User talk:Trappist the monk/Archive 17

Fix[edit]

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 2409:4065:E8C:C5D7:6A4B:465D:15C1:E917 (talk) 16:20, 11 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

How to fix it, I have tried to request an edit but the response is like the above?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2409:4065:12:47C1:1920:9B63:797F:8AC2 (talk) 19:31, 19 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Broken citation template[edit]

Monkbot broke a citation template here (line 310). It seems to have tried to eliminate "| ref = harv" and left the "2" alone on the line. I restored it, but perhaps that line needs to be gone completely? My brain goes funky when confronted by Harvard references. (Ping me when replying — I’m editing really intermittently these days.) — Gorthian (talk) 07:46, 22 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. That's been fixed.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:31, 22 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Have you fixed it in the bot's code? I just used some primitive insource searching to pre-emptively find and modify a couple dozen articles using "ref=harvxxx" so that the bot would not break them, but I know that I have missed some. I think our count of known article breakage is now up to six or seven (I know there have been hundreds of thousands of edits), and I am sure there are more broken and not-yet-broken instances out there. Is it really that hard to ensure that there is a pipe or brace following "harv" before removing it? Given that |ref=harv is not a broken state, is it worth breaking articles to remove it? – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:55, 22 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

See this diff.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 14:52, 23 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I missed this edit. Well done! – Jonesey95 (talk) 00:28, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Randomization[edit]

At Special:Diff/996774116 you asked for any advice on improving Module:Sandbox/trappist the monk/random sort. It looks like you made the mistake described in the second and third paragraphs of Fisher–Yates shuffle#Implementation errors. Since the error doesn't seem relevant to the discussion there, I brought it here instead.

Changing to r_idx = math.random (i, #source) should fix it to match the second code snippet at Fisher–Yates shuffle#The modern algorithm. Anomie ⚔ 19:14, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I did not know that there was such a thing as the Fisher–Yates shuffle. I'll implement you fix.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:58, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Disagree with task 18: cosmetic, convert language names to codes[edit]

For List of 2016 albums, Monkbot performed Task 18 (cosmetic), which included User:Monkbot/task 18: cosmetic cs1 template cleanup#convert language names to codes. I disagreed with that decision and reverted all the language codes back to clear English, with the following edit summary as my reasoning: Reverted some edits by Wiki-bot as preference. Prefer language mention for translated articles to be spelled out in clear language rather than by country code, as clearer to the casual user.

Per Template:Cite book#Title: "language: The language (or a comma-separated list of the languages) in which the source is written, as either the ISO 639 language code (preferred) or the full language name." Although language code is preferred, the template allows for full language name, and it is my preference as a non-programmer to use clear English when possible. Without evidence of a debated upon and decided upon decision, I see this as preference, and will impose my preference on some articles. However, if there has been a debate, I would love to see the link, so that I can not be obstructionist. Mburrell (talk) 22:29, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I have added List of 2016 albums to the bot's skip list.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:04, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Can all the other <List of 20xx albums> be added to the bot's skip list? I have already gone through each of the lists from List of 2005 albums to List of 2021 albums and adjusted the archivedate to archive-date, archiveurl to archive-url, and accessdate to access-date, and just don't want to deal with the language translation.

I did appreciate the empty parameter clean-up you did, more because it revealed where I had forgotten to add a date or an author than that it was empty. Thank you for taking the time to do this excellent work. I know people generally speak up when upset or to challenge you, and I want to take the time to say thank you for doing this mostly thankless task. Mburrell (talk) 23:16, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Added.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:29, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Salafi jihadism[edit]

I am sorry, I reverted your edits on Salafi jihadism, can you please do them again but without reverting my edits. Thanks Kiro Bassem (talk) 05:55, 29 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Stop Monkbot[edit]

Hi. Per this comment, please can you stop your bot. Thank you. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 14:42, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination of Noor Siddiqui for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Noor Siddiqui is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Noor Siddiqui until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

FalconK (talk) 02:32, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Is this really a good idea? It's concealing a multitude of sins[edit]

Well, I wonder how good an idea this is. It serves beautifully and powerfully to make it hard to detect empty parameters, always a *useful* sign of sloppy editing. Take this Monkbot edit which, it claims presumably truthfully: "(Task 18 (cosmetic): eval 89 templates: del empty params (266×); hyphenate params (26×); del |url-status= (14×);)". That is TWO HUNDRED AND SIXTY SIX pieces of sloppiness being swept under the carpet in one swift stroke. In that case a little search of the history reveals that some days earlier, "an editor" made this edit which added many of those incomplete citations. Nobody picked it up at the time; I wasn't watching the article, as it happens.

I think the bot should not be deleting empty parameters, for at least two reasons:

1) often, as just exemplified, empty parameters indicate incomplete citations, including vital details like publisher, URL (!), and page numbers. Just deleting them leaves a much more difficult task of detection, as (for instance) a simple search for "<param>= |" returns nothing.

2) sometimes, editors intentionally add empty parameters to mark items for further work; these are not always critical defects but may be desirable (e.g. non-mandatory URLs may be available for books or news items).

Perhaps this aspect of the bot's behaviour needs reconsideration. Chiswick Chap (talk) 17:50, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There are thousands upon thousands of articles that use cs1|2 templates where the templates hold superfluous empty parameters. It is not possible for the bot to know why editors leave empty parameters. It is not possible for editors to know why other editors leave empty parameters unless the 'leaving' editors also include some sort of note explaining why they have left this or that parameter empty. My experience is that empty parameters left by editors tend to remain empty. Any interested editor can add parameters with values at any time to improve upon existing templates so leaving empty parameters as teasers for other editors is not necessary. Unless editors bestir themselves to improve a cs1|2 template, the template will not be improved regardless of any 'tantalizing' parameter left empty by a previous editor.

If removal of empty parameters were truly a bad idea, the community would have long since risen to object. That the community have not objected after 600k+ edits suggests that removal of empty parameters is not a bad idea.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:56, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Alternatively, people may respect the good work you do on templates and just accept the things they don't like being imposed on them out of respect. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 23:00, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm one of those. I wholeheartly support the main task but consider three of the sub-tasks counter-productive, the removal of what-looks-like a template parameter in HTML comments (which trashes some comments), the removal of the valid |url-status= parameter with values different from live if no |archive-url= is given at the same time, and the unconditional removal of empty (known) parameters. I do support their removal if caused by the introduction of empty template prototypes but not if they were individually and deliberately added by editors to indicate an important missing parameter to other editors (and themselves).

I raised my concerns and proposed a more reasonable conditional removal process (based on a threshold value for the number of allowed empty parameters in a citation template), and also proposed a general alternative:

I didn't raise my concerns in the BRFA for Monkbot 18 because I didn't want to be accused for causing the general approval process to stuck (again), but I don't like the completely unnecessary collateral damage it creates.

Counting "not being reverted often" as indicator for support for the changes is, I think, a two-bladed sword. It could also be that the good changes (the main task) overrule the questionable ones, or that people value the otherwise good work and, peaceful as they are, don't want to escalate a conflict. After all, reverting someone's good-faith edits should only be done when absolutely necessary.

TTM: My experience is that empty parameters left by editors tend to remain empty.

My experience is a different one. It often takes a long time (months, sometimes years) for the empty parameter to be filled (or removed as unfillable) by editors, but eventually it gets addressed. Also, I find this to be a decades-long established "ad-hoc communication model" between editors working on articles and/or improving citations.

--Matthiaspaul (talk) 18:24, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

And I have seen multiple cases where it was obvious that the editor just copied the boilerplate from the template doc, filled in what they understood and left others to clean up the mess. Fortunately we now have a bot for that. --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 20:12, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The big issue with bots like this though is the noise they generate. When your watchlist suddenly grows to dozens of entries per day it does become an issue. You either examine each one (in case they are obscuring a real edit) which takes an inordinate amount of time, ignore them, or give up and simply delete the watchlist until the bot has finished its run. That's why I asked for an estimate of the duration, apparently it will last for 5-8 months. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 23:27, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I have seen those cases as well (that's what I meant by template prototype above) and it's good that we have a bot to clean this up, but in the current implementation the bot fixes 100% of them, but at the same time also removes "legitimate" other uses which makes it more difficult to improve citations for editors. My observation is that in most of the first type of cases, many parameters (often dozens) are empty, whereas in most of the second type of cases, only a few parameters are empty. If the bot would not remove empty parameters if there are less than, say, four or five of them in a template, it would still catch the majority of cases of the first type, while leaving alone the majority of cases of the second type. There might be other criteria, but they would be more complicated to implement. Thereby we could still get rid of the bulk of bad uses without hindering the good ones - like most good-faith human editors would do applying common sense and good editorial judgement. It would not be perfect, but better than the current "sledge-hammer" approach.

--Matthiaspaul (talk) 10:18, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Happy New Year![edit]

Empire AS ^Talk! — is wishing you a Happy New Year! It's the last day of 2020 and tomorrow will be 2025. Hope the coming year brings pleasures for you. Have a prosperous, enjoyable and a productive 2025. This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!

