User talk:Vernon39/Archive 3

Archive made 26 February 2010: Archive 3 of User:Vernon39 return to User talk:Vernon39

Evolutionary history of plants

Eugh. I'd missed out a closing slash in one of the refs. All sorted now! Thanks for taking a look. Smith609 Talk 18:09, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Scouting for Boys

Thanks - I think I saw it last year but it'll take another viewing. DuncanHill (talk) 23:35, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

Category:Members of parliament for constituencies in Cornwall

Hi Vernon. I thought I'd let you know that the above category you created needs a capital 'P' for "parliament". I'm not sure if you use WP:AWB, but if not, you could add the category onto WP:CFR instead of doing it manually. Regards, Craigy (talk) 03:07, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

I have requested speedy rename at WP:CFR. DuncanHill (talk) 09:09, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

If I recall correctly, when a category is renamed, a bot goes along and fixes things. DuncanHill (talk) 21:49, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Meta

Hi Vernon, hope all is well with you and yours. I noticed you signed the community petition at Meta from an IP address. You shoul be able to log in to Meta using your Wikipedia username and password now with the new unified log in. DuncanHill (talk) 12:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the postcard - I hope things are well with you. DuncanHill (talk) 18:07, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Coeducational boarding schools

I see that you have created Category:Co-educational Boarding schools. The name is not compliant with WP style ("boarding" should not start with an upper-case letter), but more significantly I wonder about the purpose of this category (and whether there is a useful purpose to this category). Was this based on a discussion somewhere? --Orlady (talk) 20:15, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Sorry not to have been compliant. The new category may help to provide a basis for an article on early co-educational boarding schools and another on the history of changed attitudes to them. If you wish to change the title of this category, please can we preserve the hyphen in "Co-educational", please? Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 20:35, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for explaining your objectives. My concern was that this category is going to be very large when it is fully populated, because many of the world's boarding schools (see Category:Boarding schools) are coeducational. Instead of the global category, you might want to consider subdividing categories such as Category:Boarding schools in England and Category:Boarding schools in Ireland by gender -- I think that might be more useful for your project.

The inclusion or exclusion of the hyphen in "co-educational" doesn't worry me; it can be spelled either way. However, note that renaming of a category requires administrator involvement -- see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion. --Orlady (talk) 21:47, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Although I commented on the need for an administrator to be involved, the change in case for the first letter of the word should qualify to be a speedy renaming. --Orlady (talk) 23:00, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps it should be Category:Early co-educational boarding schools and cut off at 1900. I think that many UK boarding schools in the UK have introduced a second gender since 1980, or gone bust. Do you thinl an admin would be available to delete my ill-thought out category, or can I do it myself, one-by one. The category Category:Co-educational boarding schools (Correct capitalisation) could then be used for sub-categories as you suggest. However, we already have the article Mixed-sex education, which is a bit of a mess.Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 23:19, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm... It appears to me that your proposal of Category:Early co-educational boarding schools would not be consistent with the purpose of WP categories, as described at Wikipedia:Categorization (in particular, see Wikipedia:Categorization#When to use categories and also Wikipedia:Overcategorization). A better way to achieve your goal probably would be to write that article about the early history of co-education in boarding schools (writing a new focused article might be more efficient than attempting to repair all of the problems you perceive at Mixed-sex education), and include in the article an embedded list of the earliest co-ed schools.

As for the renaming, I'm afraid that only an administrator can rename or delete a category. A change from upper case to lower case to conform with WP:MOS could be done as a "speedy rename," but anything more complicated would require a discussion at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion. Doing it "by yourself, one by one" is frowned upon. --Orlady (talk) 23:52, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Speak truth to power

Speak Truth to Power is currently a redirect to an American Friends' organization - but I feel sure that as a phrase it has much more to its history. Any thoughts? DuncanHill (talk) 21:17, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

There's some discussion of this phrase at http://www.faqs.org/qa/qa-6697.html, in a form more familiar to me as "Speaking Truth to Power". I suspect that it does go back to the 17th C, when Fds lobbied successively, Oliver Comwell, Charles II, James II and William III for the release of large numbers of Quakers in prison and a change of the law making it less easy for them to be imprisoned. Quakers have a particular set of meanings associated with the word "Truth".Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 23:08, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Lewis Fry

Done. Can you just check it to make sure its ok? Francium12 (talk) 00:23, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Oxford Wikimania 2010 and Wikimedia UK v2.0 Notice

Hi,

As a regularly contributing UK Wikipedian, we were wondering if you wanted to contribute to the Oxford bid to host the 2010 Wikimania conference. Please see here for details of how to get involved, we need all the help we can get if we are to put in a compelling bid.

