Talk:List of best-selling music artists/Archive 13

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Utada Hikaru

Hikaru Utada (宇多田 ヒカル Utada Hikaru), known by her stage name Utada (English pronunciation: /uˈtɑːdə/) in America and Europe, and as Hikki (ヒッキー, Hikkī?), is a Japanese American singer and songwriter, arranger, and record producer.

Since the release of her debut album First Love, which went on to become the best-selling album in Oricon's recent history,[1][2] Utada has had three of her Japanese studio albums in the list of Top 10 best-selling albums ever in Japan (#1, #4, #8) and an six overall of her albums (two English-language and one compilation) charting within the 275 Best-Selling Japanese albums list.[3][4]

Utada has had fourteen number-one singles on the Oricon Singles chart, with two notable record achievements for a female solo or group artist: five million-sellers and four in the Top 100 All-Time Best-selling Singles.[5][6]In 2009, she was considered the most influential artist of the decade, in the Japanese landscape, by The Japan Times.[7]. For her achievements, she was described by Time Magazine in 2001 as a "Diva On Campus," while attending Columbia University for a brief, career-break semester in 2001.[8][9] In 2003, Utada was ranked #24 in the survey of Top 100 Japanese Pop Artists of All Time by HMV,[10], #10 in HMV's Top 30 Best Japanese Singers of All Time in 2006.[11].

Additionally, Utada made two theme song contributions to Kingdom Hearts video game series, a collaboration between Square Enix and Disney: "Simple and Clean"[12] and "Sanctuary".[13] In 2007, her single "Flavor of Life" reached #2 in worldwide digital download yearly single chart with over 7.2 million downloads,[14] and contributes to 12 million digital sales for her over the same year.[15]

Precious: 700.000 copies First Love: 11.000.000 millions of copies Distance: 4.000.000 millions of copies Deep River: 3.980.000 millions of copies Exodus: 1.750.000 millions of copies Ultra Blue: 1.600.000 millions of copies HEART STATION: 1.800.000 millions of copies This is The One: 300.000 copies


OVERALL ---> +52.000.000 MILLIONS OF COPIES —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wasingpei (talk • contribs) 17:18, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

While I added Utada to the list, please bear in mind to support your provided figures with reliable sources in the future, especially if you're trying to get your point across. Sources of this kind for example (if it's one of the sources that you're aiming at above) cannot be regarded as reliable. --Harout72 (talk) 18:09, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Cliff Richard

Where is Cliff in this list he has sold over 260 million records in a career spanning 51 years! Get him in the list. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 11:20, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

As it states within the box at the top of this discussion page: Artists without sufficient certifications to support published claimed figures may not be added to the list. Consequently, Cliff Richard will not be added to this list with a claimed figure of 250 million as the number of certifications he's gathered around the world do not suggest major sales. This is all the certified sales I see for Richard:
And I don't see any certified sales for Richard in the following markets: Switzerland, Austria, Brazil, Mexico, Argentina etc.. --Harout72 (talk) 17:23, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Cliff Richard was big starting in Britain in the 1950's. He represented Britain in the Eurovision song contest in 1968 with "Congratulations" (2nd) and in 1973 with "Power to all our friends" (3rd). Outside the UK, his sales may have dropped after 1980. Do you have any certification source for Britain earlier than the BPIA which started certifications in (late?) 1973? Their first notification for Cliff Richard is 1974, and does not include either of these songs. With respect to the other markets mentioned, do their certifications cover 1955 to 1975?

-- Rob —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.206.158.70 (talk) 19:52, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, US database stretches all the way back to 1958, where Richard seems to have evidence of only 1,000,000 units in certified sales. US market consists 33% of the global market share, surely, Richard would need to have sold a lot more than just 1 million in certified sales in US to achieve a figure like 250 million. French database covers records released since 1968 which does not show a single certification for Richard. Finnish database covers sales on releases since 1953, and it shows only 25,000 units. And many other countries which have established certification-based-markets during the 1970s including Germany (1975), the Netherlands (1978), Canada (1975) do not show major sales for someone who after 1970 has released 20 studio albums, 5 Gospel albums, 6 live albums, 14 Compilation albums, not to mention 95 singles. Consequently, seeing such a tenuous sales for Richard in most countries after 1970, and of course suggesting that he's achieved 80-90% of his sales before that is equally difficult to comprehend.--Harout72 (talk) 20:54, 1 January 2010 (UTC)


He has sold over 21 million singles alone in the UK and that figure is excluding the large number of albums sold in the UK alone. What figure whould you calculate Cliff's sales to be? —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 14:49, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Cliff sold the majority of his records before the 70's which seems unfair not to count these in the total. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 15:31, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

While I'm aware of Richard's 21 million in UK singles-sales and agree that his UK sales (judging from as many weeks as his singles have spent on UK's single-chart before 1965-1970) may have been stronger before 1970 on individual bases, suggesting; however, he's sold most of his (supposedly 250 million, which is outright an inflated figure) records before 1970 is hard to believe because most of his records seem to have been released after 1970. At his discography page, I see that before 1970, he's released 13 studio albums, only 1 Gospel album, only 1 live album, only 3 compilation albums, and some 50 singles. Whereas the number of all of those, after 1970, is much larger. Surely, Richard seems to have sold as many albums as singles in UK (say about 40 million records all together in UK), but claiming that he's managed to sell 250 million without any major sales in US (the largest market in the world), immediately suggests that his actual sales should not go beyond 100 or 150 million worldwide, considering that had he experienced a similar success outside of UK after 1970 and sold millions of singles and albums as in UK, we would have seen a lot more certified sales for other markets than we do.--Harout72 (talk) 19:20, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

But why would his record company say that he has sold 250 million plus if he has not done? —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 21:59, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

That is known as a promotional tool which record companies always use to boost sales for upcoming materials. Record companies inflating figures to make their signed artists more attractive is nothing new. Therefore, I put in as much effort as I do into verifying claimed sales figures through databases in order to avoid filling this page with inflated figures.--Harout72 (talk) 22:05, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

I understand that, but why would artists like Elton John and The Bee Gees be left in the list when they have sold over 200 million records without any real proof. I do not think that this is entirely fair because you are excluding Cliff for the reason you think it is an exagerated sum but surely Elton's is probally exaggerated as well. I think you should add Cliff in with these artists again. Or you could do what you have done with Queen etc and do a list of claimed sales and actual certificated sales.