Spread the New Year cheer by adding {{subst:New Year 2}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Empire AS ^Talk! 18:21, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom. :-D —John Maynard Friedman (talk) 18:34, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Syncing leading to loss of translations[edit]

Please do refer to Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration. You have made a syncing recently from Sandbox that has led to loss of translations in the module. So, while syncing your changes, please confirm that the translations are not getting lost. Adithyak1997 (talk) 16:55, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Someone at ml.wiki imported versions of en.wiki's Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration on top of the existing (translated) version at ml.wiki. My name appears in the module's edit history because I am the editor who updated the en.wiki live module from its en.wiki sandbox. I did not do the import at ml.wiki because I do not have the necessary rights to do that. The en.wiki version of the module suite does not have translations for any of the other-language wikis that use the cs1|2 module suite. Translations are the responsibility of those other wikis, in your case, ml.wiki is responsible for its own translations.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:01, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Citation is a mess[edit]

After this edit, reference #161 was mashed up with the citations following and lots of css. I’m not sure what happened, and I cannot undo the edit. — Gorthian (talk) 01:01, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Because someone added <nowiki>...</nowiki> tags to |title= in the cs1|2 template:

{{Cite web|url = http://www.mtv.com/videos/my-super-sweet-16-justin-combs/1632432/playlist.jhtml|title = <nowiki>My Super Sweet 16 | Justin Combs</nowiki>|date = |accessdate = 27 May 2014|website = MTV|publisher = Viacom|last = |first = |archive-url = https://web.archive.org/web/20140531025431/http://www.mtv.com/videos/my-super-sweet-16-justin-combs/1632432/playlist.jhtml|archive-date = 31 May 2014|url-status = live}}

The bot removed the closing </nowiki> because it is inside an empty parameter:

{{Cite web|url = http://www.mtv.com/videos/my-super-sweet-16-justin-combs/1632432/playlist.jhtml|title = <nowiki>My Super Sweet 16 |accessdate = 27 May 2014|website = MTV|publisher = Viacom|archive-url = https://web.archive.org/web/20140531025431/http://www.mtv.com/videos/my-super-sweet-16-justin-combs/1632432/playlist.jhtml|archive-date = 31 May 2014|url-status = live}}

Mediawiki then treats everything after the remaining opening <nowiki> tag as inside a proper pair. I have fixed the template but it should probably be replaced by someone who knows what it it supposed to cite because the original url and the archive urls are all broken.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 01:32, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Greek places, language code changes[edit]

Here's a fun one for you. Monkbot's edit to Mesopotamo, Thessaloniki caused a duplicate reference error because it (unnecessarily, IMO) changed a clear full-text language name to a language code, causing a conflict with a previously identical reference in {{Infobox Greece place}}. That template is transcluded by 3,000 articles. I think that the template and its transclusions may need to be processed by the bot in a batch, or the reader-comprehensible language names may be better left alone. Or a third, even better way, which you are often good at coming up with. – Jonesey95 (talk) 05:54, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This search suggests that there are 25ish articles that have the template and are also in Category:Pages with duplicate reference names. I've added those to the currently running batch.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:56, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. It seems like this will continue to happen with templates and their transclusions. It might be worth reconsidering the quasi-random nature of Monkbot's page selection process. It might be better to operate from a list of templates that contain named references, along with pages that transclude those templates. There are probably not that many to process. (I know that is just a sample, but it's only 300, not 30,000.) I do not envy you all of the noise you are experiencing; you are a stouter soul than I. Let me know if there is any way I can help. – Jonesey95 (talk) 16:46, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Here is a search that includes all cs1|2 templates; looks for |accessdate= in named templates; and omits ~/doc, ~/sandbox, and ~/testcases pages. It finds about 150 templates. Alas, I don't know how to automate the assembly of a list of articles that transclude those templates except to fetch that list of templates and with some regex slight of hand create a 'what-links-here' link and then copy/paste the result to a master list of articles. Ugh.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:02, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I think it might be only 30 or so. I removed the software version templates from the list, since they don't seem to be affected (and should have only one or two transclusions). Here's the list of templates and transclusions from those 30 or so. – Jonesey95 (talk) 16:56, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done. The bot skipped these:

Template:LDS sects/Mormon fundamentalist – two templates previously fixed
Template:LDS sects/Mormon fundamentalist/doc – no templates
Template:MinorPlanetNameMeaningsDisclaimer – {{bots|deny=AWB}}; fixed
Template:OpenDNS IP addresses – page is protected; fixed

It also skipped all of the meanings of minor planet names articles except:

—Trappist the monk (talk) 18:46, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Super. I hope it helps reduce the duplicate ref name errors, and the concomitant noise. Happy new year. – Jonesey95 (talk) 07:15, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Tooltip change[edit]

I'm not too familiar with the protocol for CS1|2 changes, when it comes to a static tooltip string discussed Help_talk:Citation_Style_1#Intent_of_url-access=limited this is a good idea that could probably be done boldly without much problem. Could it be done in the code hot or should it go through sandbox? -- GreenC 14:39, 7 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The current wording was contributed by Editor Headbomb at this edit which is a modification of the original wording contributed by Editor Pintoch at this edit. I am always in favor of discussion and the use of the sandbox, controversial or no. Discussion should, I think, continue at Help talk:Citation Style 1 § Intent of url-access=limited. Unless something is severely broken, the usual process should not be usurped.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 15:59, 7 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(And consider waiting sandboxing until the release this weekend. --Izno (talk) 22:09, 7 January 2021 (UTC))[reply]

Need help[edit]

Hi Thedhananjayroy (talk) 16:59, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

In pawan singh wiki page have wrong official website, plz remove that website. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pawan_Singh Thedhananjayroy (talk) 17:00, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It would be best for you to make this request at Talk:Pawan Singh so that editors familiar with the subject can make whatever changes are needed.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 17:05, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Top views in one day Update[edit]

KGF Chapter 2 Teaser 78 Million in One day Duggu2001 (talk) 20:54, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It would be best if you took this issue (if there is an issue) someplace else.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 20:58, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It be[edit]

Done Estalit (talk) 22:34, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Access-date and accessdate[edit]

Hi Trappist the monk. Why is it necessary to hyphenate "accessdate"? This edit seems to just add bytes to the page. Thank you for your bot; I am in awe otherwise. -SusanLesch (talk) 14:32, 10 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

cs1|2 is moving away from the all-run-together forms of multiword parameter names. Currently nine such parameter names are deprecated and support for many more has been withdrawn. See the lists at Help:CS1 errors#Cite uses deprecated parameter |<param>=. Monkbot task 18 is preemptively changing |accessdate= to |access-date= (along with other multiword parameter names that are not yet deprecated) so that we avoid the bloodbath of Cite uses deprecated parameter |accessdate= error messages when |accessdate= is eventually deprecated. Such a bloodbath is guaranteed to cause editors to rise up with their torches and their pitchforks wherein drama will ensue. The bot has made more than 850k edits with relatively little drama.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 15:01, 10 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the pointer to deprecated parameters. I guess I am just oldfashioned. 😃 -SusanLesch (talk) 15:45, 11 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Redfern railway station[edit]

Before the visit by Monkbot today, this article had reference 7 as<ref name=NSWEnvironment&Heritage>{{cite NSW HD|4801095|Redfern Railway Station Group|accessdate=|date=}}</ref>. In change [1] this was changed to <ref name=NSWEnvironment&Heritage>{{cite NSW HD}}</ref> which causes an error at the target site. This has been reverted. Can we be sure this will not happen again? Fleet Lists (talk) 01:37, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the notification; bot tweaked.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:13, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

What's new? (Except the year)[edit]

Hey there, man! :)

Firstly I'd like to wish you a happy new year! May it be better than the one we left behind! Judging by past cases, this will probably be a long conversation so let's start it good. :)

Secondly, I had mentally planned to deal with the module update for SqCommunity in January (after finally having been able to give enough autonomy to Smallem to take care of its works alone) and your edit on the CS1 help page lately gave me the last push I needed. So, what's new overall? Before I start dealing with the update. - Klein Muçi (talk) 08:38, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And to you.

The list of things that have changed, with links to the discussions that spawned them, is at Help talk:Citation Style 1 § module suite update 9–10 January 2021.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:00, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, okay then. Thank you! I'm waiting for that change to happen first and then doing it there. Even though it will be more obvious when dealing with the configuration page, have any categories been changed/added/removed? I remember you were talking about standardizing some of those a couple of months ago. - Klein Muçi (talk) 11:02, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Module:Citation/CS1/doc/Category list. Because that is a dynamic page, as soon as the module suite is updated, the list will change so if you want to know the differences, grab a copy before the update.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:48, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, yeah. I know. We discussed it the last time. I just wanted to prepare myself mentally if there are a lot of changes in categories because that really means a lot of work for me since I wouldn't have to only deal with the module update itself but also with category creation (names + descriptions + Wikidata links) and other changes related to them in our graphs we use for keeping up with them. (Double almost everything given that I need to look after Wikiquote too.) So... :P But never mind, I'll check everything up when the time comes. - Klein Muçi (talk) 13:23, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, so I started the updating process. First of all, I have a question related indirectly to the CS1 module. Check the references here. You'll see an error written half in English, half in Albanian. Any idea where is that error modified so I can translate it properly? - Klein Muçi (talk) 10:46, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There are 185 error messages on that page. The half English / half Albanian one did not make itself obvious; which one? Or, are you talking about the help-link label? If that is the case then lines 85 & 86 at sq:Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:26, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

No, I wasn't referring to any of those but thank you for pointing out the help thing because apparently I had accidently switched it in English during the update. Let me ruin the module on purpose so you can see what I mean. Just a second... - Klein Muçi (talk) 12:32, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Please, check it now. Tell me when you have so I can turn it back to normal again. - Klein Muçi (talk) 12:35, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Now there are 266 errors. Which one? Just give me the text of the message or a reference number.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:38, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Everyone. It reads: Lua error in Moduli:Citation/CS1 at line 2654: Përpjekje për të lexuar një ndryshore globale boshe is_set. The Lua error in part is in English. It should be in Albanian. Also in the part Përpjekje për të lexuar një ndryshore globale boshe is_set., the is_set part should be formated differently from what it is. Where do I change these? - Klein Muçi (talk) 12:42, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I wasn't seeing that error message in the original; just the cs1|2 error messages. The 'Lua error in' comes from MediaWiki / Scribunto so you probably have to address that through phabricator. What do you mean by the is_set part should be formated differently?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:53, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Isn't there a module responsible for all that?

