouse politely, rather then shouting at one reviewer. Robert McClenon (talk) 10:19, 15 May 2018 (UTC)
Also, you have become a single-purpose account who is doing nothing but edit one article and demand its acceptance. Do you have a conflict of interest, such as being paid? That would explain why you are so angry and so demanding and why you are not editing anything else. If you are not connected with Ray Carr, take a chill pill and get a little exposure to Wikipedia by editing a few other articles. If you have a conflict of interest, declare it. Robert McClenon (talk) 10:23, 15 May 2018 (UTC)
User:CVActor1 - If you really are sure that your page is ready for article space, you have the right to move it into article space, and other editors have the right to nominate it for Articles for Deletion. If you are ready to defend it, maybe that is what you should do. That is definitely a better idea than just shouting at a reviewer. Robert McClenon (talk) 13:48, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Robert McClenon, First of all, I wrote to Legacypac because it was the suggestion of one of the many pages on this website to write to the reviewer and request why he/she has rejected my article. If that is you, then, yet again, I'm not being answered as to what to do about this in any constructive manner that helps at all. If it is not you, then why are you responding on Legacypac's page? Now as far as your accusations go, most of these assumptions (and we all know what that word means) are incorrect. As far as "getting exposure by editing a few other articles", I have added numerous amounts of information to many other articles on this website over the years. If you're looking for my name to prove it, I'm not always signed in when I do this. But do not for one minute assume that I just edit one article. However, I have been trying to write this article and get it accepted for years now, and no matter what I add, remove, fix or write, I keep getting the same answer. "Ray is not notable because the articles are mentions." They are not just mentions. At least two of them are articles strictly about Ray. And this was resubmitted because Ray has had a second feature article that appeared in this Friday's Plain Dealer, Cleveland's main newspaper. No one seems to have even noticed that edition in the credits, #4, since the rejection message is identical to the one I received on this article about 3 years ago. Here is the new article link: http://www.cleveland.com/ministerofculture/index.ssf/2018/05/ray_carr_a_cleveland_renaissan.html. It appeared in print on the first page of the 5/11/18 Cleveland Plain Dealer Friday Magazine, and has been online since 5/10/18 at this link. Apparently none of you have noticed, which makes me wonder if anyone is really reading this over at all. Why am I "shouting"? Well, you try working on an article for years without success and see how frustrated you get when no one seems to really listen to you, answer your questions or read what you write. I also have to say that if you think I am rude, you telling me that I have become a single-purpose account who has a conflict of interest, should take a chill pill, and am getting paid to do this, certainly seems to be very rude to me. I am not being paid for this, and have never been paid for it, so I resent that assumption. I do not need to take a chill pill. I have asked numerous times in this process for some suggestions on how to write this article, what you all want to see or not see in it, and what I need to do to finally get it accepted. I either get the same answers on things I have already fixed (like the references, for example), or no answers at all. So instead of insulting me, maybe a little help, that has been requested way too many times without success over the years, would be far more productive, don't you think? — Preceding unsigned comment added by CVActor1 (talk • contribs) 06:07, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Robert is another AfC reviewer - one of the best. He is welcome to respond on my talkpage anytime. Given the rudeness you should be glad you got a response from any volunteer. Unlike you, we have no financial or personal connection to the many subjects we work on. We have a very good understanding of what will survive a deletion discussion on Wikipedia and why. Nearly 100% of AfC submissions I accept stay on the site. In my opinion your submission would not survive a deletion discussion. If we need a newspaper article from this week to establish notability on a musician it is NOT established. There are plenty of perfectly successful good musicians that don't warrent a wikipedia article.
With that said User:CVActor1 - I'm going to watch and ensure that your submission is no longer considered by our volunteer reviewers. AFC is an optional process run by volunteers. As an editor you may move the page to article space from draft space yourself with no further involvement from the AfC project. Legacypac (talk) 07:11, 16 May 2018 (UTC)
User:Legacypac Exactly what are you saying you will do about User:CVActor1? Please do not sink to his level. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:47, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

