User talk:Sariel Xilo/Archive 1

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Welcome!

Hello, Sariel Xilo, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few links to pages you might find helpful:

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Please remember to sign your messages on talk pages by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask for help on your talk page, and a volunteer should respond shortly. Again, welcome!  I dream of horses  If you reply here, please ping me by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message  (talk to me) (My edits) @ 18:34, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

Barnstar

The Article Rescue Barnstar
I was, admittedly, highly skeptical that you could rescue Xanathar's Guide to Everything from the dregs of AfC but you proved me wrong. Chetsford (talk) 05:42, 24 June 2019 (UTC)


The Editor's Barnstar
For updating and improving Wizards of the Coast to preserve its GA status. Chetsford (talk) 21:10, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

D&D "inspiration" awarded

The Dungeons & Dragons Barnstar
Thanks for all your hard work on D&D content on Wikipedia, both articles created as well as articles improved. AugusteBlanqui (talk) 10:28, 19 December 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Defender of the Wiki Barnstar
Thanks for all your hard work rewriting and expanding The Sundering! You've brought it a long way from its humble beginning. —Torchiest talkedits 18:06, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

If you are taking requests (2019)

June/July 2019

Personally, I would most like to see you next starting Xanathar's Guide to Everything, and then an expansion of Volo's Guide to Monsters and a little more for Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes and The Rise of Tiamat. :) BOZ (talk) 15:55, 20 June 2019 (UTC)

I expanded VGM and added in the missing citations. Let me know if I should continue in that style for the Mordenkainen's and Xanathar's. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 20:53, 20 June 2019 (UTC)
Perfecto! I reused some of the commentary in the character's article as well. :) BOZ (talk) 21:07, 20 June 2019 (UTC)
I created Xanathar's. Not sure what I did differently from the other drafts, but this time I wasn't given the option "for AfC submissions". Sariel Xilo (talk) 01:14, 21 June 2019 (UTC)
Having encountered the user before who declined the submission, I know he is a real hard-liner on sources. If you can find another one or two decent sources and resubmit, the next reviewer will likely accept. BOZ (talk) 12:24, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
Done. Seems a bit annoying but hopefully it'll go better next time. Sariel Xilo (talk) 23:51, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
I hear you on that. I believe you are doing good work, and it will be recognized as such. BOZ (talk) 23:57, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
It is learning curve for a reason! Is there a good resource on which "geeky" sources are considered better and why? (Polygon vs Bleedingcool vs Geek & Sundry, etc) Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 14:57, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
I wish I had better insight on that, to be honest. By the way, cover images are generally not allowed (or at least discouraged) on draft articles, but I requested another user to see if he can get a cover for Xanathar's at least; be patient, he may take a few days to get around to it. Meanwhile, I know he probably did not work on any D&D stuff, but do you see anything that could be used to improve Draft:Andy Chambers like the work you did on Jeremy Crawford's article? BOZ (talk) 15:26, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
Hopefully, we can include the alt cover image as well since it is super cool. Good to know that images are discouraged on drafts. I've been trying to find how-to guides for creating articles so I don't step on anyone's toes in the process. I can take a look at Andy Chambers. Sariel Xilo (talk) 15:38, 24 June 2019 (UTC)

By the way, I did not realize just how new of a user you are! I have to commend you for jumping right in with D&D/RPGs, which has been an underserved area for some time. I have been working mostly with older games (1970s and 1980s), but as you can see we need a lot of work with more recent stuff too, so I am excited to see where you go next and what you do! BOZ (talk) 21:34, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

Thanks! Since it is the summer, I have a bit of downtime. I have a lot of familiarity with D&D and a bunch of the 4E/5E source books so it seemed like the safest place to start. Sariel Xilo (talk) 21:41, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
Several years ago we had a lot more activity on D&D articles, and we were able to get several articles up to "Good" and "Featured" status; if you want an idea on how that looks, check out Wikipedia:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/rightpanel#Featured content - those articles got there through solid teamwork! With the kind of sources you have been finding, getting some of those articles up to that status can be a realistic goal. :) BOZ (talk) 22:12, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

If you are up for working on any more former bio articles that I am hoping to get moved back into article space, there are several more including Draft:Adam Tinworth, Draft:Claude J. Pelletier, Draft:Jessica Price, and Draft:Ken Whitman if you can find anything for any of those. :) BOZ (talk) 14:16, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

