User talk:Michael Micklei

August 2009

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Hello Makana, thks your welcome. Surely I will do my best for as much references as possible. For this pls give some clear hints or examples of the article. Shall I add, that Morrnah was living her last year between Jan. 1991 and Feb. 1992 in my home in Kirchheim/Germany? Let's work together and Thks again from Germany. -- Michael Micklei (talk) 19:38, 10 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Michael, have you read the Ph.D. dissertation on ho'oponopono? http://mobile.presskit247.com/EDocs/Site202/Diss_MJames.pdf

OK here is the sandbox http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Ho%27oponopono/Sandbox Makana Chai (talk) 20:59, 10 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Makana, I am back. I read the diss, interesting, but this is not ho'oponopono, at least not the one of Morrnah. bye Michael Michael Micklei (talk) 22:09, 10 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

ho'oponopono done

Aloha Michael, thanks again for your help. You asked, Can I take this text as a re-translation in German, French and Italian? Yes, that would be great. Also I left a question for you on the talk page. I think it's good that people be able to see some of our thinking over there. Oh, I keep forgetting to ask if you know about Gene Ono, Ramsay Taum and Earl Pamai Tenn. Gene and Ramsay are still teaching Morrnah's original way, every month here. Pamai is my kumu hula and was Morrnah's administrative assistant for 10 years - until Hew came along, then he felt he had to leave. Pamai went with her to the U.N and all over. Anyway, Pamai took Ramsay's class and said it was exactly how Morrnah did it. And Ramsay is my husband's cousin. Small world! Makana Chai (talk) 00:00, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, yes really small world; I know Earl Pamai Tenn, he was chanting the 'I am the I prayer' at Morrnah's Ke Ola in 1992, I was next to recite it in German, my wife Yvette recited it in French. The answer of the question later, we just came back from visiting the Unihipili of Germany as her place Altötting is round the corner of us. Altötting is also only some miles away of the birthplace of the current Pope. Michael Micklei (talk) 15:42, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am going to add an introduction-overview to the article, which is standard procedure, especially when an article gets as long as ours. With warm aloha. Makana Chai (talk) 18:40, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, I have done some small edits at Morrnah's section and also a first reply to your question. Michael Micklei (talk) 20:26, 16 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mahalo Michael. All is good. Now I can't wait for you to edit Morrnah Simeona! With warm wishes Makana Chai (talk) 06:41, 17 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good morning, I added small things at Len's section (is it ok?), cannot let the finger from typing, may be an reaction that now the re-translated article is also in German visible; s.b. already added that Len's version is not Morrnah's because of inner guidance from higher spirits and added the website of him; For MS will take a few days, I am on work. Mahalo Michael Micklei (talk) 15:25, 18 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Looks great! Mahalo. I'm the same, making small changes. Well let's see what happens from others. One of my Wikipedia friends already went on and made some minor useful edits. He is very critical so the fact that he didn't make big changes is good! Aloha Makana Chai (talk) 18:01, 18 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, here is a first proposition of Morrnah's page. What do you think? Some headlines missing? Pls check my grammar also. For Morrnah's picture I have a beautiful one. Morrnah said at that time, it is free for Pacifica Seminars, but to my knowledge for copyrights one should be careful. Mahalo Michael Micklei (talk) 18:16, 19 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Morrnah

