Talk:Paul Newman/Archive 1

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Gay?

Is Paul Newman gay? an annon keeps adding that he is, I doubt it, but am not sure. Can someone check? Thanks, Mark Richards 20:03, 5 May 2004 (UTC)

Ummm.... Paul Newman is married. With 3 kids.

Usually, I find myself in the position of trying to document people who are gay, when many contributors don't want to recognize that for some reason (e.g. Vladimir Horowitz, Barry Manilow). But, Paul Newman? Not by any chance. Definitely straight....Elizabeth Taylor-straight. 66.108.4.183 22:43, 26 July 2006 (UTC) Nash's Companion
  • Paul Newman (according to IMDB) has 6 children by his 2 marriages, first to Jackie Witte then to Joanne Woodward.
<sarcasm> If Newman's gay, he's an even better actor than I thought. </sarcasm> Clarityfiend 23:14, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
LOL!  :-D

I love Paul Newman with all my heart, and I want nothing more in the world than to just meet him! My name is Noel, Im 19, Ive seen every movie & yes Im a little obsessed. If I was born in 1925, he would have been mine. <3 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.139.188.190 (talk) 19:16, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Adultery Comment

The comment about why he never committed adultery seems gratuitous and out of place. Also, if he was married to Jackie Witte until 1958, and married Joanne Woodward on January 29, 1958, that suggests that something was going on before the divorce became final. I think readers should be left to draw their own conclusions, and that the steak-hamburger comment on adultery needs to be withdrawn.

John Paul Parks (talk) 16:43, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Religion

His mother was not Jewish therefore he is not unless he has convertedDakota 06:06, 24 September 2005 (UTC).

That's a religious law. He is half Jewish and half Hungarian in an ethnic sense. Vulturell 07:10, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

Paul Newman is the better actor of all the times,it has style, personality, it deserves the respect all!! vitor Branco ( POrtugal)

Does anyone know what religion he practices?--Moosh88 06:24, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

His "Jewhoo" entry said that his mom sent him to a (Christian Scientist, I presume?) Sunday School when he was little, for something like 2 years, but that "it did not take". IMDB says (though I don't know if they can be trusted since they seem to think that his mother is Irish) that he was generally raised without religion. That's what I see as the gist of it, so I doubt that he seriously practices any religion. His wife (Woodward) is Protestant but also not heavily religious. His Jewhoo entry also said that he said somewhere that he likes to describe himself as Jewish because "it is more of a challenge". But again, that's probably more cultural than religious. So, best guess is, like many Americans from a mixed marriage - just mostly secular, but aware of the two religions he was born into. Vulturell 07:15, 27 December 2005 (UTC)


I agree with all comment, but it be interesting to know what he was rasied. He never talk about his faith and i bet be hard to believe either faith. Since both parent say other person faith is wrong.Oh for the record there is no irish in his family. (Danny Boy 22:53, 2 February 2008 (UTC)) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Irishmonk (talk • contribs)

Paul Newman Day

As a graduate of Bates College, I can attest we were celebrating Paul Newman day well before the early 1990s: I remember doing this as a sophomore in 1979. Text changes accordingly . Ssterns 22:27, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

You cant be "half jewish", jewish is a RELIGION not an ethnicity. Someone is "half catholic, half white"...come one now!

Regarding the "Jewish" part, see the articles relating to Jewish people and Judaism. There are different types of Jewish ethnicities, so yes, it is possible to be half-Jewish. Acalamari 17:46, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Picture

Why is there no picture up? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.119.147.93 (talk • contribs)

Probably because there is difficulty in obtaining a picture to use without violating copyright. --C S (Talk) 04:47, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
Can we use the Newman's Own Limeade picture? --Jnelson09 04:39, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

painting or photograph

can u tell me if paul newman ever did a painting or took photograph --70.109.127.177 02:58, 17 July 2006 (UTC)of katherine hepburn? thank u rosanne

Food Line

Why is there almost nothing in this article about his line of food? I would venture to say that for a lot of young adults who have never seen his movies, Newman is more associated with his food than he is with acting. Still, it seems important and I think deserves its own section.

Does he have French salad dressing which is sold in stores? I just got back from Walmart and they had just about every flavor except French.


Sparsefarce 16:09, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Really Color-Blind?

Is Paul Newman really color-blind? I ask this because I recall a joke/aphorism that I remember reading (possibly from an edition of the Whole Earth Catalog, where they had these on the lower corner of each page) years ago to the effect What if Paul Newman was color-blind and didn't know his eyes were blue? so I'm wondering whether someone mis-remembered this and put it in as fact. 137.82.82.135 23:35, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

A number of places make note of his color blind problem -- this was the reason he never became a pilot during WW2.

Vandalism of the Paul Newman Page

I have confirmed that his full name is "Paul Leonard Newman", despite an edit claiming it to be "Victor Paul Newman". Reverted. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000056/bio http://www.biography.com/search/article.do?id=9422564

The first footnote also fails to mention any PGA donations, and a quick search of google yielded no such ties between Newman's Own and the PGA. The edit also suggested that all $200M went to the PGA, which is clearly false. Reverted.

Anon. 1:30, 8 February 2007 (UTC) 

== Slap Shot Rocks ==

Slap shot should be added to his main filmography. It's a cult classic 10:30, 8 Feb 07

he was one of the greatest ever

theres no mention of his legendary status hes a much better actor than al pacino,de niro,nicholson etc

Cultural reference?

Newman's likeness was the inspiration for one of the most popular and recognizable superheroes today. Comic artist Gil Kane used Newman as a model for Hal Jordan, the Silver Age Green Lantern, when he first appeared in 1959 (Sinestro, his archenemy, was based on David Niven).

RETIRED (NOOOOO....)

I am so furious. Why Paul? , WHY?. Well it's been a very good and long career , but i would've liked to see him leave us with a very great last performance. But he left us Cars which was good , and before that was the GREAT Road To Perdition. So Long PAUL.


