Talk:Jim Umbricht

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Jim Umbricht/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Wizardman (talk · contribs) 17:09, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

I'll review this article shortly. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 17:09, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

Here are the issues I found:

• "making the Majors in" in this context, majors should be lowercase; only has to be capitalized when it's specifically noting MLB.
• "National League top relievers" League's
• Make sure records and scores (4-3) use ndashes.
• "in the Class D Georgia-Florida League a low" comma after league
• "as an pitcher/infielder." as a pitcher and infielder.
• "he had an 15-15 " a 15
• "mostly as an relief pitcher" a relief. Actually, there's a bunch of spots where you use an where it's supposed to be a. I'm not going to note them all, but hey do need fixing.
• "the World Series, in which the " rm in
• "He only appeared in one game during the 1961 season, pitching three innings in relief. Instead Umbricht spent most of the season at Columbus, " what day was the long game? Also, rm instead, doesn't fit.
• "a better chance of pitching in the Majors." majors
• "season in the Colts roster" on the
• "by a starting pitcher after they are removed from the game" they were
• "Major League history was a number ever retired" history a number was ever
• "The Colts opening day match" In the Colts'
• "in more games in a Astros" the one time you don't use an is the one time it's needed.
• In references, Baseball-Reference should be hyphenated.
• This is a case where a fair use image would be fine if you wanted to add one. If you don't want to that's more than fine.
• "while having terrible control, walking five batters in 2.1 innings" I'd prefer a cite that actually notes the bad control rather than a game log ref here.
• "He made a last minute start against the Los Angeles Dodgers, pitching against Don Drysdale on May 25, earning the loss." cite preferred due to the way its written.

I'll put the article on hold and will pass it when the issues are fixed. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 22:17, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

I will try to fix it by tomorrow, I'm commenting on a IPhone currently so can't do anything now. Thanks Secret ^account 05:06, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

I can keep this on hold until the end of June, but don't feel comfortable holding it longer then that. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 15:07, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

That's fine I'm experiencing some health issues, combined with a heavy workload makes me nearly impossible to edit on a computer, and when I do it's usually a 10 minute thing (instead I'm editing through my IPad or my IPhone, both of which is tough). I'll try to finish it later on today or tomorrow. Thanks Secret ^account 05:39, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Ok I should be working on this article later today, I managed to get some free time on my hands. Secret ^account 05:54, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

I see a bit of progress has been made, but will the rest be handled soon? I'm leaning towards failing it since progress is slow, though I understand you don't have much time right now. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 04:55, 5 July 2012 (UTC)

It's only a few minor things I need to take care of. I will try to fix it by saturday/sunday. If it's not fixed by then you could fail it. Thanks Secret ^account 16:13, 5 July 2012 (UTC)

Per the above, I unfortunately do have to fail it at this time. It can always be re-nominated when the remaining issues are fixed. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 12:19, 9 July 2012 (UTC)

Walt Bond

Yes Bond died while an active player, but not an active Astro. Bond last played for Houston in 1965 and he was active with Minn. Twins the season he died. This may be reason Bond's number was not retired rather than racism. 2001:558:6027:4C:6819:74F8:7240:BA53 (talk) 07:02, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

Wrist bands

No, in 1964 they would have worn black arm bands not wrist bands. 2001:558:6027:4C:6819:74F8:7240:BA53 (talk) 07:06, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Jim Umbricht/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Batard0 (talk · contribs) 17:57, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

I'll take this one on. After a first read, I can say it's well-written and appears quite close to meeting the criteria. I anticipate only a smattering of nitpicks and it should be good to go. --Batard0 (talk) 17:57, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

I'm honored for you to be the GA reviewer for this article, considering your quality work in sports articles. I will do the changes within the next day or two.

Good Article review progress box Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Lead

• A nitpick, but can we say "for five seasons" instead of just "five seasons"? The "for" establishes a sense of his career's duration a little more smoothly, I think.

• Recommend removing "public" from "public year-long," as it must have been public if he was best known for it.

• Recommend removing "dominating" from the start of the second para. His size (6' 4") conveys this clearly enough.

• I'd suggest a slight rephrasing of "Umbricht played between the Pirates and its farm team," since readers could potentially misinterpret this as somewhere between the Pirates and its farm team, not necessarily on both. Maybe: "Umbricht played for the Pirates and on its farm team".

