Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions/Archive 114

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I.P Deleting Warnings

Is anyone able to clarify whether an editor who deletes warnings from their talk page is refactoring talk page comments, and if that is refactoring how does that reconcile with WP:DRC? Thanks Flat Out let's discuss it 09:31, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

A user is not permitted to change the wording of another editor's comments, either on his own talk page or any other talk page, but the user is permitted to delete any warnings from his own talk page; the act of deleting them is taken as meaning that he has seen the warning. - David Biddulph (talk) 10:35, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks David Biddulph, I appreciate your time. Doesn't that interfere with other editors who review a Talk page to decide which level warning to give a disruptive editor. Flat Out let's discuss it 10:43, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
An editor wishing to give a warning will probably check the history of the talk page if he suspects that previous warnings have been given & deleted. - David Biddulph (talk) 10:46, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks again, David. Much appreciated Flat Out let's discuss it 10:50, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I think this should be clarified a little... I've often come across a user talk page that looks clean and I personally check the history (I think Twinkle checks it too but I am not certain) and I often find that the user has received multiple level 1 or 2 warnings in a short period of time and I usually leave a 4im when I see this. The purpose of my comment is that even if many users do not check the history, there will eventually be a stick in the mud that will come along, check, drop a 4im, watch the editor, and then report the next instance. Trolls are trolls and if that is what they want to do, then they will end up blocked. Technical 13 (talk) 11:13, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Twinkle does not check the history. It does check to see whether a warning has been left on the user talk page in the past minute (to prevent two users warning for the same incident), but nothing more. (Also, since when was I Twinkle?? There's more to me than that. WP:TW has a nice short shortcut!) — This, that and the other (talk) 11:18, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Long standing internal red links & unlikelihood of page creation

I'm working through a few of the 'arts' pages (artist biographies & notable works). Many of the entries seem to have red 'wish list' links that have been in place for years, while the entries have hardly had a look-in for as many years. While I understand that there are reasonable 'wish lists', more than half relate to cited authors who (having looked into their status) are not going to become notables and there doesn't seem to be any logical rationale for imagining that such pages would be created.

I've managed to redirect a couple of links to entries which cover the red links as thoroughly as they should need to be covered. There are, however, a couple of historical people of small notability which may be expanded at some point but, again, as the salient points regarding their relevance are already outlined within the entry itself. I know of the "Most Wanted" list but am wondering if there is some way of tracking how many articles are linking to the yet to be created page. Thank you, in advance, for your time and assistance! Iryna Harpy (talk) 04:35, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Iryna Harpy, and welcome to the Teahouse. When you enter a topic name into the search box, look carefully. Try a really common name as a test case. I notice that you live in Australia, so try "Melbourne" for the sake of this example. Of course, the first article that pops up is the article about the city, your capital. Then, there is a list of the most popular articles with "Melbourne" in the title: a cricket ground, a football club, and so on. At the bottom of that list is a box that says, "containing Melbourne". Clicking that will produce a list of every single Wikipedia article with the word "Melbourne" in the article text. This is a powerful tool.
You can use this tool to help research the potential of redlinks. If a redlinked name is mentioned on many Wikipedia pages, then that is an indication that it is a promising article topic. No hits may indicate that it is less promising, but don't take this as definitive. Do a Google Books search, and a Google News Archive search, at least. If you prefer another search engine, go for it. If the name is common, for example, a person surnamed "Johnson", then add some additional search terms like "artist" or "sculptor" or whatever will help separate the wheat from the chaff. If there seems to be potential for an article, then leave the redlink be. Or better yet, write the article.
When you get skilled at this, you can do a good-faith search for sources in less than a minute. If you conclude that the topic simply isn't notable, and that the potential for an article is weak, then feel free to delete the redlink by removing the square brackets. This is an editorial judgment, and simply by asking this question the way you did, I can see that you are a thoughtful, caring editor. If someone later comes along and does an hour's research, digs up notability, and starts an article, then they can use the same technique I described above to link to that new article. So be it. If someone restores the redlink, so be it.
So my final advice is, be bold, and take intelligent steps to improve the encyclopedia. I hope that this helps. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 05:36, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Cheers for your prompt response, Cullen! I realised, by using common sense, that this search strategy is obvious. I can be such a moron at times. I'm pleased to have found that I've already established that a few of these 'wish list' pages only point to articles within the same sphere of interest (the names only came up twice to three times) and were probably written by the same person in the first place. There are also some problems for common names where none of the potential candidates fit the bill.
By the same token, I've managed to find some permalinks to missing external references and am adding [dead link] until someone steps in to clean things up. Most of these articles, in themselves, have already been categorised as being short of verifiable sources, bad articles and questionable for a plethora of reasons. While I'm considering trying to salvage a couple which I consider to be important, there are others I'm not interested in so will only make notations of this nature in the hopes that the interested parties return to them (via messages on the individual talk pages). Ergh. Why do I feel to compelled to take this on? I just wanted to ensure that I was following policy and not vandalising pages. Again, your input is thoroughly appreciated & I'm feeling more confident in what I'm doing as a result of your missive. Thank you! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 06:11, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Cullen, may I correct something? Unless Iryna lives in Victoria, Melbourne is no longer the capital and has not been for many years.
And thank youy, Iryna, for your contributions.— Vchimpanzee · talk · contributions · 18:26, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Ta, Vchimpanzee. I understood what Cullen meant. I could have given the same analogy using Phoenix just picking a state at random. As it happens, he's right on the money: I am, in fact, a Yarra Yowie! Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:37, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Wow, now I have learned some new Australian slang - Yarra Yowie! That is much more interesting than "Californian". Thanks, Iryna. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 00:41, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
That's what the culturally challenged Sydney-siders call us since Aboriginal Yowie totems were installed in the CBD. You just can't keep a good, long standing battle of the states down. I must say that I feel compelled to commend you on your good taste in selecting Melbourne as the example. My first thoughts re. the USA tend to be of New York (culturally sophisticated and cosmopolitan, much like Melbourne)... unless it sprung to mind because you're not adverse to a flutter on the gee-gees a la the Melbourne Cup! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:59, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Mispelled Name in title