He had an excellent run and it's nice to see that he has the class to quit while he's ahead. Far too many popular actors and performers over stay their welcome to a stupid and embarrassing extent. Too bad his politics are not as classy as his life seems to have been. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.73.170 (talk) 04:35, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

What politics are you referring to? 24.6.66.193 (talk) 08:23, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Cancer news

He has Lung cancer i just found out today, put in the page —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.14.23.45 (talk) 14:18, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Article now has cancer mention. Here's a much longer and more detailed AP story about the cancer news than the one footnoted in the article.[1] --71.175.28.121 (talk) 01:55, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Kenyon College, from which Newman graduated in 1949, said in a statement that the actor had suffered from leukemia.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601088&sid=aDRGBnPCbyWY&refer=home

66.222.50.11 (talk) 23:11, 27 September 2008 (UTC) Kenyon College is a reliable source. Mr. Newman's publicist only cited cancer as cause of death. All mentions of lung cancer are unsubstantiated rumors.--Btgreen (talk) 16:06, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

It was lung cancer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.11.152.137 (talk) 16:20, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Health, lung cancer & the wheelchair photo

There is no foundation for Newman's health being at the point where he is confined to a wheelchair. The link offered by the IP is to the the Sun, which has been determined not to be a reliable source, it is a tabloid. Secondly, the article accompanying the photo says specifically that the photo is taken as Newman is leaving Sloane-Kettering Clinic after his treatment. When most American hospitals release patients from treatment, they are wheeled out in a wheelchair. There is nothing in the article to support the claim he is "confined" to the chair. Wildhartlivie (talk) 12:12, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

He only has weeks to live now. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.12.162.167 (talk) 17:43, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Can we now assume it is true that he has lung cancer; that he is terminal; that he will die this year? Whilst he and his staff have not admitted it, many people try to keep such diagnoses/prognoses secret. If it were untrue, he or his people would have clearly made a statement to that effect. There have been many media reports this year stating he has lung cancer, and he would almost certainly have taken legal action against the organisations who stated he has lung cancer, had he never been diagnosed with it. The vast majority of lung cancer cases are fatal. The large majority of lung cancer cases are caused by smoking: does he currently smoke? If not, how long did he smoke for, and roughly how many cigarettes per day? This man is very famous; he had a long, successful career; the public, including Wikipedia readers, are entitled to know the truth about this man's health, diseases, life and future death.Werdnawerdna (talk) 14:24, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

per above, we need to stick with reliable sources. WP:BLP still applies, and I suggest we wait and see, without speculating. --Rodhullandemu 14:31, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
I agree. We can't assume anything that we can't reliably source. Drawing these conclusions is beyond the scope of an encyclopedic article. As I say this, I want to go on record right now about the smoking, diagnoses and original research. The article currently states "it was widely reported that Newman, a former chain smoker, had been diagnosed with lung cancer and was receiving treatment." This is all we know. Unless Newman goes on record to say "the doctors told me that all of that smoking has caused lung cancer, from which I'm going to die" or "I think the smoking caused the cancer", we do not have the sourcing, nor the facts from it, to draw any further conclusions. It doesn't matter for purposes of this biography how long he smoked nor how many cigarettes a day, especially considering people die every day from lung cancer for whom cigarettes do not apply. To connect Newman, 2 packs a day, 40 years and lung cancer constitutes original research per WP definition. Finally, WP:V says The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. There are few basic Wikipedia tenets that outweigh this. Wildhartlivie (talk) 16:17, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

It's pretty clear from his appearance that he has cancer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.12.53.15 (talk) 18:51, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Well, then we have a reliable source. Wildhartlivie (talk) 19:49, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Error in article

This article,toward the end, states that Mr. Newman son Neil will be taking charge of Newman's Own. I believe it should say daughter Nell, since there is no living son. I don't trust my skills enough to tamper with the article itself. If someone reads this, and makes the correction, please feel free to delete my comment. Loujen (talk) 22:29, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Another error. Article states wrong number of grandchildren. He has 2 grandchildren, sons of his daughter Melissa. Source NYTimes obituary. --Btgreen (talk) 16:11, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Death

He died the 27th of September, not the 26th even if you are in Australia the date must be referred to the location of his death ( America ), 27th of september 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.183.136.193 (talk) 15:59, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


The most important fact is that he died the 27th, and not the 26th of September. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.183.136.193 (talk) 15:56, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


It really is sick that people jump on this and rush to be the first to add it. The BBC story was 16.43 and I saw it at 16.51. Someone said to me "I bet it's on Wikipedia already" but I refused to believe them. I looked at 16.51 and here it is. Seriously, people, get a life. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.232.235.75 (talk) 15:52, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Why is this sick? Wikipedia is a news source. I'm only disappointed that the death of such a great american hasn't made the homepage yet.
Wikinews is a news source, we aren't meant to be, and it's consensus that only deaths of heads of state are reported on the Main page. --Rodhullandemu 19:45, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

I have modified his death date, but the reference is in Spanish. If you can add a better reference, you can do it. Thanks you--Nico89abc (talk) 13:18, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't think we should be so hasty in reporting Paul's alleged death. I haven't seen a single credible source yet. We should wait until we get some hard confirmation. Ackatsis (talk) 13:32, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Agree, a second-hand report of an email is not a reliable source. If necessary, the article will be fully protected per WP:BLP until we have one. --Rodhullandemu 13:36, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
I requested the semi-protection because at the time, the changes were from mostly IPs. There hasn't been a report published in any reliable source yet, but we can certainly ask for full protection. I'm sure Newman would appreciate any extra time. Wildhartlivie (talk) 13:39, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

here's another source: http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/080927/nysa002.html?.v=101 love & light to the man Sssoul (talk) 13:51, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

the bbc's got it now too: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7639614.stm
in case either/both of those are deemed prefereable for English-language wikipedia than the current Italian & Spanish refs ... Sssoul (talk) 14:09, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
CNN report here. Fox News report here. Reuters report here. Regards, Anameofmyveryown (talk) 14:42, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Newman's death was verifiably sourced and cited - yet you guys locked the article and savagely beat back all attempts to correctly include the sorced info. There was no question about the Reliable Source status of the reports - just a blanket statement, unsupported, unreferenced and unsubstantiated about no RS, yet. Why not just put a big sign up, "Newman Fanclub Members Only". This little incident, and the reluctance to properly report facts, inconvenient facts for some apparently, is just another example of Wiki's failure, it's apparent inability to rise above the pettiness of the gatekeepers that seize ownership. The Wiki game will always keep the project burdened with mediocrity and unable to rise above itself.70.131.53.37 (talk) 14:34, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

(ec)This is just not true; I've been watching this article for several hours, and only in the last 40 minutes has anyone cited a reliable source for his death. It's only just hit the BBC in the UK. WP:BLP and WP:V policies say we insist on reliable sources, and I suggest you learn to live with that. --Rodhullandemu 14:40, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Is this another case of Wikipedia breaking news? The first mention of his passing was added at 02:46, 27 September 2008, which would still be September 26 in the US. And I don't see any sources reporting this before Sept. 27. Joshdboz (talk) 14:38, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

This was one of the early cites that was rejected:[2], how did it fail RS?70.131.53.37 (talk) 14:50, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
A Google translation:

This morning at 7.30 (Italian time, 5:30 GMT) I received an email from the United States in which it informs me that Paul Newman is not over between us," Manes said.