With that I mean that, if I understood it correctly, the is_set part is the part where the error has happened. The global variable, if I'm not wrong. (I'm in very murky waters here as I have a lot of difficulties understanding the message properly.) So, if that's really the case, the is_set part should be on bold, italicized, put between quotes, after a colon or in different color. Anything to distinguish it from the normal part of the sentence. The same logic could also be applied to the Moduli:Citation/CS1 part or the number line. Basically, in general, when faced with cases like these, we like to distinguish from what is "normal language" and what are "technical terms" (which are usually "hard-coded" in English), all that to make it easier to understand in non-tech users' eyes. I mean, to put it simply, if I can hardly understand what I'm reading, a lot of other users will have it way harder than me. And that's an error MANY users are presented to because it goes on every article those few hours I'm updating the module, every time there is a need to do that. Making it easier to understand would make the obsessive compulsive edits many editors make during those hours in their articles trying to "fix" the citation they're adding or the panic in their help cries in different talk pages be a bit lower.

I'm fixing the module now that we both know what we're talking about. - Klein Muçi (talk) 13:14, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

sq:Moduli:No globals. At en.wiki, the nil global is not set off by any punctuation. You are, of course, free to include whatever punctuation you want in your copy of the module.

At the risk of being unduly repetitive, sandbox the module updates before you update the live modules. The MediaWiki / Scribunto error messages are really for developers and not for the general public precisely because the message is technical and refers to something that the general public cannot fix. Those who are technically competent to fix the error don't need special punctuation to understand what the message says.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:47, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(If "Lua error in Moduli:Citation/CS1 at line 2654:" really is wanting for translation, which I agree with Ttm that the value is really low, then TranslateWiki is the place. --Izno (talk) 15:56, 12 January 2021 (UTC))[reply]

Oh, I see. It's not something that is set on SqWiki apparently. What would be the ideal approach here? Like, what would my ticket at Phab be like (in general lines)? And yes, Trappist, you're right. And, if you remember, the last time I told you that I haven't been able to do that because the whole documentation infrastructure is very weak in SqWiki and I always had a lot of updating to do in regard to CS1 so I couldn't find time to deal with it (Smallem got me a lot of time to set up). But this time I was done with it pretty fast so that's what I'll start dealing with since today. Hopefully we'll start having our sandbox versions soon.

One "generic" question before I start dealing with the doc/sandbox/testcases part: From the new changes, I don't believe there is anything that could be regexified, no? Like categories ref=harv or nocat. Asking for a (bot)friend. :P - Klein Muçi (talk) 22:04, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I believe I found the responsible message at Translatewiki for what I was searching for: Here. I changed it and I'm waiting some days to see if it fixes anything. But I can't find the "at line" part there. :/ - Klein Muçi (talk) 22:37, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know anything about translatewiki but the error message is supposed to include a line number so, shouldn't the error message read: Gabim lua te $1

Surely fixing a lot of those 'Burimi ka parametra të panjohur' errors is something that a bot friend can do...

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:43, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes I thought of that too but I saw the other versions in other languages and they didn't include that part. Maybe that's in a different message. Or maybe I'm just wrong on that part. I'll check it again after 24 hours. As for the bot (Smallem in this case) I was referring to the new categories that were added. We've talked in the past quite a lot about fixing positional parameters if you remember but you couldn't devise a failproof way for those and given that every regex idea risked having too many false positives, we left that to be fixed manually. :P - Klein Muçi (talk)

No, you're right about Translatewiki. The other languages do include that. I was unlucky of seeing a bad example. - Klein Muçi (talk) 23:39, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Uses of an unreliable source across WP[edit]

A discussion I was part of yesterday about an unrel music/ent news source being used across music articles reminded me to ask you if there's a bot capable of detecting all instances of an unreliable source being used across WP and tagging them w the unreliable source template. I see monkbot on pages I monitor all the time and figured you're probably the best person to come to. If the above is not possible, what about a notice appearing when one attempts to save an edit that uses an unreliable source, similar to the one for blacklisted sources? Part of the problem arises from people not being aware in the first place that a particular source is generally considered unrel on WP or by a particular WikiProject and thus there's no real way to stop its continued usage. -- Carlobunnie (talk) 02:01, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Without a doubt. That isn't something that I'm interested in doing but you might start a conversation at WP:BOTREQ. I guess that I would be surprised if there isn't some already-approved bot that does that sort of thing.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 02:08, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

nopp= not supported by sfn[edit]

Looks like you've taken on a labour of Hercules Trappist.... Regards Keith-264 (talk) 23:31, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

No templates in headers ...

Not so Herculean; something to do while I'm listening to the debate about the 25th amendment.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:34, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is that something to do with a dead bloke becoming President? ;O) Keith-264 (talk) 23:38, 12 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Has nopp always been deprecated? Keith-264 (talk) 08:30, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Something that has never been supported cannot be deprecated.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:59, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

FWIW, I have created Category:Pages using sfn with unknown parameters. I think that I have correctly tracked all of the supported parameters in the template parameter check, but the documentation is a bit diffuse, so I may have missed a couple. – Jonesey95 (talk) 18:56, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Stupid question[edit]

Hi there Trappist. Is there any way so that I won't see the changes made by your bot in my watchlist? - LouisAragon (talk) 23:46, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@LouisAragon: See WP:HIDEBOTS (talk page stalker). Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 23:54, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A toast sandwich for you![edit]

Most of the editors have forgotten your bot has been maked the 1 billion minus 1 (999,999,999th) edit to Wikipedia at today, but I remember. Congrats. Alcremie (talk) 06:15, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I noticed! Recorded both here. FWIW, congrats on being oh so close! But you have to admit, it was quite fitting for who got the billionth. --DB1729 (talk) 01:55, 14 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Monkbot operating twice in a row with task 18?[edit]

This is just a curiosity more than anything — I noticed that on 2018 United States House of Representatives elections in New York, Monkbot made two sequential edits: [2] and [3]. Was the code of Monkbot changed at some point so this page had to be revisited, or did something else occur? Elliot321 (talk | contribs) 06:11, 14 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

{{cite tweet}} was added to the list of templates that task 18 processes; since removed and now part of task 18b.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:50, 14 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Iceland.[edit]

Iceland will never become an EU country! Vladimir Skokan1 (talk) 10:15, 14 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is the wrong venue if you wish to discuss Icelandic politics.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:51, 14 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Acklam Grange School[edit]

Hallo, Monkbot's recent edit to this page generated a notice to me that a link had been created from this page to Scarborough Convent School, a page I created. No new link had been created, but the bot seems to interact with the {{Schools in North Yorkshire}} template in some way to trigger this irritating fake notice, the umpteenth I've had as the bot seems to be working through a lot of schools with the template. Presumably everyone else who created a school article, if they've set the same notification option, is getting the same regular unwanted notice of a non-event. Can something please be done to stop Monkbot from triggering these notices? Thanks. 80.234.189.226 (talk) 20:31, 15 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know what notification you are talking about. I cannot find your ip address in the article histories of either article. You claim that you created Scarborough Convent School but according to the article's history, that article was created by Editor PamD.

The single link from Acklam Grange School to Scarborough Convent School is in {{Schools in North Yorkshire}}. Monkbot's edit to Acklam Grange School did not touch that template. But, Editor Bleaney added Scarborough Convent School to the template with this edit so I suspect that the notification was triggered when Monkbot edited Acklam Grange School which caused MediaWiki to use the new version of the template. That means that any edit, not just a busy bot, would have caused MediaWiki to send you the notification.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 21:02, 15 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The post was from me, PamD: editing user talk pages on my mobile has become very odd in the last few weeks and in struggling to make that edit I seem to have done it as an IP. The same may happen to this one. The fact that the Convent School was only recently added to the template makes sense of the notifications, I hadn't realised that your edits would make a new version of the template be picked up. Thanks for the explanation. 80.234.189.226 (talk) 00:00, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

sfn fixes - where?[edit]

Hi, re this edit - apart from altering some hyphen-minus to en-dash, what exactly did you fix? The page is still in Category:Pages using sfn with unknown parameters. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:17, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, it's still in that cat because of this in West Somerset Mineral Railway § Decline and closure:

{{sfn|Sellick|1970|=p=75 & opposite p. 65}}

There are five articles in the category with that malformed parameter, not really enough to write a regex to fix – but, because we're talking about it, and because I've written the regex to find them, I may just do that.

In the midst of hunting for and replacing |С=, |с=, and |з= (Cyrillic capital es, small es, and small ze – haven't seen capital ze) with |p= and |pp=, I noticed that a bunch of articles use hyphen-minus and em-dash (where they should be using en-dash) and/or using |P=, |PP=, and |Pp= (where they should have been using lowercase). Since I was there, I went through the whole category fixing those along with most of the Cyrillic parameter names. That is why West Somerset Mineral Railway was edited.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 20:56, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Task 18 request[edit]

Monkbot just hit one list that I have been crafting for sometime, List of Pro Bowl players, I–K‎. Can you please queue up the remainder of pages in this list series? They are:

Thank you, caknuck _° needs to be running more often 05:06, 15 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

done.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:26, 15 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! caknuck _° needs to be running more often 21:14, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Task 18 taking out reference spacing[edit]

Hey, I'm wondering if this behaviour can be tweaked:[4] - Monkbot has gone through hundreds of articles that I watch to hyphenate "accessdate", but is also removing spacing in the process. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 00:26, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The commonly accepted style for vertically oriented templates does not include blank lines. As a normal part of its process, Monkbot task 18 removes blank lines from vertically oriented cs1|2 templates whether or not it removes an empty parameter; simpler and therefore more reliable, and consistent with the commonly accepted style for vertically oriented templates. Because it is checking every cs1|2 template in an article, blank lines, whether the result of task 18 actions, the result of another bot's actions, or the result of an editor's actions, are removed. The bot cannot distinguish the latter of these two from styling anomalies. From the first version, task 18's documentation has noted that blank lines within vertically formatted cs1|2 templates are removed.