Aloha Michael, It looks like very good work, however, I put it all in a new sandbox so we can just work out the grammar. Go to the discussion page of Morrnah and click on sandbox. It is best to do it that way. I do have some info on Morrnah to add. Mahalo, Makana Makana Chai (talk) 22:34, 19 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You wrote These publishings were finally collected at the University of Hawai'i at Manoa, Hamilton-Hawaiian Library. In 1983 and 1984 Simeona presented three lectures at the United Nations, also at the World Health Organization and the UNESCO. Do you have a citation that she spoke for WHO and UNESCO? I only have once at the UN. Makana Chai (talk) 00:31, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You can see how I re-wrote the first paragraph. It just must be taken step-by-step. Almost every sentence should have a reference. Also, when referring to a newspaper article, it is not a good reference to quote a newspaper article saying what she said. It should be someone else saying something about her. Try see if you can re-write more in this way. Aloha. Makana Chai (talk) 00:38, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha, Makana, thanks your work already; I would like to use Akaka's speach, written down in the congressional record which I have as original, simple as a reliable source. For the newspapers my target is partially different. Here in Germany (having also in mind already later translated versions in other languages), WP just needs articles in some important newspapers to show a minimum proof that Morrnah was a respected person with a certain relevance. Mahalo Michael Micklei (talk) 07:58, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good morning, I just looked through all the material I have from the former staff, but no hint on WHO and UNESCO; in 1982 Morrnah organized through Pacifica Seminars the 'First World Symposium about the Identity of Man' from July 9 to 12 in Honolulu, may be big part of Huna. A 32 pg A4-brochure has 8 pg good wishes for the Sympo as by Governor George R Ariyoshi, mayor Eileen R. Anderson, Congressman Akaka, Congressman Cec Heftel, College of Physicuians & Surgeons of Columbia University Harlem Hospital Center, Kuakini medical Center (with teaching notice), University of Hawai'i at Manoa (by Dean Wesley P. Park, Kahamea Schools/ Bernice Pauahi Bishop Estate (by Director VerlieAnn Malina-Wright). - Bob Dye said a lot of things in his Chronicles. - Some people around here have tapes and videos of classes, but that's not exactly what is needed, I suppose. - Actually an important point could be that Morrnah unlike others (as far as I know) did not stay in Hawai'i but went out in the world to share the Hawaiin gift of ho'oponopono. Aloha Michael Micklei (talk) 15:53, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good morning. I am going to check out the Bob Dye book today at the library. That may be the best resource. Not sure if it counts as a reference for WP purposes but certainly goes to show her credibility and importance. Have you been to Hawaii? I only have been to the Frankfurt and Berlin airports. Makana Chai (talk) 17:53, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha, you are 12 hrs in advance - yes, for Morrnah's Ke Ola we have been two weeks in Hawai'i, Oahu, Big Island, Maui. I went into Haleakala, on big island I made a round tour by car; at Honolulu we stayed at Stevenson's hotel at Diamond Hill (Morrnah would say: old karmic ties) Michael Micklei (talk) 18:22, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha! I got the Bob Dye book. I think you could just use this article in the Dye book as your main reference. I think this should be your baby - you write, I'll edit. Mahalo. Makana Chai (talk) 23:27, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha, I have done some edits, but I think they will be only temporarely, as I do not know what Bob Dye has in full storage (page-numbers?); anyway just to give a hint of the direction; have a beautiful day Michael Micklei (talk) 15:45, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Do you have a copy of the Congressional Record you can scan for me, or is it available online? Regarding the conference on I-dentity of Man, we have to have a published reference, the conference booklet won't do. Makana Chai (talk) 19:38, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I will try to send you the CR in a few minutes - I have the keepers of the secret too. Who wrote the article in Honolulu Magazine? - For the treasure title I would like to know, when it was exactly, is there a document at the mission too like the CR?, can you phone to the Honpa Mission? Aloha Michael Micklei (talk) 20:08, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mahalo! The page numbers in the book are 298-301, author Pat Pitzer. I will add the exact date of Living Treasure, I have a newspaper article on that. There is no such thing as a living treasure honor of the Hawaii State Legislature. I will look to see if they passed a ceremonial resolution. For the symposium, I have the list of speakers and know the hotel. The problem is, in Wikipedia, we must refer only to published sources, that is newspapers, magazines, books. But there was a newspaper article dated July 7, 1982, about the symposium. do you have that? Makana Chai (talk) 20:42, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

the date of living treasure is in the footnote, Feb. 11, 1983 Makana Chai (talk) 20:44, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I need to go to Manoa and see what they have there. It is closed today, a state holiday. Maybe next week. Aloha nui Makana Chai (talk) 21:35, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I just found out there is another book with info on her, also info on my hero Mary Kawena Pukui. It is biographies of some of those named Living Treasures by the temple. Makana Chai (talk) 22:31, 21 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Michael, just a note about WP standard. When you create a headline using the two =, do not put the three ' around the title as a friend of mine here went into ho'oponopono and took out all the ' in the titles as he said not WP standard. Who knew? Makana Chai (talk) 19:14, 22 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Michael, I have made some other edits and feel comfortable with it to go up now "live." So if you're happy with it, yes, please put it on the page. Good work! PS: You can see how I spent my Saturday night here Living Treasures of Hawai'i Makana Chai (talk) 22:21, 23 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha, thks, but your input made it a joy to read! Ok, let's go live. Again Mahalo nui for your help. Michael Micklei (talk) 07:37, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good morning Makana, shouldn't we have also a pic for the ho'oponopono page (doing ho'op at the beach or SP islands or the like)? To fill in the statue pic in the Morrnah page was no problem, but to unload an orphant-pic from s.b else is one; at least in deWP they do not accept according Commons; an eMail to deWP is necessary. Aloha Michael Micklei (talk) 18:41, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I was thinking of a ho'o picture, too, but not sure what to use. In our book we just showed people hugging and smiling. I was thinking of a picture of Kawena Pukui, but same problem of copyright. I wonder if my friend would give me a pic. I will ask her. She is married to the grandson of Pukui. Surely there must be a way to use old photos where everyone is passed already. Makana Chai (talk) 19:57, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Makana, for pic of Morrnah I will look in my own archive too; long time ago I was working in a big publishing house for street maps and travelguides and had to create new books out of this fund. For historical orphant-pics not older than 70 years we did it in that way: we published first but paid immediately if s.b. came up and proofed it was his pic. But that was private negociation, not WP with strict same rules for everybody. For ho'op-pic(s) I was thinking of a map of the South Pacific so if people from other countries who read this article and are not so familiar with this region have an idea; Hugging only seems not typical enough. Mahalo nui for helping. Michael Micklei (talk) 07:42, 25 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Michael, I sent an email to an organization to see if we could use a picture of Aunty Malia Craver, who spoke on ho'oponopono at the UN in 2000. And I added a sentence about her doing it. I was also thinking about a pic of Ramsay, I think I have one of him. A map of the South Pacific sounds fine. Maybe some other historic picture will come up. Mahalo, Makana Chai (talk) 08:26, 25 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