An email reported second-hand is not regarded as a reliable source, since we have no way of knowing whether it's genuine. --Rodhullandemu 14:57, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Your excuse and selective edit are faulty, this is the part you left on the editing room floor:

"The American actor Paul Newman passed away in the United States, announced east Saturday Vincenzo Manes, president of the foundation Dynamo Camp de Limestre ... founded by the star of Hollywood."

It was a public announcement made by a close family friend and reported in the mainstream media. That he mentioned the type of communication used to convey the information is immaterial. He, Vincenzo Manes, is unquestionably a reliable source, reported by a reliable source. Objecting to the family's way of communicating the info is a nonstarter.70.131.53.37 (talk) 16:04, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

When searching for verification, this was the first story that kept coming up. Obviously Newman didn't die in an airplane crash two years ago. The only other two things that came up were both based on that e-mail. That is the reason it was consistently removed. More than one person noted the need for a source: Reverted unsourced content, sources needed, Undoing - please cite it if true, an email is not a reliable source. Wait for such, his HAS to have a source BEFORE it is added, it stays until we have a WP:RS. It is misleading to say that the article was locked after a verifiable and reliable source was added - actually, it's just not true. The article was locked from anonymous editing only (because at the time, the death was being added by IPs) at 14:04, 27 September 2008 and the first reference, based on the email, wasn't added for 12 more minutes - at 14:16, 27 September 2008. Please assume good faith and realize there are strict policies that govern what goes into a biography of a living person, which had to be assumed until a reliable source was produced that was verifiable. This is an English language Wikipedia, since the only available sources were in Spanish, there is no foul in waiting for a source that the majority of editors could easily verify. Wildhartlivie (talk) 16:23, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, what he said. To the 'T'. --Rodhullandemu 16:25, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

His death is now widely reported by the mainstream national and international media, the cause stated as cancer. There is no doubt that it was lung cancer; earlier this year, many media sources reported he has lung cancer; the version of this article on German Wikipedia states he died of lung cancer. Werdnawerdna (talk) 15:40, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Please see note below under "lung cancer". A reliable source, Kenyon College, reports leukemia as cause of death. [3]--Btgreen (talk) 03:52, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Please see response below that the actual Kenyon College website statement does not specify a cause of death. Wildhartlivie (talk) 04:48, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Amount of funds raised for charity by Newman's Own

The statement by the CEO of Newman's Own on Newman's Death on CNN at aproximately 10:45 a.m. today, September 27, 2008, indicates the amount raised for charity is now in excess of $250 Million (not $220 million as quoted in the current article about Paul Newman).

Thank you, Chad J. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chadsj (talk • contribs) 14:53, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Neutral question?

Is it appropriate to list somebody's political donations in a Wikipedia article?

This article says "He has donated to Chris Dodd's presidential campaign.[23]" —Preceding unsigned comment added by O% interest (talk • contribs) 16:16, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

His progressive politics had part of him. I think it is relevant on that basis. What do others think?--Dstern1 (talk) 16:25, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
In that case, should all biographical articles about people who express some political opinions list their political donations? —Preceding unsigned comment added by O% interest (talk • contribs) 22:25, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
No, I don't think so. The issue for us here is whether it is sufficiently important to have been reported in reliable third-party sources, and even if so, whether it's important enough to mention. Off the top of my head Charlton Heston Woody Allen Jane Fonda and others have certainly been vocal in political terms, but that does not imply we should make a point of it beyond a neutral description, and although political donations are recorded (as far as I'm aware), and are in the public domain, it should depend on how much of a part of their whole career is their politics. I've deliberately chosen some obvious examples, but I'm sure there are more subtle cases where although actors have made recordable donations, that's irrelevant to their career as an actor. If an actor has been vocal enough to publicly align to a political cause, I'd suggest that we should not ignore that. Otherwise, I doubt its relevance. --Rodhullandemu 23:39, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

There should be a lot more about Paul's political activism, because he was as famous for that as he was for his acting. He was a very good man, it's ironic that he died in the same year as his arch enemy Charlton Heston. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.11.101.98 (talk) 08:20, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

I believe it is quite notable to include someone's political donations and belief's in their bio. Mr. Newman was extremely involved in activism and philanthropy and did a wonderful job, in my humble opinion. It takes a lot of guts to stand up to some of the conservative crap that exists out there. All this aside, his beliefs and contributions spoke to the essence of who he was.Wikiport (talk) 05:07, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Other Honors

In 1992, Paul Newman was presented as a Kennedy Center Honoree on the same evening as his wife Joanne Woodward for their careers on stage and screen and their tireless philanthropic contributions.

http://www.kennedy-center.org/calendar/index.cfm?fuseaction=showIndividual&entity_id=3765&source_type=A —Preceding unsigned comment added by LKLWahoo (talk • contribs) 20:26, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

LGBT Activism

The GLAA considers Newman and Woodward to have been their first patrons[4], and he's reported to have been a fairly vocal supporter of gay rights including same-sex marriage[5][6]. Unfortunately, I'm having a problem finding specific information other than the 2005 GLAA letter and the one quote- is there anyone who can expand on this? Dysperdis (talk) 21:01, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Added information to "Political activism" section with a suitable news source. Cheers, --Jkaharper (talk) 12:07, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't think that being supportive of equal rights specifically defines someone as an activist for that given cause. Not long ago, I came upon someone who had added the politician tag to WP Biography talk page templates if they were the least bit politically active. We have to avoid over-categorization. Wildhartlivie (talk) 13:15, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Paul, who was a bisexual man by the way, was a vocal supporter of gay marriage. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.13.100.55 (talk) 13:16, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

He was a vocal supporter of homo marriage, he went out of his way to assist homos in their political aims, which is why I asked whether he was actively pro-LGBT enough to be considered an LGBT activist. Can anyone provide any evidence of the claim, above, that he was bisexual? If he was, that would help explain his political stance. Werdnawerdna (talk) 22:53, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

To clarify, perhaps it would be better to refer to it as same-sex marriage rather than homo marriage. Please ignore the inflammatory statement left by a confirmed sock puppet (see note further up about sock puppet accounts) who has pushed questions of sexuality on many high profile actor articles and don't respond to them. Thanks. Wildhartlivie (talk) 01:24, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Paul Newman was not bisexual and you do not have to be gay, lesbian or bisexual to support same-sex marriage. Anyways I'm sure we can agree that a minor mention of his vocal advocacy for same-sex marriage is enough. I'm sure whoever posted that comment about Newman's "bisexuality" above was either making it up, told wrongly or is getting mixed up with somebody else... --Jkaharper (talk) 21:13, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Findagrave link