I believe, you need to go over both Bee Gees' and Elton John's certified sales before saying that they are on the list without any real proof. The certification databases are at the top of this page. Please type in Bee Gees or Elton John in just a few of them and see it for yourself that they both have had major sales everywhere. That said, slight exaggeration would be acceptable; however, in the case of Cliff Richard, we are not looking at a slightly exaggerated figure but rather an outrageously inflated figure, 250 million. Therefore, he should not be on the list, unless of course we locate a source claiming 100 million or 150 million.--Harout72 (talk) 16:50, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

It is a bit impossible though because most of Cliff's sales were before the 70's and you can not find anything about that anywere. As in the case of the Bee gees and Elton it is easier because you have most of their reocrd sales certified because they were successfull after 1970. Can you honestly say that Julio Iglesias has sold 200 million? Also Nana Mouskouri you have also put at 200 million. Nana started the same year as Cliff did and she can not be said to be a bigger seller than Cliff, Surely? —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 22:05, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

I looked at Nana's sales and she has certified sales of;

  • The Netherlands - 50,000
  • UK - 220,000
  • Germany - 600,000
  • Canada - 1,500,000
  • Argentina - 180,000

Add that up and it comes to 2,550,000 which is a lot less than what Cliff is certified. Nana does not appear to have any certified records in the USA, Australia, Norway and Finland (all of which Cliff has had sales)

I also found Cliff has had sales of 140,000 in Australia and the results only went back for just over 10 years. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 22:57, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, Julio Iglesias has had major sales almost everywhere also, please check and see it for yourself. As far as Nana Mouskouri's sales goes, while I agree that she lacks certified sales also and because of which I may consider removing Mouskouri from the list, it's worth to point out that her claimed figure is far less than that of Richard's. Also note that Mouskouri seems to have released a lot more records before 1975 than Richard has, which is why we don't see lot of her certified sales. Note that certification-award-levels have changed quite a bit after the hard-hit of the music-piracy. So, you need to dig further when calculating certified sales for markets like Germany and the Netherlands for example. This is what Mouskouri's available certified/actual sales looks like.
  • France (actual sales): 13,352,000
  • Germany (certified sales): 1.5 million (refer to this for changes in award-levels)
  • The Netherlands (certified sales): 100,000 (refer to this for changes in award-levels. The document is uploaded in Words).
  • UK (certified sales): 270,000 (refer to this for UK's album-releases prior to 1979.)
  • Canada (certified sales): 1.1 million
  • Argentina (certified sales):180,000
Also, note that there are reliable sources claiming 300 million for Mouskouri, but I have objected to use them due to not enough certified sales. See this discussion for example from the past.--Harout72 (talk) 01:15, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Before 1975 Cliff had many million selling albums in the UK and many singles that earned him silver discs from 250,000. So i think it is unfair to keep Cliff off the list because of the lack of certified sales after this year. Also you say Nana has had 'reliable sources claiming 300 million' but i could easily say Cliff has had reliable sources claiming 250 - 260 million and this figure has been used to describe Cliff's sales for the last 10 years or so. And bearing in mind he has only sold a few million over the last 10 years, know has enflated this figure anymore, giving me the opinion 250m is a reliable figure to use. Is there no way you can contact Cliff's reocrd company to make it clear of Cliff's overall sales? —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 17:22, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

I add; Cliff had the majority of his top 20 album hits before 1975 (20) and he also had success with over 40 EP's which were also a success in many European markets. He also charted around 40 top 10 hits before 1975 and just under 30 after in the UK alone. Overseas he charted over 30 hits in South Africa, 35 in Norway, 68 in the Netherlands, 42 in India, 26 in Malaysia, 29 in Sweden, nearly 20 in Singapore, 55 in Thailand, 16 in Israel, 85 in Ireland, 14 in Japan, 54 in New Zealand, 66 in Australia, 85 in Ireland, 18 in Malta, over 20 in Canada, over 50 in Germany, over 80 in Belgium, 33 in Hong Kong, 14 Finland, 16 Denmark and 20 in USA. The majority of all these singles were released before 1975 meaning high sales in all of the listed countries and others including Chilie, Austria, Iceland, Luxembourg, The Phillippines, Poland, Spain, Switzerland and Lebanon were he charted in the top 10 during the 60's and 70's several times meaning many high sales again. All of his success before 1975 must equal 10's of millions in singles sales alone and that is forgetting the 10's of millions of albums and EP's that were sold around the time. Bearing in mind most industries do not go that far back Cliff's sales must be estimated meaning 250 million is a good estimate for what Cliff has sold. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 22:12, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Could you support your arguments with reliable sources please rather than simply claiming that Richard has earned many silver-awards before 1975, because BPI didn't issue any silver or any other kind of certifications before 1973 and I don't see any certifications before 1975 for Richard in BPI's database. Supporting your claims with reliable sources may actually help your arguments. I hate to say it, but without providing reliable sources for your sales figures or awards, you are not helping me to change my mind. Please, remember that anybody could come here and claim major sales or countless awards for any artist, but in the end sourced figures and sourced certification-awards on individual bases is what matters. By the way, I don't know what you understand when you say hits, but hits are those that enter the top-10. That said, Richard's US positions could be checked through this German chart-position-tracking-system. And it shows only 7 US positions, only two of which are top-10 (Hits) including the single which has earned him a gold-certification-award in US. Also, bear in mind that top-10 chart positions do not immediately reflect record-sales unless records remain within the top-10 or top-20 for many consecutive weeks. Finally, to avoid making this discussion any longer than it has already become, you could provide sources of this kind or this one here for example to support his supposedly major sales. Otherwise, it's pointless to continue this futile discussion as it's not helping either one of us.--Harout72 (talk) 23:08, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Well basically I can not be bothered with this discussion anymore because we all know Cliff has sold a lot of records! He has spent thousands of weeks in the charts and has had hundreds of top 10 hits worldwide. The list is basically all speculation as there is NO WAY of proving all the sales speculated for all of the artists. So really the list is a total joke and I feel you must hold a grudge against Cliff for some reason. Possibly because he has done so well! That is a good end to the discussion I think. —Preceding unsigned comment added by JonathanCR (talk • contribs) 17:19, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Richard Clayderman

Hey, how about adding Richard Clayderman to the list. 90 million copies is a lot. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.36.244.253 (talk) 23:08, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

I have corrected his record sales at his page (Richard Clayderman) as the source supporting his sales, clearly states 70 million not 90 million. However, even the 70 million is exaggerated for promotional purposes it seems. As far as his actual sales goes, his available certified sales does not suggest anything close to even 50 million. Here is all I see:
  • German Certified Sales: 3,250,000,
  • UK Certified Sales: 1,060,000,
  • Canadian Certified Sales: 100,000
  • French Total Sales: 3.5 million, which is a very tiny figure for his home-market, especially when Clayderman's claimed figure is 70 million.
  • Brazilian Certified Sales: 100,000
From 1996-2009, Clayderman has not sold a single million unit of any of his materials released during those years in the entire European continent, see the Europe's certification database here. I would; however, consider adding Clayderman to the list with a reliable source which claims 50 million (not 70 million as it's inflated at least by 20 million).--Harout72 (talk) 01:45, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Broader genre spectrum?