BOZ For the WP:THREE sources on Price, should I go with broader coverage of her career (ie the 2013 Bitch Media interview, the 2016 WP article about Gen Con, & then a 2018 article about ArenaNet (probably Polygon's)) or should I do more coverage about ArenaNet (so the WP article & 2 on ArenaNet)? Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:12, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
If I get the feeling right, the reviewer is asking for which specific sources cover her the best (so not trivial mentions or name-drops), so without having reviewed the sources myself, my suggestion would be to find the best source for each of the important sections (career, views, controversy) that best defines her; failing that, if you have two really good ones for one section and only a weaker one for one of the other sections, then I would pick the three best. BOZ (talk) 19:28, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
The bottom line is that he's going to evaluate the three sources you select and decide whether they add up to her being notable enough for an article. If that fails, we can leave this draft alone for another time - I am nothing if not patient. ;) BOZ (talk) 19:35, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
I gave it a shot. :) In the meantime, I'll take a look at some of the other bios you listed. Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:48, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
Sounds good! And not getting an article past AFC is not a failure; you or anyone can always try again as long as the draft exists. Her career is still going, so she may very well accumulate more reliable sources over time, or maybe there already are more sources out there which just haven't been found yet. I just keep in mind that even if an AFC reviewer, or AFD respondents, think a subject is not notable, they might just be prove wrong in time. I have seen drafts go through review 3 or 4 times before finally being accepted. For you, it's a learning experience! BOZ (talk) 20:32, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
Thanks! I think I'll leave it alone for now. Someone else has jumped in under "Comment on AfC review" & I'm not entirely following their comments. I haven't found anything on what Price has done since 2018 (outside of stuff on Twitter) so hopefully we'll see more reliable sources in the future. :) Sariel Xilo (talk) 20:42, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
Sounds good - I take what you did so far as a "win" because the draft is a lot better than before you started, which in my book is always a form of success. Meanwhile, yeah, if you want to take a look at those other drafts, that would be cool, otherwise there are more 5E books if you want to continue with that, and there are plenty of little stubby articles for 4E books that need attention, or basically anything you feel like working on! I could go on and on about what needs work, but you should figure out what you want to do - I don't want to overwhelm you! BOZ (talk) 20:55, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

To bring a somewhat off-topic discussion here, as regards your question to why some existing articles may exist without appearing to meet WP:N while we have a draft that is better sourced... well, there's about as much of an answer to that question as "why do good things happen to bad people" but less of an answer than we have to "why do we exist", in other words, they just do. ;) Articles may have been created without much regard to Wikipedia's style of notability, and not noticed by people who would like to challenge their existence, while others were noticed and challenged, and that is basically just a roll of the dice as to which ones got noticed (or you could point them out to people who might challenge them and see what happens, which I try to avoid). I tend to create articles with a source or two, getting the article started, and hoping to find more later; perhaps not the best practice, but it has succeeded for me far often than not. My best philosophy is, if you have a source for something that needs a source, add it! If it's a good enough source, then that will help to answer the question as to whether it meets WP:N. See my user page under "Saving the Lost Children" for a number of bio articles that I helped to save from deletion and redirection, and if you like, feel free to add more to any of those. :) BOZ (talk) 00:56, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

Two items came up today where I could use some help if you have the time – I may have time later in the week to look myself, but definitely not today. First of all, would you have any sources that could be used to improve the article for the company Dream Pod 9, or its games in particular Heavy Gear, Jovian Chronicles, Tribe 8, and Gear Krieg (and to a lesser extent, Project A-ko: The Roleplaying Game and CORE Command)? Also, some concerns have been raised regarding the Wizards of the Coast article at Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/Wizards of the Coast/1 that will need to be fixed. BOZ (talk) 15:33, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

BOZ Just wanted to let you know that I'll be offline until Friday but I can probably look into Dream Pod 9 then. I also didn't get done what I wanted on the Wizards page (more history of Magic throughout the page since this 2019 Bloomberg article suggests it makes the most money next to Monopoly for Hasbro, and then reorganizing the sections for improved readability) so if I have time I'll probably continue on that. Sariel Xilo (talk) 20:42, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
No worries, you did great so far! I will probably have a little time today or definitely tomorrow to start working on Dream Pod 9 and its games, but not sure how far I will get. I will check on the GAR page for WotC to see if the outstanding issues have been resolved. You earned a rest, go for it. :) BOZ (talk) 20:56, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
Sariel Xilo, I would say that the Wizards article is likely to stay as a "Good Article" thanks to your efforts, although of course, if you want to add anything else you certainly can. The more pressing concern right now for me is Dream Pod 9; Another user and I have added a couple of sources to it so that may help to prevent it from being deleted, but if you can find anything more about the company or its Silhouette system, or anything to add to the articles on its games, then that should be more than enough. :) BOZ (talk) 12:54, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
BOZ Back home! My return trip got super delayed... Dream Pod 9 is tricky. I focused on finding industry award nominations. Is this page still up for deletion or has that discussion been closed? Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:36, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
Oh, it's definitely still up for deletion, and the nominator is working hard not to let this one go. He may just succeed despite our best efforts. :( BOZ (talk) 18:39, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
The same editor also proposed Heavy Gear to be merged into a video game based upon it (likely to fail), and Jovian Chronicles for deletion as well (plus several other deletions that I don't even want to get into just yet, sheesh), so we can only see what we can do for them to improve the quality of the sourcing. BOZ (talk) 18:54, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
Good work on improving Jovian; I think that one may have a realistic change at being salvaged from deletion. Did you see any sources that could improve the Tribe 8 and Gear Krieg articles, or for that matter Project A-ko: The Roleplaying Game and CORE Command, in case those get nominated as well? BOZ (talk) 22:38, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
I added all the publications I could find for Tribe 8 but I couldn't find any reviews. I assume, like Jovian Chronicles, there are reviews in old RPG magazines but I'm not familiar with them. I'll see what I can find on the others tomorrow. Sariel Xilo (talk) 05:13, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
Great work on adding the Pyramid review to Tribe 8; I bet there were more reviews from Pyramid for a lot of these games from the 1990s through the early 2000s, hopefully more for these other DP9 games!  :) BOZ (talk) 18:15, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Glad to see you working on books again!  :) We might get a small (hopefully) break from deletion for a few days at least, with a little luck. The same user who (at first reluctantly) approved some of your 5e book draft articles has also become very active in game-related article deletion activity lately, as you probably noticed. I don't want to overwhelm you by asking you to work on every article up for deletion, but rather I will ask that if you are able to find anything to go ahead and help out where you can. Not everything will be salvageable within the time allotted, but I also believe that even if something is deleted or redirected for now, that is not necessarily permanent, and when and if the sources are ultimately found in the future, it can always be brought back later! I personally keep Wikipedia:WikiProject Role-playing games/Article alerts, Wikipedia:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/Article alerts, and Wikipedia:WikiProject Board and table games/Article alerts (there is some overlap between them) on my watchlist to keep an eye on anything that comes up, so if you see anything for deletion on those pages that you think you can handle then I would appreciate any efforts you are able to make.  :) BOZ (talk) 23:10, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for articles I think I can find sources for. I just submitted Draft:Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set for review. Not sure what I'll work on next. Sariel Xilo (talk) 21:04, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
Awesome, I saw! :) Yes, take a look at the articles currently at AFD and see if there is anything you can do for any of them; there may not be much, but you never know. If you are interested in working on more articles about D&D books, I can look through the articles about 4E books and suggest which ones are in need of some TLC? BOZ (talk) 21:29, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
I don't have a copy of Shannon Appelcline's books. Did he write anything about the 3E/3.5 starter sets? That's the weakest section in terms of quality of sources. On a different note, I have a bunch of 4E books so if you have suggestions in that area you can send them my way. I'm a bit busy this week but I'll take a look. :) Sariel Xilo (talk) 23:24, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
Well let's see, if you like, you can start with three releases towards the end 4E: Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms, Menzoberranzan: City of Intrigue, and Into the Unknown: The Dungeon Survival Handbook. Since they were more recent than the earlier books, they may have more references remaining online? I can take another look tomorrow to see if he addresses those 3E books you have listed. There are several more deletions started since I last replied on your talk page; they multiply like rabbits it seems. BOZ (talk) 23:31, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
No worries! My draft is low priority - the AfC queue looks super long right now. Also, that Menzoberranzan book is great so I'll probably start there. Sariel Xilo (talk) 23:36, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
I skimmed through the books in the 3E section of your draft (D&D Adventure Game, D&D Basic Game, D&D Player's Kit), but I did not see anything, unless they are just tucked somewhere hard to find. BOZ (talk) 15:28, 23 July 2019 (UTC)
Great work on those two books as always; did you see anything for the Elminster book aside from the Ennies Award? A larger quote was removed from the Into the Unknown article[1], but if you want to abbreviate I'm sure you can still use a shorter form of that. BOZ (talk) 16:19, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
Excellent! Neverwinter Campaign Setting could definitely use some work as well, if you are up for that. :) BOZ (talk) 22:41, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

