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March 6

White Fang

How was it possible to film movies based on White Fang such that no dogs were harmed in the making thereof? In particular, how was it possible to film the scene of the last fight between White Fang and the bulldog, where (at least according to the book) they were literally ripping each other to shreds? 2601:646:8A00:A0B3:C119:5F8:1314:9E22 (talk) 03:36, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

How do you know that no dogs were harmed? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 03:44, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In the world of CGI scenes can be filmed where no live animals are involved. Films like Amores perros and TV series like Game of Thrones have scenes of brutality without harming the animals involved. MarnetteD|Talk 03:47, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

True, but most of these films were made before CGI was invented (some as far back as the early 70s). 2601:646:8A00:A0B3:C119:5F8:1314:9E22 (talk) 03:49, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Your question did not address older films. Prior to the 1970's (and after depending on the country that the film was made in) there are films where the action could cause harm. Horses being felled by trip wires happened quite often. As associations like the SPCA began to protest any harming of animals in making films new techniques were developed to avoid harm to animals. Highly trained animals, camera angles and editing allow for scenes that look brutal but do not harm those involved. MarnetteD|Talk 03:56, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Yes. For example, this source [1] discusses how many of the animal scenes in White Fang (1991 film) were filmed. Probably the scene you refer to most involves this:

All the fight scenes were filmed with the animals playing not fighting. Many hours of filming the animals at play were edited down to a few minutes. Anything that looked like a real fight was edited in and sounds were dubbed in later. The animals had their own make-up trailer where "blood" and "scars" were applied. For White Fang's last fight he wore a fur collar and it is the collar that the Pit-bull had between his teeth, not White Fang's neck.

This was a Disney film anyway so I'm doubtful it was extremely graphically violent.

Some of the reviews here [2] make me think that White Fang (1973 film) was fairly graphic despite the target audience also being children

What happens is that we get to watch a German Shepherd tear a man's throat out, and then look at that man's face as he bleeds out, his body giving one last twitch as he dies. Then there's a cut to the film's hero looking grim as he watches. Then a cut to the dog with his tongue hanging out all floppy and happy as a musical sting assures us "you see before you an irredeemable psychopath exulting in his crime".

But I gather from these discussions [3] [4] that still much of the violence is maybe not that great fakery

Two of these are very similar: a fight between White Fang and another dog, and then a fight between White Fang and a bear. The latter scene is a remarkable bit of sloppy filmmaking: the bear is played a miserably scrawny cub in shots with people, a medium-sized and obviously angry brown bear in shots where it doesn't actually make contact with the dog, and a man in a very obvious bear costume when it's grappling with White Fang. And I mean very obvious. The ears sit atop the head exactly like a teddy bear. These three different incarnations of one animal cut together just as badly as you'd suppose (though the filmmakers have the presence of mind to limit the screentime of the bear costume to the merest flashes), and that helps make this seem silly rather than greatly upsetting, which is much appreciated: for the scene also involves chunks of flesh being ripped from White Fang's side, as the dog grows increasingly caked in his own blood.

One thing perhaps worth considering is filming a bear genuinely fighting a dog probably involved various challenges in itself. Especially if the dog is supposed to barely win the fight. (Or whatever happened.) But as I don't know much about Italian law and norms at the time, and the director's views, and haven't seen the movie, it's not clear to mere if some scenes involved real harm to the animals involved. (The elk scene for example.)

Nil Einne (talk) 13:48, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! So even without CGI, there were ways to do it without having them fight for real (it just took a lot of effort!) 2601:646:8A00:A0B3:C119:5F8:1314:9E22 (talk) 02:22, 7 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Find a movie

I recall watching movie maybe 25 years ago about a woman and her mother who find that her husband is cheating on her. She decides to poison him by putting pills in his spaghetti. But he just won't die. He later realises that she is trying to kill him, and if I recall correctly he begs for forgiveness. The movie had an Italian / American feel. I thought this stared Julia Roberts and was called mystic Pizza, I have been corrected. I can recall the face of the actor who played the husband but cant recall his name. I would like to see the movie again but cant remember the title. Any help would be greatly appreciated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.131.40.58 (talk) 17:58, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I Love You to Death. Nanonic (talk) 18:22, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

KEVIN LINE!!! You're a star. Thanks so much! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.131.40.58 (talk) 18:27, 6 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Or Kevin KLINE. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:19, 8 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]