I added a findagrave link that was removed because "he isn't even buried yet." So when he is buried, the findagrave link will have to be added back. So what's the deal with what information is on findagrave? If the findagrave page exists for someone, it seems valid to have a link to it. Dk1965 (talk) 02:41, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Policy on external links says we don't include links to information that would not already be covered if it was a Featured Article; the link currently does not fulfil that test. WP:CRYSTAL says that we do not write about things that haven't happened yet unless they are reliably sourced. The combination of these tests suggests that it is (a) unnecessary and (b) premature to include the Findagrave link, although it can be added when it is updated. Hope that helps. --Rodhullandemu 03:54, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm not sure I completely agree with the policies, but I do understand their goal. Anyway, Newman's findagrave page has been updated, but somebody has added a "no more links" advisory to Newman's wikipedia page. I think it is appropriate to add the findagrave link, but I don't want it to be deleted a second time. Opinions? Dk1965 (talk) 18:17, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
If the link has been updated, there should be no objection to it going back in; the editorial note is there to discourage duplication, but this is new material. --Rodhullandemu 18:22, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

date of marriage to Woodward

in Joanne Woodwards wiki page, their date of marriage is listed as Feb 2nd, not january 29 as listed on this page, someone should confirm and source it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4rousseau (talk • contribs) 04:47, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

picture

The picture at the top of the page isn't very good for the size of a star he was.. has anybody got anything better? --Jkaharper (talk) 08:24, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia can only use pictures, licenses of which allow sharing, example being creative commons, public domain, or gnu public license. On wikicommons there are only three pictures, two from exodus, the same film where the top picture is from. If anybody has a more recent picture and is willing to share, please do and remember to use one of these licenses. Ben T/C 12:39, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Philanthropy

{{editsemiprotected}}

Paul Newman was one of the founders of the Committee Encouraging Corporate Philanthropy (CECP), a membership organization of CEOs and corporate chairpersons committed to raising the level and quality of global corporate philanthropy. Founded in 1999 by Newman and a few leading CEOs, CECP has grown to include more than 175 members and through annual executive convenings, extensive benchmarking research, and best practice publications, leads the business community in developing sustainable and strategic community partnerships through philanthropy.

He also built at least one more camp for teminally ill children in Lake Luzerne, NY that was called Double H Hole In The Woods. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.148.120.98 (talk) 23:04, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

[1]

 Done--Aervanath lives in the Orphanage 17:15, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Conversion to Christian Science

It is not clear in the article WHO converted to Christian Science...the father, the mother, or both? Unclemikejb (talk) 04:14, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Newman's mother; I'll try and fix it to make it clearer. All Hallow's Wraith (talk) 04:16, 29 September 2008 (UTC)


Reference for (citation needed) for oldest driver winning a race

At the age of 70 he became the oldest driver to be part of a winning team in a major sanctioned race,[citation needed] winning in his class at the 1995 24 Hours of Daytona.[2]

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080927/FREE/809279997/1065

Bbigjohnson (talk) 18:50, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Lung cancer

Show us some reliable sources that detail which cancer Paul Newman died from. The sources in the article do not show he died from this. Otherwise this is inaccurate and reverts will continue. Guroadrunner (talk) 04:20, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

According to Newman himself, he was not battling it: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1024980/Paul-Newman-speaks-Im-NOT-battling-lung-cancer.html
Guroadrunner (talk) 04:21, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
The second reference to that statement does in fact say lung cancer. Meanwhile, your source above was at the time that his illness was first hitting news sources and was still denying any health problems. Your source also quotes him as saying he was being treated for athlete's foot and hair loss. How many references do you want? Wildhartlivie (talk) 04:56, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
There are plenty of sources on the net that state Mr. Newman died from lung cancer. I'm not sure what you will accept as notable. I think this is one subject that may be better served, if we wait to see what evolves from the media, and follow on sources in the wake of this unfortunate happening. Wikiport (talk) 05:00, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

He died of lung cancer. That fact should not be denied. There are many mainstream media articles which state that fact. In many cases where someone has lung cancer and/or died of it, the afflicted person and/or his/her family merely state cancer, deliberately omitting lung. The only reason they do that is that well over 80% of lung cancer cases are caused by the afflicted person smoking for many years; therefore the person caused their own disease (and death). Despite the proven fact that that smoking causes millions of cancer deaths, the afflicted people and/or their families/friends/fans etc are in denial of that, and pretend that it wasn't the fault of the person struck by the disease. Werdnawerdna (talk) 03:04, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't think there is cause to say that the word "lung" being omitted by family when discussing a cause of death is to hide smoking or that anyone is in denial. That's your opinion. Newman didn't hide the fact that he smoked for many years, nor have a large number of people who I knew who died of lung cancer. By the time someone dies, it really becomes a bit irrelevant to identify the location of cancer. Besides, that is still a "blame the victim" argument that isn't valid. About 20% of people who die from lung cancer never smoked. Wildhartlivie (talk) 08:10, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Bloomberg news cites Kenyon College's announcement that cause of death was leukemia. Kenyon College is much more reliable that the Daily Mail. --151.202.90.98 (talk) 03:36, 1 October 2008 (UTC) Here is the Kenyon news release:[7]

That might be true, if the Kenyon College site actually said he died from leukemia. In fact, it doesn't say anything about the cause of death, although the link you provided, to the Columbus Dispatch does credit Kenyon College with saying that, as does Bloomberg. It's understandable that some would say that because the focus of the camps was for children with cancers and leukemia. Meanwhile, please point out where anyone has used the Daily Mail as a source for any citation on the article. Wildhartlivie (talk) 04:46, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

It is fact, not merely opinion, that Newman died of lung cancer, and that the word lung is being deliberately omitted. The large majority of sources only state his cause of death as cancer, not lung cancer. There are many people in denial of the facts regarding not only him, but cancer and smoking in general. Whilst he was alive, there was basically denial from him and his people that he was seriously ill at all, let alone that he was terminal and he knew that fact. He said he was 'doing fine' or words to that effect, which was an outright lie. Wildhartlivie's 20% statistic is incorrect - in fact, only about 10% of people who contract lung cancer are lifelong non-smokers, and the cause of a significant proportion of those cases is passive smoking. Lung cancer causes massively more deaths than any other form of cancer. It is never irrelevant to identify the location of a cancer's organ of origin: it is a matter of recorded fact on the afflicted person's medical records, and is stated on death certificates, which are an official document. Different cancers have different causes, which makes it very relevant which people contract each type of cancer and why - that is how researchers and experts make scientific and medical progress. Wikipedia has categories including: deaths from lung cancer, deaths from colorectal cancer, deaths from breast cancer, deaths from prostate cancer etc. Therefore, the identification of a malignant neoplasm's parent organ is important and relevant - on Wikipedia as well as elsewhere. Werdnawerdna (talk) 20:03, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure why you are arguing, Werdnawerdna. The article contains the word lung. It's in there, it's sourced, it's been settled. As far as it being deliberately omitted by families/people because it is lung cancer, if it is fact, you'd have to prove it with reliable sources, and I don't think you can do that. It isn't relevant to the discussion about Newman having lung cancer or why he didn't make a huge public announcement months ago. It doesn't matter why Newman chose to downplay his illness - maybe he didn't a lot of public attention over it, he was always a private person when it came to his life and family. I said 20% because you said "over 80% of lung cancer cases are caused by the afflicted person smoking for many years." That either means around 20% of people who smoked didn't develop lung cancer or around 20% of lung cancers aren't related to smoking, or some combination of the two. Regardless, it isn't pertinent to improving the Newman article, and thus isn't appropriate for the talk page. I'm not going to debate personal politics regarding lung cancer or "blame the victim" mentality. Wildhartlivie (talk) 00:49, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