August 2019

Ideally, if you have anything for Neverwinter Campaign Setting, it is easier to save a page at AFD than it is to bring it back through AFC. :) BOZ (talk) 04:18, 2 August 2019 (UTC)

I took a stab at it, however, I didn't find much. I'm actually going to fold in some of the info I've found in the Neverwinter page because it has the "in-universe style" tag & needs some help. I've been going through some other 4E books. I think this three part adventure series (King of the Trollhaunt Warrens, Demon Queen's Enclave, Assault on Nightwyrm Fortress) should be merged because I can't find anything to make each individual page stronger but as a series together they might stand a better chance. Thoughts? In general though, it seems the AFDs have slowed down. Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:41, 2 August 2019 (UTC)
It's a big improvement, so I am happy about that (also happy that RPG-related AFDs have slowed down). Good work on improving the other articles as well. I don't think we need to merge the other articles at this time, although that may be something to look at somewhere down the road. BOZ (talk) 00:40, 3 August 2019 (UTC)
Totally spoke too soon about AFDs... (if I could use emoji I would). I'm out of pocket today & will mostly be offline but if you ping my talk page I should get a notification. Sariel Xilo (talk) 15:10, 4 August 2019 (UTC)
No worries; I just got back from GenCon. :) The user who was up to most of the recent AFD activity appears to be involved in something else entirely at the moment. BOZ (talk) 02:43, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
How was GenCon? Friends of mine who went sent me amazing photos. I especially liked the booth that had a prototype baby Owlbear plush that they're going to try and do a Kickstarter with. Let me know if there are other sourcebooks, adventure modules, etc that need help. Sariel Xilo (talk) 16:21, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
Ooh, cute, I think I might have seen that or something like it! It was lots of fun, I had not gone in a couple of years, so I was glad to go back. If you find anything more for the Neverwinter CS book then great, otherwise don't worry about it for now. A couple more 4E books you could take a look at would be Heroes of the Feywild and Heroes of the Elemental Chaos. :) BOZ (talk) 17:18, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
Sariel Xilo, if you were interested, and since you asked, I made a couple of suggestions above about books you could work on next, in case that got lost in the totality of my response. :) BOZ (talk) 23:24, 20 August 2019 (UTC)

Not sure if you would have anything for him, but Rick Loomis just passed away. I restored his deleted article back in 2013, and I think it has been improved a lot since then, but I always like to honor people in the field who have passed away. I also took the photograph on his article. :) BOZ (talk) 00:50, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

November 2019

Hey BOZ! Just to put it on your radar - I created Draft:Eberron: Rising From The Last War. I'm going to hold off on publishing it until the book comes out and reviews drop. Sariel Xilo (talk) 01:28, 11 November 2019 (UTC)

OK cool, good plan. :) BOZ (talk) 02:00, 11 November 2019 (UTC)