• Suggest a comma after "1962" to introduce the new subclause. I'd also suggest replacing "where he became" with "and became". The referent of "where" is not immediately clear to the reader (it could be 1962 or the Colt .45s, although it quickly becomes obvious).

• Can we wikilink National League? (That article is terrible, however; could link to Major League Baseball#League organization.)

• Recommend changing "prior to" to "before" for conciseness.

• Suggest "His subsequent comeback" instead of "The subsequent comeback"; "His" here is more explicit and specific.

• Suggest "comeback to baseball" or "comeback to the major leagues" instead of "the Majors", which I think is too colloquial; some people unfamiliar with baseball might not readily get what the majors are.

• Recommend "soon afterward" instead of "not long afterwards" for conciseness. "Afterwards" (with an "s") appears to be a secondary variant per this dictionary and in any case is one letter longer.

• A comma after "afterward" I think is warranted here as it introduces a new clause with a subject-verb (he died), but this is mostly a matter of taste and isn't required.

• Remove "then" from "His ashes were then" (more concise, doesn't change the meaning)

• I'd suggest a slight rephrasing of this sentence to make it more accessible for readers who might not know about the Astrodome or what it's associated with. Perhaps: "His ashes were spread over the construction site of the Houston Astrodome, the future home of the Colt .45s."

• I don't think we need a comma after "number" in the last sentence. It's a list of just two items.

That gets it started...despite the length, these are all minor, and I won't object if you have serious reservations about making any changes suggested above. --Batard0 (talk) 18:23, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

• Done with all except for the forth point. I'm not so sure how to rewrite that sentence. Umbricht played with both the Pirates and its farm system during his tenure with the club each season, and your suggestion sounds like (to me at least) that he played for both at the same time, which makes me unclear how to write this? Any suggestions. Secret ^account 02:05, 16 November 2012 (UTC)
  • Hmm...perhaps we could say he "rotated between playing for the Pirates and in the team's farm system" or maybe "went back and forth between playing for the Pirates and in the team's farm system" or something like that. --Batard0 (talk) 05:31, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

Early career

• The comma isn't necessary after "Illinois" in the first sentence. It also might be wise to put in "moved with his family" since he presumably didn't move on his own to Atlanta at age 16 or so.

• We can safely remove the second instance of "baseball" in the second sentence ("practicing every day on a field").

• I suggest changing "the captain for both teams" to "the captain of both" and a slight rephrasing of the first part of that sentence to: "He attended the University of Georgia on a scholarship and played on the school's baseball and basketball teams"

• "named a member to" can be "named to" for conciseness.

• I'd recommend a paragraph break after "first team All-SEC as a shortstop in 1951", since we're transitioning from his early life and college career to his minor league career.

• "first team" here should be hyphenated ("first-team") because it's a compound adjective.

• "tryout" is one word (not "try-out")

• In "low level minor league affiliate", "low-level" should be hyphenated, as compound adjectives take hyphens.

• "within the Milwaukee Braves organization" : "in the Milwaukee Braves organization" suffices, for conciseness.

• "He managed to make the team" --> "He made the team" for conciseness.

• I suggest a slight rephrase of "That year Umbricht pitched for the Bears appearing in 10 games, starting in eight of them." to "That year Umbricht pitched for the Bears in 10 games, starting in eight of them," for clarity and flow.

• The next para should start with "Umbricht" instead of "He".

• The sentence "He then missed the 1954 and 1955 seasons serving a stint in the United States Army, where he pitched for the Fort Carson baseball squad" could be better phrased as "Umbricht then missed the 1954 and 1955 seasons to serve in the United States Army. While in the Army, he pitched for a military team at Fort Carson in Colorado." Also, could we put in something more about his service? Was he drafted? Did he serve in the Korean War? And we should wikilink United States Army.

• • He probably got drafted if he served a stint in the Army during that time frame, and its unlikely he saw service during the Korean War if he was playing baseball for the Army. But my sources isn't really specific on it, and adding that information is OR until I can find a source. Secret ^account 23:22, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

• "After finishing his service in 1956" --> "After he was discharged in 1956" is better if that's correct. --Batard0 (talk) 19:06, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

• "Umbricht appeared with" --> "Umbricht played for" is a bit more descriptive.

• "for a team that finished" --> "as the team finished" is a little more concise and says the same thing.

• I'd recommend removing "where one of his teammates was future broadcaster Bob Uecker" unless Umbricht's connection with Uecker has a special significance that can be elaborated on. Otherwise, it seems like trivia.
  • Removed Secret ^account 23:22, 18 November 2012 (UTC)
• "assigned Umbricht to its Triple A affiliate" should be "Triple-A" (takes a hyphen).

