Talk:Dwight D. Eisenhower/Archive 3

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Archive 4

Edit request from 46.246.177.230, 20 July 2011

Post-Nominal letters OM

46.246.177.230 (talk) 13:41, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

Not done: If "OM" is included then the post nominals of all his other honours of comparable stature will also have to be included. There are too many, so per WP:POSTNOM it should not be done. Jnorton7558 (talk) 07:28, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Bonus Army

The article states that Ike was the executive officer to General George V. Mosely until 1933, when he became chief military aide to General Douglas MacArthur. How is it then possible that he participated in the violent suppression of the Bonus Army in 1932 as junior aide to MacArthur? There seems to be missing one part in his career, a relativly unpopular one. --Beliar (talk) 18:56, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Cholelithiasis

Should the health section mention that he began to suffer from cholelithiasis in August 1966, for which he underwent surgery on 12 December 1966? (92.7.4.161 (talk) 13:51, 12 August 2011 (UTC))

Tabasco?

My first time commenting, but I am pretty sure Eisenhower did not campaign for tabasco sauce. His K1C2 slogan was "communism, corruption and Korea". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.136.192.166 (talk) 21:23, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

The associated edit was reverted within a few hours. —ADavidB 08:41, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

UFOs?

I'm wondering if a new section could, should be added as I just read, "EX US President Eisenhower was briefed about the presence of extraterrestrial intelligent beings on Earth and was invited to meet alien visitors. Henry W. McElroy, Jr, retiring State Representative to New Hampshire, declared this week that former US President Eisenhower was briefed about the presence of extraterrestrial intelligent beings on Earth.

McElroy also said that the document he viewed while at the State Legislature made referrence to the opportunity for Eisenhower to meet the alien visitors.

The Daily Telegraph May 25, 2010 9:00AM

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/weird/president-told-aliens-are-on-earth/story-e6frev20-1225870887598?from=public_rss"Matthew 19:14, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Need a way better source than that (or the many blogs and such repeating the same story). --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 19:19, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Iran and Suez

I believe the Iranian coup d'etat warrants mention in the introduction since it is a highly controversial event (the United States and United Kingdom deposing an elected leader of a country in order to restore a dictator to power). The foreign policy section ought to mention the fact that no less a person than his own Vice President Richard Nixon claimed that Eisenhower later regretted saving Colonel Nasser in 1956. Also Roger Makins' contemporary account of the secret discussions between Eisenhower and Harold Macmillan at the White House on 25 September 1956 largely confirmed Macmillan's account of the meeting - that Eisenhower talked of the US and UK cooperating to overthrow Nasser, and that the main objective was regime change rather than ownership of the Canal. (92.7.14.190 (talk) 20:15, 12 December 2011 (UTC))

The king of the country (Shah) was not restored to power in the coup. He was in power before, and he was still in power afterward. The coup removed Mosaddegh as prime minister and replaced him with another man more friendly to British and US interests.

Mosaddegh was elected in a farcical election with 99.9% of the results favoring him, and the results seriously questioned by contemporary accounts and by later scholars. Your word 'elected' emphasized Mosaddegh's election unnecessarily, increasing the sense of his legitimacy beyond the fact that he did indeed win the election, by whatever means.

There is no need to argue the importance of the action; it is described in the article body, so it can be mentioned in the lead section per WP:LEAD. The reason people have continually reverted your addition is because of the non-neutral wording you selected. Binksternet (talk) 20:30, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

I was just worried readers might wonder why Eisenhower was reluctant to remove Colonel Nasser in the same way after he had declared himself President of Egypt in a rigged election. (92.7.14.190 (talk) 20:33, 12 December 2011 (UTC))

That kind of analysis is fit for the article body, not for the lead section. Binksternet (talk) 20:40, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Ike was very clear why the British-French-Israeli move was a very bad idea and he never changed his mind. see Eisenhower and Israel: U.S.-Israeli relations, 1953-1960 By Isaac Alteras p 192 online Rjensen (talk) 02:46, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

The United States already had its own plan to bring down Nasser by political and financial means rather than the use of force. The UK's ambassador to Washington Roger Makins was at the secret White House meeting on 25 September, his contemporary report of what was said shows Eisenhower did discuss regime change for Egypt. Furthermore it is worth mentioning that Nixon said Eisenhower told him he regretted saving the Egyptian dictator. (92.7.6.232 (talk) 14:26, 13 December 2011 (UTC))

Meeting with Macmillan

As relayed in Charles Williams' book, Ambassador Makins' official account at the time of the conversation between Eisenhower and Harold Macmillan records Eisenhower talking about the need to "bring Nasser down", which the President agreed was the main issue rather than the Suez Canal. This needs to be mentioned, as it is therefore not surprising that Macmillan assumed the US government would support the military attempt to remove Nasser. (MuammarGunshot (talk) 18:14, 12 January 2012 (UTC))

You appear to want to exonerate Macmillan in his communication to Eden that the USA was behind an invasion. What Williams says Makins' said is that Macmillan heard one thing and assumed another. In other words, Macmillan is not exonerated by Williams or Makins. He still heard one thing and assumed another.

Other reliable sources say that Macmillan gave Eden a false sense of US acceptance of invasion, so Williams is not the only voice.

At any rate, Eisenhower's role in the meeting does not change in any of the versions. Nobody says Ike was trying to fool Macmillan. This Eisenhower biography does not need to spend energy in saving Macmillan's reputation. Binksternet (talk) 19:13, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

The original poster is another sockpuppet of HarveyCarter. This page is full of 'em! Be aware of POV pushing and repeated immediate reversions. Binksternet (talk) 20:42, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

David?

According to here:

President Eisenhower was born David Dwight Eisenhower, not Dwight David Eisenhower as some sources report. His family had always addressed him by his middle name (Dwight) to differentiate him from his father, who was also named David, and later came to be known as Dwight David Eisenhower. Birth records, the Eisenhower family bible, and the Eisenhower's themselves, all confirm he was born David Dwight Eisenhower, and later transposed his first and middle names.

--Hodgson-Burnett's Secret Garden (talk) 20:32, 20 January 2012 (UTC)

I have noted Ambrose's reference to his mother reversing the first two names after birth. Ambrose doesn't go into greater detail on the birth record. I am willing to bet this issue has been discussed in the talk archives if you wish to examine the past handling of the issue here further. Hoppyh (talk) 20:14, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

Correct, it's discussed in Archive 2 and the article addresses this issue with sound sourcing already. --WGFinley (talk) 21:34, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

Images need some work

There is some overcrowding. I have initially removed the following image to help with this. File:American World War II senior military officials, 1945.JPEG|thumb|From left, front row includes army officers Simpson, Patton, Spaatz, Eisenhower, Bradley, Hodges and Gerow in 1945. Hoppyh (talk) 20:08, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

Disagree entirely on removing notable historic images that illustrate the subject. I think there is good formatting and breakup in the article and the article could stand some more images. If there was an overcrowding problem (which I don't think there is) that still wouldn't be a case for outright removal of images, a gallery should be introduced instead. --WGFinley (talk) 21:29, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

You're right...I lapsed into a GA nom mode where editors in my own experience have been more restrictive about overcrowding. (That's why I used the talk p..) I think you are right about use of a gallery here; there are many more pics that could be used. Cheers. Hoppyh (talk) 13:37, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

I have removed the following image at Buchenwald and am replacing it with a pic of the surrender at Rheims, since this is mentioned in the body of the article while the Buchenwald pic is not. File:Ohrdruf Eisenhower 04649.jpg|thumb|210px|Ike views dead prisoners at Buchenwald, 1945. Hoppyh (talk) 21:29, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

Quote not used

I have removed the following quote from a speech Ike never gave, the idea being that the article should use statements actually made. Feel free to restore if deemed appropriate.

