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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Gog the Mild via FACBot (talk) 24 June 2024 [1].

Igor Stravinsky[edit]

Nominator(s): MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 14:51, 1 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Back again for more with the 20th century's greatest parody artist: Igor Stravinsky. All jokes aside, his ability to blend in with so many styles and still provide a quintessentially Stravinskyian sound is amazing, and makes going through his oeuvre so exciting! Excited for everyone's comments, and thanks to those who were at the short PR before this nom. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 14:51, 1 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Image review[edit]

  • File:Léon_Bakst_001.jpg needs a tag for the original work. Ditto File:Rimsky-Korsakov_Serow_crop.png
    • Fixed MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
      • For the first of these, life+100 wouldn't apply until after this year, and the source provided predates 2003. The other has the same pre-2003 source. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:04, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
        • The source is the from the Yorck Project, which donated 10,000 scans to wikimedia in 2005- see this email which is linked on both files, so the art itself is public domain and the scan is allowed to be used on wikimedia MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
          • Why is the art in the public domain, though? The current tagging suggests because it was not published before 2003, but the provided source is a publication before 2003. Nikkimaria (talk) 14:03, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
          Well, the only other way it would work is removing the unpublished tag entirely. The Yorck tag looks like enough to show that it's PD, since it explicitly states that the art is PD worldwide and that the reproduction is licensed under GNU. This would make the original tag unnecessary, since the Yorck tag states that the art is PD. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 15:52, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • File:Igor_Stravinsky_1946_(v).svg is mistagged
  • File:Stravinsky-parents_(cropped).jpg was published before 2003. Ditto File:Bakst_Diaghilev.jpg[2], File:Igor_Stravinski_6_slika_1915_žak_emil_blanš_(cropped).jpg[3], File:Vera_Stravinsky_by_Serge_Sudeikine.jpg[4]
    • Then I've no clue how to tag these. They're all very old works of art (the first being created over a century ago, same for Diaghilev) so I've no clue how they could not be public domain. What's the right tag here, because if there is a publication from before 1929 that has those images, I certainly will never find them. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • File:Katya_Stravinskaya_1907.jpg: why is this believed to be PD?
  • File:Dushkin_LCCN2014717914_(cropped).jpg: when and where was this first published? Ditto File:Igor_Stravinsky_(1962).tif
    • LOC said that there are no rights on the Bain collection, so Dushkin is free regardless of when and where (even then, Bain was a news service, so tracking it down would be very difficult). I don't know where the latter was published because I cannot access the source, since it was uploaded by someone else from the archive MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
      • The former has PD-old-70-1923 - can its terms be verified? On the latter, can a first publication in Brazil be verified? Nikkimaria (talk) 03:04, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
        • I certainly couldn't verify it, seeing as the archive website breaks every time I open it- perhaps it works for you, but my computer is not liking it for some reason MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • We need to be able to use a tag that can be verified to be correct. Nikkimaria (talk) 14:03, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    What should be used if unpublished does not apply anf the expired tag can't be used because we don't know the first date of publication in America? MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 15:55, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nikkimaria, wanted to clarify, does the image review pass? If there's anything else that needs to be cut I can try to find other replacements. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:01, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

All images seem appropriate except the one of Rostropovitch who isn't mentioned at all in the article. Either a mention or a chop... — Iadmc♫talk  12:11, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Iadmc, yes, perhaps that is odd- cut. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:47, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe one other thing: alternate the images left/right? Just my preference — Iadmc♫talk  12:49, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Also a good idea. I added the Rostropovich image back to replace an unverifiable image, except moved it up to the "Life" section, so it has more context now MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 20:56, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(watching) Alternating is not a good idea. Left images cause formatting problems, therefore images should be left only if they show a person looking to the right. My 2ct. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:14, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Gerda Arendt In what way do they cause formatting problems? @MyCatIsAChonk I've added a short paragraph about S and Rostropovitch to go with the image. Hope it's ok? — Iadmc♫talk  03:54, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I saw that, thank you! I edited a bit of it and actually moved it into an efn within the caption- while it does provide context, it feels more like extra info that isn't important to that era of his life. However, I certainly see its value in showing how he collaborated with other musicians, so I think and efn works best. Thank you for writing that out! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:21, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's fear enough. I did wonder hao important it was. EFN is better — Iadmc♫talk  12:54, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MyCatIsAChonk Thanks for the thuncks deespyte my speeling! — Iadmc♫talk  13:45, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hardly the worst typos- even some of the most amusing are intentional (WP:YOURMAJESTYYOURSLIPISSHOWING is one of the best essays we have to offer) MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 14:15, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
LOL. End of that — Iadmc♫talk  14:33, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I looked into the Yorck Project issue a bit more. It appears that the PD claim for the artwork is based on life+70 so would still need US tagging. Believe File:Igor_Stravinsky_(1962).tif is still unverified as well. Nikkimaria (talk) 18:37, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Cut the 1962 image and added tags to the Yorck images (the Firebird sketch is now owned by the museum of modern art and was included in a 1978 exhibition, so we can safely say that it's public domain; the Rimsky portrait was acquired by the Tretyakov Gallery in 1898 so it's definitely public domain). Thank you for the thorough review! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 20:55, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Article review[edit]

Hello! I've read through the article. Here are some points to consider:

  • Vladimir Rimsky-Korsakov isn't really notable apart for being Stravinsky's friend and Nikolai's son. Remove the horrible red link!
  • "Importantly, Rimsky-Korsakov agreed to personally advise..." is a split infinitive: this isn't Star Trek! " Importantly, Rimsky-Korsakov agreed personally to advise..." is better.
  • "...the student began his large-scale Symphony in E-flat,[c] the first draft of which he finished in 1905. Stravinsky's first public premiere came in 1905, when the dedicatee of the Piano Sonata, Nikolay Richter, performed it..." I was confused here as was still thinking about the Symphony!
  • Again, a red link: Church of the Annunciation (Saint Petersburg). Needs an article or removing.
  • Renard is linked twice in two adjoining paragraphs: Remove the second link.
  • Turn towards neoclassicism better The turn towards neoclassicism or Turning towards neoclassicism? (See also Turn towards serialism later.) Same Religious crisis and international touring perhaps A religious crisis and international touring? Maybe just me...
  • We know what an affair is! (There are other possibly unnecessary links too like superimposed further up.)
  • "...where the composer died at home on 6 April at the age of 88". No year here! (1971)

