Wikipedia:Featured sound candidates/October 2008

Please cut and paste new entries to the bottom of this page, creating a new monthly archive (by closing date) when necessary.

• For promoted entries, add '''Promoted Example.ogg''' --~~~~ to the bottom of the entry, replacing Example.ogg with the file that was promoted.
• For entries not promoted, add '''Not promoted''' --~~~~ to the bottom of the entry.
• For entries demoted, add '''Demoted Example.ogg''' --~~~~ to the bottom of the entry.

Use variants as appropriate, e.g. with a large set of files, all of which pass, '''Promoted all''' is fine, but if one of them didn't pass for some reason, make sure that's clear.

I Want to Go Back to Michigan

Irving Berlin is an important enough songwriter to deserve a place among our featured sounds. The challenge is to find an early composition and a recording under free license. This 1914 song is remembered largely for Judy Garland's performance in the film Easter Parade. The film was made too late for the pre-1923 window, but I was able to locate this 1914 recording from the year the song was first composed and it's good quality for the period. Appears at "I Want to Go Back to Michigan" and at Edison Records. Lyrics available at Wikisource.

• Nominate and support. Durova^Charge! 20:48, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support. --Kleinzach 03:09, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support --Banime (talk) 18:56, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support --Vejvančický (talk) 08:57, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
• SupportGeni 23:37, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted I Want to Go Back to Michigan.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:34, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

O frondens virga

A fine recording of plain chant, by the wonderful User:Makemi, whose professional-level a capella recordings grace featured sounds in many places.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 01:20, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support with a question: does it need the applause? Durova^Charge! 21:15, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
  • No, we could lose it if desired. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 21:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support with removed applause. --Banime (talk) 19:21, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted O frondens 2.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:37, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

The Carnival of the Animals

Such a major work deserves -even needs a full recording for Wikipedia. This is a professional recording, with the famous and hugely respected Seattle Youth Symphony, which shows off the work to great effect.

Used in The Carnival of the Animals, Seattle Youth Symphony, Camille Saint-Saëns, Vilem Sokol

• Co-nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 19:36, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
• Co-nominate and support. Bastique ^demandez 19:42, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
• question when was it recorded? Zginder 2008-09-15T19:57Z (UTC)
  • Not sure, but the Vilem Sokol was only conductor of the Seattle Youth Symphony until the 80s, and Pandora Records was established in 1973, so... circa 1980. The Pandora Records archive isn't always as detailed as one might hope. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 23:27, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
• Is the Cortado player acting funny for anyone else? I've put a bugzilla report in, but I swear this project suffers more from bad coding than any other featured project. Oh, well, if it is, download it for now. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 23:53, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
• Just listened to it, it sounded fine. Played til the end. Support. - Jameson L. Tai ^{talk ♦ contribs} 05:22, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
• Oppose until the en dashes are fixed (year ranges) and there's a space after "c.". See MoS. Pity these music recordings are on the fizzy side. Is it ogg or the source? Now, the so-called "votes" of two co-nominators can't possibly be counted as part of the three required "votes" after 14 days. Otherwise, it's an inbuilt two-thirds of the requirement just on nomination, which would be ridiculous. This is supposed to be a review process, not one of self-congratulation. Tony (talk) 06:31, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Should be fixed. However, as one nominator vote has counted towards the three throughout the Featured sound run, and on every other featured project, I'd suggest that they count as at least one collective vote. Sadly, while we're a viable project now, we're still not quite out of the inbred early stage. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 10:37, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support for the same reasons as Jameson L. Tai. Very nice. Ncmvocalist (talk) 18:32, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support per nom. Durova^Charge! 04:17, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Camille Saint-Saëns - The Carnival of the Animals.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:34, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Le trompeur trompé