Our landings in the Cherbourg-Havre area have failed to gain a satisfactory foothold and I have withdrawn the troops. My decision to attack at this time and place was based on the best information available. The troops, the air and the Navy did all that bravery and devotion to duty could do. If any blame or fault attaches to the attempt, it is mine alone." Hoppyh (talk) 23:43, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

it's a statement that Ike indeed wrote in case of losing, and has been widely cited by historians as showing his sense of responsibility. Rjensen (talk) 07:01, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

I have seen the light. Hoppyh (talk) 15:23, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

Book on Eisenhower, reviewed by The Economist

This book review and the book itself can provide additional detail on the life of Eisehower: http://www.economist.com/node/21550240 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.123.41.188 (talk) 15:56, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

File:Eisenhower Painting.jpg Nominated for Deletion

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Ambrose "quotes" on civil rights

I previously removed (and will remove again) the speculation attributed to Ambrose about Eisenhower never accepting Plesy v Ferguson. There is -no- documentary evidence of any such statement, and the interview in which Ambrose claims he said it never happened (see the New Yorker "Channeling Ike" article for more on Ambrose's fabrication). Below is a footnote from Smith's "Eisenhower in War and Peace" to explain it further.

Please do not add this quote back without some other reference than Ambrose's interview, as I think no serious historian believe it happened (or at least I was unable to find anyone seriously supporting it).

"1984, Stephen Ambrose published the first of several biographies of Eisenhower. In it he stated that “Eisenhower personally wished that the Court had upheld Plessy v. Ferguson.” The allegation is repeated by Ambrose in his subsequent works. Because of Ambrose’s position as an associate editor of the Eisenhower Papers, a generation of historians have accepted his version of Ike’s views. Ambrose provides no documentation, no references, and cites only “private” conversations. The fact is Ambrose cut the allegation from whole cloth. There is no evidence whatsoever to sustain Ambrose’s claim. David A. Nichols, in his definitive study of Eisenhower and civil rights, writes that “there is no credible evidence” for Ambrose’s assertion; Blanche Wiesen Cook, one of the earliest researchers in the archives of the Eisenhower Library, found none, nor have I. In the April 26, 2010, issue of The New Yorker magazine, Richard Rayner reports that Ambrose’s alleged interviews with Eisenhower never took place. The record does not sustain that he ever met privately with Ike. Timothy D. Rives, deputy director of the Eisenhower Presidential Library, provided chapter and verse sustaining Rayner’s conclusions in a subsequent article appearing online on George Mason University’s History News Network, May 17, 2010.

Smith, Jean Edward (2012-02-21). Eisenhower in War and Peace (Kindle Locations 13977-13987). Random House, Inc.. Kindle Edition. " — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.197.182.198 (talk) 02:38, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

De-linking of title in lead/infobox

I've noticed that someone has de-linked "President of the United States" in the lead and infobox for this article, as well as the Harry S. Truman article. It's not a terribly urgent thing, but I wonder why this is the case. I'm not one for undoing someone's contribution if I'm not certain of the intention. So, what's the purpose of de-linking the title in the lead and infobox? Tyrol5 [Talk] 16:38, 5 May 2012 (UTC)

It's been changed back by another editor and looks much better now, especially the main photo. Don't mind me. Tyrol5 [Talk] 17:01, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Source for reactivation post-Presidency

http://eisenhower.archives.gov/All_About_Ike/Post_Presidential/Post_Presidential.html (The website is not Firefox compatible, use IE Tab if using Firefox)

http://www.eisenhower.utexas.edu/all_about_ike/post_presidential.html updated Giuseppe Caruso (talk) 06:07, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

Section on health

Ike's heart failure is mentioned as the cause of death on the page, but not the contributing adrenal pheochromocytoma, which plagued Ike for years. See "The President and the Pheochromocytoma," http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17478167 Any mention of this would increase public awareness of this condition. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 110.165.229.61 (talk) 13:13, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 3 October 2012

Hello, Nationality information of <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower> is not available now. I was using this information which is connected to nationality property of dbpedia resource <http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dwight_D._Eisenhower>. I use this resource to executing FedBench Cross Domain queries (for this topic it is result of http://iwb.fluidops.com:7879/resource/fbench:q/cross-domain_3 ), for evaluation phase of federated query engine. I want to receive result to this query without being obliged to download and open an subset of old dbpedia dump uploaded in fedbench, naturally I want to query original dbpedia endpoint <http://dbpedia.org/sparql> and receive up to date result. Please add nationality information <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States> to this resource <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower>, so it will be updated on dbpedia after editing on wikipedia. Regards, Burak Yönyül Burakyonyul (talk) 11:23, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

Not done: I think this is redundant given that Eisenhower was President of the United States and a high-ranking officer in that country's military before that. If there is a specific place in the article where you believe this needs to be mentioned please let me know and I will reconsider. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 20:58, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

Hi, The nationality information is avilable on this president : <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Clements?oldid=493288459> and on many others. Isn't it nice to add this information to <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower> too. So it will be consistent with most of other American presidents. Regards, Burak Yönyül — Preceding unsigned comment added by Burakyonyul (talk • contribs) 06:32, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Bill Clements was not a President of the United States; he was a Governor of Texas, which is considered a lower level political office (perhaps you have him confused with Bill Clinton). I have not yet seen any article on a U.S. President that includes nationality information in the infobox, and I think if we were to add this information it should be done on all 43 U.S. Presidents. If you wish to propose this I recommend going to WikiProject U.S. Presidents. Again if I've missed something please let me know. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 15:07, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

typo

search for "do not see now" which should be "do not see how", it seems. Benvhoff (talk) 08:38, 16 October 2012 (UTC)

This is corrected. Thanks —ADavidB 17:08, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

Change of name from Eisenhauer to Eisenhower

The introduction to the article claims that the name Eisenhauer was changed to Eisenhower when the family immigrated from Germany. However, according to Michael Korda's book, Ike (page 60), Jacob Eisenhauer, Ike's grandfather, kept the name, at least for some time. By the time Ike's father opened a general store, the name had been changed to Eisenhower (page 63). The reference is: Korda, M., "Ike: an American Hero", 2007, Harper Collins. Pigdog234 (talk) 09:54, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

By the way, the German spelling had changed around 1650. Before that "Frau" had been spelled "Fraw" and "hauen" was written "hawen" (also "und" was written "vnd" ect.). So it's very likely, that the German Eisenhower family had been spelled "Eisenhawer", or actually even more likely "Eysenhawer".--Demoiselle Clarisse (talk) 16:59, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

A link to Marshall Plan article

In this section President at Columbia University and NATO Supreme Commander

"a study group he led as president concerning the political and military implications of the Marshall Plan"

Linking "Marshall Plan" to its article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan, would be useful

AreebAlowisheq (talk) 09:00, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Agreed, and done. Thanks. —ADavidB 15:56, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Promotions

The article doesn't mention any promotions after the promotion to Brigadier General. Shouldn't this info be inserted?Ishboyfay (talk) 00:08, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

Use of "Ike"

Should we not perhaps avoid the use of "Ike" when referring to President Eisenhower except where required by context? Phrases such as "Conner's comment on Ike was..." and "Ike's sense of responsibility was underscored by his draft of a statement to be issued if the invasion failed..." presuppose an unwarranted familiarity

Skimitar (talk) 07:53, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request 12/15/2012

The second to last sentence of the third paragraph of the "Early life and education" section reads as follows: "In 1948, Eisenhower said he was "one of the most deeply religious men I know" though unattached to any "sect or organization"."