Generally the whole article is well crafted and passes all the requirements for FA: well-written, comprehensive, well-researched, verifiable with inline citations where appropriate; neutral, stable, and compliant with Wikipedia's copyright policy and free of plagiarism or too-close paraphrasing. It follows the style guidelines well and all media are appropriate and relevent. It is quite long however... Then again, he was the leading composer of his time and is extremely influential. I did tire towards the end though. Hope you get the FA! — Iadmc♫talk  13:01, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks for the review! On the comment about subtitled: composer articles that I referred to use subtitles in the form of "[Subject's] return to Paris", like in Debussy and Tchaikovsky. Here, it's his notable action during that period without his name preceding it: "[Stravinsky's] Turn towards neoclassicism" or "[Stravinsky's] Religious crisis and international touring". All else were fixed- thank you! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 15:39, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Forgot to ping Iadmc MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 15:40, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Got it thanks! Good luck! — Iadmc♫talk  16:11, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Iadmc will you be supporting/opposing the promotion? Just wanted to clarify- it's all good if you're just here for comments! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 21:04, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support easy — Iadmc♫talk  21:10, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support from Tim riley[edit]

I'm not quite sure how I came to miss the previous excursion of this article to FAC, but I was one of the peer reviewers this time round and commented extensively then. Rereading now for FAC I see little more to quibble about. In no particular order:

  • I don't think TIME should be in caps in the caption
  • The heraldic picture is of the whole arms of the family (the coat of arms is just the shield) with crest, mantle and all. Just "Arms of ..." is what you want, I think.
  • "By age fourteen, Stravinsky mastered Mendelssohn's Piano Concerto No. 1" – the piano part, presumably, but it might be as well to say so.
  • "the influence from Russian Orthodox vocal music and 18th-century composers like Handel were not well-received in the press…" – singular noun (influence) needs a singular verb (was).
  • "the Brandenburg Concerto-like work…" I think I'd add another hyphen, between Brandenburg and Concerto, but I don't press the point.
  • "Threni showed his full shift towards use of tone rows" – could do with a blue link to tone row
  • " Soon after being dismissed from Lenox Hill Hospital…" – is one dismissed from hospital in AmE? (One is discharged in BrE, but I merely ask the question.)
  • "Stravinsky's music is often divided into three periods of composition … where Stravinsky used highly structured composition techniques pioneered by composers of the Second Viennese School" – the second and third "Stravinsky"s in this sentence would be better, I think, as pronouns.
  • I was uncertain at PR why you sometimes use the ♭ and ♯ symbols but keep referring to his (delectable) early symphony as the Symphony in E-flat. I still am. We also have "E-flat dominant 7 superimposed on an F-flat major triad" and "Piano Sonata in F-sharp minor". I'd recommend sticking either to ♭ and ♯ symbols or to words throughout.
  • Initials: I believe the MoS prefers us to put a space between people's initials: T. S. Eliot rather than T.S. Eliot. You have done so for C. F. Ramuz and W. H. Auden, and I think Eliot should be treated likewise.

Nothing there to prevent my adding my support for the elevation of this fine article to FA, and I'm happy to do so. I still think it's a mean trick to put a link to a different article in the info-box, but if you must… – Tim riley talk 17:51, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, "discharged" from the hospital is certainly where my mind was, but I apparently didn't conjure that word... thank you for this and all the other comments! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 20:51, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Pseud 14[edit]

An in-depth coverage of the subject overall. This would be more of a general (non-expert review) and perhaps some nitpicks on formatting here and there, since the writing and the structure IMO is in solid shape.

  • three ballets for the Ballets Russes' -- there are a few instances where the possessive forms follow an "apostrophe" and "s" (i.e. Thomas's, Los Angeles's) perhaps, either is correct, but perhaps we can make it consistent throughout.
  • died of pulmonary edema on 6 April 1971 -- comma after the year per MOS:DATECOMMA
    • I believe MOS:DATECOMMA only applies to dates in month-day-year format- this article uses day-month-year, and you don't need a comma after the dates in DMY format (which is why I personally prefer it). MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
      • You're right, didn't realize yours the DMY format. Pseud 14 (talk) 02:24, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • His father, Fyodor Ignatyevich Stravinsky, was a famous bass -- perhaps specify that he is a bass opera singer as you did in the lead.
    • In retrospect, just saying "bass" is enough- cut the bit from the lead instead. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
      • I think that works too, as we do refer to folks like Pavaroti and Domingo as tenors.
  • Igor was born in Oranienbaum while his family vacationed there for the summer; -- maybe some slight change to say, Igor was born in Oranienbaum, where his family vacationed for the summer, assuming there refers to Oranienbaum.
  • The Stravinsky family moved to Lausanne, Switzerland -- Lausanne, Switzerland per MOS:GEOLINK
  • Clarens, Switzerland - do not link country or write as "Clarens"
  • Leysin, Switzerland - same
  • Carantec, France - same
  • Nice, France - same
  • His student works were primarily assignments from his teacher Rimsky-Korsakov and were mainly influenced by Russian composers like his teacher. -- some variation perhaps so that the second mention of teacher isn't repeated.
  • however, critics found the works to actually stick too close to his teacher's traditional style -- perhaps something like resemble or similar wording instead of stick too close

That's all from me. Fantastic work on this BLP biography. Pseud 14 (talk) 22:17, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Pseud 14 I wish it were a BLP! To see him conduct would be a blessing... but alas, there are many recordings- thanks for the review, all points have been addressed! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 01:37, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Out of habit, I have a tendency to refer to every biographical articles a BLP, when so many are indeed not living (something I haven't worked on yet). Nevertheless, changes look good and happy to support for promotion. Pseud 14 (talk) 02:24, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Your long line of BLP FAs is an impressive feat and continues to impress- look forward to the next one! Thank you! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 00:12, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