If you're "back at work" and have the time - at least for now - if you want to pick up where we left off, a couple more 4E books you could take a look at would be Heroes of the Feywild and Heroes of the Elemental Chaos. :) BOZ (talk) 01:29, 12 November 2019 (UTC)

Oh yeah, looks like you did get one of those already a few months ago.  :) Well, if you are up for it and want to continue, the next three books I had on my list were Madness at Gardmore Abbey, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Emporium, and Monster Vault: Threats to the Nentir Vale.  :) BOZ (talk) 17:10, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
Hey, moving right along! :) If you want to have a look at the next three books on my list, those are Heroes of Shadow, Heroes of the Forgotten Kingdoms, and Marauders of the Dune Sea. :)
Also, since you had a lot of success previously with getting bio articles out of draft space, Draft:Adam Tinworth is waiting for a review in case there is anything you can add to improve it! BOZ (talk) 15:15, 13 November 2019 (UTC)
If you can find anything for Adam Tinworth then great, but if not then no worries. We'll get his article republished eventually. :) BOZ (talk) 02:48, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
BOZ
Are you having issues accessing the Internet Archive? The whole website is down for me (but I'm not having issues elsewhere).

Sariel Xilo (talk) 20:43, 13 November 2019 (UTC) Nevermind! Issue appears to be resolved. Sariel Xilo (talk) 20:46, 13 November 2019 (UTC)

If you spot anything useful for Tinworth go ahead and add it. Meanwhile, moving on, if you want to take a look at the next three books on my list, those would be Dark Sun Creature Catalog, Vor Rukoth, and Orcs of Stonefang Pass. :) BOZ (talk) 15:12, 19 November 2019 (UTC)

Hey BOZ! If you have time, can you continue to add novels to Menzoberranzan? I listed the ones I could find mentioning the city in the AFD. I need to go make a pie for the holiday before it gets too late. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 03:10, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

It's that time of year! :) I'm not sure what you want me to do as far as adding novels to the article though? In the publication history section? I'm not sure what's missing from there. BOZ (talk) 04:18, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
So these novels were all listed in the FR wiki for Menzo: War of the Spider Queen series (Dissolution, Insurrection, Condemnation, Extinction, Annihilation, Resurrection); Neverwinter Saga (Charon's Claw), Companions Codex (Night of the Hunter, Rise of the King, Vengeance of the Iron Dwarf); Homecoming (Archmage, Maestro, Hero); A Reader's Guide to R. A. Salvatore's the Legend of Drizzt.
I have been doubling checking the plot descriptions to see whether or not Menzo was a primary or secondary location and then seeing if I could find any secondary sources on it that mention the city (because they're arguing about notability). The novels are definitely not my wheelhouse. But if you find any other sources for the rest of it, that would be great too. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 04:40, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
I sent myself a note and will do my best to find time to look at those tomorrow! BOZ (talk) 04:58, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
OK, so I found a list of novels for Menzoberranzan at the bottom of https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Menzoberranzan so I will start going through those and see what the plot summaries of the novels say! I have been pretty busy so far, so I may have do spend time on it later in the week or on the weekend, but I can definitely start now. BOZ (talk) 18:15, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

OK, I managed to find more time than I thought I would!  :) I looked through the plot summaries on the FR wiki for each of the novels and saw which ones were actually set at least in part in the city (rather than just "this character came from Menzo") and basically made a list of them. Rather than post them in the article without secondary sources, these are my findings:

  • Meznoberranzan is used in the Companions Codex, and plays a significant role in Night of the Hunter.
  • Menzobarranzan is prominent in the Homecoming series, and plays a significant role in the novels Archmage and Maestro.

The reviews you have been finding should also be useful in the articles about the novels, so I will take a look and see what I can re-use there when I get the chance.  :) BOZ (talk) 19:10, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

I hope you had a great Thanksgiving! Excellent work on improving Menzoberranzan. Unfortunately you were right about people trying to overwhelm the deletion process, as the list on Wikipedia:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/Article alerts continues to grow. :( BOZ (talk) 13:43, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

December 2019

You went above and beyond on improving Menzoberranzan! If the horde of deletions on fictional elements were a trickle instead, perhaps there would be more room to save more of them. :( Anyway, back to books, do you see anything that could help on the novel Finder's Stone or the sourcebook Book of Exalted Deeds? BOZ (talk) 13:12, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

Hey, not sure how much you know about Werewolf: The Apocalypse, but if you can find anything more there are a few supplements that could use some TLC if you have the time and inclination? BOZ (talk) 17:03, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

If you are taking requests (2020)

January 2020

No real requests at the moment, but if you're going to be on for a bit and have some time to lend for searching for sources, you can see that I have quite a bit of recent AFD activity on my talk page! :o BOZ (talk) 19:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

