User talk:Habst/Archive 2

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Archive 1 Archive 2

Thu Jan 4: Hacking Night + Wikipedia Day soon

January 4: Hacking Night @ Prime Produce

You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for NYC Hacking Night at Prime Produce in Hell's Kitchen, Manhattan. This event is a successor to our inaugural December 2023 Hacking Night. It is intended primarily for technical contributors, though newcomers are welcome as well!

All attendees are subject to Wikimedia NYC's Code of Conduct and Wikimedia's Technical Code of Conduct.

Meeting info:

January 14: Wikipedia Day 2024 @ Columbia University

In addition, you are invited to Wikipedia Day 2024, hosted at Columbia University by the Brown Institute for Media Innovation with Wikimedia NYC. Eventbrite RSVP is required, while RSVP on-wiki is also highly encouraged.

The special focus this year will be Artificial intelligence in Wikimedia projects.

More details about the event will be shared later, but save the date for now!

(You can subscribe/unsubscribe from future notifications for NYC-area events by adding or removing your name from this list.)

--Wikimedia New York City Team via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 03:08, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

PRODs

I saw you do some excellent work in finding sources for some historical Olympic sprinters - it seems a bunch more have been proposed for deletion - I was able to rescue a couple of them, but some I can't locate sourcing for. Can you find coverage for any of these?

BeanieFan11 (talk) 18:39, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

@BeanieFan11, thank you for the compliment and thank you for your great work on this as well. I am on a bit of a WikiBreak this week, but I will make sure to get to those before the PROD 7 day window expires. Keeping an eye on WP:WikiProject Athletics/Article alerts to monitor the new deletion discussions. --Habst (talk) 20:38, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
@BeanieFan11, they are all handled for now. Thanks again for the heads up. --Habst (talk) 00:32, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

Category:OpenAI-written articles

Hello Habst, I noticed that you've been adding this category to biographies you've been creating. First, I wanted to point out that people are not articles. I don't think we have any articles on articles written by OpenAI, if OpenAI writes articles. So, it would appear that that category should not exist at all. Second, assuming that that means that those biographies were contributed to in full or in part by one of OpenAI products, presumably ChatGPT or its derivatives, that seems to put these articles into a murky area copyright-wise. So, I am wondering if there was a discussion regarding how these should be done, and whether any policies and guidelines were amended or created anew to regulate them. Best, Usedtobecool ☎️ 16:47, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Usedtobecool, thank you for checking in. That category should be a WP:HIDDENCAT, it should not be a default-visible category. As a hidden category, it would make sense to track even articles about people, because hidden category names can refer to their members as "articles" even if they are not articles about articles. That was its original intention, as it was used to track usages of the old {{OpenAI}} which I did not create (confusingly, since it was deleted an unrelated template was moved there, but its TfD is here).
Yes, those few biographies (Paola Borović, Patriks Gailums, Girmawit Gebrzihair‎, Simen Guttormsen, Jesper Hellström‎, Mathias Hove Johansen‎, Ferdinand Kvan Edman) were created in part using ChatGPT. They were all tagged by me as such and I have not seen any problems reported with them. All of these articles already had interwiki articles on other languages before the English-language version existed, so I used ChatGPT to translate their contents into English, followed by a fact check (comparing the statements with sources) and often some other touchups as well. I understand that there is a theoretical risk of GPT hallucinating, but that is why I check the output to make sure it is accurate. I find that the ChatGPT translation tends to produce less errors than other machine translation tools I have tried.
There is no copyright issue because the AI-generated text is just a sentence-for-sentence translation of the relevant articles in German or Norwegian, and the translations are also all properly attributed (using {{Translated page}}) to their original Wikipedia authors on the talk pages. My understanding is that Wikipedia is still developing its final policy on large language models, and it is not complete yet.
What do you think about making it a hidden category, and re-adding those articles to it? --Habst (talk) 17:14, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
I think these things need to be discussed in a more public venue. I asked you first in case those discussions have already occured. I will have to ask a few more people and think about it a while before I can suggest how best to proceed. Best, Usedtobecool ☎️ 17:32, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
The category was originally brought up as an example in an unrelated discussion we were having at Wikipedia_talk:New_pages_patrol/Reviewers#Neverending_NPP_backlog. I do not know what direction that discussion will go, but in case you are interested in developments... Usedtobecool ☎️ 17:50, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
Habst, so, you are already aware why I am concerned about usage of LLM. Putting that aside, since that will get decided when that gets decided, in my opinion, if you are translating from another language with the help of chatGPT, you should note in the edit summary of the first output that you publish here, that it's a translation, the page of which it is a translation, and the fact that that translation was achieved with help of chatGPT, then checked manually for accuracy. Not only would that cover all the bases with regard to attribution, the transparency would help other editors who come across such articles. I do not have any problems with having a hidden category of that kind, but I also do not know much about hidden categories and practices surrounding them. So, it may be best to ask people familiar with categorisation first. Regards! Usedtobecool ☎️ 02:08, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
@Usedtobecool, thank you, I share your concern and I will make sure to note both in the edit summary and in categorization going forwards. I made the category hidden and added the above articles to it, happy to participate in any future discussions about this. --Habst (talk) 13:59, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
Sounds good. See you around, Habst. Happy new year to you and yours! Usedtobecool ☎️ 15:35, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Article Rescue Barnstar
Your ability to find obscure sources on foreign, pre-internet athletes is fantastic. Thank you for your work in saving these articles; it is greatly appreciated! BeanieFan11 (talk) 19:20, 11 January 2024 (UTC)
@BeanieFan11, thank you, that is very nice of you to say. I'm very grateful for your work here as well. --Habst (talk) 20:16, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Nomination of 2015 World Youth Championships in Athletics – Boys' javelin throw for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article 2015 World Youth Championships in Athletics – Boys' javelin throw is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/2015 World Youth Championships in Athletics – Boys' javelin throw until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.