Unable to edit a mispelled title of a page. Page is John Naoti but should habe been John Naioti. How can I get it fixed.CaptJack15 (talk) 04:54, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

 Fixed In future, if you want to rename a page, you can place your cursor over the small arrow in the edit bar on the top of the page, and click "Move" in the dropdown menu. From there, just replace the current page name with the new name and click the "Move page" button below. Then, you are done. Arctic Kangaroo (✉ • ✎) 05:06, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Images And Copyright

Are images that one took themselves of a copyrighted program (i.e. off a screen) subject to the same restrictions as standard copyrighted material that is not user generated? The reason I ask is because I want to upload a picture of a TV show that I took off the screen but I got into controversy in the past over image uploading. I'm trying to be more careful this time. What basically happens if it's an image i took myself but is of a copyrighted program?EnglishEfternamn*t/c* 20:00, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Copyright still covers the image. It is just the same as if you took a photo at a gallery of a famous artist's latest painting. You can't use that photo to make and sell posters. The artist (or the TV production company) still hold the copyright on those works. That includes all rights to control and profit from any copies. There are Fair use exceptions that allow some limited use, but the copyright still exists. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 21:35, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Redirection of a page

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=International_Committee_on_Systematic_Bacteriology&action=edit&redlink=1

The page above needs to be redirected because the above committee have changed their name to 'International Committee on Systematics of Prokaryotes.' How do I do this?

Thanks

Binko100 (talk) 16:54, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Binko100! You see where it says "Advanced" on your toolbar? Click that first. Then click on the second button from the right. It's the one with the arrow coming out of the rectangle. That will create the redirect format. From there you put in "International Committee on Systematics of Prokaryotes". Voila! Redirect created! You may mess up, but keep trying and I'm sure you'll get it. Happy editing! öBrambleberry of RiverClan 16:56, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Hi Binko, I have created that re-direct for you. Matty.007 19:45, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Review of reviewing?

I'm branching out a bit and have tried reviewing some of the articles submitted for review (other than my own!). The bot is a big help, though doesn't always give me the reason to decline the item. My question is who lets me know if I'm doing it right? I believe I'm following the guidelines and most of the rejections are pretty obvious, even to a noob like me. And how does one get the article out of the review space when it is rejected? I come across a number that have been rejected, but are still listed for review.The Ukulele Guy - Aggie80 (talk) 14:58, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello, Ukulele Guy! If you see an article that is still on the Articles for creation list after being declined, it's probably because the editor has submitted it again. Also, there's a talk page for the reviewers at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation where you can ask for help or a second opinion if you come across something you are not sure about - which happens to me all the time. —Anne Delong (talk) 15:05, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
That I can understand, Anne Delong, but here's an example. It was declined over two weeks ago, but still shows on the listing. Cullen Investments The Ukulele Guy - Aggie80 (talk) 15:17, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Aggie80, please move this discussion to WT:WikiProject Articles for creation where it is more appropriate. Thank you. Technical 13 (talk) 15:26, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
It was submitted again for review on 29 May, and not been reviewed subsequently. - David Biddulph (talk) 16:22, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
I want everyone to know that I have nothing to do with "Cullen Investments". Cullen328 Let's discuss it 19:21, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Good to know :) EBY (talk) 19:53, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

But if it becomes the next Berkshire Hathaway, I want a 1% stake. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 01:43, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

How do you search other pages?

I've successfully gotten another article added to Wikipedia. Now I want to go to other articles (and I know there are many!) that reference the subject and add in the wikilink. How do I search for them? If I use the search bar, it just takes me to the main article.

The Ukulele Guy - Aggie80 (talk) 12:23, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi there! Try searching from Special:Search. Cheers, --LukeSurl t c 12:27, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
That was what I was looking for! Thanks, LukeSurl! There are hundreds of places to link out there! No way I'm ever going to get to them all (the guy had over 5000 music track credits, so his name is on hundreds of pages}! Is there a bot that helps with that? The Ukulele Guy - Aggie80 (talk) 12:49, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
The Wikipedia:AutoWikiBrowser is a tool for semi-automating repetitive tasks (such as adding wikilinks). It's not something I've personally used much, but there are instructions at that page. Hope that helps! --LukeSurl t c 13:25, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello and welcome back to the Teahouse Aggie80! What I usually do is add {{Orphan}} to the top of the page and hit Show Preview. Once you do this, scroll back to the top of the page and there will be a box that has a few links in it that will help you find articles to link to yours. Good luck! Technical 13 (talk) 12:35, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks, Technical 13, I'm not sure how that works. The {{Orphan}} just puts a flag at the top of the page and I didn't see anything in the form of helps. I'll play with it a bit more.The Ukulele Guy - Aggie80 (talk) 12:49, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Aggie80, at the end of the line of text on the flag are two links: "related articles" and "suggestions may be available". Clicking on the first one will preform a semi-refined search on wiki for you as LukeSurl suggested and the second is an off-wiki tool that does a more specific search for you. Good luck! Technical 13 (talk) 12:55, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Still not seeing that, I'll try to play with it some more
A list of matching page names drops down as you type the query (unless you have that turned off in your preferences). The search box will navigate directly to those, but to get search results instead: choose Search, or choose "⧼vector-simplesearch-containing⧽" from the drop down list, or add the tilde ~ character to the query. You could also switch to a different skin such as Monobook that separates out a "search" button and a "go" button, which is what we had for years (I have never understood why it was removed when they implemented the terrible default vector skin). I also imagine there's a way to separate out a Search and a Go button in the Vector skin by some code in your .js or .css file but I'm not sure how to do that.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:51, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
I have Go and Search, guess I never realized there was a difference, and usually just hit return. Now that I know, I'll put it to use! The Ukulele Guy - Aggie80 (talk) 13:12, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Ha! you had the search button all along. This is a problem that comes up over and over for those without, so I assumed you were using Vector. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:17, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

How are cite templates used?