Is there a rationale for the blank lines that precede the first pipe in vertically oriented cs1|2 templates? Why is this 'style' not also applied to the vertically oriented {{ONint}} templates in Ontario Highway 117?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:53, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Personally it's a style I've just used over the past decade or so... I use different slightly different spacing for tables, infoboxes and references so that they are easily picked out from one another in a wall of text (ie. {space}|{space}param for citations, |{space}param for tables, and |param for infoboxes). I wasn't aware there was a commonly accepted style for wikitext markup, but I am aware that there is a policy against automated cosmetic-only edits. Task 18 doesn't seem like it should run unless there is an additional edit being performed, and hyphenating parameters doesn't really qualify as that. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 17:39, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You're right, cosmetic-only edits are generally discouraged but, there is this sentence in WP:COSMETICBOT:

"Consensus for a bot to make any particular cosmetic change must be formalized in an approved request for approval."

Task 18's BRFA is here: Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/Monkbot 18.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 17:52, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Alright... well that doesn't mention anything about removing spacing or prior discussions about these actions. I see no mention of spacing, and the closing note is:

"For the record, this bot task is being done so that future improvements to the cs1|2 template family will not have to deal with improper parameters, old copies of deprecated parameters, and otherwise hacking together support for multiple outdated or soon-to-be-invalid parameters."

So I'll be more blunt... where did you arrive at the thought that this is (or: that there is a) "commonly accepted style", what does it accomplish, and please disable it from doing something that serves no purpose. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 22:24, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Above, I quoted the mention of spacing from the task 18 documentation. That quote has been in the documentation from the beginning. That documentation page is linked from the BRFA (3× by me, 1× by another) because I didn't want to rewrite the documentation in the BRFA. That editors at the BRFA did not choose to discuss the spacing aspects does not change the fact that task 18 does remove blank lines in vertically oriented templates and that the documentation has always said that it does.

For commonly accepted style see: Wikipedia:Citation templates § Examples; see the 'big four' cs1 template docs: Template:Cite book § Usage, Template:Cite journal § Usage, Template:Cite news § Usage, Template:Cite web § Usage; see the template docs for the templates used in Ontario Highway 117: Template:Cite map § Usage, Template:Cite report § Usage; and see the template docs for pretty much every other cs1|2 template. No blank lines.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:40, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Cool, that's template documentation, not commonly accepted styles. Guess I'm adding {{bots|deny=MonkBot}} and undoing about 250 edits per MOS:STYLERET. Looks like that "consensus" is pretty against this at the bots noticeboard... is there a reason you linked me to a stale discussion rather than a current one? - Floydian ^τ _¢ 00:56, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You are of course free to see-but-not-see that the template docs do show the commonly accepted style for vertically oriented templates. Were the commonly accepted style other than it is, the template docs would show that other style.

You suggested that the bot should not be running. I then quoted the sentence in WP:COSMETICBOT that describes the requirements for a bot to make cosmetic edits (a WP:BRFA). I then linked to task 18's BRFA that authorizes because linking to anywhere else would not make any sense in the context of the discussion.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:08, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That's an association fallacy, but anyways, I started off by asking you to remove the bit that is removing blank lines. When you pointed me to the BRFA, I then mentioned that the approval stated "For the record, this bot task is being done so that future improvements to the cs1|2 template family will not have to deal with improper parameters, old copies of deprecated parameters, and otherwise hacking together support for multiple outdated or soon-to-be-invalid parameters." To which I inferred that the removal of spacing is a rider. I am all for standardising template parameters, but don't fiddle with spacing in templates! - Floydian ^τ _¢ 23:31, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Monkbot accessdate skip[edit]

Hey Trappist, happy new year to you. In this edit, Monkbot performed Task 18, then came back about a month later and made this edit, fixing one of the accessdates, but in the intermediate edits no new "accessdate" was added, meaning that Monkbot didn't notice the straggler. Is it possible this happens often? Thanks and regards, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 19:19, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Between 2020-11-28 and 2020-12-08, task 18 did not change |accessdate= to |access-date=. During that period, task 18 edited approximately 163,000 articles. Some of them (most of them?) have |accessdate= so the bot is revisiting. Indian Television Academy Awards is one such.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:39, 16 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, I see the issue was my misinterpretation of what Monkbot fixed. Sorry. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 16:30, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Umm, not your misinterpretation. There was nothing to misinterpret. How are you to know from the information that you can glean from the article history that the bot was operating differently on the two occasions that it edited Indian Television Academy Awards? You can't, so you asked; no need to apologize for asking.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:32, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Please stop vandalism by Monkbot[edit]

Please fix Monkbot so that it stops destroying comments that are useful for humans editing reference sections. Example: here. Thanks. Boud (talk) 17:53, 11 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There are no comments in your example.

Because editors may have any number of reasons that the bot should not edit particular citations and an attendant number of ways to bring that about, task 18 maintains a list of articles that it will not edit. This is mentioned in the lead of the bot's documentation page which is linked from every edit the bot makes. Give me a list of articles that you think should not be edited and I will add those to the bot's skip-list. The skip-list already has sixteen of your articles.

By far the most common mechanism that editors use to 'hide' template skeletons is to the wrap the template skeleton inside html comment tags. Monkbot supports this so from your example you might write:

{{void| templates (examples):

<ref name="..."><!-- {{cite web | last1 = | first1 = | last2= | first2= | authorlink = | coauthors = | language = | title= |trans-title = | website= |date = | url = | access-date = 2020-|archive-url= |archive-date= 2020-|url-status=live |url-access = }} --></ref>

<ref name="..."><!-- {{cite news | last1= | first1= | last2= | first2= | language = | title= |trans-title = | date= |newspaper= | url= |access-date=2020-|archive-url= |archive-date= 2020-|url-status=live |url-access = }} --></ref>
}}

support for |coauthor= and |coauthors= was removed years ago...

You can also 'break' the template skeletons by inserting a space between the opening braces: { {cite web ...}}}; the bot ignores such malformed templates.

Easiest is for you to give me a list of articles that the bot should not edit.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:15, 11 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You could also just skip anything in {{void}} Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 23:55, 13 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Giving a list of articles where I've felt that templates like this are appropriate (e.g. if I start them, or there is very little content), including future articles, would require extra work for me, a human, and would also prevent Monkbot from doing the fixes that are actually useful. (Thanks for the comment on coauthor(s) deprecation.)

I'm not convinced about your suggestion that html comment tags are the usual solution, because that's what I've been doing for a very long time, until a few weeks or so ago, and Monkbot modified the content inside the html comment tags. This might be a problem with Monkbot not being able to handle nested html comment tags: 

I switched to {{void}} after reading the documentation that this is designed as something nestable and specifically useful for temporarily disabling code. It sounds ideal for robots. I agree with Headbomb. Unless there is a good reason for Monkbot to work on content inside {{void}} templates, the simplest solution is for Monkbot to conserve the content inside {{void}} templates. (Obviously, if there were vandalism or banned URLs or dangerous code, an exception would be justified, but Monkbot doesn't handle those types of issues, AFAIK.) Boud (talk) 23:13, 18 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Wot, is the bot not autoconfirmed?[edit]

It bemuses me, but also vaguely soothes my existential angst, that an illustrious bot's edits can also somehow get trapped in the pending changes protection. :) Cheers, --DoubleGrazing (talk) 14:00, 19 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

According to Special:UserRights/Monkbot, the bot is implicitly autoconfirmed so perhaps there is an issue with how MediaWiki handles bots? Previous bot edits appear to have been automatically accepted which suggests that something at MediaWiki has changed.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 14:21, 19 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The prior editor was not AC. PC is working as expected. --Izno (talk) 16:22, 19 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, this edit by an unconfirmed editor had not yet been accepted when Monkbot made its edit. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:02, 19 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I've been meaning to ask[edit]

Are you really a monk? Inquiring minds want to know. E Eng 21:31, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

the snow falls softly

melting on my extended

tongue is poor haiku?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:35, 17 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is EEng to conclude from this that Trappist the Monk is sticking his blessed tongue out at me? E Eng 15:16, 21 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Deleted categories mid-Jan[edit]

Regarding the various categories you deleted related to Help talk:Citation Style 1/Archive 74#module suite update 9–10 January 2021 (such as Category:Pages with URL errors and Category:Pages with citations using unsupported parameters), is there a reason *not* to simply redirect them to the new names? Many of these have a number of incoming links, and a redirect causes no harm. ~ Amory (u • t • c) 12:06, 22 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you want to redirect those dead category names, I have no objection. It appears that most of the incoming links are from notices written by the now deactivated ReferenceBot so there is little benefit to be gained from redirecting those links.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:57, 22 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Edits break template[edit]

This edit breaks the citation template; the two vertical bars are needed for the correct parameter to be used as the author-link. Yes, I'm aware that use of the parameter |author-link= would overcome this problem but I suspect there might be a few hundred occurrences of the double vertical bar with Template:DNZB. Would appreciate your thoughts; please ping when you reply. Schwede 66 11:31, 26 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. Thanks.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:54, 26 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Cite palaeontology[edit]

Above template currently calls Template:Citation/core which is, uh, missing out on everything our beautiful modules do now. Could you convert it to use the template wrapper module? --Izno (talk) 06:06, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I could but why? That template is used in less than ten articles. None of them work. Might it not be better to simply convert all instances of the template to {{cite journal}} and then add |archive-url= etc (if an archived copy exists) and then tfd {{cite palaeontology}}?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:59, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Just wanted to avoid drama when my mission is elsewhere. I agree that 10 uses is not favorable to its general utility. If you looked and the documented functions do not work as expected, I see no issue with conversion to modern CS1/2. --Izno (talk) 18:17, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Cite_OEIS[edit]

Hello Trappist, appears to be a problem with this edit as it causes a double accessdate. Keith D (talk) 15:33, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Fixed.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 15:36, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Belt Parkway[edit]

Hi! You may notice that the bot's edits were a casualty of reverting some stealth vandalism here. Not sure if you need to go back over it,or the bot will find it again, but flagging if you need. StarM 18:42, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the note. Task 18 will likely revisit. Sometime...