It is true that Newman did not acknowledge the nature of his illness. The announcement of cause of death was "cancer." Perhaps the family will be more forthcoming about the type of cancer. Until that point, I think "cancer" is all that is really verifiable right now. Some mainstream media have reported lung cancer, but none of the sources listed give their sources in their articles, they just say things like "lost his battle with lung cancer." --Btgreen (talk) 03:24, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Since mainstream media has reported lung cancer makes it verifiable, that's the meaning of verifiable. It's not particularly true that they will always cite their sources. Please see WP:V - it is incumbent upon editors to use sources to back what is put in an article. It may be that at some future point, it could be proven as erroroneous, but appearing in mainstream media reports defines verifiability. Wildhartlivie (talk) 04:16, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Kenyon College website now does report leukemia as cause of death. [8] --Btgreen (talk) 02:40, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

That isn't an official announcement from the college, it's the student produced newspaper. It is the only place where I can find the reference to leukemia and it just doesn't overrule all the other sources in mainstream media. Wildhartlivie (talk) 05:00, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

editsemiprotected

Golden Globe Award for Best Supporting Actor in a Series, Miniseries or Motion Picture Made of Television 2006 for Empire Falls - Second column last entree at bottom of page; needs to be changed to for

Fixed, thanks. Wildhartlivie (talk)

WP:WikiProject Actors and Filmmakers priority assessment

Per debate and discussion re: assessment of the approximate 100 top priority articles of the project, this article has been included as a top priority article. Wildhartlivie (talk) 06:56, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Newman article under attack from HarveyCarter IPs SP

Revert all sock puppet additions in this 92.8 to 92.12 IP range.

~ WikiDon (talk) 08:09, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Jewishness

He is in the categories Americans of Jewish descent and Jewish actors. Was he Jewish or merely of Jewish descent? He self-identified as Jewish. His father was Jewish, but his mother was not. Was he a religiously observant Jew and/or a convert? What religion was he raised in? If he is categorised as Jewish, he should be in the American Jews category, not Americans of Jewish descent. If he is not regarded as actually Jewish, but merely of part Jewish ancestry, he should not be in the Jewish actors category. Werdnawerdna (talk) 18:13, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

According to Jewish law, Newman was not Jewish. To be Jewish, you have to have a Jewish mother. --Gilabrand (talk) 19:35, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

There are many people who self-identify as Jewish, yet were not born of a Jewish mother. These include people with a Jewish father and people who convert to Judaism. Whilst many matrilineal Jews do not consider such people to be real Jews, there are many people not born of a Jewish mother who are currently in Jewish (not merely Jewish descent) categories on Wikipedia. His father was a lifelong Jew and Paul self-identifed as Jewish. Werdnawerdna (talk) 02:49, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

If you convert, then it is not "self identifying", it's being Jewish - Jewish law is the first to say this. No "matrilineal Jew" considers a convert as anything other than another Jew. Now I've heard that Newman considered himself Jewish, but I can't seem to find anything concrete to put in the article - or even a good spot to throw it in. However, he shouldn't be put in any list that is specifically for categorical Jews.FlaviaR (talk) 02:09, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Some fully-Jewish/matrilineal Jews do not accept converts that were not born of a Jewish mother to be Jewish. Jews in general do not seek out converts, and many discourage it. Many Jews view converts and prospective converts to Judaism with suspicion. Some people, who were not born Jewish, claim to have become Jewish, yet have never practised Judaism. Can such people really be regarded as Jews? Newman self-identified as Jewish because "it's more of a challenge". If that, along with the fact his father was Jewish, is all there is to his Jewishness, then he was of partial Jewish descent, but not a Jew himself. Werdnawerdna (talk) 23:06, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

An article about Paul Newman hardly seems like the place to settle the age-old question of "what is a Jew?" If we have reliable sources where he considers himself to be Jewish, that should be enough for Wikipedia, especially if it's worded correctly. We don't need to try to settle the question...it may never be settled and that has nothing to do with Newman.  Frank  |  talk  00:03, 3 October 2008 (UTC)
I agree with you, Frank, above, and I made those points on Gilabrand's talk page. Epson291 (talk) 04:14, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
Does anyone really have a problem with saying "Paul Newman considered himself Jewish" & leaving it at that?FlaviaR (talk) 06:17, 24 October 2008 (UTC)
If you've got a reliable source, no problem. Ed Fitzgerald t / c 01:58, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
Firstly, it is already sourced by Time, which is as reliable as sources come. Second, I do have a problem with removing the categories which identify him as Jewish, I'm not sure if that's what you're proposing or not, as I said before, he identified as a Jew, had a Jewish father, and the largest Jewish denomination in the United States would regard him as a Jew, it is not right to remove the category. The definitions on defining Jewishness is not clear cut, and doing it only as Orthodox Judaism would see it would be NPOV (see Who_is_a_Jew#The_controversy). Other than that, unless there is anything more concrete on his Jewishness I would just leave what is already in the article, no need to make a big deal about it. Epson291 (talk) 04:58, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Newman=Not Polish I think he should reconsider his ancestral roots, because that is either English or German.Davido488 (talk) 13:18, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Strange sentences in Jewish articles

What is the point of having the sentence:

Newman had described himself as Jewish, stating that "it's more of a challenge"?

This only seem to be added to make someone "more Jewish" (if by law, their mother isn't) as you never see it used with other ancestries. "Newman had described himself as Hungarian" or "Newman had described himself as Christian" Nobody ever bothers to search for and add that. There's a similar sentence in the Neve Campbell article:

Campbell is Roman Catholic, but also identifies as Jewish because of her mother's Sephardic Jewish ancestry, about which she has said: "I am a practicing Catholic, but my lineage is Jewish, so if someone asks me if I'm Jewish, I say yes".