If I want to cite a journal, I can use {{cite journal}} - But I have no idea what to do with it. (And Wikipedia persists in making finding out how to use its zillion tools almost impossible except through the friendly real people at the Teahouse and the pump.)Kdammers (talk) 09:18, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi Kdammers, I put {{cite journal}} in <nowiki>...</nowiki> in your post to display what you typed instead of trying to apply the template. The documentation is at Template:cite journal. See general template help at Help:A quick guide to templates. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:32, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
I guess I'm dense. I can't understand how to use the template after reading the quick guide (which led me to a page on to help page on {{cite journal}} that seemed to just say by putting the template into an article will produce the formatted data olong the side. I don't see how: I need to put the data in somewhere; when I did a preview of it, all I got was "

Empty citation‎ (help)" in the body of the text.Kdammers (talk) 11:15, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

There are templates that help you. When you open the edit window, there should be a box in the menu at top left "Templates." Click that then choose which cite you want to use and a box will appear for you to add information then insert. If "templates" is not there at top left, go to the top right of menu and click on "Cite" and templates will then appear. Does this help? Flat Out let's discuss it 11:21, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Hi Kdammers. I also found all the {{cite}} templates difficult to use. That's one of the reasons I installed the ProveIt tool (instructions to do this are on that page). It's a brilliant device that handles creating a citation in a user-friendly way, through a little interface rather than just text. I'd strongly recommend getting it. Cheers -LukeSurl t c 11:37, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

I want to thank LukeSur. I isntalled ProveIt and found it easy enough to use. In response to Fat Out!: I could not find "Templates" or "Cite" at the top left. Nor could I find "Cite" or "templates" at the bottom right of the menu. Kdammers (talk) 11:53, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Cite is at the top right, but I also installed ProveIt based on LukeSurl's answer so we are both on a better track. Flat Out let's discuss it 11:56, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

edit on edit

  • Hello, i was wondering if there is kind of warning that can be given on someone who edits for no reason, changing and reversing the content for edit counts purpose probably. well you guys can decide if you watch what happened in here. [[1]] all the undo to an undo edit can be found in here [[2]]. this page by the way has been originally started by me, to make it a source of accurate transfer for the current seasons and not an edit war.

your advices will be gratefully accepted and respected (Argento1985) 23:06, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

  • the one who causes the trouble is User:Bgwhite who is master editor as it says on his talk page. i don't know who gives such titles in ranking, i wanted to learn how are "earned" also ((Argento1985) 23:10, 12 June 2013 (UTC))
He has displayed Master Editor II, which means that he has made over 51000 contributions to WP and has been contributing for more then 7 years. But he is entitled to in fact display the next one. You can see that on Wikipedia:Service awards. Nobody needs to give awards, once you have attained a particular level, you can display that badge. The other edit you have pointed out look all right to me. He has not removed the link, as you mentioned in your edit summary. He has just removed the pipelink as the club is called APOEL F.C..--Vigyanitalkਯੋਗਦਾਨ 06:36, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
However, it seems that these are all football clubs. Does it make sense to add the F. C. after just one of them? —Anne Delong (talk) 08:56, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
It makes as much sense to me as only linking the first wikilink to an article. It starts to look like a see of blue and red when people link every instance of a word. The idea is that it is suppose to enhance the understanding of the article, and once something has been defined there is no reason to redefine or redeclare it for every instance. I know my wording isn't great on this one, maybe someone else can improve it if needed? :) Technical 13 (talk) 12:08, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

*Hi Argento! With the really experienced editors (many years, thousands of edits), many work off of scripts, moving quickly, making clean-up and consistency changes across dozens of articles with a standardized description (like "Do general fixes and cleanup" which, I agree, isn't exactly describing much.) Looking at one of their edits or a couple of reverts may give an opposite impression (like troublemaking) of their overall mission. In this case, APOEL F.C. is part of the APOEL multi-sport club so the designation "F.C." could be pretty significant, thus the removal of the shortcut. I don't know for sure if that was the editor's intention since they didn't leave a better description, but it's a strong guess. A good way to get that editor's attention can be to make a comment on the Talk Page of the article in question and then tag the editor's talk page alerting them to the conversation. Don't give up the good work. Cheers, EBY (talk) 20:10, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Years in Switzerland

Hi everyone,

Does anyone know of anyone who is likely to help me create pages for this? Thanks, Matty.007 18:49, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Welcome back to the Teahouse, Matty.007! Starting tomorrow I can definitely help you create pages for years in Switzerland. I love eliminating backlogs of articles that need to be created. Happy editing! öBrambleberry of RiverClan 21:48, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks, Matty.007 16:09, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Images in Sandbox question

I've been working on articles related to Rock music. My usual way to work if the article is small (e.g. an album article) is to throw the whole article into my sandbox then make changes and roll them back into the live version. Usually, I try to roll them in at the sentence or paragraph level so there is a good audit trail rather than just re-dumping the whole sandbox and just replacing the entire article at once. (I know in theory I could just edit the live article but just not comfortable with that, I like testing it out in a space that's not live first).

