Talk:Great Replacement conspiracy theory in the United States

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Great Replacement conspiracy theory in the United States article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

United States Low‑importance

	United States portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Discrimination Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Discrimination, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Discrimination on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.DiscriminationWikipedia:WikiProject DiscriminationTemplate:WikiProject DiscriminationDiscrimination articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.

Skepticism Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Skepticism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of science, pseudoscience, pseudohistory and skepticism related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SkepticismWikipedia:WikiProject SkepticismTemplate:WikiProject SkepticismSkepticism articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Alternative Views Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Alternative views, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of significant alternative views in every field, from the sciences to the humanities. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion.Alternative ViewsWikipedia:WikiProject Alternative ViewsTemplate:WikiProject Alternative ViewsAlternative Views articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Politics: American Low‑importance

	Politics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by American politics task force (assessed as Low-importance).

Sociology Low‑importance

	Society portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Sociology, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of sociology on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SociologyWikipedia:WikiProject SociologyTemplate:WikiProject Sociologysociology articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

It is requested that an image or photograph be included in this article to improve its quality. Please replace this template with a more specific media request template where possible.

Wikipedians in the United States may be able to help!

The Free Image Search Tool or Openverse Creative Commons Search may be able to locate suitable images on Flickr and other web sites.

Upload

This new article is a split from Great replacement#United States, which became excessively long in covering the whole world. See the history of that article for attributions Rjensen (talk) 09:43, 10 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Replacement as a good thing?[edit]

This makes clear that anyone who says that the Great Replacement is real and bad is a conspiracy theorist but what about mainstream publications saying it's real and good? Is the Great Replacement only a conspiracy theory when it's evaluated as bad? Or is it still a conspiracy theory when it's evaluated by mainstream publications as good? An explanation is needed for why this is a conspiracy theory when it is evaluated as real and a bad thing but is apparently not a far right conspiracy theory when the exact same thing, sometimes even using the very word "replacement" to express it, is evaluated as real and a good thing. Surely the epistemological status of the facts about demographics cannot depend upon our moral and political evaluations of those facts, can it? Or there some kind of postmodern anti-racist epistemology at work here? --2601:300:4080:6230:D150:C2A0:B86E:468E (talk) 19:23, 18 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I will assume you are serious here and not sarcastic. The links are talking about immigration and demographic changes, while the conspiracy theory is talking about the intentional displacement of White Americans. Nobody is actually orchestrating immigration to displace an ethnic group. Dimadick (talk) 04:19, 19 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The links say, "U.S. birthrates are plummeting. Increasing legal immigration can help." and "Immigration Is the Solution for the Falling US Birth Rate" -- Those are not merely descriptive. Those are prescriptive. Saying that the solution to the problem of the falling native U.S. birth rate is increased immigration (instead of taking measures to increase the birth rate or resolving the problem some other way) is in fact advocating for the replacement of native born U.S. with immigrants. Those certainly appear to be just different words for the same exact thing. If there's a difference then the article needs to explain what the difference is. --2601:300:4080:6230:68A2:7555:B29E:B41D (talk) 23:51, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The article makes clear that the conspiracy theory is based on white supremacist ideology. The discussions of population shifts that you have linked to are about demographic changes. Cheers! 98.155.8.5 (talk) 20:32, 25 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Pardon me, chiming in here, but: what is the difference exactly between the Great Replacement and demographic changes? Is it specifically the claim that these trends are being orchestrated by a power structure, instead of the invisible hand? It seems to me that this, and related articles, don't offer a decisive refutation of the conspiracy theory -- it makes some counter-arguments, but not enough. Even if there's no grand scheme, those on the right-wing will connect the dots between abortion, lgbtq+, feminism, and unrestricted migration, and come to the conclusion that these policies lead to a demographic shift against whites in favor of other ethnic groups, and from there justify their beliefs. If you want to change their minds, it's not enough to just call it racist. Xcalibur (talk) 01:35, 19 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Is it specifically the claim that these trends are being orchestrated by a power structure Yes.

If you want to change their minds We don't. (BTW we already know that their minds are write-protected.) We want to have an encyclopedia article about that crazy idea. And this page is for making suggestions for improving it. --Hob Gadling (talk) 08:50, 19 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That's fair enough. Let me clarify my suggestions for the article: 1. Make it more explicit that this theory is not just about white demographic decline, but more specifically the belief that this decline is engineered by the powers that be (gov'ts/corps/NGOs), and 2. offer a more decisive refutation of this line of thought. Xcalibur (talk) 14:27, 19 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"is it specifically the claim that these trends are being orchestrated by a power structure" "Yes."

The US federal government accepts mass immigration from Mexico, China, India, The Philippines, and El Salvador. These are the top 5 sources of legal immigrants, not counting the millions of illegal immigrants who the federal government has allowed here from South America and Asia. All of these countries are non White. That isn't to say it's good or bad, it's simply a factual statement.

Would this not meet your criteria of a "power structure" orchestrating a trend that is reducing Whites in America to a minority? 73.108.8.167 (talk) 06:15, 7 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

sidebar topic area - Discrimination or Conservatism in the US ?[edit]

The sidebar topic was recently changed from Discrimination to Conservatism US.

There is definitely some overlap here with the topic areas, but I am wondering what other editors think about this change? 72.14.126.22 (talk) 17:55, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Tammany Hall[edit]

Tammany hall and Catholicism are both central to the topic. At least a reference should be brought. Tammany hall is a well documented and thoroughly researched political motivation largly subscribed to by catholic democrats, particularly: Newyorkers, Californians, and chicaginites. The existence of a Tammany Hall political mechanic would have to be central to the theory when it's being supposed as a "conspiracy theory." 112.198.70.139 (talk) 11:15, 24 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Our article doesn't mention Chicago or California residents. But sure, if you have good mainstream reliably published sources bring them here. Otherwise your comments are pointless. Doug Weller talk 13:40, 24 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]