• Fixed everything here Secret ^account 23:22, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Pittsburgh Pirates

• I'd recommend removing "For his effort with the Bees" or else rephrasing it as "On the strength of his performance for the Bees" for clarity. I also suggest saying "near the end of the 1959 season" instead of "at the end", since "at the end" could mean he was promoted after the season was over, which apparently wasn't the case.

• I suggest a slight rephrase of "He appeared in only one start, a 7-6 loss against the Cincinnati Reds" to "He appeared in only one game, a 7-6 loss to the Cincinnati Reds" or "His only appearance was in a 7-6 loss to the Cincinnati Reds, a game he started."

1960-1961

• Substitute an endash in the subsection title.

• "In the beginning of spring training" --> "At the beginning of spring training"

• Instead of "these two spots" I'd recommend "a place on the rotation" for variety's sake.

• "had a good start in spring training" --> "started strong in spring training" for conciseness.

• "On March 17, against the Detroit Tigers" --> "In a March 17 game against the Detroit Tigers" for better flow.

• "on throwing a no-hitter" --> "to throw a no-hitter" for conciseness.

• "Umbricht's pitching ability" : we can remove "ability" without altering the meaning.

• "the Pirates fourth starter" : here "Pirates'" needs an apostrophe (possessive).

• "on his first start" --> "in his first start" (grammar)

• In "while having terrible control, walking five batters in 2.1 innings" I'd suggest removing "having terrible control." The walks themselves demonstrate this.

• • I'm not sure how to explain it to a non-baseball reader, that's why I kept the term around, though I should link control somewhere. Secret ^account 08:08, 28 November 2012 (UTC)
    • Ok, this is fine, but I'd suggest a slight rephrase if you want to keep it, because it reads somewhat awkwardly. How about "In his next start against the Philadelphia Phillies on April 21, Umbricht had terrible control, giving up three runs and walking five batters in 2.1 innings." --Batard0 (talk) 18:21, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

• I'd suggest rephrasing "After those two starts, where he gave up nine runs in seven innings of work" to "After giving up nine runs in seven innings of work in his first two starts"

• "He made a last minute start" --> "He made a last-minute start" (compound adjective takes hyphen)

• I recommend rephrasing "against the Los Angeles Dodgers against Don Drysdale" as "against Los Angeles Dodgers pitcher Don Drysdale" to avoid repetition of "against".

• "on May 25, as Pirates starting pitcher" --> "on May 25 after Pirates starting pitcher" for clarity.

• "second inning home runs" --> "second-inning home runs" (compound adjective takes hyphen)

• "After an off-day" : here we don't need a hyphen between "off" and "day", since this is not a compound adjective.

• "two innings in relief, as the Pirates broke a team record" : no comma is necessary here, I think.

• "16 inning victory" --> "16-inning victory" (compound adjective)

• I'd suggest instead of saying "managed to win the pennant" we could say "managed to win the National League pennant" or something like it; it might not be clear to the uninitiated what this means.

• "Umbricht wasn't named" --> "Umbricht was not named" (avoid contractions, per MoS)

• "Umbricht appeared in 17 games for the Pirates, where he compiled" --> "Umbricht appeared in 17 games for the Pirates, compiling" for clarity and concision.

• The final paragraph of this section starts with "He" -- should be "Umbricht".

• "Umbricht was sent back to Columbus where he spent the rest of the 1961 season on their roster, being used as a full-time starter" --> "Umbricht was sent back to Columbus, where he spent the rest of the 1961 season as a full-time starter" for clarity and concision.

Houston Colt .45s

• In "Houston Colt .45s as the 35th pick" I'd suggest changing "as" to "with".

• I'd recommend rephrasing the next two sentences slightly, because it's not immediately clear why Richards would select Umbricht to give him a better chance at pitching in the majors. So currently it's "Houston's general manager Paul Richards selected Umbricht to give him a better chance of pitching in the majors. They were friends since Umbricht was at Waycross in 1953, immediately impressing Richards with his no nonsense attitude." And I'd suggest something like: "Umbricht had become friends with Houston general manager Paul Richards when the two were at Waycross in 1953, and Richards selected Umbricht to give him a better chance of pitching in the majors."

• "in order to make room" --> "to make room" suffices.