Fram (talk) 11:32, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

Template editor granted

Your account has been granted the "templateeditor" user permission, allowing you to edit templates and modules that have been protected with template protection. It also allows you to bypass the title blacklist, giving you the ability to create and edit editnotices. Before you use this user right, please read Wikipedia:Template editor and make sure you understand its contents. In particular, you should read the section on wise template editing and the criteria for revocation.

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Useful links

Happy template editing! — xaosflux Talk 12:37, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

Why sync module sandbox?

Hi. Why sync Module:Annotated link/sandbox with main when the sandbox is set up for testing a feature proposed in recent discussion and has initial test cases? This action detrimentally affects efforts to evaluate the proposed feature, and makes no positive contribution. Any competent template/module editor wanting to work on the code will check associated talk pages for recent activity and if there's no good reason not to, will ensure the sandbox is synced prior to testing any of their own changes anyway. Were you under the impression that I am an incompetent or wreckless template/module editor? Fred Gandt · talk · contribs 20:18, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@Fred Gandt, I'm sorry for the confusion, I meant nothing like that. I was simply preparing to test a feature that I was developing, namely adding a |remove_parentheses= option, and I wanted to sync the sandbox to make sure that the changes I was about to make did not conflict with any other in-development changes. I simply checked the page history and saw the last edit and discussion comment was over 9 days ago so I thought it was not under active development, and I would be allowed to test my changes.
Thank you for letting me know that you are still actively using it, I have since made my changes in Special:Diff/1199334917 but I have reverted them to your revision here, I will test my changes in my own module sandbox then until development of this new feature is completed. --Habst (talk) 20:30, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

AFDs

Hi Habst. I greatly appreciate your attempts to save athletes from AFD, but I would recommend not over-commenting (e.g. responding to every comment that does not agree with your opinion, especially if its an individual vote that is not replying to you). Its tempting, but try to just say your piece in a few comments with maybe 1-2 rebuttals to other votes if you really think it necessary (but I would not do it every time), as some consider your current comments at AFDs to be WP:BLUDGEONING. Just some advice. BeanieFan11 (talk) 16:52, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