A thoroughly professional recording of a fine, if obscure opera. Lyrics are provided. They translate pretty easily, I'll do that tomorrow.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 17:51, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Question How do we know this is a 'fine' opera? Has it been performed in the last 100 years? Is there a recording? Has any music survived other than this aria? I've been looking and I can't find anything. --Kleinzach 04:48, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
    • You're the one who owns Grove and is the head of the Opera project. I'd have thought you had more resources to hand on 17th century (the 18th centuryt starts in 1801) French opera than I did - almost all my sources are on Victorian English opera. I suspect the music does survive - why would one aria alone survive? but suspect it would be far easier to find information in France. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 16:15, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
      • Thousands and thousands of operas have been written, performed or not performed, lost and forgotten. Sometimes the music is preserved in libraries but often not. Grove is the largest work on opera in the English language but it only covers the 2,000 most notable works. Grove covers Pierre Gaveaux - because of his importance as a singer and the connection with Fidelio - but the biography doesn't mention Le trompeur trompé. Nevertheless you decided to write an article on it - hence my questions. --Kleinzach 03:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
        • At the very least, this aria was professionally recorded. The composer is reasonably notable, andd I found information on the opera fairly easy to find. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 10:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
          • And yet you don't know whether any music has survived, other than this aria! I'm underwhelmed. --Kleinzach 05:34, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
• Weak oppose. Notability not established. --Kleinzach 05:36, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support If it is notable for the encyclopedia and improves the artilces it is in it is notable enough to be featured. Zginder 2008-09-16T13:03Z (UTC)
• Oppose. So thus far, there's one functional support, isnt' there. Can we work out how the policy of notability applies to sound files, please? I'm confused. This is a good performance, although it's a pity the clarinet is so closely miked—the chalumeau isn't flattering, and there are a few breathy phrases; odd, since the tone elsewhere is beautiful. If this work was an opera (again, no link), surely this is some strange kind of reduction of the orchestral parts for piano and clarinet; the info page says nothing. Again, we all need to read WP:DASH to get it right for year ranges. Spaced or unspaced? Hyphen or en dash? You tell me. Surely Levine should be linked; and doesn't the composer have a dedicated article? Tony (talk) 06:45, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I believe it's an early form of what would later be known as a chamber opera, done with only a few instruments. Anyway, we have a good recording of an opera by a reasonably notable composer. I think that it compellingly illustrates his article, it was a commercial release on historical instruments, and I think it should pass. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 11:52, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
    • Given the continuo it's almost certainly a scaled-down arrangement. The opera is an opéra comique, there's a short article, also Category:opéras comiques with 65 examples including Carmen. Nothing to do with chamber opera. It's pleasantly sung and very enjoyable . . . but that's not the point, is it? --Kleinzach 09:31, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
      • I don't know. It could be the point. I mean, it certtainly illustrates Pierre Gaveaux well, and that's probably all it needs to. =) Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 10:25, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
        • No, no, it doesn't illustrate Pierre Gaveaux well! That's the point. It's not one of his notable works! We should have something from Léonore or Sophie et Moncars - though even these don't have articles. --Kleinzach 10:00, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support - Good recording, has potential to be used well inside other parts of the project. Xavexgoem (talk) 23:37, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Pierre Gaveaux - Polacca from the opera Le Trompeur Trompé.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:32, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Antonio Pasculli - Gran Concerto

A particularly fine example of what the oboe is capable of. Very encyclopedic for Oboe, great for Antonio Pasculli and Oboe concerto too.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 02:32, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support per nominator. Zginder 2008-09-19T19:56Z (UTC)
• Support - Decent recording of a piano concerto. Can't get much better than that :-) Xavexgoem (talk) 23:34, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Antonio Pasculli - Gran Concerto.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:31, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Hunters' Chorus from The Lily of Killarney

A recording from the Library of Congress music division using period instruments for a chorus from an opera by Julius Benedict. The Lily of Killarney (also known as The Rose of Erin) is the composer's best-known work. Appears at Julius Benedict and The Lily of Killarney.

