User talk:Mr. Gerbear/Archive 40

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On the subject of Baybayin

Hello, recently you reverted my edits on removing Baybayin off of the Tagalog language. Such inclusion of the script is usually removed like here in the national anthem of the country, [1]

We only include official scripts that are backed by law, such as the Jawi script in the Malay language.

Unless it is backed up by law, I will be removing it as it not widely used other than for historical/educational purposes. And also because it is not recognized as an official script of the language.

Cheers, PyroFloe (talk) 15:25, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

Hello! Thank you for your message. May I ask which Wikipedia policy this is? As far as I know, Tagalog (and the actual use of any language) is not universally bound by law. In fact, it is not even regulated by a language academy (except for one variety, Filipino). Removing it from the Philippine national anthem was appropriate because it was unsourced and the form of the national anthem is prescribed by law. Removing it from the infobox for Tagalog would be denying that the language was--even at least at one point in time--written with Baybayin. Mr. Gerbear|Talk 15:59, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

Hello, including it in the article is fine by me no doubt. I am just skeptical of including it in the lede paragraph. I think the Baybayin transliteration should be inserted in Tagalog language#Writing system instead since it already tackles it there despite it not being an official script.

Including a non-official script is kind of common sense to not include since you can write any language you want in a particular writing system that isn't officially bound to it like Russian in Latin letters for example. So I think that we must stick to official scripts unless a provision or law does make Baybayin an alternative script for the language. PyroFloe (talk) 19:39, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

The problem here is "official." English is not "officially" written in the Latin script. Neither is Tagalog. There is no "official" way of writing either language, so I'm afraid that that argument isn't sufficient. I will concede to remove Baybayin from the lede, yes, but I don't think the argument should be because it's not "official". Latin script for Tagalog is simply customary, widespread, and conventional, but not official. I will revert my own edit, only per WP:LEADCLUTTER as I really can't find any Wikipedia policy on this, and simpler ledes are better. Thank you for your input! Mr. Gerbear|Talk 20:02, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

If I may way in, "common" would be a better criterion than "official" (which latter is not applicable here, and not a policy). Baybayin is the heritage script of Tagalog, and readers will occasionally encounter it (most probably on a peso banknote), but in the lede, only the commonly used writing should be used. Changes are low that readers will encounter "(wikang) Tagalog" written in Baybayin in Tagalog/Filipino texts about the Tagalog language, unless these explicitly have Baybayin as topic. It's more about due weight in a summary. –Austronesier (talk) 20:29, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

Absolutely, I agree. My apologies to PyroFloe in particular for my hasty judgment. Mr. Gerbear|Talk 21:52, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

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Reversions at Ferdinand Marcos

Hello, Mr. Gerbear. I hope my little tweaks at Ferdinand Marcos didn't hinder you too much in your reversions. I know it's sometimes a whole lot easier to fix an onslaught of unhelpful changes if nobody has fiddled with the page in the meantime. I debated with myself whether to wait for others to weigh in and possibly revert, or go ahead and make some minor fixes. I guess maybe I should have waited. Thanks for your work there, IAC. — JohnFromPinckney (talk) 21:24, 9 March 2021 (UTC)

Hey, no problem! It was a fun little challenge to figure out how to put things back together. The other user did have a couple of constructive edits, too, which complicated the reverting process a bit. Thank you for your work, too! Mr. Gerbear|Talk 21:44, 9 March 2021 (UTC)

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