MSinccc[edit]

  • I have read the article and would like to offer suggestions for the prose. Comments will follow shortly. Regards MSincccc (talk) 07:00, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

  • Specify that Stravinsky was "of Russian descent" to provide clarity on his background without altering the flow significantly.
  • Use notable for the riot it provoked at its premiere to notorious for the riot it provoked at its premiere for a more precise expression
    • After this, Stravinsky's Russian phase was followed could be changed to Following this, Stravinsky's Russian phase gave way to for better readability
  • Could change adopted serial procedures to adopted serial techniques.
    • Simplify the description of his later work to avoid redundancy, such as His compositions during this period echoed elements of his earlier works.
    MSincccc (talk) 07:11, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


  • and Anna (née Kholodovskaya), an amateur singer and pianist from a long-established Russian family.

Only one suggestion for now. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 07:53, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@MSincccc, thanks for the review! For the comments about the lead: is the green text supposed to be quotes already present? I can't find "notable for the riot it provoked at its premiere" or "After this, Stravinsky's Russian phase was followed" or the others in the lead at all. Are these suggestions to change an already-existing sentence? Thanks! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:26, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MyCatIsAChonk The green ones are the suggested versions whereas the turquoise ones are the versions existing in the article. Furthermore, the sentences mentioned under the Life, Music and Artistic influences headings are the suggested ones. The suggestions have been made after consulting the Oxford English dictionary. Looking forward to your response. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 12:54, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MSincccc, I'm having a difficult time understanding the comments. The first five bullet points confuse me, as none of the turquoise text quotes are actually in the lead. For the other points, I'm not sure what those are trying to replace. Could you name the exact sentences in the present version that you think should be rephrased? Thank you! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 14:08, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MyCatIsAChonk I will be posting the remaining comments later. Sorry for the inconvenience. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 14:47, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It’s all good, thanks! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 15:17, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Starting from the beginning then.
Lead
  • Stravinsky's Russian period was characterized... Could use "his" here as "Stravinsky" is mentioned in the preceding sentence.
  • The same sentence could be rephrased as-During his Russian period, Stravinsky was notably influenced by Russian styles and folklore. Works such as *Renard* (1916) and *Les noces* (1923) drew upon Russian folk poetry, while compositions like *L'Histoire du soldat* (1918) integrated these folk elements with popular musical forms, including the tango, waltz, ragtime, and chorale.
  • In 1998, Time magazine listed Stravinsky as one of the 100 most influential people of the century. "Listed" is preferable to "named" for a smoother flow. Also you could delink "magazine" in the above manner. Rest of the lead is fine as it is. Regards.
MSincccc (talk) 04:28, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Life
  • The name "Stravinsky" is of Polish origin,... "Is" is preferable to "was".
  • Stravinsky was born in Oranienbaum while his family vacationed there for the summer;... This version avoids repeating the phrase "was born in Oranienbaum" and also omits his first name "Igor" which need not be mentioned repeatedly. It's also more concise than the present one.
  • Constantly in fear of his short-tempered father "Short-tempered" is preferable to "hot-tempered".
  • There should be consistency in how the article's subject is referred to. In some places, it's "Igor," while in others, he is referred to as "Stravinsky."
    • This is intentional; just saying "Stravinsky" would be confusing since his family is also being discussed. The prose officially switches to just discussing him at paragraph 3, so the last name is used then MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • By age fourteen, Stravinsky had mastered the solo part of Mendelssohn's Piano Concerto No. 1, and at age fifteen, he completed a piano reduction of a string quartet by Alexander Glazunov. Suggested version.
  • Despite his musical passion and ability, Stravinsky's parents expected him to study law at the University of Saint Petersburg, and he enrolled there in 1901. Refined sentence.
  • During summer vacation of 1902, Stravinsky traveled with Vladimir Rimsky-Korsakov to Heidelberg Could omit "Vladimir" here.
  • In August 1905, Stravinsky announced his engagement to Yekaterina Nosenko, his first cousin whom he had met in 1890 during a family trip. Slightly more preferable as it includes "had" before "met".
  • The couple soon had two children: Théodore, born in March 1907,... Could mention at least the month given it is known.
It's mentioned here though. Regards MSincccc (talk) 18:56, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • as "the best of my works before The Firebird". Replaced "was" with "as". But the present version is also fine as it stands.
Comments up to the International fame, 1909–1920 sub-section. I will provide further suggestions later. MSincccc (talk) 04:58, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Preferred versions from the International fame, 1909–1920 section
  • In 1907, Diaghilev presented a five-concert series of Russian music at the Paris Opera; the following year, he staged the Paris premiere of Rimsky-Korsakov's version of Boris Godunov. Changed "next" to "following".
  • Stravinsky was working on Act I of his first opera The Nightingale.
  • While composing The Firebird, Stravinsky conceived an idea for a work about "a solemn pagan rite: sage elders, seated in a circle, watched a young girl dance herself to death". Replaced "had" with "conceived" for a more refined version.
Illness and wartime collaborations
  • In early 1914, his wife, Yekaterina, contracted tuberculosis and was admitted to a sanatorium in Leysin, Switzerland, where the couple's fourth child, Maria Milena, was born. More preferable.
  • In early July 1914, while his family resided in Switzerland near his sick wife, the composer traveled to Russia to retrieve texts for his next work, a ballet-cantata depicting Russian wedding traditions titled *Les noces*. Soon after he returned, World War I began, and the Stravinskys lived in Switzerland until 1920, initially residing in Clarens and later Morges. Refined version which is clearer and avoids repeating "Yekaterina Stravinsky".
Comments up to the France, 1920–1939 sub-section. I will provide further suggestions later. MSincccc (talk) 11:44, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Starting from the France, 1920–1939 sub-section.