• Nominate and support. Durova^Charge! 07:46, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
• Oppose Unfortunately, there are no voices - so this is a not a chorus. The recording is misnamed and frankly not very useful. I think it's a kind of medley of tunes. --Kleinzach 13:29, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
  • What are you on about, a chorus does not necessarily have anything to do with voices. GerardM (talk) 06:04, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
  • It's a good quality recording on period instruments and the score is also available in a good resolution file. If at some point we're able to find a free licensed recording that also has voice I'd be glad to delist and replace (we recently delisted and replaced Vivaldi when a better version was located). Durova^Charge! 19:10, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
    • OK. Can you verify that it is the music of the chorus even if the chorus itself is absent? If so I suggest the file be re-named. At present it's misleading. I can put this to the Opera Project but it's likely the consensus will be for deletion from the The Lily of Killarney article. It's not possible to have one standard for verification/notable of text and another for audio. Best. --Kleinzach 02:56, 31 August 2008 (UTC)
      • Well, the Library of Congress bibliographic notes linked from the image hosting file include the following statement: On September 27, 1974, the Music Division of the Library of Congress recreated a typical concert of brass-band and vocal music from mid-nineteenth-century America. Recorded selections from that concert are presented here. These recordings are the result of several years of research by Jon Newsom of the Music Division and many more years of experience and study by Frederick Fennell, founder and former director of the Eastman Wind Ensemble and professor of music at the University of Miami, and Robert E. Sheldon, then of the Smithsonian Institution's Division of Musical Instruments and presently Curator of Musical Instruments in the Music Division, Library of Congress. Because the purpose of these recordings is to demonstrate the style and quality of the popular music of the era, the musicians use instruments appropriate to the period. I simply used the same descriptors LoC used. Durova^Charge! 03:04, 31 August 2008 (UTC)
        • The Lily of Killarney is not American, but English. I think it's possible that the recording is a popular (American?) rearrangement of music from the opera. If that's so it may well have satisfied the purposes of the Library of Congress, but it may not help us with the actual opera. --Kleinzach 02:55, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
          • Please provide a source for these assertions. The Library of Congress bibliographic notes say these are alternate names for the same opera. It appears you are opposing this candidacy and threatening to remove the file from the article based upon unsupported claims. This nomination is already sourced according to the same standards as dozens of my previous media featured content nominations. I would gladly amend it if new evidence emerges. Durova^Charge! 03:46, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
            • Please read what I actually said: "I think it's possible . . ." I did not overstate the case given the paucity of information. As for the nationality of the work, please see the article. Re "alternate names for the same opera" I don't understand, can you clarify? (I thought the only name we had here was The Lily of Killarney.) Thanks. P.S. Nigel Burton's Grove article doesn't mention this chorus at all, so it doesn't seem to be a particularly notable section of the work even when there is a chorus! This quote from Burton may be helpful: "His orchestration is superb: never obtrusive, always sensitive to each instrument's obbligato qualities, yet sometimes prophetic of Elgar in its subtle blends of colour." Is that what you are hearing in this clip?--Kleinzach 06:57, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

(outdent)The citation specifies ...the opera The Rose of Erin (1862), originally called and still known as The Lilly of Kilarney. Now as you wrote, It's not possible to have one standard for verification/notable of text and another for audio. I agree with that statement. This discussion is very confusing: you first declare that the same citation standards must apply to music that apply to text, then when I point out that it has been properly cited and ask for competing citations, it looks very much that instead of supplying them you ask me to violate WP:NOR and attempt to second guess a professor of music and a Smithsonian scholar with my own ear. Well of course I'm not going to do that. If there's something here I'm misunderstanding please set it straight. Durova^Charge! 07:49, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose As Kleinzach wrote, an opera chorus played by a wind orchestra doesn't seem very useful — it doesn't seem to give a true impression of a work which is decribed as "The English Ring" (does Viking really say that?). While Benedict may well deserve its convincing handling of Irish idiom for the work overall, this chorus doesn't seem to be a good example — it sounds very German to me.

I fail to see how this clip lives up to any of the requirements at Wikipedia:Featured sound candidates (i.a: … should illustrate a Wikipedia article in such a way as to add significantly to that article); in fact, I think it detracts from the article: after listening to the clip, I certainly wouldn't want to hear the whole work.

Apparently, the actual chorus includes sopranos which is unusual for a Hunters' Chorus; now that I would like to hear. As it stands, it represents an unusual arrangement of a minor number from a minor opera (notwithstanding its appearance in Ulysses), played by a thoroughly unremarkable orchestra (those tubas need to work on their pitch).

@Durova: Where did you find a score of this work? I found three (very un-operatic) piano scores at the LOC, but nothing like what we hear in this clip.

I don't think this clip satifies the requirement of the first two sentences at WP:FSC. Are there any further evaluation criteria? Michael Bednarek (talk) 11:46, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

• Support Frankly, I'm shocked that two long-time Opera people would be so ignorant about the popularisation of opera. The popular operas of the 19th century were assisted in this popularisation by brass band arrangements of their songs. For instance, according to the popular story H.M.S. Pinafore's rise to popularity was directly caused by Sullivan adding extracts of the opera to brass band concerts he was in charge of. (Modern research says that view is simplistic, though most scholars agree it helped)

This is one such arrangement, performed on historical instruments. Admittedly, Durova could have done a much better job of explaining what it is, but this is very, very typical of how a 19th century opera would be used in popular culture. Description should be changed, though, as it is misleading to leave out the words "Brass band arrangement of..." Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 06:12, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

• • At least we know what it is now. Despite my extraordinary ignorance - which is really much, much greater than the black hole you have identified re. popularization of opera in 19th century America - I did get close in guessing what it was (as Michael Bednarek did). Anyway it's not a chorus, not an opera and shouldn't be elevated to featured status - as an example of opera. Thanks for sorting this out. It would have been unfortunate if it had slipped through. Best. --Kleinzach 07:16, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I do study 19th century British opera as my main field of study - I have this bad habit of presuming that what I know is basic knowledge, when it's often really specialised. =) I do think it's encyclopedic for brass band articles, though. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 08:51, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

If it's an example of 19th-century American brass band playing that's absolutely fine by me. I just don't think it should be on the opera article. --Kleinzach09:20, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

This is to judge a soundfile; it is not to judge an article on opera. GerardM (talk) 14:13, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

It's not quite that simple. WP:FSC starts with "Featured sounds is a list of sounds that add significantly to articles, either by illustrating article content particularly well, or being so striking to the ear that users will want to read the accompanying article. […] the sounds featured on Wikipedia:Featured sounds should illustrate a Wikipedia article in such a way as to add significantly to that article." The objection is that this sound doesn't do anything for this article.