BOZ I'll take a look & see if I can find anything. Monsters are definitely harder to source. Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:10, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
Oh yeah, I know that fictional elements are definitely a challenge (you saved Menzoberranzan a month ago after a herculean effort, for example), so you can take a look at those if you get a chance, but I am more thinking of articles on books and games. Some of them may be salvageable and some may not, but the current slate of nominations includes: Dankendismal, Shadow Lords Tribebook, Mecha Manual 2: Invasion Terra Files, Uncle Albert's Auto Stop & Gunnery Shop 2035 Catalog, To Court the King, Claim-Jumper: The Game, and Rules According to Ral: Chaos Wars. Yikes! That is more than one person can deal with alone, but any of those you can help with would be appreciated! BOZ (talk) 19:55, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
Just to be clear to anyone reading my comments above regarding any articles facing PROD or ongoing AFD discussions, and to avoid any further baseless accusations of wrongdoing on my part, please note that I have only ever asked people for assistance in finding sources who have proven skilled and interested in doing so on similar topics; I have never, and will never, ask or expect another user to participate in such AFDs. BOZ (talk) 16:52, 21 January 2020 (UTC)
I'll follow up on that as well: if you go back through my talk page, you'll notice BOZ has been suggesting all sorts of RPG/game articles that they thought I might be interested in. Most of these articles aren't in AfD, they're just under-sourced & need a bit of help. I'm a relatively new editor and BOZ has been a great mentor especially with finding articles that I might have an interest in that I wouldn't have found on my own. Repeating what I said on the Administrators' noticeboard: I'm fairly decent with research if a topic has an internet presence or at the very least finding the names of obscure out of print titles that I can direct an editor towards if they want to take the time to find them offline. You'll also notice that I don't follow up on everything they suggest. I pick and choose based on interest, time and what I find when I do a basic research sweep. If I think I can contribute to an AfD or another article, then I do.
Let me know if you have questions or article suggestions yourself. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 22:48, 23 January 2020 (UTC)

I know that most of the above articles may be difficult to find sources for, so how about moving on to other things.  :) We left off previously at the 4E books

and Orcs of Stonefang Pass from my list. After those we can continue on to other 4E books if you like, otherwise I know you really enjoy 5E and I had a much shorter list of those that I think are worth starting; we can side-trek to those if you prefer? :) BOZ (talk) 17:02, 21 January 2020 (UTC)

I definitely do struggle with older products/games that don't have an internet footprint. I'm good with taking a look at 4E over the next few days. If you also have suggestions for biographies, that would be good too. I was reading an article (maybe in Slate?) about how Wikipedia has more articles on men than on women and that often new articles on women are held to higher notability standards than new articles on men. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 22:53, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
Hey awesome, thanks for the vote of confidence above and on the AN thread.  :) If I am ever being overwhelming or seem demanding in anyway, just let me know to back off.  ;) We can always switch directions, because there are many different types of articles we can work on. It is easy to forget that you are a newer editor since you are so skilled with sources already! I will not add any more of these AFDs to your page so that we can focus on other things; if you like, feel free to keep an eye on the games AFD page yourself to see what pops up there.
So yes, let us focus on 4E and 5E books then. I have the three above, and I have more ideas for when you are done with those.
As for biographies of women, that is always definitely an area that needs improvement.  :) Another friend of mine recently added some work on Draft:Amanda Hamon Kunz if you want to tackle that? There are a few more drafts I have for women bios, or I could pick out some stubby articles that you could work on as well? BOZ (talk) 23:23, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
Research has always been a strong suite in my family. It's a very random skill to have but Wikipedia has been a good outlet for it. My free time is all over the place but I don't think you're overwhelming. If I don't have time, I tend to just not sign on. :) I'll get started with what you suggested & poke you if I want to shift gears. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 23:33, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
BOZ I've tackled Dark Sun Creature Catalog and Vor Rukoth so I've crossed them off the list above. Sariel Xilo (talk) 21:29, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

I may not be commenting on any further AFDs (either in the discussion, or to you here), but when all else fails just remember to keep an eye on the Article Alerts pages. :) BOZ (talk) 01:14, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

February 2020

If you get a chance, take a look and see if there is anything you can add for Ron Edwards (game designer), and topics related to him. BOZ (talk) 23:44, 12 February 2020 (UTC)

Sources have been added to improve it, but there is still talk about deleting it, in case you get a chance to add anything for him and his works. BOZ (talk) 02:49, 15 February 2020 (UTC)
I think the article for Edwards is safe for now, because sources have been added. If you are looking for something else to work on, then leftover from last month we had the D&D book Orcs of Stonefang Pass, and the bio article Draft:Amanda Hamon Kunz. :) BOZ (talk) 20:29, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
@BOZ: I found that an interview with Hamon Kunz exists in Tabletop Gaming Issue 12 (2017) but I couldn't the interview itself for free. There's also her list of game credits on RPGGeek but not much else in terms of secondary sources. Sariel Xilo (talk) 02:28, 24 February 2020 (UTC)
OK cool, thanks for checking. :) Let me know when/if you're ready for more suggestions! BOZ (talk) 04:13, 24 February 2020 (UTC)
That said, if you are interested in a challenge, there may wind up being a Featured article review to determine whether the main Dungeons & Dragons article should stay as a Featured article, based on the concerns brought up in this conversation. BOZ (talk) 14:02, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
I'm taking a stab at replacing sources. Quick question, what do you do if you discover part of something you've quoted has been removed from article? The Bloomberg article appears to have removed the second sentence "Stewart says sales of the fifth edition of the game, which was first published in 2014, were up 41 percent in 2017 from the year before, and soared another 52 percent in 2018, the game’s biggest sales year yet. According to Wizards, an estimated 40 million people play the game annually". But they didn't update their correction date (July 8, 2019) because you can see the original quote in the archive copy of the article.[1] I didn't include the 40mil estimate in the D&D article but I did use that in the WoTC article over the summer. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:28, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
To be honest, I'm not sure how to handle that. BOZ (talk) 19:49, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
Apparently, WoTC PR issued a correction but it appears Bloomberg just erased the sentence: https://www.enworld.org/threads/40-million-people-have-played-d-d-updated.666473/ I'll update the WoTC article with estimated player numbers from the Seattle Times article. Sariel Xilo (talk) 20:48, 25 February 2020 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Pilon, Mary (July 8, 2019). "The Rise of the Professional Dungeon Master". Bloomberg Businessweek. Archived from the original on July 10, 2019. Retrieved 25 February 2020.