The comment about there being a 'broader genre spectrum now' should be deleted on the grounds of being bad English, offensive, wrong, completely indefensible and stupid. RANT ALERT. Just because some rhythm and blues singers etc. have now decided that, 'Like, what I'm like doin', man, is like a whole new genre, or whatever' does not make it true. There has always been a huge spectrum of music - were someone like Schubert alive today he would not like the idea of being dumped with everyone from Gregorian chanters to Stravinsky under the general name 'classical', and he would no doubt consider the 'varied' genres of today the same monotonous brainless beats. And that says nothing of the older music of the rest of the world. I think there is far LESS variety today - and no matter what you believe, this statement should be removed.


Mary J. Blige Album Sales

Mary J. Blige's page says she has sold over 65 million albums worldwide, it doesn't have a source or anything. Should I put it on here, or wait? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.99.58 (talk) 04:57, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

I have already removed the 65 million from her page as it was not referenced. --Harout72 (talk) 04:59, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Ok thanks, on Amazon it says she has sold more the 40 million, could I use that as a source? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.99.58 (talk) 05:02, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Here at this list artists must have sold at least 50 million records to appear on the list. As for Amazon.com, you should not use that as a source anywhere at wikipedia, it's not regarded as reliable and it will most probably be removed by some editor.--Harout72 (talk) 05:15, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Oh ok, thanks! I'm new here:)--68.32.99.58 (talk) 05:53, 12 January 2010 (UTC)Hayden White

Enya Album Sales

Me again, on Enya's page it says she has sold 80 million worldwide and there IS a source, can that be changed on here? Or wait? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.99.58 (talk) 05:05, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

All taken care of, that was not a reliable source.--Harout72 (talk) 05:24, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Thanks again--68.32.99.58 (talk) 05:53, 12 January 2010 (UTC)Hayden White


red hot chili peppers sales

according to this they have sold just 50 million when actually in truth they have sold 65 million, the 50 million sales figures was about four years ago —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 19:42, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

I agree. On the RHCP discography page the sum of all of their studio and compilation albums comes to 62.5 million. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.45.127.247 (talk) 02:03, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

yes the red hot chili peppers sales deferentially need to be looked into because they are well over 50 million —Preceding unsigned comment added by Feedmyeyes (talk • contribs) 03:30, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

I've looked at some of those album sales figures on the RHCP discography and have had to remove quite a few of them as they were unsourced or not present in the source provided. I've also had to reduce several of them as they were claimed higher than they were in the sources. I still agree though that the RHCP are eligable for 65 million records, though I suspect that reliable sources with that figure may be very hard to come by. Hitthat (talk) 04:01, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

I'll go over their certified sales, I'm sure certified sales will help us to determine whether or not RHCP's actual sales could be over 50 million.--Harout72 (talk) 19:07, 24 January 2010 (UTC)
RHCP's certified sales (including singles, albums, videos combined) coming from 85-90% of the regions wherein they've sold their records, suggests that their actual sales is above 50 million but not over 60 million. This is what I see:
Plus adding the remainder album-figures from Europe's IFPI database after deducting the figures already counted in the available searchable databases. Albums:
  • One Hot Minute: 1,000,000-(already counted figures)=505,000
  • Californication:4,000,0000-(already counted figures)= 1,927,764
  • By the Way: 3,000,000-(already counted figures)=460,000
  • Greatest Hits:2,000,000-(already counted figures)=1,457,080
  • Stadium Arcadium:2,000,000-(already counted figures)=533,841
I personally couldn't find any reliable sources claiming figures like 55 or 60 million for Red Hot Chili Peppers, but if anybody does, please bring them to my attention. Thanks. --Harout72 (talk) 22:44, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Out of interest, is the UK included in the IFPI figures at the bottom Hitthat (talk) 07:33, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, IFPI (Europe) certifications are based on sales coming from every single market in Europe including the sales submitted by BPI.--Harout72 (talk) 16:19, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Certified Sales Only?

This article is useless as a tool for comparing success of different artists, for several reasons:

1. A Double Album, Album and Single all share the same value. 1 Sale. The Beatles, ABBA and Elvis therefore look more relatively successful than they really were.

2. Claimed sales are meaningless unless they can be backed up. The Beatles record company claimed that they sold a Billion records, but certified sales are only 230 Million, 23% of claimed sales. U2, as an example, have claimed 170 Million sales, and have worldside certified sales of 112 Million (66% of claimed sales.

3. Free Internet downloads and CD/Cassette recordings have distorted the sales of recent artists, especially someone like Coldplay, who sold 50 Million albums from a decade of huge hits.

While we cannot fix all of this, I suggest we modify this article to do the following:

A: Sort by CERTIFIED sales B: Give an Album a higher weight than a single. ($3 versus $15)

Thoughts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Laurencedunne (talk • contribs) 18:49, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

It's important to note that The Beatles for example have begun their career years before most countries established certification-based-schemes; therefore, a lot of their sales have gone uncertified. If you look at the notes bellow the tables for all five artists on the list, you will see the years that each available market has begun issuing certifications. However, it's worth mentioning that 1 billion claimed by The Beatles' record company is rather exaggerated. Had we had all of The Beatles' releases certified, their total certified sales shouldn't be more than 400-450 million, and the actual sales in its turn would be somewhere between 550 and 600 million records.
I haven't gone over U2's certified sales yet, but the 112 million units in certified sales seems logical for 170 million claimed figure (actual sales). Bear in mind that, unless a record reaches the next platinum-level, one cannot see what remains between the first (visible) certification-award and the next one (which has yet to be issued). In other words, if an album in US gets certified 1x platinum but has sold 1.9 million units, we won't see the rest of the units after 1 million (1x platinum) in the RIAA's certification-database. And all those artists with large catalogs might have lots of records (albums, singles) which may have come very close to the first or the next platinum-certification-level but have just missed reaching that point which would qualify them for the 2nd or the 3rd platinum-award. However, certified sales should be close to the actual sales for those artists who haven't released countless materials.
As for your suggestion above, records are counted towards certification-awards by units, singles and albums. We cannot change the way Music-industry-associations process the certifications. RIAA, for example, counts double-CD albums as two units towards certification [1]. In other words, if a double-CD has sold 500,000 units in US, that qualifies for 1x platinum for selling 1 million units.--Harout72 (talk) 23:09, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Donna Summer