This sentence, nor the previous sentence, alludes to who Eisenhower is talking about (who "he" is). Is he talking about himself? This is confusing and random; please remove the sentence or correct it. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.128.77.251 (talk) 20:56, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

This is corrected. The cited source at the end of the paragraph showed that Eisenhower was speaking of himself. —ADavidB 06:01, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Edit Request 2/5/2013

Any citations that use Stephen Ambrose should be removed. Ambrose novel's embellish certain aspects of Eisenhower's life by citing interviews that were in reality much shorter than Ambrose proclaimed, and the author repeatedly ignores facts in order to create a more complete narrative. http://www.newyorker.com/talk/2010/04/26/100426ta_talk_rayner Cheers, Reddevil1421 (talk) 23:11, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

Categories

I just counted 84 categories for this page. Should this be reduced? 84 is alot.--Solomonfromfinland (talk) 15:55, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

From WP:CAT, "each categorized page should be placed in all of the most specific categories to which it logically belongs." Overly broad categories could be narrowed, or removed if a more specific subcategory is present. —ADavidB 17:20, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Peacefull

How are Eisenhower terms "peacefull" if he was President during the Korean War. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.109.103.190 (talk) 17:24, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

Eisenhower was president from 1953 to 1961. The Korean War ended in mid-1953. The article states his terms were "peaceful ones for the most part". —ADavidB 16:37, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

Taxes

from the section on President at Columbia University and NATO Supreme Commander "During that year Eisenhower's memoir, Crusade in Europe, ....Eisenhower's profit on the book was substantially aided by an unprecedented ruling by the Treasury Department that Eisenhower was not a professional writer, but rather, marketing the lifetime asset of his experiences, and thus only had to pay capital gains tax on his $635,000 advance instead of the much higher personal tax rate. The ruling saved Eisenhower approximately $400,000. " Very interesting. How much during Eisenhower's presidency did the tax rates change? How much was his influence on these changes ? Wfoj2 (talk) 23:35, 27 March 2013 (UTC)

Ike showed no interest in tax policy. (He was however worried about the national debt and so he tried to cut spending including the army). Rjensen (talk) 00:14, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

1960 U-2 incident

I was thinking of adding a sub-section as to the May 1960, U-2 incident with pilot, Francis Gary Powers. The matter is very briefly mentioned and linked in the lede but not in the body of the article, as it should be. Kierzek (talk) 00:56, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

good idea. Rjensen (talk) 01:16, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Something like this:

1960 U-2 incident

On May 1, 1960, a U.S. one-man U-2 spy plane was reportedly shot down at high altitude over the airspace of the Soviet Union. The U-2 "spy-in-the-sky" was allowed to use the Pakistan Air Force portion of Peshawar Airport to gain vital photo intelligence in an era before satellite observation over the Soviet Union. Previously, on April 9, 1960, there had been a successful U-2 flight over the southern national boundary of the Soviet Union in the area of Pamir Mountains and it flew over four Soviet top secret military installations. The U-2 was detected by the Soviet Air Defense Forces but avoided interception and landed safely in Iran.

On May 1, fifteen days before the scheduled opening of an East–West summit conference in Paris, Captain Francis Gary Powers, left in a U-2 from the US base in Peshawar to overfly the Soviet Union, photographing ICBM sites in and around Sverdlovsk and Plesetsk, then land at Bodø in Norway. Flying over the Soviet Union, the U-2 was detected, however, it could not be brought down by standard fighter-jet aircraft. The U-2 was eventually brought down near Degtyarsk, Ural Region, by the first of several SA-2 Guideline (S-75 Dvina) surface-to-air missiles. Powers bailed out and was captured soon after parachuting down onto Russian soil. Four days after Powers disappeared, NASA issued a very detailed press release noting that an aircraft had "gone missing" north of Turkey. The press release speculated that the pilot might have fallen unconscious while the autopilot was still engaged, even falsely claiming that "the pilot reported over the emergency frequency that he was experiencing oxygen difficulties."

Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev announced to the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union, and thus the world, that a "spy-plane" had been shot down but intentionally made no reference to the pilot. As a result, the Eisenhower Administration, thinking the pilot had died in the crash, authorized the release of a cover story claiming that the plane was a "weather research aircraft" which had unintentionally strayed into Soviet airspace after the pilot had radioed "difficulties with his oxygen equipment" while flying over Turkey. The Soviets put Captain Powers on trial and displayed parts of the U-2 spy plane which had been recovered almost fully intact. The 1960 Four Power Paris Summit between President Dwight Eisenhower, Nikita Khrushchev, Harold Macmillan and Charles de Gaulle collapsed, in large part because Eisenhower refused to accede to Khrushchev's demands that he apologize for the incident. Powers was interrogated extensively by the KGB for months before he made a forced confession and a public apology. The incident set back talks between Khrushchev and Eisenhower. On August 19, 1960, Powers was convicted of espionage against the Soviet Union and sentenced to three years in imprisonment followed by seven years of hard labor. He served one year and nine months of the sentence before being exchanged for Rudolf Abel on February 10, 1962.

I will add in the cites. Most of it is copy edits from the U-2 incident article. What do you think? Kierzek (talk) 02:13, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

The proposed section seems too heavy on detail for inclusion in this article. Perhaps the first two paragraphs could be trimmed and combined. I like the third paragraph's linkage to Eisenhower. —ADavidB 17:01, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

yes the text has too little on Eisenhower and too much on the U2. It was a major diplomatic setback ruining what he thought would be a graceful exit. Rjensen (talk) 17:38, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Re-edit

On May 1, 1960, a U.S. one-man U-2 spy plane was reportedly shot down at high altitude over the airspace of the Soviet Union. The U-2 "spy-in-the-sky" was allowed to use the Pakistan Air Force portion of Peshawar Airport to gain vital photo intelligence in an era before satellite observation over the Soviet Union.

The flight occurred fifteen days before the scheduled opening of an East–West summit conference in Paris. Once over the Soviet Union, the U-2 was detected. The U-2 was eventually brought down by a SA-2 Guideline (S-75 Dvina) surface-to-air missile. Captain Francis Gary Powers bailed out and was captured soon after parachuting down onto Russian soil. Four days after Powers disappeared, the Eisenhower Administration had NASA issue a very detailed press release noting that an aircraft had "gone missing" north of Turkey. The press release speculated that the pilot might have fallen unconscious while the autopilot was still engaged, even falsely claiming that "the pilot reported over the emergency frequency that he was experiencing oxygen difficulties."

Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev announced that a "spy-plane" had been shot down but intentionally made no reference to the pilot. As a result, the Eisenhower Administration, thinking the pilot had died in the crash, authorized the release of a cover story claiming that the plane was a "weather research aircraft" which had unintentionally strayed into Soviet airspace after the pilot had radioed "difficulties with his oxygen equipment" while flying over Turkey. The Soviets put Captain Powers on trial and displayed parts of the U-2 spy plane which had been recovered almost fully intact. The 1960 Four Power Paris Summit between President Dwight Eisenhower, Nikita Khrushchev, Harold Macmillan and Charles de Gaulle collapsed, in large part because Eisenhower refused to accede to Khrushchev's demands that he apologize for the incident. Up until this event, Eisenhower felt he had been making progress towards better relations with the Soviet Union. At the summit, nuclear arms reduction and Berlin were to have been discussed. Eisenhower stated it had all been ruined because of that "stupid U-2 business". The affair was an embarrassment for United States prestige. Further, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee held a lengthy inquiry into the U-2 incident. In Russia, Captain Powers was interrogated extensively by the KGB before he made a forced confession and a public apology. On August 19, 1960, Powers was convicted of espionage against the Soviet Union and sentenced to three years in imprisonment followed by seven years of hard labor. On February 10, 1962, Powers was exchanged for Rudolf Abel in Berlin and returned to the U.S.

