Wikipedia talk:Noticeboard for India-related topics/Archive 59

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More help needed!

First off, let me say that I love you guys. You're always willing to come in and help with articles that I list here, which is really appreciated since in many of these instances the coverage isn't in English and your input can either help show notability where it otherwise wouldn't have been seen or confirm that something isn't notable. I can't tell you how valuable all of you are to Wikipedia. I know that I come here often looking for help and I just feel that you guys deserve some solid back pats for helping whenever you have a free moment, since I know that India-related articles are frequently deleted and/or brought up for deletion and as such, you guys are kept pretty busy.

Now that said, I do need to ask for more help. (Sorry! The first paragraph is genuine and not a way to butter you guys up!) I recently declined a speedy deletion for Amrutha Anand, a woman who is said to hold a world record for holding a specific yoga pose for an impressively long period of time. I don't know if the record site is usable as a RS and English language coverage for her seems to be non-existent for the most part, so I was wondering if there was coverage in Hindi or any other language. I've directed the user towards here as well, so you may get a message from them. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 07:20, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

Not likely in Hindi, didn't find. Can't say about Tamil. --AmritasyaPutraT 17:37, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

Vyasa: Talk:Vyasa#Definition of Vyasa

There is a dispute on Vyasa on should "Vyasa" be defined as "a title given to the sage or Rishi who divides the Hindu holy scripture Vedas in every Dvapara Yuga of every Yuga cycle" OR an individual who is "the author of the Mahabharata, as well as a character in it ... the scribe of both the Vedas and Puranas." Please add your input. --Redtigerxyz Talk 13:09, 16 February 2015 (UTC)

Caste prejudices

Should Wikipedia dutifully document all the caste prejudices that may have existed, as it does here:Chitpavan Brahmin? Kautilya3 (talk) 19:21, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

Can you please quote the disputed lines, Kautilya3. "caste prejudices" may mean different things to different people (read castes). --Redtigerxyz Talk 10:02, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
I mean this sentence in the lead: Until the 18th century, however, the Chitpavans were not esteemed in social ranking, and were indeed considered by other, older Brahmin tribes as being an inferior caste of Brahmins. It is one thing to talk vaguely about rank, but this is going too far. Kautilya3 (talk) 10:16, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
If RS references say so, it should be mentioned. As far as I have read about Chitpavans, while verifying references in GA Deshastha Brahmin and copyediting it, I read that the Deshasthas did consider them inferior and when the Peshwa title passed from the Deshasthas to the Konkanasthas, the latter flourished and gained social prestige. --Redtigerxyz Talk 10:29, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
The sources probably say it, but the question is really, "is it encyclopedic language?" Are we going to write down everything people thought about the Dalits till the 18th century, for example? Kautilya3 (talk) 10:41, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
It seems to be encyclopaedic language to me: the tone is fine. I think what you are asking is whether the content is too trivial to be worth a mention, in which case my answer would be "no, it isn't". Articles that concern castes should reflect what sources say about them and the historic aspect is as relevant to an article as the contemporary. In particular, the interplay between castes is a significant factor in explaining why the constructs exist at all. Look, for example, at the Nair article and how it treats them with regard to the Nambudiri Brahmins. - Sitush (talk) 10:59, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Help with Hindi at Prabhudayal Vidyarthi

I have just pruned Prabhudayal Vidyarthi, which was full of original research/synthesis based on letters written by Gandhi etc. Looking at the contributions of the article creator, and in particular their now-deleted uploads of images from a personal collection, it seems likely that the article is hagiographic in nature due to a family connection.

The guy is notable because of his politician status but I would appreciate it if someone could verify the statements that are sourced to Hindi newspapers such as ejagran (the urls are valid but I cannot read the content). Thanks. - Sitush (talk) 13:59, 7 February 2015 (UTC)

It seems that more of the same has been added today. - Sitush (talk) 14:47, 9 February 2015 (UTC)
I read the first reference and found it difficult to match the content.It is only written he went to such and such place at age 10, that is not exactly "to participate in Indian Freedom Struggle". The event was conducted by Gandhiji and was about independence... but I would not automatically summarize it that way. We should have equal references in English if all that content about him is accurate. --AmritasyaPutraT 17:32, 9 February 2015 (UTC)
Thank you. Someone else has also commented on the article talk. - Sitush (talk) 11:01, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Actors

Why are some Indian actors covered by Wikiproject India, and others are not? What is the group's position on actors? Also, I would be glad to receive comments at Wikipedia:Peer review/Shah Rukh Khan/archive2. BollyJeff | talk 13:26, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Early Janjuas as a reliable source

I have started a discussion about at Hussain Khan's Chronicles of Early Janjuas here at the Reliable Sources Noticeboard. I would appreciate any thoughts people might care to leave there. - Sitush (talk) 07:10, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

Rabindranath Tagore

The article has been an FA since 2006, and on a quick glance seems to be in decent shape. However it may need to be reviewed and updated to retain its FA status (see note on talkpage. Can some knowledgeable and interested editors take a look? Pinging @Saravask, Dwaipayanc, and Ragib: in particular who have been previously active on the page but are currently hibernating.Abecedare (talk) 18:34, 12 February 2015 (UTC)

Indic Scripts

Myself Sumedh Tayade (talk) 16:14, 12 February 2015 (UTC) Hi, I have been pointed out by NeilN to not indicate the name of Kalyan City in Marathi language which is Kalyan's official language, Please explain me about this.

@Sumedh Tayade: Multiple editors have pointed you towards WP:INDICSCRIPT. Have you read it and the discussions that it is based on? --NeilN talk to me 16:39, 12 February 2015 (UTC)
@Sumedh Tayade: I reverted your edits to Bal Thackeray and Raj Thackeray too. You added them back without replying. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 10:21, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
Also read Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Sumedh_Tayade_and_WP:INDICSCRIPT Delibzr (talk) 15:59, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

Verification of website at Arvind Kejriwal

Per the request at Talk:Arvind_Kejriwal#Semi-protected_edit_request_on_10_February_2015_b I removed the website pending verification based on being cautious about BLP. Can someone who is familiar with the person and such websites review and restore or include the proper website? -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 18:56, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

The talk request was correct. The Contact Us page of that site clearly states that it is not official. - Sitush (talk) 18:57, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
Yes, the website is UNOFFICIAL but the content is AUTHENTIC. This is what I concluded from my review. Rest is left to the best of your discretion. Felt free to add. -- Anand2202 (talk) 05:47, 11 February 2015 (UTC)
We can use section of External links. Fundarise (talk) 03:11, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

Suggestions regarding 'Education in India' family tree

Hi, Listing all Educational institutes in India by city or town is going to clutter the category very badly in future. I believe that we should be following a definite hierarchy-> 'Education in India' at top, which contains sub-categories for 'Education in India by States'. Than for each state, there will be further drill down into city-town level education. that was we would have better navigation, and better tracking for the missing content. Vishal0soni (talk) 11:14, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Vishal I agree with your proposal, seems more managed. Delibzr (talk) 11:20, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Swami Mukundananda (2)

Dear India experts: This old AfC submission will soon be deleted as a stale draft. Is this a notable subject, and should the page be kept and improved? —Anne Delong (talk) 04:07, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

Pinging @Redtigerxyz:. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 08:20, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Anne Delong, on first glance the person does not seem to be non-notable and seems to an important disciple of Kripalu Maharaj. There is some coverage of this person in neutral sources and lot of coverage in Kripalu Maharaj related sites. I suggest let the article be moved to mainscape. Afd can be initiated in the future, if notability is in question. --Redtigerxyz Talk 10:25, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
I resubmitted, the title looks weird though, and the namespace too, shouldn't it be in Draft space? --AmritasyaPutraT 11:15, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, Redtigerxyz and AmritasyaPutra. I removed most of the honorifics and added a couple of extra references. It was hard to find them among the massive number of press releases and event announcements. I couldn't find anything beyond sales sites about his books, and I was surprised to find very few reports after his various visits, but I may not have been looking in the right places. The reason that the draft was in "Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation" is that it was written before the Draft space was available. It's in mainspace now.—Anne Delong (talk) 14:02, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Appreciate that. Thank you. --AmritasyaPutraT 14:06, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Category:Indian actors in Hollywood

There is a discussion about deleting this category. If you have any opinion about that, pro or con, please weigh in. Liz Read! Talk! 18:39, 21 February 2015 (UTC)

Buddinni

Having cleaned up some formatting and removed some inappropriate links, the article still could use more cleanup and verification from a knowledgeable editor. Just notifying here, if anyone is interested in the topic. GermanJoe (talk) 04:51, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Translation request (Telugu language)

Hello board, please help translate the following from English into Telugu:

  • Please do not contribute text in Telugu to English Wikipedia. Your contributions are more than welcome at the Telugu Wikipedia.

It will be used to create a template at WP:NOTENGLISH.– Gilliam (talk) 14:45, 21 February 2015 (UTC)

  • Namaste and welcome back to WikiProject India noticeboard. I personally do not know Telugu (I can help with Bengali). I'll ask a friend to help here. Regards. --Tito Dutta (talk) 15:37, 21 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi, Tito Dutta thanks for reaching out to me. Gilliam here is the translation of the message in Telugu.

  • నమస్కారం. ఇది ఆంగ్ల వికీపీడియా కావున ఇక్కడ తెలుగులో సమాచారం చేర్చకండి. మీరు తెలుగులో రచనలు చేయాలనుకుంటే తెలుగు వికీపీడియాలో చేయండి. తమరి రాక మాకెంతో సంతోషం సుమండీ!

I have improvised it a bit to speak in a lighter vein to the Telugu speaker. Let me know if you need any further help.--Vishnu (talk) 07:26, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

 Done Thank you very much. The new template is at Template:Contrib-te1 for review.– Gilliam (talk) 10:58, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Feedback appreciated

I would appreciate some feedback about the draft at User:Sitush/sandbox3 before I move it into article space. There are one or two queries that I need to resolve, and I am still trying to get hold of a copy of the book mentioned in the Further reading section before writing the lead.

In particular, I'd like opinions regarding whether it reads too much like an essay and any tips for additional sources and additional themes. I'm not even sure of the best title to use when the move happens, so thoughts on that would also be useful.

Comments at User talk:Sitush/sandbox3, please. - Sitush (talk) 20:19, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

What is the topic? -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 20:22, 19 February 2015 (UTC)
Conduct and limitation of Raj census operations: why, what, how. - Sitush (talk) 20:26, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Great article but you do not mention Ghurye at all. He was considered the foremost authority on caste for good part of the 20th century.Jonathansammy (talk) 23:20, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

He was indeed but I cannot recall his take on the census. I'll re-read him. - Sitush (talk) 01:33, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Nashik Sandbox Review.

Few students from Nashik are trying to improve coverage about Nashik on Wikipedia. As of now they are using Sandbox. Kindly have a look at sandbox - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Nashik/Sandbox AbhiSuryawanshi (talk) 18:14, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

Great. However, a lot of the content needs to be changed. There is plenty of OR, as well as tone related issues. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 08:07, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Images of Pune and Mumbai

Hi, I will be doing a lot of travel in and around the cities of Pune, Pimpri-Chinchwad, Navi Mumbai and Mumbai in the next two months. If anyone has any specific image requests, please do let me know or post it on this page. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 08:22, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

@Rsrikanth05:, Chinchwad's most famous temple, the Ganesha temple "Morya Gosavi Mandir" established by Morya Gosavi and the sage's samadhi's temple.--Redtigerxyz Talk 08:42, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
@Rsrikanth05: Images of Bombay House located at Fort, Mumbai would be a good option.--Skr15081997 (talk) 08:54, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
Noted down. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 09:55, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Indian rupee symbol

Hi all, please have a look at Template talk:Indian Rupee#Changing from image to unicode where I have initiated a discussion. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 21:21, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Looking for Hindi Wikipedia administrators' noticeboard or admins at Hindi Wikipedia

I'm looking for either. There is a sock at WMF active at here, at simplewiki, commons, and now Hindi. I can't find anything at Hindi except the sock's self-promo pages. Could someone please help? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:06, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

RFC at 2012 Delhi gang rape

Considered input on whether the victim's name should be mentioned in the article, would be appreciated. Abecedare (talk) 16:46, 5 March 2015 (UTC)

Commented. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log)

RFC at Bharatiya Janata Party

Views either way in On _Godhra_train_burning, would be appreciated.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 16:58, 5 March 2015 (UTC)

Audio recordings

Hello! I have recently rewritten the article on Aspirated consonant. Many Indian languages have aspirated stops (t, th, p, ph, etc.), and it would be wonderful to add some audio illustrations to the article, showing how these consonants sound. I've been asking around to find someone who would be willing to record audio examples of Hindi words, but have not got any responses yet.

I thought I would ask here: are there native speakers of Hindi who would be willing to record audio illustrations of aspirated consonants? It would be wonderful to include other languages like Bengali, Marathi, and Gujarati, or any other Indian language with aspirated consonants, but I only have a set of examples from Hindi. — Eru·tuon 22:43, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

@Erutuon: I can do that, let me know what you want recorded, in which format. I can do for the other languages you mention too. --AmritasyaPutraT 01:54, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for responding! I'll write a message on your talk page with the specifics. — Eru·tuon 02:16, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
@Erutuon: I am a native speaker; would like to help. Please post your requirements on my talk page. — isoham (talk) 15:02, 5 March 2015 (UTC)
@ISoham: Sorry for the slow response. I appreciate the offer, but regrettably the examples have already been recorded. If I do some work on Hindustani phonology and find more examples to be recorded, I'll let you know. — Eru·tuon 01:26, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

Seeking articles on India in the late 1960s

Greetings, Wikiproject India. I'm looking for articles about India in the late 1960s—let's say, 1965–1970—which might give an overview on society, government, foreign policy, economics, etc. "History of the Republic of India" does not offer much in the way of content or links. "First Indira Gandhi ministry" is only a list of ministers. Indira Gandhi#First Term as Prime Minister between 1966 and 1971 is pretty limited. Is this pretty much all there is? And if so, would it be reasonably to significantly expand "First Indira Gandhi ministry"? Or should there be a new article, such as "History of the Republic of India 1964–1971" (or some other reasonable periodization)? Thanks in advance for your opinions. groupuscule (talk) 22:16, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

A very good book to look at is India After Gandhi: The History of the World's Largest Democracy (2011) by Ramachandra Guha. Rjensen (talk) 22:24, 2 March 2015 (UTC)
IMO most of the Indian history articles could use enormous expansion, coupled with branching into more specific articles where there is too much content. To me the logical split is to do it by administration, so the article would be "First Indira Gandhi Administration" or something like that, with appropriate redirects. The ministry itself may or may not require a separate article; I'm not certain how much coverage it has received. Guha is an excellent source for an overview, and to understand the base for a more detailed article, but for the details themselves, specific journal articles are probably a better option. Vanamonde93 (talk) 00:18, 3 March 2015 (UTC)
OK thanks for the advice. Does her first "Administration" extend from 1966 through 1977 (including Emergency)? The idea of starting a new article on this topic is a bit daunting. Part of my conundrum is that, necessarily, a lot of the material at the Indira Gandhi article covers political happenings during this period. This was one reason—and this is my usual instinct—the desire to narrow the focus a bit. But 1966 in India, etc. might be a bit too narrow. Maybe it does make sense to start with Indira Gandhi#First Term as Prime Minister between 1966 and 1971, currently a top-level section containing four sentences, and see where that goes. shalom, groupuscule (talk) 03:25, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

Issues on Hinduism

The main article, Hinduism, in its current state contains a lot of errors, including the misrepresentation of sources. It requires a strict review. Kindly view the conversation at Talk:Hinduism#Article issues. Delibzr (talk) 02:52, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

I've seen the issues. Now you have discussed them for a while, you should try an RfC and highlight your specific points. Thanks. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log) 03:41, 2 March 2015 (UTC)
@OccultZone: Just opened a Rfc. Feel free to have your comment. Delibzr (talk) 06:57, 8 March 2015 (UTC)
 Done Took some time to examine the major shift. Thanks. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log) 08:00, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Expert help needed: POI & OCI

Could some knowledgeable person take a look at the following articles Persons of Indian Origin Card, Indian nationality law and Non-resident Indian and person of Indian origin - and update these articles (and links) in light of the changes following the Person of Indian Origin Card (PIO Card) Amendment Scheme, 2014, and the merger of the Person of Indian Origin (PIO) and the Overseas Citizen of India (OCI) categories (see: [1], [2]). There also still seems to be a lot of outdated information on the web regarding this - including on many official Government of India websites. Any information or sources prior to January 2015 may now be outdated. Chris Fynn (talk) 19:14, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

@CFynn: I'll have a look at it. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 10:03, 26 February 2015 (UTC)
@Rsrikanth05: Thanks Chris Fynn (talk) 17:42, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Translation request (Punjabi language)

Hello board, please help translate the following from English into Punjabi:

  • Please do not contribute text in Punjabi to English Wikipedia. Your contributions are more than welcome at the Punjabi Wikipedia.

It will be used to create a template at Template:Notenglish.– Gilliam (talk) 07:42, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

  • Namaste and welcome back to WikiProject India noticeboard. Unfortunately (here too) I do not know Punjabi language, but I'll ask a native Punjabi speaker. Best, Tito Dutta (talk) 08:28, 7 March 2015 (UTC)
Per Tito's communication, I have pinged some Punjabi Wikipedians for help on this.--Vishnu (talk) 11:08, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
"ਮਿਹਰਬਾਨੀ ਕਰਕੇ ਅੰਗਰੇਜ਼ੀ ਵਿਕੀਪੀਡੀਆ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੰਜਾਬੀ ਨਾ ਲਿਖੋ। ਤੁਸੀਂ ਪੰਜਾਬੀ ਵਿਕੀਪੀਡੀਆ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਪਣਾ ਯੋਗਦਾਨ ਪਾ ਸਕਦੇ ਹੋ।" Here's the translation.--Satdeep Gill (talk • contribs 12:59, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
 Done Thank you kindly for your assistance. The new template can be seen here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gilliam (talk • contribs) 22:26, 10 March 2015‎ (UTC)

Translation request (Gujarati language)

Hi again. At Special:Newpages we are getting some articles in Gujarati as well. Kindly translate from English into Gujarati:

  • Please do not contribute text in Gujarati to English Wikipedia. Your contributions are more than welcome at the Gujarati Wikipedia.