watching out pages

Aloha Michael, Now that we have our lovely pages up, we need to check our "watchlist" regularly to see what other people do on the pages. I just found someone who added a sentence to ho'o saying that she teaches, too, and giving her website. I reverted the changes. WP is not for commercial promotion. I hope you are doing well today. I still plan to seek out more on Morrnah on Thursday. Tomorrow, my husband and I are going hiking at the North Shore. It is our first day off together in two months, and our first big excursion in two years! Good night! Makana Chai (talk) 07:31, 26 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, have fun you both! I will look the watchlist too. Have also filled in Auntie Malie on the deWP. To keep all this talk or delete or making abstracts? Mahalo nui Michael Micklei (talk) 14:16, 26 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Michael, You could delete all of the above if you want, or archive it. We will start a clean page! Off to the north shore now. Have a good day. Makana Chai (talk) 18:03, 26 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I try this version first. Aloha Michael Micklei (talk) 19:54, 26 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Michael, The clean up looks good! I just added a map to ho'o that shows Hawai'i and the So. Pacific as just a start. We had an amazing day today, hiking 3 hours and swimming and sunning for an hour. I will post a picture or two. Every time I am in nature with my husband I remember what a gift it is to be alive in Hawai'i nei. He found the site of a heiau and holua run without even trying. Makana Chai (talk) 04:17, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, good information with the maps; the 2nd one is may be not true to scale, shouldn't we mark down this? for ho'o in deWP also s.b. set a link to a commercial site showing next Len's seminars. I removed it. Here is a German site called "SpiritualWiki", do you know it? It is not listed in sister wikis. Mahalo Michael Micklei (talk) 07:21, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Michael, Thanks for your comment on the maps. I don't know if it is to scale, nor do I know how to mark that it is not, and I don't want to mark it as not if it is. Hmmm, yes, also it bothers me that New Zealand is on the map but not named. I suppose it will do for now, better than nothing, but if you find it not to scale and how to mark that, that would be good. I know you can caption a picture on the commons, maybe that is the way to do it. I just looked at SpiritualWiki. Too bad it is not a real Wiki and I would put some info on there! I would love to keep the ho'o article totally clean of commercial links. I have not been able to keep up on Huna and it is strewn with links. Once I finish my book then I will go in and clean it up. If you go to my User page you will see a great rock we saw today. Makana Chai (talk) 07:29, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You are right about that Polynesia map. I removed it. If people don't know where Polynesia is, that map is not going to help! Hopefully we can find a new one. Off to work now.Makana Chai (talk) 17:28, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Found another map! Check it out. NOW off to work. Makana Chai (talk) 17:45, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha and Good morning Makana, I added one sentence only about Self-Identity at the Morrnah section, but the 'history' made a big fuss out of it. Is the adding ok? 'history' gets confused as I also cut one paragraph in two. - I was very busy the last two days. Saw your rock picture, strange. I am also looking for further pic, not easy. Have a wonderful day. Michael Micklei (talk) 17:13, 29 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good morning Michael! The change looks fine. I am sorry I was not able to get to the library on Thursday. Maybe next week. We are getting ready to go to Maui the week after next so not sure how much time I will have. Many things to do before then. I asked a friend of mine here on WP to look over our article. He looked at it briefly and will give us some suggestions for improvement. Have a good day!Makana Chai (talk) 19:06, 29 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha, don't worry for the scans, send them when it is fitting well for you. Perfect organization with your friend, may I know his name already? Have done another small changes. Good night now. Michael Micklei (talk) 22:04, 29 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, Makana, the last days we worked on the French translation of our both articles. this morning I put them in frWP! Can you see them already? I also added tiny pieces to the English versions, hope it is ok. Aloha Michael Micklei (talk) 14:24, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Michael, Thanks for putting it up in French! C'est bon! Also thanks for continuing to refine our articles. I have been getting back to writing my book. Will be adding more on ho'oponopono. Also supposed to be meeting with a Hawaiian who has written a paper on traditional ho'o. I hope he will give me a copy. Will let you know. Have a great day. Makana Chai (talk) 18:50, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