Also, I can't read a judgement of the opera article in Kleinzach's remark. Michael Bednarek (talk) 16:03, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Support. Brass band arrangements were a large part of the historical popularization of opera. I do not see why it would be inappropriate to include an example of this historically significant phenomena in various appropriate articles, including the article for the composer and operatic piece. Vassyana (talk) 17:59, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose I side with Kleinzach & Michael Bednarek on this one. I don't see this satisfying the criteria. Eusebeus (talk) 02:25, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support as good music. Xavexgoem (talk) 23:19, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Hunters' Chorus from The Rose of Erin.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:30, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Le Bourgeois gentilhomme

It's an entire ballet by Lully and Molière, sans Molière's dialogue between the movements. The importance is obvious, and, insofar as I can be considered able to judge Baroque music, I think the performance quite good. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 22:13, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

It's used in Lully, Le Bourgeois gentilhomme, and various bits are used elsewhere, e.g. French overture.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 22:13, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
• I hate this silly business of making up one of the required three "votes" in nomination and support. What the rule are, in effect, is two votes, isn't it. The vote of the nominator is clearly a conflict of interest. And if there are co-nominators, does that mean that only one reviewer's "Support" is required? Now, en dashes, not hyphens, required in the titles. Spelling error in the info page of the first one. Good performance indeed; pity about the boxy acoustics. Where was it recorded, and by whom? Tony (talk) 06:23, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
  • This is how it's been done in every featured content voting section since time immemorial. Secondly, it's a horrible, horrible idea to use things that cannot be typed on any keyboard in a file name. Some keyboards can type é. At the least, it's immediately clear that é is not e. That is not true with - and –. This is basic common sense. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 12:19, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I didn't realize that the nominator could support his or her own nomination! (Obviously I wasn't paying attention!) Anyway this can't be right! --Kleinzach 09:46, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
    • It's in the template, as it is in WP:FP and various others. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 10:23, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
      • Then I think it's high time there was a reform. Where can I propose it? --Kleinzach 07:10, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
        • Try the talk page here, but I would suggest that there would have to be a simultaneous discussion on WT:FPC. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 20:50, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support Zginder 2008-09-30T17:03Z (UTC)
• Support I sampled randomly and it seems a perfectly acceptable performance. Eusebeus (talk) 15:22, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted all. --MZMcBride (talk) 19:11, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Swan-Lake

Both elegant and unique - a "hands-down" masterpiece that has been revered and admired for generations. This debuted back in '77 (1877 that is) as part of a ballet. Arguably Tchaikovskys best work.

• Nominate and support. Flewis^(talk) 12:11, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
• Comment What is meant by the copyright statement on the recording? Does it mean it is copyvio in the USA. What about commercial use? Zginder 2008-10-07T13:37Z (UTC)

Copyrights are recognized internationally depending on the location of where the work was created. --Flewis^(talk) 14:16, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

• This was recorded by Michael Tilson Thomas and the London Symphony Orchestra, apparently in 2006. Is it really copyright free? Also why is Swan-Lake hyphenated? --Kleinzach 13:51, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

This wasn't recorded by the London Symphony Orchestra, this is the recording of the performance. Swan-Lake is hyphenated due to file-name consistency. Eg, some browsers may have have trouble understanding blank spaces (%20) --Flewis^(talk) 14:16, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Are you sure about that copyright rationale? The permission section's interpretation of the relevant UK copyright law appears to only cover graphic images of publically displayed works, ie photographs of works of art and suchlike. It does not sound like it covers audio recordings in this way. ~ mazca ^t|c 18:42, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Let me see if I understand the rationale: This was performed outdoors, in a public place, and you recorded it there? Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 20:45, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Nope, recorded in a concert hall ("A premises open to the public" - The UK copyright license does not explicitly state any information regarding audio - especially if the audio is not an official recording by the artist/group in question) --Flewis^(talk) 21:59, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