Gentlemen, feel free to tweak it or comment. Kierzek (talk) 00:13, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

It still seems to have far more U2 info than is needed in Eisenhower's article. Much of what's in other articles doesn't need to be repeated here. Unfortunately I won't have much time for a while to go through and suggest specific modifications. Source citations would be helpful too. —ADavidB 08:20, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I will tweak it again soon, as time allows. Kierzek (talk) 02:52, 20 April 2013 (UTC)

re-edit 2

On May 1, 1960, a U.S. one-man U-2 spy plane was reportedly shot down at high altitude over the airspace of the Soviet Union. The flight was made to gain photo intelligence before the scheduled opening of an East–West summit conference which had been scheduled in Paris, 15 days later. Captain Francis Gary Powers had bailed out and was captured soon after parachuting down onto Russian soil. Four days after Powers disappeared, the Eisenhower Administration had NASA issue a very detailed press release noting that an aircraft had "gone missing" north of Turkey. The press release speculated that the pilot might have fallen unconscious while the autopilot was still engaged, even falsely claiming that "the pilot reported over the emergency frequency that he was experiencing oxygen difficulties."

Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev announced that a "spy-plane" had been shot down but intentionally made no reference to the pilot. As a result, the Eisenhower Administration, thinking the pilot had died in the crash, authorized the release of a cover story claiming that the plane was a "weather research aircraft" which had unintentionally strayed into Soviet airspace after the pilot had radioed "difficulties with his oxygen equipment" while flying over Turkey. The Soviets put Captain Powers on trial and displayed parts of the U-2 which had been recovered almost fully intact. The 1960 Four Power Paris Summit between President Dwight Eisenhower, Nikita Khrushchev, Harold Macmillan and Charles de Gaulle collapsed because of the incident. Eisenhower refused to accede to Khrushchev's demands that he apologize. Therefore Khrushchev would not take part in the summit. Up until this event, Eisenhower felt he had been making progress towards better relations with the Soviet Union. At the summit, nuclear arms reduction and Berlin were to have been discussed. Eisenhower stated it had all been ruined because of that "stupid U-2 business". The affair was an embarrassment for United States prestige. Further, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee held a lengthy inquiry into the U-2 incident. In Russia, Captain Powers made a forced confession and apology. On August 19, 1960, Powers was convicted of espionage and sentenced to imprisonment. On February 10, 1962, Powers was exchanged for Rudolf Abel in Berlin and returned to the U.S.

Notes

Kierzek (talk) 17:29, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

This looks good. Thank you for reworking it. The photo should have a simple caption added – something like "a U-2 reconnaissance aircraft in flight". —ADavidB 18:01, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

On further consideration, this expanded content on the U-2 incident may be most appropriate in the Presidency of Dwight D. Eisenhower article. —ADavidB 02:33, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. As for the addition, it needs to have a mention in the main body of this article; it was an important event, and but for one short linked sentence in the lede is not discussed; and since it is mentioned in the lede, it therefore needs to be in the main body, as well, per WP:LEAD. Mention in the Presidency article is fine too. I have to go for now. Cheers, Kierzek (talk) 14:04, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

I added "1960 U-2 incident" subsection at end of Foreign policy subsection, with cites. Cheers, Kierzek (talk) 15:07, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

I was thinking maybe less in this article and the full description in the Presidency article. I reworded two sentences. —ADavidB 16:00, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

I don't think there is much more that can be trimmed, but I am open to consider your thoughts on it. Kierzek (talk) 20:11, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

I added by copy edit, an edited version with cites over to the Presidency article. Kierzek (talk) 01:30, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Eisenhower and Patton

The article stated that Eisenhower reprimanded Patton for giving a "grossly errant speech". Actually, that event has been exaggerated. Patton made that speech in Knutsford in which he said it was "the evident destiny of the British and the Americans - and of course, the Russians - to rule the world after the war." Unfortunately, many newspaper accounts left out the part about the Russians, and Patton was unfairly accused of snubbing them. Eisenhower was told the facts, but he still considered relieving Patton of command for the simple reason that he was getting sick and tired of having to cover for him. Patton had no business commenting on postwar policy, so he deserved the reprimand, but let's not accuse him of more than he actually did.97.73.64.156 (talk) 01:44, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Second Term

Article needs a section on the 1956 election156.99.108.1 (talk) 18:57, 24 August 2013 (UTC)

Award categories

A user boldly removed a bunch of award categories from the article. I temporarily reversed this because I think such a major change should probably be discussed. It's questionable to me whether some of these award categories should exist—but here, the question is while they do exist, should this article be removed from all of them, some of them, or none of them? Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 20:00, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

• Without the awards categories, Eisenhower is still in 30 categories. That is still so many that it will overwhelm most users. I think he should be removed from absolutely all awards cats.John Pack Lambert (talk) 20:05, 11 September 2013 (UTC)
• Comment Some of these awards are ones that in some cases are the key to a person's notability, such as possibly some of the crosses of war from maybe France or Belgium. However it is not a notable fact for Eisenhower that he got those awards.John Pack Lambert (talk) 20:21, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Presidency section

Should the "Presidency" sections be significantly shortened, with the bulk of its material moved over to Presidency of Dwight D. Eisenhower? Even though that's supposedly the "main article" about his presidency, the Presidency section here is far more comprehensive on the subject than is that entire article. As things stand currently, it actually seems pointless to me for that article to even exist. 76.169.117.161 (talk) 06:53, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Why isn't there a part about criticism of Eisenhower? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.234.203.191 (talk) 12:18, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

Citation needed

This statement rings phoney: "Dwight developed a keen and enduring interest in exploring outdoors, hunting/fishing, cooking and card playing from an illiterate named Bob Davis who lived by the river." It sounds like the SNL sketch of the motivational speaker who lives in a van down by the river. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.253.136.138 (talk) 17:49, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Never mind. Reference [6] p. 23 has thr Bob Davis story. Davis is described as a trapper, guide, and fisherman (and illiterate), but does not locate his residence by the river.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.253.136.138 (talk) 18:07, 27 April 2013‎ (UTC)

I also have yet to find a reliable source that states Davis lived "by" the river. Eisenhower wrote (in At Ease; current reference 28) that they "spent weekends together on the river" though that's not a clear statement that Davis lived there. —ADavidB 00:34, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

On reviewing reliable sources, I could only verify that Davis camped on the (Smoky Hill) river. I added source citations and tweaked the text accordingly. —ADavidB 02:09, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Another citation request, for the statement "Upon discovery of the Nazi concentration camps, he ordered camera crews to document evidence of the atrocities in them for use in the Nuremberg Trials." There are varying versions of whom he ordered to visit the concentration camps (the other version says any US troops that were nearby: "Eisenhower also ordered every American soldier in the area who was not on the front lines to visit Ohrdruf and Buchenwald." -- this version is at the Eisenhower Memorial website on the Wayback Machine, at http://web.archive.org/web/20041112001453/http://www.eisenhowermemorial.org/stories/death-camps.htm ). Does anyone know of a source that quotes the order verbatim? WilliamWQuick (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 18:06, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Birth name

The infobox has his birth name as David Dwight Eisenhower without any explanation. Surely that isn't correct, is it? 92.40.249.156 (talk) 22:12, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

It is correct, and it is explained--in the text of the article, should you get a chance to read it. Lithistman (talk) 22:37, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

Contract bridge

Moments ago I added this column as a source for the listing at List of contract bridge people#Famous people and bridge:

< ref >Walker, Karen (June 2009). "D-Day Memories of the Bridge Player in Chief". [ACBL] District 8 Advocate (Illinois, in part; online at comcast.net/~dist8adv). [1]. Retrieved 2015-01-10.</ref>

--P64 (talk) 18:42, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Overruled or not?

