Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2016 July 11

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July 11

Why an empty category?

The redirect United States Senate election in Arizona, 2018 is a redirect to the article United States Senate elections, 2018 (as for other states) and has the category Category:Arizona elections, 2018. But for some reason this category appears as empty: Why? I asked this question before and got a non-answer, but what is needed to remove the problem (which only affects only this state). Hugo999 (talk) 04:20, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

The article has not been placed in the category you refer to. (See categories at the bottom of the page). It is however, in Category:United States Senate elections, 2018 which does not appear to have any sub-categories. As Arizona Elections 2018 refers to all elections not just Senate it would appear that it could be a valid category for the page. However, I'm not certain whether it is appropriate to have a re-direct in more than one category, and it is arguable as to which could be considered the more specific. Eagleash (talk) 07:02, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Hugo999: You didn't say where you asked it before so I don't know what you consider a non-answer. When I visited United States Senate election in Arizona, 2018, it had Category:Arizona elections, 2018 at the bottom but was not listed on the category page. A null edit of the redirect updated the category page. I guess the problem was caused by the category being created after the redirect was last edited. I haven't seen this variation of needing a null edit before but it often solves similar problems so it was my first thought. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:55, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Aspendale

Please fix up ref number 3 - the publication name is wrong I think. SorrySrbernadette (talk) 00:31, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Resolved

(The page name is Aspendale, Victoria). Eagleash (talk) 00:38, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Deletion request on page titled "Joe Eszterhas"

Edit request

On the page titled "Joe Eszterhas" Joe Eszterhas, there is a bit in the second paragraph referring to his parents Maria nee Brio and Istvan Eszterhas. It currently states that his father's name was "Count István Esterházy" which is incorrect. His name was Istvan Eszterhas. Joe Eszterhas and his family are of no relation to the Esterhazy family.

I am working alongside Mr. Eszterhas and would like to have his page updated with the most accurate information.

Thank you for your time!

Maryjanekathryn (talk) 00:55, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Maryjanekathryn, I've edited the article to match what the references state. As for your concerns with the article in general, please see WP:AUTOBIO. Dismas|^(talk) 02:42, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

How do I delete a profile? I have two.

How do I delete a profile? I have two. Where will I receive the answer to this? Norm Tered 01:19, 11 July 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Norm Tered (talk • contribs)

Actually, you have zero, because we have nothing by that name. Perhaps you could provide links to the two things you have in mind, and then when volunteers get a chance, they can help you with an answer.--S Philbrick(Talk) 01:45, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Norm Tered, what "profile" are you referring to? Wikipedia doesn't have anything called "profiles", so we're not clear on what you mean. There is nothing on your userpage at User:Norm Tered if that's what you're referring to. Dismas|^(talk) 02:36, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

• I think probable that Norm Tered refers to user accounts. The bad news is that having two without having clearly disclosed it is bad, and grounds for blocking. The good news is that no sane admin will block someone asking to delete their own sockpuppet.

The other bad news is that the only situation I can imagine where someone ends up with two accounts and asks for deletion of one is if they forgot the password. In which case it is likely that the password of "Norm Tered" will be forgotten as well, and they will never get the notifications of replies on their third account. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 20:26, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

reliable source

I want to use this link but I am hesitant. Is insing.com a reliable source for a GA or not??? Phamthuathienvan (talk) 04:14, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

• Hi there. While there are many articles on Wikipedia which use the said website's articles, the best place to ask this question is the reliable sources noticeboard. Lourdes 06:38, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Hans von Blixen-Finecke

Ref number 3 is not correctly done. Please fix 58.108.249.112 (talk) 08:56, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Hello, I have fixed the title and clarified it a bit as well. Thank you for pointing this out. GermanJoe (talk) 09:14, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Harv Error detection tool

Hello, I would like to know how to install the "Harv Error" detection tool. Markhole (talk) 11:54, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Markhole: I haven't tried it but see User:Ucucha/HarvErrors. PrimeHunter (talk) 12:02, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: Thanks! Markhole (talk) 12:23, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

How to upload word documents to Wikipedia

How am I able to upload word documents to Wikipedia talk pages? Thank you for your response. Gordon410 (talk) 12:05, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Gordon410: to talk pages? Why would you need to do that? -- samtar ^{talk or stalk} 12:12, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Samtar: I need to include footnotes for a post. This is only possible in a document.