This still sounds extremely dubious to me - by that rationale almost any recording of a non-modern piece of music could be classed as free. ~ mazca ^t|c 22:37, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose and delete The recording is obviously not free, and there is no indication that the arrangement is free either. I propose that we suggest deletion of Commons. Zginder 2008-10-07T22:23Z (UTC)

If anything, the music itself is within the public domain (Author died 115 years ago), which "weakens" the "copyright" further - doubled over by the fact that this is not an official recording by any commercial organization/group. --Flewis^(talk) 04:55, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

For any more copyright-based 'opposes' - please continue the discussion here, to avoid a pile on --Flewis^(talk) 04:55, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose per Zginder. --Kleinzach 23:10, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
• Notice Has been deleted on commons. Zginder 2008-10-10T04:30Z (UTC)

Not promoted as deleted and no support --Zginder 2008-10-10T04:31Z (UTC)

Tokay gecko mating call

Field recording made in northern Laos of a gecko mating call.

• Nominate and support. Durova^Charge! 18:49, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
• Weak Oppose Notability isn't really established in the article itself and it contains no citations. It states that the gecko is known for its call, but it is unreferenced. The above vote was me, sorry for forgetting to sign. --Banime (talk) 12:30, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
• Previous objection is unactionable, since this is not a review of articles, but of the sound file. I do wish there were more information on the recording—what time of day, who the recordist is, just a short phrase as to what the creature is, was it on a river bank? Tony (talk) 06:34, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

I was just referring to the followering FS Criteria: Role. The file helps readers to understand the topic of an article. The file is used in at least one article, where it is supported by the text and, if appropriate, reference citations on the file description page. I stand by my weak oppose for that reason, I don't think the sound has an appropriate role especially in an unrefenced section of that article. --Banime (talk) 19:12, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

• Support - Recordings of animals' cries and songs are inherently usefuul, even if the articles suck =) Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:34, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support It is very helpful sound file for readers/listeners to understand the subject's features.--Caspian blue (talk) 05:02, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Mating call of a male Tokay gecko (Gekko gecko).ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 06:41, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Flag song

An example of Omaha musical culture performed at the Library of Congress in 1985. Ceremonial anthem. Translation provided at image hosting page. Appears at Omaha (tribe).

• Nominate and support. Durova^Charge! 20:46, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
• Comment: Can someone check the copyright status? I'm not sure in what sense this is supposed to be the work of a federal US government official. Fut.Perf. ☼ 06:27, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
  • It was a performance sponsored by the Library of Congress, recorded on Library of Congress equipment. The underlying artistic work is public domain. Durova^Charge! 08:15, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support Zginder 2008-10-04T18:43Z (UTC)
• Support While the voice at the start is really annoying, I think this will do very well until we get better. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 06:09, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Flag song.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 18:39, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

Morgenlich leuchtend im rosigen Schein

The song that all of Die Meistersinger, Wagner's opera about the creation and theory of music, revolves around. Wagner clearly intended this song, breaking all the old stuffy rules of the Meistersingers, to be a clear expression of his views of music, and hence, it is important and eminently featurable =)

A score is forthcoming. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 13:26, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 13:26, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support per nom. Too important a composer to ignore. Durova^Charge! 19:07, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support per above--Banime (talk) 21:11, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support but please don't spam it over multiple articles - just on the relevant Leo Slezak and Meistersinger pages please. --Kleinzach 02:39, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I've only put it in those and Richard Wagner - I think it's helpful to collect some samples in the composer articles Edit: and in 1868 in music, for obvious reasons. The "XXXX in music" articles are usually very poorly illustrated.. I'm not sure where else it could go, outside maybe Romantic music or something, if it illustrated some point well. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 04:22, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
    • Hmm. If this is appropriate for Richard Wagner then so are thousands of other potential files as well. Please keep these files only in directly relevant articles. WP uses links - no reason to put duplicates all over the place! --Kleinzach 03:52, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
      • I really dont' think it's a good idea not to at least have some files in the main composer article. Certainly, we can be a bit selective, but we should include at least a few. Richard Wagner lacked any examples of Wagner for voice (as I recall), which is not ideal in such a predominantly opera composer. =) Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 04:39, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
        • Please refer this to the Wagner Project - they should be the people to decide. --Kleinzach 08:50, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support for the Leo Slezak article but not in the Wagner pages. I would be astonished if the Wagner editors were content for this to remain on the Meistersinger page; at best, it would be a capricious choice. I would defer to their view, natch. Eusebeus (talk) 15:18, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
  • Well, the decision of which recordings was done on the Wagner page, and this was one of the two suggested of the set of 6 I provided. If they dislike it, I'm open to doing another. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 15:51, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
• I love the song very much, but let's face it. The value of the sound is "historical aspects" coming from the composer, singer, and recording date, not the quality of the sound. The sound is in poor quality, so I must oppose to promote it. I think we're too mild on FS candidates compared to FP and FA/FL.--Caspian blue (talk) 04:53, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Richard Wagner - Preisleid from Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg sung by Leo_Slezak 3.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 18:38, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

Lillian Russell - Come Down Ma Evenin' Star

Lillian Russell was one of the "big names" in operetta. She starred in Gilbert and Sullivan, Offenbach, the New York run of Dorothy, and, in the early 20th century, in musicals, reviews, burlesques, and various other comedies. This is her only recording.