Again, why was this dug up? It doesn't seem to be done with other ancestries, and it feels weird. We report their background, why not leave it at that? What significance do these sentences have other than to tickle the fancy of Jewish grandmas wondering if they're favorite celebrities identify with their religion? Bulldog123 00:50, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

New image

New image on commons

Your image has been deleted. :( We really need to get a good picture of this important person. --Tocino 06:02, 08 October 2008 (UTC)

I notice that the picture of him is from 2007. Is it preferable to use recent pictures, or to use a picture of the person when they were in their prime? Is there a guideline or policy on that? I would certainly prefer the former approach. --Lazar Taxon (talk) 02:58, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

It's recommended to use a more recent image. And a free use one. Wildhartlivie (talk) 03:30, 7 February 2009 (UTC)
But that doesn't make sense to me - all public figures (alive or dead) need to look as old as possible? I mean, it doesn't seem to apply to people who died before Wikipedia started. The picture that they use for Jimmy Stewart, for example, is from the 1950s, not from the 1990s. --Lazar Taxon (talk) 09:07, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
Regardless, it's recommended to use the most current and valid image as possible. Newman was still making films in 2005 and doing voice work in 2007, the date of the image used in the infobox. It's as valid as any other image of him. I'm not sure that Newman would have considered his prime, at least work-wise, 40 years earlier. It's not a matter of "looking as old as possible", it's a matter of available free-use images, the length of the body of work and what editors agree upon. We can't replace a current free image with one that is non-free from Cat on a Hot Tin Roof. Wildhartlivie (talk) 12:09, 8 February 2009 (UTC)
Not disputing your claim, but you have used the phrase "it's recommended to use the most recent image" several times in variation. Could you provide a cite where this recommendation occurs in WP guidelines? I haven't found one. My opinion, BTW, is that the image should be one in which the subject is most recognizable for the period in which he or she is best known. For example, film star Anita Page was huge in silent pictures, then practically disappeared from public view until she did a few TV interviews in her 90s. It seems strange (and, to me, silly) to insist on some image of her when she was a shrunken and unrecognizable little old lady instead of one from her prime. My opinion. I would appreciate that cite, though. Thank you.Monkeyzpop (talk) 18:52, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

College

Paul went to Kenyon College (my grandparents were in his graduating class), not Ohio State. I'm not good at edits, so can someone add this? The source would be Kenyon's website - www.kenyon.edu. Thanks. 12.152.207.5 (talk) 15:51, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

The article doesn't claim that he went to OSU. Nothing needs fixed. —Politizer( talk • contribs ) 15:55, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Unitarian Universalism

Newman was apparently a Unitarian Universalist. See [9]. I'm not sure where this should go into the article. Aleta Sing 18:08, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

If you can find examples of how he was involved in the church, you might be able to put it under Political activism, as the UU church is often fairly politically active. Or, if you can find proof that he was raised UU (as opposed to joining later in his life), you could put it under Early life. —Politizer( talk • contribs ) 14:17, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the suggestions, Politizer. I think he probably did become UU later in life; I read somewhere that he was introduced to it by Woodward. That was not a citeable source, however. So far I have not been able to find really anything beyond what I've already posted. I'm hoping some more about his UUism will appear in reliable sources so we can flesh it out a bit. Aleta Sing 17:40, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Non-notable source

I've deleted references to Paul Newman: The Dream Has Ended!: Part One by Jenifer Demers as a non-notable reference in the bibliography. The "book" is a 32-page pamphlet, apparently self-published, written in a manner more reminiscent of something from a not-very-literate fan than of a reliable source. For further information, see http://www.amazon.com/Paul-Newman-Dream-Ended-Part/dp/1440433232/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1228018882&sr=1-9. I appreciate the writer's devotion to Newman, but this work has no place in an encyclopedic bibliography. Comment invited. Monkeyzpop (talk) 04:27, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

Drowning

In what movie did Paul Newman's character's brother drown? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.215.208.204 (talk) 21:57, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Sometimes a Great Notion Monkeyzpop (talk) 22:33, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Lung cancer

Does anyone know when he was actually diagnosed? Nietzsche 2 (talk) 11:00, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Simpsons dedication

The Simpsons episode Lost Verizon has a (seemingly sarcastic) dedication to the memory of Paul Newman at the end. It depicts a bottle of his salad dressing. 86.131.89.40 (talk) 00:29, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Sooner or later, every celebrity/actor gets mentioned on The Simpsons and/or South Park. It's not unusual. Wildhartlivie (talk) 08:25, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Fidelity claims

An open secret has recently emerged casting doubt on his claims of fidelity. See the following link. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1176388/Dark-heart-Mr-Sundance-A-new-book-claims-Hollywoods-golden-boy-Paul-Newman-drunken-philanderer.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.79.207.43 (talk) 02:31, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

Auto racing

Does this, "and auto racing enthusiast.", merit inclusion alongside his other occupations in the intro sentence? I've never seen someone's recreational hobbies included like this in a WP article. 98.239.166.251 (talk) 10:37, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

It was a bit more that a recreational hobby. See the other sentence "He also won several national championships as a driver in Sports Car Club of America road racing, and his race teams won several championships in open wheel IndyCar racing" and the entire section Auto racing. He placed second in the 1979 24 Hours of Le Mans, was the oldest driver to be part of a winning team in a major sanctioned race in his class at the 1995 24 Hours of Daytona, co-founded Newman/Haas Racing, was a partner in Newman Wachs Racing and owned a NASCAR Winston Cup car. It was a business venture that was notable. Wildhartlivie (talk) 15:26, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

As a color blind person myself, I wonder what being color blind has to do with auto racing and his success at auto racing?172.79.143.4 (talk) 13:09, 9 April 2017 (UTC)

Did Newman finish his Yale drama studies?

I read recently bits of a chatty bio of Newman. The author states that Newman did not complete his course of study at Yale Drama School; rather, he resettled in New York City for paying work after spending some time at the Drama School. I'll research this point, and edit accordingly this and the Yale Alumni entries. Anyone know more than I do now on this point?SLY111 (talk) 18:36, 16 September 2009 (UTC)SLY111

What bio is that? There have been a couple released that are less than accurate and reliable. Wildhartlivie (talk) 22:57, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

Paul Newman, artist

I have come across a pen and ink pix of a young robert redford. It is signed Newman. I am curious because he was a multi tallented man and one of my favorite actors. Personally, I don't think he did any artwork, but I would kike to know for sure. My curiosity is peaked! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.45.83.241 (talk) 04:50, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

No idea. You'd be better asking an autograph dealer about the signature, but you won't find that here. Wildhartlivie (talk) 05:00, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
I have a pen and ink portrait of robert redford in his 30's. Is it possible paul newman did this. It is signed Newman. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.45.83.241 (talk) 04:56, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
No idea. You'd be better asking an autograph dealer about the signature, but you won't find that here. Wildhartlivie (talk) 05:00, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Marriage date(s)?