• "He appeared in 23 games for the 89ers, earning a 3-4 win–loss record with a 3.39 earned run average" : there's a lot of "earning" going on here. Perhaps we could say "He appeared in 23 games for the 89ers, posting a 3-4 win–loss record with a 3.39 earned run average"

• "He struck out 55 batters, while walking only 17" : no comma is necessary here.

• The second para of the section begins with "His"; should be "Umbricht's"

• "four different pitches" --> "four pitches" (conciseness)

• We need an "a" before "fastball".

• "control damage caused by a starting pitcher after they were removed from the game" should be "control damage caused by starting pitchers after they were removed from games" (grammar)

• "Umbricht compiled a 9-5 win–loss record, while recording 133 strikeouts" --> "Umbricht compiled a 9-5 win–loss record with 133 strikeouts" for conciseness.

Cancer diagnosis

• "Umbricht noticed that he had a small black mole in his right leg, near the thigh while on a golf outing with Richards" could be more concisely phrased as "Umbricht noticed a small black mole near his right thigh while on a golf outing with Richards"

• "it started to grow at a rapid pace" --> "it grew at a rapid pace" for conciseness.

• "three inch section" --> "three-inch section" (compound adjective)

• "removed from his body" can be simply "removed".

• "cared about others well-being" --> "cared about others' well-being" (grammar)

• This sentence: "Ewell, the team trainer said that Umbricht "had the most wonderful attitude of anyone you'll ever meet." should be: "Ewell, the team trainer, said Umbricht "had the most wonderful attitude of anyone you'll ever meet." " (missing a quotation mark at the end, and add a comma after "trainer" while removing "that")

• "As a result, Umbricht cancer diagnosis" --> "As a result, Umbricht's cancer diagnosis" (grammar)

• "Umbricht immediately underwent a six-hour operation" : remove "immediately" as it's not necessary here.

• In "The perfusion technique was radical at the time, and only been used as surgical procedure not long before Umbricht's surgery." I suggest a rephrase to "The perfusion technique was radical at the time, and began to be used as surgical procedure not long before Umbricht's surgery."

• In "After a month long hospital stay, Umbricht and his doctors told the media that he beat the cancer because of the surgery and crediting "early detection and good physical condition" further stating that "he should have five or six good years left" in his baseball career" I suggest a rephrase to "After a month-long hospital stay, Umbricht and his doctors told the media that he beat the cancer, crediting "early detection and good physical condition," further stating that he "should have five or six good years left" in his baseball career.

• In "Privately however, Umbricht learned that the doctors weren't sure if the cancer surgery was a success, or even if it had been completely removed from his body." I suggest a slight change to "Umbricht, however, learned that the doctors weren't sure if the cancer surgery was a success, or even if it had been completely removed from his body."

• "Umbricht was persistent to return to pitch for the Colt .45s" --> "Umbricht wanted to return to pitch for the Colt .45s"

• "the Colts active list" --> "the Colts' active list" (possessive)

• "commenting to the Associated Press that "he was anxious to get back to pitching"" --> "telling the Associated Press he was "anxious to get back to pitching" (concision)

• The sentence, "After the game, Umbricht stated that he felt "real good" despite the poor performance" could be "After the game, Umbricht said he felt "real good" despite the poor performance" (conciseness)

• "he required over 100 stitches and blood was coming out from the wound while he pitched at times" --> "he required over 100 stitches, and blood seeped from the wound while he pitched at times"

• "Umbricht posted a 4-3 won-loss" --> "win-loss" (spelling)

• "Umbricht's cancer had started to spread throughout his body requiring him to be sedated at times from the pain" --> "Umbricht's cancer had started to spread throughout his body, and he needed to be sedated at times because of the pain"

• "He was released from his current contract on December 16 citing his deteriorating health." --> "He was released from his contract on December 16 due to his deteriorating health."

• The ref numbers are out of order after the above sentence.

• "The National League allowed the Colts to sign Umbricht to a scout contract given the circumstances, becoming a player contract once he rejoins the active roster." --> "The National League allowed the Colts to sign Umbricht to a scout contract given the circumstances, with the proviso that it would become a player contract when he rejoined the active roster." for clarity.

• • Reworded to your statement, but I felt if he rejoined... is a better word choice than when here. I think you would agree as well. Secret ^account 07:55, 27 November 2012 (UTC)
    • Yep, that is fine. --Batard0 (talk) 18:21, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

Final months and death

• "When he wasn't hospitalized" --> "was not hospitalized" per MoS

• "usually for a "most courageous athlete" award" : recommend "often" instead of "usually".