Hello, Gordon410. There is no way to upload a file of any kind to a page: files are uploaded into File space, and can then be linked from a page. But WP:Creation and usage of media files#Text files says: "Please do not upload plain text (.txt), Microsoft Word (.doc), or text files in other formats. Instead, please start a new page and input the text using standard wiki formatting". You can put footnotes in using the referencing mechanism, see WP:REFB. If you use the template {{reflist talk}} at the bottom of the section, it will collect the footnotes there rather than put them at the bottom of the page. --ColinFine (talk) 14:07, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@ColinFine: Thank you for your comment. How can I upload my file to "File space"? Thank you for your response. Gordon410 (talk) 16:10, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Gordon410. I have quoted the section that asks you not to do so. --ColinFine (talk) 16:17, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Gordon410: I am puzzled at your suggestion that you need to upload a Word document to include footnotes. Wikipedia has tens of millions of footnotes none of which are or documents. Do you need help with how to include footnotes? See Help:Referencing for beginners--S Philbrick(Talk) 16:31, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@Sphilbrick: Yes, please, I do need help with footnotes. Gordon410 (talk) 16:35, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Two different editors have now provided a link to useful help.--S Philbrick(Talk) 16:37, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

@ColinFine: not to do what? Gordon410 (talk) 16:31, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

You should not upload your document. There are better ways to accomplish your goal.--S Philbrick(Talk) 16:32, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

FYI, you asked this question at the Teahouse. It is not a best practice to ask the same question at different locations in general, but if it is warranted, you should link to the other location. I realize you are new, and probably didn't know that, but now you do.--S Philbrick(Talk) 16:42, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Global 'Latest_stable_software_release'

Is there any way to set the 'latest release version' in the infobox of a software project for all the languages at once? I have created a template Template:Latest_stable_software_release/lzip, but I can't see any way to update the version in other languages except by editing every page individually. Thanks. Ant diaz (talk) 12:10, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Ant diaz. Interesting question. I don't know the answer, but if there is, it will be by using Wikidata: the Wikidata entry on the software will have to have a property giving the latest version, and the articles in each language will need to pick that up using a parser function. Alternatively, there is a project to generate infoboxes directly out of Wikidata, but I'm not sure where that's got to. Please see WP:Wikidata for more information, especially the sections "Infoxobes" and "Inserting Wikidata values into Wikipedia articles". --ColinFine (talk) 14:13, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Thanks ColinFine. I have finally figured out that I must add an statement for property P348, but it seems that this can't be done with my browser because the add link mentioned in the help does not appear. I hope this does not require a "supported" browser. Ant diaz (talk) 16:44, 12 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi, Ant diaz. That sounds rather unlikely to me. Are you saying that on d:Q1143890 you don't see a +add at the end of the Statements section? (it looks a bit different from the Help page). If not, why do you think it is a browser issue?

Note, by the way, that if you are going to use this in a Template, you will have to make sure you code it in such a way that it can cope if the particular software hasn't a Wikidata entry, or hasn't a P348. (Also note that you can make Wikilinks to Wikidata pages by starting with d:) --ColinFine (talk) 18:02, 12 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi ColinFine. It may sound unlikely, but the only "add" I can see on d:Q1143890 is the one in "additional terms may apply". The page does not contain neither the add at the end of the Statements section nor the edit and add links inside each statement box. I can't modify about anything in Q1143890. I suspect that the server is programmed to serve the full version of Q1143890 only to recent browsers with javascript enabled, because the html source says class="client-nojs" even if I enable javascript on Firefox 2.0.0.4, Seamonkey 1.1.2 and Konqueror 3.5.7. (BTW, IMHO javascript does not belong in an encyclopedia. It is too perishable).

Just now I do not plan to use this in a template. I just hope it appears in the infobox, as it seems to be the case in fr:7-Zip. (Thanks for the hint about Wikidata). Ant diaz (talk) 15:41, 13 July 2016 (UTC)

Ah, right, Ant diaz. It's a dynamic feature, so it may well not work if your browser is that old. I see your point about Javascript in an encyclpaedia, but I think it only applies to readers: supporting ancient technology for editors is an unreasonable demand in my view. If you want to make a proposal for a change in how Wikipedia works, WP:VPR is the place, but I don't honestly think you'll get much traction with that one (and in this case it's Wikidata, which is a separate project, and not primarily intended to be read by humans anyway). --ColinFine (talk) 17:27, 13 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi ColinFine. IMHO, 9 years old is not ancient technology by any means, but after some work I have updated seamonkey to 2.0.14 (2011), and it still does not work. It is not easy to "upgrade" to a newer version because this is an AMD K6 II from 1999, which I won't replace because it works fine for all my internet tasks except editing Wikidata. I won't produce more electronic waste just because some programmer thinks that it is nice to require javascript just to edit a pair NAME=VALUE. If a 5 year old browser is considered too old to edit the Wikipedia (or the data it gathers from Wikidata), then I guess the motto should be "the free encyclopedia that anyone careless enough about the environment can edit". Ant diaz (talk) 18:43, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

Thanks ColinFine for all your useful help. Dachary has added the statement for property P348 to Q1143890, so I can now try to make the version appear in the infoboxes. Ant diaz (talk) 14:46, 25 July 2016 (UTC)

3rr

why isn't there just a 1rr? someone adds something...another person reverts it, the first person reverts the revert...why should it be allowed to continue beyond this without talkpage discussion?68.48.241.158 (talk) 15:34, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

IP, the 3RR is a hard-line "rule", not nessesarily a guide to dealing with disputes - it's almost always better to BRD - be Bold (make a change), maybe you get Reverted, so you then Discuss the issue on the talk page -- samtar ^{talk or stalk} 15:39, 11 July 2016 (UTC).

