Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates/André Messager/archive1

TFA blurb review[edit]

André Messager (30 December 1853 – 24 February 1929) was a French composer and conductor. His compositions include eight ballets and thirty opéras comiques, opérettes and other stage works, among which his ballet Les Deux Pigeons (1886) and opéra comique Véronique (1898) have had lasting success; Les P'tites Michu (1897) and Monsieur Beaucaire (1919) were also popular internationally. Messager took up the piano as a small child and later studied composition with, among others, Camille Saint-Saëns and Gabriel Fauré. He became a major figure in the musical life of Paris and later London, both as a conductor and a composer. Many of his Parisian works were also produced in the West End and some on Broadway; the most successful had long runs and numerous international revivals. He wrote two operatic works in English, and his later output included musical comedies for Sacha Guitry and Yvonne Printemps. As a conductor, Messager held prominent positions in Paris and London, at the head of the Opéra-Comique, the Paris Opéra, the Orchestre de la Société des Concerts du Conservatoire, and the Royal Opera House, Covent Garden. Although as a composer he is known chiefly for his light works, as a conductor he presented a wide range of operas, from Mozart to Richard Strauss, and he acquired a reputation as a conductor of Wagner. In Paris he conducted the world premieres of Debussy's Pelléas et Mélisande, Massenet's Grisélidis and Charpentier's Louise. At Covent Garden, he gave the British premieres of operas by Saint-Saëns and Massenet. Messager's music became known for its melodic and orchestral invention, musical craftsmanship, and characteristically French elegance and grace. Although most of his works have been infrequently revived, historians of music consider him the last major figure in French opéra comique and opérette. (Full article...)

Ssilvers and Tim riley: I'm doing blurbs for 2018 FACs but having a hard time with this one ... interested? - Dank (push to talk) 03:06, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Hi. This is basically the whole Lead section, right? What generally needs to be done to convert a Lead to a TFA blurb? Does it simply need to be shorter? If so, I think you could cut down the description of his education to say simply: He studied composition with, among others, Camille Saint-Saëns and Gabriel Fauré. In the next sentence after that, you could cut "both as a conductor and a composer". I think you could cut the sentence that begins "In Paris he conducted the world premiers of...", as well as the following sentence beginning "At Covent Garden..." If you still need to cut more, you could cut the clause: "Although most of his works have been infrequently revived", and start the sentence with "Historians of music..." But please do wait for Tim to weigh in, as he is more experienced with TFAs, especially in the classical music area. Ssilvers (talk) 03:55, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks ... yes that's the whole lead above. Tim? - Dank (push to talk) 04:01, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - Greetings! I'll ponder and report back. Tim riley talk 09:53, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - Would something like this do? I've pruned details of his conducting career and rejigged the stuff about his stage works. This weighs in at 165 words:

André Messager (30 December 1853 – 24 February 1929) was a French composer and conductor. His best-known works are the ballet Les Deux Pigeons (1886) and the opéra comique Véronique (1898). His stage works span the period from 19th-century operetta such as Les P'tites Michu (1897) to 20th-century musical comedy, including Monsieur Beaucaire (1919). His later output included stage shows for Sacha Guitry and Yvonne Printemps. Many of his works were also produced in the West End and some on Broadway, some with long runs and numerous international revivals. He became a major figure in the musical life of Paris and later London, both as a composer and as a prominent conductor in the concert hall and opera house. His music was known for its melodic and orchestral invention, musical craftsmanship, and characteristically French elegance and grace. Although most of his works have been infrequently revived, historians of music consider him the last major figure in French opéra comique and opérette. (Full article...)

If there were room for 12 more words it might be eye-catching to add to the blurb that he was the only Frenchman to compose a Savoy Opera – Mirette (1894). This could go in before or after the Guitry and Printemps sentence. @Ssilvers:, @Dank:, what think you? Tim riley talk 10:28, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Very nice! On the assumption that it won't run on his birthday, I removed the birth and death dates ... now we're down to 1028. I hate to niggle, but if you can find a word somewhere to axe, axe it, to get us below 1025. - Dank (push to talk) 14:33, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Well, unless my partner in crime objects, I think we could lose "organist, pianist" from the first sentence. Tim riley talk 18:42, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Done. - Dank (push to talk) 18:51, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Comment, arising from pure ignorance on my part: I don't think I ever knew there was a 1,025-character limit for TFA blubs, and I wonder if it might be helpful to other editors to mention that limit when opening the discussion about the blurb. Just a thought. Tim riley talk 18:57, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I usually do ... I just figured you were an old hand at this :) - Dank (push to talk) 19:07, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Flatterer! But fine. And thank you for your ongoing skill at getting the TFAs into shape. Tim riley talk 20:08, 6 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Happy to follow Tim's advice here! -- Ssilvers (talk) 01:28, 7 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]