It says on her official website that she has sold over 130 million yet she isn't mentioned on this list! I know she had 11 million selling singles in the US alone in the late 70s/early 80s and also had three number one albums there (all of which would have been multi-million sellers). If you then take all the millions she's sold worldwide then surely 130 million must be pretty accurate??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.242.136.152 (talk) 12:22, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Official sites tend to exaggerate sales figures almost always, and they are not regarded as reliable. In addition, I have gone over Donna Summer's certified sales which doesn't suggest anything remotely close to 130 million records..
That's all the certified sales I see for Summer. She doesn't seem to have had any major sales in most countries including Germany, Argentina and Finland. Summer's actual total sales should not be anywhere beyond 60-70 million including all her records that do not show in certification-databases due to not reaching a level of either Gold-certification-award or the first Platinum-certification-award.--Harout72 (talk) 03:09, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

"Period"

Which sense makes this Section? When an artist dies, really stops the selling of the music? I don't think so. Only to notice the beginning makes sense. Not the end, because there's no end. I bought all my Beatles-albums long after 1970. Marcus Cyron (talk) 22:59, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

By term Period we are indicating the period the acts/bands are/were active. In other words, we are not after the years throughout which the acts/bands have been able to sell their records.--Harout72 (talk) 00:01, 30 January 2010 (UTC)

Anne Murray

there's a mainstream news source that says she sold 54 million recordings."Having sold over 54 million recordings, Murray has been recognized by the music industry many times over, including four Grammy Awards, 24 Juno Awards, three American Music Awards and three CMA Awards. She is currently finishing work on her memoirs to be published by Knopf Canada and released by Random House in North America on October 27th."[2] does that count ? can someone verify that number with any other source ?Grmike (talk) 10:10, 3 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

according to their sourced wikipedia articles alannis morissette has sold over 40 million anyone know how close she is to making the list ? as of 2006 sarah mclachlin has sold over 40 million albums anyone know how close she is to making the list ? Grmike (talk) 10:17, 3 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

As far as Anne Murray's actual total worldwide sales goes according to what her certified sales suggests, it should not be more than 30 million. The source provided above is not reliable, by the way. As for Sarah McLachlan, I have removed the unreferenced claim about her sales.--Harout72 (talk) 00:37, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
I added Anne Murray to the list because the number of sources on the internet (BBC Music, Rotten Tomatoes, Canada's walk of fame website, theglobeandmail (canada's national newspaper) and over 2000 other references on the internet) is many. sorry about the first source i posted on here, i recognized global tv as being reputable because it's one of the largest cable networks in the world, one of Canada's most trusted news sources, but the website that's quoting it may have some problems.

Grmike (talk) 00:44, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike even wikipedia says she sold 54 million albums on Anne MurrayGrmike (talk) 00:47, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

manyt of the sources for other singers listed do not differentiate between certified on uncertified. anne murray's sources talk about her sales in the same kind of context nana mouskouri's do.Grmike (talk) 00:53, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

I have reverted your edits because none of the sources you provided can be regarded as reliable. In addition, please do not use wikipedia mirror sites such as this here. Bear in mind that sources are to be highly reliable for this page; in other words, regardless of how many thousands of sources claim 54 million, she cannot be added to the table unless there is a highly regarded news service or music industry association supporting that figure. To see the examples of the source that we have so far accepted at this page, please see the reference section. By the way, I have removed the sales claim from her wikipedia page as it was not referenced.--Harout72 (talk) 01:01, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

does ctv news in Canada count ?"She was the first Canadian female solo singer to reach No. 1 on the U.S. charts, and also the first to earn a gold record. She's sold 54 million records and has won four Grammy Awards, 24 Juno Awards, three American Music Awards and three CMA Awards"

[3]Grmike (talk) 01:22, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

Also, Anne Murray's certified sales cannot be compared to the likes of Nana Mouskouri for example, because Murray's success has begun in early 70's whereas most of the developed countries in the world have established certification-based-markets either in early 70's or mid 70's. Therefore, 95% of Murray's releases had a chance of being certified if they reached a Gold/Platinum certification-levels.--Harout72 (talk) 01:09, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
i'm still a bit unsure of what you mean by certified sales. the heading says estimated sales and at the top of the page even claimed sales are allowed in, isn't there bias involved when someone won't accept estimates sales figures that the artist themselves consider reliable ?page, just so you know the sales figure on anne murray's page was not added by me adn appears to have been there for some time.Grmike (talk) 01:38, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

proof that she considers over 50 million reliable [4] the link that says BIOGRAPHY. that number stands out i don't see a 30 million sales figure anywhere on her websiteGrmike (talk) 01:50, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

Well, let's just say that the source [3] that you provided above is more reliable than all your previous ones, but still only weakly reliable. What I am having hard time understanding is how could Murray have sold 54 million records whereas I see only 16.5 million in US certified sales, 2.7 million in Canadian Certified sales. And I see some 60,000 in certified sales for UK market. She seems to have been popular in North America, I see no certified sales for Germany, France, Finland, the Netherlands and the list goes on. Even if we take all Murray's records into account which have sold some units but have not reached either the first gold-certification-level or the second platinum-level, her worldwide should still not be more than 30-35 million. Anyways, if you come across a source like Fox News, BBC or CNN claiming 50 million or over records, bring it to my attention.--Harout72 (talk) 01:51, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
Reuters [5], globeandmail [6],Canadian Music Television (this is a mainstream music network in Canada available on regular cable) [7], Grmike (talk) 02:03, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

Since the claimed figure is not huge I added Murray to the list, supporting her 50 million in sales with Rueters and The Vancouver Sun. --Harout72 (talk) 02:14, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

alright, i understand there are other sources that put the figure closer to 30 million but after searching them all i find that there are more that put it closer to 50 million. about not being able to find an article with that number of sales at fox news, cnn, there simply aren't many if any articles on anne murray by those sources. couldn't find many at bbc, but bbc music seems to think the over 50 million figure is reliable, though they quoted the wikipedia mirror site. Can i add the 50 million back to Anne Murray with the same source listed here ?Grmike (talk) 02:26, 4 February 2010 (UTC)grmike