LegacyPac, where in my last paragraph was I rude? I never called anyone a name, never told them they were being paid ("Unlike you, we have no financial or personal connection to the many subjects we work on.") when they weren't (What do I have to say to make that clear? college radio does not pay anyone, okay? If you don't believe me, call any college radio station and they will tell you this.), never told anyone to take a chill pill, and I find it interesting that I have "become a single-purpose account" in your minds, yet this is the first time I have resubmitted this article in FOUR YEARS. When have I done nothing else if I haven't submitted it in four years? Yet, you and Robert see fit to continue to insult, and now threaten me with "I'm going to watch and ensure that your submission is no longer considered by our volunteer reviewers". I don't have anyone jumping on the wagon. I do not gang up on people and still say that they are rude. I get that you are all volunteers here. Guess what? So am I. I do not get paid for any of this. Out of exasperation, stretching back over 4 years, I typed one and half sentences in caps, which simply asked - not demanded - asked - what I needed to do to finally get this article included, and that makes me rude. Yet you and Robert threaten me and call me names and you are not rude? Think about that. I remember that this site had requests up recently for donations to stay in business. Insulting people who want to add to your website is no way to do that, regardless of what you think they've said to you. You want me to move my article? Fine. How do I do that? I don't need anymore threats, insults or name-calling. Especially when all of this is a result of not being given the really constructive help to fix any of this in the first place. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CVActor1 (talk • contribs) 08:10, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

User:CVActor1 - I have not threatened you, and saying that I have threatened you, when I have not, amounts to a personal attack. I have cautioned you about conduct that can get you blocked from editing, but I am not an administrator and cannot block you. If you want advice on what to do to get your article accepted, ask for advice at the Teahouse, although you may be advised that nothing that is done to an article about a non-notable person will get the article accepted. If you want to move the article to article space, just move it. If you need advice on how to do that, you may ask at the Teahouse or the Help Desk. Please do not accuse us of threats. Please do not SHOUT. (The idea that the use of ALL CAPS is shouting is not unique to Wikipedia but is well-known in all on-line communities. Anyway, you knew that it was shouting, which is why you did it. We only disagree as to whether you are more likely to get an answer by shouting your demands for one.) Go ahead and move the page to article space, or ask for advice. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:47, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
User:CVActor1 - Also, once again, are you employed by Ray Carr? You seemed to say, four years ago, that you were. You seem to be saying, now, that you are not. Either you were and are, or you never were and still are not, or you were and no longer are. Please answer the question. It isn't optional. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:47, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

11:48:27, 18 May 2018 review of submission by FeWorld


Hi, you recently declined the submission for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Ice_Poseidon_2 on grounds of notability. Could you provide some feedback on the sources used since I thought coverage from respected sources such as Rolling Stone, Next Web, Polygon, Kotaku, Vice, CBS, Fox and more would show sufficient notability. I also have a question on the name of the article since it should be created as just 'Ice Poseidon' not 'Ice Poseidon 2' (since this draft is a restoration of a deleted page) and the page is move protected. Do I have to request an admin to move it first?

Thanks FeWorld (talk) 11:48, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

Yes you will need an Admin. Many watch this page so hopefully one will look into this. Legacypac (talk) 11:52, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
If and when the draft becomes acceptable, an admin can be pinged and the protection lowered to allow for the move. Primefac (talk) 13:18, 18 May 2018 (UTC) (talk page stalker)
Okay, do you have any feedback on the sources given since they are from respected sites such as Rolling Stone, Next Web, Polygon, Kotaku, Vice, CBS, Fox and more before I resubmit or am I likely to be declined again for some other notability test. FeWorld (talk) 14:18, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
Given the history of the page I'm not inclined to review it again. Your account has sufficent age to request an Admin to deal with it. AfC is an optional process. Legacypac (talk) 18:03, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

The Auditor-General Republic of Namibia

I've just deleted The Auditor-General Republic of Namibia (which you accepted and moved to mainspace) as it was a clear copy-paste from the official website - please be more careful when reviewing drafts. Cheers! :) [stwalkerster|talk] 20:11, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

Actually that is not a correct action. I examined that before acceptance and found the material repeated was direct quotes from the country's constitution and enabling law which can't possibility be copyrighted. Surely in every country it is legal to republish sections of such documents - please restore User:Stwalkerster Legacypac (talk) 07:39, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:01, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Due to a lack of references and notability, I would like to speedy delete the following page : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Sonia_Jam

However, before I delete I would like to use the content as an English translation for an already existing French page : https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonia_Jam

How do I do that? I added the {{translated*|fr|Sonia Jam}} tag to my entry, but the page was never translated. I asked in IRC forum but they were unable to give me an answer. Can an admin take care of this? Thanks Abonzz (talk) 13:35, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Declined Publication