Regards,– Gilliam (talk) 03:39, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Thanks to User:Sir Nicholas de Mimsy-Porpington for the help. Here is the translation: "મહેરબાની કરી ને ઈંગ્લીશ વિકિપીડિયા માં ગુજરાતી લખી ને ફાળો ના આપો ! તમારો ફાળો ગુજરાતી વિકિપીડિયા માં વધુ આવકાર્ય છે."--Vishnu (talk) 11:30, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
Linking Gujarati Wikipedia:
 Done Many thanks for the help. The new template may be viewed here: Template:Contrib-gu1.– Gilliam (talk) 03:13, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

Lingala, Krishna

Dear India experts: I accepted this village article at AfC, but it appears there may be more than one village with this name in Krishna District. Can someone more familiar with Indian geography please check and see whether this article needs merging or disambiguating? Thanks. —Anne Delong (talk) 15:46, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

Creation of Indian Infobox Templates:

Hello, I think we should make our own Infobox Templates Like Indian States, Indian Union Territories etc. Please submit your views on this topic.Prymshbmg (talk) 11:46, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

@Prymshbmg: Would suggest that you start an RfC. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 12:17, 17 March 2015 (UTC)

Vijender Kumar: A consensus is needed in afd discussion

Vijender Kumar who recently became VC of Law University in Assam following the hunger strike of students and agitations in the University is being discussed in afd. A better consensus is needed. So far, most of the views are to "keep" it. Please contribute. Thank you. Educationtemple (talk) 22:14, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Dicussion at Delhi rape page

Hi, a discussion is ongoing on the talk page to determine consensus as to whether the victims name should be included or not. Please have a look at Talk:2012 Delhi gang rape‎. Thank you. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 13:58, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

I think this discussion is concluded now - with the views as last updated by Gandydancer in the article. Educationtemple (talk) 22:32, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Translation ?

Rsrikanth05 was kind to endorse the inclusion of the audio documentary entitled "Wo Desh Ki beti (Nation's Daughter)" in the above article (see under Legacy). The original work is in Hindi. I feel that it would add value if someone translate this poem in English too, and Present in the same way the "Hindi" work is presented since the topic is fairly International.

This documentary (Original Name "Wo Desh Ki Beti - Nation's Daughter"; see video) has become more important after the "India's Daughter" controversy. I see several translation request above on this page. I wonder if such translations of the original work from Hindi to English could be done here on WP as a community activity by learned Indian / Foreign Editors well versed in Hindi and English? Views?? Note: I tried using google translator, but it was horrible translation! Educationtemple (talk) 22:41, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

WikiProject India En workshop

Please note

Feel free to discuss any plan here, but, please note, this is just the initial proposal (draft 0.1). The actual detailed schedule, work-plan will be planned on Meta only after finalizing the event. Contacting WMF etc. will be done after that too.
Also note, your comment here does not guarantee your selection in the event (specially if you are living outside India, it might be complicated.

I think it would be of WikiProject India's interest to conduct a National Level en-WP workshop and peer review session to discuss and try to find solutions to some of the most critical issues plaguing the project. These include caste, religion conflicts, availability of sources, establishing notability,paid editing, CoI editing etc. As the En community is the largest and one of the most important wing of the WMIN chapter, such a workshop would be productive IMO. I request community input and discussion about the proposal. Cheers, ƬheStrikeΣagle 11:23, 10 March 2015 (UTC)

Discussion

  • Endorse: I endorse your proposal. It was discussed during or after ICC 2014, Swatantra 2014 and the recent Wikipedia TTT 2015. It should be very helpful. --Tito Dutta (talk) 11:27, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Support --AmritasyaPutraT 02:33, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Support: I like the idea of a workshop restricted to en.wiki issues and more importantly per Tito. :) Amitrochates (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
I have come across CoI editing although it isn't very ubiquitous in Indic topics, at least in the articles I watch. Our discussions on other critical issues such as religious or ethnic conflict would probably be more productive if we discuss issues pertaining to Indian history (contemporary included) at the workshop. I mean stuff like what texts on Indian history are acceptable as reliable sources, how do we evaluate due weight etc. It seems simple enough but many recent dispues have convinced me it isn't. Regarding availability issues, I haven't yet taken AmritasyaPutra up on their offer. But this could be a possible solution to our problem. And of course we don't need a workshop to advertise this. Amitrochates (talk) 16:47, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Endorse Well, it's a fine idea but can you gather enough number of participants for this sort of off-wiki discussion? Handful of editors discussing things offwiki will not really help and long time, experienced editors should be invited and in some cases travel funding should be provided. Jim Carter 16:56, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • can you gather enough number of participants... -- That's a challenge. Let's try it for the first time. Let's see how it goes. travel funding should be provided — travel, accomodation etc will be taken care of. --Tito Dutta (talk) 17:03, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • The proposal made by Tito is worth pursuing and the suggestion endorsed by User:Jim Carter is a positive step. To start with a tutorial kind of a short note on the importance of referencing, tools for editing, and other aspects of notability etc and the suggestions made by User:Amitrochates and others in this page could be included. This note could be then sent to all the Indian registered users on English Wikipedia. A national workshop or seminar, only for Indian Wikipedians in English could be organised, in Bangalore, if funds could be found. --Nvvchar. 08:01, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Endorse I believe the proposal has a lot of merit. AFAIK, the Indian English community is one of the underworked communities and needs a boost to restore ourselves to our former glory. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 14:02, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Comment

  • Comment: I hope this is a discussion about the proposal instead of support/oppose count. Honestly I haven't come across CoI or paid editing yet. Establishing notability and availability of sources is genuine problem, feedback to the library might help, what are the other possibilities? I believe that few of us have access to good resources, in fact I advertise that I am open to help with providing reference material but I rarely see any request for the same. Regarding caste conflict Sitush can give guidance, I have zero inputs regarding this. Religion or racist conflict is perhaps there in negligible amount and it is more from editors who will not be attending the India workshop. ;-) What are the possible ways to eliminate it? --AmritasyaPutraT 15:07, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • [[User:AmritasyaPutra, User:Sitush has not replied so far. I feel, we have enough issues and topics to conduct a half dozen events. The exact program details will be planned only after finalizing the event. Regards. --Tito Dutta (talk) 16:20, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment: Great idea in principle. Imho a mite too ambitious a scope. It may be best to reduce it & do it by part or somethings will only get lip service. Ideally these things are done on wiki. Off wiki consensus doesn't count as far as WP is concerned. How do we take this into account? AshLin (talk) 15:34, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • That's a good question and that's what I was saying to WMF and other teams for last few months. Off-wiki team can never force a consensus on the on-wiki community. On the other hand real-life events are surely a much better way to a) gather data,b) understand issues, c) planning something d) communication. --Tito Dutta (talk) 16:25, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment Any effort that expands and/or improves editor participation always has my support. However I am not clear about:
    1. Who is the intended audience for the workshop? Is is aimed at attracting new editors, or at getting currently active project-members on the same page.
    2. Relatedly, is it meant to be pedagogical (ie, teaching participants about best practices) or meant to formulate best practices through discussion? If the latter, IMO an online discussion may be preferable to an in-person workshop especially, as AshLin points out, off-wiki consensus is not worth much on-wiki, and may even raise concerns of cabal-ism.
As an aside (may or may not be relevant to this discussion): I think the project can do a better job documenting existing institutional knowledge/consensus that editors can be referred to. I am thinking along the lines of the the existing Talk:India/FAQ, WP:INDAFD, WP:NPOV/FAQ#Religion, or more ambitiously WP:VG/S (of course, there is no possibility of paralleling the Video Game project exactly, but it may be possible to create lists of generally accepted/generally unacceptable sources in narrower areas of caste, films, cricket etc). Abecedare (talk) 20:38, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Abecedare, StrikeEagle should answer it as the proposer,anyway,let me try. . . unlike the other Indian language communities the En communities doesn't get much attention from WMF or any body at all. On one hand when Tamilor Malayalam Wikis organize meet-ups and workshops regularly, we the En WP Ind editors are just not organized yet in a systematic way. But that's not an issue.
    We have more than enough issues to call a series of meetings. Probably we'll invite the best Indian En WP editors and non-Indian editors (depending on the budget/fund) here. About attracting a new editors— I personally did not think about it, but yes, we may prepare and release a series of videos, tutorials etc discussing and explaining WP India issue (sessions, lectures and other things), but let's discuss it when we'll reach the bridge. --Tito Dutta (talk) 20:57, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment I like the thought behind this proposal but its nature is unclear. For example, looking at the specific areas mentioned: caste, religion conflicts, availability of sources, establishing notability,paid editing, CoI editing; two are not specific to the WP:IN (paid editing, COI editing); two are directly content related and better discussed on wiki rather than off (caste and religion conflicts). Availability of sources and establishing notability in the Indian context, on the other hand, are definitely worthy topics that can be explored both on wiki as well as off. Of course, there is no bar against discussing content off wiki but discussions amongst a limited subset of editors are unlikely to gain sufficient traction with the broader community of WP:India editors. Finally, of course, there is the issue that being physically present at one of these meetings comes with a loss of anonymity and that does have consequences. All that said, I do like the idea of more off-wiki forums on India matters - substantive ones rather than mere get togethers - being held both in India as well as outside India and am supportive of the general idea. --regentspark (comment) 23:14, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment From my point of view, the greatest contribution a forum like this can make is to explain to the editors and potential editors about what makes Wikipedia tick and how its various policies play a role in achieving its success. The problem we have with many of the contributors from India, and the reason contingencies like ARBIPA have to exist, is that too many editors from the subcontinent don't take Wikipedia policies seriously. We end up having to repeatedly explain what sources are, what reliable sources are, what neutral point of view means etc., even to editors that have been here for several years. So, developing a sense of why these policies exist and how they a play role in some of our top articles could go a long way in alleviating our on-wiki burden. Look at this very recent exchange with an anonymous editor, for example: [3]. Kautilya3 (talk) 00:39, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment I agree wiki policy is not made off-wiki. But my experience suggests that for difficult questions, an intensive face-to-face meeting of at least some active voices to discuss and come up with proposals can move things forward. If one or more good proposals can be created as a result of such a meeting, they can be taken back to the community, on-wiki, for continued discussion and possibly, eventually, adoption. Ijon (talk) 20:31, 15 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Comment It sounds like a good idea. A problem that I often confront here at Wikipedia is that modern, scholarly research of Hinduism paints a picture of (the history of) Hinduism that is totally at odds with the traditional understanding. It seems to be quite shocking for a large minority to be confronted with these challenging views. The response has become quite predictable: it's not true - it's biased - the sources are not reliable - you are wrong. Nevertheless, it's an understandable, human response; the same has happened in Europe over the past few centuries, and is still going on. For me, personally, I've learned again that the best response is to stay calm and polite, provide reliable sources again and again and again, and to stay calm and polite (it's a repetitious circle). I don't know how newbies can be educated on the scholarly views on hinduism, but something in line with Abecedare's proposal of "documenting existing institutional knowledge/consensus that editors can be referred to" might ne bood. Nevertheless, maybe everyone has to undergo this "culture-shock." Maybe it's a life-long process; I'm also still learning how to integrate these scholarly, agnostic views with a religious view. But it seems to be an important aspect of editing on India-related articles. I hope I don't affront anyone with this commentary... Best regards, Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 07:17, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
NB: there are currently several scholars active at Wikipedia; e.g. User:Wujastyk, User:Ms Sarah Welch, User:Mark.muesse. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 10:24, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
We can discuss whether editors should be promoting their own research on Wikipedia at the workshop. Our policy is pretty clear on that though. I did interact with one editor who tried to backdate Indian texts based on his own conference paper. Most editors however manage to avoid blatant COI issues. I will post a reply to rest of your comment on your talk page to avoid cluttering up this space. Amitrochates (talk) 11:39, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
It's not about promoting their own research; on the contrary. Those editors are quite knowledgeable; it might be good to ask them for advice or so, when necessary or usefull. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 13:41, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
So you were pointing out a resource rather than initiating a discussion. Sorry for misreading that. I can't help but link a discussion regarding subject–matter experts in which you were involved.[4] Regards. :) Amitrochates (talk) 14:23, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
From my side also apologies, in case I failed to notice scholarly qualities from other editors. The short overview was in no way meant to be exhaustive. Best regards, Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 14:45, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Translation request (Marathi language)

Looking for a Marathi speaker to address a language concern at Wikipedia:Administrators' Noticeboard/Incidents#RichaChaudhary. If you can help, please visit the thread. Cheers. Ivanvector (talk) 15:32, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Oh, never mind, I found Template:Contrib-mr1. Thanks anyway! Ivanvector (talk) 15:40, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

British Raj Naming

To those concerned over my edits:

I argued that princely states are not part of of British India as British India only includes parts of India that were directly ruled by the British. (See British Raj)

The British Raj (officially the Indian Empire, or simply India) was an:

Imperial political structure comprising (a) British India (a quasi-federation of presidencies and provinces directly governed by the British Crown through the Viceroy and Governor-General of India); (b) Princely States, governed by Indian rulers, under the suzerainty of the British Crown exercised through the Viceroy and Governor-General of India

Is my point clear enough? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zaketo (talk • contribs) 22:59, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Dear Zaketo, why dont you write something on your userpage to get rid of this red colour of your username. It will look nicer, if it is not flagging with red. Also sign your contributions using ~~~~ Educationtemple (talk) 23:12, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Educationtemple, I added something on my userpage just now. Thanks for also reminding me to sign, I always forget! Zaketo (talk) 00:54, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
Context: This discussion concerns how we should refer to birth-places of persons born in pre-independence India in infoboxes. The current approach is to give the birth place as <city>, British India, and User:Zaketo has sporadically been changing it to <city>, <state or province>, Indian Empire over the past few months to which there were objections on his talk-page and requests to establish consensus for the new approach.
  • I think the question of whether Princely states were de jure/de facto part of British India is a fair one, and worth discussing.
  • However, Zaketo can you provide sources for the claim that "Indian Empire" was the official name for British India and the Princely States collectively? You may want to take a look at the related discussion on the British Raj talkpage. Pinging @Sitush, Rjensen, Dabbler, and RegentsPark:, who participated in that discussion.
Abecedare (talk) 02:54, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Hope you can find something in this ancient book Educationtemple (talk) 05:48, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

  • "Indian Empire" was a political form of words that largely fell out of use - do not forget the hoo-hah that surrounded Disraeli's fawning of Victoria (he said "everyone likes some flattery, and when it comes to royalty one should spread it on with a trowel"). "Indian Empire" implies that the Empire was Indian (ie: governed by Indians) when in fact it was a part of the British Empire. "British Raj" is best used to refer to the administration in India after Company Rule rather than to the entity. The entity is nowadays referred to as "British India" because that puts it into context both in time and as a geographical (pre-partition etc) space. - Sitush (talk) 12:35, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
Indeed 'British India' was also just in use, and never the official name of India. India was always "India" or Bharatvarsh (as mentioned in historical books) and even Aryavrath (as mentioned in Indian epics such as Mahabharat etc). Similarly, it was never the Moguls India, Turks India, Moryans India etc. and similarly, it was never Indian Empire or even "British India". If we start changing the name of India to "Indian Empire" or British India etc., we then have to do massive changes in Wiki for example, we have to say that Tajmahal was built in some xyz India but now it is located in India! We also never say that person "A" was born in Jawaharlal Nehru's India and died in Manmohan Singh's India. Moreover, I did not find any official ruling evidence which says that India was officially named as "Indian Empire or "British India" at any time. I think that all the edits by anyone where India is changed to "Indian Empire" or "British India" need to be reverted to "India" Educationtemple (talk) 14:51, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
No, sorry. British India was an extremely different space to "India". Using "India" for people born in what is now Pakistan just leads to a whole load of nationalist pov-pushing and that is precisely the sort of thing that cause discretionary sanctions to be imposed on the topic area. Also, as per the discussion that Abecedare links, we really do not pay much attention to official naming conventions. - Sitush (talk) 15:21, 19 March 2015 (UTC)
  • I am sure that constitutionally/legally, User:Zaketo is correct, i.e., the area under the British Paramountcy was called the "Empire" rather than the "British India." But that distinction fades in time. Right now, we mention places along with their Princely State or Province, before adding British India, e.g., Porbandar, Kathiawar Agency, British India. So, pragmatically, there is no problem of clarity in the nature of the administration in the place. I propose that we let the dead horses lie. Kautilya3 (talk) 09:00, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
It appears that, in terms of substance, what we really need is an article on British Paramountcy. Kautilya3 (talk) 09:05, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
Yes, it would be good to have an article on British Paramountcy, which would also serve as a useful link target when we wish to collectively refer to the areas directly/indirectly controlled by the British. Volunteer? Abecedare (talk) 21:02, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject India/Assessment proposal and possible revival

(first posted on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject India/Assessment/Tag & Assess 2014#Here) Most of you may know that Wikipedia:WikiProject India/Assessment has been stagnant for quite some time with old reassessment requests left as it and new editors occasionally adding their requests thinking it's still active. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 17:51, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Adding using "|reassess=y" instead of special requests

WP:VG had the same problem, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Assessment/Requests. They remedied it by adding a new field to their article tag: "|reassess=y" which automatically adds it to the relevant category. I think this would make our assessment department simpler and quicker; it be able to kick-start it back to life. Category:India articles needing attention which works pretty much the same way. On Template talk:WikiProject India, only minor requests were made and I thought this would be more watched. Thoughts about this?