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:14, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Requesting you add List of 2021 albums to Monkbot's skip list[edit]

Trappist the Monk, I would request that you add List of 2021 albums to your skip list for Monkbot. I had a good conversation with you earlier, archived at User talk:Trappist the monk/Archive 17#Disagree with task 18: cosmetic, convert language names to codes, and you had added the various List of 20xx albums to a skip list, but recently, List of 2021 has been bot'd twice, converting fully spelled out country languages with coded country languages, and twice I have reverted. Thank you for the work you do, I am just rejecting this change for these lists. Thanks. Mburrell (talk) 06:29, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Done.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 11:50, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

List update[edit]

I moved this to Wikipedia talk:Bots/Requests for approval/Monkbot 18, but your input is needed there. Primefac (talk) 19:09, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Monkbot task 18 and articles nominated for PROD[edit]

Can you kindly program the bot to avoid all articles in Category:All articles proposed for deletion? Me, and other editors, watchlist articles that are PRODded, in order to see if information that should lead to the PROD tag being removed or if a user removes the PROD tag and another check to see if a follow up with AFD is needed. For whatever reason, Monkbot has been running task 18 through articles proposed for deletion, which makes it much harder to monitor changes to these pages. I see no reason why articles proposed for deletion should be considered priorities for purely cosmetic bot edits, especially given the disruption of the watchlist. If this is not done, I will be manually adding {{bots|deny=monkbot 18}} to every article I propose for deletion. In fact, given that these edits are clear and blatant violations of WP:COSMETICBOT, that there is absolutely no consensus to deprecate non-hyphenated parameters, and the fact that I have valid personal reasons for preferring |accessdate over |access-date, I will be adding the monkbot task 18 denial to any pages I intend to significantly edit. Hog Farm _Talk 16:21, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is it true that all pages in Category:All articles proposed for deletion include the {{Proposed deletion/dated}} template?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 16:37, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

They will. Files and books have different prod templates, but task 18 does not operate in those namespaces, so that will be fine. Apologies for the harsh tone of the above. I was frustrated and got a little uncivil. Hog Farm _Talk 18:23, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Bot now skips any article that has {{Proposed deletion/dated}} and {{Prod blp/dated}}

—Trappist the monk (talk) 21:54, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Hog Farm _Talk 23:08, 31 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Monkbot 18[edit]

Just as an update, I've put Task 18 on hold for the moment; I've explained fully at Wikipedia:Bots/Noticeboard#Monkbot_18. I'll put up an RFC about the rest of the task in the next day or two. Thank you for your patience, both in dealing with this hiccup as well as with the pushback. Primefac (talk) 00:28, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

accessdate[edit]

Consider this message "pushback" on automatically changing |accessdate= to |access-date=. I don't think it is helpful. —Anomalocaris (talk) 22:31, 5 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Relativistic_Doppler_effect&diff=cur&oldid=863562194[edit]

The indicated link above is where this bot made the addition:

<<< The converse, however, is not true. The analysis of scenarios where both objects are in accelerated motion requires a somewhat more sophisticated analysis. Not understanding this point has led to confusion and misunderstanding. >>>

probably as a biased response to the controversy about the novelly discovered extra-energy-shift between emission and absorption resonant lines concerning Mössbauer spectra for a co-orbiting source and absorber at the rotor rim the way first tackled by Walter Kündig (1960s). Please modify the indicated passage in terms of the following list of references where Prof. Kholmetskii et al. have dismantled all such notions of so-called "relativistic solutions" (such as the debunked "synchronization effect") that allegedly clear away "confusion and misunderstanding":

[1] KHOLMETSKII A. L., MISSEVITCH O. V. and YARMAN T., Phys. Scr., 78 (2008) 035302.

[2] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., MISSEVITCH O. V. and ROGOZEV B. I., Phys. Scr., 79 (2009) 065007.

[3] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T. and ARIK M., Ann. Phys., 363 (2015) 556.

[4] YARMAN T, KHOLMETSKII A. L. and ARIK M., Eur. Phys. J. Plus, 130 (2015) 191.

[5] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T. and ARIK M., Ann. Phys., 374 (2016) 247

[6] YARMAN T, KHOLMETSKII A. L. and ARIK M., et al., Can. J. Phys., 94 (2016) 780.

[7] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., Eur. Phys. J. Plus, 133 (2018) 261.

[8] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., J. Synchrotron Radiat., 25 (2018) 1703.

[9] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., Ann. Phys., 411 (2019) 167912.

[10] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., Int. J. Mod. Phys. D, 28 (2019) 1950127.

[11] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., Ann. Phys., 409 (2019) 167931.

[12] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., Ann. Phys., 418 (2020) 168191.

[13] KHOLMETSKII A. L., YARMAN T., YARMAN O. and ARIK M., J. Synchr. Rad., 28 (2021) 78.

Prof. Dr. Ozan Yarman — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ozanyarman (talk • contribs) 14:22, 6 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have no idea what you are talking about. Monkbot task 18 made two edits to that article, the first on 3 December 2020 (diff) and the second on 12 January 2021 (diff). Neither edit added the text that you have quoted.

If you have concerns about the Relativistic Doppler effect article, the place to raise those concerns is at Talk:Relativistic Doppler effect; not here.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 14:37, 6 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Old edit request[edit]

Question about an old discussion here, from early 2020: Template talk:Nihongo foot § Template-protected edit request of 30 March 2020.

My edit request there seemed to reach the low bar of consensus needed (support from Opencooper and Nihonjoe) for such a minor change, and I am unsure why it was declined. I see that the Lang/utilities functions have since been split out to Module:Nihongo like you suggested, so my question is if you could simply make the requested change (adding a comma), or if I should open a new edit request at Template talk:Nihongo (I felt like this would be a bit redundant for something so minor).— Goszei (talk) 22:45, 6 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

To learn the reason why the edit request was declined you must talk to the editor who declined it; that editor was not me. The declining editor appears to be Editor Amkgp.

Still:

{{nihongo foot||デッドマンズQ|Deddomanzu Kuesuchonzu}}^[1]

References

^ デッドマンズQ, Deddomanzu Kuesuchonzu

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:15, 6 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Question[edit]

Hello again Ttm, is it possible to have fixed/ unsortable rows in a sortable table? For example, in a given table we can add the header as an unsortable footer to help with reading, but say a table is 300 rows, and we wanted to add the header intermittently, eg after every 50th row, to further help with reading; can those intermittent header rows remain in place after sorting? Currently they would just bunch up, which can then have an adverse affect on reading, plus the page often has to be refreshed to reset the table to its initial sort. I checked both Help:Table and Help:Sorting, but did not see an apparent solution and I was curious to see if you might know of one. Thanks in advance for any insight you may have. Cheers - wolf 21:31, 7 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know of any way to do that.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:50, 7 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks anyways - wolf 00:58, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is not possible in the middle of a table. You are looking for class sortbottom or sorttop, but these function only with the top and bottom rows.

Having a header mid-table is not the correct solution regardless as it makes the table confusing for screen readers. You should consider installing the "experimental" sticky table header gadget (though I don't know if it supports Chromium browsers) and/or recommending that for editors. --Izno (talk) 01:07, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Another alternative is to break these into smaller tables along some interesting line, perhaps the default sorting. See WP:DTT. --Izno (talk) 01:09, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination for deletion of Template:Cite rt[edit]

Template:Cite rt has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the entry on the Templates for discussion page. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 22:32, 9 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yet another Monkbot thread[edit]

Following up on my thoughts from the BOTN discussion, have you talked to CampariVA? She's a researcher interested in human-bot interactions on Wikipedia, and her insight may be helpful for you as you work on the RfC. Like I said at BOTN, I think the problem with task 18 is largely a PR problem, not the bot task itself (see also Human–robot interaction#Methods for human-robot coordination), so her work and findings might help you convince people to not be afraid of our new vacuum. — Wug·a·po·des 21:24, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Elsewhere I wrote: I cannot, I will not, be the one to write an RFC because I am biased. I intend to keep to that so I will not be working on any rfc related to the work that task 18 might do.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:52, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A shame, but completely understandable given the situation. Thanks for all of the work you do around here, even if we don't add RfC drafting to that long list. — Wug·a·po·des 03:13, 4 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

— Just jumping in here to say my collaborator Momobay and I are looking for people to interview about bots on Wikipedia! If you have worked with, argued about, built, or just developed a mild opinion about bots, we're interested. Hit me up and I can set up a short interview over your favorite platform. CampariVA (talk) 16:29, 10 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you have questions, ask.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 16:59, 10 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hania Amir[edit]

Hania Amir birthday is on 12th February not 11th please correct it check her insta — Preceding unsigned comment added by 14.0.164.202 (talk) 11:38, 11 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The place to discuss this is at Talk:Hania Amir; not here.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:42, 11 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

FBC[edit]

Học Hỏi FBC86 (talk) 11:49, 11 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is clearly meaning Learn In Vietnamese, Please make Constructive sections in talk pages. LooneyTraceYT (talk) 17:59, 14 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Module:Language/data/iana languages[edit]

You'll have to excuse me for not being familiar with whatever the IANA language-subtag-registry file might be. It certainly doesn't sound like a Wikipedia content policy, so I'm unclear as to why using the commonly accepted name of a language is something that must be reverted due to it. To be clear, there is no Pacific Gulf Yupik article, as you can see it redirects to Alutiiq language. Beeblebrox (talk) 22:47, 14 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The IANA language-subtag-registry file is used by browsers and screen readers so that they can correctly render/speak text from a variety of languages. The reference for all browsers and screen readers when it comes to languages is the subtag-registry file. That file derives from various international standards (ISO 639, ISO 15924, etc).