Hi Legacypac! I'm a new wiki contributor and I'm getting my start by making a few edits here and there as well as creating pages for some comediennes and artists that I'm into. I've tried to make a couple pages and I haven't got it right yet, but I'll keep trying! One of my pages was called "Abbey Luck" and was marked for speedy deletion, but I didn't catch it in time and now it's gone! Would you mind restoring it so I can look at the content? It's okay if it doesn't end up meeting the notability requirements, I'll probably just skip that one plug away on other people I'd like to add (that may get rejected, haha!). I'd still like to get the copy though because I didn't save it, for future reference. but the reason said it was deleted said "filled with Spam links"... I def didn't put spam in there but maybe we have different views on what that means. Any way, thanks for the help! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mysssteriousss (talk • contribs) 01:47, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

I'm not an Admin - you need one of them to restore or send you a copy. I don't recall the page so can't offer much advice. Legacypac (talk) 15:12, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Request on 13:40:37, 20 May 2018 for assistance on AfC submission by Abonzz


Legacypac I would like to speedy delete this page. However, the content can be used as an English translation for the following page:https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonia_Jam So before I delete, can an admin add the English content to the existing page in French wikipedia? Abonzz (talk) 13:40, 20 May 2018 (UTC) Abonzz (talk) 13:40, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

We can't put Englsih content on French wikipedia. I can't delete your page but many Admins watch my page so maybe one will do it. Legacypac (talk) 15:10, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
My immediate reaction to this is, unsurprisingly, that we have enough backlogs here without doing other Wikipedia's work for them. Then I see that it's already a translation from the French article. The only way I can delete the page quickly is if it's moved to an Abonzz sub-page and they put {{Db-u1}} on it. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 15:21, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
Well, for U1, "Pages which have previously been moved are only eligible if all previous titles were in the user's userspace". WP:G7 should be applicable as declines and comments aren't really content of the page. Galobtter (pingó mió) 15:30, 20 May 2018 (UTC)
(talk) I can delete the page. It's the English translation that I would like to keep. However, on the French page, I don't see the "Dans d’autres langues" menu for displaying the page in English. How did you access the English translation on the French page? Thanks Abonzz (talk) 15:32, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Portal guidelines etc

Hi,

Would you be interested in being involved in this?

Kind regards, Cesdeva (talk) 20:07, 20 May 2018 (UTC)


G13 Eligibility Notice

The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.

Thanks, HasteurBot (talk) 03:00, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Editing Page Title

Thank you Legacypac for taking the time to review and accept my article for Wikipedia. Please may I request your assistance to help add something to the Page Title - I'd like to add the acronym SAMCODES. JLL87 (talk) 07:09, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

No that would go against our naming conventions. Legacypac (talk) 10:54, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Please clarify - how is that against naming conventions? Are acronyms not allowed? If that is the case then please could you create a redirect as you suggested on my talk page. Many thanks JLL87 (talk) 13:00, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
We create at the proper name North Atlantic Treaty Organization or NATO not a combination of the two. I already created SAMCODES Legacypac (talk) 13:10, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Scam accusations against cryptocurrencies

I think someone who has actually written articles about cryptocurrencies should judge is Monacoin is a scam. I want someone else to review this article. Draft:Monacoin The article for Monacoin already has a Japanese version.

I will find a cryptocurrency article editor to review it right now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MingT8 (talk • contribs) 15:23, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

My statement is accurate. By submitting to AfC you asked for a review. If you don't want to take the review on board don't use AfC. [1] Legacypac (talk) 15:27, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Draft:Dani Bell and the Tarantist CSD

I might be missing something on the draft, I couldn't find anything that made it an attack page. Before I removed the tag, I just wanted to be sure I didn't miss something. RickinBaltimore (talk) 19:44, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

There is a bunch of total BS in there like chasing wild animals in Vancouver. It's mocking the subject and maybe a hoax. Legacypac (talk) 19:49, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Gotcha, I'll have a look into it a bit more. RickinBaltimore (talk) 19:50, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
There was a cleaner version prior to the IP edits. I rev del'd the possible BLP vios and reverted the draft back. RickinBaltimore (talk) 19:57, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
For all the work you've been putting in to AfC - nice to see that we are finally back under 1000 KylieTastic (talk) 19:13, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Yahoo did we get under 1000? Legacypac (talk) 19:19, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
Yup, hopefully we can keep it there... if only people would stop resubmitting utter crap... KylieTastic (talk) 22:02, 21 May 2018 (UTC)
lowest is 996 at one point. Quek157 (talk) 23:43, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Page deleted Lisa-Jayne Lewis