I have pretty much no idea how this is done so am hoping any admin would comment here too. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 17:51, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Have you got any links to the previous discussions? I would say that this would be a good idea. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log) 17:56, 8 March 2015 (UTC)
As in? links to any such proposals before? No, didn't try searching. I'll also look at these template's history and attempt to find out how its done. If I get lucky I'll report back here. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 06:15, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
I now have a clue as to how to do this by toying around editing Template:WikiProject India/sandbox. It can be proposed as an edit request for an admin to edit the fully locked template. However, such major changes require consensus and I'm unsure about doing it with so little input. I'll put this idea on hold then. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 08:43, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
  • @Ugog Nizdast: If I am understanding it right, under the proposal, a user desiring an article to be re-assessed will add "reassess=y" to {{WikiProject India}} template, which will add the article to Category:India articles needing reassessment. Assuming that is right, two possibly naive questions:
    1. Is monitoring new additions to the category easier than monitoring the page WP:IN1? A watchlist can be used for the latter; is there an analogous way to keep track of new entries to a category (ie w/o periodically going to the category page) ?
    2. (unrelated to your proposal) What is the "attention=y" field in the wikiproject template used for in practice? I went to Category:India articles needing attention and clicked on a random-member (Talk:Gonsalo Garcia) and couldn't figure out what needed immediate attention.
Abecedare (talk) 09:23, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
Yes, you got it right. An editor requesting it will only need to do add that and if they want to add comments like how it was done via manually posting, they can leave a message on the article talk page itself for the reassessing editor.
  1. As far as I know regarding ease in monitoring both, there's not much difference. I found {{PAGESINCATEGORY:India articles needing attention}} and there's also {{Backlog progress bar|initial=219|goal=0 |category=India articles needing attention|unit= articles}}, both which show how many members are there when purged; there must be others but the mechanism will probably be the same.
  2. I'm not been here long enough but when I came across that field, I randomly checked a few and removed that parameter, finding nothing needing immediate attention. It was probably set up for extreme cases and predictably, it was overused and the category must have remained unchecked. There are 219 members currently, I was thinking of sorting through all of them *some day*.
-Ugog Nizdast (talk) 10:22, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the clarifications, Ugog.
Barring any new information/objections I support the proposed change. (I am being a bit trepiditious only because I have not been a regular in the assessment department, so there may be some detail that I may have overlooked. Pinging @AshLin: who has coordinated previous Tag & Assess drives and may have some useful input). Abecedare (talk) 20:06, 11 March 2015 (UTC)
@Abcedare:, I really dont know. We need a tech editor to completely learn the template system so that the spring-cleaning & modification of template of WikiProject India can be done! AshLin (talk) 08:04, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
@AshLin: Just saying I've done the template edit request. I didn't have to do much, all I did was saw in which edit the VG template got the reassess feature and made a similar change request to WP INDIA, after testing it out in the template sandbox. My request was similar to your post back in 2012 at Template talk:WikiProject India#Please amend the template. I was unsure about proposing such a change and am uncomfortable spearheading such a big one. But at least five of you all have given a green signal, so I'm confident this will be okay. You said we'll need to learn the code and spring-cleaning? Can you elaborate? Is there something you see or reason we shouldn't make this change. I'll really like to know, else this is fine, no need to reply here. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 15:08, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
@Ugog Nizdast:. No, I have no evidence, or logic for my concerns just FUD. Imho the template is a patchup of legacy code and if we could have someone who understood this, we could undertake a rewrite/simplification/other much needed tweaks. AshLin (talk) 04:41, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

@VasuVR, Abecedare, and OccultZone: and others interested. My edit request to the template here has been done and it seems to be working fine. There are two articles who inaugurated Category:India articles needing attention. Yay. Now the main Assessment page has to be revamped/updated. Good day to all, Ugog Nizdast (talk) 15:08, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

@Ugog Nizdast: - Excellent work! I have not had the inclination to try to learn this kind of complicated templates. By the way, since I am busy I will not be doing any further assessments for a few weeks nor any edits to Wikipedia either. VasuVR (talk, contribs) 17:04, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
Nice work, Ugog! Abecedare (talk) 20:50, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Help improve to FA India House and Niedermayer-Hentig Expedition

Hi wonder if anybody would be interested to help improve the prose in India House, and help copy edit [[Niedermayer-Hentig Expedition to FA status the last time I was trying to get it to FA status almost six years ago. . rueben_lys (talk · contribs) 17:10, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Request for review

Hi, can any interested user please review my GA nominee Jama Masjid, Delhi. I would be pleased, if anyone does so. RRD13 দেবজ্যোতি (talk) 10:37, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Sellagudapatti,Krishnagiri(DT)

Dear India experts: Here's one more village article which will soon be deleted. I haven't found much in the way of references, but maybe someone here will know where to look.—Anne Delong (talk) 15:46, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Translation request (Nepali language)

Hello board. Could someone translate the following from English into Nepali:

  • Please do not contribute text in Nepali to English Wikipedia. Your contributions are more than welcome at the Nepali Wikipedia.

It will be used to create a template at Template:Notenglish.– Gilliam (talk) 09:41, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Vital articles/Expanded/People

There are very few Indian figures in the above list. I have nominated Raj Kapoor, Mehmood Ali and Devika Rani for inclusion. Please voice your opinions whether they should be included or not. Thanks--Skr15081997 (talk) 14:09, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

Indian railway stations

Shivanshsinghrajpoot has been creating articles on various Indian railway stations, such as Kerakat railway station, which has been nominated for deletion. The Trains WikiProject hold that all railway stations should be capable of sustaining articles, thus the creations are valid and potentially useful. It would appear from his talk page that English is not his first language. Are there any editors who can assist us in working with this editor to improve the quality of the articles on creation. Mjroots (talk) 07:15, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

Tourism in North East India

There was not any special page regarding tourism in entire north east region on India. So I created Tourism in North East India page. Please do support in this project. I'm relatively new on Wikipedia, when I searched on google about Tourism in North East India then I don't see this page in results. What is to be done? --Human3015 18:27, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

The Times of India (1838-2001) available online

Proquest's Historical Newspapers database includes The Times of India from 1838-2001. This will be very useful for our whole project. A request for the database access to Wikipedia editors has been made at Wikipedia:The_Wikipedia_Library/Journals/Requests#ProQuest. Please weigh your opinion on whether it would be helpful or not. Thanks.--Skr15081997 (talk) 12:11, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

  • Namaste and welcome back to WikiProject India noticeboard. Thanks for notifying. I have made some copyedit in the page and updated the link in your post. --Tito Dutta (talk) 17:14, 24 March 2015 (UTC)
Nice to know this. It would be great if we could access the database. Educationtemple (talk) 14:48, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

Collage in Bengali people

There is an ongoing discussion about list of people in the collage at Bengali people. ~ nafSadh did say 22:13, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Lahoti commission document? (Charkhi Dadri midair collission)

The final report of the Charkhi Dadri collision is called the "Lahoti commission." Does anyone know if this document is hosted online? It would be a great resource for the article. WhisperToMe (talk) 17:38, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Violence against Muslims in India

Template:Violence against Muslims in India has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:46, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Baghal Rajput

This article needs some attention from a knowledgeable editor. Thanks! --Randykitty (talk) 09:36, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

PRODed. - Sitush (talk) 10:10, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
Now at AfD because the PROD was removed. - Sitush (talk) 04:55, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Andhra Pradesh Capital City ‎

Seems to be a number of new editors insisting that Andhra Pradesh Capital City should be named "Amaravati" and have been reverted by established editors. Also added hatnotes to Amaravati, Andhra Pradesh referring to same. Anyone know what's happening and what the real story is? Apparently the 'city' doesn't exist yet. One source added, after I challenged the info is http://www.ndtv.com/andhra-pradesh-news/amaravati-will-be-andhra-pradeshs-new-capital-budget-20-000-crores-751648. 220 of Borg 12:55, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

I'd bin the entire article per WP:CRYSTAL and WP:NOTNEWS. It is at the "first draft" of a plan, and capital construction projects often don't work out, especially in India. - Sitush (talk) 13:32, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
Another editor 'updated' with Andhra Pradesh govt approves Amaravathi as new state capital from indianexpress.com. Don't know if that make any difference. I think I'm a bit too involved now. (3RR) I reverted last edit as the editor only changed part of the ref, leaving it with erroneous details. Feel free to nominate it as you see fit Sitush. 220 of Borg 14:51, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
What a mess! There are overlapping articles on:
  1. Andhra Pradesh Capital City
  2. Andhra Pradesh Capital Region
  3. Andhra Pradesh Capital Region Development Authority
  4. Amaravati, Andhra Pradesh
Eventually, only the last one is likely to be worth keeping. The others discuss the topic of "Andhra Pradesh's proposed capital following the Andhra Pradesh Reorganisation Act, 2014" (all of which can be covered in one article documenting the process) and reify it into cities and regions by mis-capitalization. Also note the related recentism/crystal balling issues with the lede and infobox of Andhra Pradesh. The question is whether uninvolved editors can be bothered enforcing WP:CRYSTAL and WP:NOTNEWS, or just choose to wait it out till the whole thing settles in a few years time and then delete the extraneous pages created in trying to keep up with the news. Abecedare (talk) 17:53, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
Merge all into Andhra Pradesh Capital Region for now. Amaravathi is still the proposed name. I don't know where some users get this idea that no new city will get built, but the city is going to pop up in a while. Unlike Chandigarh, Hyderabad is the Joint capital for ONLY 10yrs, as it is physically separated from AP. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 20:51, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
How many past proposals have gone way over the time scale? The Telangana bifurcation was one, IIRC. - Sitush (talk) 04:40, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
I have proposed merging Andhra Pradesh Capital City and Andhra Pradesh Capital Region Development Authority into Andhra Pradesh Capital Region until things settle down. I am less sure about Amaravati, Andhra Pradesh, which at the moment seems just to contain information about the village but obviously is likely to become a problem in the future. The merge discussions are separate - see Talk:Andhra Pradesh Capital City and Talk:Andhra Pradesh Capital Region Development Authority. - Sitush (talk) 04:55, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Semi-protected for a period of 10 days, after which the page will be automatically unprotected. --Tito Dutta (talk) 21:07, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
@Titodutta: Thanks for that, though about 50 mins ago I reverted the 'name' again on 'Andhra Pradesh Capital City', edited by a confirmed account. I warned them about edit warring (again) and suggested they go to the talkpage, where I have started a section on the issue. :-/ 220 of Borg 02:17, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
  • User:220 of Borg, you have done the right thing. Sitush has proposed a merge. Let's see how it goes. If more auto-confirmed users come and make disruptive edits, we'll do something. --Tito Dutta (talk) 05:02, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. Many more important things to do on WP than worry about the name of a city that isn't built yet. At least there should be! :-/ 220 of Borg 12:39, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Kali Bari Chhindwara

I was sent to the article "Kali Bari Chhindwara" to fix a Checkwiki error. I discovered that the large navbox "Kali temples in India & Bangladesh" is defined in this article.

Would somebody from WikiProject India please edit the article:

  • if appropriate, create a separate navbox from the definition in the article;
  • in the navbox definition, please remove the wikilink [[User:Shali Temple]] because it is throwing the Checkwiki error #95 "Editor's signature or link to User space" that sent me to the article in the first place.

Thanks. Knife-in-the-drawer (talk) 10:37, 6 April 2015 (UTC)

Project-related template nominated for deletion

The Article adoption template. By me. Discussion here. Input welcome. Abecedare (talk) 04:43, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

Focus problem relating to Warangal and nearby "cities"

We have a focus problem at a few Telangana articles. Greater Warangal Municipal Corporation describes an administrative body covering Warangal, Hanamakonda and Kazipet. The first of those articles seems to assume that the body is the city of Warangal, but Tri-Cities, Telangana says they are independent (although, presumably, not independent of the GWMC). Meanwhile, the Hanamakonda article says it is a suburb of Warangal, as does the Kazipet article.

Looking at it from a UK perspective, not all of this can be correct and it is causing problems re: statistics etc. Is there a way to rationalise these and perhaps other discrepancies that ultimately seem to relate to a focus/definition issue? I am going to leave a note of this discussion at the talk pages of the various articles linked here. - Sitush (talk) 07:55, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Asian American#Indian American in infobox

You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Asian American#Indian American in infobox. Thanks. RightCowLeftCoast (talk) 18:45, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

Eyes needed

Eyes needed for this page Bhakti Arora Manekar --Tito Dutta (talk) 15:23, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

The sourcing of the article is pretty poor (twitter, facebook, the channel website, and the city supplement of Deccan Chronicle). And frankly, I think such articles should be deleted/redirected as WP:BLP1E unless there is some coverage independent of the original show where the contestant gained fame. But I already have one AFD open with that rationale, so don't want to appear to be leading an "ideological crusade" on the issue. Do others agree with my assessment, or am I an outlier? Abecedare (talk) 18:53, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
I agree with Abecedare. It looks more like personal profile. Its right place is under MasterChef India along-with other contenders. Gaidinliu (talk) 10:59, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Book reviews of The Dynamics of InstitutionaI Change and RuraI Development in Punjab, India (1974)?

I went on a Japanese database and found:

It's a Japanese-language review of an English-language book about the Indian Punjab. I wanted to see if I could find other review articles about that book, but I was unsuccessful. Does anyone know of any more review articles about it? WhisperToMe (talk) 13:21, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

@WhisperToMe: Didn't find any additional sources. The monograph was republished as part of the edited volume:
  • Rural Development and Local Organization in Asia, Volume I: Introduction and South Asia, edited by Norman T. Uphoff, Macmilian, New Delhi, 1982
So may be worth searching for reviews of that later work too, though I didn't find any on a quick search. Abecedare (talk) 14:16, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Location of Aragonda

Could Aragonda once have been a part of Tamil Nadu? Our article says it is in Chittoor district, Andhra Pradesh but that might be a states reorganisation thing. - Sitush (talk) 10:10, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Possible, although will need to somehow dive into the details of the Andhra Pradesh and Madras Alteration of Boundaries Act to verify. Context for question? Abecedare (talk) 10:41, 3 April 2015 (UTC)
Birthplace of Prathap C. Reddy. The article said Nellor, Chittoor, AP but the source that was already there says Aragonda, TN. As per convention, we should use what ever it was called at the time (1933). - Sitush (talk) 10:57, 3 April 2015 (UTC)
In that case it should perhaps be Aragonda, Madras Presidency. Borderline OR, arguably. Abecedare (talk) 12:56, 3 April 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, it is all a bit murky. - Sitush (talk) 04:39, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
 Done The source was wrong. It is indeed in Chittoor district now, Madras presidency then. Fixed. Kautilya3 (talk) 14:16, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. - Sitush (talk) 08:51, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Is khyber.org a reliable source in any case?

He's used this as a source at least once. I'd think not for history. Dougweller (talk) 09:09, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

No, and I'd extend that beyond just an area of history. That said, I haven't looked at this user's insertions and it seems to be a Pakistan-based source, so it might be better asking the Pakistan WikiProject or Pashtun WikiProject. Harej may be able to help if he's active. Ncmvocalist (talk) 09:36, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Sukanya Samriddhi Account

This page, Sukanya Samriddhi Account, seems to have a high level of edits by new WP:SPA accounts, some with obvious COI. They are adding (and re-adding) links to webpage and account 'calculators'. (Some spamming them to other pages as well) Any idea what this is about? Should the page be protected? 220 of Borg 14:14, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

This is a new financial tax-saving product and I think advertisers are trying to take advantage of the people who are visiting the page to understand the scheme. Prad2609 (talk) 06:30, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
@Prad2609: Thanks, I thought it was something like that. 220 of Borg 02:21, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

I did some ce on the article. Also removed promotional links / unreliable blogspot post links and added reliable source citations. Educationtemple (talk) 16:39, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Editor who may need some guidance

I've just reported Jawwad khan marwat (talk · contribs) to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Spam for spamming Kyber.org, adding multiple links to a number of articles today. He's also, at Lohani, added copyvio from that site and material copied from out of copyright books, linking the source but with no indication the material is actually directly copied. I expect there may be more. Unless he is connected to khyber.org he's probably a good faith editor, and has responded already to my complaint, but he's also removed some further reading material at [5]. Does anyone have the time to advise him? Dougweller (talk) 08:26, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Worse than I thought. He's created a series of articles on what he calls the Afghan-Mughal Wars. I'm quickly finding copyvio, eg First Afghan-Mughal War (1526–1529) from [6]. Dougweller (talk) 09:09, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
This website belongs to Omar Usman from Peshawar, Pakistan. Educationtemple (talk) 19:10, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

How do you pronounce "Bangalore"?