• The ref numbers are out of order after this sentence.

• "Umbricht didn't travel" --> "did not travel" (MoS)

• "Several members of the team attended the funeral, with manager Harry Craft, coach Lum Harris and teammate Dick Farrell among the six pallbearers" : I recommend a slight rephrasing to "Several members of the team attended the funeral; manager Harry Craft, coach Lum Harris and teammate Dick Farrell were among the six pallbearers"

• "Construction of the Astrodome, the Colts' future ballpark had just begun a few weeks prior to Umbricht's death" : I suggest "Construction of the Astrodome, the Colts' future ballpark, had begun a few weeks before Umbricht's death" (conciseness)

• "throughout its grounds" : I suggest "over the site" since it was a construction site at the time.
  • The sentence already mentioned that he flew over the construction site, i feel adding "over the site" makes it a bit redundant with words, maybe a scattered his aches there... sounds better?. Secret ^account 07:55, 27 November 2012 (UTC)
    • Ok sure -- so to make sure we're on the same page, we have this at the moment: "His family decided to spread his ashes on its grounds, so "it could be his headstone" ... Jim's brother Ed flew over the construction site and scattered his ashes throughout its grounds." Here I think we should try to avoid saying "spread his ashes on its ground" and "scattered his ashes throughout its grounds" in two adjacent sentences, just because it's a bit repetitive. I also find the reference to "grounds" as "it" to be slightly confusing because grounds is a plural noun and "its" is a singular possessive. Perhaps this would be better: "His family decided to spread his ashes on its grounds, so the new ballpark "could be his headstone". After the funeral service, Jim's brother Ed flew a plane over the construction site and scattered his ashes." Here I removed the last "throughout the grounds" because that should be clear from the preceding sentence. I also added "a plane" because I assume Ed didn't have superpowers. --Batard0 (talk) 18:16, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

Aftermath and legacy

• "The day after his death the Colts" --> "The day after Umbricht's death, the Colts" (grammar and start a new para with Umbricht's name)

• "the first time the club retired" --> "it was the first time the club retired" for clarity.

• "the Colts' opening day match" --> "the Colts' opening-day match" (compound adjective takes hyphen)

• "Umbricht's number retirement had their share of critics however." --> "Umbricht's number retirement had its share of critics, however." (grammar)

• "Jimmy Wynn mentioned in his autobiography" --> "Jimmy Wynn wrote in his autobiography" is more precise.

• "despite appearing in more games in an Astros uniform" : suggest "despite that he appeared in more games for the Astros"

• "Journalists criticizing the retired number process sometimes uses Umbricht as an example of a name whose number was retired but is unfamiliar to baseball fans." : I'd suggest "Journalists criticizing the retirement of numbers sometimes use Umbricht as an example of someone whose number was retired but who is unfamiliar to baseball fans." (grammar, mostly)

• "he went to the team doctor which diagnosed him with melanoma" --> "he went to the team doctor, who diagnosed him with melanoma" (grammar)

That's about it for the prose. I think it's generally in good shape, despite the number of nitpicks here. --Batard0 (talk) 07:08, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

• The Bibliography section appears before the references. The MoS says that "A general references section should come after any footnotes section(s)". It earlier defines "general references section" as "(3) general references (bibliography items) that are not explicitly related to any specific parts of the text or are the target of a short citation." Thus I think the Bibliography should come after the references under the MoS layout guidelines.

• Looking back through, I'd suggest changing the "6'4"" in the lead to 6-foot 4-inch size (or 6 ft 4 in), and also including a metric conversion, as is common in other articles.

I fixed everything you suggested except for a couple of minor comments that I need a quick follow up. Thanks Secret ^account 08:08, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

• Ok, looks quite close now. Let's sort out the remaining minor issues and we'll be there. Well done. --Batard0 (talk) 18:21, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

Fixed the last two suggestions. Thanks Secret ^account 05:14, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

• All right -- looks like everything has been addressed. I'm listing it, and good work on this. --Batard0 (talk) 05:34, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

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When was his number retired?

He died April 8, 1964, and the "baseball in 1964" article says his number was retired in 1965, when the team had changed nickname to Astros, and I find that on the Houston Astros page too. But Umbricht's article says his number was retired immediately. Please reconcile. Carlm0404 (talk) 00:31, 14 April 2020 (UTC)