This morning I received a message that user Werietch had modified my sandbox and removed the image there. (The image was the album cover for the Rory Gallagher album Blueprint) The justification was WP:NFCC#9 If I'm interpreting this correctly its stating that those album cover images have a fair use exemption for the article(s) that are about the album but not for anything else like my sandbox. So in the future I should I assume stop doing this, or at least be more careful if I copy a whole article into my sandbox make sure there aren't images with use restrictions? Just wanted to make sure I'm understanding this correctly. Mdebellis (talk) 16:23, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Mdbellis.... Copyrighted pictures can't be kept in sandboxes. Miss Bono (zootalk) 16:36, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello Mdebellis and welcome to the Teahouse. To elaborate as there has been much discussion about how to deal with such "violations" of NFCC#9, the way that I prefer to deal with it on my sandbox pages is to use the following code: [[File:Example.png| Actual options for the file on the article |link = Actual filename.svg ]] which will display a free example image that is the same size and configuration of the image on the live article to allow you to adjust it for placement and size and whatnot and clicking on the image will take you to the page of the image that is used on the live article but does not display in your sandbox where it isn't appropriate. I hope this helps. If you need any further help, I would be happy to assist (I actually have some stuff on this topic in my sandbox and a bugzilla ticket in for a better fix). Technical 13 (talk) 16:48, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I'll use that code in the future. Thanks! Mdebellis (talk) 17:14, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
On a related (and less important) note, you should not have the categories from the article you are working from live. You can either skip copying them, or you can place nowiki tags around them (<nowiki>categories</nowiki>) so they don't work to categorize the sandbox draft (but don't forget to remove the tags when you paste back). Cheers--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:52, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks for telling me that. Had no idea. Is there a consensus among experienced editors about the best way to do this? Do more experienced people tend to edit in place? Among other things I thought it might look weird to someone reading the page to see minor changes happen in the sort of haphazard way they occur to me. Also, I had a follow up question, I'll enter below. Mdebellis (talk) 01:37, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Follow up question. I realize now this is the question I should have asked at first. I tried SuggestBot (very cool idea btw) and started to work on a totally different topic, the page on the Fast Carrier Task Force needs more structure. I started to copy that article into my Sandbox but then was concerned about all the pictures. So the question I should have asked is: is there an easy way to know if copying a picture into my sandbox would cause a problem? Or should I just assume that all pictures are copy righted and never do it? Mdebellis (talk) 01:43, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
First let me clear up one issue, it is not copyrighted images that this is about. It's non-free copyrighted images used under a claim of fair use. All images that we use here (that are not in the public domain) are copyrighted. Some are just freely-licensed in a manner compatible with our free licenses, and we can use those... freely, in sandboxes or wherever. We allow use of regular old fully copyrighted (non-free) images on a limited basis if they meet the stringent requirements of the non-free content criteria, and part of that, is that the use is claimed fair for a specific purpose always in a specific location or locations with a rationale for that use there ("this image is fair use in Article X because..."). Thus, the image is never going to be properly fair use for display anywhere else, such as a sandbox, talk page, etc. End digression.

As to your first question, it is not uncommon and though there are copyright issues involved—you should be complying with Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia when you make the sandbox copy—there's nothing wrong with your method.

As to the follow-up question, why copy any of the images? Here's what I suggest for the situation you encountered of an article with lots of images. To make an image a link instead of display, you just prefix a colon before the markup, e.g., [[:File:name.jpg]] So, click edit on the article, click the search and replace function (the tools with this icon: at the top right of the edit window), search and replace all iterations of [[file with [[:file, then copy to your sandbox. When written out like that it sounds like an involved process but it should take about 20 seconds of real time. When transferring back you'd just do the reverse. That's the you-need-not-bother-looking-at-each-image answer but you can always visit each image's page to see its licensing status to check whether you need to disable if for a sandbox, and one tip is that any Commons images can be immediately excluded and will be useable as they are all free, which are easily recognizable by the logo on the image page: File:Commons-logo.svg. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 04:06, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

That is a great and easy solution. I wanted to try it to make sure I get it so I just now tried this with the Fast Carrier Task Force. I'm going to describe what I did in a little detail since this is how I will move articles into my sandbox from now on. First I copied the entire Fast Carrier article except for the Categories at the end (are categories always at the end of the article or might they ever be included at the top or in the middle?). Then I pasted it into my sandbox (slightly different, I'm still kind of phobic about doing things like a query/replace on the text of a live article) then before saving the change I did the find/replace as instructed above. The results are in my sandbox http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Mdebellis/sandbox now. I noted that the effect wasn't uniform. Actually there were only 3 find/replaces when I expected more, I think there are six pictures in the original article. I'm going back to look at it now. I think some pictures have "image" rather than "file" or something. Anyway that's where I'm at now, going to look at my sandbox now but wanted to post this in case anyone can further instruct in the mean time. thanks for all the help on this. Mdebellis (talk) 13:27, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
So I think some of the pictures were using "image" rather than "file". So I repeated the proces of find/replace matching for "[[image" and replacing it with "[[:image" This was an easy way to take out all the pics and I can repeat the process easily if I want to replace the text as one big chunk (which I don't do most of the time but I might want to on this one actually because I think what is needed here is a change to the overall structure of the entire article). Mdebellis (talk) 13:32, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Perfect. Not flagging "image:" was an oversight on my part. Until about three years ago, all media files started with image. They switched over to file but of course kept image working, and so there are many thousands of grandfathered-in uses. Note that you could first use search and replace to change all instances of "image:" to "file:" (that replacement can remain permanently), and then do the secondary search and replace of [[file: to [[:file:. I do understand why you're phobic about live replacements, but so long as you don't hit save page, you should never have a problem (I constantly use live articles and the show preview button for all kinds of silly tests, often completely unrelated to the actually article). Glad this helped.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 19:58, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

trouble with creating reference list

Hello, I am a new editor. I have made changes to several entries without any apparent problem. Now I am trying to write new articles and am running into trouble. I have written an article in my sandbox and am not correctly creating the reference list, though I've followed the instructions. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.