The next to last paragraph in the "Tributes and Memorials" section states:

"President Dwight D. Eisenhower, an Augusta National member, hit the tree so many times that, at a 1956 club meeting, he proposed that it be cut down. Not wanting to offend the president, the club's chairman, Clifford Roberts, immediately adjourned the meeting rather than reject the request."

However, the cited source states: "Clifford Roberts, the club chairman and co-founder, overruled the president and adjourned the meeting."

This is obviously not a matter of great importance. However, because I have mislaid my Wikipedia login information, I will leave any changes to active editors. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.208.246.22 (talk) 13:47, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

Shall we mention Executive Order 10450, which is very significant in Eisenhower's relations with the LGBTQ community? Allyn (talk) 21:48, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

I did not see any referrals to Eisenhower issuing executive order 10450, for which called the investigation and firing of anyone who is gay in the U.S. civil service. This is source in many places including here in Wikipedia. Would any of you object if I mention it here? Allyn (talk) 21:48, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

Would that not go under Presidency of Dwight D. Eisenhower. Under what context would it be mentioned, (as I read it) the order applies to any personal matters that would mark a candidate out as "unsuitable" for federal post.GraemeLeggett (talk) 14:11, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

Iranian coup

The 1953 Iranian coup d'état must be mentioned in the introduction, as it was by far the most controversial event of his presidency. (FrancesJefferson (talk) 16:58, 23 August 2015 (UTC))

Do the sources say that? And there's finite room in lede which has to give an overview of the whole article, if mentioned it might have to be brief. GraemeLeggett (talk) 17:33, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

I'm in agreement with GraemeLeggett. As far as it being the most controversial event in his presidency -- sources for that to support such a claim? -- WV ● ✉ ✓ 17:47, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

FYI, FrancesJefferson has been blocked as yet another sock of HarveyCarter. Favonian (talk) 18:15, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Thought the account and the edits looked fishy (or "socky"). Thanks, Favonian. -- WV ● ✉ ✓ 18:21, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Civil Rights, Earl Warren, "Big Black Bucks" and Steven Ambrose

As anyone that studies Eisenhower knows by now, anything that Ambrose attributes to his "personal interviews" with Eisenhower, which didn't actually take place, need to be vetted from a third source. And not one that just points back to the same inventions.

There are two totally discredited urban legends that people come along and add for some reason:

1) That Eisenhower stated that Earl Warren was his "worst mistake as President" because Warren was progressive. Never said it. Didn't happen. Or at least we can't prove it. If you can, and it does not involve a chain of references back to fictional Amrbose inventions, please add it back.

2) That Eisenhower made some statement about Southerners not being "all that bad", they just "don't want some big black buck sitting next to their little blonde girl" (paraphrased). Again, no one has a credible reference for this.

Please do not add these back without a non-circular reference back to the same discredited or absent source. They are exceptionally ad-hominem and exception claims require exceptional evidence.

I'd really like to lock that section until people figure it out, but so far as I'm aware you cannot lock only a section. Davepl (talk) 01:57, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

While the fact that Eisenhower had stated that Earl Warren was his "worst mistake as President" is disputed, it is not an urban legend that Eisenhower told Earl Warren that Southerners "don't want some big black buck sitting next to their little blonde girl". Warren himself stated that in his memoirs, published after his death in 1974. There are reliable sources: [2],[3][4]!Olegwiki (talk) 20:58, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

That NYTimes article does qualify Warren's memoir with "While writing his book, Warren may have been feeling especially bitter toward Eisenhower, who had been quoted as saying that Warren’s appointment was one of his biggest mistakes as president" which may be a warning that Warren is unreliable. It's not clear also whether the article author is quoting Warren or quoting Warren quoting Ike. A direct reference to the memoirs would be more useful. GraemeLeggett (talk) 22:36, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

It is not only the NYTimes article, there are other reliable sources which I have mentioned.Olegwiki (talk) 11:47, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

I don't know, that looks like an unsubstantiated quote of a quote, not original reporting by the NYT. If an NYT reporter heard it an reported it, that'd be plenty. Given there are NO first-person accounts, it likely was never said (as a guess). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.17.192.70 (talk) 18:43, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

Also, of the references about the "Big Buck" comment only the third carries any weight, and I can't tell what the citation is there, as it's ALSO not a direct quote (but if you have the book or Google Books does and can tell me what -their- source is, their note 18, that'd be handy). 24.17.192.70 (talk) 18:45, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

Health Issues - Interesting speculaton from an insider

Several years ago I had an acquaintance who was friendly with a blood relative (whom I rather not name) of President Eisenhower. I knew that Ike was a heavy smoker for years but didn’t know at the time if he had ever quit. Out of curiosity, I asked my acquaintance to ask his friend that question which he kindly did. He responded that his friend had replied that it was funny that he asked him that question. Ike’s relative had been doing some research (perhaps for a projected biography) and discovered that while at Columbia there was an unaccounted for period when Ike was in seclusion and when he reemerged he had quit smoking. Ike’s relative recounted that there was speculation that Ike had suffered a minor heart attack which had been covered up due to his possible interest in running for president. This article states that Ike had “given himself an order” to quit in 1949, but says nothing about his reasons.

I know this cannot be added to the article as it is purely anecdotal and speculative at that. I just thought it was interesting.HistoryBuff14 (talk) 22:54, 5 November 2015 (UTC)

Operation Wetback

Eisenhower's deportation of Mexicans in Operation Wetback has been in the news lately. Shouldn't this at least be mentioned in the DDE article? Kdammers (talk) 18:27, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

It has a paragraph in the Presidency of Dwight D. Eisenhower article's "Domestic affairs" section. —ADavidB 19:37, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Vietnam

Eisenhower did a lot to help the French in Vietnam. The introduction was misleading so I corrected it. (79.67.120.118 (talk) 16:20, 16 November 2015 (UTC))

the main point is that he did not send US soldiers or warplanes. Rjensen (talk) 16:27, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

He did send warplanes and US pilots. (79.67.120.118 (talk) 16:28, 16 November 2015 (UTC))

you need a cite for that claim. Rjensen (talk) 16:29, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

On March 3, 1954, twelve C-119s of the 483rd Troop Carrier Wing ("Packet Rats") based at Ashiya, Japan, were painted with France's insignia and loaned to France with 24 CIA pilots for short-term use. Maintenance was carried out by the US Air Force and airlift operations were commanded by McCarty. (79.67.120.118 (talk) 16:31, 16 November 2015 (UTC))

those were transports, not bombers. and they amounted to very little aid. Rjensen (talk) 16:33, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

US pilots also flew in support of the French in November 1953. (79.67.120.118 (talk) 16:34, 16 November 2015 (UTC))

passenger planes or bombers? no cites provided. the claim was "Eisenhower did a lot to help the French in Vietnam."' -- no RS says that Rjensen (talk) 16:36, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Eisenhower did everything he could to support French colonialism in Vietnam. Two US bomber pilots were killed during Operation Castor. (79.67.120.118 (talk) 16:40, 16 November 2015 (UTC))