Comparing Paul's and Joanne's articles:

"Newman married actress Joanne Woodward on February 2, 1958."
"Woodward married Paul Newman on January 29, 1958."

Why did they marry each other on two different dates? Maybe there is a missing fact which should be mentioned?

PRR

Actually, you go with the date that has a sold reference with it, which was on February 2, 1958. ("Remembering Paul Newman." People. September 27, 2008.) Wildhartlivie (talk) 20:34, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Early works

Perhaps more detailed research should be done to include a more complete history of Paul Newman's acting career. I have recently viewed an episode of Suspense (TV series) in which he appeared briefly (as Captain Radetski) in the second act, and more prominently in the third act. The episode: "Woman in Love" (episode #160) aired August 26, 1952; [ref: http://www.suspensetelevision.com/episodes_1952/ ]. 75.94.142.89 (talk) 20:22, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Last work

Was in 2005 in "Empire Falls" mini-series. A real appearance in most episodes, not just a voice. Macaldo (talk) 15:15, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

File:Paul-Newman-portrait.jpg Nominated for Deletion

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Correction to Newman meeting Woodward

The article states that Newman met Woodward on the set of The Long Hot Summer. Newman met Woodward while working as understudies in New York on the play "Picnic". By 1958, Newman was already separated from his wife, he and Woodward were living together in California, and married this same year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.74.27.48 (talk) 03:31, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

Confusion about children

The children in the article and the children listed on the side bar are not the same. Who is Jack Newman and where is the second daughter from the first marriage?66.19.144.8 (talk) 15:35, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Political Activism and Gay Rights not verifiable under citation quoted

The link to the "Actively supported gay rights" contains absolutely no reference to being a supporter let alone an open supporter. Further, there is no mention of "gay" anywhere IN the article. I believe this allegation should be challenged and opted to voice concern here first in case I have missed something?NunyaBitnes (talk) 17:20, 24 July 2012 (UTC)NunyaBitnes

Second paragraph of Military Service

This is a confusing paragraph. Looking at reference 13, I can understand some of what happened, but our paragraph is badly phrased, at best. The squadron he was assigned to was sent to an unknown carrier, but his aircraft was grounded from that assignment because of the pilot's ear infection. The others (all?) in the squadron were killed on that carrier. He then performed further service. If I knew more about it I'd try to fix it, but someone should. htom (talk) 14:20, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Birthplace

There seems to be conflicting info about his birthplace. I see Shaker Heights (1, 2, 3), Cleveland Heights (1, 2, 3), and Cleveland ( 1). Does anyone have sources of official records or cities claiming him? Given the sources, I'm most inclined to believe it's Cleveland Heights (as noted by local newspapers and historians), but felt it was worth discussion. EvergreenFir (talk) 16:07, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

Infobox image

There seems to be a dispute about the infobox image and I think it might be a good idea to discuss this rather than continue to revert each other. My personal view is that the image of Newman and Woodward is a better image because the alternative image proposed looks like it was taken while Newman was on the toilet and the lighting makes it harder to look at.-- Mrmatiko (talk) 09:02, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

They're both good, but I'd go for the john shot. His eyes and face are lit better, with more color and depth, where the other one is in shadow. It's also a bit distracting to have two people instead of one. --Light show (talk) 09:23, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
I certainly agree that a picture of Paul alone would be preferable but I find it difficult to look at the publicity shot. This image would have been good if it didn't have other peoples' heads in the way. Maybe this one from 1954 would be better? -- Mrmatiko (talk) 09:40, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
I vote for "Paul Newman - publicity". It's a nice clear head shot and comes from the era when he was at his peak. --Loeba (talk) 13:11, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
  • My position is fairly obvious; the publicity shot is awful. The lighting is utter garbage, and it makes him look very unpleasant. I cannot understand why people think that is an acceptable picture to use, given how poor the colours are. I'd be perfectly happy with the 1954 picture; the lighting is reasonable, he doesn't look like he's badly ill, and there's nothing wrong with black-and-white. The 1987 one isn't really that good, and he's quite a lot older in that one. Lukeno52 (tell Luke off here) (legitimate alternate account of Lukeno94) 13:22, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
  • I don't dislike the publicity shot, and I think it is better for this use than the dual shot (which could be used later In the article). I do prefer the black and white however. --kelapstick(on the run) 01:12, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Unfortunately, some editor just tagged the publicity photo for deletion. Apparently it was taken and copyrighted around 2006, just before he died, which they feel is more likely than it being a prime example of copyfraud. Newman was noted for looking youthful. The 1954 shot is my 2nd choice. --Light show (talk) 19:48, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
  • It's highly unlikely that the image itself was from 2006; that is two years before he died, and he would've been 81. If you look at the deletion thread on Commons, you'll see that the copyright is attributed to the company who initially uploaded the still, and not the original image creators; I would expect that request to fail. Lukeno52 (tell Luke off here) (legitimate alternate account of Lukeno94) 20:08, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Sorry Luke, but after looking at all the options I pick the publicity shot as well. It's a shame, though, that we don't have more choices. Drmies (talk) 05:22, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
    • The Getty Images version of the color publicity shot is much better than the version being debated, but it is watermarked. The photo with Woodward is wonderful and belongs in the article, but not in the infobox. I vote for the 1954 image, cropped tighter to his face. I hope a better freely licensed image can be found. What a wonderful guy he was! Excuse that opinionated comment. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 05:36, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
The photo of him and Woodward is still in the Personal life section, so I added a new one for the lead. The 1954 photo was his debut film and not really a prime career photo. Hope the new one is OK. --Light show (talk) 08:44, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
I like the new image, seems more suitable for the infobox than any of the other images in the article. -- Mrmatiko (talk) 08:52, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
  • I'm happy as well. My objection was to the terrible publicity shot, so :) And yeah, the Woodward/Newman shot definitely has to be in the article. Lukeno52 (tell Luke off here) (legitimate alternate account of Lukeno94) 11:09, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Cullen, I have it on good authority that you and Newman used to go toe to toe in male beauty contests. Is this true? Drmies (talk) 15:41, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Well done, Light show. As for you, Drmies, I have two aphorisms for 2014: "Question authority!" is the well known one. I wrote the other one, "Question those who question authority". Cullen328 Let's discuss it 18:05, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
To be fair and play it safe, I also gave Joanne Woodward a new lead image. It's not that I believe in ghosts or anything, but . . . . Light show (talk) 18:59, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Not a bad idea whatsoever, particularly as that image is very good. I'm glad this has been rectified to pretty much everyone's contentment. Lukeno52 (tell Luke off here) (legitimate alternate account of Lukeno94) 19:45, 31 December 2013 (UTC)

Contentious edit regarding Newman's mother

It seems that this edit about Newman's mother is contentious. Rather than edit warring, it seems sensible to discuss this here.