  • During this period, Stravinsky expanded his involvement in conducting and piano performance. He conducted the premiere of his Octet in 1923 and served as the soloist for the premiere of his Piano Concerto in 1924. Following its debut, he embarked on a tour, performing the concerto in over 40 concerts. Refined version that is more preferable.
Religious crisis and international touring
  • Stravinsky's schedule was divided between spending time with his family in Nice, performing in Paris, and touring other locations, often accompanied by de Bosset.
  • Most of 1929 was spent... could be replaced with Most of that year was spent... The latter version is preferable to the former as it avoids repeating the year (1929).
  • Between touring concerts, he composed the choral Symphony of Psalms, a deeply religious work that premiered in December 1930 could also be replaced with Between touring concerts, he composed the choral Symphony of Psalms, a deeply religious work that premiered in December 1930 for the same reason.
    • I'm confused about this one, since the red and green text appear to be the same sentence? I think I understand what you mean though; added 'that year' in place of 1930 MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • On 10 June 1934, Stravinsky became a naturalized French citizen, protecting all his future works under copyright in France and the United States. Is the precise date relevant in this context? If so, the sentence could be adjusted to adhere to WP:Proseline guidelines despite it not being mandatory.
  • After the short run of Perséphone, Stravinsky embarked on a successful three-month tour of the United States with Dushkin;... Preferable to use "tour of the United States" to "United States tour"
  • Stravinsky's last years in France from late 1938 to 1939 were marked... Could omit the phrase "from late 1938 to 1939" for a smoother flow.
  • In addition, the increasingly hostile criticism of his music in major publications and failed run for a seat at the Institut de France further dissociated him from France, and shortly after the beginning of World War II in September 1939, Stravinsky moved to the United States. Refined version which I suggest could replace the present one. It omits the phrase "the man" which comes out of nowhere(despite it being understood that we are referring to Stravinsky himself).
@MyCatIsAChonk Looking forward to your response to the above suggestions before I publish my final set of comments. It was a great read (pardon me if the list is too long to bear). Regards MSincccc (talk) 14:23, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
MSincccc All fixed- many thanks for the comments thus far! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 18:56, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Preferred versions-
  • Stravinsky and Vera de Bosset were married on March 9, 1940, in Bedford, Massachusetts. After the completion of his lecture series, the couple relocated to Los Angeles, where they applied for American naturalization.
  • ...and frequent guests included musicians Joseph Szigeti, Arthur Rubinstein, and Sergei Rachmaninoff.[150][147] However, Stravinsky eventually joined popular Hollywood circles, attending parties with celebrities and becoming closely acquainted with European authors Aldous Huxley, W. H. Auden, Christopher Isherwood, and Dylan Thomas. You could drop the "like" after "musicians" and "authors" for a smoother flow.
  • In 1945, Stravinsky received American citizenship and subsequently signed a contract with British publishing house Boosey & Hawkes, who agreed to publish all his future works. Additionally, Stravinsky revised many of his older works and had Boosey & Hawkes publish the new editions to re-copyright his older works.[147][153] Around the 1948 premiere of another Balanchine collaboration, the ballet *Orpheus*, Stravinsky met Robert Craft in New York; Craft had asked Stravinsky to explain the revision of the *Symphonies of Wind Instruments* for an upcoming concert. Stravinsky quickly befriended Craft, inviting the latter to Los Angeles, and Craft soon became Stravinsky's assistant, collaborator, and amanuensis until the composer's death. Dropped the phrase "the young conductor" and used "latter". Furthermore, could you please reduce the number of times "Stravinsky" is mentioned in this paragraph (if possible)?
  • In 1953, he agreed to compose a new opera with a libretto by Dylan Thomas... This version avoids using "Stravinsky" in each sentence thus preventing unnecessary repetition.
  • in which the latter sought to correct myths surrounding him and discuss his relationships with other artists. Could use "latter".
  • where he attended a dinner at the White House with then President John F. Kennedy in honor of the composer's 80th birthday.
  • In September 1962, he returned to Russia for the first time since 1914, accepting an invitation from the Union of Soviet Composers to conduct six performances in Moscow and Leningrad.
  • During his three-week visit he met with Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev and several leading Soviet composers, including Shostakovich and Aram Khachaturian.
@MSincccc I see now, thanks- it's been fixed MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 15:07, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Stravinsky revisited biblical themes for many of his later works.
  • A funeral service was held three days later at the Frank E. Campbell Funeral Chapel. Added "the"
This concludes my list of suggestions for the Life section. I will be leaving comments for the remaining sections later. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 09:08, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Artistic influences
Preferred versions:
  • You could also link Charles F. Ramuz.
  • Their collaboration was apparently tense:...
@MyCatIsAChonk Nothing more to complain about from this section. Looking forward to your response. Regards MSincccc (talk) 11:00, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Legacy
Preferred versions:
  • After his death, Stravinsky's importance in modernist music became evident: though many modern styles quickly fell out of fashion (like twelve-tone music), the music of Stravinsky stood out as a body of unique ingenuity, according to Walsh.
  • Béla Bartók could also be linked in the article.
Recordings
  • Stravinsky received five Grammy Awards and a total of eleven nominations for his recordings, with three of his albums being inducted into the Grammy Hall of Fame.
The Writings section is fine as it is. Regards MSincccc (talk) 11:10, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MSincccc, all have been addressed- thank you for your thorough reading of this article! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 11:17, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MyCatIsAChonk Suggestions for the Music section -
  • Much of Stravinsky's music is characterized by short, sharp articulations with minimal rubato or vibrato.
  • Stravinsky's student compositions were primarily assignments from his teacher Rimsky-Korsakov and were mainly influenced by the latter and other Russian composers.
  • ...marked the beginning of his international fame and a departure from 19th-century styles.
I will be leaving my suggestions for the rest of the Music section later. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 16:56, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

MSincccc addressed those three MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 17:26, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