Ike strongly rejected any American combat ops. He provided $ and supplies and let the French do the fighting. see Ambrose V2 "The President himself said that he could not visualize a ground troop operation in Indochina that would be supported by the people of the United States" Rjensen (talk) 06:14, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

That's a lie. US pilots flew bombing missions with the French in November 1953. (79.67.105.45 (talk) 07:44, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

says who? Rjensen (talk) 08:00, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

CIA files that were made public in 2005, and remarks made by the French ambassador in Washington. (79.67.105.45 (talk) 09:46, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

you need a reliable secondary source. 10:16, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

You can read the declassified CIA files online. The US air force flew multiple bombing raids with the French air force throughout Operation Castor and the siege of Dien Bien Phu. (79.67.105.45 (talk) 10:42, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

no--you need a reliable secondary source. Rjensen (talk) 10:54, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

The CIA's own files are not reliable? (79.67.105.45 (talk) 11:26, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

uninterpreted raw data is a no-no for Wikipedia. read wp:RS and of course you do not actually cite these files which run millions of pages. what do the files actually say about Ike's decision? Rjensen (talk) 11:35, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

They say he began to give more and more help to the French in late 1953 right until the defeat at Dien Bien Phu. (79.67.115.88 (talk) 16:02, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

the CIA files do not appear to be online--what source if any are you using?? Rjensen (talk) 16:07, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

They were. There are multiple reports about it online. It's even covered in articles on this site. (79.67.115.88 (talk) 16:17, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

you have been unable to cite any sources you claim to use. zero. zip. so why believe any of your claims? I think you perhaps used Wikipedia as a secret source and that is not allowed Rjensen (talk) 16:29, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

All the information has been in the First Indochina War article since it was released in 2005. Eisenhower sent US pilots to take part in bombing raids with the French in 1953 and 1954. (79.67.115.88 (talk) 16:34, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

well that's your problem. You have not looked at ANY reliable sources -- and Wikipedia can never be used as a self-reference. Rjensen (talk) 16:35, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Why are you so desperate to pretend Eisenhower did not help the French in Vietnam? (79.67.115.88 (talk) 16:37, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

He gave $ and supplies but strongly insisted no 'boots on the ground' --so that is an important precedent (to use a 2015 term). Rjensen (talk) 16:40, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Allowing US pilots to take part in bombing raids is not "boots on the ground". It's also mentioned in the "CIA activities in Laos" article. (79.67.115.88 (talk) 16:44, 17 November 2015 (UTC))

Pointing to 'mention' in other Wikipedia articles is not sufficient. Read WP:V if you care about this, which as an editor you should – it's a core content policy. Please also consider reading how to identify reliable sources. —ADavidB 00:48, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Eisenhower's Name

According to the first episode of the current (2015-2016) season of America: Facts vs. Fiction (Tuesdays on the American Heroes Channel), Eisenhower's full name is David Dwight Eisenhower, not Dwight David Eisenhower.

HankW512 (talk) 22:34, 19 November 2015 (UTC)

This is covered in the article, in the fourth paragraph of the "Early life and education" section. His name at birth was "David Dwight" and was changed later to "Dwight David". —ADavidB 11:18, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

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Article photo

I'm proposing a new Main Article photo. There is nothing wrong with the current photo. However, there is not much consistency of photos from Roosevelt to Johnson.

It is as follows;

• Roosevelt's photo is black and white
• Truman's photo is black and white
• Eisenhower's photo is colour
• Kennedy's photo is black and white
• Johnson's photo is colour

To add to the consistency, I propose to use one of the photo's below

• 
  General of the Army portrait
• 
  Presidential portrait

So then the Article photo's would be as follows;

• 
• 
• 
• 
• 

or

• 
• 
• 
• 
• 

instead of;

• 
• 
• 
• 
• 

Preferably, It should be the General of the Army photo.

Thoughts? Caviar Cohort (talk) 08:49, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

There is no need for any consistency between articles in this respect. And the uniformed picture presents a certain POV. Rmhermen (talk) 03:41, 8 February 2016 (UTC)

This is not an area where consistency matters. This is a very high quality portrait already.   Spartan7W §   14:35, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

Eisenhower's Scotch-Irish roots.

Should I add the category of 'American People of Scotch-Irish Descent' to this article. This category has been removed before. It is known that his father was primarily Swiss-German, but his maternal great-grandmother, Mary Ann Hannah was the daughter of Scottish-Irish settlers Robert Hannah, born in Ulster, Ireland and Mary Kilpatrick, also born in Ulster. Details of this Scotch-Irish ancestry can be found here.

The source provided includes "family trees submitted ... by users" and "can change over time as users edit". It is not a reliable source. —ADavidB 17:48, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

I agree with Adavidb--leave it out. not a RS. Rjensen (talk) 19:19, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

I'll leave it out. However, I've found a newspaper article from the Times Daily in 1953, saying that Eisenhower had 'a trace of Irish on his maternal side'. Although, this would imply Native Irish ancestry, rather than Scots-Irish. If you'd like to look at this for yourself, here is a link. I'm unsure as to who wrote the article or it's accuracy.--JoeyofScotia (talk) 19:43, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

Having a "trace" of something in one's bloodline is just not notable. Also, if it is unsupported in the text of the article, it's not appropriate to add it as a category. Scr★pIron^IV 16:38, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

The Eisenhower presidential library has a family tree showing German names on both sides: [5] Rmhermen (talk) 02:06, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

Tributes and memorials

I have not changed the quoted paragraph below, but I am in strong disbelief that Switzerland was an inspiration for the US highway system. It was rather the other way around, since the first material stretch of Swiss "autobahn" was only built in the 1960ies. See also Motorways_of_Switzerland. Furthermore, Eisenhower did not have any Army experiences in Switzerland during World War II. The country remained neutral and was not invaded by any of the belligerent parties.

>The Interstate Highway System is officially known as the 'Dwight D. Eisenhower National System of Interstate and Defense Highways' in his honor.

>It was inspired in part by Eisenhower's own Army experiences in World War II, where he recognized the advantages of the autobahn systems

>in Germany, Austria and Switzerland — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.82.112.188 (talk) 13:35, 15 October 2016 (UTC)

A related source is provided in the article's 'Interstate Highway System' section and reads as follows: "While in Europe during World War II General Eisenhower viewed the ease of travel on the German autobahns. That, coupled with the experiences of a young Lt. Col. Eisenhower in the 1919 Transcontinental Convoy, convinced the President of the overwhelming need for safer and speedier highways." Based on this mention of only Germany, I've removed Austria and Switzerland from the sentence in question, and repeated the source citation. —ADavidB 03:23, 18 October 2016 (UTC)

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Change in the lede sentence

I notice that the lede sentence was just changed to remove "politician" and "general". The phrasing "American politician and general who was the 34th president of the United States" (or "who served as") has been in the lede sentence for a couple of years, I believe. But earlier (2014 at least) it followed the pattern of this recent revision, "…was the 34th president of the United States", omitting "politician" and leaving the generalship to the next sentence. Has there ever been discussion or consensus about how to describe him in the opening sentence? (I became aware of this change because it seems to be inspired by an as-yet-unresolved discussion about how to describe Donald Trump in his biography's lede sentence.) --MelanieN (talk) 01:52, 19 December 2016 (UTC)

I support the edit. Ike was not and did not consider himself a politician. Samf4u (talk) 02:22, 19 December 2016 (UTC)

Lead too long!

Apparently the maintenance template with links to the guidelines wasn't enough of an explanation to why they were added, so I re-added them and am making a note in the talk page about this.