I saw a reference on ANI about imposing a 1rr restriction on someone and thought 'why not everyone be restricted to this?' perhaps it's a matter of it simply be violated far too much if that was the rule, even though it's better..??68.48.241.158 (talk) 15:42, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

(edit conflict) I think you (and Samtar) are under a misapprehension as to what 3RR is. The situation you're describing is edit-warring and is dealt with accordingly; 3RR means one person can't make more than three reverts to the same page in 24 hours (except for a few exceptions like obvious vandalism) even if they revert something different each time, not that they can't revert the same material three times. A strict 1RR (nobody can revert anything a second time) is used in a few edit-war hotspots like Israel/Palestine, but if it were rolled out across Wikipedia would make things much more bureaucratic that they ought to be; the simple fact is that most reverts are legitimate removal of inappropriate or unsourced content, and forcing people to run to a noticeboard every time someone editwarred to include a link to their blog or a photo of their cat would make Wikipedia virtually unworkable. ‑ Iridescent 15:43, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @Iridescent: I'd hope I don't have any misapprehensions at this stage! :/ -- samtar ^{talk or stalk} 15:51, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

but they also can't revert the same material three times either according to 3rr, correct? it's just that reverting the same material would likely be considered warring before a technical violation of 3rr..??68.48.241.158 (talk) 15:49, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

And also, you're saying that, for example a person can't make more than 3 reverts to a particular article in 24 hours involving different material in different sections of the article even if all reverts are uncontested and valid?? that seems odd...why?68.48.241.158 (talk) 15:54, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

"An editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page—whether involving the same or different material—within a 24-hour period." Admins will use their common sense when looking at reverts of different material. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 15:58, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Sure, since it would by definition constitute four reverts to the same page (3RR means no more than three), but from the initial question it seems that the OP thinks it only refers to reverting the same material three times. In practice, despite the "bright line rule" claim, 3RR is more subtle than that. If someone has made a long string of edits to an article, some of which are valid and some of which aren't, one could easily rack up a dozen technical reversions to an article in a few minutes as they went through and removed the non-compliant part bit-by-bit, but despite this crossing a supposed "bright line" no admin is going to block for it. The interaction of IAR and Wikipedia's supposed bright line rules is subtle and not easily explained at a help desk; a better way to look at edit-warring is to largely disregard WP:3RR and look at every edit through the prisms of "would any reasonable observer consider this edit-warring?" and "would any reasonable observer consider this change an improvement?". ‑ Iridescent 16:01, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

okay, makes sense..in other words common sense always applies and a technical violation of 3rr wouldn't always involve a sanction in a 'bright line rule' kind of way (and warring can also come before 3rr etc)..68.48.241.158 (talk) 16:08, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Yep, you got it. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 17:07, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Help needed at Glendale, Arizona

Yes, it would be nice if you could cool the place down from its 110º, but that’s not what I am looking for here. The "Geography" section consists of coordinates and then a box showing who the neighbors are to the N,S,E & W. If that box were a bit smaller it would fit in the space next to the info box to the right, rather than beneath it. Make the whole page a lot nicer. Take a look, you’ll see what I mean and perhaps you will be able to fix it? I looked at the code and did not see a size option but I know that some of you are pretty smart and can likely figure something out. thanks, Einar aka Carptrash (talk) 16:13, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Everyone's screen is a different size. Unless you shrink them to the size of a postage stamp, you're never going to be able to guarantee that two design elements will be able to fit side-by-side. Remember, most of Wikipedia's readers (the usual estimate is 60%) are viewing on phone screens. ‑ Iridescent 16:20, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

And if you force the size, it will look silly on my 60" plasma screen - don't waste your time making a page look "right" on your screen, as it will look totally different on someone else's. Elements side by side, or text sandwiched between images left and right, cause the most problems. - Arjayay (talk) 16:26, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Well thank-you, even though it was not what I wanted to hear. Anyone else able to fix it for my screen? Carptrash (talk) 16:30, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Hello, Carptrash. While that discussion was going on, I moved the template {{Geographic location}} to the place in the article where WP:LAYOUTNAV says it should be: down the bottom, after External Links. I wasn't sure whether to include it into the collapsed set of navigation templates ("Files relating to Glendale") but I decided not to. --ColinFine (talk) 16:34, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Page regarding myself