Hi! Does anyone know how you're supposed to pronounce Bangalore? If you do, would you mind adding that information to Bangalore, please? Thanks a ton in advance! Red Slash 19:28, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

In the first line itself in the article, this is explained very well. what is your query? Educationtemple (talk) 19:32, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
 Done. But please do not add the comments in the article itself the way you did. Talk pages are there for this. Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 19:51, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Grand Ashura Procession In Kashmir

Took a glance at the article and it has glaring POV, editorializing, and potential WP:OR issues. Not immediately sure if these can be solved by copyediting and, proper attribution and sourcing of opinions, or if they require a fundamental rewrite. Can someone familiar with the subject of the article take a look? Abecedare (talk) 05:20, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

I previously came across this article through Freedom of religion in India when a new editor wanted to add that to it there. I looked at the references given and it became obvious that the addition itself was riddled with POV violations. I tried to fix but was reverted and accused of "vandalism" a year back. After that, I think the editor wanted to add it to lead as well which I objected to Talk:Freedom of religion in India#Mention of Shia Muslims example in the lead. I have little patience in dealing with such editors so I restricted my edits to just the main Freedom of religion page knowing well that there was a potential walled garden there. Now that you've brought it up, I think it's time I tried to clean it. But will need some help in dealing with the new editor(s) 'guarding' it. Shall we? -Joel. Ugog Nizdast (talk) 09:38, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
Agree. See my note at article talk page. And more eyes would be welcome. Pinging User:Titodutta and User:RegentsPark: would help if you watchlisted the page in case semi-protection, "stern admin words", or blocks are needed in the future (not warranted at the moment). Abecedare (talk) 18:30, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
I have rewritten the page to clean out the unsourced, poorly sourced, POV, and OR content and to better reflect the (reliable) cited sources. Reads quite a bit like a news article but perhaps that can't be helped. Reviews and comments welcome on article talkpage, especially with regards to whether the page needs to be renamed. Abecedare (talk) 19:49, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
Wow, you beat me to it. Very well done. Now I regret not pursuing this earlier, well at least it's finally cleaned up. I put it on my watchlist too. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 22:01, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

Adarsh Liberal

Okay. Someone has made an Adarsh Liberal page. Please discuss notability and neutrality of the page. -Kenfyre (talk) 07:09, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

Sukanya Samriddhi Account part II

Despite multiple warnings and reverts by multiple editors, the user @Santanu25: is again and again adding an external link in the article. Can a senior admin take care and intervene for an appropriate solution as per WP policy or remind the user to not do so, if appropriate. Part I of the discussion on this issue is here. Educationtemple (talk) 07:15, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

I've reverted and warned (you can user Twinkle for that) the user. Don't hesitate to do same if the edits continue. Consider reporting the user (or the page for protection) to the Administrator's noticeboard. Good day, Joel. Ugog Nizdast (talk) 09:53, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

Violence against Hindus

Editors may be interested in this discussion, regarding the size of the sidebar. Vanamonde93 (talk) 16:23, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

Indian Biography articles that need attention

What is it all about

I am screening the biography of Indian biologists and science related people. I found that the following articles need attention (either to be send to afd or need serious improvement). I invite the learned editors here to please contribute and take appropriate actions - such as sending the article to afd discussions. I do not want to do it all alone, hence this humble call! Educationtemple (talk) 04:22, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

In Category:Indian biochemists

Sent in afd discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:10, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Dee Datta: Not a notable figure. Not sourced. Not contributed anything notable to Indian Science as per google search. Recommended afd Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Update - 7 April 2015: Article already deleted. Educationtemple (talk) 10:23, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Abbas Ali Mahdi: Notability missing. Sources cited are poor, facebook and google scholar pages. Did not find anything in google about his contributions, that could be added to improve the article. Recommended afd Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:55, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Ananda Prasad - notable figure in zink metabolism, but the article could be improved and more citations could be added. Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd. Educationtemple (talk) 14:27, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

In Category:Indian biotechnologists

  • Aravind L Iyer - Not a notable figure. Article not sourced. Could not find anything in google search. Quick deletion recommended. Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 16:52, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Ajay Kumar Parida - article is in bad shape at present. But he is Padma Shree. It could be improved at least to remove all the red notices from the top of the article. Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:23, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

In Category:Indian immunologists

Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:25, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

In Category:Indian biologists

  • Somdatta Sinha - not a notable figure. I could not find any significant contribution to Indian Science. Could be discussed in afd. Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:17, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
  • C. R. Narayan Rao - article not sourced. Not notable. NO notable contribution. AFD recommended.. Notable enough, need little research and update. Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
  • Niraj Rai - Student of Dr. K. Thangaraj as mentioned in the article. I dont think "He is the first scientist who established ancient DNA research in India" as claimed in the article. Need attention on many claims made in the article - that seems to belong to Dr. K. Thangaraj. Not a notable figure. AFD recommended. Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd. Educationtemple (talk) 14:52, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Atanu Kumar Pati - I checked his CV. It says that he "was" dean of PRSU in 2010-12. The article claims that he is still a Dean. many such facts need to be corrected. Serious improvements needed. May be afd due to lack of notability Educationtemple (talk) 20:07, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd. Educationtemple (talk) 20:29, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd. Educationtemple (talk) 14:10, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:33, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:36, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:43, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
Sent in afd for discussion. Educationtemple (talk) 17:52, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
I think it would be useful to keep your comments here rather than to use transclusion. Like most India-related articles, these tend to be poorly researched (cited using newspapers and web links) but many are notable. It needs a case-to-case examination. I can readily see that C. R. Narayan Rao and S. L. Hora are notable enough. Shyamal (talk) 06:40, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
Agree. I update my comments on these two specific articles, with a view that we try to improve them. Educationtemple (talk) 09:02, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for letting us know. I have a special interest in articles about Nobel Prize winners (not the persons you have mentioned most here) and I will try to improve several of those articles that happen to be about persons from India. -- WeijiBaikeBianji (talk, how I edit) 13:14, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
The one, which are flawed bio, unsupported, not notable and just the promo material, should be sent to afd. I have given my recos above, you can revert them logically, as we did for Hora and CRNR. Rest, I will recommend to be sent to afd with the help of a senior admin. Educationtemple (talk) 19:45, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Restored from archive per Educationtemple's wishes, so that discussion can continue. Abecedare (talk) 06:09, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

7 mouthed pot

7 mouthed pot

Could tell me the name of this musical instrument? It looks like Panchamukha vadyam, but has seven mouths or faces. --AntanO 05:30, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Niraj Rai

I just nominated Niraj Rai in afd discussion. In the mean time can some of you could check if the Image on this article has proper source/license etc. At least, I could not find the one. If so, could someone of you, who is aware of the procedure could speedy delete it? Educationtemple (talk) 15:23, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

  • Educationtemple the image has unclear source/license details. It mentions Facebook as source but we can not see any evidence that it was released in public domain. IMO, it might be nominated for deletion where editors will discuss it. --Tito Dutta (talk) 06:38, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
@Titodutta: - the entire article is being discussed in afd. Educationtemple (talk) 07:01, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Sreelakshmi Suresh - Promotional material with bogus list of 'awards'!

Request the members from India to please comment on - Basically promotional material/shameless self promotion.

Discussion - Sreelakshmi_Suresh - Web_badges/Bogus award list

Article is here - Sreelakshmi_Suresh

Please refer the archived pages too, I mean the 'Talk' page of the article. --LVerina (talk) 13:40, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

The article is very well sourced with appropriate citations. There may be some re-writing required, but it is not a bogus article. Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 13:52, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Let me investigate it properly, if there is something wrong. Educationtemple (talk) 13:57, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

OK. My assessment is over. Not a single line in the article is bogus. Everything is supported with appropriate reliable secondary sources inline to WP standards. In the past, 3-4 afd have been made on the article, every time it survived since everything is as per WP guideline there. Period. Educationtemple (talk) 15:28, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
@Educationtemple: thank you for looking over the article. Mkdwtalk 15:45, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

This article has been routinely reduced and then brought to deletion as "non-notable". As Educationtemple pointed out, it has been brought to AFD four times. This was an article that I and other administrators have been watching over a number of concerns. It draws an usual amount of attention for its subject matter including an SPI that resulted in blocks and the flagging of single purpose accounts. I began actively editing it after being a participant in its first AFD. I've actually written much of the article content including the awards section, so I find the accusation "promotional material/shameless self promotion" very controversial. It's been brought up before: [7] in an edit with the edit summary: "Sad people keep forgetting it, especially when they become seniors". Something seemingly directed at me since it was in the form a reply to my comment. Nonetheless, we're all here to edit Wikipedia and improve it. I'm an editor from Canada and can amusingly state with certainty I have no connection whatsoever to the subject. Moreover, the article has been written in a neutral tone even pointing out discrepancies in the news stories as part of a collaborative effort. Awards, regardless of how they're obtained or their prestige, are noteworthy if a reliable and independent source has mentioned them in an in-depth article about the subject. In this case, multiple publications. I think there are a lot of unsupported assumptions and original research being made on how these awards have been obtained. I don't necessarily like the awards either, but WP:IDONTLIKEIT because of their "ease of acquirement" is not a rationale for removal. Mkdwtalk 15:45, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Additionally, I hereby caution and warn @LVerina: to NOT use inappropriate words of hatred such as shameless etc here on WP. It may result you being blocked on WP. Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 16:09, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
Alright, I apologize for using the word 'Shameless'. But I never meant hatred. I have huge respect to all the editor of Wikipedia and I never tied to vandalize the article in any manner. None of my words were pointed towards Mkdw. I apologize again, if any of the statements made by me hurt him.
Now, regarding the points I mentioned.
1. The main two points, on which the whole story or the Wikipedia article is based on 'Youngest Website Designer' and 'Youngest CEO'. Please feel free to ignore my findings/research or whatsoever completely, but please do a google search and there are enough material and sources stating it wrong. And majority of the sources were published before the person made these two claim. That is one of the reasons I mentioned it as bogus. The source and the person's own interviews mention the name of 'Ajay Puri' many times which the person admit as an inspiration.
2. The long list of awards. Again, 11 of the 14 awards were mere mention by the person/her parents/people behind her and the newspapers quoted them as it is. Again, please search in the internet and I am sure we will not be able to find anything about those 11 awards. They doesn't exist at all. I agree few newspapers published the long list of awards - it was more than 11 before. I remember checking few, and those sites were merely supplying badges (just an image/link) to everyone who apply! This again looks suspicious and that is another reason I mentioned the article as a promotional material
3. Coming to the edits made by Mkdw. Please refer the latest edits by him in which he tried to restore the word 'Since' multiple times even though I clearly mentioned many sources which were published long back. At some point of time, he reverted it very fast without even reading the source and mentioning the person whom the article is about, started webdesign at the age of 3! Actually none of the sources claim such a thing.
4. Regarding my comment - "Sad people keep forgetting it, especially when they become seniors" I am really sorry, but I still feel that is right. The main inetention, which I believe, behind the Wikipedia concept is to provide free and accurate (as much as possible) information to the general public and not to create a lot of articles, just because few newspapers quote the person/their parents/people behind them and print their claims as it is. Of course, if we follow the rules and follow it blindly, we will have a lot of articles, thus giving importance to quantity and not quality. I stand affirm on this. I will not feel sad if any of the admins block/ban me for this reason. --LVerina (talk) 17:15, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • I believe this article should have been deleted (or rather redirected to National Child Award for Exceptional Achievement) because it is largely sourced to fluff "local kid done good" media coverage that mainly reflects what the parent's tell the reporter, rather than independent investigation and evaluation. IMO, we should be much more conscientious in applying WP:BLP/WP:BLP1E/WP:TOOSOON in these situations, so as to not saddle a preteen kid with a permanent wikibio that often ends up covering a passing phase of their childhood. That said, the article has already been through multiple AFDs, and is currently written as "neutrally" as reasonably feasible given the sources we have. So Lverina, I'd strongly urge you to drop the stick and move on. Abecedare (talk) 17:37, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • @LVerina: - be assured you are equally important here as anyone of us - your comments are equally respected and heard. As Abecedare has mentioned, this is exactly the case with this article. Sometimes news paper and media in India function in the manner you and Abecedare highlighted. But, we on wiki can NOT do original research to find out the background stories at our own. That was the reason, this article survived all these years. Coming to your point that most awards do not exist. May be it is true. But you let us know if this is written in any secondary source that the award that the subject of this article claimed to have received do not exist. Just show me one secondary source mentioning this, I myself will add this fact within the article. Show me just one citation stating that the subject and her parents have played a trick to make the subject famous, I will myself add this too in the article. As for your observation about "age of 3", I have already added 'citation needed' template there. Good observation you have made! Thanks for this. Finally, we together too can not do anything specially, since several secondary sources are talking about the subject, it is no concern for us why these sources are doing so, but if some of the secondary sources contradict the claims of other secondary sources in this article, your points will have great meaning, else, best is that you too move on like many others. Educationtemple (talk) 18:05, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • It should be noted the article used to say "age 4" and the reference was removed by LVerina. The ref the tag refers to was removed in the previous edit. The article was a deadlink but was seemingly archived elsewhere and can be verified. I've replaced the citation and returned the cited age to 4. I would like to retract my edit summary; I had incorrectly attributed the removal of the reference to Sanjoy64. I did track down when it became "3" which was done by a SPA. Mkdwtalk 18:15, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Now this is confusing! The source you just added - http://www.aawebmasters.com/GulfTimes.pdf - is a PDF file that is inside another website which is noway related to Gulf Times! I am not sure how can we believe that such a pdf file is genuine as anyone can create such a file and upload to their personal site. If you want to cite Gulf Times, why not a valid link inside that site? Even if we assume it as genuine (personally I do not think so), such a practice is allowed in Wikipedia? Like if I create a similar PDF file stating a different age and upload it to my personal site claiming it is from Gulf Times it will still be accepted as a valid source? No, not to start another war, I am just curious. --LVerina (talk) 18:28, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • LVerina, relax. It's a screen shot of the Gulf Times page. The original link was provided and was used to verify the statement at the time. For whatever reason the page doesn't exist. It's not surprising since the story is 8 years old. Websites change. Archives are often not made available to the public after a certain time frame. That being said, the page was screenshot and archived by a third party for whatever reason. It doesn't appear to be a forgery and in fact cites the very same link that was originally used as reference on Wikipedia at the bottom of the screen shot. Frankly, I think it's even a more dubious process to remove citations and then say things like "Actually none of the sources claim such a thing". Mkdwtalk 18:38, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Guess you didn't get it. I am not arguing for the sake of it. My question is still valid. If I upload a similar pdf with a different age, claiming it as a genuine screenshot, will it get accepted as a valid source in Wikipedia? Now, regarding my words "Actually none of the sources claim such a thing", I guess you went wrong again! Refer the edit summary added by you. It reads - "Reverted to revision 656211522 by LVerina: According to this source: http://www.successstories.co.in/sreelakshmi-suresh-one-of-the-youngest-web-designers-in-the-world/ she was designing at 3" Nowhere in the link it says "she was designing at 3" but you stated so! That is what I meant. Want me to provide links of your edits with edit summary? Just a moment.LVerina (talk) 18:45, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • And interestingly enough, the same AA Webmasters also archived another story about the girl, which also cites "age four" but in this particular case the original page is still hosted by the original news provider: http://www.arabnews.com/node/293715. I'm sorry you don't think these links are genuine but there is no conspiracy here. What possible rationale are you using to think they're not genuine archives? What would possibly motivate them to create a false news story about one of their award winners? I even did a search on the author of the Gulf Times story, Ashraf Padanna, and they're a legitimate journalist for the Gulf Times. Mkdwtalk 18:44, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • OK, I think I got where you are confused! The second link you just mentioned, that is "Arab News", only thing with age 4 I can see is (please correct me if I am wrong) - "Sreelakshmi’s brush with the digital world began at a relatively young age of four" That doesn't mean she started designing websites at the age 4! It may sound pretty silly, but when we talk about the 'Youngest Webdesigner', we need to find sources which mention the age at which she created a website and not the age at which she started learning computers or get introduced to the digital world! LVerina (talk) 18:53, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
LVerina, you need to stop using things like "you are confused!". WP:NPA is very clear. No assertion is being made that at "age four" she became the world's youngest web designer. Therefore no source is required to make that statement true. If you're looking for a source when she started designing. We have one. If you're looking for a source that names her the youngest web designer. We have one for that as well. We're not our own investigative reporting publication. Mkdwtalk 18:59, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
If you meant the Arab News as a source for "she started using computers at the age of 4", then I agree with you, it is sure a valid and genuine source. Regarding the screenshot, I am sorry, technically speaking, I disagree with you. If you provide a web archive that is in the public domain, we may consider it as genuine but if someone upload a pdf file to a private website and claim something, I do not think we can blindly believe it. Again, it is not about the credibility of the journalist or the newspaper you just mentioned but about that private website which has the pdf file.LVerina (talk) 19:02, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
  • I again suggest you dear LVerina: please believe that you are not alone here! We all are with you and it is nothing that you alone have to fight with all wrongs on WP. Before you made this comment, I have done who.is of this website. It is NOT a personal website. It belongs to American Association of Webmasters whose head office is in CA. It has nothing to do with the subject in the article. Thus, this citation is a valid citation, even if it is an uploaded pdf of some other secondary source. It is as good as American Association of Webmasters could have written this news article by itself, thus is a valid citation. If this was not and If this was not the case, I could have been first to delete this, rather Mkdw also could have not added it. Hope this assure you that nothing unsubstantiated can go on wiki specially if it is taken care by independent editors. Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 18:55, 13 April 2015 (UTC)
Sorry about it. My mistake as I was confused on what the source he cited is for. It is clear now and I guess it is time to get some rest :) Thanks Educationtemple and Mkdw. LVerina (talk) 19:15, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

B. R. Ambedkar: temporary protection?

The Ambedkar-page seems to be popular these days. Maybe it should be fully protected temporarily? Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 12:27, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Today is his birthday. Also government holiday for that occasion. Everyone is at home and free Educationtemple (talk) 12:30, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
Someone made the request here at the RPP and it has been protected indefinitely (wow, that's rarely done). -Joel. Ugog Nizdast (talk) 13:44, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
Nice to see that Google acknowledged him with a Doodle. That probably was the main source of traffic to the page. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 17:04, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Draft:Bhutmugli

Hello India experts. Here's another draft article about an Indian village. —Anne Delong (talk) 23:39, 15 April 2015 (UTC)

Peer review request about "(Indian) Copyright Act, 1957" at en wikisource

In last couple of days, at english language wikisource project, I have worked quite a bit on (Indian) Copyright Act, 1957 to update the same to include changes of copyright amendment act 2012. Please note on most of internet as of now Copyright Act, 1957 may not be uptodate with 2012 amendments, and en wikisource would be one of those few (and also free) places where people can refer the updated document, Provided that it is peer reviewed for accuracy.

As of now this is not general invitation to read the document, but first I am seeking help in peer review and improvement of the document at en wikisource from people who are comfortable/or used to reading bare act versions of the law.

Thanks and regards

Mahitgar (talk) 09:22, 16 April 2015 (UTC)

Very Important discussion that may lead a a statutes for Indian FNAS, FIAS, FNAAS, FISCA, FINAS

Some important discussions are ongoing here on this afd, and this afd. Please join the discussion and opine, since this will create a precedent for other such Indian articles on WP existing now, and created in future. Please dont miss out! Educationtemple (talk) 14:08, 16 April 2015 (UTC)

Drink and Edit

The complaint does not have merit. Being discussed at Talk:Chola_dynasty. Continue there. --Tito Dutta (talk) 21:35, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Drink and drive is so dangerous .similar like drink and Edit is also so dangerous ..because of those editors are highly dangerous for Wikipedia.Please admins of India-related topics kindly look on that.rvert Edit history of chola.talk page of mine.talk page of the particular user page saying he could drink the alcohol.He may drive his own path but which is not suits here.people may think is that waste of time to contribute here?!.so we have to focus on that.Really funny guy he is !ooops .Eshwar.omTalk tome 09:44, 9 April 2015 (UTC)

  • red-outlined triangle containing exclamation point Warning Calling an editor "drunk" as you have done above and here — is a personal attack. Please try avoiding such wordings unless you can clearly prove it. --Tito Dutta (talk) 11:57, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Shome mishtake, shurely? ;) I've opened a thread at Talk:Chola dynasty regarding the real issue. Allegations of drunkenness are, of course, completely wrong. - Sitush (talk) 12:02, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

What is a "hobali"?

Hi all,
I've noticed there are some mentions of this term in Wikipedia articles about places in India. It appears to be an administrative subdivision of some sort.
I don't otherwise have any clue what it means. I would greatly appreciate your help with this.
PS: the search help message said "Did you mean: hobart". I think I would know if it was Tasmania-related.
Pete "no, Tasmania is not a fictional place" AU aka --Shirt58 (talk) 10:02, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

Alternative spelling and pronunciation of hobli. Imc (talk) 19:38, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
Didn't know either terms. Small but great example of wikipedia's utility. Abecedare (talk) 21:03, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

Tag & Assess 2014

Gosh guys, The Tag & Assess 2014 still drags on valiantly but basically because a couple of Wikipedians just do not give up 

              MANY HANDS MAKE LIGHT WORK..