Module:Language/data/iana languages is used by {{lang}} and the {{lang-??}} templates which we use to tell browsers and screen readers that this text is spoken or rendered in a manner different from the normal English. Because the subtag-registry file is a living document, it is periodically updated. When it is, we update Module:Language/data/iana languages (and a handful of other modules) to stay in sync with the master. Any manual changes to those modules are overwritten during the update.

I have made the change in the appropriate place:

{{lang|fn=name_from_tag|ems}} → Alutiiq

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:25, 14 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Still not sure I get why it has to work that way, but this whole thing has been a peek into what seems to be a rather obscure realm of Wikipedia. I appreciate the change. Beeblebrox (talk) 23:33, 14 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Language subtag registry update[edit]

Hey, sorry to bother you but an update to the language-subtag-registry came through the IANA mailing list a few days ago. I tried to update the various Module:Language/data subpages using the script but don't have permission and saw you were the one regularly updating it. Cheers, josecurioso ❯❯❯ Tell me! 11:35, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Basketball Tournament[edit]

Hey Monkbot - when you Google The Basketball Tournament, the Wikipedia snapshot shows Jonathan Mugar as the Founder and Nick Elam as the "Creator." This is not accurate. Nick Elam is the creator of the Elam Ending, but not the tournament. Can we fix whatever is causing this to appear? Thanks a bunch! — Preceding unsigned comment added by JBrownTBT1 (talk • contribs) 16:52, 22 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If there is something wrong with the en.wiki article then the best place to discuss that is at Talk:The Basketball Tournament. If you are talking about the google knowledge panel of stuff at the right side of the google search results page, then perhaps you should be talking to Google because en.wiki does not have any control over what google puts in that panel (there is a feedback link at the bottom of the panel that you might try).

—Trappist the monk (talk) 17:13, 22 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Spain flag at the 1980 Summer Olympics[edit]

Hello! Can you see if it is possible to correct the mistake regarding the Spanish flag at the 1980 Summer Olympics. They used the Spanish Olympic flag during that games. Mvh Sondre --80.212.169.236 (talk) 15:45, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Probably best to raise that issue at Talk:1980 Summer Olympics or at Template talk:Medals table. I'm not sufficiently interested in sports to be interested in figuring out how the underlying Module:Medals table works to attempt a fix.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 16:04, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Senja[edit]

Hi Trappist the monk, I was wondering how to fix the CS1 error in that one. Thank you for your time. Lotje (talk) 16:03, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The cs1|2 error merely indicates that the template is missing |archive-url= and |archive-date=. The bigger problem is that the archive url doesn't work. From the current https://www.met.no/en/free-meteorological-data/Download-services page, the link to eKlima.met.no (actually http://sharki.oslo.dnmi.no/portal/page?_pageid=73,39035,73_39049&_dad=portal&_schema=PORTAL) doesn't work either. So, a better source is needed or someone needs to tell met.no that their website is broken...

—Trappist the monk (talk) 16:22, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you Trappist the monk, hopefully the problem will be solved soon. I just do not like the red in articles.

Lotje (talk) 16:31, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Help with regex/bash scripting[edit]

Hey there, Trappist! :)

I wanted to ask you something. You know of Smallem and all of its regexes. Its source code is made out of 1 command and a +46k list of regexes as arguments. It has been some months I'm using it even on SqQuote beside SqWiki and this requires, at least according to my current understanding, having another copy of that code with the addition of "family:wikiquote" on that command. Now, I don't really like the idea of having 2 separate source codes (changing by literally just 2 words) because you know how the regexes require updates every once in a while and copying those 46k lines on bash usually takes me around 20 minutes (that's 20 minutes of execution time after pressing the command "Paste"). By having 2 separate scripts that time is doubled and if Smallem is activated on another project that number only goes up. So I devised a way of having 1 single file for arguments and getting the arguments from there for each wikiproject's "unique" script. Now on the normal way, the regexes are like this:

"First word" "Second word" When parsed, quote marks are automatically stripped and the robot does its job happily.

In the second method, I can't use quote marks apparently because they aren't automatically stripped. The workaround I found on this is to just simply use them without quote marks and it works very good. Entries get replaced like they should. The only problem is when doing regexes to remove words.

On the normal way, that would have been written like this:

"Word to be removed" ""

With the second method, that would look something like this:

Word to be removed

But this is the part when the script gets confused and thinks of it as missing the replacement word (it sees everything as 1 entry only) and it keeps giving me an error while saying that the replacement command is incomplete. Do you have any ideas how can I find a workaround towards this given your knowledge on regex? How can I imply "nothingness" without using quote marks? I know this falls a bit outside your usual activity but I thought of asking nonetheless because you already know how Smallem works in general and it had been quite some time without saying hello. LOL I hope I've been able to explain clearly what I'm asking because it's really easy as a question. Even though I've not been able to find an answer to it yet. - Klein Muçi (talk) 23:07, 14 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If I understand what you are saying, before the change you made, each of the 46k lines had the form:

"regex expression" "replace string"

with the change, you had to remove the quotes. Is that right? Without the quote mark delimiters, how does smallem know where the regex expression ends and the accompanying replace string begins? White space is a perfectly legitimate element of a regex expression so something must delimit the regex expression from the replace string so that smallem knows which is which.

If this is all inside a bash script, and the bash script holds a command line to piwiki bot, can't you make the bash script smarter so that it determines when to change the two words based on a bash command line parameter?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 00:10, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, you understand perfectly. Even better than me apparently because I hadn't stop to think how Smallem was able to distinguish between the 2 strings. I only noticed that it worked and didn't put much thought into it. Basically what I did was that I copied those 46k lines of regexes on a page and made 2 scripts (one for Wikipedia, one for Wikiquote) that had in them 1 single line (the main command) + the mapfile command that copies everything from that other page and "transcludes" it there (using Wikipedia jargon). When I did this I noticed that even though the script was working without any errors, it wasn't changing anything. I opened up the debugging mode and I saw that if I put the regexes directly, when parsing, "regex expression" "replace string" was turned into regex expression replace string, while if I did "the template way", the regexes were turned into "regex expression" "replace string" and that's why it wasn't changing anything because it didn't treat quote marks as metacharacters/delimiters, "the template mode" parsed everything you put into it ad verbatim. That's what made me understand that removing quote marks would fix the problem and so it did but I don't know how actually the script it's able to differentiate between strings. I think maybe that's because space is a metacharacter on its own because if you want to use it as space (plain character) you need to escape it. That's why I hoped that regex expression would work on its own but apparently it doesn't. :/ As for your suggestion, I believe technically that's doable but it's outside of my abilities at the moment. After all, as I said, all I did was basically create a template for those 46k regexes and transclude it at each script specific for a Wikiproject. I was hoping for a solution that basically keeps "the general logic of replacement" even when removing. For example, instead of saying "when you find X, remove it", we could have something saying "when you find X, replace it with Y" (because we know that that thing works) and the "Y" to be something that basically is nothingness. But I don't believe such a "character" exists, does it? After all, even white space is something. Or any workaround/hacking of the same sort. - Klein Muçi (talk) 01:32, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I reread the documentation page. On it you can see this regarding regex arguments:

First unnamed argument is the old text, second argument is the new text. If the -regex argument is given, the first argument will be regarded as a regular expression, and the second argument might contain expressions like \1 or \g<name>.

And also this:

Should either the old or the new text contain spaces, use quotation marks!

Soo... I guess it uses spaces as delimiters and, if that's to be used as a character, it uses quotation marks? I don't know how to use that information to help me in my case of removing strings instead of replacing. Basically when "the new text" is nothing. - Klein Muçi (talk) 01:45, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

PS: It seems I should be using fixes instead of mapfile for that purpose. It would function organically with the overall pywiki script and it wouldn't have problems in parsing. I'll retry it tomorrow. If it works, I should change the Smallem module. - Klein Muçi (talk) 04:39, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Update: Fixes.py work perfectly. The transclusion part works as intended in replacement and in removal by autostripping the quotation marks. Can you help me change the Smallem module so the results are changed from

this template: "(\{\{\s*cit[aeio][^\}]*\|\s*language\s*=\s*)English(\s*[\|\}])" "\1en\2" \

to

this template: (r"(\{\{\s*cit[aeio][^\}]*\|\s*language\s*=\s*)English(\s*[\|\}])", r"\1en\2"),? - Klein Muçi (talk) 15:17, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Ok. Do you want each pair on a separate line or do they need to be jammed one after the other as a single line?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 15:29, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Each pair on a separate line. The script now is more or less this:

fixes['Smallem'] = {
    'regex': True,
'nocase': True,
    'msg': {
        '_default':'Smallem: Përmirësime teknike dhe rregullime të gabimeve me referimet',
    },
    'replacements': [
(r"(\{\{\s*cit[aeio][^\}]*\|\s*language\s*=\s*)-onbikannte-Schprooch-(\s*[\|\}])", r"\1und\2"),
(r"(\{\{\s*cit[aeio][^\}]*\|\s*language\s*=\s*)-ongerscheidlijje\ Schprohche-(\s*[\|\}])", r"\1mul\2"),
(r"(\{\{\s*cit[aeio][^\}]*\|\s*language\s*=\s*)AEBko\ ingeles(\s*[\|\}])", r"\1en-us\2"),
    ... 40k lines
(r"\|\s*ref\s*=\s*Harv\b", r""),
(r"\|\s*dead-?url\s*=\s*(?:true|yes|y)\b", r"|url-status=dead"),
(r"\|\s*dead-?url\s*=\s*no", r"|url-status=live"),
(r"\[\[Kategoria:CS1\]\]", r""),
(r"\[\[Kategoria:Gabime\ CS1[^\]]*\]\]", r""),
(r"\[\[Kategoria:Mirëmbajtja\ CS1[^\]]*\]\]", r""),
(r"\[\[Kategoria:Vetitë\ CS1[^\]]*\]\]", r""),
(r"\[\[Kategoria:Gjuhë\ CS1\]\]", r""),
]
}

- Klein Muçi (talk) 15:35, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, try it. Example at sq:Përdoruesi:Trappist_the_monk/Livadhi_personal