  • I would also recommend just going for the ones that have in-depth coverage, unless you can find a really strong argument otherwise to keep it (e.g. Abdou Manzo being a three-time Olympian who's called a "glory of Nigerien athletics" is one; whereas Dagiero Dagiero, for competing poorly at the 2015 World Championships on a quota, not so much). BeanieFan11 (talk) 16:57, 29 January 2024 (UTC)
    @BeanieFan11, thank you for your kind message, I appreciate your opinion. I will step back and consider what you have said for future discussions. --Habst (talk) 19:28, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Niger

One way we may be able to get Kimba saved would be to get in contact to some media source in Niger (they would probably know whether he's been significantly covered). I, personally, am not sure exactly how we would do this, but just throwing out an idea. BeanieFan11 (talk) 23:39, 1 February 2024 (UTC)

@BeanieFan11, I appreciate your willingness to save this article. Okay, let's try.
I found this death announcement on Facebook which has 70 comments. I also reached out to WP:WikiProject Niger here: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Niger#Sources for Nigerien newspapers from the early 1990s to 2013?.
I'll continue to look into this. Thank you, --Habst (talk) 01:08, 2 February 2024 (UTC)
I also contacted the author of the German Wikipedia article on Kimba, here: de:Benutzer_Diskussion:Funke#Sources_for_Boureima_Kimba. I saw that this person had created many articles for people from Niger, so maybe they have some knowledge as well. --Habst (talk) 01:23, 2 February 2024 (UTC)

Thu Feb 8 NYC Hacking Night + Feb 21 WikiWednesday

February 8: Hacking Night @ Prime Produce

You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for NYC Hacking Night at Prime Produce in Hell's Kitchen, Manhattan. It is intended primarily for technical contributors, though newcomers are welcome as well!

All attendees are subject to Wikimedia NYC's Code of Conduct and Wikimedia's Technical Code of Conduct.

Meeting info:

February 21: WikiWednesday Salon @ Prime Produce

WikiWednesday is back this month! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our WikiWednesday Salon at Prime Produce in Hell's Kitchen, Manhattan, with an online-based participation option also available. No experience of anything at all is required. All are welcome!

All attendees are subject to Wikimedia NYC's Code of Conduct. In addition, to participate in person, you should be vaccinated and be sure to respect others' personal space, and we may limit overall attendance size if appropriate.

Meeting info:

(You can subscribe/unsubscribe from future notifications for NYC-area events by adding or removing your name from this list.)

--Wikimedia New York City Team via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:12, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Antoine Nkounkou

Can you find anything on this guy? Thanks, BeanieFan11 (talk) 13:24, 8 February 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. There's some ambiguity on this person, as Tilastopaja has him listed as Antoine Kiakouama with the same 13 Sep 1948 DOB, but Kiakouama's errata at Olympedia says that may be a mistake. Then there is doubt if any results on "Antoine Ntsana" are for Antoine Nkounkou or Kiakouama, and perhaps some of the results under Kiakouama's name (he is more accomplished) actually belong to Nkounkou...
In theory, the deletion process on Wikipedia should reward such ambiguities, because we can't prove that the results listed under "Antoine Ntsana" or "Antoine Kiakouama" aren't for the deletion subject. As far as newspapers go – Congo and Niger are difficult subjects to research, I haven't yet given up on Kimba above and I do believe that news coverage must exist somewhere. I will try to look into it further. --Habst (talk) 14:28, 8 February 2024 (UTC)
That's confusing...as for Kimba, it looks like it'll be moved to my userspace so we have unlimited time to look. Maybe we could find some way to contact the Niger Express or Le'Sahel (two Nigerien newspapers)? There's a good chance the Nigerien media would know how notable he was. BeanieFan11 (talk) 14:33, 8 February 2024 (UTC)
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