Also, is there a way to draft multiple articles in a sandbox? It looks like I'd run into trouble if I tried to start a new one after my reference list.

thanks for any help.

KXF (talk) 17:27, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. The error message in your sandbox gives a link to Help:Cite errors/Cite error refs without references, so that is the place to start reading. That page also gives a link to Referencing for beginners.
As far as drafting multiple articles is concerned, you could call one draft User:KXF/Rex M. Ball and then User:KXF/your next article title, and as many as you need. - David Biddulph (talk) 17:34, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
I also am having problems with the reference list. I checked the reference page and it told me to enter "{ { Reflist } }" which I did, but the list of references won't show up (although the little footnote numbers do). All of my references are done with the "< ref >...</ ref >" encoding. (Note: I added spaces into the version so it wouldn't read it as code-- I obviously don't have spaces between the braces or the angle brackets in the article). What am I doing wrong? Thanks. Sulpicia3 (talk) 01:16, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Gender inequality on Wikipedia

People don't have a problem with names of female celebrities suffixed by the last names of their husbands. I am not collecting examples so i the one i am mentioning is enough.But take the example of Abhishek Bachchan. Editor's are so irrational they are havin a problem to let me mention that he is way behind his wie Aishwarya Rai in terms of success and popularity. It is not an opinion but a fact! aish.ego (talk) 14:45, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Aish.ego. You must cite a reliable source for any claims about "success" or "popularity". Why do you think it improves these biographies to make that claim? Is this the subject of extensive discussion in reliable sources, or is it just trivia? Cullen328 Let's discuss it 14:54, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
The information you want is still included in the lead. It's just not the first thing said after giving his birthday and occupation. --Onorem (talk) 15:28, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

Dear Cullen .It is not trivia, it is nformation. Someone who is searching for this actor must know what is helping him to at least survive in his industry.What made him enter the Cannes film festival or Oprah Winfrey's show or even the industry!

Dear Onorem, it's not written as clearly as this -Bachchan comes from an illustrious Bollywood family. He is known outside of India for being former Miss World Aishwarya Rai's husband and Bollywood legend Amitabh Bachchan's son. His mother Jaya Bachchan has also been a leading actress in Bollywood.[1] . Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aish.ego (talk • contribs) 17:51, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

What he has done does deserves to be first. Notability is not inherited. If he had done nothing but be the son of famous parents and the husband of a famous wife, he wouldn't have an article. --Onorem (talk) 17:55, 11 June 2013 (UTC)


You mean i can add this statement after his accolades? -He is known outside of India for being former Miss World Aishwarya Rai's husband and Bollywood legend Amitabh Bachchan's son. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ‎Aish.ego (talk • contribs)

No need. It already says who he is married to and who his parents are. Your edit would add nothing. Please stop. --Onorem (talk) 14:22, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

of corse m stopping n soon am going to quit this biased WP... i wntd to add an additional info that he is known primarily in India, n outside of India, he appears due to and with his wife. aish.ego (talk) 18:13, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

  • Because the person we are discussing is alive, special considerations have to be made in what can be said in a Wikipedia article. Living persons have a legal right to their reputations so everything in Wikipedia MUST respect certain guidelines. If the New York Times wrote an article about a person's career being dependent on their spouse, then absolutely that could be quoted here. But otherwise? No. That information, as you say, can NOT be included without that reliable, published source. EBY (talk) 21:24, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Well thanks, now i found the references and have added them. aish.ego (talk) 08:08, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Question

I'm still pretty new (first registered towards the end of March), but I was wondering, is it okay for me to give someone a barnstar? Thanks. --1ST7 (talk) 21:44, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Absolutely, yes, without any qualification.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:30, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks. --1ST7 (talk) 23:33, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

CHanging Article Title

I created an article titled "Knobody" because there are two figures in the music industry named "Knobody". One is a producer and A&R (This one already has a wikipedia page titled knobody).

The page that I am attempting create is for Knobody the rapper. I would like to know how to change the article title from "Knobody" (because it already exists) to "Knobody (rapper)"…

Thank you for your help Osophy13 (talk) 03:49, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

THis is my first article & because there is already a page with the title I chose, I am not even sure if it made it to submission.. help!!

Osophy13 (talk) 03:52, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi Osophy13! Thank you for your question and welcome to the teahouse =D! The article Knobody would still stay as the A&R music producer as it is the primary topic, and the article you want to create should go to Knobody (rapper). In this case, one would put Template:Other uses at the top. E.g. {{For|the rapper|Knobody (rapper)}} at the top of Knobody. However, your article may not be accepted at AfC because he does not meet the notability guidelines for musicians. I'll do a further check. ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 04:42, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
Update: Hi, I've done a search on he's only released one album on Hieroglyphics Imperium Recordings (needs at least two to qualify), and may be dropped from this label because his 2012 EP was not released under it. He's also never charted on any national music chart. Also, do look at Wikipedia:Your first article. There are several issues with your AfC, namely that it's not written in a neutral POV and not adequately cited. ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 05:03, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Recreating deleted article (for guardNOW)