A transcription of the lyrics is forthcoming.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 06:32, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
• Wish there was a little less static, but the quality of the voice might be compromised if more is taken out. Other than that reservation, support. Ncmvocalist (talk) 09:08, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support. Regardless of available sound quality due to age, this is a notable recording with a fascinating story. Vassyana (talk) 16:01, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Lillian Russell - Come Down Ma Evenin' Star.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 17:00, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Shine On, Harvest Moon

Do I really need to defend this one? Everyone knows this song. Durova has provided a complete music score at commons:Category:Shine_on_Harvest_Moon.

Lyrics are available at the dedicated article Shine On, Harvest Moon.

• Co-nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 08:37, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
• Conominate and support. A fine old song still remembered. Durova^Charge! 17:07, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support. A very nice historical and enjoyable illustration. Vassyana (talk) 15:59, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Ada Jones and Billy Murray - Shine On, Harvest Moon.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 17:01, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Le Cid

A fine recording, done during the composer's lifetime. Marguerita Sylva, a.k.a Marguerite Sylva, was good enough to star at the Opéra-Comique in Paris [1], and that's good enough for me. =)

Le Cid is not Massenet's most popular opera, but it has a large, detailed Wikipedia article that is vastly improved by the addition of this sound. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 15:41, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 15:36, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support Weak oppose as non-notable. Not only does Marguerita Sylva lack an article - she's only mentioned once in another WP article (The Fortune Teller). She's not, for example, in the The Record of Singing. It would be far better to concentrate on notable singers, for whom we have articles. (The recording itself is fine. I'd withdraw my oppose if someone can produce a decent article.) --Kleinzach 06:49, 6 October 2008 (UTC) Changing my vote to support now we have an article - but Shoemaker's Holiday, please don't spam this file over multiple pages. Leave it on the biography! --Kleinzach 23:18, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
  • There appear to be plenty of sources, but I'm not quite sure why the presence of a Wikipedia article should affect the quality of her performance, or her notability =) Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 07:02, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
    • Not only does an article provide the best place to locate the sound file, but it is also - among other things - a WP-related proof of notability. Did I really need to explain this? WP is an encyclopedia not a podcast. --Kleinzach 23:49, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
      • I think we're coming at this from different perspectives. I come from these things from the perspective of the operas and composers, you from that of the singers. I think that if the recording illustrates the opera well, then it has a home, and adding more information, such as information on the singer, is a bonus. Likewise, if a highly notable singer's only recording does not have an article on the song or opera, I don't see that as a problem either. By creating the pages on the other half, the file becomes more valuable, but does not lose all value because it is only currently doing one of the possible rôles. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 02:32, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
        • Oh come on. . . Most of these early recordings can only be appreciated by people who already know the operas. The listener needs to have some aural imagination. That's why they are not appropriate for composer pages. --Kleinzach 12:40, 11 October 2008 (UTC)
• Comment I can't vote as I don't have the ogg thingy on my PC, but if others approve of the sound quality, I'd be all in favour of it being a FS. I've just written Marguerite Sylva so the file can have a "home". A very interesting lady! In general terms, I think it's important for readers to have an article which contextualizes the artist they are listening to and would suggest that this be an important criteria to consider when assigning FS status in the future. Best wishes and thanks to Shoemaker's Holiday for all their hard work, Voceditenore (talk) 21:58, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support All the raised issues are solved in my mind. Zginder 2008-10-07T22:42Z (UTC)

Promoted Massenet - Le Cid - Pleurez, pleurez, mes yeux.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 07:39, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

O soave fanciulla

Two of the biggest names in turn-of-the century opera sing a song from the opera by Giacomo Puccini they helped make the smash hit it has remained to this day. Everything about this is top importance to opera. The singers are the biggest starts of their day, Puccini is arguably the most popular opera composer of all time, and... well, La bohème. The only minor flaw is that Caruso seems to have been hogging the recording horn, making Melba sound a bit weaker.