—Trappist the monk (talk) 15:41, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Perfect! Greatly appreciated man. It's been all these times you've helped me. :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 16:24, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(talk page watcher) @Klein Muçi: The <poem>...</poem> tag pair is not very suitable for use in the situation above; you would almost certainly find that <syntaxhighlight lang=python>...</syntaxhighlight> is much more appropriate. More at mw:Extension:SyntaxHighlight. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:47, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Redrose64: thank you a lot! I've been struggling to find something like that. - Klein Muçi (talk) 20:58, 15 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, Trappist, quick question. This list

Extended content

aa, ab, ace, ady, af, ak, als, am, an, ang, ar, arc, ary, arz, as, ast, atj, av, avk, awa, ay, az, azb, ba, ban, bar, bat-smg, bcl, be, be-tarask, be-x-old, bg, bh, bi, bjn, bm, bn, bo, bpy, br, bs, bug, bxr, ca, cbk-zam, cdo, ce, ceb, ch, cho, chr, chy, ckb, co, cr, crh, cs, csb, cu, cv, cy, da, de, din, diq, dsb, dty, dv, dz, ee, egl, el, eml, en, eo, es, et, eu, ext, fa, ff, fi, fiu-vro, fj, fo, fr, frp, frr, fur, fy, ga, gag, gan, gcr, gd, gl, glk, gn, gom, gor, got, gsw, gu, gv, ha, hak, haw, he, hi, hif, ho, hr, hsb, ht, hu, hy, hyw, hz, ia, id, ie, ig, ii, ik, ilo, inh, io, is, it, iu, ja, jam, jbo, jv, ka, kaa, kab, kbd, kbp, kg, ki, kj, kk, kl, km, kn, ko, koi, kr, krc, ks, ksh, ku, kv, kw, ky, la, lad, lb, lbe, lez, lfn, lg, li, lij, lld, lmo, ln, lo, lrc, lt, ltg, lv, lzh, mad, mai, map-bms, mdf, mg, mh, mhr, mi, min, mk, ml, mn, mnw, mo, mr, mrj, ms, mt, mus, mwl, my, myv, mzn, na, nah, nan, nap, nb, nds, nds-nl, ne, new, ng, nia, nl, nn, no, nov, nqo, nrm, nso, nv, ny, oc, olo, om, or, os, pa, pag, pam, pap, pcd, pdc, pfl, pi, pih, pl, pms, pnb, pnt, ps, pt, qu, rm, rmy, rn, ro, roa-rup, roa-tara, ru, rue, rup, rw, sa, sah, sat, sc, scn, sco, sd, se, sg, sgs, sh, shn, shy, si, simple, sk, skr, sl, sm, smn, sn, so, sq, sr, srn, ss, st, stq, su, sv, sw, szl, szy, ta, tcy, te, tet, tg, th, ti, tk, tl, tn, to, tpi, tr, ts, tt, tum, tw, ty, tyv, udm, ug, uk, ur, uz, ve, vec, vep, vi, vls, vo, vro, wa, war, wo, wuu, xal, xh, xmf, yi, yo, yue, za, zea, zh, zh-classical, zh-cn, zh-min-nan, zh-tw, zh-yue, zu

that I get when using Module:Smallem for listing all possible languages, is it static? I believe it is prone to change, isn't it? I'm experimenting with Smallem to make it know how to autoupdate its code and I thought I could copy-paste the list somewhere and teach it to feed values to the module in batches and copy-paste the results and remove duplicates (what I do manually when I update it) but I believe ideally speaking I shouldn't make a static list of it, no? - Klein Muçi (talk) 12:19, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't change often, but it does change.

If you can invoke sq:Module:Smallem to create the find/replace strings, then you can invoke Module:Smallem to get the list of language codes:

{{#invoke:Smallem|lang_lister|list=yes}}

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:44, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That's what I suspected. Thank you! :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 23:39, 16 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Continuing on the said experiments, if I have this text:

Extended content

Jump to search

aa, ab, ace, ady, af, ak, als, am, an, ang, ar, arc, ary, arz, as, ast, atj, av, avk, awa, ay, az, azb, ba, ban, bar, bat-smg, bcl, be, be-tarask, be-x-old, bg, bh, bi, bjn, bm, bn, bo, bpy, br, bs, bug, bxr, ca, cbk-zam, cdo, ce, ceb, ch, cho, chr, chy, ckb, co, cr, crh, cs, csb, cu, cv, cy, da, de, din, diq, dsb, dty, dv, dz, ee, egl, el, eml, en, eo, es, et, eu, ext, fa, ff, fi, fiu-vro, fj, fo, fr, frp, frr, fur, fy, ga, gag, gan, gcr, gd, gl, glk, gn, gom, gor, got, gsw, gu, gv, ha, hak, haw, he, hi, hif, ho, hr, hsb, ht, hu, hy, hyw, hz, ia, id, ie, ig, ii, ik, ilo, inh, io, is, it, iu, ja, jam, jbo, jv, ka, kaa, kab, kbd, kbp, kg, ki, kj, kk, kl, km, kn, ko, koi, kr, krc, ks, ksh, ku, kv, kw, ky, la, lad, lb, lbe, lez, lfn, lg, li, lij, lld, lmo, ln, lo, lrc, lt, ltg, lv, lzh, mad, mai, map-bms, mdf, mg, mh, mhr, mi, min, mk, ml, mn, mnw, mo, mr, mrj, ms, mt, mus, mwl, my, myv, mzn, na, nah, nan, nap, nb, nds, nds-nl, ne, new, ng, nia, nl, nn, no, nov, nqo, nrm, nso, nv, ny, oc, olo, om, or, os, pa, pag, pam, pap, pcd, pdc, pfl, pi, pih, pl, pms, pnb, pnt, ps, pt, qu, rm, rmy, rn, ro, roa-rup, roa-tara, ru, rue, rup, rw, sa, sah, sat, sc, scn, sco, sd, se, sg, sgs, sh, shn, shy, si, simple, sk, skr, sl, sm, smn, sn, so, sq, sr, srn, ss, st, stq, su, sv, sw, szl, szy, ta, tcy, te, tet, tg, th, ti, tk, tl, tn, to, tpi, tr, ts, tt, tum, tw, ty, tyv, udm, ug, uk, ur, uz, ve, vec, vep, vi, vls, vo, vro, wa, war, wo, wuu, xal, xh, xmf, yi, yo, yue, za, zea, zh, zh-classical, zh-cn, zh-min-nan, zh-tw, zh-yue, zu

Gabim Lua: bad argument #1 to 'len' (string expected, got nil).

and I want to do something similar to the top voted answer here (I believe it is easy to understand what I'm trying to achieve), what would my regex be like using "jump to search" and "Gabim Lua" as limits? Empty lines between limits and text may or may not be there always.- Klein Muçi (talk) 01:56, 18 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

How similar? in a sed command line?

sed -e '/Jump to search\s*$[a-z\-, ]+$\s*Gabim Lua/\1/'

Caveat, this is not tested.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:20, 18 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, don't worry about testing. Unless I say otherwise, everything on this thread is for testing purposes on my PC so I'll deal with the tests and ask for help again if that's needed. Thank you! :) - Klein Muçi (talk) 12:50, 18 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

So, I get this error: sed: -e expression #1, char 45: Invalid range end. Do you think it is related to the regex itself or am I doing something wrong in scripting? - Klein Muçi (talk) 10:11, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Apparently, it is related to the hyphen. :P - Klein Muçi (talk) 10:14, 19 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I tried today following the instructions mentioned in the page I brought in the above answer and ever omitting the ([a-z\-, ]+\) altogether, just to see what would happen and I still get a syntax error (sed: -e expression #1, char 32: unknown command: '\') and can't make it work. Do you have any ideas what I might do to troubleshoot it? Don't worry too much though because as I said, I'm just experimenting for new features. Smallem is still working fine. - Klein Muçi (talk) 09:44, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps try this: ([-a-z, ]+\).

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:32, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Now I get this: sed: -e expression #1, char 45: unknown command: `\'. Meh... :/ - Klein Muçi (talk) 18:27, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I think that I've noticed that the command line example that I gave above is malformed. According to this, the command line is missing the 's' command so the command line should read:

sed -e 's/Jump to search\s*$[-a-z, ]+$\s*Gabim Lua/\1/'

—Trappist the monk (talk) 11:46, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Now it doesn't give any errors but the regex doesn't work. It just catches the whole page. - Klein Muçi (talk) 10:02, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps the parentheses don't need escaping, so try:

sed -e 's/Jump to search\s*([-a-z, ]+)\s*Gabim Lua/\1/'

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:32, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

sed: -e expression #1, char 46: invalid reference \1 on `s' command's RHS (I'm sorry I'm making you spend energy on this. :/ ) - Klein Muçi (talk) 19:00, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This?

sed -r -e 's/Jump to search\s*([-a-z, ]+)\s*Gabim Lua/\1/'

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:24, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Works but doesn't work (catches the whole page). - Klein Muçi (talk) 19:32, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I would guess that by now you know more about sed than I do. I have no further ideas. The regex Jump to search\s*([-a-z, ]+)\s*Gabim Lua works (try it at https://regex101.com/ against the sample that you put in the second collapsed section above) so whatever the problem is, it must be something else... Since you can fetch the whole page, can you make a page that has only the language-code list (without the Jump to search and Gabim Lua...)?