First three ballets, 1910–1913
Preferred versions:
  • Stravinsky also used a folk tune from Rimsky-Korsakov's opera *The Snow Maiden*, showing the former's continued reverence for his teacher.
  • Stravinsky's third ballet, *The Rite of Spring*, caused a near-riot at the premiere due to its avant-garde nature.
  • He had begun to experiment with polytonality in The Firebird and Petrushka,... Avoid mentioning "Stravinsky" in consecutive sentences when its clearly understood that he is being referred to.
Russian period, 1913–1920
  • The composer Béla Bartók considered Stravinsky's Russian period to have begun in 1913 with *The Rite of Spring* due to its use of Russian folk songs, themes, and techniques. Using its and also omitted "The composer" as we have already introduced Bartok in the previous section. Should it be mentioned again under the Music section
  • While Stravinsky did not use as many folk melodies as he had in his first three ballets, he often used folk poetry.
  • L'Histoire du soldat was composed in 1918 with the Swiss novelist Charles F. Ramuz as a small musical theatre production for dancers, a narrator, and a septet.[221] It mixed the Russian folktales in the narrative with common musical structures of the time, like the tango, waltz, rag, and chorale.[222] Even as his style changed in later years, Stravinsky maintained a musical connection to his Russian roots.
  • He pointed out how the opera contained numerous references to Greek mythology and other operas like Mozart's Don Giovanni and Bizet's Carmen,...
  • Stravinsky was inspired by the operas of Mozart in composing his music,...
Serial period, 1954–1968
  • Agon (1954–57) should be changed to Agon (1954–1957)
  • whereas the second movement from Canticum Sacrum (1956) was the first piece to contain a movement entirely based on a tone row.
  • it begins diatonic,...
  • The influence of other composers on Stravinsky can be noticed throughout this period. He was heavily influenced by Schoenberg,...
  • In addition, he was very familiar with the works of Anton Webern,...
@MyCatIsAChonk This concludes my list of suggestions for the prose of the article. Looking forward to your response. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 08:59, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@MSincccc, all addressed with just one comment above MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 11:59, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fine then. @MyCatIsAChonk I have nothing more to complain about. Sorry for the delay. Support. Regards MSincccc (talk) 13:41, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's all good- thank you for your very thorough review! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 14:45, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ligaturama[edit]

I participated in the peer review so my first tranche of comments has already been addressed. I've gone through the lead to ensure all its assertions are backed up by cited statements in the article body. I also have some miscellaneous suggestions. Nothing major, as before it looks fundamentally sound. Ref numbers taken from ID 1227368908

Lead:

  • Says he was granted American citizenship in 1945, but the body only says "they moved to Los Angeles and applied for American naturalization". Walsh 2001 section 8 gives the year.
  • Says the Rite brought Stravinsky "international fame", but I only see that it was an "overnight sensation" and received "widespread critical acclaim" (presumably from Parisian critics); and that his first three ballets (not just the Rite) "were the beginning of his international fame"
    • I think the way its worded further implies that it's the associated "riot" that brought him international fame, but I don't know if that's the intention
  • The standard division of his works into the three periods isn't directly supported by the body, it's just implied in passing by the cited works at the beginning of the "Music" section. A a citation for "Stravinsky's music is often divided into three periods of composition:" should be a quick fix for this.
  • "While many supporters were confused by Stravinsky's constant stylistic changes" - I'm not clear on how this is supported in the body.
    • In Legacy: However, many saw his subsequent neoclassical period as a return to the past while other composers tried advancing modern music.[272] His subsequent turn towards serialism further alienated him from audiences,
      • When going through it I wasn't sure if this really supported the word "confusion", but I can see what you mean and I can't think of any more appropriate descriptor myself. Ligaturama (talk) 06:49, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Citations to look at:

  • [13] for Stravinsky receiving piano lessons: wrong page number, should be p26
  • [32] I can't see this quotation at all on the page or after a search in the book
  • [54] regarding Diaghilev hearing the early Petrushka drafts, should be pp35-36
  • [67] relevant part appears to go on to page 45

For the record I checked all usages of the following and they seem fine: 1, 2, 4, 25, 51, 60, 63, 187, 212, 213, 214, 218, 236, 264, 265, 278.

Misc:

  • "Stravinsky's compositional career is divided into three periods" - I'd say typically divided into three periods, there are bound to be academics who disagree because they're such a contentious lot.
  • The link to Straus 2001 contains a search query, which means if you follow it it highlights lots of text. Remove the question mark after "f9WSc5aLd6IC" and everything after it
  • "the first draft of which he finished in 1905. In 1905, the dedicatee of the Piano Sonata" - repetition of "in 1905" is a little awkward, would replace with "That year"
  • "necessary to making it in the Russian music scene" - "making it" sounds quite casual, I'd put "success", and maybe replace "scene" with something more academic
  • "Catherine was my dearest friend and playmate ... and from then until we grew into our marriage" - this doesn't seem to make sense unless I'm misreading it, perhaps that second "and" should be removed? I can't check on the original text per the note above
  • In the "Life" section, Pulcinella is mentioned directly before the "Turn to neoclassicism" section, which is strange because it was his first neoclassical work so should be the start of that section.
    • There's a reason for this, see my reply to Tim riley at the PR: "These two sections are actually separated by Stravinsky's move to France, as Stravinsky lived in Switzerland when he traveled to Rome, but I had no other ideas for a subtitle. Noble opined that the Symphonies of Wind Instruments officially started his neoclassical era, Bartok thinks it's the Octet... really, I wrote it in this way because Pulcinella still has lots of Russian period elements, but the thematic idea was much like his neoclassical works. So this "turn towards neoclassicism" more refers to his regular use of this style in his music." MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • "a capella" should not be italicised per MOS:MUSIC
  • The link to "tone row" in "Turn towards serialism": the pluralising "s" has been nowiki-ed so it isn't part of the link to tone row, is there a reason for that?
  • "Between touring, the composer worked relentlessly" - "between tours" or "while touring" would seem to make more sense
  • "Bartók argued that the period "really starts with his Octet for Wind Instruments, followed by his Concerto for Piano ..."" - not sure what's going on with that ellipsis, the sentence ends there.
  • "but still "embody[s] the distinctive structure of a fairy tale"." - "embod[ies]", or "but still embodies "the destinctive..."
  • Footnote C: "Opus" should be capitalised in "Opus 1" per MOS:MUSIC
  • Footnote M needs a space before its ellipsis
  • Footnote R is missing a closing bracket (parenthesis)
    • Not sure what you mean here, there is a close parenthesis at the end of the sentence for me; the content of the parentheses extends until the page numbers end) MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
      • My mistake, I misread it as it stops being link partway through. Apologies. Ligaturama (talk) 06:49, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ligaturama (talk) 15:36, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Ligaturama I deeply appreciate you going out of your way to find the correct pages for the failed spotchecks- for the giant blockquote, I put the wrong Stravinsky and Craft book, easy mistake to make when there's six to deal with! Individual replies above, all else were fixed without question MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 19:46, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Great, all addressed so no reason not to add my support; I believe the article meets the FA criteria. I think you've done a particularly good job on keeping it summary-style without too much or too little detail on any specific area, and accordingly it flows at a nice pace despite being a fair length. Thanks for all your work. Ligaturama (talk) 06:59, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your help along the way! If you open another GAN/FAC anytime soon, let me know- hopefully Liszt can make an appearance at FAC/PR sometime soon MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:00, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments and support from Gerda[edit]