Extraction of the piece from its context in the opera seems to have involved the removal of a short counterpoint phrase for Mimi (a repeat of the end of the previous song) near the beginning, otherwise, I believe this is complete.

Anyway, I'm going to bed now. I don't think there'll be any significant problems. I haven't found a score yet, but if I don't find one before it closes, I'll grab a transcription of the lyrics instead.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 00:38, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
• Correction needed: As I wrote to you on 4 September: This is famous. It was recorded in New York on 24 March 1907 (Victor C4326 95200 [2]). I can't support this nominations unless the documentation is corrected. It discredits the encyclopedia to publish wrong information. (Of course if you don't think it's C4326 95200 please say so and give the right matrix number.) (BTW this is so famous I hardly think a score/text is necessary.) --Kleinzach 07:02, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Corrected. Sorry about that, I clearly missed an e-mail or message. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 09:04, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support. --Kleinzach 09:52, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support now that its corrected. --Banime (talk) 21:12, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support - good sound quality, great documentary value, priceless improving of Caruso's article Vejvančický (talk) 08:47, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Enrico Caruso - Nellie Melba - La bohème - O soave fanciulla (restored).ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 03:46, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

O souverain

Forgive all the Massenet - I shall be moving on to Puccini after this, but wanted to finish up a couple articles I had started improving.

That said, I believe I should justify why a lot of what is coming up of late is the same few singers. Basically, when you're looking at pre-1923 public domain sound, you're looking at the infancy of the recording industry, and a lot of frankly bizarre recordings were made as people experimented with the novel new medium. At the moment, I'm trying to fulfil some commitments I've made to WikiProject Opera, as well as helping out a few others with some other genres well-represented in that time period. This means finding high-quality recordings of certain arias and composers.

90% of what I find is utter crap. Every recording I evaluated of the Toreador song from Carmen, for instance, was simply awful. But then we have those few singers who manage top-quality performances consistently, the top few percent of the herd. If the choice is to go with Caruso, or Billy Murphy, or Ada Jones again; to choose someone who sounds terrible; or to not have any coverage at all, I think everyone will agree that choosing Caruso is a good choice.

Perhaps it's unnecessary to defend such choices, particularly as Caruso has only been featured once, but I feel better having done so.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 13:08, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support - but it should only go on the Le Cid and Enrico Caruso pages. --Kleinzach 01:10, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
  • This is a bit of an aside, but can you confirm the spelling and capitalizatiob? I've seen it done several ways, including "O souverain, ô juge, ô père!", and am not really sure which is preferred. Also, I've put it in Massenet for the moment, as the other Le Cid was there, and it's probably best to know what's there before trimming. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 02:23, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
    • Can't confirm spelling/capitalization as I don't have a source. Also there's a lot of clutter on the Massenet page. These sound files (unnecessarily IMO) take up so much white space. --Kleinzach 04:46, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
• Opinion, The wobbling sound around 27 to 29 sec could be edited?--Caspian blue (talk)
  • I'll have a search, but it can be hard to find these things, and harder to fix them. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:12, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
    • Oh, that. Unfortunately, no. The human voice is fiendishly complex, and some things aren't really restorable. Luckily, the flaw is pretty subtle, I think? Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 19:47, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support. While I'm not much of a fan of Massenet, this is an excellent historical recording of his work that is illustrative of his style. Vassyana (talk) 16:16, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Jules Massenet, Enrico Caruso, O Souverain, O Juge, O Pere.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 02:16, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Manon

As you may have noticed, I'm trying to keep the number of featured sound nominations on the page at a decent number. Luckily, I'm also doing masses of sound file restorations, so it all works out in the end. This is usually considered Massenet's masterpiece, and I think these recordings are very good samples of it. Particularly, perhaps, the Caruso-Farrar one. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:08, 6 October 2008 (UTC) *Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:08, 6 October 2008 (UTC) (see below)

• IMO two unrelated recordings would be best as separate candidates. --Kleinzach 06:13, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
  • Possibly. Let's split the vote. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 06:54, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
• Comment. I can't help but think there have to be better recordings available of "Manon". Of all of Massenet's works, I would think it is by the far the most performed and recorded. Vassyana (talk) 16:20, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
  • Better than Caruso and Farrar? I'll grant there may be better than the Giorgini, though it'll be close, I suspect. I'll check. However, do realise the predominence of Manon and the falling off in performance of the others happened a bit after the 1923 cut-off, I believe. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 18:03, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Manon! avez-vous peur...On l'appelle Manon