As long as you use those reliable sources that I supported Murray's stay at this page, you should be fine.--Harout72 (talk) 04:51, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Upgrate

sorry but I say that this section is not updated, Britney Spears and Enya albums have not upgraded to the present, it is not even present yet Anastacia has sold 50-52 million cd ... Mina has sold over 100 million CDs and is not mentioned ... also lack Cranberries / Dolores O'Riordan

Sorry if I made mistakes but I do not speak English very well

scusate ma vorrei precisare che questa sezione non è aggiornata, Britney Spears ed Enya hanno gli album non aggiornati ad oggi, Anastacia non è nemmeno presente eppure ha venduto 50-52 milioni di cd... Mina ha venduto più di 100 milioni di cd e non viene citata... mancano anche i cranberries/dolores o'riordan

scusate se ho fatto errori ma non parlo inglese molto bene

______________

sorry but as I think I can think of ... Laura Pausini also, with its 70 million CDs sold, is not mentioned ...

scusate ma man mano che ci penso mi vengono in mente...Laura Pausini anche, con i suoi 70 milioni di cd venduti, non viene citata.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by AccendiLaLuce (talk • contribs) 12:37, 13 February 2010 (UTC)



List of The Cranberries certified sales
US - 15 million
UK - 1.66 million
Germany - 1.5 million
France - 1.9 million
Canada - 1 million
I haven't gone over other countries yet but these are the biggest markets. I have found these The Mirror (50 million) and this Billboard (40 million). Mattg82 (talk) 00:04, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

I just finished going over their certified sales, besides those pointed out above:

I also added to the top of each European market's certified sales, the remainder figures from IFPI, by deducting already counted/visible certified sales (within each country's database) from the Europe certified sales figures:

  • No Need to Argue: 5,000,000 - (already counted figures)=2.4 million
  • To the Faithful Departed: 1,000,000-(already counted figures=300,000
  • Bury the Hatchet: 1,000,000-(already counted figures)=415,000

The Cranberries are relatively new act which is an advantage when it comes to calculating the 85-90% of their sales through the certification databases. No matter how you look at it, Cranberries' actual sales would never reach 50 million, in my opinion Billboard's figure (40 million) is a correct estimation.--Harout72 (talk) 02:32, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Backstreet Boys sold more than 100 million

The group has sold over 130 million, 40 million for millennium, 32 million for backstreet boys, 24 million for black and blue, 14 million for the hits chapter one, 11 million for backstreets back, 10 million for never gone, 2 million for unbreakable and so far over 500,000 for this is us —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 19:13, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

This is just albums though, if your talking about records then you have got to take the singles into account, and that would take the sales up to well over 200 million.[1] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 19:18, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

The unreferenced figures provided above are rather inflated for every single album mentioned with an exception of Backstreet's Back. The following below is Backstreet Boys' certified sales which should cover 80-85% of the territories where the act has sold their records.
  • Never Gone (Worldwide should be around 3 - 4 million)- U.S sales 1 Million, Entire European Continent less than 1 million units (not certified due to not reaching 1 million units), Canada 100,000, Mexico 50,000, Australia 35,000. The total certified sales for these regions should be around 2 million units.
  • The Hits (Chapter One) (worldwide should be 3-4 million)- US sales 1 million, European Continent 1 million, Australia 35,000, Brazil 125,000. The total certified sales for the available regions is 2,160,000
  • Black & Blue (worldwide should be 15-17 million)- US sales 8 million, European Continent Less than 1 million (not certified due to not reaching 1 million units), Australia 70,000, Brazil 250,000, Mexico 300,000. The total certified sales should be around 9.5 million units.
  • Backstreet's Back (Worldwide should be 9-11 million)- European Continent 5 million, Canada 1 million, Australia 350,000, Brazil 500,000, Mexico 350,000. The total certified sales for these regions is 7,075,000 units.
  • Backstreet Boys (worldwide should be 20-25 million) - US sales 14 Million, Canada 1 million, Entire European Continent 3 million, Australia 70,000, Brazil 250,000, Mexico 100,000. The total certified sales for these regions is 18,420,000 units.
Note that there are no major sales for the album Unbreakable, therefore, I wasn't able to find certified sales for it. As far as the 200 million goes above, your source is not a reliable one. All in all, I'd say their total worldwide sales including albums, singles, videos, should not surpass 110-120 million. That said, I'd be willing to update their sales to 110 or 120 million if there is a highly reliable source claiming a figure of that kind. --Harout72 (talk) 23:00, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Millennium has sold 40 million, backstreet boys sold 32 million and black and blue sold 24 million, they are exact as they have been on numerous biggest selling albums countdowns and certified everywhere. Millennium was in the guiness book of records for 40 million sales. those three albums alone are 92 million and with all the other sales it is then 130 million —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 19:20, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Not according to the certified sales those albums haven't sold as much as your unreferenced figures suggest.--Harout72 (talk) 19:25, 5 January 2010 (UTC)


http://meglomedia.com/videoinfo/backstreetb2klinks.html this site actually shows 120 million albums but says 200 million records. is it just albums that are included in this best selling artists list or are singles as well —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 19:27, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_album_artists, this is from the biggest selling album artists off wikipedia and it says 120 million, plus on their discography page it has 130 million, these are just albums of course —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 19:31, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, that doesn't exactly make it a reliable source, now, does it? Lots of unreliable sources claim inflated figures for different artists. That doesn't mean we should blindly go along with what they claim. As for the 130 million at their discography, I have removed it as it was not referenced. I have also tagged the figure at List of best-selling album artists as unreferenced.--Harout72 (talk) 19:35, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Here is the reference for the 130 million sales http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/art/2010/01/143_58459.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.209.165.168 (talk) 12:36, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

I've seen that source and it's not as reliable as the sources that we currently have supporting Backstreet Boys' claimed figures. That figure becomes available by a highly reliable source in the near future, I will make sure to update their figure on the list. But for now we should stay with what we've got.--Harout72 (talk) 16:19, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

This here http://www.princegeorgecitizen.com/20081117161837/local/news/backstreet-boys-show-their-strength.html is a trusted source which claims they have sold 200 million records. Anyway, they certainly have sold more than 100 million. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.9.121.235 (talk) 23:58, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Here is another source that claims they have sold 130 million albums http://despardes.com/?p=12593 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.9.121.235 (talk) 16:48, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