I also participated in the peer review, and thank for changes I liked. I didn't get to details of the music section yet:

Generally, while we are requested to link each item only once, we may expect readers to be interested only in that section, and start linking again, such as Glazunov.

Student works

  • I'd place the one review from a later time at the very end of that section.

First ballets

  • "Stravinsky's Russian influences often used large orchestration" - I had to read it twice, - not knowing how influences can use something, and then orchestration ;)
  • I believe that the antagonism of Firebird and K. can be told simpler, without repeating each character's name.
  • I think "second ballet" is enough, without for whom.
  • The melody by R.-K.: does the source say it is the elder's "influence"? I think it could just be a sort of reverence ;)
  • I think we could speak about the third ballet without recalling the ubiquitous riot.
    • I believe it's important to mention, since one may skip straight to this section without reading 'Life'. It also shows that the work was very important to Stravinsky's career and unique in the music scene of the time. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • Why not speak about playing with atonality in the first ballets where they are covered, instead of adding the point afterwards?
    • The source did not state specific examples of how Stravinsky used polytonality in those works; White frames it as a contributing factor to The Rite's tonality MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • "the small instrumentation of traditional cantatas" - what does "traditional" mean here? Some 19th-century cantatas use large orchestra, and even some Bach cantatas, or are they not "traditional"? If the early cantatas, Italian works for one voice and a few instruments, are meant, perhaps say so, or link?

Need a break. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:49, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Neoclassical

Legacy

  • The lists of names at the end look a bit like names-dropping, - perhaps say a bit more precisely what influenced individual ones.
    • The students I have no details about because they come from an encyclopedia of teachers and students. I'm not sure how to elaborate on "Stravinsky also influenced composers like Elliott Carter, Harrison Birtwistle, and John Tavener" because those three names are from a series of quotes in the source- most of them just say that Stravinsky influenced them, not necesarrily naming why or how. Carter claims that hearing The Rite inspired him to become a composer, but I'm not sure how I'd work that into the para, and it doesn't seem too relevant since I'm sure Stravinsky has inspired many to compose MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)

Recordings

  • link NBC?
  • "the Théâtre des Champs-Élysées (where The Rite of Spring premiered)" - I see a contrast of the strictly French theatre name and the English of the ballet, which was of course premiered in 1913 as Le Sacre du printemps.
    • Well, most sources used say the english title of The Rite, but still use the french name for the theatre. This is all just based on what the sources commonly use (also, in general, I think the average reader would know the name "The Rite of Spring" but not "Le sacre du printemps") MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)

Writings

  • "In 1959, several interviews between the composer and Craft were published as Conversations with Igor Stravinsky, which was followed by a further five volumes over the following decade." - a bit awkward structure, and I think it's "were published", then also "were followed", no? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:06, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Gerda Arendt, all were fixed, with some individual replies above- thank you! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 19:23, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, support. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:17, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ps: In Germany, the third is so known as Le Sacre du printemps, that I looked twice when Pina Bausch staged it danced as Frühlingsopfer ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:19, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support by SafariScribe[edit]

I have read this and to chip in a little. In the lead second paragraph, change "Stravinsky's father was a famous bass in Saint Petersburg, and Stravinsky grew up taking piano and music theory lessons." to "Born to a famous bass in Saint Petersburg, Stravinsky grew up taking piano and music theory lessons". It reduces the linking and makes it clear for readers. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 19:54, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Though Saint Petersburg is a very popular place, Wikipedia is also an international project, hence I got confused thinking it was the one in Florida. While you may'nt link it, add "Russia" to immediately signal which one.
Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 19:58, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the comments! Yes, I also get confused with the geography- some earlier comments were confused with why French and Swiss cities were paired with the name of the country, and it was really because I'd never heard of those cities before researching this article MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 20:21, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Closure[edit]

Question: how does this get decided? Does an independent editor swing by and approve/decline the proposal? Thanks — Iadmc♫talk  03:59, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The @FAC coordinators: sorts this out. No other editors close this. — VAUGHAN J. (t · c) 06:15, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks — Iadmc♫talk  08:25, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Source review[edit]