Can everyone please lend a hand to do even 5 or 10 assessment manually each time you sit down to edit? I'm sure that we'll soon finish off the less than 1200 articles pending!

Wikipedia:WikiProject_India/Assessment/Tag_&_Assess_2014

Thanks in advance, :) AshLin (talk) 18:28, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

@AshLin and Ugog Nizdast: In that case, Why not create Tag & Assess 2015 for a two month time period & grab few Rewards? It would then be more interesting. Tag & Assess 2014 contest itself seems to be outdated. Thanks for reminiscing the past competition! - Ninney (talk) 17:36, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Hello AshLin-ji, yes, this is an important work. There are too many works I have been doing now including 100wikidays, but, I'll join here from tomorrow and will do at least some assessments. Thanks for taking the initiative. Regards. --Tito Dutta (talk) 21:32, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
I agree that something should be mentioned about 2015, perhaps something like that it being extended to this year. One thing about Assessment, it looks and feels like a pointless/boring/menial task, but if you think of its potential, besides being for housekeeping within the Project, it's still quite important (though a bit boring). Sadly I doubt it can be automated or semi-automated beyond a few scripts or AWB. For India, it's a mammoth task (about hundreds of articles being created every week) but if every pitches in even a little, it makes things much easier. Like the last time's 2012 Tag & Assess had so many contestants and must have got over fast. Good work AshLin-ji, in getting editors to sign up and initiating Tag & Assess every year. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 08:52, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
Hey, it takes a lot of effort to set up Tag & Assess 2015. To put things in perspective we dont need a drive when there are hardly 1200 pages left to assess. We need editors to make a few assessments. If instead of posting here, we all did assessments, it would be over in no time. If 12 guys did 100 assessments or 120 guys did 10 assessments, it would all be done! Come on guys, pitch in as you all do for you do for the Indian cricket team! AshLin (talk) 10:53, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
Had already started the work since yesterday & in no time would be completed. Two things I need help on -
01. Guide - Part 4: Assessment Bar doesn't appear at the bottom of the page ? Tried with User:Yuvipanda as well as User:YuviPanda.
02. No. of Edits in Individual tallies - How do I keep a track without looking at my Contributions which is almost filled with dozens of Wiki Projects. Can Wikimedia Tool Labs be used?
Thanks! - Ninney (talk) 11:16, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Assessment bar doesn't work any more unfortunately, there are other scripts you can experiment with but I do the regular way. For counting no of edits, I personally have two ways. Suppose I was in Category:Articles of Unknown importance, and just finished a couple of assessments, (I have Google Chrome btw), all the articles I've visited (i.e. the ones I assessed) will be marked as already visited; thus, I can just count those links marked as already visited. Other way only works if you just did more than 50; look at your contribution page to display 50 edits only, if you have made 54, it would be a single page + the number of edits on the next page. All this what I said sounds pretty obvious and not exactly accurate but we shouldn't stress too much on our exact count. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 14:29, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

  • I follow a slightly different method. My asessment is completely manual, BUT my edit summary is identical. I write Tag & Assess 2014 which autcomplete fills out for me. In the edit summary of the individual tally table, I add the url of my last assessment in a hidden comment wikitext. So that I know, I only need to count the "Tag & Assess 2014" edit summaries after that date. AshLin (talk) 17:40, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Continuous abuse Sukanya Samriddhi Account

Sukanya Samriddhi Account is being abused again and again by few SPAs. Warned multiple times by multiple editors, article was protected, but they are adding a specific blogspot link again and again. Is there no solution to such abuses, or one has to always keep doing a security guard type job for these SPAs?? Educationtemple (talk) 18:20, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Appears to be WP:REFSPAM efforts by Adbknp (talk · contribs), Pavan1804 (talk · contribs), Santanu25 (talk · contribs). Have watchlisted. Also pinging @Titodutta and RegentsPark: to keep an eye in case blocks are needed. Abecedare (talk) 18:38, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Abecedare for taking a good care of this issue. Educationtemple (talk) 03:46, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Raj censuses

I've just moved a draft from my sandbox - see Census of India prior to independence. It needs a better lead and some expansion but the thing has been sitting around for ages. I would appreciate it if someone could assess because it is likely to be linked from a lot of different places. - Sitush (talk) 07:03, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Done. Thanks Ninney. - Sitush (talk) 16:55, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
Expanded lead. Can still do with improvement. AshLin (talk) 03:42, 26 April 2015 (UTC)
Yeah. There will be more to come but I'd hit a bit of writers' block. - Sitush (talk) 06:38, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

Mass Clean-up (Swachch Bharat Mission)

As discussed above The following articles are being discussed in afd at present. I wish the one that rightly deserve survive in afd! Everyone is free to contribute, please:

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Educationtemple (talk • contribs) 07:38, April 14, 2015

Thanks User:Educationtemple for your thorough review of the articles in Category:Indian biologists. Such spring cleaning is very useful. A few notes:
  • Remember to add India related articles you nominate to WP:DSI. Don't try doing it by hand though; use one of the tools listed here
  • It is usually advisable to nominate no more than, say, 2-5 articles in an area at one time. This has the advantage of not overwhelming the reviewers active in the area. And feedback obtained at the previous AFDs can help in writing up the nomination for the next set. (This is just a tip, not a rule. And there may be cases where a mass, or even combined, nomination is preferable.)
Cheers. Abecedare (talk) 18:01, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
Dear @Abecedare: thanks a lot! I see that you have taken great pain to add appropriate category on the afds!! This was a big task! Thanks a lot!. Yes, I have literally gone through each bio from India one by one and notified the above. Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 18:31, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
The credit for the AFD sorting actually belongs to User:Gene93k, who works tirelessly in the area. Abecedare (talk) 18:37, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
I thanked User:Gene93k too on his talk page. Cheers! But one thing, I am really surprised that the same editors who are so critical many times, become so soft other times that forget that WP goes by reliable source citations and nothing else! That WP is not the place to become emotional! That WP is not the place to set all the wrong things happening in the world set right! That WP is just an encyclopedia to present the things as they are and substantiate claims reliably. In the complete absence of reliable secondary sources too, editors are giving a big Keep on many articles! Educationtemple (talk) 18:49, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Attention required!!!

It is illegal to show / display half/incomplete emblem of Govt of India in India. See this order of Government of India. Therefore all these 3 barnstars (1, 2, 3) are illegal and can not be displayed in India and if this is done, it will be considered the violation of several Indian Legal Acts in force (see above order). Attention may be drawn to this and these as well as all such barnstars may be deleted immediately. Ping to @Philg88: to comment. I am not sure, how experienced Indian Editors approved these barnstars and how these are in use for such a long time! Educationtemple (talk) 16:36, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

Are we a "Government agencie"? Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 17:36, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
I guess that this is not the right place for raising this issue either. Fundarise (talk) 02:11, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
I dont think it matters. Not being Government doesn't give permission for this. Any individual (who is not Govt agency) can not dishonor Govt symbols. As soon as Wiki page is opened in India, the Law of Land come into effect immediately. Ther are enaugh ruling about this. Educationtemple (talk) 17:48, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
Also please go through these documents from GOI sites. THE PREVENTION OF INSULTS TO NATIONAL HONOUR ACT, 1971 prohibits WIKI to use Indian Emblem, that also in disrespectful manner i.e. half Emblem as used in these barnstars. THE STATE EMBLEM OF INDIA (PROHIBITION OF IMPROPER USE) ACT, 2005 clearly says -"It extends to the whole of India, and also applies to citizens of India outside India (including Indian editors here on Wiki). There is a provision for the Award of 2 Year imprisonment for IMPROPER USE of Emblem by any Indian Citizen in India or abroad. Improper use includes displaying half Emblem (by any citizen of India in India or abroad). Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 18:21, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
@Educationtemple: As far as I can see, the design used in the barnstars is not the Emblem of India as defined by State Emblem of India (Prohibition of Improper Use) Act, 2005 and State Emblem of India (Regulation of Use) Rules. In fact, it can be argued that it would be against the law, at least so far as it applies to actions of Indians and those in India, to use the (complete) emblem in the barnstars since it could be seen as improperly implying a link to GoI. So the action you seem to be suggesting, of using the complete emblem, may take us in exactly the wrong direction.
Now, my above analysis may be wrong too, but should help illustrate why wikipedia discourages editors from conducting such amateur legal analysis or labeling other editors' actions "illegal" (see WP:NLT). If you are really concerned about the legal ramifications for Wiki(p/m)edia, write to legal@wikimedia.org or contact User:Philippe (WMF). If, instead, you are interested in proposing alternate designs for the barnstars based upon good editorial/design judgment, we can continue the discussion here. Abecedare (talk) 18:39, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
/me raises eyebrows. Yeah, this again.  :-) The WMF doesn't edit content without a court order telling us to, in almost all cases. Community discussion is the way forward here... and it appears the community has discussed and isn't interested in changing these . You could attempt to raise more voices, but I think it unlikely to be successful. Time to pack it up and go home. Philippe Beaudette, Wikimedia Foundation (talk) 19:12, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for weighing in, Philippe. Abecedare (talk) 19:20, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
  • It makes sense. The above presented documents show that these may be considered the violation of several Indian Legal Acts. So I feel these images need to replaced or removed unless any other alternative is found. --Tito Dutta (talk) 18:43, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
@Abecedare: - I honor your observations. It is indeed not appropriate to use Emblem (either complete OR incomplete) in Barnstars. While the use of complete Emblem attracts a specific ACT, the use of half Emblem attracts some other ACTS too. Coming to WP:NLT and its provisions. I understand, it is our own responsibility to ensure that we dont involve ourself in any illegal acts. I am sure, Wiki must have taken this acceptance from us while we registered our accounts here. We can not hold WP responsible for everything that we do. As for writing to specific person on Wiki, I think some senior editors, admins from India will certainly do this once it come to their notice, rather than I doing it (being very junior to all of you) Educationtemple (talk) 18:50, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
EducationTemple, sorry but your legals citations are incorrect. You cite [The prevention of insults to national honour act, 1971 as prohibiting use of "half-emblem", but it absolutely does no such thing! And in any case, the law, which applied to the Indian flag and the constitution, was significantly overhauled in 2002 after a high-profile public movement to lift restrictions on display and use of the Indian flag by the general population (see Flag Code of India for the resultant law). I have already pointed the (possible) errors in your interpretation of the rules governing the State Emblem of India.
Again, I am fine with replacing the images in the barnstar, but dubious and faux legal analysis is not the right reasoning. Abecedare (talk) 19:02, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
My mention to use of incomplete Emblem was this displaying half Emblem. Also, I am aware of those rulings of 2002 that enabled us to hoist Indian flag on out houses and cars etc, but with certain restrictions as described in Flag Code of India (such as flag on car can not remain open), flag on our houses should be taken down in the evenings and night. I am not for discussing these ruling point by point and word by word here - but a general observation that use of Indian Emblem (full or Half) or use of Indian Flag (3 colours with Blue wheel inside - only tricolour can be used without any problem, though since it is not Indian flag if there is no blue wheel inside) to symbolize something personal/personal business/personal website etc (as is being used in many of our barnstars such as The Indian Barnstar of National Merit may not be appropriate - and it may may be considered the violation of several Indian Legal Acts as rightly pointed out by @Titodutta:. I dont see any point that we ourselves violate (or possibly violate) any law of our Nation, specifically, if such matter has come to notice. Educationtemple (talk) 19:18, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

I know Modi can be a bit of a nutter for nationalist issues I know there are some strident nationalists in India but if anyone is going to get sued for using these emblems in the way we do (which is positive, in the context of barnstars) then I think it would have happened years ago. Storm in a cup of chai, whether or not the legal analyses are correct. - Sitush (talk) 19:21, 22 April 2015 (UTC) Struck and changed the first few words - Sitush (talk) 19:34, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

The discussion started with the use of Half / broken/ cut Emblem (which is certainly not appropriate and against the Law in force) and NOT the use of Indian Emblem or Flag (for positive sense as Editors do on Wiki to praise other Editors). By the way, I am neither an advocate for Modi nor Wiki. It is up to all of you to use such symbols (specially half symbols of Indian Emblem) and continue to do so despite your knowledge about such usage and appropriate Law in force, I myself would at least refrain from using half State Emblem and displaying it anywhere. This is not a game where one person, who dared to say something become a looser if his observations are not taken seriously, or winner if the observations gain more voices. Law is blind and Law is not a Democracy where more votes from people can make statutes and less can dis-regard it. law is same for everyone as long as we come under its purview and at least temporal factors (such as using something for long time and not being sued) can not legalize an inappropriate action. Time for rest for me but I did not understand what Philippe (WMF) said. Who should pack what? Educationtemple (talk) 19:39, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
What Philippe was alluding to, I think, is that this type of issue has arisen before. For example, a known BJP activist who was also a Wikipedian challenged our use of maps of India, claiming that they breached India's laws because the boundaries did not match those that the Government of India claims to be correct. I'm not suggesting some political motive relating to you or anyone else involved in this thread but if even Modi isn't doing his nut about it, the issue is most likely theoretical even if your analysis is correct.

The general guidance from WMF about issues such as the maps is that if you think it possible that you might breach of the law that applies in your country then you should ensure that you do not in fact do so. But the WMF is not in India, nor are a lot of other contributors, so while there could theoretically be some sort of case brought against an India-based contributor (assuming your analysis), it isn't going to make any real difference to the project. - Sitush (talk) 19:49, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

Again, the use of map, half map etc is different than use of half Emblem. To the best of my knowledge, there is neither any statute nor Act in force to guide the use of half, or full map of India or Full or half map of India on a wall of our personal house or even on a shirt or even undergarments (someone may correct me, if I am wrong). But there are well defined guidelines/law/statues/acts guidelines for Indian Flag and Emblem. Philippe as well as anyone else can not generalize these two different issues and reach to same conclusion to "pack and go home". As for WMF is not in India - there are sections that define the jurisdictions of Indian Legal regime on foreign land specially, Indian citizens in abroad, I dont want to discuss those clause here. Cheers! Educationtemple (talk) 20:03, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
(edit conflict) The claim regarding the maps was that we were doing something illegal. Seems like the same difference with the emblem to me. Howver, I am merely surmising re: what Philippe meant. To be honest, his last sentence sounds like he's just a tad fed up at the moment: the poor guy gets a lot of stick and you really will not know just how much hassle has been going on behind the scenes in relation to one particular Indian group (or perhaps just one person, pretending to be many). Vast amounts of WMF time and money have been spent dealing with an issue that, frankly, has basically become that group/person versus the entire Wikipedia etc project. While the group/person is never going to win, it is sometimes soul-destroying just having to deal with the silliness day in, day out. I suggest that you give him a break: he will have meant nothing nasty. - Sitush (talk) 20:09, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
Something to consider is WP:LEGAL - generally, content should follow the laws of the United States. We've got plenty of content that is objectionable or illegal is some countries (see the always interesting Talk:Muhammad/images. Ravensfire (talk) 20:28, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
My friend, content May be deemed to follow the US laws. But for the actions of all of us (as individuals), WP may not be responsible. I did not / and will not challenge the content of Wiki or its Legal regime (since I am not qualified to do so), I simply mentioned that the actions of individuals, such as display of half Emblem on wiki or elsewhere as the theme of this discussion (even if that half Emblem was created by someone in USA) by Indian Citizens in India or abroad is not permitted by law of land and we all (Indian Editors, including NRIs) are bound to follow the law of land. Just imagine, if I but a half emblem (of full emblem) which is made in USA, can I display it on my Car? No. Since the content was created in USA, it does not legalize the free and unlimited/unrestricted use of that content by anyone and everyone. Good night. Educationtemple (talk) 20:43, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
And then there's an easy answer - don't use something you don't like. Create an alternative. Wikipedia is WP:NOTCENSORED. Simple as that. Ravensfire (talk) 20:46, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
Again, it is not a matter of like or dislike it is a legal issue related to the Honor of Nation where specific Law in place prohibit the use of specific content irrespective of someone's liking or disliking and I reenforce the analysis of @Titodutta: that "these images need to replaced or removed unless any other alternative is found". Period. No discussion further at my end. Educationtemple (talk) 20:50, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Licensing question, using, remixing: I dislike the last line of Philippe "Time to pack it up and go home". Legal or illegal — that is not an important question to me, User:Educationtemple, I think we may rewrite/re-ask it in this way— "As these barnstars are part of WikiProjects India and mainly/generally created, maintained and used by and awarded to Indian editors, as we have found that some of the images used here do not follow "this" and "this" act and also may be considered as dishonour to the Indian Flag, should we continue using these or try to think of some alternative. If "yes", what?"
    HOWEVER, I must also mention— even in the government websites/events they create/present half-flag, artistic depictions or remixes of the flag, flag without the wheel or Ashoka Chakra. So, I am not sure that it is a very critical issue.
    License re-check: AND if these images are really in public domain in India and in the US, as mentioned in image license pages, naturally those may be remixed and derivative works may be created." Indian Gov should not stop us. From here comes my next question, a stronger one— If the images, in its home-country, are under public domain BUT with so many restrictions — the base images don't comply with Wikimedia's free image policy, in my opinion. --Tito Dutta (talk) 21:11, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

Final clarification @Titodutta: - your really sincere comments and observations made me to comment again. Yes, your final statements make the things clear. Coming to second point - Indian flag - the remixing etc is done only of tri-colour (i.e. just tri-colour without a wheel). As soon as we place a wheel (Ashok Chakra), Flag Code of India come into picture, which prohibits us its usage in any disrespectful manner including remixing etc. Having said this, a respectful display of Indian Flag can be done on personal property as long as we follow Flag Code of India. This was also permitted after 2002 statutes. Again, use of Indian Flag (with wheel) as used in one of Barnstar here (Indian barnstar of national Merit) is not legal since it create a dilemma as if it is an award is given by Government of India/president of India. Flag code of India prohibits us to use Indian flag (with blue wheel and 24 spikes - Ashok Chakra) as a show piece or as a symbol or mark on personal property/logo and trophy etc. A flag without Ashok chakra (just tri colour) is not Indian Flag by the way, and one can even make an underwear of these three colours and wear it openly.