The lead is too long for this article. I would alter the lead myself, but I feel it is best to leave that to the people who know what information is best to have in the lead. Thanks.  {MordeKyle}  ☢ 20:12, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

I also agree with this. I am no expert on Ike so I won't be doing anything with it but I highly recommend a person experienced in the field of U.S. Presidents and WWII Generals to edit this so that it is suitable. This article in my opinion is nearing good article class it just needs a bit of improvement here and there (introduction) and then I believe it will be promoted. So yeah anyone who can fix it please fix it! CnocBride (talk) 11:58, 31 December 2016 (UTC)

1960s Military service

Hi,

Eisenhower's sidebar states that his military service resumed in 1965 until 1969 but there is no source or mention of this in the body of the article. Can anyone shed any light on this?

Hypnoticmonkey (talk) 15:37, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

I checked on this earlier. The info is mentioned and sourced in the last paragraph of the "End of presidency" section. —ADavidB 22:31, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 April 2017

Add citation for "The Eisenhower Golf Club at the United States Air Force Academy, a 36-hole facility featuring the Blue and Silver courses, which is ranked No. 1 among DoD courses, is named in his honor."

From Air Force site: http://www.goairforcefalcons.com/facilities/eisenhower-golf.html Aconner3 (talk) 00:40, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Not done for now: Could you find a better source? It doesn't appear to support the number-one ranking you claim. Even if it did, it's the "Official Site of Air Force Athletics", which suggests it isn't an independent source. Who does the ranking, anyway? Rivertorch^FIRE_WATER 05:16, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

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Strange contradiction

Closing discussion initiated by banned User:HarveyCarter.
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Why did Eisenhower support European imperialism in Iran and Vietnam, yet oppose it in Egypt? (86.144.85.72 (talk) 09:04, 15 May 2017 (UTC)) He strongly supported an independent South Vietnam and kept pressuring France in that regard. In Iran the question was the legitimacy of the Shah's rule Rjensen (talk) 18:26, 21 May 2017 (UTC) South Vietnam was a product of Western imperialism. The people wanted a united Vietnam. Eisenhower intervened in Iran to prevent the British-owned oil industry from being nationalized. (FarnuBak (talk) 15:09, 22 May 2017 (UTC)) which people wanted a united Vietnam?? how did their vote work out? Rjensen (talk) 15:14, 22 May 2017 (UTC) When was a vote held on partitioning Korea, Austro-Hungary, the Ottoman Empire, the United States, Czechoslovakia, Poland, Germany, and Ireland? The majority of people in Vietnam wanted a united country, which is why the US illegally invaded after the French were driven out. (FarnuBak (talk) 15:18, 22 May 2017 (UTC)) This is not a forum for individual thoughts on the article. If constructive changes to the article are sought, please state them specifically and provide reliable sources to support those changes. —ADavidB 16:12, 22 May 2017 (UTC) The article needs to make clear why he supported colonialism in Iran and Vietnam, but not in Egypt. (FarnuBak (talk) 16:18, 22 May 2017 (UTC)) Then find reliable sources that explain the motivations of his various actions and edit the article accordingly. Nobody's stopping you from improving the article, provided that you have reliable sources to cite while doing it. LacrimosaDiesIlla (talk) 16:28, 22 May 2017 (UTC) This historian's analysis provides a lot of details and notes that U.S. policy goals toward Egypt in the 1950s conflicted with themselves. What other sources are there? —ADavidB 16:37, 22 May 2017 (UTC) European imperalism was far from the most important issue for Eisenhower's foreign policy (though it was a factor), so there isn't much of a contradiction here. I think the article makes it fairly clear that managing the Cold War was at the center of his foreign policy. These were also three very different situations: Vietnam involved supporting a colonial power against a left-wing insurgency in its colony, Egypt involved stopping an invasion by foreign powers, and Iran involved supporting an internal coup. Orser67 (talk) 01:43, 26 May 2017 (UTC) The Iranian coup was by the British Empire and the Vietnam conflict was by France, yet Eisenhower opposed those same imperialist/colonialist polices in Egypt? (FarnuBak (talk) 10:59, 26 May 2017 (UTC))

Semi-protected edit request on 28 May 2017

Add Merrill Eisenhower Atwater as biological son of Mary Eisenhower in the family tree. 2602:304:CDB7:6B20:1AC:4F0E:DD49:F8F9 (talk) 22:39, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 02:25, 29 May 2017 (UTC)

Source 1 = http://www.kansas.com/news/business/aviation/article61951312.html Source 2 = http://www.bizjournals.com/wichita/news/2016/11/22/10-minutes-with-merrill-atwater-kansas-department.html Source 3 = http://ingrams.com/article/40-under-forty-the-class-of-2017/ Source 4 = http://www.toledoblade.com/Education/2013/04/02/Ike-s-great-grandson-to-help-mark-school-s-50th.html He even refers to his great-grandfather as “Ike,” using the two-term president’s boyhood nickname that stayed with him all his life. Mr. Atwater’s mother is Mary Jean Eisenhower, the president’s granddaughter. She was born in Washington during Mr. Eisenhower’s first term and christened in the Blue Room of the White House. Source 4 = "Other honors[edit] The city of Marshfield, Missouri chose Eisenhower as a 2008 honoree of the Edwin P. Hubble Medal of Initiative.[11] His grandson, Merrill Eisenhower Atwater spoke on his behalf at Marshfield's annual Cherry Blossom Festival. The medal recognizes individuals who demonstrate great initiative in their chosen field." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Eisenhower |answered=no2602:304:CDB7:6B20:9F6:2211:D3AF:BAAC (talk) 02:33, 3 June 2017 (UTC)

2602:304:CDB7:6B20:9F6:2211:D3AF:BAAC (talk) 02:30, 3 June 2017 (UTC)

Y I've added an entry for Merrill Eisenhower Atwater to the {{Eisenhower family tree}} template. Information on his father is lacking, however. His mother's article includes her marriage to James Brewton Millard, but nothing to explain Merril's last name of Atwater. —ADavidB 10:29, 3 June 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 June 2017

Merrill Eisenhower Atwater is the biological son of Mary Eisenhower but is NOT the son of James Brewton Millard. They don't even share a last name. Please just move the line below Mary's name. https://www.admin.ks.gov/offices/news-events/news-releases/2015/10/07/dwight-d.-eisenhower-inducted-into-kansas-walk-of-honor 104.181.110.211 (talk) 16:30, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

Y Done. For what's it worth, the template for the Eisenhower family tree is separate from this article and is not protected. LacrimosaDiesIlla (talk) 18:11, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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Semi-protected edit request on 6 November 2017

Eisenhower received an honorary doctorate degree from Dartmouth college in 1953. It should be mentioned. Vwchong (talk) 04:54, 6 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made.  — Ammarpad (talk) 06:07, 6 November 2017 (UTC)

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"Biggest Mistake" quote

I took out the old "Warren was my biggest mistake" quote because it's bogus and creeps back in every couple of years. He didn't say it, and even if he did, there's no reliable source for it that I've ever seen (besides people claiming they heard someone say they heard it third hand, etc).

He might have -thought- if for all I know, but Wikipedia isn't for mind reading. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.17.192.70 (talk) 19:05, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

Here’s the removed material:

Eisenhower regretted the Brennan and Warren appointments, saying in 1961 that the two greatest mistakes of his presidency were "both sitting on the Supreme Court."