We only accept highly reliable sources at this page, your provided sources won't do, I'm afraid. See the reference section to see the current sources supporting artists' figures.--Harout72 (talk) 17:41, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

A list of likns for more claims of 130 million http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2915106 http://craxxy-jizzle.blogspot.com/2010/01/backstreet-boys-aj-mclean-releases-solo.html http://libre.com.ph/features/featured-articles/2796-backstreets-back-alright http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=539980&publicationSubCategoryId=70 http://977music.com/blog/2010/01/battle-of-the-boy-bands/ There are a lot more than this —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.9.121.235 (talk) 22:15, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

I take it you never looked at the reference section to see what kind of sources we accept here, because you keep filling this section with unreliable sources.--Harout72 (talk) 22:29, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Celine Dion Sales

On Celine Dion's page it says she has sold over 250 million albums world wide, and it has a source, would it be safe to put that up on this page?--68.32.99.58 (talk) 19:15, 6 February 2010 (UTC)Hayden White

At this moment we should keep Dion on the list with the sources that we currently have since the source provided at her page supporting the 250 million in sales is not verifiable.--Harout72 (talk) 19:21, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
Ok, thanks!--68.32.99.58 (talk) 19:24, 6 February 2010 (UTC)Hayden White

Village People

I seriously doubt that the Village People have sold over 50 million worldwide. The RIAA claims that they have only sold 6 million in the States; I'm sure they haven't sold 44 million elsewhere!75.142.54.211 (talk) 06:26, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps, Village People have not sold 65 million records as stated within the provided source, but their US certified sales stands at 8 million. And lot of their single-records, released in US before 1989, may have sold close to one million units but have just missed reaching the Gold-award-level (Gold-award in US on singles before 1989 was 1,000,000 and Platinum was 2,000,000). Therefore, a lot of their US sales doesn't show within RIAA's database. However, despite their success in Canada (1.6 million in certified sales) and France (3.2 million in actual sales),their European sales, comparatively, seems to have been rather weak including the sales in Germany (500,000 in certified sales), UK (850,000 in certified sales), The Netherlands (200,000 in certified sales). So, in the end, it looks like they may have sold close to 40 million records maximum, but nowhere near 50 million, let alone 65 million. But I would like to find a reliable source claiming around 35-40 million records before removing Village People from the list. --Harout72 (talk) 03:56, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

RIAA digital download certifications

Searching for an article about usher above for 50/60 million sales I came across this. It seems that the riaa certification thresholds for downloads is much lower than for normal sales. Mattg82 (talk) 16:27, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

That's right, initially, when the Digital gold and platinum certifications were introduced in 2004, the levels were: Gold (Digital)=100,000, Platinum (digital)=200,000, from 2007 on, the levels were brought up to match with the levels of physical-records, Gold=500,000 and Platinum=1,000,000. Master-Ringtone-certifications; however, were introduced in the middle of 2006, the levels of which were from the begining: Gold=500,000 and platinum=1,000,000.--Harout72 (talk) 17:24, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
Oh right, that makes sense now. I got confused after seeing that article and I was wondering why it wasn't listed separately in the criteria. Thanks for clearing that up. Mattg82 (talk) 18:06, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

The Beach Boys

They've sold over 100 million records. Why are they not on the list? http://www.osceola.org/index.cfm?lsFuses=department/OsceolaOrg/32554 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Strangebrownbag (talk • contribs) 17:48, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

I just finished going over The Beach Boys' available certified sales; although, RIAA has 24.5 million in certified sales for them, their sales outside the US seems to have been not as strong. The following are The Beach Boys' certified sales:
Finland, the database of which stretches all the way back when The Beach Boys have begun their career, doesn't contain a single certification for them. Although, The Beach Boys' US actual sales could reach 30-35 million, they haven't done (sales wise) well enough abroad to suggest that they have sold 100 million records, perhaps 50 or 60 million worldwide, but 100 million is an awfully big stretch.--Harout72 (talk) 19:02, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

"According to Billboard, in terms of singles and album sales, The Beach Boys are the No.-1-selling American band of all time." http://www.recordresearch.com/record_setters.php?id=1 What we talking about? They sold over 100 million copyes in worldwide... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Morden112 (talk • contribs) 15:40, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

Michael Jackson

The LA Times, June 26th, claims half a billion, so I put this on there.

I believe the other sources are equally as not reputable. The source does not have to be from the Internet.Facial (talk) 21:19, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

Yes, sources don't have to be online materials but they have to be verifiable. In the case of your entry, it is absolutely not verifiable as it's not only missing such details as page numbers and the name of the author but it's also missing the ID number. Refer to WP:Citations and also WP:Citation templates. Regards.--Harout72 (talk) 22:19, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
What is the DOI for the LA Times? How can I look it up? Facial (talk) 00:05, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

You should refer to the folks at WP:RSN, they should be able to give you some useful tips on all of that. --Harout72 (talk) 03:09, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Juan Gabriel

Not in the list, are many singers. One of them Juan Gabriel has sold more than 100 million records according to [8]. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.101.10.117 (talk) 12:01, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

According to RIAA's Oro y Platino, Juna Gabriel has 4.6 million in US certified sales, and accodring to Mexico's AMPROFON, Gabriel (since 1999) has 1.5 million in Mexican certified sales. Gabriel doesn't seem to have any major sales in Brazil (at least not since 1990), nor has he had any major sales in Argentina (just 30,000 in certified sales). Based on the number of the certifications, it's fair to say that Gabriel doesn't seem to have sold as much as 100 million records. I'm afraid to say, he should not be added to the list due to lack of his certified sales.--Harout72 (talk) 05:07, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

Madonna

Madonna has sold at least 300 million records (albums+singles+videos). The source on this list, IFPI, mentioned that she sold 200 million albums, not records. The sources has been also out of date (2006). Well, in the United States alone Madonna has MORE gold & platinum singles than any other female artist. She has even beaten The Beatles for most Gold-singles since "Hung Up" (2005). In the UK, she has more than 60 top-ten singles. I believe she sold more than 200 million albums and at least 300 million records. 114.126.176.42 (talk) 12:37, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Please support your statements with reliable sources, otherwise you're not helping at all, anybody could come here and claim anything they want about any artists without providing sources. I personally, have gone over Madonna's certified-sales, which doesn't suggest anything close to 300 million records, perhaps 250 million. But then again, we'd need a highly reliable source backing that figure.--Harout72 (talk) 18:31, 22 February 2010 (UTC)


Alla Pugacheva

Alla Pugacheva - Russian superstar had sold more 250 million records
[Encyclopedia Britannica]:
"By 1997 Russian pop idol Alla Pugacheva had reportedly sold as many as 250 million records--perhaps more than the amount sold by U.S. pop star Michael Jackson--but they were nearly all in Russia and the other countries of the former Soviet Union. Widely admired at home, she was still little known elsewhere.