Hi, I am testing out new content and updated links for the creation of a page for guardNOW. I was wondering if someone could have a look at my Sandbox to see if I'm on the right track; here is the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Zaid231/sandbox

Thank you in advance for any feedback on this -

Zaid231 (talk) 22:04, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi Zaid. Were the article posted right now in that state it would be deleted under section G4 of the criteria for speedy deletion as a re-post of an article previously deleted at a deletion discussion (Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/GuardNOW), that does not substantively address the basis for deletion. It still cites to sources like PRweb and has none to reliable, secondary sources that are unconnected with the subject of the article. The simple fact is that if those sources do not exist to show notability and to verify the content, Wikipedia should not have an article on the topic.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:19, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Changing the color of a link

I have these two userboxes: User:Miss Bono/Userboxes/friends and User:Miss Bono/Userboxes/age. i want to change the color of the link to get a best contrast with the black background. Can someone help Miss Bono  (zootalk) 12:59, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

In the WikiFriend userbox the I want to change the colours of both links. Miss Bono  (zootalk) 13:11, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
I've changed each as an example. You can view what I did in this diff and this diff and then emulate. See Web colors for your palette. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:17, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
The links for the name of the users and the date remins with the blue colour. Miss Bono  (zootalk) 13:20, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello and welcome back Miss Bono. To change the colors of the links you do just like you did in your signature. You provide the link and put any formatting code in the piped section like [[linking|<span style="color: red;">text for link</span>]] Technical 13 (talk) 15:29, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Thank you both, Fuhghettaboutit and Technical 13 :) Miss Bono  (zootalk) 15:40, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Oops. I guess I left you hanging, but I was out. No problem; always another person to rely on:-)--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 21:12, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Deltion

can some admin help me to delete this file File:Ali_Hewson_and_Bono_in_2010_EDUN_in_a_Louis_Vuitton_campaign.xcf?? Thanks... Miss Bono (zootalk) 12:15, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Thank you!! :) Miss Bono (zootalk) 12:33, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Hey Miss Bono. I've deleted it. For future reference, you can tag something you created yourself for deletion under section G7 of the criteria for speedy deletion by adding to the page {{db-g7}} (which has intuitive redirects such as {{db-self}} and {{db-author}}) ("db" stands for delete because and all of the speedy deletion templates start with it.) Tagging with G7 does not guarantee deletion if the page tagged is considered useful or has contributions by others, but is the standard method for such requests. Note that pages in your userspace you created, should instead be tagged with {{db-u1}} or {{db-userreq}}. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:38, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Thnak you so much Fuhghettaboutit Miss Bono  (zootalk) 12:44, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
You're welcome!--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:59, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Multiple Pages of Single Reference

Thank you for inviting me to Teahouse.

While writing article, i need to quote a Page number of an authentic book so i used reference as (Page No: 68, Book Name, Author Name). Now in same article i need to mention 4 more pages of same book to explain some fact and i again used reference tage with text (Page No: 78, Book Name, Author Name)....(Page No: 107, Book Name, Author Name)....Is this correct approach as in references section we get 4 link to same book with different page numbers? Here i am creating article related to it, History of Dasam Granth (RawatSingh (talk) 06:09, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

There are several ways to do it. I would use named references (so that you only need to enter the citation details once), and the 'rp' template outside the reference tags. See WP:Citing sources#Citing multiple pages of the same source for suggestions and explanation. --ColinFine (talk) 09:33, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Hi Rawat. There are a couple of ways you can do this.
<ref name="Smith2011">Smith, J; ''The Big Book of Stuff'', London, 2011, pp 26-32</ref>
and then use: <ref name="Smith2011"/> (note the slash at the end) for all other references to the same passage. This tells the software to create an in-text citation to the same reference as before; it's much tidier than listing the same book four or five times.
  • If the references are to several pages in the same book that are widely spaced apart, then you can create a bibliography and use short citations. Format your references like this:
<ref>Smith 2011, p. 22</ref> or <ref>Smith 2011, p. 47</ref>
and add a {{Reflist}} template as normal. Then, underneath your References section, create a new section headed "Bibliography", and list all of the books you are using there in full.
Hope that helps somewhat (if all else fails, you can find full instructions at Help:Cite for both these methods and more). Yunshui 雲‍水 09:37, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
If you want to see an article that does what Yunshui is discussing, so you can see it in action, let me recommend Plymouth Colony, which uses the "short citations" format he recommends. --Jayron32 03:36, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

How to gain notability when I have reliable sources?

I am curious how I can produce an article that displays the notability of a company. I have sources from major publications like Entrepreneur and and Smoke Magazine (major magazine regarding the cigar industry). My sources include both online and print material. I am trying to learn the process of adding material to Wikipedia and chose this article submission because I assumed it would be my easiest to have accepted. The page is located here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Articles_for_creation/Bow_Tie_Cigar_Company

Prpiranha (talk) 05:31, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

You are advised not to edit articles related to your company as there can be a conflict of interest. ♛♚★Vaibhav Jain★♚♛ Talk Email 05:37, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
This is not my company

Prpiranha (talk) 05:39, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Sorry for the wrong response. Btw are your sources available online? ♛♚★Vaibhav Jain★♚♛ Talk Email 05:53, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
They are, excluding Smoke Magazine. This is print media only. I found a version on the company's page, but assumed linking back to their page more than once seemed odd. Plus, the magazine did not intend for it to be online.