March 2020

Hey there! :) If you are interested or just need something to do this month, there is one leftover D&D book Orcs of Stonefang Pass, and after that it is wide open horizons. If you have a specific area you are interested in suggestions for, let's work on that! There are more 4E and 5E D&D books, but there are many other games. There are companies and games that need work (if you have the Article Alerts pages on your watchlist you'll see some in need), but there are supplements, bio articles (in drafts and otherwise), old games and new games, etc. :) BOZ (talk) 12:47, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

April 2020

Archive.org has a ton of older tabletop gaming magazines if you are doing research, including The Space Gamer[2][3], Ares Magazine[4], partial collection of 12 issues of Different Worlds[5], Imagine[6], and Adventurer[7] and probably more that I haven't found yet. :) BOZ (talk) 03:25, 28 April 2020 (UTC)

Also Polyhedron[8]. It looks like a lot of these were uploaded by the same user, so there may be more - will let you know. BOZ (talk) 05:25, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
Thanks for these! I keep running into interesting sources that don't quite fit whatever I'm actually looking for so I've started to stick them in my sandbox in hopes they're useful for something in the future. Sariel Xilo (talk) 16:07, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

May 2020

Hi there! A user was asking me about sources for Matt Colville to see if they can build an article on him; I am not too familiar with the subject, but if you have the time could you have a look at User talk:The Squirrel Conspiracy/sandbox/1 and see if you have anything to add? Thanks! BOZ (talk) 05:43, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

BOZ I'll take a look. Colville has a big following in the 5E community so I'm curious about how much coverage he has in terms of Wikipedia notability standards. Sariel Xilo (talk) 16:10, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

One more, by the way. I restored Cyberpunk (collectible card game) recently and did find one good source, so there may be more out there. BOZ (talk) 20:06, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

BOZ do you think we could expand the Wikipedia:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/References section with more updated websites like this: Wikipedia:Webcomic sources? I'd be fine taking point on that. I just had to explain to someone in a talk page somewhere that Polygon, 411Mania, & Bleeding Cool were reliable sources for D&D... Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 13:42, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

Yes, I think that is a good idea... that page was built like 10 years ago and rarely updated. :) If those are reliable sources elsewhere on Wikipedia, then we should consider them reliable as well - I mean, why not? Maybe a separate section for websites which are not game-centric but do regularly cover games as part of their overall coverage? BOZ (talk) 14:42, 14 May 2020 (UTC)
BOZ I put together an initial list here: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/References. I'll probably expand the list as I run across websites I forgot to add to it. Where should I notify editors that might be interested in joining the conversation? Sariel Xilo (talk) 16:15, 14 May 2020 (UTC)
Good work! :) For starters, I would say that Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons is an obvious good place to start. BOZ (talk) 16:39, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

If you were looking for anything else to work on, you may have noticed that one thing I have been doing is to create more articles on Origins Award winners going back to the beginning, but here are some for some more recent games (as in, this century) that I created for 2000 and on: Icehouse: The Martian Chess Set, Fields of Honor: The American War for Independence, Death in Freeport, Unseen Masters, Marvel HeroClix: Infinity Challenge, Mage Knight Dungeons, The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (board game), Redhurst Academy of Magic Student Handbook, Black Sails Over Freeport, Path of the Bold: An Anthology of Superhero Fiction, The World of Darkness: Storytelling System Rulebook, Paranoia Mandatory Bonus Fun! Card Game, Deadlands: Reloaded, Hobby Games: The 100 Best, Astounding Hero Tales, Zombie Fluxx, BattleTech: 25 Years of Art & Fiction, Shadows over Scotland, Night's Watch (Green Ronin Publishing), No Thank You, Evil!. Pick a few here and there, work on the ones that interest you. :) There are a bunch more redlinks on the award winner lists that I will eventually turn into articles, but probably not soon. BOZ (talk) 00:00, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

Good work as always on Magic in Dungeons & Dragons! If you've got anything left over for Magic item (Dungeons & Dragons), it could use some improvement as well. :) BOZ (talk) 17:36, 31 May 2020 (UTC)
Thanks BOZ! That magic article is a bit of a hot mess but I've been slowly working through it. I'm probably going to take a break from it for a bit. Hope all is well with you. Sariel Xilo (talk) 01:34, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

June 2020

Hey there! Perhaps a little unusual request, but do you see anything that can improve the article for Reality Simulations, publisher of Origins-award winning play-by-mail games like Hyborian War (current FA candidate) and Forgotten Realms, and also Duel2 (aka Duelmasters) and Alamaze? BOZ (talk) 12:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

Do you have any of the magic left that you used to get Wizards of the Coast fixed back up to GA standards? If so, take a look at Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/Forgotten Realms/1. BOZ (talk) 22:15, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