Given that the population of the former USSR was 270 million, and declining by the 1990s, it must mean that about 93% of households purchased one of her records, which is hard to believe. You must also cite the certified sales, to be at least on par with ABBA and Queen to rank up there. Alla did not sell more than Michael Jackson - because the lower limit for his estimate is 300 million, with the upper estimate of 750 million.Facial (talk) 00:10, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
In the Encyclopedia Britannica states 250 million. Such staid could publish unverified information. (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/482973/Alla-Borisovna-Pugacheva)
I agree that to believe such a figure is difficult. Yet it is so. Can you even harder to believe that in this vast country, only one singer - Alla Pugacheva sang songs about love (not patriotic or about the war like everyone else). In the Soviet Union was no one to listen to just has been an information vacuum and the music was "iron curtain". We do not know what kind of music sung in the world. We all sang only songs that were politically reconciled. Pugacheva refused to sing such songs. It is thus extremely popular.
USSR had an impact countries such as Poland, Czechoslovakia, Bulgaria, East Germany and others. These countries have also performed Pugachev, knew her and released records. In addition to these countries, it drives out in: Korea, Japan, Finland, Sweden and other countries. It is a prize winner of the "Golden Microphone" firm "Dinakord" (1981); golden disks «Track Music» (Finland, 1984), the All-Union firm "Melody" (1985), firm Ampeks "for the album" Alla Pugacheva in Stockholm "(1989 ).
In Sweden, the name Pugaevoy called steam. In Russia, out shoes under the brand name "Alla Pugacheva". And in Russia (Ukraine and Moldova) operates radio stations in its name - "Radio Alla '(under the direct supervision of Alla Pugacheva). Unprecedented case in world music. No more musicians, whose names are called the radio station. Students of many Russian cities are listening to the radio only to hear the songs Pugacheva.
The musicians group "ABBA" wrote his famous musical "Chess" for Pugacheva. They planned that she would sing it the party of his wife of chess. But Pugacheva was unable to do so - it is not released then from the country (such at that time we were orders)
These 250 million announced firm "Melody". This is the only company in the USSR, which dealt with the release of records. After the collapse of the Soviet Union to sell discs is impossible to calculate because in Russia a lot of titles printed "pirates".
In the Soviet Union was even anecdote: "Brezhnev - a small figure era Alla Pugaevoy". In modern Russia, said: "We have three P: Pushkin, Putin, Pugacheva"
[Shoes "Alla Pugacheva [(http://www.econika-style.ru/model.xgi?&brand_id=74)]]
[Radio "ALLA" [9]] --Ермолаев (talk) 11:44, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Finland's certification database seems to contain evidence of only some 25,000 for Pugachova. 250 million in sales is a serious figure, which could not have been generated with only former Soviet Union's non-existent economy. I'm having a hard time believing that they (in former Soviet Union) even had the capability of being able to press as many vinyls (or cassettes) as you're suggesting, equally, I'm finding it hard to believe that east Europeans would buy tons of records coming from Soviets whom they (east Europeans) desliked intensely. Britannica has had no way of verifying the so-called 250 million submitted by Russians, who have tried to make an impression or tried to compete with an impressive sales generated by some of US artists. Even highly reliable news services publish outrageous sales figures sometimes, so seeing Britannica claiming a ludicrous figure of that kind for Pugacheva is no surprise. I'm entirely against having Pugacheva on the list.--Harout72 (talk) 16:53, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Higher Backstreet Sales

This group has now sold 130 million albums http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=552734&publicationSubCategoryId=70 Their total record sales are higher but their total record sales aren't exact, there are just other sources saying in the region of 200 million. And they formed in 1993.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Music Realist (talk • contribs) 00:33, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

We accept highly reliable sources only at this page, the source above is not.--Harout72 (talk) 02:18, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Still, their year needs to be canged to 93 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Music Realist (talk • contribs) 13:09, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

I have corrected the year they have formed.--Harout72 (talk) 15:58, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Led Zeppelin

Led has sold over 300 million records, in their official myspace, there are two biographys one that says they sold 200 million records and the other that says they've sold 300 million records, i have two source that said that they've sold 300 million records, look at this pages

http://new.music.yahoo.com/led-zeppelin/news/led-zeppelin-returns-with-rocking-london-reunion--53590296 and http://new.music.yahoo.com/led-zeppelin/news/led-zeppelin-returns-with-rocking-london-reunion--53590296. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.188.147.251 (talk) 18:16, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Prince mention???

Wikipedia itself says Prince has sold more than 100 million records, so shouldn't he be on the list? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mauri96 (talk • contribs) 01:16, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

I could not find any sales claims at Prince's wikipedia page. Could you provide the source which is supporting that claim? Thanks.--Harout72 (talk) 02:02, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

I realize that, and here is what you posted on September 17:

"Here is what Prince's figures look like in the following countries: US: 47 million UK: 4.3 million Germany: 1.7 million France: 3 million Canada: 1 million The Netherlands: 610,000 So 82 million for US and Canada is about 15-20 million exaggerated. Prince's worldwide total should not go any farther than 80-90 million.--Harout72 (talk) 00:09, 17 September 2009 (UTC)"

So I think NOW we can change it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mauri96 (talk • contribs) 00:14, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Change it to what? I don't follow you.--Harout72 (talk) 04:08, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Madonna: She Shoud be on top of the page alongside MJ, The Beatles etc.