However, the issue pertaining to the use of Emblem is much more serious since specific orders of Government are in place for the same - and literally no Indian citizen can use the Emblem if he/she is not in this list pl see page 3, this is in hindi, English version of this can be searched on net. This prohibits the use of this emblem on barnstars on wiki. Use of Half Emblem/distorted Emblem is even more offensive in the light of recent order from MEA (cited above by me).

Coming to the public domain issue - Yes Indian Emblem is in public domain since last few years, since it completed its 100 years since the time it was created for the first time. Any image after 100 years come in public domain automatically. This imply from the definition of public domain image that we can use it, reuse it and remix it the way we wish. But if you read license page again,or the definition of public domain image (I read it in books but it could be googled) it must also say that "remixing can be done for public domain images ONLY if it is not prohibited by specific law in place". In case of Indian Emblem, the specific laws are in place (cited above) and every Indian Citizen whether in India or in abroad has to follow and obey them. Indian Emblem (despite being in public domain) cannot be distorted, remixed and even used by any Indian citizen (except those listed in the prohibition act) at his or her free will. Educationtemple (talk) 22:11, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

  • User:Educationtemple, I do not have "authoritative knowledge" on public domain works, but when you say "public domain", I immediately feel it is "free", as Richard Stallman says "Free as in Freedom". Note, "public domain" license is also called "CC0".
    Now you can not remix upon it (please note, "half flag" is a derivative or remix work) or you need to follow "so many rules and restrictions" — this is not free or creative commons culture.
    For now, there are two questions— first what you have explained above with lots of details, and second, image licensing issue— Wikimedia Commons require that an image will be either free (CC 4.0 SA etc. etc. or PD) both in the content's home-country and the US.
    Take this example: File:Emblem of India.svg — in public domain in India — no information on 1971 act or other restrictions, as a result it has incomplete home-country license details.
    I do know what else to say. Regards. --Tito Dutta (talk) 22:52, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
  • This is the answer - to explain why public domain CANNOT be remixed/used as free as in freedom IF other restrictions are in place as in case of National Emblem of India. Educationtemple (talk) 23:02, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
Then start deletion discussions over on commons for the images to be deleted and go with whatever result happens. Ravensfire (talk) 23:14, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
I humbly request an admin to please help at this point - and take these images to deletion discussion in the light of the above discussions. I can help to some extent to identify such images - but all the barnstar containing Emblem (half or full) and the barnstar containing Indian flag (with Ashok Chakra) come in this category Educationtemple (talk) 23:22, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Educationtemple, if it is nominated for deletion, it'll be something really BIG. (BTW, you don't need to nominate each an every image, just discuss on the main ones and write in brief about other derivative works.) But again, this is going to be something really BIG. So, why not ask some of the best image-copyright experts first, umm, you may request these users' opinion: (not linking any username now to avoid ping): User:Sfan00 IMG, User:INverCry (Commons), User:Sreejithk2000 (Commons, India expert), User:Trijnstel, User:Wikitanvir etc. (I have talked to and worked with few more experts, but my bad memory :() ? --Tito Dutta (talk) 23:39, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
  • OK. I think you are right, while we want to assure that we dont do anything (unknowingly) that is in serious violation of law (Country's Honour, as discussed above) we also don't want to mess up the things here. So, I am humble to invite @Sfan00:, @INverCry:, @Sreejithk2000:, @Trijnstel: or any other known expert such as @Wikitanvir: for their expert comment on this issue and if appropriate, take the discussion to next level / or nominate the images for deletion or speedy deletion as they feel appropriate after reading this discussion and further discussions. Regards. Educationtemple (talk) 04:14, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Summary of the Issue - Many barnstars for example (1, 2, 3) have been using distorted National Emblem of India as a base image. Use of Emblem of India (or any part of it) in barnstars on WP is in violation to many Acts and Statutes of India (1, 2, 3, 4). Further, using the half/distorted Emblem attracts even more severe consequences since it is not inline to Law and Statues of India in Force (this order of GOI). These Acts also prohibits the use of this Emblem by Indian who are not in India since they are bound to follow the law of Land (Section 1.2). It is pertinent to mention that these barnstars are part of WikiProjects India and mainly/generally created, maintained and used by and awarded to Indian editors. A detailed discussion on this issue along with citations and links to appropriate laws/statutes had taken place at this page yesterday.
  • It is a matter of urgent concern and we all need to take a decision whether we want to continue to violate the Statutes and Laws of our Nation and Continue to dishonor or wish to replace such barnstars with appropriate image. Educationtemple (talk) 14:24, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
TLDR - that advisory is for government organizations that are not printing their legal tender/stationary right. As far as I can tell there is no rule against artistic depictions or use of symbolism in other contexts (or else we are going to be protesting the fact that some photos show flag waving in the wind with some parts obscured or that the Ashokan monuments are chipped or well someone is using saffron clothes) Shyamal (talk) 09:58, 24 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Yes, you are right, that order is for govt organizations that are not printing their legal tender/stationary right. This order cannot indeed be for anyone else Since no one else is allowed to use this symbol!! read section 1.2 (Section 1.2). Also, I think, I was clear to cite that the rules for flag and the rules for the Emblem are different. The discussion above is about Emblem of India and its usage on barnstars. Please show me just one place (anywhere on the internet, book or what so ever) where artistic depiction of Emblem has been done. In any case, let someone who knows Law decide upon it, legal matters can not be decided by votes and opinions. Yes, if you can help to take this discussion to appropriate legal experts, admins of WP, you and all are welcome for that. Educationtemple (talk) 10:14, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Also please see this, where part of the Emblem (Satyamev jayate) was used on private affairs, what happened! Here our barnstars are using full fledged symbol and distorting it on some private trophies (Barnstars). Educationtemple (talk) 10:19, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

  • Update - You would love to read the comment at admin noticeboard at commons. Common's admin took just a second to separate India from Wikiproject India!! But for sure, if they say "This is problem of India, not problem of Commons" they too acknowledge that "problem" is there. I just wonder, what is the fun hundreds of Indian editors work day and night here on wikiproject India!! Glorification of whom??? Presentation of what facts?? Can't we even project the glory of our nation, the honor of India the National Emblem appropriately?? I and @Titodutta: alone cant do anything, but I will certainly present this in our next meeting of Bar Council and the Council Scholars and show the images where Indian National Emblem has been dishonored on Wikiproject India (possibly by our Indian colleagues). May be some top advocates of India/or the Press/Journalist who are generally present there as representative take a cognition of this Educationtemple (talk) 16:21, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Sorry my friends, I have closed my protest to this issue now with the following note and I am very saddened on the fact that no Indian Editor (except one more other than me) here on wiki did open their mouth at all on this issue -

"All right. It is not a problem of Wikipedia (as most admins commented above), but as stated above by one admin, it may be the problem of India. India is not a country of me alone, it is the country of 120 million and thousands of editors here on wikipedia. As a responsible citizen of India, the maximum I could do at this stage is that bring it to the notice of top officials of Government of India in a neutral manner. They have more knowledge than us about their statutes, their rules and Emblem of India and they are right people to decide if this was a violation at anyone's part or if it is OK to use these images/distorted images on barnstars. I close my protest to this here. Cheers!" Educationtemple (talk) 04:38, 27 April 2015 (UTC)

GAR Jainism

Jainism, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Rahul (talk) 17:02, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Shivalaya

(Pasted from Talk:Shivalaya)

The text of this page is very ungrammatical and in many places hard or impossible to understand. It badly needs editing by someone who is competent in English as spoken in natively English-speaking countries (I am) and who also understands the form of Indian English used here (I do not). To discuss this, please {{Ping}} me. --Thnidu (talk) 05:40, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

New article

Need someone to check Hemalatha Lavanam, at this moment, this article looks like it is slanting towards a specific point of view. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log) 15:55, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Need attention on military articles

On at least 2 articles such as Battle of Rajasthan and Indo-Pakistani War of 1971 where we can find use of unreliable sources or attempt to WP:RGW. I had also seen the same edits from this particular editor on other articles[8], but they had been reverted by other editor. OccultZone (Talk • Contributions • Log) 08:43, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Specify what help you need on 1971 Indo-Pak War please. AshLin (talk) 16:14, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

ownership

Is Ganesha article belongs to user Abecedare? diff!is that ownership allowed?let me know?!Eshwar.omTalk tome 19:58, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Reverting the addition of an unreliable source is not by itself an example of ownership. Read WP:OWN. Follow the bold-revert-discuss cycle, and take your concern to the talk page. Vanamonde93 (talk) 20:05, 28 April 2015 (UTC)
More eyes will be be welcome at Talk:Ganesha#owneship Abecedare (talk) 20:42, 28 April 2015 (UTC)
Also at Talk:Ganesha#Recent additions. Abecedare (talk) 16:35, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Lothal FAR

I have nominated Lothal for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 18:23, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Confusion ?!

Is Tamil Nadu belongs to India or it is separate region from India?!or it is Alien place?Guys Please help me in this?!Eshwar.omTalk tome 19:57, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi Eshwar.om The article Tamil Nadu clearly states that it is 29th state of India. What is the confusion? Vishal0soni (talk) 06:13, 1 May 2015 (UTC)
Context: I recently removed/reworked some material from the Ganesha article that Eshwar.om had added. Eshwar believes that it was due to my alleged anti-Tamil/anti-South India bias. Hence the cryptic complaint. See related talk page discussion. Abecedare (talk) 06:27, 1 May 2015 (UTC)
Really wonder about Abecedare .he is not replying in Ganesha article's talkpage.But replying here:).Eshwar.omTalk tome 17:38, 1 May 2015 (UTC)

Dear User:Vishal0soni yes i know the article Tamil Nadu clearly states that it is 29th state of India?But editers like some few wont allow me to add Classical tamil related info.For them i have to say some thing,that is Tamil is one of the longest surviving classical languages in the world .Tamil is one of the longest surviving classical languages in the world.[1][2] .It has been described as "the only language of contemporary India which is recognizably continuous with a classical past."[3] The variety and quality of classical Tamil literature has led to it being described as "one of the great classical traditions and literatures of the world".[4].The two earliest manuscripts from India,[5][6] acknowledged and registered by UNESCO Memory of the World register in 1997 and 2005, were in Tamil.[7].the first Indian language to be declared a classical language by the Government of India in 2004.so Hinduism based articles mainly belongs to india.so lot of literacy works done in this languages like tamil and sanskrit .i won t say every article of Hinduism must contains this literacy works. but unfortunatly we wont remove these works from Hinduism article.because it has setup like that. Reason why explained above.Hoping that some user may understand this.Eshwar.omTalk tome 17:38, 1 May 2015 (UTC)

Let me tell you I almost regularly visit this noticeboard, I saw this question right after it was posted and guessed what's going to be asked later (although I did not know "which" article or editor? If you want to ask a question, why not "ask directly". I see no reason behind asking vague questions like "Is Tamil Nadu an Indian state?" A few weeks ago you accused that Sitush was drunk, but when he tried to discuss the issue, you have not participated still.--Tito Dutta (talk) 20:16, 1 May 2015 (UTC)
Titodutta please dont say like this. from my end there is no need to ask vague questions.but people makes me to ask like this.And you know well one thing that is ,Wikipedia is like a open Dictionary for all.every one see everyone's contribution.And your saying you dont know the name of the article and which Editor.it is clearly visible for all.Do you thing i never spoken with the Editor .i spoken but waste of time.i experienced many times from the past 3 years.they come with many Wiki rules for all time and bite me.i dont want to use the user name here.his name not a Sin but it is visible to all. i feel shame to use his/her name.Eshwar.omTalk tome 22:48, 1 May 2015 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Cite error: The named reference Circulation and the Historical Geog was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  2. ^ Steever 1998, pp. 6–9
  3. ^ Zvelebil, Kamil (1973), The Smile of Murugan, BRILL, pp. 11–12, ISBN 978-90-04-03591-1
  4. ^ Hart, George L. Statement on the Status of Tamil as a Classical Language, University of California Berkeley Department of South Asian Studies – Tamil
  5. ^ The I.A.S. Tamil Medical Manuscript Collection, UNESCO, retrieved 13 September 2012
  6. ^ Saiva Manuscript in Pondicherry, UNESCO, retrieved 13 September 2012
  7. ^ Memory of the World Register: India, UNESCO, retrieved 13 September 2012

Sari

Resolved

There is a problem with Template:Saree which is not displaying correctly, e.g. in the article Sari. (I'm not sure whether this is the right place to post this; please move if appropriate.)--Johnsoniensis (talk) 08:48, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

@Johnsoniensis: There was a broken link added by some contributor on 17 April but should be now  Fixed. Thanks for bringing this to our attention. Regards, Ncmvocalist (talk) 08:55, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Indic Script for placenames

I know that consensus exists for ignoring WP:INDICSCRIPT for placenames, provided that the only scripts used represent the official languages for the place. For some reason, the guideline doesn't say this and - which is worse - I've just been alerted to the notion that such scripts should only be in the infobox, not in the lead section. I may have missed this later discussion but I'm struggling to find the actual "consensus" threads in the archives, among all the various other threads about usage. Can anyone help with a link? - Sitush (talk) 09:18, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

The specific instance that caused me to ask this can be seen at Talk:Srinagar#Indic_script. - Sitush (talk) 10:43, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Instead, It will be better to keep Indic script in lead section of all articles, but as WP:INDICSCRIPT claims that consesus has been made by "community" to remove Indic script from lead section, then this rule should be applied to all languages, as in above mentioned talk page by Sitush about article Srinagar we are discussing whether Urdu name of Srinagar which is there in lead section currently should remain or not. If Urdu name is accepted there then it should applied to all other Indian languages to keep them in lead section. Thank you. --Vtk1987 (talk) 11:23, 2 May 2015 (UTC)
Sigh. I've explained all this to you: the problem is that the guideline has not been updated to reflect the consensus for an exception, simple as that. You are not going to get consensus to scrap the entirety of WP:INDICSCRIPT, and you arguments at the Srinagar talk page are a very good example of why that guideline was introduced: we have enough bickering and edit warring on India-related articles without reinstating another layer that 90% of our readers and contributors probably do not even understand and cannot easily check for errors, vandalism and the like. There is a long history here and it is not pretty reading. - Sitush (talk) 11:51, 2 May 2015 (UTC)
I'm really curious to get this clarified too. If you don't know then maybe ping the other participants of that discussion? -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 17:45, 2 May 2015 (UTC)
Oh, I know. I just can't spot it in the archives even though I took part in the discussions. I have other things on my mind at the moment, I'm afraid. The last thing I want to do is revisit the entire issue of whether or not scripts should be used. All that I'm after is a link so that the guideline can be updated. - Sitush (talk) 17:49, 2 May 2015 (UTC)
There are several threads in Wikipedia talk:Noticeboard for India-related topics/Archive 50 but I'm pretty sure that there are more recent ones also. I think everyone who has been around for a while knows my opinion on the matter and it is the fact that my opinion differed from the consensus that made it stick in my mind. - Sitush (talk) 18:01, 2 May 2015 (UTC)
Its ok Sitush, me too not against keeping Indic script in lead, but there are some users who keep on removing Indic script from lead, rather removing Indic script makes most part of their edits. You may have reach of many articles on Wikipedia, I think you should have watch on such issues, though I'm also increasing my watchlist rapidly, cheers. --Vtk1987 (talk) 19:07, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Great swathe of templates

I have just found Category:India political party shortname templates which contains a whole slew of templates that are far longer in name than the outcome when they are transcluded. I wondered if you have any idea what these might be about? It seems perplexing that the effort of typing them in is greater than the effort of typing in the thing they produce. Fiddle Faddle 10:03, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

Those templates along with the bunch under Category:India political party colour templates are used as a database by the {{Template:Election box candidate with party link}} template to convert full party name (which is what the user types in), to the party colour and shortname. See use here for example. The article editors never type in the short name/color templates' names, and need not even be aware of their existence. Abecedare (talk) 14:23, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
A strong suggestion, please, in that case, is to document the usage on the category and perform a bulk edit to add the template documentation to each template (I suggest a simple transclusion) so those of us who run into them (and similarly deployed templates) are no longer perplexed. I found the area when an author submitted one at WP:AFC and I had absolutely no idea what it was. Fiddle Faddle 14:55, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
I agree that that should be done, and I have added such such a note to the category you brought up. However I don't work much in template and category space and am not sure of the norms and process for adding such notes more widely. Any suggestions from other editors here on how to do this, or even what would be the right venue to discuss the issue? Abecedare (talk) 15:13, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
I have no idea of the correct venue, but I know an editor who would be able to implement a decent solution for the team who uses the templates. Technical 13 might, if asked very nicely,have the time to turn his hand to the task and have a decent clue about how to automate it so that it is no trouble to anybody.
Thank you for picking up the baton with the category heading. IT makes a difference. Fiddle Faddle 15:32, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
  • I'm not sure I follow what is being asked for here; although, I'll admit I'm quite distracted by having a task of completing 9/10 quizzes, 3 exams, and doing a final project for my Linear Algebra class today and tomorrow (I'm just starting the class today, it's my own fault I'm so backlogged). — {{U|Technical 13}} (e • t • c) 15:49, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
@Technical 13: In short the question is whether it is possible to add a note along the lines of
to all the sub-category and template pages in the categories:
Not an urgent question. But would save the sleuthing efforts Timtrent and I undertook to figure out what these templates do. Abecedare (talk) 15:55, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
  • Oh, yeah. Simply put in a request on WP:AWB/TA and I'm sure someone would happily blow through and do that. — {{U|Technical 13}} (e • t • c) 16:08, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

Help with sources?

I was wondering if anyone could help me look for sources for the article Sandipta Sen. I can't really find much via a Google search, but therein lies the problem: I'm doing a Google search in the United States. Can any of you guys find anything? Offhand it looks like there should be more sources out there, but all I'm bringing up are Times of India hits for the most part. Also, is the Tele Academy Award a major one or one that could give partial notability? Offhand I'm thinking it'd give at least partial notability, but I want to make sure since that is probably going to be pretty important in helping to establish notability in case someone tries to take it to AfD. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 06:44, 4 May 2015 (UTC)

I think there's bare minimum notability. Would I AFD it? No, since it has a decent chance of surviving it. I tried to find more but only "Durga s latest avatar", Times of India came up. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 09:42, 4 May 2015 (UTC)
  • Thanks for searching- I have to agree on the bare minimum notability part. I figure I'll leave it and just hope that nobody else AfDs it. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 08:06, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Selvin (actor)

I wanted to know if anyone can look for Tamil language sources for the article Selvin (actor). I did some searching and found the sources currently in the article, but there's not a lot out there in English. There is enough to where I think that more sources are probably out there, but are likely in Tamil since the guy has predominantly starred in some of the more independent films that don't get as much coverage in English. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 08:08, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Khamar

Khamar is a type of landholding/working - eg: here - but is it also a specific caste group? I'm struggling to find anything for it. Someone created Vaishnav Khamar and it seems like another bit of community creation to me: Vaishnavite smallholders or something similar. They say it is a split from the Patidar and that the community is small in number; frankly, it looks to me like the community exists pretty much only in their own head and that is why it is small.