BOZ I can help a bit tonight. My laptop charger broke and will only charge if held in place so I'm a bit limited until the replacement arrives later this week. Do you have a copy of "Dungeons & Dragons" and Philosophy"? This JSTOR review says: "Parts three and four, "Crafting Worlds" and "Foray into the Forgotten Realms and Dragonlance," move into the more general territory of world building and fantasy narratives, engaging in discussions useful to literary analysts and creative writers". That might be helpful to source the article and expand the reception section. Sariel Xilo (talk) 23:28, 29 June 2020 (UTC)
OK, thanks for doing whatever you can! Unfortunately no, I don't have that book. I was going to take a look at Designers & Dragons tomorrow to see what I can add since that book didn't exist when we got it up to GA in the first place. :) BOZ (talk) 00:02, 30 June 2020 (UTC)
BOZ Taking a break. I didn't get a chance to add anything 5E related past SCAG (2015). Sariel Xilo (talk) 21:11, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

July 2020

BOZ Just wanted to flag this book for you: Dread Trident: Tabletop Role-Playing Games and the Modern Fantastic by Curtis D. Carbonell. It has a dedicated chapter to D&D multiverse and the free preview on google books was super useful as a source for Forgotten Realms & Planescape related articles. I'm assuming the rest of the chapter would be useful for other campaign settings but the e-book is $70 so not something I'm buying right now. :) Also on books I don't own, does Designers & Dungeons have anything on The Grand History of the Realms?

On a different note, I think we should suggest merging Time of Troubles (Forgotten Realms) and The Avatar Series. Both have been flagged as needing work and I think the topic would have a stronger chance to survive AfD as one article given the (probable) success of The Sundering. Thoughts? Sariel Xilo (talk) 01:13, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Well, I know "Designers & Dragons" does touch on Time of Troubles / Avatar Series, as I added notes on them to the main FR article. :) I am not sure if it deals with Grand History but I think it might - unfortunately, I only have a digital copy of that book on one computer, which I will not have access to again until Monday... I will leave myself a note to check it again next week. That other book you found was pretty cool, and you get a sizable chunk of material there, I think the whole 20+ page chapter about D&D! BOZ (talk) 01:26, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

BOZ Do you have any article suggestions that could be a palate cleanser after AfDs and yet another round of are RPG sources reliable? Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 00:19, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Yes indeed! Give me a day or two and I will send that your way. I have a list of 4E books that need work, and a list of 5E books that need to be created; do you have a preference for one or the other, or would you rather take on two of each? BOZ (talk) 05:10, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
How about 2 of each? Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:17, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
OK, so I had compiled lists of 4E and 5E books that I was eventually going to ask you to look at, and I tried to find them, but I think I left both of those at my office so I won't be able to access them until the office reopens... so, oh well, I will have to just make it up as I go in the meantime. ;) I will look more into the list of 5 books this week, but in the meantime I think that Heroes of the Feywild is in decent shape but could always benefit from anything you can find for it, and I would say about the same for The Shadowfell: Gloomwrought and Beyond. BOZ (talk) 04:00, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
The Gloomwrought book is actually one of my favorite D&D books. I tracked it down on Ebay a few years ago - it has some amazing art but I've never been able to find high quality digital versions of the art (you can sometimes get art prints but Wizards is never consistent with when they allow artists to do that). I'll take a look at these over the next few days. Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:43, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
For one of the 5E books, I think that we could use an article on Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide, so I started a small stub on that. :) BOZ (talk) 18:27, 11 July 2020 (UTC)
OK, so I started a stub for Curse of Strahd, so with the Gloomwrought guide that you already did, the Feywild book, and the Sword Coast book, that makes four as requested. :) If you are looking for more after those, ping me! The number of D&D books is finite, but there are plenty more. ;) BOZ (talk) 00:34, 18 July 2020 (UTC)

Do you by chance have access to Playing at the World (2012) by Jon Peterson? I came across it as a reference to spell points (something I was looking up for non-Wiki reasons) and it occurred to me that it might be a good source for both Magic in Dungeons & Dragons & Magic system. This fandom article says "RPG history book Playing at the World (2012) attributes one of the earliest spell points systems to Lee Gold and Ted Johnstone, contributors to Los Angeles gaming newsletter APA-L. In APA-L #521, Johnstone referred to "points of goetic energy", while in APA-L #522, John Hertz used the term spell-points which would later be used by official D&D sourcebooks". And this stackexchange says "According to Playing at the World, non-Vancian spellcasting was one of the earliest house rules applied by D&D players, who felt it unreasonable that the first-level wizard only cast to cast one spell per day. In fact, many groups allowed it by accidental misinterpretation of the rules. This was one of the first forms of spontaneous casting in D&D". Neither references page numbers, so I'm not comfortable just adding the info & attributing to the source without a closer look. But it does seem promising! However, my library doesn't have access to it even with a interlibrary loan. Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:50, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

PATW is a book that I definitely want to get a copy of at some point, but do not yet have unfortunately. Does it show up on Google Books? I would say, try asking at the D&D and/or RPG WikiProject talk page to see if anyone has a copy they can get the page #s for. BOZ (talk) 20:11, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
Some people choose to be impossible to work with, so assured are they of the correctness of their position. :\ Meanwhile, I think that the same user is likely to be going on another AFD spree beginning with The Iron Crypt of the Heretics. BOZ (talk) 12:32, 8 July 2020 (UTC)
I got what I wanted - one, the conversation on the noticeboard and two, a continuing record of trying to politely work with editors to get consensus (or get help in getting consensus) even when we disagree. Now I didn't get someone who would want to work towards finding middle ground on future issues but that's not really skin off my nose. My childhood was fairly WASPy so the failure of the editor being either sneaky or clever with wordplay was more entertaining than annoying. Thank you as always for looking out for me! AfDs aren't my jam but I'll take a look. Sariel Xilo (talk) 15:50, 8 July 2020 (UTC)
I find it amazing that you always continue to impress me. :D BOZ (talk) 15:57, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