Hi - can you help me. I thought that the page I had written was in line with the many other pages of a similar content. I had used many citations, more than on some allowed articles and the page in no way was promoting it was entirely information based I would have thought a notable person working in broadcasting with a citation on the European Broadcasting Union would have stood. I am just unsure how to go about restoring this and trying again in a way that passes. Wikipedia is very difficult to use, unless you are a computer geek and understand all the weird coding, is there not a more affable way to be able to help people create articles rather than just delete everything? It's difficult to talk to people, difficult to ask questions, difficult to achieve anything unless you are one of the greats, I genuinely thought Wikipedia was a community effort but I may have been mistaken in that, I just need so help and guidance. Lisajaynelewis (talk) 06:33, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Do you always talk about yourself in the 3rd person? Read WP:AUTOBIO please. Page suffered from a variety of things, including you just do not pass WP:N. Legacypac (talk) 08:04, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Thanks!

Thank you for your suggestion to add to the Collections section of the page I am creating for Anna Wong(artist). It is much appreciated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jaggitha (talk • contribs) 18:53, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Draft Rejected for Lack of Notability

Hi Legacypac, I noticed that Draft:Vapor (Server-side Swift) was rejected again for a lack of notability. I created this article to provide a more complete view of server side swift. Since Vapor is a red link on the Swift (programming language) article, and similar server side swift projects like Perfect (server framework) and Kitura are equally notable, I thought the draft was filling in missing information. I have a couple metrics to prove that Vapor is equally (arguably more) notable than Kitura and Perfect. This first source shows the number of questions asked on Stack Overflow for each framework. Stack Overflow is a place for developers to ask questions, making it a great network to evaluate the usage and therefore notability of each framework.

Developer recognition is also shown by GitHub stars, which demonstrate each framework's popularity in the developer community. (http://www.timqian.com/star-history/#vapor/vapor&perfectlysoft/perfect&ibm-swift/kitura).

I believe that the sources added since my first review adequately show the notability of the subject and all are from reliable, secondary sources, but if you would like more sources, please let me know as there are many more I can add.

Thanks for your time! Confiture1271 (talk) 17:03, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

User:Confiture1271 you are obviously ready to defend this if someone seeks to delete it. AfC reviews are completely optional. You are free to move the page to Article space yourself. Legacypac (talk) 00:50, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Draft:GWC Warranty

Can you provide specifics of references that do meet your guidelines? After deep review of your guidelines, I'm still incredibly confused as to why this continues to get rejected. Putting the same exact explanation as the previous reviewer does nothing to help me supply information that complies with your guidelines. I'd like to create something that fits your rules, but my sources are being declined when I see far inferior sources on other business pages. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mattvanstone87 (talk • contribs) 20:32, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

User:Mattvanstone87 It takes time to understand exactly what rules apply to Wikipedia articles. We provide helpful links but there is no substitute for simply editing some existing articles. Creating a brand new article that will survive a deletion discussion is an advanced skill. Legacypac (talk) 00:53, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Clive Wilkins

Hi Legacypac, I've been trying to get the Clive Wilkins entry onto Wikipedia. Proving his notability seems to be evading me, despite the man's success in being invited to influential venues, universities and conferences all over the world to speak on memory and perception using art and literature to illustrate his points, often his own art and literature. If his contribution was vacuous, he would hardly be likely to be invited anywhere. The University of Cambridge, department of Psychology, have made him their first artist in residence in a science department and kept him there for 6 years on the trot. It has never happened before. On some level these things are a measure of success, but I understand, not in terms of Wikipedia. I am surprised that some of the later references in the article don't convince you of the worth of the entry in Wiki terms. But that's me still not having worked out what is needed no doubt. I am working on it.:))) The peer reviewed articles and papers are published and have been distributed in notable and well respected journals, I could put up more, indeed I will improve the citations and present them with the academic status they deserve. Work which is not considered of worth is not published in academia. Reference 18 seems to go some way to providing an independent third party account of what Clive has done~ would you agree? If there was more like that would it help? The paintings, in many people eyes speak for themselves, he has been described as 'one of the UK's leading figurative artists' in the foreword to an exhibition catalogue of his work. Could I use that and quote the extract? Is that allowed or does that infringe a copyright or something? He has national newspaper mentions for his paintings could they be used? If you could tell me what I should be looking for, that would help~ I find it a little hard reading and understanding the wiki pages that describe these things, I am not used to them yet and can think of multiple ways of interpreting what they mean. My problem is I am new to this~ as you can tell~ my apologies. Give me time to sort this out please~ I think I can do it~ I am working on it~ Hope to hear from you. I hope you are allowed to reply. Best wishes in any event. Jean Scott Thomson (talk) 23:25, 22 May 2018 (UTC)Jean Scott ThomsonJean Scott Thomson (talk) 23:25, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Creating a new page in Wikipedia that will survive a deletion discussion is tough - an advanced skill. You are better served editong some existing pages to get a feel for things. You are also free to move your Draft to Article space yourself if you wish. Legacypac (talk) 00:56, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Clara Anna Fontein