Usually, I would send this to AfD or even PROD it without raising the issue here but I had a bad experience with some very experienced contributors a few hours ago and am in self-doubt mode. - Sitush (talk) 15:18, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

Possible Deletion of Battle of Rajasthan

The article Battle of Rajasthan has recently been nominated for deletion by Xtremedood. Any editor who may know more about the background might be interested in providing better sources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gurutanyas (talk • contribs) 15:50, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

@Gurutanyas: The AFD was already closed as "no consesnsus" abot six hours bfore you posted here. There is ongoing discussion on Talk:Battle of Rajasthan about the article sourcing, content and name where you are welcome to participate especially if you have additional sources to contribute.
By the way, in case you heard of the deletion discussion on an off-wiki forum or because you have an existing wikipedia account, you should read up on wikipedia's policies on sock and meat-puppetry to avoid falling afoul of those rules. Abecedare (talk) 19:31, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

Swami G. C. D. Bharti

Hello India experts. Is this article at the appropriate title? —Anne Delong (talk) 21:56, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

Definitely, Yes! as per WP:UCRN. The person indeed is known by that name & same is used in government website as well as Newspapers. - Ninney (talk) 22:44, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

Have started a rename discussion. Please weigh in. Abecedare (talk) 00:32, 10 May 2015 (UTC)

List of Indian Mathematicians

I am amazed that the name Meghnad Shaha, FRS, does not appear on the list. Please insert the name of this outstanding mathematician and physicist. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xyzdipakganguli (talk • contribs) 17:58, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

Sitaramdas Omkarnath

Can anyone help out at Sitaramdas Omkarnath? It seems to be yet another corner of the walled garden that is the Divine Life Society, complete with umpteen hagiographies etc. I'm getting a bit fed up of seeing all these articles about gurus and yoga, most of which seem to garner their notability only because of the reverential publications of their adherents. - Sitush (talk) 10:33, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Rfc: 2012 Delhi rape case

Talk:2012 Delhi gang rape

Using the police charge sheet might be awkward due to WP:PRIMARY, although it might contain a simple statement that would be ok. That said, the Indian media isn't particularly known for its accuracy and tends both to be driven by and to drive frenzies, and to plagiarise each other. The Hindu is usually by far the most reliable but better still is to use non-Indian news sources, especially if the stories are also filed outside India. - Sitush (talk) 10:37, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
I waded through the muck a few hours back, and it turns out that while we/the media didn't mix-up the juvenile offender and Vinay Sharma, that issue is moot, since the police/media claims of the juvenile being the most violent were later dismissed by the Chief Justice of India and the juvenile trial board. See my comments on the RFC page for details.
As an aside: relying on foreign media wouldn't have helped since at least Fox News, BBC, New Zealand newspapers etc reported the same claims. And primary sources are no panacea either, for example the court judgment for the adult offenders not only has numerous grammatical issues, but also typographical/factual errors such as getting some arrest dates wrong (eg on page 7 Akshay's arrest date for the crime pre-dates the crime; the juvenile's arrest date is likely off by a week too). Abecedare (talk) 17:06, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

TAG & ASSESS 2014 NEEDs YOU!

Tag & Assess 2014 needs you to assess articles! TODAY!
 Working: This is really intersting. Thanks User:AshLin & User:Ugog Nizdast! - Ninney (talk) 07:00, 27 April 2015 (UTC)
 Working: Only 800 articles pending for tagging & assessment. Request all to join T&A 2014 & complete the backlog classification at earliest. - Ninney (talk) 15:50, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
 Working: Only 444 articles pending for tagging & assessment. Request all to join T&A 2014 & complete the backlog classification at earliest. - Ninney (talk) 14:19, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

List of schools in Mumbai

red-outlined triangle containing exclamation point Warning: Urgent attention required on recent 3 months edits made on article List of schools in Mumbai. All schools are hyperlinked on www.school.classfever.com. The last best Revision I could find was as of 2015-02-11T00:30:36 - Ninney (talk) 16:05, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

@Ninney: Reverted that article to months-old (still sub-standard) version, to clean-up 100s of spam-links to www.classfever.com added by SPA User:Highfever2015 to that and other articles. May need to keep an eye out for any future additions of links to that website by this or other promotional accounts. Abecedare (talk) 19:57, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
@Abecedare: Thanks ! I had planned few to-do's to improve the article.
  1. The Job of removing external links (Status: complete)
  2. Referring categories & adding appropriate Wikilinks in the list. Category:Schools in Mumbai, Category:Schools in Chembur & Category:International schools in Mumbai
  3. Tabular format presentation.
Will do so in the last week of May as I am currently engaged in backlog work (Tag & Assess 2014, T&A Needs You)
- Ninney (talk) 20:31, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
That would be great, since the shape my revert left the article in is hardly acceptable. Incidentally, if you are looking for non-promotional sources for such lists, see this government database of schools. And if you are really interested in devoting some time to the area you may want to think about, propose and discuss criteria for creation of such lists and inclusion criteria for entries. See this earlier related discussion, which brought up some potential issues with such lists but did not settle on any agreed norms. Abecedare (talk) 20:41, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
My work would be to make the list page readable ... Less no of Red links ... no addition unless Wiki article ... no article creation ... Period. Should not take more than couple of hours to complete, but definitely not as of now in my priority list & that is the reason I posted it on Notice board. - Ninney (talk) 21:19, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
I have cleaned it up, in the sense of removing the barelinks, the primary schools and the unreferenced etc. It is still a mess because of all the redlinks but we'll probably be in a fight with the schools project if we remove them. - Sitush (talk) 06:21, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
And, yes, the classfever.com refs should be replaced by the government database. Maybe next week. - Sitush (talk) 06:23, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for all the hard work! BTW you had removed all of the schools listed in Category:Schools in Chembur, my school was one of it. - Ninney (talk) 11:58, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Well, there is something rather odd going on at that list's talk page now. I get the feeling I am being tag-teamed. - Sitush (talk) 07:19, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Hey guys, the DISE links seem like a viable replacement for Classfever, but dont need to be linked so because of two reasons - Its an .aspx page which cannot be directly linked and even if that were possible, the format of the information in it is hardly decipherable by an average person. Probably removing the Classfever links should be enough. Additionally, Yes there is an issue pending to be solved as of now on the list's Talk page; Whether or not to table-format the entire list and add columns of Location and Website (official) AND whether to add a subsection of Primary schools Within the article. We should be able to get this out of our way soon. Cheers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Anonymousbananas (talk • contribs) 2015-05-18T15:58:29‎

Bhanwari Devi

This article on a prominent rape case from the 1990s has become a target for caste-based POV pushing and BLP vios. See this blog post from last year that accurately analyzed the problems, many of which still remain. Could some experienced editors add the page to their watchlist and help in dynamiting it? Abecedare (talk) 00:31, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Pinging @Sitush: a proficient user of TNT; @Gandydancer and Rsrikanth05: who were acyive at 2012 Delhi gang rape article; and @Lvdt and Dl2000: who have previously helped clean up the Bhanwari Devi article. Abecedare (talk) 00:35, 19 May 2015 (UTC)
? I never watch TNT. I have watchlisted the article, though. - Sitush (talk) 04:51, 19 May 2015 (UTC)
Will watch the page and help out. --Rsrikanth05 (talk) 05:12, 19 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. And Sitush, TNT = complete rewrite. I have started at one end (lede) and Dl2000 at the other (Film section), so just the middle remains to be rewritten. Cheers. Abecedare (talk) 05:19, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Islamist POV in Kamala Surayya

Please see Kamala Surayya, a certain author pushes fringe POV based on websites like islamicbulletin.org and radianceweekly.com which neither conform to WP:RS or WP:N. I am very busy now and cannot afford to spend time discussing. Hope to bring it to the community's notice. Snowcream (talk) 08:15, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Ramakrishna

There's a warrior running around at Ramakrishna. I'm at three reverts now; could somebody take over? Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 07:03, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

TIt-for-tat synthesis

The two articles on Anti-Pakistan sentiment and Anti-Indian sentiment have been filled with synthesis by editors joyfully indulging in tit-for-tat editing. Any help in cleaning the crap out would be useful. Vanamonde93 (talk) 22:59, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

These type of articles are always in need of mass cleanup, with all the various drive-by pov additions of every possible side. A simple cleanup will take a while and wish I could help more since am on a partial wikibreak. In fact, I remember watchlisting similar such articles in view of doing something *eventually*, this at least prevents them from deteriorating further. Don't want to mention them as that will steal the thunder from what you've posted. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 06:34, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

Sources?

I was wondering- can anyone find sourcing for this film? (Paalam) It's from the 80s so odds are I won't be able to find anything on my end. I have been searching but so far it's just non-usable "junk" hits that just show that it existed. I'd nominate it for AfD, but I want to give it a fair shake before that. I suppose it could probably redirect to M. Krishnan Nair (director) rather than AfD, if anyone thinks that's a good alternative. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 08:44, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

Butcher of Gujarat dispute

There is a Wikipedia:Redirects_for_discussion/Log/2015_May_21#Butcher_of_Gujarat discussion going on here there has been alleged canvassing ,edit warring and claims of WP:BLP violation as it redirects to Narendra Modi which in turn is rebutted by claims of WP:RNEUTRAL.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 14:57, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

@Pharaoh of the Wizards: Can you post a notice of the debate to (say) the WP:BLPN and WP:NPOVN boards? It would be good if this didn't degenerate into a India-Pakistan issue, and we had some outside eyes. (I have already commented at the RfD so not posting the notices myself). Abecedare (talk) 15:14, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for your message .Okay will post it fully agree with your views.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 15:22, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

RfC: Request for new infobox Template for Indian States and Territories

There is an RfC for infobox template for Indian States and territories. Please Comment on it. Here is the link. Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Indian_states#RfC:_Request_for_new_infobox_Template_for_Indian_States_and_Territories. Prymshbmg (talk) 10:45, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Indian Occupied Kashmir

Does calling Indian side of Kashmir as "Indian Occupied Kashmir" in article is valid or not? Because I thought using terms "Indian Administered Kashmir" and "Pakistan Administered Kashmir" are valid. Article named China–Pakistan Economic Corridor has a big map in lead which shows Indian side of Kashmir as "Indian Occupied Kashmir". I got reverted two times when I removed controversial map, no one replied on talk page. Instead someone said me in edit summary that "if you are not Pakistani national then don't edit this page". What will be the solution for it? --Human3015 Say Hey!! • 17:06, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

  • Indian Side of Kashmir should not be called as Indian occupied Kashmir as Indian didnt occupy Kashmir in a conflict, but it was merged in India, by their king Hari Singh. And Pakistan occupied some part of it after 1965 Indo-Pak war. Prymshbmg (talk) 10:54, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
  • Agreed. Both "Indian occupied" and "Pakistan occupied" are POV terms that shouldn't be used anywhere on Wikipedia except in direct quotes. Redirects are different because they are meant to be search terms, not content terms. - Kautilya3 (talk) 12:05, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Notable?

Draft:Govind Dwivedi. Thanks, FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 16:24, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

As a retired major general (4th highest rank in Indian Army) and a dean faculty at a well known university, I would say yes. But the draft needs some work, especially neutralisation. — Yash! (Y) 16:49, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Food - Photo contest for Indian Cuisine

Frameless
Frameless

Hi, we are running a photo contest called Wiki Loves Food featuring Indian Cuisine. Could you please announce this in WikiProject India page and related portals? Thanks.--Ravishankar (talk) 11:02, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Hindustan Murdabad

RfD for redirect Hindustan Murdabad is going on here Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2015 May 26#Hindustan Murdbad.--Human3015 Say Hey!! • 15:09, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Tamil history expert requested to establish Notability at: Draft:Ondiveern Pagadai

Can someone who speaks Tamil and is familiar with the reigon's history please take a look at Draft:Ondiveern Pagadai?

This figure, a claimed 18th century Tamil freedom fighter, certainly seems important, but whether due to language issues or transliteration or whatnot I'm just not finding sources. Any help, thanks! MatthewVanitas (talk) 10:14, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Sindhi people listed at Requested moves

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Bihari people listed at Requested moves

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Kashmiri people listed at Requested moves

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Pesarattu listed at Requested moves

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Kosli cinema listed at Requested moves

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Divisions of Indian Railways listed at Requested moves

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Goat Days listed at Requested moves

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God's Mischief listed at Requested moves

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Swami G. C. D. Bharti listed at Requested moves

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Arti Singh listed at Requested moves

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Kesavan's Lamentations listed at Requested moves

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List of municipalities of Telangana listed at Requested moves

A requested move discussion has been initiated for List of municipalities of Telangana to be moved to List of municipalities in Telangana. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 03:47, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Requests for comment:Customised Version of Form I & Affidavit per (Indian) Copyright act 1957 rules

This is a Request for comment at meta to seek broader input to improve page: meta:Help:Form I & Affidavit (Customised for relinquishment of copyright as per 'free cultural work' definition) an option available under (Indian) Copyright act 1957 rules.

Rgds.

Mahitgar (talk) 08:18, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Peer review/Mayabazar/archive1

Pavanjandhyala has opened the peer review for Mayabazar (1957), the first Telugu film to be attempted for FA class. Feel free to leave comments. — Ssven2 Speak 2 me 05:30, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

"Hindu Politics" template

I've been examining this template, and although it initially seemed useful, I'm beginning to have my doubts. The template is too narrow in some ways, in that there are notable Indian politicians and political thinkers who are not included. On the other hand, if all such were included, it would be incredibly large, and in any case the inclusion criteria are not very clear. Finally, there is also the Sangh Parivar template, which covers a lot of the same information but is at least well defined. Any thoughts? - User:Vanamonde93

Yeah, I guess it was an effort by the Hindu nationalists to say that they were part of a bigger movement of "Hindu politics." But the main deficiency is that we don't have good concept pages for "Hindu revivalism" and "Hindu traditionalism," which could tie these different strands together. - Kautilya3 (talk) 08:22, 4 June 2015 (UTC)
Drive-by comment: The Sangh Parivar template is more factual than the "Hindu politics" one since the latter has a very subjective inclusion criteria. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 08:32, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Ayurveda RFC

A Request for Comments is now in progress at Talk:Ayurveda concerning whether [[Category:Pseudoscience]] should be added to the article on Ayurveda. Participation in the RFC is encouraged. Robert McClenon (talk) 15:56, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

How I Braved Anu Aunty and Co-Founded a Million Dollar Company

Hey, I was wondering if anyone could do a check for sources for the article How I Braved Anu Aunty and Co-Founded a Million Dollar Company. It's up at AfD and I managed to find one review, but the majority of the sources only mentions the book in passing when talking about Varun Agarwal and the other stuff he's done. I keep getting the impression that there should be more out there, so I was wondering if any of you guys could do a little searching. I know that sometimes the English language search engines won't bring up all of the results that are out there, so it's worth a try, right? Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 04:38, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

Tokyogirl79, here's another review.--Skr15081997 (talk) 05:08, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
  • Skr15081997, does the website have its editorial process posted anywhere? I see that it's done by a site admin, which is good, but if the editorial process isn't listed anywhere it's likely to get shot down. In any case, this is pretty much why I asked here- I didn't see this one come up when I searched. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 05:10, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
Tokyogirl79, I found a review published in The Tribune and added my opinion at the AfD. Thanks for posting this here. I see that you have to leave messages here very often, you can use this tool to find info in Indian newspapers. Regards, --Skr15081997 (talk) 05:29, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
  • WOOT!! I remember someone giving me a link to something similar at one point (probably Titodutta), but I'd lost it long ago. I'm totally adding this to my user page so that I don't lose it again! Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 05:34, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

Symbols of Indian states

Can anyone find refs for this? Some of the entries seem a bit off to me (though they may or may not be incorrect) and this list is a master list of all states, so potentially a boat load of articles that could be fixed if we find the necessary refs. I've tried a few state websites etc, but no luck. cheers. —SpacemanSpiff 15:15, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

  • See this, which was archived from a page in the Wildlife Institute of India website. I do not know if the original page exists anymore, may be in some other URL.--Dwaipayan (talk) 15:54, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
    • Thanks Dwai, the birds and animals seem to be the easiest, but there's a lot of other stuff like dance, art, sport, etc which seem to be something some politician declared and then nothing about it. Also, as far as Elephant goes, I'm guessing we should use the sub-species Indian elephant across the board, since now it's a mix of all sorts. —SpacemanSpiff 16:16, 7 June 2015

Merger discussion - local government

There is a discussion at Talk:Local self-government in India#Merge discussion about whether Panchayati raj (India) should be merged into Local self-government in India. --Bejnar (talk) 20:28, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

G RajNarayan

New BLP G RajNarayan appears to be written by a new editor with a COI as their username RadelIndia (talk · contribs) suggests a connection with Radel, the electronics manufacturing company founded by RajNarayan. However, despite many messages on their talk-page I have got no response. They have been removing standard things like categories and moving the reflist template to external links. Asked for edit summaries twice, none used. If any one thinks they can communicate with them better, please have a go. 220 of Borg 12:26, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

220, the article appears to be a copy of various sources (the lede is from the company's about us page). If you find any of the other sources, do let me know/tag the page, it should definitely be deleted under G12/G11, but I'm waiting to see if you get any responses to your numerous comments to the editor. —SpacemanSpiff 09:07, 11 June 2015 (UTC)
@SpacemanSpiff: waiting, waiting .... I wish I could say "spiffy!", but I can't. I think this is just a case of promotion and page ownership by whoever is writing it. For example I have removed "Mr." from the lead (Per wp:HONORIFIC I believe), and they have again returned it here. They have, finally, learned to use an acceptable citing/referencing method, [9] but then they removed most of that content again [10]!
Oh I see why, the sources and awards were about another person (N R Narayana Murthy) entirely! WT$! They seem to be in the habit of copying wiki 'code' from that page and then 'correcting' it. They also copied the infobox from there, see here. - 220 of Borg 11:36, 11 June 2015 (UTC)
I've had to delete the article under a combination of G11/G12 and have directed the editor to use the AFC process to create a new article. Let's hope they are able to get the message. —SpacemanSpiff 12:19, 11 June 2015 (UTC)
Eh, spiffing what! It should be called "G. Raj Narayan" anyway shouldnt it? 220 of Borg 12:46, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Dr G Satheesh Reddy

Seems to be a 'run' on Indian scientists at the moment. G. Satheesh Reddy was created by a new editor, then in the next edit moved by another 'new' editor to Dr G Satheesh Reddy (Non-mos title?). Odd activity like trying to protect the page claiming, "High level of IP vandalism.", when there were only 7 (mostly) helpful edits by one IP 117.195.254.216 (talk · contribs). Worth keeping an eye on I think. 220 of Borg 12:56, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

And it has been moved back to where it should be, for now. 220 of Borg 16:19, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Babur GAR

Babur, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for an individual good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. - Sitush (talk) 17:07, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Tag & Assess 2014 is done! :)

Great news! The second article assessment drive has been completed and Tag & Assess 2014 is officially over. Kudos to the handful of editors who participated to the best of their abilities to make this happen - (alphabetically) - Cesdeva (talk), Kautilya3 (talk), Ninney (talk), OccultZone (talk), Titodutta (talk), Ugog Nizdast (talk) & VasuVR (talk).