Prpiranha (talk) 05:55, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

It does not matter whether a source is online or not. If the magazine is, as you say, a major magazine about the industry, then it is a good source. Kdammers (talk) 09:13, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
What you need to do is to add the citations to your references, as inline citations (supporting specific pieces of information in the article). See WP:Referencing for beginners. As Kdammers says, it is not necessary that the references be online, just that they be substantial - not just a listing in a directory - and from reliable publishers (but if they are online, it is helpful to provide a link). --ColinFine (talk) 09:28, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Display of Article Title (Which is Only a Redirect) in the Search Box

I created a page The Chathams, New Jersey, which is used to redirect to Chatham, New Jersey.

When I begin to type "The Chathams, New Jersey" in the search box, there are no displays in the list of available articles. After I finally type out the full name, I can click on it and it will take to me to Chatham, New Jersey.

Why are there no displays of available articles with "The Chathams, New Jersey" title? Is there anything I can do to correct this?

As an example, when I begin to type "Jitney taxi", the displayed list of available article shows Jitney taxi, which is simply a page with a REDIRECT. When you click on it, it takes you to Share taxi.Wondering55 (talk) 02:05, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Hey there! Welcome to the teahouse :) I think that's just a bug in the updating time of the search feature of MediaWiki, what with keeping up with 4 million pages in articlespace alone it takes it a while. Wait a day or two then try :) Charmlet (talk) 02:31, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
There are a heck of a lot of redirects that start with "The". I recommend patience. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 02:50, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
Just so your know, the search index catalogue is updated approximately every morning, Greenwich Mean Time, so you should expect such delay until then.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:11, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Guests

Hi again,

I was looking at this, and it seems to periodically get rid of people who have put their names on there. Is this meant to happen?

Thanks, Matty.007 20:01, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hey Matty! Yep, TH/Guests only lists recent guests--a complete list can be found at Wikipedia:Teahouse/Guest book. Cheers, Theopolisme (talk) 21:31, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Think of it this way: Hosts tend to stay for months, or in the case of an old guy like me, well over a year. Most guests tend to drop by once or twice, and then move on. That makes them "past guests", if you will. Those guests who return frequently will continue to be listed as guests. Some will progress to become hosts. So it goes. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 02:55, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
OK, thanks both of you. Matty.007 18:49, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
I'm a frequent guest but I don't think i'm listed there.— Vchimpanzee · talk · contributions · 20:44, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Rotten Tomatoes?

I noticed that most articles (about films) use Rotten Tomatoes in the "Critical reception/response/reaction" section. The thing is that the percentage (of critics who gave a positive review) and the "average score" (out of 10) are typed directly onto the article without using any templates, etc. This means that every time they are updated, we will have to wait for someone to update it manually. So is there any way we could create a template using some sort of coding to copy and paste the data from the RT page directly into Wikipedia? Koopatrev (talk) 09:24, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Koopatrev and welcome to the Teahouse. I've thought about this before as it slightly "annoys" me as well. I suppose that a WP:bot could be written that would check the current ratings once a day using the list of pages using Rotten Tomatoes as a source. Such a bot would have to be approved by the Bot Approval Group. If you are not in a hurry, it's actually on my looooooong list of things that I would like to do. If you are more of an immediatist, I encourage you to take on this project yourself and suggest asking Theopolisme if you need any assistance writing the bot (make sure that when you get in touch with him to explain in as much detail as you can what you want the bot to do. He gets understandably annoyed when he gets asked for help and doesn't know what it is suppose to do. Good luck! Technical 13 (talk) 12:22, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks, very much appreciated! Koopatrev (talk) 06:09, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Not a problem... Theopolisme has actually already picked up this idea (he had thought about it in the back of his mind once or twice before too apparently) and has started development of such a thing. You can view and comment on the conversation here on his talk page (AND I encourage you to do so ;)). Technical 13 (talk) 11:42, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Reviewer vs Rollbacker

What is the difference between the two, as they both have to do with vandalism work. I know what rollback is as I have the permissions to use it, but I am unaware of what a reviewer does. I know they work with pending changes, is that all? Thanks --PrabashWhat? 03:27, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi and welcome to the Teahouse! A rollbacker has some advanced options to revert vandalism such as the ability to use Huggle and Stiki, whereas a reviewer has the ability to accept or reject changes to articles with pending changes protection. So yes, a reviewer only deals with pending changes. WP:ROLLBACKER and WP:REVIEWER have more information. Happy editing. Go Phightins! 03:29, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks that simplified things for me substantially! Cheers. --PrabashWhat? 03:39, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

How do you make titles of articles italic?

How do you make the title of an article italic? The reason why I'd like to know is because the article is for a film, so it needs to be italicized. Thanks.

Ianeds63 (talk) 02:49, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi Ianeds, and welcome to the Teahouse! The short answer is that you cannot make the title of an article appear italic in the address bar, so far as I know. But to make the title of an article appear italic at the top of a page, simply add {{Italic title}}. Hope this helps! Go Phightins! 02:55, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Alternatively, place {{DISPLAYTITLE:''italicized name here'' (any non italicized words)}} at the top and you're good to go. =) ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 02:58, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Cool thanks Ianeds63 (talk) 05:56, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

de-orphaning

I'm trying to de-orphan an article (Smart Sparrow) by linking it to another article (Adaptive Learning). This makes sense since Smart Sparrow is mentioned on the Adaptive Learning page. I've put in an edit on the Adaptive Learning page, and added the line in the edit summary that is supposed to de-orphan it. But nothing seems to have happened. Can you see what I've done wrong? Sorry for the hassle.Mightier (talk) 23:31, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Mightier. You haven't done anything wrong, and it isn't a hassle. You just didn't finish the process. You added the link to Adaptive learning but you didn't remove the orphan tag from Smart Sparrow. Just edit Smart Sparrow, and remove the tag, which should be at the very top. Whenever you have resolved any tagged shortcomings in an article, remove the tag. It is unlikely that anyone else will do it for you. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 00:36, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Also worthy of noting, although it technically only takes one link to article space to de-orphan an article, many editors prefer to see a minimum of three links and believe that leaving it an orphan until that is accomplished actually encourages improvement in or creation of other articles and improves the overall well-being of the wiki. There are some cases where it is obvious that this will never happen, which is why there is "some" editor discretion involved. If you think that other articles could link to Smart Sparrow in the not too distant future, I might encourage you to leave the {{Orphan}} tag until there are three links. Technical 13 (talk) 01:57, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