There are some page ranges that are put in singular format (e.g "p. 43–44, 47, 56. "), that should be corrected. Just out of curiosity, are there any French or Russian sources? I am kind of unsure if "How Stravinsky's Rite of Spring has shaped 100 years of music" is heavyweight enough for the claim it supports. What makes "Predota, Georg (17 March 2021). "Stravinsky's Literary Sources". Interlude. Retrieved 23 June 2023." a reliable source? Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 06:20, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Pages: done
  • French/Russian sources: There are certainly books in those sources available, however I don't speak either of those languages. One editor was going to help me with Russian sourcing, but they are now on wikibreak and I don't really know anyone else. However, a number of the sources were originally French or Russian and this article cites the translated versions (e.g. Boucourechliev 1987, Savenko 2013, Strawinsky et al 2004)
  • "How Stravinsky's Rite of Spring...": The article's author, George Benjamin, is a prominent composer and teacher of contemporary music- I trust his claim here since he is of such prominence in the contemporary music world. But, I added a ref to Grout to back it further
  • Predota 2021: Interlude is an online magazine where guest writers discuss classical music subjects- there isn't much info about the author of the article, Georg Predota, however I can find some articles he wrote on researchgate and his writings in interlude have been cited in scholarly texts (ref 78 on that page)
Jo-Jo Eumerus, all addressed - thank you very much for the review! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 11:36, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Jo-Jo Eumerus, is there anything else that needs addressing? Just wanted to check in! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 11:31, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No. I admit that the Russian/French thing is a bit of a big issue re: the completeness criteria. Punting this to FAC coordinators, tho'. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 19:47, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Got it then- thank you! @FAC coordinators: will this stop the article from meeting the FA criteria? I cannot remedy this- I have tried my best by finding translated versions of foreign language sources, but my reach is limited in this capacity. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 21:20, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That depends. WP:NONENG seems to be relevant. "... because this project is in English, English-language sources are preferred over non-English ones when they are available and of equal quality and relevance." So are there non-English HQ RSs which contain information which should be in the article for it to be promoted which isn't in any English language HQ RS? No one is expected to prove a negative, so where to draw the line on this can get a bit hand wavey. That said, I would prefer specific missing works to be mentioned, if at all possible, just as one would for a missing English language source. That help? Gog the Mild (talk) 22:08, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't believe anything important is being excluded here. There are some Russian sources I've seen on other articles (eg Yekaterina Stravinsky) but I don't think they can add anything more to this article, since they were published before Walsh's massive biography (which essentially adds on to White's biography to include every finite detail of Stravinsky's life). Thank you for the clarification! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 00:36, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Stravinsky scholarship doesn't really expand to French musicological circles; Boucourechliev, an exception, is already used quite a bit here. Although he is not Russian, Taruskin is by-far the leading authority on Stravinsky's relationship with Russia, and he is already heavily cited. All major biographies of Stravinsky are cited as far as I can see. I see Asaf’yev's Russian account missing, but it is rather old (from the 1930s) and largely surpassed by later scholarship. Aza24 (talk) 06:01, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Jo-Jo Eumerus: ping the reviewer. Gog the Mild (talk) 20:20, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
SC
Early life in Russia
  • "originally called the "Soulima-Stravinsky"s,": why not just: "originally called "Soulima-Stravinsky","?
Religious crisis
  • "He had abandoned the Russian Orthodox Church": there are three uses of "church" in this sentence: any chance of rewording slightly
Writings
  • May be worth formatting the isbns in a consistent manner (and you seem to have isbns from before they were introduced in 1967, which is a neat trick!)
Refs
  • Refs 86, 123, 266, 283 should be pp., not p.

That's my lot. – SchroCat (talk) 18:51, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Good catch on the isbns and the refs- thought I'd nipped both of those problems in the bud. Thanks for the review @SchroCat! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 21:30, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Coord comment[edit]

Starting the end of June 21 (this Friday) I will be out of town and offline for six weeks. Sparing any major opposes, I hope this can still go through. To any editors who have other comments: please feel free to implement any changes you see necessary while I'm offline. Thank you! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:07, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There are no opposes (yet) so this should go through. All the changes necessary are pretty minor. Have a great Wikibreak! — Iadmc♫talk  12:38, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If there are any unexpected queries te absente I'll be happy to field them if I can, but I think Iadmc is right: this review seems to be rounding into the home straight. Tim riley talk 18:34, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That is much appreciated- thank you for taking it on! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 20:06, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Matarisvan[edit]

Hi MyCatIsAChonk, my comments:

  • Link to music theory?
  • Link to ragtime and chorale?
  • Are the second links for neoclassicism and serialism in the lead necessary?
  • Use ill to link to the Russian language wiki for Vladimir Rimsky-Korsakov?
  • Is the Church of the Annunciation we mention, the same as the Annunciation Church of the Alexander Nesky Lavra? If so, consider linking?
    • For this and the Vladimir comment: I actually did have ill links for these, but another reviewer suggested they be cut since it is unlikely those articles will be created on the English wikipedia anyway. I agreed and they were removed, so I think it'd best this way. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • Link to mezzo-soprano?
  • Link to song cycle?
  • Link to Sophocles?
    • I avoid linking the artist when their name precedes a work of theirs (e.g. "Sophocles' tragedy Oedipus Rex") since the artist's link can be found on the work's article
  • Link to Chicago Symphony Orchestra in the Life and Recordings sections?
  • "researches": just "research" is better from a grammatical POV?
  • Link to Jeremy Noble?
  • There are two sentences we have repeated twice: "The near-riot due to The Rite of Spring's avant-garde nature" and "Stravinsky befriended many other authors as well, including T. S. Eliot, Aldous Huxley, Christopher Isherwood, and Dylan Thomas, the last of whom Stravinsky began working with on an opera in 1953 but stopped due to Thomas's death", where the only thing different from the Life section is the mention of T. S. Eliot. Consider removing these repetitive sentences?
    • The repeat of the first sentence is in the lead and a later section, so I think it's fine. I'm not sure where you see the authors sentence duplicated; yes, the authors are also named in "Life", but not with the same text. Having the authors in both is intentional MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no)
  • Link to Stephen Walsh?
  • Is the second link to CBC Symphony Orchestra in the Recordings section necessary?
  • Link to Mussorgsky in note f?
  • In the biblio, link to Nicholas Cook, Peter Hill (pianist), Wilfrid Mellers, David Matthews (composer, if this is the correct one).
  • Shouldn't Steinberg 2005 be in the books subsection and not the articles?