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:08, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support. This is the first part of Scene 1, Act 2. That should be noted. (BTW Farrar is excellent as Manon.) --Kleinzach 07:36, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support. Notable work, notable performers, historical value. Vassyana (talk) 15:58, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support I could barely tell it was a old recording. Zginder 2008-10-16T16:32Z (UTC)

Promoted Enrico Caruso - Geraldine Farrar - Jules Massenet - Manon - On L'appelle Manon.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 02:17, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Ah! fuyez, douce image

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:08, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
  • I'll withdraw this one of the two for now, to allow the other to pass. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 02:05, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Oh! How I Hate to Get Up in the Morning

An Irving Berlin hit from 1918 in a well restored historic recording, sung by Arthur Fields. Composed while Berlin served in the U.S. Army for a benefit show. Appears in Oh! How I Hate to Get Up in the Morning, Yip Yip Yaphank, Arthur Fields. Complete lyrics and sheet music available at Wikisource (linked from the song article).

• Nominate and support. Durova^Charge! 09:26, 11 October 2008 (UTC)
• Question Why this one and not the Irving Kaufman recording? Zginder 2008-10-12T01:53Z (UTC)
  • This one has better sound quality. Durova^Charge! 04:24, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
    • Support Listening to them both; I agree. Zginder 2008-10-16T21:45Z (UTC)

• Support Beautiful and funny song. Surprising quality of the sound!--Vejvančický (talk) 22:46, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

• Support. Good sound quality + notable composer + historical recording (in multiple senses) + excellent performance = absolute support. Vassyana (talk) 08:51, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Irving Berlin - Arthur Fields - Oh! How I Hate To Get Up In The Morning.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:18, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Frog Legs Rag

This recording is an excellent example of what a synthesized piano can do, when done properly. It was made to illustrate the article on the rag as a public domain recording could not be found. It appears in Frog Legs Rag and James Scott. Created on a synthesized piano by Shoemaker's Holiday.

• Nominate and support. Zginder 2008-09-30T02:57Z (UTC)
• Support - both for the content and the synthesized bit. Xavexgoem (talk) 21:43, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
• Question: Who is the performer? Uploader? Honestly, I don't think the performance is good enough to be featured because of the excessive articulation. --Caspian blue (talk) 04:44, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

• There is no performer; it is a synthesized piano. Zginder 2008-10-11T01:50Z (UTC)

• You mean the performance was played by a player piano, self-playng piano? I thought term "synthesized piano" referring to synthesizer or digital piano. If so, you may say me to reconsider grading the artistic value of the performance. However it is still not good. --Caspian blue (talk) 02:04, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

• Oppose This may be the featured sound only for mobile phones. It's a bit "synthetic" :)) Every day I'm forced to listen many good examples, what synth. pianos can do. Sorry --Vejvančický (talk) 19:01, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
• Oppose per Vejvančický. --Kleinzach 23:51, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
• Oppose. Useful and well done, but the computer performance really doesn't hold a candle to what a good human piano player can do.--ragesoss (talk) 15:16, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Not promoted Frog Legs Rag 2.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:18, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Florodora

The musical was hugely popular at the time, and is usually considered important to the development of the musical, particularly the chorus line. This recording gives the first verse (presumably for length reasons) of the hit song, "Tell me pretty maiden". A score is linked on the information page.

• Nominate and support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 05:31, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
• Support. Excellent sound quality for the period. A very good performance. Historically noteworthy. Vassyana (talk) 16:04, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support. --Kleinzach 00:56, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Florodora_-_Tell_me_pretty_maiden.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:18, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Mozart - Eine kleine Nachtmusik - 1. Allegro

A very striking example of Mozart's works, often used in popular culture. It was performed by Advent Chamber Orchestra and uploaded by User:Graham87 to commons.

• Nominate and support. Alexius08 (talk) 07:41, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
  • Can you confirm that copyright is OK? This is a good recording by a professional orchestra in 2005-6. --Kleinzach 08:52, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
    • Copyright status confirmed. Like all music from the Pandora Music site, this is released under the EFF OAL, a licence which has been merged in with CC-by-SA. It's a pity they've only released the one movement, but, hey, I'll take what we can get. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 09:56, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 09:57, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support Clear and good balanced sound, a high quality performance--Vejvančický (talk) 18:44, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support as uploader. A fine performance of an important work. I've taken the liberty of correcting my username above. Graham87 07:25, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
• Support Impressive quality. Zginder 2008-10-17T14:27Z (UTC)
• Support Internet has a lot of treasure like this. Clean recording with a good performance and "free file. :) --Caspian blue 00:24, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

Promoted Mozart_-_Eine_kleine_Nachtmusik_-_1._Allegro.ogg. --MZMcBride (talk) 01:20, 31 October 2008 (UTC)