How to make audio version of Wikipedia article

How do I make an audio version of a Wikipedia article? Specifically, I want to make an audio version of the Kenneth Arnold UFO sighting. I have no idea where to start. --XndrK (talk · contribs · count) 21:46, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Easy! you may say the entire article and record the whole thing, or you may use an automated program to do the recording for you. Save the file as an .ogg and upload it to the article you want to use it. Just read WP:WSW for more information. --PrabashWhat? 22:26, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

How can Alice cooper's career span 6 decades?

A 65 old man can't have a 6 decades career unles he started before being 5 years old. How can Alice Coper's career span 6 decades?108.216.57.154 (talk) 19:06, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

108.216, read the article and you'll see how. His career only has to be active from 1969 to 2010, a 41 year period, to cover 6 decades. Spanning 6 decades is different from saying that his career has spanned 60 years. NtheP (talk) 19:15, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
(e/c) Hello. He started at 16 in the 1960s (1); '70s (2); '80s (3); '90s (4); 2000s (5); and 2010s (6). What was not intuitive is that his career spanned only a small portion of the 60s and the 2010s. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 19:16, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
I saw Alice Cooper perform in Saugatuck, Michigan in the summer of 1969. It was a stunning thing to see, as I had never heard of him before.Cullen328 Let's discuss it 00:29, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Summer of '69 - that would make a good name for a song. At that time I was preparing for my first year of school so clearly you are very old ;) Flat Out let's discuss it 05:20, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Well, from my point of view, 61 is quite young, and thank you very much, mate. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 05:29, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

electron spin reversal

why does the plasma field reverse a circuits characteristics by allowing it to be on weather its off or on you turn it off and then restart it in off lol50.93.30.1 (talk) 17:30, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

50, welcome - this page is for questions about editing Wikipedia but you can ask your question at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Science where somebody can probably help you. NtheP (talk) 17:37, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Uploading Album Artwork Image

Usually I don't load images to the commons but I need the artwork for an album. I remember there was a special dialog I used that walked me through it but I can't seem to find that. I remember the dialog I'm thinking of asked me specific questions like "which page(s) will be referencing this" and "is this the original art work and will you be using it just for the article on the album". I tried using the normal dialog at the Commons home page. I was thinking perhaps I just remembered the dialog wrong and at some point I would get to those questions but I didn't. So right now there is an image uploaded in the commons that I think needs to be removed (or needs additional information). That file is: File:RoryGallagherAgainstTheGrain.jpeg Mdebellis (talk) 15:05, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi Mdebellis and welcome to the Teahouse! Commons is strictly for freely usable images only. For copyrighted works, please upload here. Don't worry about the image on commons, an admin there will take care of it. cheers =) ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 15:08, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Hi There! I see you have uploaded an image to Wikipedia Commons. If you don't want the image to be there, you can request it to be deleted, you may notify an admin there of put in a deletion tag. Cheers! --PrabashWhat? 15:14, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks for that link. That is what I was thinking of and I'll bookmark it just in case I need it again. Mdebellis (talk) 15:50, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Just a quick note that copyrighted image must be smaller than the one you accidentally uploaded to commons. I usually use the one on iTunes. Here it is. ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 15:16, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
I have tagged the non-free Commons image for speedy deletion. Mdebellis, the only place I can see that such an image would be fair use for is in the article on the album and Against the Grain (Rory Gallagher album) already has a fair use image in use. It might be possible to replace the current one with the other and delete the current, if there was some good reason for doing so, but having two fair use images for one album would normally fail WP:NFCC#2(a) for minimal usage and would not be allowed. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 15:45, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks. Now I get it. I do think there is a good reason to use a different image although its not a major deal. The original album art work is what I want to use. It was a picture just of his famous Stratocaster guitar showing the wood grain that was very distinctive, all worn out from constant use. The look of that guitar was something he was known for. It really was indicative of who he was and the play on words of the album title makes more sense with that picture. The one there now is a new picture by some record company. You can still see the grain of the guitar but I think its a lot clearer with the original picture. Mdebellis (talk) 15:50, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
What I need, I think is to remove the current image (a new picture from a CD release) and replace it with the image I want (the original art work image). Is that doable? Mdebellis (talk) 16:06, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
Sorry I think I was wrong about the image size. Let me get back to you on that ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 16:07, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
I assumed that it would get compressed down into the appropriate size. Some systems do that so its better to start with a big picture so the detail is there if you need it. That was my thinking anyway. Either way the iTunes suggestion is a good one. If I need to do this again (hopefully i won't) that is where I will look and I've downloaded the iTunes image in case I am able to replace the existing art work image in this case. Mdebellis (talk) 16:16, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Please ignore what I said about the size; as long as it's less than 300px it should be fine. I should have linked you to the original image on iTunes which is as big as the one you uploaded. I just think that reliable sources should be used, not from blogspots. Have you uploaded it to Wikipedia? consider adding it with {{Template:Extra album cover}} let me know if I can help with anything else. ⊾maine12329⊿ talks✿wiki 16:13, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

  1. ^ Cite error: The named reference top earners was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
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