Talk:Edith Schloss/GA1

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Reviewer: Mujinga (talk · contribs) 08:25, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Review progress

Good Article review progress box Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Hi Delabrede, I'll take this on for review as part of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Women in Green/Meetup/4 Mujinga (talk) 08:25, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Delabrede I'm going to stop here to discuss because I'm hitting some issues with information verification. I'm not halfway through the article yet but my spotchecks aren't going well, as you'll see below. I'm not questioning whether your statements are true and I'm enjoying reading the article, but I am finding it hard to verify things based on the citations given. That's grounds for a quickfail under 2 of the criteria and I do notice this is a rather new article, so I'd first like to discuss what to do. It may be best to withdraw and resubmit after checking the refs? Mujinga (talk) 09:14, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for this thorough review. I apologize for the errors. Clearly my own pre-submission review was a poor one. It might, as you say, be best to withdraw. I'll review and correct although I probably won't resubmit. Delabrede (talk) 14:03, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

I know it can be discouraging but think of it as part of the collaborative aspect of wikipedia - hopefully the article will benefit from the review and you can in time resubmit. I would advise checking all the refs before doing so. I'll reply where necessary to your responses then add the prose commentary which i did before the spotchecks revealed some issues. Then I'll quickfail this; I would encourage you to work on it more and resubmit for GA. Thanks for the work you put in so far on this woman who I had never heard of before. Mujinga (talk) 18:43, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Copyvio check

There's some worryingly high hits on earwig but they're quotes and titles, so that's fine

References and spotchecks

On this version:

• "By 1944 Schloss and Langerhans were no longer living together although, as was fairly typical of their set, they remained friends.[8]"
  • not backed by ref

-- The 1944 date is confirmed in the Life in the Lofts Chapter of Loft Generation. I was confident when I wrote the phrase but can't find my source for "remained friends". It's implicit in Mira Schor's introduction to Left Generation which states that she had her own place that year. It is not a significant fact however and the article won't suffer if it disappears.

• "A few months after she met Porter he brought her to Willhem de Kooning's studio where she met him for the first time."[8]
  • goes beyond info in source - "In 1944, Porter introduced Edith to Elaine and Willem de Kooning"

-- This too is discussed in the Life in the Lofts chapter of Loft Generation.

• "Schloss completed her studies at the Art Students League in 1946 and somewhat tentatively settled into a career in art.[13]"
  • gonna need page numbers on this 88 page document in order to verify the claims

-- As to page number in the Sundaram catalog, it is page 8. The source does not support the phrase "somewhat tentatively settled" however. My source for that is Jacob Burckhardt's forward to Loft Generation. It is also implicit in Schloss's discussion of her writing career in the Critics and Artists chapter of Loft Generation.

• "In August 1946 she participated in her first exhibition, a large annual held by Gloucester Society of Artists in Gloucester, Massachusetts. Reviewing the exhibition, a critic for ArtNews cited her contributions as outstanding.[17]"
  • if it's the mention on p45 I don't see much of this being backed except her participation

-- This is what I have from this source:

"In the annuals, the second of which is now current, paintings by Umberto Romano, Nell Blaine, Barbara Swan, Edith Schloss, Jimmy Ernst, and Emma Fordyce MacRae are outstanding."

https://archive.org/details/sim_artnews_1946-08_45_6/page/45/mode/2up?q=%22edith+schloss%22Reviews and Previews

apologies if I missed that but it doesn't change my overall opinion Mujinga (talk) 18:49, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

• "Reviewing this show, an ArtNews critic described her paintings as "light-hearted abstractions".[20]"
  • This one is backed by source

• "A 1955 duo exhibition that Schloss held with another Pyramid artist at the Hudson Guild drew favorable comments from a critic for Art Digest. Calling her work "simply and beautifully executed", the critic discussed elements of her style including its "feminine quality" and "delicate but firm handling".[26]" - quotes back, "another Pyramid artist" is not

-- I gave the wrong volume and page numbers. This is what I have for this source:

The Art Digest 1955-03-01: Vol 29 Iss 11. "There is an unabashed feminine quality to the painting of Edith Schloss, both in her choice of subject where the charming and pretty predominate, and in the delicate but firm handling of the paint and the unique, rather dainty arrangement of objects in the still lifes. There are a number of oils depicting careful arrays of little jars and pots such as one might see in an apothecary window, painted with a free but clearly intentioned stroke. Sparkling little watercolors of the Italian landscape and the Maine coast are simply and beautifully executed. M.S."

https://archive.org/details/sim_arts-magazine_1955-03-01_29_11/page/n3/mode/2up?q=%22edith+schloss%22+martica+sawin%22

• "A 1997 show at the high school in Rome from which her son had graduated was probably her first retrospective exhibition.[15]" - not really backed by source, which is also not secondary. it's her own website and says "1997 “Miti e Monti: Dipinti Nuovi, / Myths and Mountains: New Paintings (curated by Giuseppe Casetti),” Il Museo del Louvre, Rome, Italy, March 3-26."

-- The show was not a retrospective. I got that wrong. It was probably the first solo following her death. I'm not clear as to why the source is not secondary. It was created by Schloss's estate and is published on the web.

ok - what i meant was that if you were to say "was probably her first retrospective exhibition" i'd be asking for a citation to an art historian on that otherwise it reads likem original research. but ofc it's fine to use that site purely for exhibition dates Mujinga (talk) 18:49, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

prose

Article reads good, here are some comments which I made offline earlier in case they are helpful, but I will be quickfailing the article on verifiability concerns Mujinga (talk) 18:46, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

• boston linked but not florence?

• another paragraph could be added to flesh out the intro per MOS:LEADLENGTH

• "Jewish persecution kept her from further study in Germany, " - this makes it sound like she was persecuted by Jews

• "In 1938 she left Fascist Italy for London" - Italy already mentioned, so link on first mention?

• "She arrived in Quebec on September 28" - this needs a bit more explanation - how did she get there, boat? and maybe specify Quebec is Canada, otherwise it seems like it's in the US

• "small group of self-exiled German socialists" - wikilink socialism?

• "A revolutionary socialist whose views aligned with the group" - link Revolutionary socialism

• "In 1942 the pair moved to New York finding apartments " - New York City?

• "She later said she learned most from the first of these. On one occasion Sternberg reportedly told her, "Never wait for that famous inspiration. Just go on steadily every day and you’ll get there."" - this is a bit prolix, suggest "She recalled she learned most from Sternberg who once told her "Never wait for that famous inspiration. Just go on steadily every day and you’ll get there.""

• "her work would appear in 40 solo exhibitions and some 50 group shows" - do you need "some" here?

• Most years, she would spend the warm months painting in Liguria or Tuscany - link Liguria and Tuscany

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.