We are also in the process of forming a new UK Wikimedia chapter to replace the soon to be folded old one. If you are interested in helping shape our plans, showing your support or becoming a future member or board member, please head over to the Wikimedia UK v2.0 page and let us know. We plan on holding an election in the next month to find the initial board, who will oversee the process of founding the company and accepting membership applications. They will then call an AGM to formally elect a new board who after obtaining charitable status will start the fund raising, promotion and active support for the UK Wikimedian community for which the chapter is being founded.

You may also wish to attend the next London meet-up at which both of these issues will be discussed. If you can't attend this meetup, you may want to watch Wikipedia:Meetup, for updates on future meets.

We look forward to hearing from you soon, and we send our apologies for this automated intrusion onto your talk page!

Addbot (talk) 19:32, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Kathleen Lonsdale

Hello! I just added the category British Quakers to Kathleen Lonsdale. Her name is mentioned on List of Quakers, but she had no quaker category. Problem: was she british or irish (birth place)? I looked at this page because of an article in "Cahiers de la Réconciliation", Paris, Janvier 1963. -- MHM-en (talk) 19:40, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

She joined the RSoF in 1935, having been brought up as a Baptist and having moved to England with her parents, aged 5. I would say she was a British Quaker. I'll copy this to the Kathleen Lonsdale Talk Page.Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 21:06, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Pease & Fox

Hello Vernon. Thanks for yours. I'm new to this but am eager to learn and willing to help (cautiously), where I can. Charles681 (talk) 21:17, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Quaker Banks

Hello Vernon. In this new environment, I will only be happy to contribute, if I can offer anything meaningful. At this stage however, I am simply dipping my toes in the water. I cannot offer any authoritative view, for banking is now largely family history but might be able to assist with original source information, if pertinent to a particular line of explanation or where expansion may be required. Genealogically speaking, my main interest lies within the scope of Quaker enterprise and the manner in which Friends were very often family, though historically speaking, almost all family were Friends. Meanwhile, I value the communication and may trust to your guidance in these matters. Charles681 (talk) 19:27, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

No, I don't have a copy of Milligan's Directory but shall certainly be buying it from Sessions very shortly.Charles681 (talk) 10:22, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

George Fox dab page

You may wish to take a look at Talk:George Fox (disambiguation) --NSH001 (talk) 09:36, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Quaker-exclusion

At Talk:George Fox (disambiguation)#Dict-defs and less, for non-notable people you wrote

... BTW, Quakers were excluded from Oxford & Cambridge by their religion. I don't think GCF III (or was it IV) went to Uni.

You have me fascinated, perhaps especially in light of (IIRC) Newton's fictional Puritan roommate's experiences in Quicksilver (novel), including seeing a Quaker abused (murdered?) by a noble student (who, later, was at least in the royal retinue and maybe king or pretender; the trilogy/octalogy has far too many details to retain or, for me, even track the implicit ones while reading), and in light of this Fox's U-age coming over a century later. Are we talking about some kind of oath? About explicit exclusion of non-conformists? (Neal Stephenson might lie to me, uh, i mean us, about that.)
No doubt you've already guessed, for a dozen reasons, that i'm a colonial [wink], so please forgive my weak historical perspective on things British.
--Jerzy•t 20:43, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

I think that undergraduates at Oxbridge had to assent to the Thirty-Nine Articles of the Church of England. In 1836, University College was established and did not require religious conformity. Does this answer your enquiry? I am not familiar with the novel Quicksilver. Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 23:20, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

• Yes, that's quite helpful, and appreciated. (And BTW, thanks for the occasion to recall