My view is that the assertions made shouldn't be in the article because they seem to imply something through an interpretation of the lack of evidence, rather than any secondary source that provide actual evidence that Newman's mother isn't of the ancestry stated in the article. -- Mrmatiko (talk) 20:20, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

The evidence re her baptism can be disputed. The immigration-record evidence, no. I found that record; that was clearly hers; go look at yourself. 108.40.7.179 (talk) 00:39, 5 January 2014 (UTC)
In edit summary, the IP editor mentioned a link to a St. Mary's University of Minnesota web page that discusses the advantages of primary sources in doing research at the university level. That is all well and good for university research. But Wikipedia is an encyclopedia and we simply don't publish original research of any kind. Instead, we summarize what the best quality independent, reliable sources say about the topic. The best of these will be secondary sources. "Any interpretation of primary source material requires a reliable secondary source for that interpretation." Accordingly, I am not comfortable relying on what someone says they saw in an immigration document for a factual assertion in this biography. Instead, we should summarize what the best biographers of Newman say about his ancestry. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 03:34, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

Drank 24 cans of Coors beer each day

Newman drank a lot of beer and probably had an affair. So what? Cullen328 Let's discuss it 04:54, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

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Paul Newman movie credits

Paul Newman had a starring role in a 1963 movie called "The Prize" I did not see this mentioned in his Wikipedia biography. Did I miss it or should it be verified and added?

Fred Dreis174.23.4.208 (talk) 01:19, 28 May 2016 (UTC)

It's not exactly a major film. Plus the image in the infobox is from the film (the caption gives the title and year) and it's in Paul Newman filmography. That's plenty IMO. Clarityfiend (talk) 20:38, 28 May 2016 (UTC)

Note on a RfC about "military careers"

There is currently a discussion and a RfC on Mel Brooks's article about his so-called "military career," noted by an infobox module. Since his military service, similar to that of Don Rickles, was for a few years and before their actual careers began, inserting a massive module in the standard infobox, as in this article, seems both misleading and erroneous. For Newman, his "military career" module takes up about 25% of the infobox, while his notability is for being an actor. And like the others, he never had a "military career."--Light show (talk) 02:07, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

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Voice acting

Dear IP,

please explain first why you wish to remove the "voice acting" designations, but only if the last edit log and it's content did not convince you. Thank You(KIENGIR (talk) 19:19, 6 February 2018 (UTC))

It's basically the same thing as acting, as I explained it in the edit summary of the edit. Only if they are notable to have more than 100 voice credits, like Frank Welker and Jim Cummings for example. Because not ever celebrity on here is credited as a voice actor, just a few. 97.33.74.164 (talk) 16:44, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

I am torn between both points you guys are making. I agree that Newman shouldn't have a voice acting section, however the section shouldn't be deleted until someone moves these credits in the respective year of release.Filmman3000 (talk) 19:05, 25 April 2019 (UTC)

Major films intro?

His biggest performance in my mind is Cat on a Hot Tin Roof (1958), should be mentioned in the intro. It is a spell to see it. (But it is not in the style like his later cast.)

The main text writes: 

In 1958, he starred in Cat on a Hot Tin Roof (1958), opposite Elizabeth Taylor. The film was a box-office smash, and Newman garnered his first Academy Award nomination.

--Zzalpha (talk) 12:13, 7 June 2020 (UTC)

Redundances

1. "That performance led to his breakthrough role as Rocky Graziano in the film Somebody Up There Likes Me in 1956.[32] The Dean connection had additional resonance. Newman was cast as Billy the Kid in The Left Handed Gun which was a role originally earmarked for Dean. Additionally, Dean was originally cast to play the role of Rocky Graziano in Somebody Up There Likes Me; however, with his death, Paul Newman inherited the role."

Somebody up there likes me and Rocky Graziano are repetitive.

2. "For Newman's support of Eugene McCarthy in 1968 (and effective use of television commercials in California) and his opposition to the Vietnam War, Newman was placed nineteenth on Richard Nixon's enemies list, which Newman claimed was his greatest accomplishment."

The double "and" is not good.

ICE77 (talk) 06:44, 27 August 2022 (UTC)--ICE77 (talk) 06:44, 27 August 2022 (UTC)--ICE77 (talk) 06:44, 27 August 2022 (UTC)

Newman German ancestor

He hat definitely german ancestors, because Newman is english for german Neumann, a frequently german family name. It is no polish family name. 2001:9E8:B43C:7400:7CF0:9165:291F:D137 (talk) 06:50, 12 October 2022 (UTC)

inconsistency in place of birth

Lede says: Born in Cleveland Heights, Ohio

Early life says: born on January 26, 1925 in Shaker Heights, Ohio. 84.13.113.33 (talk) 16:18, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

Public Delegate to United Nations

In 1978 President Jimmy Carter appointed Paul Newman to be U.S. Public Delegate to the United Nations Special Session on Disarmament. 2603:9001:8500:44D8:D890:604F:FD1E:2150 (talk) 20:07, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

german ancestor, Neumann and Fetzer

His family name is defenitely neither ungarian nor polish, it is a typical german name "Neumann". So, yes, his father must have german speaking ancestors like germans or from austria-ungarian. And his mother, born Fetzer had a german name too.

2003:CA:A72F:4900:84C4:1F40:FD3:E096 (talk) 20:03, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

Education section

I'm confused by the following, from the "education" section: "He later attended the Yale School of Drama for one year, before moving to New York City to study under Lee Strasberg at the Actors Studio. Oscar Levant wrote that Newman initially was hesitant to leave New York for Hollywood, and that Newman had said, "Too close to the cake. Also, no place to study." Newman arrived in New York City in 1951 with his first wife, Jackie Witte, taking up residence in the St. George section of Staten Island."

Newman moved to New York, and then the following statement is about his hesitancy to leave for Hollywood? Is the implication that he then moved right away? (he did not, of course) The presence of "initially" makes things harder to understand. Maybe, the place was supposed to be "Connecticut" as Newman had just graduated from Kenyon College, or, the word "initially" was meant to be "often" (or not even there at all) as the cited source says that "he [Newman] had come West to make a movie, but did not expect to stay any longer than necessary". Perhaps the sentence is OK, but as written it comes off a bit confusing. 173.73.119.87 (talk) 02:30, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

  1. ^ http://www.corporatephilanthropy.org
  2. ^ At 70 he co-drove a Mustang to victory in the GTS class of the 24 Hours of Daytona, the oldest driver to win a major sanctioned race.
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