Hello, I want to be able to change my image on a page about me, but receive a message stating I don't have permission. I should be the only person with permission if it is about me? The page is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Royal. Thank you. Jgroyal44 (talk) 17:28, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

See WP:OWN and WP:COI: you do not own the page about you and you should not edit any page you have a conflict of interest with. Ian.thomson (talk) 17:30, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

COI editing is not strictly prohibited (I've learned about this in the past)....and this person would simply have to meet notability:academics or whatever (a standard I disagree with..I think the should meet the same standards as anyone)...but question about the tag placed on his article just now...part of the point of the academics guidelines is that they are not notable via secondary/third party sources...so most assertions made in the articles would have to come from the horse's mouth anyway (or their grad students etc)...68.48.241.158 (talk) 18:23, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Jgroyal44, (partly) disregard the above as they are not notable via secondary/third party sources is the opposite of Wikipedia policy. The actual policy is at Wikipedia:Notability (academics); there are a set of criteria which if met confer the presumption that an academic is significant enough to warrant coverage on Wikipedia, but you (or any one else) will still need to provide independent sources to demonstrate that the academic meets one or more of the criteria. ‑ Iridescent 18:31, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

check out the page in the nutshell thing at the top of those guidelines, specifically mentions how they often don't have any secondary/third party sourcing...this is why I don't get articles for academics...but it appears that tag only requires one assertion to be sourced...everything else wouldn't need to be sourced then?? is a link to google scholar publications a source if they qualify via just this?? it's complicated and weird imo..68.48.241.158 (talk) 18:37, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Jgroyal, I'm sorry that the other editors are having an argument between themselves and not answering your question. As Ian.thomson says, it is not your page, and in general you are discouraged from editing it (see the links he gave). But updating the image is one thing that you are all right to do (unless there is a consensus that the image you introduce is less appropriate to a Wikipedia article than the one that was there before). Using images is a little complicated: you need to get the copyright right, and then you need to upload them before you can use them in an article. In general Wikipedia requires that images used are free for anybody to reuse: either in the public domain, or licensed under a licence such as CC-BY-SA. If the copyright holder (likely to be the photographer, but might be you if you have an agreement with the photographer to that effect) is willing to release it, there is no problem. Either they can upload it to Wikimedia Commons, and make the licence declaration as they do it; or they should mail Wikipedia as described at donating copyright materials. They or you can upload the image using the Upload wizard, and can then insert a reference to the image into the article about you. --ColinFine (talk) 20:10, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Jgroyal: Wikipedia's guidelines say that, in an article about a person, we should prefer a picture that shows them looking at the camera. If you can upload a better picture of yourself, as ColinFine has described, then the Jeffrey Royal article can be edited to use it in place of the current one. Maproom (talk) 07:50, 12 July 2016 (UTC)

Thanks ColinFine and Maproom for your help, I will attempt to upload one. Thanks again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2606:A000:4A03:6300:911B:6049:D28F:A7A7 (talk) 21:52, 14 July 2016 (UTC)

Why aren't my sfn references working?

My sfn references on User:Newbiepedian/WIP/Salmon argument show up blank and put the page in the cite errors category. Why? I've followed the instructions on the Template:sfn documentation to the letter.--Newbiepedian (talk · contribs · X! · logs) 19:09, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Fixed it for you—if you're using {{sfn}}, you don't need to include the <ref> syntax as well, as it creates those for you. ‑ Iridescent 19:19, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Thank you! --Newbiepedian (talk · contribs · X! · logs) 19:25, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Determine if a topic is noteworthy enough for its own article?

Earlier today I asked a question on WikiProject Alberta on whether or not a topic I had in mind was noteworthy enough for its own article. However, it seems that many of the "active" participants on that project have not made recent edits in the past few months so I'm not sure if I'll even get an answer... for future reference, is there a place where you can ask this question about articles you're thinking about starting in general, regardless of what WikiProject they might fall under? GSMR (talk) 20:25, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

GSMR, someone's answered there now, seems sound advice. If there is some national coverage it would help, and creating as a draft is always a good idea rather than throwing straight to the wolves Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:57, 12 July 2016 (UTC)

Why does this url break and how can I fix it?

I'm trying to help a new editor, my post to them includes a url for a Google search, but as you can see it breaks after the first "=" character - https://www.google.com/search?q="Hedy+Habra"&tbm=nws How do I fix it? Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 23:06, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

remove the quote marks?

https://www.google.com/search?q=Hedy+Habra&tbm=nws

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:21, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Thanks Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 23:29, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

You can also percent-encode them: https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hedy+Habra%22&tbm=nws. See Help:URL#Fixing links with unsupported characters. PrimeHunter (talk) 00:01, 12 July 2016 (UTC)