  • Madonna: 9,500,000
  • Like a Virgin: 21,000,000
  • True Blue: 24,000,000
  • Who's that Girl: 5,500,000
  • You Can Dance: 6,000,000
  • Like a Prayer: 14,500,000
  • Breathless: 6,000,000
  • The Immaculate Collection: 26,000,000
  • Erotica: 6,500,000
  • Bedtime Stories: 7,000,000
  • Something to Remember: 9,000,000
  • Evita: 8,000,000
  • Ray of Light: 16,000,000
  • Music: 11,000,000
  • American Life: 4,000,000
  • Remixed & Revisited: 500,000
  • Confessions on a Dancefloor: 9,000,000
  • Confessions Tour: 1,500,000
  • I'm Going to Tell You a Secret: 800,000
  • Hard Candy: 3,600,000
  • Celebration: 2,000,000 (so far, shipped/sold)

Total Album Sales: 191,400,000 (based on existing Certifications)

Single Sales: 120,000,000 (based on worldwide certifications and data from all the official singles charts)

TOTAL RECORD SALES: 311,400,000

DVD Sales: 5,000,000+

('Record Sales including DVD's: 316,400,000+')

Madonna is by miles the most commercially successful female artist of all time in terms of record sales. IFPI announced ALBUM sales (a figure which does not include single sales) of over 200,000,000 copies in 2006 (before Hard Candy & Celebration). Therefore, including singles, Madonna is above the 300,000,000 mark without a doubt, not only based on common sense, since anyone can figure that out if he/she adds Madonna's record sales, but also according to IFPI's reports.

Moreover, there are countless sources that support that Madonna is way above the 300,000,000 mark.

For example, this source => [[10]] <= claims that. I can post as many sources as you wish later. I believe that Madonna should be included in the top of the page alongside the likes of Michael Jackson, the Beatles, Elvis Presley etc.

Thank you,


"Mysterious Spy" or simply Elias. :D


--Mysterious Spy (talk) 00:26, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

I've personally gone over Madonna's available certified sales and it's 157 million (albums, singles and videos combined). And the provided source above is not reliable. We accept highly reliable sources only for this page. I believe, Madonna's actual sales is somewhere around 225 million but then we'd need a highly reliable source in order to update her.--Harout72 (talk) 06:36, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
  • Her certified album sales are of over 190,000,000 and including singles, her record sales are over 250,000,000 according to certifications only. Her actual sales stand at well over 320,000,000 copies, though, and if you did some thorough research, you would figure that out yourself.

Also, both sources that support "200 million copies sold by Madonna" in this page, actually talk about 200,000,000 million ALBUMS sold (the IFPI source in 2006 clearly claims that she has sold 200 million albums, not including singles). Including singles, her RECORD sales are at over 300 million copies, whether you like it or not.

Madonna's single sales are enormous. She has sold about 115 - 120 million singles and that SHOULDN'T be ignored, as single sales are included for artists like ABBA, Michael Jackson or even Mariah Carey and Celine Dion in this Wikipedia page. If you want to make this list accurate, then Madonna's sales must be updated. I can even provide you with several sources that support what I'm saying.

Thank you.


--Mysterious Spy (talk) 13:38, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

If I were you, I'd try and support my arguments with reliable sources rather than simply saying that she's sold this much or that much. As I've stated above, Madonna's certified sales is only at 157 million including Singles, Albums, Videos, and that is not enough to suggest over 300 million in actual sales.--Harout72 (talk) 15:32, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

DVD's

Does this list, and more importantly maybe, should this list, included DVD sales/certifications? — R2 15:48, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Yes it does. DVDs are calculated as well.--Harout72 (talk) 23:59, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Constraints

The following subsection was in the article, but I removed it as original research, having been tagged as such since Oct '09 - as 'meta information', not factual, and not supported by reliable sources which infers that the rules for the article differ from the standard policies and guidelines.  Chzz  ►  05:23, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

Constraints

Although the criteria for the following list are intended to be expansive (including comparisons for total-sales for all recording artists) there are certain limitations and constraints that may limit the conclusions that can be derived from these data.

Such constraints include:

  • Bias involving acts who have had success in a specific country or region.
  • Bias involving older artists; there is a broader genre spectrum of music to listen to in the 2000s which limits the number of listeners.
  • Bias involving modern artists. Comparatively fewer successful pre-modern artists will have sold more records, as both global spending power and population have increased. In 1950, the world's population was 2.5 billion; by 2000 it had risen to 6 billion. Also, older artists suffer from bias as their record sales are less likely to have been accurately tracked, and estimates of their early sales are likely to be more vague.
  • Fan websites, press articles and record labels have been known to inflate record sales claims.
  • Inflated claims for artists who performed in different acts during their careers. Sometimes all of the sales data is attributed to an individual artist. For the purposes of this list, an effort is made to separate the individual acts (e.g., the sales figures for The Beatles and Paul McCartney & Wings are mutually exclusive).
  • Inconsistencies between the sources of the various statistics. For example, in some cases world sales are compared to US (RIAA certifies US sales only).
While I'm not able to locate sources for most of the claims within the section Constraints, I managed to find two reliable sources to support the claims for record-sales-inflation that record companies are famous for. I re-inserted this claim simply adding it to the lead of the article. I felt that it was very important to have this statement in the article because most editors are not familiar with the basic promotional tools that record companies normally use to boost sales.--Harout72 (talk) 01:50, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Sales of what?

What kind of recrods are being sold? Singles, albums, or both? 169.233.58.181 (talk) 15:05, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

This list includes all records, inclduing albums, physical singles, digital singles and ringtones. Hitthat (talk) 20:55, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Vicky Leandros

Hasn't she sold over 50 million albums and been on the list before? Source: [11] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.183.235.90 (talk) 06:08, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Leandros doesn't seem to have a single certification listed in any of the databases available above at the top of this page. All artists should have significant number of Gold/Platinum certifications to support their claimed sales-figures.--Harout72 (talk) 16:58, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

The official Eurovision Song Contest site esctoday.com has just done a detailed survey of the top selling artists worldwide who have appeared in the ESC . The top ten list of artists was published a few days ago . Vicky Leandros is at number 7 on that list with over 150 Million certified sales . They are obviously satisfied with the evidence for that as they state there the artists they have not included owing to lack of evidence on the figures . The award in Germany was for sales of 55 Million ALBUMS - that is WITHOUT SINGLES !!!!!! Her total WITH singles downloads etc and other media included in other claims is easily in excess of 150 Million as is claimed in numerous cases for her so of course she should be on the list as the claim for her is probably far more valid and believable than for many on the list who are there because of one very high claim still probably wrong but stated by an acceptable body . She has had many enormous hit singles in multiple languages around the world . In 2003 she received the Greek Government Xenios Zeus award where her sales of 150 Million plus were stated . Why list some artists with what is CLAIMED for them and decide not to list others .

  1. ^ http://www.buzzinpopmusic.co.uk/backstreet-boys-this-is-us-tour-2009/681
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