new revisions

Aloha Michael! Well my friend Viritidas looked over our ho'o article and had a lot of good and constructive changes to suggest. You can see them all here User:Viriditas/Ho’oponopono. Also look at the talk page of the article to see my response to him. We should talk over there I will write more there now. It is not as big a project as it might look. Someday we may even get this article nominated for an article of the day, where it is on the front page of WP!Makana Chai (talk) 18:19, 2 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, Mahalo your interesting info; so far I agree with Viriditas. Yes, as you have done already, one should go from general to specific. Need good pictures. What about the Hula-language? To show with a small sequence of pictures, how stories are told (picture/text), e.g. about a special tradition? Could help for recognition of „oral histories“? I have heard from a sandd rawing language at Vanuatu (they are now titled „cultural worldheritage“ by the United Nations). I have tapes of classes from Morrnah and Stan, I also know a friend who once made a video; possible later to fill in on YouTube-platform within WP? I shortened Morrnah’s text at the ho’oponopono-site 10% and I changed the headlines from names to ideas (pls have a look on the grammar, when you find it ok in general). Huna is surely a stub for the moment, but I suppose you may fill in more, as you are writing a book? One WP-user in Germany changed all aposthrophes and called the new sign „okina“ according Hawaiian Dictionaries. This sign looks like a komma upsite down. Is it ok? Michael Micklei (talk) 17:46, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Michael, thanks for your good work. I did have to change it somewhat. I put Huna as a separate section. That's something I am really passionate about, that's what my book mainly is about - showing all the ways that Huna is NOT Hawaiian. But, it turns out the MFL actually described Huna accurately. So thanks for adding that in, because people would wonder. Technically, I should have a reference for saying he described it accurately so I better hurry up and finish my book! Regarding pictures, I don't know of any hula that relates to ho'oponopono. I don't know much about hula, but I once asked my kumu hula and he said pretty much every Hawaiian song is about a place, and usually that place is a metaphor for a loved one. And for that matter, my kumu is Pamai Tenn so if there was a hula relating to ho'o he would have taught it to us! I have a DVD of Morrnah talking about ho'o but it is copyrighted like everything else. I wonder if they have a picture of her at the state archives. Those pictures are not copyright. I just don't have time to run down pics right now. Regarding changing names to headlines, if you are okay with it, so am I. But I changed Hew's to Zero Limits since that is recognizable. Regarding the apostrophes, WP standard is to not use apostrophe but instead to insert an okina symbol. Actually I am surprised Viriditas didn't catch us yet on that! We just have to go through and do it everywhere at once. I will do it later. So the one thing I would suggest for you is to see if you can move some of what is in the Morrnah section in ho'o to her own article. Mahalo! Have a good day!Makana Chai (talk) 18:44, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aloha Makana, here are some suggestions for the trilogy of Huna, Morrnah and Stan. I hope they are comparable like blue, red, green, not like blue, cold, short.

Fillfilling wishes (Huna) - Freedom from negativ memories (MS) - Getting to Zero (HL)
Directing the fate (Huna) - Freedom from Karma (MS) - Creating state of Zero (HL)
Creating reality by shamanism (Huna) - Creating peace of mind (MS) - Incessently cleansing (HL)

What do you think? I know, at Huna so far we have no citing. But do you really not want to give a small hint? Just 2 lines? I added 3 citings at Len's section as I was feeling that they were missing. My eMail? The okinas for the French version I have already done. Mahalo and lots of inspirations Michael Micklei (talk) 17:19, 4 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Problematic See Also links

Hi Michael -- I've removed the link from Mind. If an article on that level were going to wikilink to such distantly related articles, the See Also section would have a thousand entries. I think a number of your other wikilinks are also overdoing it, but I'm going to restrict my own actions to articles on my watchlist -- so far mind is the only one you've altered. Regards, Looie496 (talk) 17:28, 14 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Morrnah Ho'oponopono

Aloha Michael, I want to thank you for your help contributing to those two articles. --★ Pikks ★ ^MsG 11:07, 30 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Just replied to you on my talk page. --★ Pikks ★ ^MsG 12:51, 30 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]