We are also grateful to all those editors who contributed anonymously to this drive. Though it took months, we persisted & we got it done.

Der aaye, durust aaye! goes an old Indian saying (never mind the lateness of a safe return)!

It is hard work & not quite cool to do assessments, but these guys did it! All these editors have earned well-deserved barnstars & some have won medals or awards.

A special mention goes to the top three contributors - VasuVR, Ugog Nizdast & Ninney. Congrats guys.

We request the community participate more widely in these essential maintenance tasks about the WikiProject that we love so much - WikiProject India!

AshLin (talk) 15:00, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Not to forget AshLin who was the brain behind this drive in the first place. Hope we have more editors next time when it's time to organise a new Tag L& Assess drive. - Ugog Nizdast (talk) 15:32, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
Thanks guys, we made a great team :) AshLin (talk) 15:44, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
I didn't contribute to the drive, but will gladly lead the cheering masses. :) Nice work, all! Abecedare (talk) 17:37, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Rfc on Herbert Hope Risley

Please join the discussion. -Kenfyre (talk) 13:08, 15 June 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Food 2015

Wikimedia India chapter is currently running a competition Wiki Loves Food which concludes on 15 June 2015. By my estimation it will have about 7500 images. Some of the images are uncategorised, or inadequately categorised and need improved captions. We can rectify this and also illustrate some of our food articles on Indian food and also create a few new stubs for them. Hope people will contribute some editing time to this as it is a subject dear to the hearts of almost all Indians - food! :)

AshLin (talk) 05:36, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

@CosmicEmperor: might you be interested in this? I noticed that you have recently created many Indian food articles. ‑Ugog Nizdast (talk) 08:01, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, but I don't have much experience in Wikipedia to do whatever they are asking. And I am searching references for new food articles that I want to create.Cosmic  Emperor  08:21, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
  • I will help but, some one has to point on the image that needs work.Prymshbmg (talk) 13:32, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
Find the images here @Prymshbmg:. but not there's not one or two or even a dozen, 8905 and increasing :) AshLin (talk) 14:17, 15 June 2015 (UTC)

Schools in India - overview

We have had a few threads lately regarding various schools-related articles. I've been digging around and we're in a real pickle with them. One issue is the extent to which we are trying to maintain numerous lists that contain (or should contain) fundamentally the same institutions, which makes for a massive duplication of effort.

Just as an idea, and starting from the top, List of schools in India is clearly unworkable, with potentially a million or more entries. We should be diluting that so it just contains links to List of schools in Maharashtra etc. In turn, those state/territory lists can be diluted to a list for each district, and in many cases the district lists can be diluted to towns/cities.

Instead of adopting something like the above, we have the same schools being mentioned at each level and in the articles for the various towns/cities etc. It is complete madness, as is not having a uniform titling for the various lists.

Ignoring the many other problems, more notably sourcing, can we at least get some sort of consensus for the basic organisation and titling. And can we agree on whether or not it is a good idea for the data to be presented as a plain list or as a table. The latter bit has recently surfaced at Talk:List of schools in Mumbai and I am extremely concerned because these are the type of article that attract hoardes of inexperienced contributors who haven't got a clue how to use our table mark-up and thus the maintenance cost becomes horrendous.

Thoughts? - Sitush (talk) 10:23, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Sitush (talk · contribs) I would suggest something like the List of Schools in United States, but modified to match our purpose.
India list - Links to State lists
State lists - Links to City Lists
City lists will finally have the schools listed
all references of schools in the city pages to be moved to the appropriate school list pages. We can take up the list v/s table debate once we have the structuring of Schools in India as a whole sorted out. Also the content of pages like List of Boarding schools in India should be merged into these pages itself. P.S - VisualEditor now supports all basic table functions. Advanced ones are left though. Anonymousbananas (talk) 10:45, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
Additionally a lot many articles are like "Education in Nashik" which contain a horrid mix of all types of colleges and schools and whatnot. Please include a word or two about your stance on such pages ( Split, or let them be ) Anonymousbananas (talk) 11:16, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
What you suggest is basically what I'd already said. I have split out the schools from the Nashik mess - the rest will have to wait. Take a look at List of schools in India#Maharashtra now, and also List of schools in Maharashtra. Click-through from the latter to the town/city lists, none of which have many entries other than that for Mumbai. In creating those lists, I was able to clean up some of the city articles etc also: no article + no source = no mention. Ultimately, every linked article in each list will need some work on the category and See also aspects, if nothing else.
That is an example of how I see things going but I'm not doing any more until other people have had a look and a say. Obviously, the lists will need to be maintained and it might be worth creating a standard edit notice about WP:V and WP:NLIST, although experience tells me that a lot of people seem simply to ignore such notices. - Sitush (talk) 13:48, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
I'd go with Sitush's proposal. Also, don't you think it's time to revisit the community consensus that says that every secondary school is notable? That could generate so much crap, and not just in the Indic area. Vanamonde93 (talk) 14:52, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
I think Sitush's proposal makes sense. Let's go with it. Vanamonde93, you're right but changing community consensus is not going to be easy on this one. Personally, I think categories should take care of all this but .... :) --regentspark (comment) 15:04, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
Meh, you're probably right. Vanamonde93 (talk) 15:36, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
It's not really consensus. WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES merely tells us that high schools usually survive AfD. I don't know if that observation is (still) accurate and I notice the talk page discussions about it over the last couple of years have focused on American high schools. In this village pump discussion a few days ago, there was no clear agreement that secondary schools were inherently notable, let alone that consensus already existed. NebY (talk) 16:18, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Two points:

  • I believe that instead of cities, we should use districts, since the latter have unambiguous boundaries and we won't run into issues of whether a school is within a city, metropolitan area, suburb etc. The city lists can then be redirects to the relevant district page(s).
  • And, as I just commented at Talk:List of schools in Mumbai, we need to nail down the inclusion criterion. Per WP:CSC we essentially have two choices:
  1. Include only those schools that have wikipedia article of their own (where the cited sources presumably establish notability; if they don't those articles can be deleted)
  2. List all the schools in the district. Such a list can be constructed from this official database by selecting the school year, state and district in the top three fields. Note that on average a district has 2,000-3,000 schools, and a substantial fraction of that even if we exclude non-secondary schools.

I prefer the first option, as it's more manageable (although as RegentsPark says, we may as well use categories). Abecedare (talk) 17:33, 18 May 2015 (UTC) .

I understand the problem re: boundaries and have no issues with that. I'd already looked at the database and it is horrendous to use unless a bot is deployed. I've had the argument about categories far too often and I always lose to members of the WP:ARS, who say that both should exist. I've got the feeling we will also lose to them and the Schools project re: any deletions, although there have been various threads of late that suggest a sizeable number of people are questioning the so-called consensus.
I'm working on List of schools in Pune at the moment and I think we might be able to use that as a test case for thrashing out criteria, format etc. It will be easier than using the Mumbai list because it is so much shorter but still includes items without articles, items with unref'd articles, ones where the article is a school group, etc. Give me a few more hours and it will be ready for that discussion, although the best venue might be here or a subpage of this rather than at the list itself. - Sitush (talk) 04:47, 19 May 2015 (UTC)
I'm working on List of schools in Mumbai right now, weeding out redlinks, reffing/citing web address where possible. I just want to add another point of concern to the discussion. If you look at Santacruz Mumbai, it talks a certain deal about schools within para-text. Firstly, Santacruz is an area within Mumbai, the list for which exists. Secondly, though It does talk a little about the significance etc of the educational institutions etc. What do we do about these? Let them be or remove em? Anonymousbananas (talk) 05:36, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

List of schools in Pune now includes every relevant school I can find that has an article or that was unlinked but sourced in an article. I'm sure I will have missed some but I've just reverted this while we have the necessary discussions regarding inclusion criteria. The are some additional schools from Pune district which are listed at List of schools in Maharashtra - if we are going to redirect to List of schools in Pune district then of course these will need to be merged. - Sitush (talk) 21:27, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Would it be wise if instead of deleting the non-notable schools directly, we instead move them to a small list on that article's Talk page for future reference, to allow any editor to add it back to main list as and when (if) any school becomes notbale at a later date ? Anonymousbananas (talk) 11:54, 20 May 2015 (UTC)
They certainly could be moved to the talk page but we will likely end up with more schools on the talk page than in the article. These lists of unsourced/unlinked schools tend to grow rapidly, as anyone who periodically cleans up articles about towns etc will know. - Sitush (talk) 08:29, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Correct Sitush. I would prefer removing all schools with no wiki articles to be removed because with so many schools in India we will never be knowing what is notable and what is not notable. The list will also be ever increasing and it will be difficult to maintain such long lists. It will also be prone to hoax. So it should have an article to get an inclusion in the list. Lakun.patra (talk) 08:07, 25 May 2015 (UTC)
True that, but what about in situations like, lets say D.P.S Gorakhpur (fictional School) does not have a wiki article. Now D.P.S as a parent institution is reputed and notable. Does it make sense to remove this list item too? I think we should remove non-notable school like "St. Francissi of great heights school" or "Sant Nirankari mahanirvahan school" (Sample fake names) In Short, im saying it probably wont hurt to have a few schools in the list which dont have wiki articles as mentioned above and i think any verifiable/notable sources can be substituted for letting a school be in the list instead of a wiki article, like a newspaper article, or in some cases, official websites. Anonymousbananas (talk) 12:15, 25 May 2015 (UTC)
Okay I understand your concern. But if you say a school is NOTABLE, then why not create an article for it. And as per my experience in Wikipedia schools generally pass the notable criteria easily. Be advised that wikipedia is not a collection of lists but is an enyclopedia and not having an wikipedia article of a notable school just beats the sketch. And the problems that we will be facing if we don't allow only blue links are:
1. Long list. Difficult to maintain
2. Prone to hoax - Non- notable schools will also find way into here. Just a passing by ref will then be sufficient to be listed here.
3. Duplicates - We even may have a XYZ school and St. XYZ school. But in real life both will be same.
4. Well for parent institution as notable, then it does not qualify all its subsidiaries to be also notable.
5. There are 75,000+ primary schools and 19,600+ secondary schools in Maharashtra only(as of Sep,2010) and at least 10000 applications are sent every year. Do we need to add every single 1? As most schools will have a newspaper article or at least official website?
6. RTE Act has made it mandatory to have at least one primary school per kilometer and a secondary school every 3 kilometers. Please count the no of schools we will have if implemented.
7. Lastly I do not see any reason to not write an article first on a school (that is considered notable) and then adding it over here. It just serves dual purposes of having a notable article as well as mentioned on the list. Lakun.patra (talk) 05:23, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Has anyone else got any thoughts concerning this? If not then I think we may be heading towards a slash-and-burn process. - Sitush (talk) 20:56, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

I'd like to help out with this as well. When is Consensus considered as 'reached' ? Space.mountain9 (talk) 16:57, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
Is User:Space.mountain9 a User:Anonymousbananas sockpuppet? Hard to believe a newbies first edit is regarding a sortable table. AshLin (talk) 18:09, 15 June 2015 (UTC)

Khap

The article at Khap looks organized, but when I tried to read it, I quickly got lost. The word "khat" seems to be used for a number of different meanings: "council". "republic", "court", "caste". The article seems to be a hodgepodge of historical councils and some imagined formal structure, as well as a complaint about criticism of khap courts. Also, I am unclear how it relates to the article at Caste panchayat. --Bejnar (talk) 20:28, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

@Bejnar:The Khap article is a bit light on the current panchayat system, focusing almost exclusively on the origins. Caste panchayat shouldn't be a separate article though, it should just be a part of this. —SpacemanSpiff 08:06, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

Anarsa

Phenori or Chiroti.

I added a picture to this article that someone recently added to Commons. However on double checking the item in the picture doesn't seem to match other Anarsa image on Google. Is this some unusual variation or another item entirely? Rmhermen (talk) 01:00, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

Rmhermen There seems to be wide variation in appearance. The pic on the page looks like a flaky pastry, some look like a ball, others more like a biscuit/cookie. See here. 220 of Borg 01:29, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Rmhermen, the image you added is the image of Phenori or Chiroti, have a look at my image of phenori in Commons! Are editors doing due diligence about names for a dish in other languages before creating? AshLin (talk) 13:58, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Personal attack

A new editor who knows the term "owning a page", meanwhile making personal attacks diff. Adminstrator-intervention would be welcome here. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 11:57, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Addition of Categories Section in Wikipedia:WikiProject India and others

There should be a Categories section in the article Wikipedia:WikiProject India, Wikipedia:WikiProject Geography of India, etc. With their respective category trees as their body. Please suggest, comment and vote on the topic.Prymshbmg (talk) 06:57, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Just a procedural note, an RfC should be used when there's something that's contentious and not resolved through usual discussions. This doesn't appear to be something like that, I'd suggest withdrawing this and just having a normal discussion. —SpacemanSpiff 07:08, 11 June 2015 (UTC)
  • Now that you have withdrawn your RfC, I'm not even sure what you're trying to ask for here. If you think the cats should be linked from the project pages, they are already there along with the links to the multitude of other types of pages. —SpacemanSpiff 04:01, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
@SpacemanSpiff: I want you to look at Wikipedia:WikiProject Civil engineering Categories section.Prymshbmg (talk) 07:14, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
And I am removing your warning as it is not a RfC anymore. And it doesn't relate to the discussion at all.Please Remove this statement by editing it after you have read it.Prymshbmg (talk) 07:14, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
DO NOT remove my postings on any talk page. This is becoming highly disruptive behavior. —SpacemanSpiff 08:20, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
  • I am requesting to close this discussion with no result as the discussion got off-tracked. and User:SpacemanSpiff has converted this noticeboard into his talk page.Prymshbmg (talk) 08:28, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
@Prymshbmg: you can just be bold and create a hierarchical list of all India project related categories in your userspace and then ask if the list can and should be included at WP:IND page. I am personally skeptical as to whether categories fall into a neat enough hierarchy to make a such a tree-listing feasible; and there are maintainability issues as categories are created, deleted and moved around. But then again, I don't work much in the category area, and this may be a solved problem. Also the list, if made, may be too large (several megabytes in size) to include in toto at WP:INB, in which case it may be better linked. But it is really hard to discuss these issues in the abstract and as with your Infobox for Indian States and UT RFC, I'd recommend that a concrete proposal be presented when starting a discussion/RfC. Abecedare (talk) 17:51, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
@Abecedare: we do not need to create any list we just have to use <categorytree>India</categorytree> and <categorytree>WikiProject India</categorytree> in a new section of the page.Prymshbmg (talk) 14:04, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Like This

Categories

India
India-related lists
Buildings and structures in India
Culture of India
Economy of India
Education in India
Environment of India
Geography of India
Government of India
Health in India
History of India
Organisations based in India
Indian people
Politics of India
Society of India
Images of India
India stubs


more can be learned here Prymshbmg (talk) 14:13, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Caste system in India

Please join the discussion on the talk page of Caste system in India.Soham321 (talk) 00:43, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

Kargil war

Request for comment on an serious RFC going at the talk page of Kargil war here ? Shrikanthv (talk) 09:15, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

Nag Champa

Mmmmmmmmmmmmm, Nag Champa. :) Please comment at the talk. Cheers. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:12, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Siachen glacier

Currently RfC is going on Talk:Siachen Glacier#RfC: Should the infobox say that the glacier is disputed ? to decide does infobox of geographic article should say that "its disputed between India and Pakistan"? (Both India and Pakistan notice boards are informed by me} --Human3015 Call me maybe!! • 19:45, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Peer review and document improvement request

This is a Peer review request to seek broader input to improve page: meta:Help:Form I & Affidavit (Customised for relinquishment of copyright as per 'free cultural work' definition) an option available under (Indian) Copyright act 1957 rules.

Mahitgar (talk) 03:46, 24 June 2015 (UTC)

International Day of Yoga

Need pitures for the first International day of yoga and a logo for the infobox--Sukph (talk) 07:31, 24 June 2015 (UTC)

Copyright Violation Detection - EranBot Project

A new copy-paste detection bot is now in general use on English Wikipedia. Come check it out at the EranBot reporting page. This bot utilizes the Turnitin software (ithenticate), unlike User:CorenSearchBot that relies on a web search API from Yahoo. It checks individual edits rather than just new articles. Please take 15 seconds to visit the EranBot reporting page and check a few of the flagged concerns. Comments welcome regarding potential improvements. These likely copyright violations can be searched by WikiProject categories. Use "control-f" to jump to your area of interest.--Lucas559 (talk) 22:38, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Merger discussion - local government

There is a discussion at Talk:Local self-government in India#Merge discussion about whether Panchayati raj (India) should be merged into Local self-government in India. --Bejnar (talk) 20:28, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

  • Reposted, as there has as yet been no input from this project's members. --Bejnar (talk) 18:53, 30 June 2015 (UTC)
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