  XXIX. Of the Wicked, which eat not the Body of Christ in the use of the Lord's Supper.

which ranks well up there on my list of unintentionally enlightening thots.)
You can of course read in WP about the book, and the other two volumes that go with it, and NS, and his other work. Personally, if find his scholarship and his willingness to harness it in support of his imagination exciting and challenging. He's usually not as florid as he was (in the novel that made him famous) in naming a main character Hiro Protagonist; i think it suggests his commitment to the spirit of "Hold on to your hats, boys; it's gonna be a bumpy ride!"
--Jerzy•t 06:01, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Swanpool

As you worked out, NQR was not quite right. There was nothing seriously wrong, the hat note(s)were just a little unwieldy. If I have the opportunity this morning (AEDT) I will have a go at creating the disambiguation page. Cheers, Mattinbgn\^talk 19:38, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

And it is now done. Have a look at Swanpool and make any cahnges you think appropriate. I have gone through the back links and think I have all the ones that are needed. If you like you can check again and fix any I missed. Cheers, Mattinbgn\^talk 20:05, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Guy Barnett

I have undone your reversal of Jim Knight's description of Guy Barnett on the latter's page. The source is clearly biased. Sorry to sound so dreary about something so trivial! :) 79.73.87.25 (talk) 16:36, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Cornish publishers

Thanks for your work on the Twelveheads Press. Do you feel inclined to a collaborative project on Cornish Publishers or publishers of material on Cornwall? Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 10:54, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

That was my intention- I picked Twelveheads as a try-out but didn't realise it would be so hard!!! Do you have a list of other publishers?Talskiddy (talk) 21:03, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Cornwall Editions, Alison Hodge, D. Bradford Barton . . . Would you like to set up a collaborative project within Wikiproject Cornwall? Perhaps we need some parameters - Publishers based in Cornwall OR publishers of material about Cornwall. Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 21:34, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Heres a list of one I have found so far. Talskiddy (talk)

• Tabb House
• Truran books Dyllansow Truran
• Cornwall Editions
• Polperro Heritage Press
• Alison Hodge Publishers
• Acorn House
• Acanthus Books
• Tor Mark Press
• Lodenek Press
• The Cornwall Review
• Alexander Associates

But what about:

• University of Wales Press
• Federation of Old Cornwall Societies
• Barracuda Books
• Independent Academic Press
• Tempus Publishing
• Halsgrove
• Royal Institution of Cornwall
• Cornish Hillside Publications
• Cornwall & Devon Media
• . . . Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 11:19, 27 November 2008 (UTC)

From a new article

"[William Clift's] only daughter, Caroline Amelia Clift, was married at New St. Pancras Church on 20 July 1835 to Professor (now Sir Richard) Owen, and died at Sheen Lodge, Richmond Park, on 7 May 1873, aged 70. A pleasing glimpse into her character is afforded by a passage in Caroline Fox's Journals (first ed. p. 137)." DuncanHill (talk) 21:51, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

New article

Just noticed this Falmouth Art Gallery and thought it might be up your street! DuncanHill (talk) 14:21, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

Tresidder/Municipal buildings

This report [1] confirms him as the architect. From a swift google it looks like he was at some point the borough surveyor for Falmouth. DuncanHill (talk) 20:19, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

169.244.136.204

FYI: I went ahead and blocked this IP, which you reported to AIV. It may have appeared as though it was not blocked, but this was due to you formatting the report incorrectly as "User:169.244.136.204", so that anyone looking into the report was looking at the contribution page of a nonexistent User:169.244.136.204 rather than IPvandal:169.244.136.204. No big deal. Just wanted you to know it was taken care of. Hiberniantears (talk) 20:23, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Anglican Pacifist Fellowship

Thanks for your work on this page. I have just added a lot more information. You may want to check for any inaccuracies or issues. Cheers. 202.138.16.73 (talk) 02:39, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Edward Long Fox

New article of interest - Edward Long Fox - needs your attention. Hope you are keeping well, DuncanHill (talk) 21:30, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Polypill