Good day Legacypac

I accept your opinion to make it part of Durbanville. I would however like to respectfully verify why I belief it is justifiable to have it as its own subject. It was never part of Durbanville. Population growth has caused that this original farm today falls under the jurisdiction of Durbanville. It was one of that original Tygerberg farms. Its was a landmark in the valley. Its also shows the urban creep that takes place in urban areas. I will however accept your decision if you still feels like it. I have altered certain parts of the article. If I include it under Durbanville, should I include everything I have written in this draft?

Thank you

User:Barry Ne — Preceding unsigned comment added by Barry Ne (talk • contribs) 15:59, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

page just looked really thin. All inhabited places are autonotable. You don't need AfC permission to move it to mainspace as you are an experiemced editor. Legacypac (talk) 00:59, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

06:36:35, 23 May 2018 review of submission by Veronica111a


Good morning! I was trying to create a page about russian blogger Eugenia but all articles from reliable magazines like L'Officiel or Marie Claire are in russian language (links are attached). Does it mean that it is better to create first page in russian in wikipedia and after that create in english?

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marieclaire.ru%2Fmoda%2Fevgeniya-epplbum-nachnite-s-horoshih-bazovyih-veschey-%2F&edit-text=

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.lofficielrussia.ru%2Fbeauty%2Feugenia-applebum-carolina-herrera

Veronica111a (talk) 06:36, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Russian and English wikipedia operate under different rules and guidelines. Starting your effort at English Wikipedia by building a new page on a blogger using all Russian sources is going to be a very difficult process for you. I suggest contributing to existing pages for a while before attempting a new page. Legacypac (talk) 12:19, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Request for review

Dear Legacypac, thank you for your feedback. As I already wrote in the former message, I noticed that my article needed to be improved and I understand that you stay by your assessment. Now I have submitted in my sandbox a new version of my draft Susy Rottonara with all reliable references. I am a researcher of minority languages in European culture and I came across this woman, as she is the promoter of the Wikipedia Ladina in ladin language. Thank you in advance for the time you will spend to review my article. Best regards.Johannade57 (talk) 07:20, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Drafts pasted in the sandbox can't be moved. Please put it at Draft:Susy Rottonara User:Johannade57 Legacypac (talk) 09:31, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Dear Legacypac, thank you so much for your help. Best regards Johannade57 (talk) 06:58, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Dear Legacypac, thank you for your review. I have substituted the references to the user's generated sources with a reliable reference of a European expert conference and I have substituded the reference to the publication on her own website with the link to the festival. The international awarded productions are supported by reliable sources. I hope now it is ok. Of course you already got the topic watchlisted, as I put it for review some time ago, but there were many things to improve as you noticed. Thank you for your time. Best regards. Johannade57 (talk) 14:45, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

PHP Tools for Visual Studio

Hello Legacypac, I noticed that you commented on my draft of PHP Tools for Visual Studio. Thank you very much for reading it and for your feedback.

You stated that it looks like an ad, but it's not your field of work. Sincerely, I'm just trying to describe the tool and I have seen that this is usually how other tools are described here in Wikipedia. However, I'm not interested in making it an ad.

Please, can you give suggestions on how to improve it? I'll be more than willing to apply the changes. Thank you. ~~Fernanda Liendo~~ —Preceding undated comment added 07:32, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

It's really not my field. You might try WikiProject Computing? Legacypac (talk) 14:48, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

Discussion

There is a discussion at AFC that you will undoubtedly want to comment on. Primefac (talk) 17:56, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

You've Got Mail

Hello, Legacypac. Please check your email; you've got mail! The subject is Race Winning Brands.
It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

Leach1441 (talk) 19:03, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

23:22:45, 23 May 2018 review of submission by Jpacura


Jpacura (talk) 23:22, 23 May 2018 (UTC)


Hello,

I wrote wikipedia page for House Flipper and it keeps being rejected. Could you please tell me what's wrong with it? Thank you in advance.

User:Jpacura Various reviewers have tried to explain. I don't know what else I can add. See comments on the Draft. Legacypac (talk) 00:21, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Legacypac/Archive_7&oldid=1005019107"