Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Mr. Hankey, the Christmas Poo/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Karanacs 21:05, 19 May 2009 [1].

Mr. Hankey, the Christmas Poo[edit]

Nominator(s): — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 21:52, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
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I am nominating this for featured article as part of the South Park Featured Topic Drive. It has already passed as a GA. Please note' that I will be on vacation from May 3 to May 10. I will have limited Internet access and will check in here from time to time, but will not be able to address suggestions or objections as swiftly until I return. Thanks!— Hunter Kahn (contribs) 21:52, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Given that, would you consider withdrawing the nomination until you return? That a nominator will not be here to respond to issues will likely put many off from reviewing the article. Steve T • C 22:31, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strike it. I can respond; I just found out I have Internet access at the room I'm staying at, I wasn't sure whether I did or not at first. Sorry about that... — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 03:15, 2 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comments - sources look okay, links checked out with the link checker tool. Ealdgyth - Talk 17:43, 3 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • This character isn't difficult to describe, and does not justify the use of a non-free image, File:Hankey_flush.gif, using the text "A poo with a santa hat" would provide the same information WP:NFCC#1, WP:WIAFA#3 Fasach Nua (talk) 20:59, 3 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I removed the image. Perhaps we could find a different image from the episode to use instead. Cirt (talk) 10:41, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
What are you unable to explain without an image? Fasach Nua (talk) 13:52, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not sure, was simply making a suggestion. :) Cirt (talk) 13:53, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'll take a look too for other possible images. I don't exactly agree that an illustration of the character isn't necessary (I know he's easy to describe, but it's not an exact visualization, and I just feel given the popularity of the character from this episode, an article without his image is a lesser article) but Fasach's comments are well taken and I'm OK with the removal. — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 14:19, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Personally, I think that that image is okay. Maybe the infobox caption could be improved, but I think that the image would pass the NFCC. Sceptre (talk) 17:44, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe you could mention the Mickey Mouse connection, and show the fudge trail. - Peregrine Fisher
I completely disagree to removing the image and not having any representation of the character because (i) the character is quite popular and thus some user might be interested in actually seeing a representation of such a ridiculous character, (ii) how is this different from removing all the images from say Britney Spears by saying that it is enough to say that she is a blond female? Nergaal (talk) 17:26, 5 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
(i) 'quite popular' is not included in NFCC, (ii) the licencing Fasach Nua (talk) 20:57, 5 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • The popularity by itself isn't included in the NFCC, but wouldn't you say that the fact that this character became a household name, and helped convey the show to a new level of relevance, plays to the Significance section of the NFCC? I also disagree agree that the text "poo with a Santa hat" is sufficient to create a visual illustration of Hankey, and now that the image has been removed I feel all the more strongly that an omission of some some or Hankey image would be detrimental to the article.
  • Taking the feedback above into consideration (especially from Peregrine), I've added a new image. In addition now to illustrating the character and "potty humor" of the episode, it also better demonstrates the Mickey Mouse/1930s elements (due to the closeup) and the (rather gross) fudge trail. (This is all under the Purpose of Use rationale.) I think this is better, but I would appreciate any more feedback. — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 00:37, 6 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

oppose - FA criteria #3, inappropriate use of non-free content 17:52, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

  • I'm assuming this unsigned comment is still Fasach Nua? If so (or even if not) can you provide any more specific feedback? It seems that based on all the feedback that was left above, the image licensing problem has now been resolved... — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 19:39, 6 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • "this theme is overly stated by Stan" should that be overtly?

(talk) (contribs) 18:03, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • "Parker's voice for Mr. Hankey is an exact, unexaggerated version of how his counselor spoke" Should that be Mr. Mackey?
  • "composes the avant-garde musical score for the avant-garde musical score for the non-denominational" repetition?
  • "was the episode that really brought South Park to the level of popularity and relevance it attained." seems awkward.
    • Changed it to "elevated South Park to a new level of popularity and relevance," like from the lead. — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 03:05, 5 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • "top 27 South Park episodes for television marathon" Should it be "for a"?
  • " government buildings refusing to allow models of the nativity scene and other Christian holiday symbols" Should it be "the display of models"? - Peregrine Fisher (talk) (contribs) 15:22, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: comprehensizeness checks out. 40KB is twice my personal baseline () Sceptre (talk) 15:50, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support but I'd like to see something like "The close-up of the character also accentuates the visual style of Mr. Hankey, who was deliberately designed to resemble Mickey Mouse from the 1928 cartoon Steamboat Willie, particularly in the eyes, so as to convey the wholesomeness of cartoon characters from that era." from the image description page used in the images caption. If other people like the current caption, that's fine too, since that info is in the body, but it's my preference to put a summary of the NFCC meeting text right next to the image. - Peregrine Fisher (talk) (contribs) 19:19, 6 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • I was concerned that the caption would be too long, but I've incorporated it. What do you think? — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 19:39, 6 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • It is long, but I think it's OK. Let's see what others think. If people think it's too long, then a shorter version is OK with me too. - Peregrine Fisher (talk) (contribs) 21:33, 6 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • This article has my support regardless of caption, but my preference is for Steamboat Willy to be mentioned in the caption. - Peregrine Fisher (talk) (contribs) 16:51, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment—Considering that the infobox pic's caption is so long, why not move it to the Episode Production section, where the Mickey Mouse resemblance is actually discussed? I don't think there is a rule (even an unwritten one) that TV episode articles must have infobox pics. indopug (talk) 10:56, 9 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • You're right that there's no rule, but it's certainly preferable, especially considering that the photo illustrates elements touched on all throughout the article, not just the episode production section. What I've done, using the FA Damien (South Park) as a precident, is shorten the caption but kept the whole shebang in the Purpose of Use rationale. Does this work? — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 00:41, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: In the Reviews and ratings section, what does "The episode also earned a 51 share of the male demographic aged between 18 and 24." actually mean? --RexxS (talk) 11:09, 9 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • I added a definition to try to clarify; let me know if that works. — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 00:41, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks - that works for me. I ought to add I slightly prefer the longer caption referred to above, particularly the "Steamboat Willie" allusion - although that's in the main text, I felt it was a good point to make in the caption. Have a look at WP:CAPTIONS and see if something like "The Mr. Hankey character helped elevate the popularity and relevance of the series through its resemblance to Mickey Mouse in the 1928 cartoon Steamboat Willie" might be a compromise? Anyway, I'm happy to Support however the caption turns out. --RexxS (talk) 09:49, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thanks for the support! I think this new version covers the length issue and the Steamboat Willie allusion. — Hunter Kahn (contribs) 20:23, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support: Hunter Kahn has done great improvements to the article. The article deserves the bronze star. —Terrence and Phillip 20:25, 9 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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