References

Is there any evidence this was not said to Fred Friendly in 1961? Anythingyouwant (talk) 20:46, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

the 2017 summary says the consensus of scholars is that Ike never said it. "The often repeated story that Eisenhower came to regard the appointment of Warren as his greatest mistake simply has no basis in truth." see https://books.google.com/books?id=gpNZDgAAQBAJ&pg=PA220 Rjensen (talk) 00:41, 29 December 2017 (UTC)

Starving of POWs and alliance with Spain

The article does not mention the fact that thousands of German civilians and POWs starved to death under his administration, which some have called criminal. Also Eisenhower's alliance with Spain was highly controversial as it was only financial aid from the US that enabled Franco to remain in power and pursue ruinous economic policies. Without that aid it is likely the Spanish people would have risen up and tried to overthrow him. (5.81.222.218 (talk) 23:28, 18 January 2018 (UTC))

Excessive quotes in reference footnotes?

I think the extensive quotes from Brad Sears and Judith Atkins, recently added to the footnotes in the “Civil rights: LGBT” section (references 207-212), are excessive. I think we should trim them significantly (a key sentence or two is a typical footnote quote) or remove them entirely. If people want more information about the subject, they can click on the link. What do others think? --MelanieN (talk) 23:28, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

I agree it's excessive--Furthermore the whole section belongs in the article on Ike's presidency because it says zip about Ike. Rjensen (talk) 23:30, 15 January 2018 (UTC)

Agreement here on trimming or removing the excess source quotations. Per WP:CITE#Additional annotation, such (precise) inclusion is to allow the reader to readily "identify the applicable portion of the reference", also helpful when the source is not very accessible, which doesn't seem to apply. —ADavidB 03:28, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

With no other discussion or objection over a week later, I went ahead and trimmed the quoted text from these citations. —ADavidB 18:20, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Lavender Scare section

Just as we must include this section we must be accurate - it wasn't rampant homophobia that drove it, it was the belief that being gay in the 1950s made you a target of blackmail and exploitation. Same as alcoholics and the mentally ill - which the act also covered - it wasn't about "getting them out": It wasn't about the supposed character of the gay person but the ability of others to target them. We don't really explain this at all in the section, and it just comes across as anti-gay. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.17.192.70 (talk) 18:26, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

It appears that you have already made edits to the article to correct this. --MelanieN (talk) 18:30, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

article seems to miss character of Ike

I'm sorry, but the article leaves me with little or no sense of Eisenhower the man. His loves. His personality. His character. Article seems to avoid saying much personal about him. As one example of many, what about the momentous decision to go ahead with D-Day? No mention. What about his involvement with another woman during WW2? No mention. If Ike had little or no personality, perhaps that should be stated. But I don't think that is the case. What do his biographers say? AAABBB222 (talk) 19:37, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

categories seem really excessive

The categories at the end of the article seem really excessive. They seem to obscure the essential categories in a sea of what seem to me very tangential ones. As one example of many I could cite, Ike is listed as People from Abilene, Kansas; People from Denison, Texas; and People from Gettysburg, Pennsylvania. Normally, "from" means where one was born (Denison). Living various places during one's lifetime does not qualify as being "from" all those different places. I imagine someone has put a lot of effort adding the myriad categories, but I think it damages the article. AAABBB222 (talk) 19:45, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

"Successful" Invasion of North Africa?

After the U.S. entered World War II, Eisenhower oversaw the successful invasions of North Africa and Sicily before supervising the invasions of France and Germany. says the article.

Hunh?

The North African invasion was only successful in that the Germans eventually withdrew. For the Americans, it was a series of disasters.

The main event in Sicily was the naval Battle of the Strait of Messina. This did not take place. Its non-occurrence is given inadequate coverage in history books: the result of the non-battle was the successful evacuation of German forces to Italy, with subsequent huge damage to Allied troops.

If these were successes, the world need never fear failure.

David Lloyd-Jones (talk) 21:09, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

I agree. The article goes on to say "highly successful" concerning the Sicily and Italy invasions. I think that to be an over-statement. AAABBB222 (talk) 19:49, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Military legacy?

The section 'Legacy and memory' sums-up his political achievement. But there is no evaluation of his military contribution. Valetude (talk) 18:34, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

External links

Not counting the three sister projects there are eighteen links under the "External links" section. This would be considered far above any notion or intended definition of link farming for even a lessor classed article. Otr500 (talk) 11:03, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

Link farms have hundreds of unselected links. WP:Link farm states the issue with them is that excessive lists can dwarf articles and detract from the purpose of Wikipedia. So 18 links at the very end of the article take up under 3% of the space--"dwarf" is clearly not the case here. I dropped five links so it's under 2% of space now. All these links are selected, most are based at major research centers, and all are of direct relevance to users looking for primary sources. (Teachers at the high school and university levels often insist on using primary sources for class projects.) --Ike is a popular guy. OTR can tell us which ones he considers least useful and we can discuss dropping them. Rjensen (talk) 13:03, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

Thank you. I am not sure of the meaning with the "hundreds of unselected links". The quoted section also begins with "There is nothing wrong with adding one or more useful content-relevant links to the external links section of an article;". WP:ELPOINTS #3 states, "Links in the "External links" section should be kept to a minimum. A lack of external links or a small number of external links is not a reason to add external links.", and WP:ELYES #3 states, "Sites that contain neutral and accurate material that is relevant to an encyclopedic understanding of the subject and cannot be integrated into the Wikipedia article due to copyright issues, amount of detail (such as professional athlete statistics, movie or television credits, interview transcripts, or online textbooks), or other reasons.", so maybe some "can be integrated".

I have been working in the area of "External links" for eight years and when I see 18 links it is usually because they have been allowed to creep in. Normally this is on lessor classed articles but sometimes on better articles and sometimes on "former" GA or featured articles. I didn't investigate any farther than noting the large number of links and making mention of it. I can state that this is a B-class article and proudly wears a tag "A former good article nominee". Under the "Writing and formatting" section of the review the last four points involve the "External links".

I also note that there is a list article Bibliography of Dwight D. Eisenhower so cannot imagine why having a "Main article:", a large embedded list, and then what looks to be the whole thing listed under a standalone list article as a duplicated fork.

Anyway, I think it is a pretty good article still needing a lot of work. I do not, however, wish to engage in needless Wikilawyering over some new percentage of space concept as justification for expansion. There is an excessive list, that would still likely be too big if cut in half and then divided by two. Have a great day, Otr500 (talk) 03:37, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

The Wiki "farm" rule has two criteria for "excessive" -- a) does it "dwarf" the article. No. 2) does it degrade the article and hurt users? No it helps users by pointing them to valuable resources of very high quality. They are full of primary sources (which we cannot include here for copyright reasons, which is another explicit criterion re what to link to). Let's try to help the users who want to learn some history. Everyone else can disregard this very short section buried at the very end. Rjensen (talk) 07:46, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

You did make improvements and that is a good thing so thanks. Does it hurt users? No. Does it degrade the article? That is subjective, and I can't say it does, but will the article rise above B-class with such a long External links list? We can see. Otr500 (talk) 09:46, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

Golf-time statistics?

I can remember contemporaneous criticism of how much time Eisenhower spent playing golf (even though I was just a kid at the time). But are there any tallies of just how much time it actually was? BMJ-pdx (talk) 09:51, 25 November 2018 (UTC)

One website [6] shows Eisenhower and Wilson playing more rounds as President than Trump. But Trump as a much better player. Rmhermen (talk) 17:04, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

What's your point/question? While there was indeed criticism at the time of how much time Eisenhower spent playing golf, his golf-playing time statistics are of no consequence in the broad scheme of his life, and comparing the number of rounds he played with the number of rounds other presidents played is immaterial. Drdpw (talk) 17:21, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

I disagree. Having statistics that could be compared to other preidents would allow objective judgment on just how valid the criticism was. BMJ-pdx (talk) 16:01, 6 May 2019 (UTC)