The Guardian article is interesting. New Zealand will be keen on this medication too because of their drug agency Pharmac which signicantly reduces drug costs. I think that Folic acid is falling out of favour for inclusion in Polypill Wazza (talk) 09:27, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

File:DSCN0721ArwenackAvenueFalmouth.jpg

Hi Vernon39. I'm writing to thank you for the above lovely image which is helping me in my research, and to ask you please whether it would be possible for you to upload another picture showing more clearly the row of houses on the left of the picture, i.e. on the south side of Arwenack Avenue, Falmouth. I understand that this row was built between 1939 and 1941 and was originally called the Arwenack Estate of High Class Houses. The architect of Church Army Chapel, Blackheath designed these Arwenack Ave houses as an architectural apprentice aged 16-18yrs. At the age of 16 he designed the Guildhall at St Ives File:Guildhall St Ives 1939.jpg. (I left this message on Commons for you, then realised you'd be more likely to see it on Wiki.) --Storye book (talk) 10:17, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Hi Vernon, very kind of you to agree to do this. I'm looking for what was originally called the Arwenack Estate of High Class Houses. Falmouth planning dept seems sure that the south side of this road is the estate. Looking at Google Earth, it is surely the row of very similar houses as shown in your photo on the left hand side. The ones with the hipped roofs and the bay windows with (originally) little panes.I would not include no. 28, which has a reddish-coloured roof while the others are pale grey. So I would include the grey-roofed ones on the south side of the road from 26 going north-west until I ran out of similar-looking houses.

It's tempting to wonder whether there is more Arwenack estate than just that row. On Google Earth there appear to be more houses with similar-coloured roofs in the area to the south-west and west of Arwenack Avenue - as far west as Trelawney Avenue, maybe. My source is a list of buildings that the architect wanted to be remembered for, written in his own hand shortly before he died. He called it an estate (not a row), and so did all his siblings, when they were alive. It would be interesting if you happened to notice whether those in the backstreets look more or less the same. If so, it would be very helpful if you could upload a pic of some of those too.

I would be really pleased if you could find some with original windows (i.e. not plastic) so that we can see what the original design was like. Your current photo shows only one with plastic windows, but that was two years ago.

The architect designed these as an architectural apprentice attached to Cowett Drewett and Wheatly of Penzance, aged 16-18, probably because everyone else was at war. I think he may have started his apprenticeship at age 14. Thanks for your help and I look forward to the photos.--Storye book (talk) 19:53, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for that, Vernon - very helpful. I'll contact the society and ask. Cheers.--Storye book (talk) 22:07, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for your message. Apologies for delay in replying; just returned from brief holiday. Thank you so much for putting those photos on Flickr. I hope it would be alright if I printed out one or two of your photos for inclusion in the archive? They will end up in the RIBA archives later this year. Thanks for the invite to help edit the Arwenack page. I didn't have much time today, but did add a few temporary external links at the bottom, for later use in inline refs. Hope some of them will be useful. I'll add a bit more later if I get time, but meanwhile please edit or remove my additions if you don't need them.--Storye book (talk) 18:06, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

Hi Vernon. Thank you for the message: yes of course you're welcome to edit the article as you think fit. That section does need some updating anyway - I had been waiting to do it as the St Ives archivist is sending me some research in the post which may give me some inline refs for the St Ives guildhall. But please change the subheading to suit your link.--Storye book (talk) 16:04, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Bolithos

The book you mention about the Bolithos looks interesting: is there a mistake in the date which appears as '197'? (perhaps 1970s is meant) I have added a small amount to the place article for Bolitho on the important family but as I am not in Cornwall that is about as far as I can go. The Landowners list looks odd: there are two lists with quite different names both for the mid-19th century with only one source. Then a third list with Rashleigh at the top for almost the same date as the source.. Mid-19th century could be anywhere in about 30 years: 1872 looks like late 19th century.--Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 10:11, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Fishing in Cornwall

There used to be a blank for the topic Fishing in Cornwall which was unsatisfactory as that is one of the notable things about Cornwall. I have only pieced together a few sections about fishing ports with a summary of part of the history based on Hamilton Jenkin (1933): obviously updating to the current situation would be a major task and the history 1850-1930s is hardly accounted for. St Ives is very prominent in what Hamilton Jenkin wrote but again that requires more effort to transfer properly. It would be useful to have a second opinion on the present article anyway.--Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 09:48, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for all the work you are putting in. Haven't anything much to say on fishing. The Fox family of Falmouth exported fish. So did Valentine Enys of the Enys family of Ennys. Bit tired and got to get up very early. Goodnight. Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 20:01, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

AfD nomination of John Blight (disambiguation)

An editor has nominated one or more articles which you have created or worked on, for deletion. The nominated article is John Blight (disambiguation). We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also Wikipedia:Notability and "What Wikipedia is not").