That's all from me. Cheers Matarisvan (talk) 14:28, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Matarisvan, replies above; all else were addressed. Thank you for the review! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 19:03, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Hurricanehink[edit]

As a composer myself (and with an active FAC), I figured I’d review this.

  • ”While studying law at the University of Saint Petersburg, he met Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov and studied under him until his death in 1908.” - I suggest varying the wording here, as the two usages of “study” could imply that he studied law with Rimsky-Korsakov.
  • The main author and nominator is offline for the next six weeks and I have undertaken (see above) to field any queries that I can. I'll look in at your open FAC shortly. Tim riley talk 10:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tweaked as suggested. Tim riley talk 10:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • ”Stravinsky's compositional career is often divided into three periods: his Russian period (1913–1920), his neoclassical period (1920–1951), and his serial period (1954–1968).” - which period was 1951-54 part of?
  • ”about fifty kilometers west of Saint Petersburg” - be sure all units have imperial conversion. Later on you also say “five miles”, so be sure units are consistent too, which one goes first.
  • ”His mother, Anna Kirillovna Stravinskaya (née Kholodovsky)” - why did the mother have a different last name (Stravinskaya) than Igor and his did?
  • That was the convention in some eastern European countries, using feminine forms for the surnames of women. (Even today, the author of the Harry Potter books is billed in the Czech Republic and Slovakia as "J. K. Rowlingova".) Tim riley talk 10:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Fascinating! I wondered if it was something like that. It's not a requirement for my support, but could you maybe add a note to add that? ♫Hurricanehink (talk) 18:07, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'll scout about for a suitable reliable source. Tim riley talk 19:14, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • ”The family was originally called "Soulima-Stravinsky", bearing the likely-German Soulima coat of arms, but "Soulima" was dropped after Russia's annexation during the partitions of Poland.” - the “likely German Soulima” is odd, especially since the previous sentence said it was Polish. I know that part of the world was nebulous, but in the late 1800s there wasn’t even much of a German identity post-unification.
  • I cannot answer this, I'm afraid. Pruned for now. The main author can always explain and re-add it on his return. Tim riley talk 13:58, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • ”Igor was born in Oranienbaum” - two paragraphs start mentioning his birth location. Seems redundant
  • and Gury, his close younger brother with whom he found "the love and understanding denied to us by our parents" - who said this quote? I can’t support an FAC with an unattributed quote.
  • I'd have thought it obvious that these were Stravinsky's own words, and having checked the cited sources I can confirm it. Stravinsky and Craft 1981, p. 21: "We found in each other the love and understanding denied us by our parents...". Tweaked to make it plain that these are the composer's words. Tim riley talk 10:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • ”From age nine, Stravinsky was taught piano privately.” - by whom? His father the bass? Mother? Family friends? The governess?
  • ”and at age fifteen, he completed a piano reduction of a string quartet by Alexander Glazunov” - would you mind explaining what a piano reduction is in the article, for non-musicians? I also think you could use “arrangement” instead of reduction, which I feel is a more common word.
  • ”likely due to the glamorous charm of The Five's music, according to the musicologist Richard Taruskin.” - I would rather have a bit more context than “glamorous charm”, which doesn’t really sound like you’re describing a group of five Russian composers. Here, something like, “likely due to the popularity of the group of five Russian classical composers known as The Five.” Would be better IMO, something like that
  • ”and it was there that Stravinsky began work on a Konzertstück for piano and orchestra depicting the tale of a puppet coming to life.[55][60] After Diaghilev heard the early drafts, he convinced Stravinsky to turn it into a ballet for the 1911 ballet season.[61][62] Petrushka premiered in Paris on 13 June 1911.” - is Petrushka the same Konzertstück you mentioned?
  • Stravinsky conceived an idea for a work about "a solemn pagan rite: sage elders, seated in a circle, watched a young girl dance herself to death". - again it’s an unattributed quote
  • ”caused a near-riot” is begging to have some explanation! I don’t mind that in the lead as a summary, but you could add a bit more.
  • Footnote added. As the hubbub was more to do with the choreography than the music I think it more suitable to have the details in a note than in the main text. (The music was, in fact, well received when performed in concert on 5 April 1914.) Tim riley talk 10:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Soon after he returned, World War I began, and the Stravinskys lived in Switzerland until 1920,[g] initially residing in Clarens and later Morges. - a bit grammatically odd. After the WW1 mention, you could say, “leading the Stravinskys to live in Switzerland until 1920.”
  • The grammar seems all right to me, and I don't think we can say unequivocally that the war led the Stravinskys to live in Switzerland. It may well be that the war was indeed one reason, but it isn't for us to conjecture. The family had moved temporarily to Leysin, in the Alps east of Lake Geneva, in January 1914 while his wife was treated for tuberculosis, and they stayed in Switzerland until June 1920, when they returned to France.) Tim riley talk 10:13, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • The second paragraph of France is confusing. Did he work on player pianos until 1930, when the Aeolian Branch shut down, or 1933? “and he worked at the Rochechouart factory until 1933, long after the player piano went out of fashion.”
  • Redrawn. The Pleyel premises remained Stravinsky's Paris base even after the bottom had fallen out of the pianola market. Pleyel remained a leading manufacturer of pianos and harps.
  • ”The Stravinsky couple's poor English” - I thought the wife died by the time Igor moved to the US? This is in the US section.
  • “In his 1936 autobiography, Chronicle of My Life” - earlier you referred to it as “Chroniques de ma vie” - it’s inconsistent.
  • I think this is all right. It was published in French first and later in English. This is made explicit in the following section.

All in all, a good read, just a few minor issues here and there. Hurricanehink mobile (talk) 22:45, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I appreciate all of your edits and feedback, Tim riley (talk · contribs)! Happy to support. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:07, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Excellent! In MyCat's absence I thank you for your support of his nomination. Tim riley talk 19:14, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Drive-by comment[edit]

  • Cite 63: Fedorovsky 2002 needs adding to the sources. Gog the Mild (talk) 20:31, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thank you for spotting that! Now added (and misspelling corrected). Tim riley talk 07:12, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


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