—Trappist the monk (talk) 20:44, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It needs a s* in the beginning, no? And unfortunately, no. I was able to find a bash web browser (links2), login on SqWiki with Smallem and go to a page where the language-code list is. Then I searched for a command that I could use with the web browser to copy that code somewhere but I only found the "dump" command which unfortunately copies the whole page and has no regex mechanism, as far as I know. (I kinda think that there must be a way here but I haven't found it yet.) So I saved the results in a page and the next step was to get only the list. I saw some commands that could help on that. Awk, sed, grep... Sed looked the most promising and... You know the rest. The next step would be to fragment the list and somehow use it on wiki to generate the regex lists in a row and then combine them and overwrite the source code. This would be a very crude way to autoupdate Smallem and then I could work on making it more efficient on each step. But strangely enough we're getting stopped by the regex part in sed. Anyway, you've really tried a lot so thank you! :)) - Klein Muçi (talk) 21:23, 25 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Much to my surprise, I was able to make it work using the instructions explained here. The command was sed -n '/Jump to search/,/Gabim Lua/{//!p}' but I have almost no idea of the meaning of the syntax I'm using. If you understand it a bit more, feel free to clarify anything to me. :P Especially the {//!p} part. The only problem I'm facing now is that the results have 1 extra newline in the beginning of the language list. How can I make it so that gets removed as well? Strangely, sed -n '/Jump to search\r\n/,/Gabim Lua/{//!p}' didn't work. If I write it like that the command returns no matches. - Klein Muçi (talk) 02:24, 26 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Update: I was able to remove the extra newline with another command and fuse the results of both commands together. This concludes for a while the long Smallem epopee. As always, I'm really grateful for all the help I've always gotten here. - Klein Muçi (talk) 02:48, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Question[edit]

Hello Ttm, I'm hoping you can help me with a question regarding templates, table markup and sorting. I made a sample inflation table below, where amounts have been entered as ranges. When sorted, ranges are ranked per the lower number by default.

In the second column, the entries are plain text which can be ranked per the higher number using the {{sort}} template (including breaking a tie between Item 1 and Item 4).

The problem is with the third column, where to get the Inflation values for each range, the {{Inflation}} templates are placed within a {{formatnum}} template. There appears to no information for the formatnum template, and despite digging around, I can't seem to find any.

Sample Inflation table
Items	Amount	Adjusted
Item 1	$50-100	$97–183
Item 2	$60-120	$114–183
Item 3	$70-110	$93–219
Item 4	$40-100	$73–201

Would you know how to change the default to have the ranges in the 3rd column rank per the higher number? (and perhaps even break the tie between Item 1 and Item 2?) Either a markup string, or a template, or...something? Any info you can provide would be greatly appreciated. Cheers - wolf 05:41, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

{{formatnum}} is not a template but is a magic word. See mw:Help:Magic_words#Formatting.

Did you try:

{{sort|{{formatnum:{{Inflation|US|100|1999}}}}|${{formatnum:{{Inflation|US|50|1996}}}}–{{formatnum:{{Inflation|US|100|1999}}}}}}

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:15, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yep, that works. Thanks again. Cheers - wolf 18:01, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

		The Guidance Barnstar
		For all those times that I, and others, have sought guidance, which you've always provided readily and at a very reasonable rates! Cheers - wolf 18:21, 27 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

LL CoolJ (other ventures)[edit]

I was an artist on LL Cool J's Rock the Bells label, under the stage name "Pragmatic". I have the recording contract to prove it. Where can I provide my sources? RLee84 (talk) 18:44, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you are sufficiently notable, according to Wikipedia's Notability and/or Notability (music) guidelines, it is likely that someone will add information about you to the encyclopedia. It is best that you do not attempt to do this yourself because that would be a violation of Conflict of Interest guideline.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:06, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Spanish flag at the 1980 Summer Olympics[edit]

Hello! Can you correct the mistake regarding Spain's flag for the 1980 Summer Olympics. They used the flag for the Spanish Olympic Commitee during that games. They used the Spanish Olympic flag during that games. Yours sincerely, Sondre --62.73.207.204 (talk) 19:18, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Probably best to raise that issue at Talk:1980 Summer Olympics or at Template talk:Medals table. I'm not sufficiently interested in sports to be interested in figuring out how the underlying Module:Medals table works to attempt a fix.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:24, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have a feeling this is defined by Template:Country data Spain. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:09, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

South Korean flag at the 1984 Olympics[edit]

Hello! Is it possible for you to correct the mistake regarding the South Korean flag at the 1984 Summer and Winter Olympic Games. They used the flag from 1949 until 1984 until they switched flag in October of that year. See what you can do. Yours sincerely, Sondre --62.73.207.204 (talk) 19:16, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Probably best to raise that issue at Talk:1984 Summer Olympics, Talk:1984 Winter Olympics, or at Template talk:Medals table. I'm not sufficiently interested in sports to be interested in figuring out how the underlying Module:Medals table works to attempt a fix.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:24, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have a feeling this is defined by Template:Country data South Korea. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:12, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Monkbot[edit]

Is monkbot still running? I cleared out my watchlist last December to await its conclusion, is it safe to return to editing? Thanks, Martin of Sheffield (talk) 10:36, 7 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(talk page stalker) If you're talking about task 18 (cosmetic edits), it's currently disabled pending an RfC on deciding whether it should continue running. As a general note, you might want to disable "bot edits" in your watchlist to avoid seeing them. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 10:54, 7 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I thought about that, but then real edits get hidden. I thought it best just to keep my head down for a couple of months whilst the leadership sorted themselves out and then come back refreshed. Good to know it's disabled though, I'll return to editing now. Thanks. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 10:59, 7 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to hope that task 18 will restart...

Elsewhere, others have suggested this:

at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-watchlist:
- check Advanced options → Expand watchlist to show all changes, not just the most recent
- check Changes shown → Hide bot edits from the watchlist
at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-rc:
- check Advanced options → Group changes by page in recent changes and watchlist

—Trappist the monk (talk) 12:02, 7 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for that Trappist. I've implemented the suggested settings and hopefully that will make the system usable again.

Thanks for adding your two cents[edit]

Thanks for adding your two cents at the VPP RFC about parameter hyphenation. I hope that the closer actually reads the arguments and explanations rather than just counting votes. – Jonesey95 (talk) 19:28, 8 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Red linked name[edit]

If you want to answer questions at the Help desk, then please be helpful and informative instead of idiosyncratic and inscrutable. Thank you. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 21:15, 8 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Cameron[edit]

Hello Monkbot. I am imagician. Douglas Euan Cameron, aviator in No 1 RAF was my grandfather. The corrections I placed in his page are factual. You reverted them, but hope you can reinstate my fixes ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Imagician (talk • contribs) 16:12, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You are mistaken. Monkbot is a robotic tool that does not do reverts. Your edits were reverted by Editor Wyatt Tyrone Smith who noted that the changes you made to Douglas Cameron (RAF officer) were unsupported additions. If you have a problem with that, you should discuss it with Editor Wyatt Tyrone Smith.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 16:43, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

See Talk:Togoland Campaign[edit]

Talk:Togoland Campaign Do capital letters really matter? Regards Keith-264 (talk) 20:32, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Apologies, wrong editor, regards Keith-264 (talk) 20:34, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Removing unused template parameters when commented out[edit]

Please modify Monkbot to prevent it from removing unused template parameters when they are commented out. In general, Monkbot should ignore anything that is commented out. In this case, it removed a template for people to copy and paste when adding a new entry to a list. Thanks! ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WP Japan! 00:00, 16 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation link notification for March 16[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Babar Ahmed (director), you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Al-Bilad. Such links are usually incorrect, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of unrelated topics with similar titles. (Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.)

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 06:16, 16 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Articles containing traditional Chinese-language text[edit]

Hi, you recently edited Category:Articles containing traditional Chinese-language text, which is currently not hidden like it used to be. I don't know too much about how categories work, but I don't understand why you removed Template:Non-English-language_text_category. Could you take a second look at it? ◢ Ganbaruby!  (Say hi!) 07:02, 16 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

[last update][edit]

For CS1 Errors, if a source says [last update], how do I fix it, see an example here --つがる Talk to つがる:) 🍁 02:43, 23 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Someone has added the literal text string [last update] in the first citation right after putting the year value so those words get rendered together with the year. If you want it removed, just check your first citation and remove those words from there. A practical way: Open source code of that article, CTRL+F "[last update]", delete, publish changes. - Klein Muçi (talk) 02:51, 23 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, that ↑. However, the source itself isn't dated so |year=2011 seems like it is a made-up date. If you believe that source to be reliable according to simple.wiki's reliable-source rules, then perhaps |access-date= is a better choice. Same for the WolframAlpha source on that page. But, were it me, I would remove the WolframAlpha reference and the sentence to which is is attached because Julian dates are rarely referred to by an 'extrapolated' Gregorian date. If you do remove that WolframAlpha source and attached sentence, check the preceding year articles because they may also use this source (8 does, 10 doesn't).

And why is Halloween called out? Did (could) Halloween even exist in 9 CE? Perhaps modify the source url to be http://www.calendarhome.com/cgi-bin/tycyear.pl?year=9&change=1&suppresshol=1

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:06, 23 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Requesting recreation of Test page[edit]

Hello,

Can you please recreate the page Test page as a redirect to Wikipedia:Sandbox and fully protect the redirect as well? "Test page" has the same meaning as the sandbox and should be a redirect to the sandbox. 54nd60x (talk) 13:05, 25 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

In addition, please also create Talk:Test page as redirect to Wikipedia talk:Sandbox and fully protect the redirect as well. 54nd60x (talk) 13:06, 25 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not particularly interested in overriding a nearly decade-long status quo. If you feel it necessary, you might take up the issue at WP:VPM or some other venue more public than my talk page.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 18:53, 25 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Automated Url Archiver[edit]

Hello! I'm wondering if there is a bot that will read all the citations in a wikipedia page, recognize those ones without archive URLs and automatically archive the sites and then add the archive url and archive date. Does that exist?Brent Severnie (talk) 13:15, 3 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know. Best person to ask is likely to be Cyberpower678 who operates InternetArchiveBot.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:45, 3 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Are you related to User: FeloniousMonk?[edit]

Just curious. 69.5.112.154 (talk) 20:35, 3 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

[1] デッドマンズQ, Deddomanzu Kuesuchonzu

[1]