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Charles Gilpin, Water Cure, and Quakers

Hi Vernon39. Thanks for your contribution to the Hydrotherapy article, with the link to the Charles Gilpin article which you recently created. It's good to see there are people who pay attention to references, where often the real effort behind an article is to be found. It was intriguing to see the Quaker overlap. In my readings around on the topic of hydrotherapy and its promoters, I have seen reference to the Quaker movement, both in the U.K. and in the U.S. I have however, not fleshed it out, as I can't do everything in relation to that topic, which overlaps with several things from that era. But a brief sentence here and there may prompt someone to inquire further.Wotnow (talk) 01:49, 24 December 2009 (UTC)Wotnow

Thanks for you message. I am sorry that I do not know of any C19th Quakers, other than C. Gilpin, who were interested in this subject. Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 20:13, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Why Caps?

Hello, Vernon39. You have new messages at ShelfSkewed's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Samuel Fox

British quakers .... Do you have access to any extra info on Samuel Fox (1781-1868)? I see you edit the page on Milligan's British quaker book. Thx anyway Victuallers (talk) 13:03, 12 January 2010 (UTC) Thanks for your prompt help. Do you agree that Sarah Jowitt was his wife... any other details of his birth? I was hoping you might be intrigued to see if "your" book could identify biogs for the missing quakers in "my" painting Victuallers (talk) 16:10, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Thx Vernon. You wrote "In 1810, he and Sarah Jowitt (1787-1827), the younger daughter of Thomas Jowitt (1760-1789) were married. After her death, he was married to another Sarah Jowitt (born Storer, 1762-1799). There were no children from either marriage."

Did you mean another Sarah? Or was there really a second Jowitt? cheers Victuallers (talk) 20:04, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, two Sarah Jowitts. That is how I understand Ted Milligan's entry for Saml Fox. Seems improbable - need to check more. Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 22:05, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Oh I see. My refererence to "my" painting is because most of the articles, and the clickable template, so far are "by" me..... and lots of them are quakers. I am on the track of some of them, but in others its difficult to find the correct person. e.g. it took a while for me to stop tripping over the other Samuel Foxs who litter the midlands at that time. I have been contemplating taking an article using the picture as its centre.... are you interested in helping? I have a draft in one of my sandboxes? Victuallers (talk) 23:24, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 23:36, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Gorseth Kernow

In Constantine Vanessa Beeman is a former Grand Bard but the Gorseth Kernow page does not have the name of her successor.--Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 16:19, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Vernon's reply - try Gallery of Grand Bards Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 18:05, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Query regarding revert

Hello. Your revert to the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World article has me puzzled. Can you explain why you reverted the article to its state 250 days ago? Thanks, — Kralizec! (talk) 14:31, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

Another Cornish Fox

Hi Vernon, I hope you are well. Have you found Joseph Fox the elder yet? I just came upon him while dabbing links to Falmouth. DuncanHill (talk) 02:25, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Good to hear from you. Hans Weebers is a bit of an enthusiast, isn't he! He is descended from Joseph Fox and has put a lot of text up that needs wikifying. I've been working on Francis Fox of St Germans, so that the data on other branches Francis's descendants can be moved from the Fox family of Falmouth to there, hoping no deletionist will spot it. Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 15:39, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

Edward John Hutchins

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The masonic website copied the non-masonic material from the Times Obit (1876)Vernon White ^{. . . Talk} 23:57, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Edward John Hutchins

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-Z-removed tagVernon White ^{. . . Talk} 23:58, 16 February 2010 (UTC)