Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Ba Cut

The following discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Ba Cut

Passed --Eurocopter (talk) 10:15, 21 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nominator(s): YellowMonkey (talk)

Featured article candidates/Ba Cut/archive1

A Vietnamese warlord from the Hoa Hao sect. A rather obscure an idiosyncratic fellow, not that much is known of him. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 06:24, 20 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

~~Oppose~~ Support Issues have been solved

Not detailed enough. (will be expanded)

The whole nationalistic and religious background of his time needs to be highlighted.

Outlined the various factions trying to get a piece of the action after WWII. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 04:46, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The relationship between religious and military hierarchy of the Hoa Hao needs to be described.

Well, the Hoa Hao had a leader who gained massive followings very quickly, and it was basically a one-man show, ie a cult, not like a modern state with a defence minister, chief of defense force with more discretion/power. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 04:46, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You didn't read the article after you finished editing?

"However, in June 1946, So and become estranged from his military leaders and started the Dan Xa (Social Democratic Party)." Doesn't make sense.

His "career" is a description of the general circumstances and then starting out of a sudden "Ba Cut was one such commander of the Hoa Hao. He was feared by his enemies, described as "a sort of lean Rasputin"". Frankly, you have to restructure the article and find a more suitable caption. Next step, if you don't introduce somebody with birthdate and childhood, you have to mention that this is unknown and then mention since when the guy started making a career in this militaristic sect. That's the point where a career starts and it would make a nice second chapter after the background.Wandalstouring (talk) 11:16, 27 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Why were the French trusting him 5 times?

Basically they were broke, and needed people to fight for them, and hence the wobbly alliances. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 04:46, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You still haven't outlined why the French trusted him 5 times and you contradict yourself: "His sobriquet came from his self-amputation of a finger as a vow to defeat the Vietminh" vs. "despite his disloyalty and the fact that aged seventeen, he had cut off the top of his third finger to remind himself to always fight the French"

This allows two solutions: he made up the story why his ba was cut or the sources are contradictionary and as a plus you got a nice story about young Ba Cut that in a chronological order can serve as an introduction.Wandalstouring (talk) 11:16, 27 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ba Cut broke again from the Hoa Hao leadership in August 1954. That can't be again because you mention nothing about such an event at an earlier date.

Fixed up. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 04:46, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Still doesn't work. Hoa Hao breaks apart, with Ba Cut as a leader of a subgroup, then Ba Cut is suddenly "the Hoa Hao leader "[who]"was openly contemptuous of the prime minister." and from this position he breaks with himself as the groups leader? Wandalstouring (talk) 11:16, 27 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Nominating an article for GAC and A-class review at the same time is pretty much stressing the reviewers to find the same errors twice. Wandalstouring (talk) 19:18, 22 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I don't really agree, because the reviewers won;t really be tripping over each other giving a simultaneous review. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 04:46, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have made another round of improvements. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 08:10, 3 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You puzzle the reader. Ba Cut cuts his finger to remember fighting the French, but in fact he never fought them. That's interesting and it merits more background information whether the other factions were also not fighting the French. Wandalstouring (talk) 09:14, 3 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Added the general Hoa Hao policy. It seems they were the same, says Elliott. YellowMonkey (click here to vote for world cycling's #1 model!) 06:35, 16 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support. No major issues. Good work. Cla68 (talk) 01:46, 17 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Didn't notice any important problems. – Joe N 00:11, 20 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.