I put some more work into Forgotten Realms today [9] largely focusing on removing some of the primary sources and replacing them with independent sources. I am done with that for the moment. BOZ (talk) 16:48, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

August 2020

Hi there! Do you see any good sources for Jefferson P. Swycaffer? If not, I will probably move the article to draft. BOZ (talk) 00:13, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

I wasn't able to find any. Sorry! Sariel Xilo (talk) 21:39, 10 August 2020 (UTC)
Thanks for checking. Darrin Drader was recently gutted, so I am not sure if there are any sources available for that one. BOZ (talk) 21:40, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey BOZ! You might have noticed that I fell down a Magic the Gathering rabbit hole & I don't even play that game. I was looking for sources for the 2 D&D/MTG books and then it kind of spiraled. But on the positive side, I think I have enough sources to at least start drafts on those pages when I sort out my internet. When I lost power a couple weeks ago, it fried my router and now like 25% of the time it doesn't provide internet which is way too high. So my goal this weekend is to get a new one and set it up. But I did get a chance to start working on both Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide & Curse of Strahd, so I'll continue working on those if I can. Best! Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:37, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Yeah, I see that! I do not deal with M:tG much either, unless I come across a review to add. It sounds like you have had some struggles there so take some time and get yourself set up the way you want to be. :) Those two are definitely looking a lot better, so save any touch-up work you might have for Heroes of the Feywild for whenever you have time to focus on it! BOZ (talk) 21:43, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Someone went on a real tear with Forgotten Realms books, the apparent intention to clear out the category entirely. I understand there are many and any one volunteer only has so much time (oh, but deleting takes so little work and time, especially when not taking time to assess an article and using a boilerplate rationale, doesn't it?), but do you see anything more for any of the following?: Volo's Guide to the Dalelands, Champions of Ruin, Netheril: Empire of Magic, Anauroch (accessory), Aurora's Whole Realms Catalog, The Bloodstone Lands, Giantcraft, The Great Glacier, Underdark (supplement), Unapproachable East (supplement), Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, Champions of Valor, Cities of Mystery, City of Splendors: Waterdeep, The Code of the Harpers, The Dalelands, Draconomicon, Dragons of Faerûn, Dreams of the Red Wizards, Drizzt Do'Urden's Guide to the Underdark, Drow of the Underdark, City System, Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms, Elminster's Ecologies Appendix I: The Battle of Bones / Hill of Lost Souls, Elminster's Ecologies Appendix II: The High Moor / The Serpent Hills, Empires of the Sands, Faiths & Avatars, Faiths and Pantheons, The Forgotten Realms Atlas, Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Forgotten Realms Player's Guide, Gold & Glory, The Grand History of the Realms, Hall of Heroes (Forgotten Realms), Heroes' Lorebook, The Horde (boxed set), The Jungles of Chult, Horde Campaign, Lords of Darkness, Lost Empires of Faerûn (accessory), Magic of Faerûn, The Magister, Maztica Campaign Set, Menzoberranzan: City of Intrigue, Monsters of Faerûn, Moonshae, Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes, Mysteries of the Moonsea, Netheril: Empire of Magic, The North: Guide to the Savage Frontier, Old Empires, Pages from the Mages, Pirates of the Fallen Stars, Player's Guide to Faerûn, Player's Guide to the Forgotten Realms Campaign, Power of Faerûn, Races of Faerûn, The Ruins of Myth Drannor, The Ruins of Undermountain, Ruins of Zhentil Keep, The Savage Frontier, Serpent Kingdoms, The Seven Sisters, Shining South (accessory), The Shining South, Silver Marches (accessory), The Vilhon Reach, Villains' Lorebook, Volo's Guide to All Things Magical, Volo's Guide to Monsters, Volo's Guide to Waterdeep, Warriors and Priests of the Realms, Waterdeep and the North, Wizards and Rogues of the Realms, Xanathar's Guide to Everything. Some of them do have one or more independent sources already, but anything we can't source can always be merged to List of Forgotten Realms modules and sourcebooks. I will check through Designers & Dragons for them tomorrow. BOZ (talk) 05:21, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me know. Some of this was popping up on my watchlist but that's not comprehensive. I don't have much time tonight but I did oppose & remove PROD from the three 5E books that got hit because they have a bunch of secondary sources that are considered reliable. I thought PROD was for stubs and such and AfD was for more developed articles. I'll try & strike through articles as I go (if I find additional sources, if I think the article is well sourced as is, or if I can't find anything, etc). Sariel Xilo (talk) 05:50, 28 August 2020 (UTC)
I was able to add some notes to several of them from Designers & Dragons. Any help you can give on any of them is great – some of the PRODs were removed, and a few are at AFD – but if you want some direction on prioritizing, since I know you have better access to 4E books than earlier ones, if you want to check and see what you can do with Draconomicon, Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms, Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Forgotten Realms Player's Guide, and Menzoberranzan: City of Intrigue, although I know you already worked on a few of those. If you think you might have some luck with later 3rd edition books, I can sift through those as well. BOZ (talk) 16:48, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

September 2020

Do you have any sources which could help back up Kender (Dragonlance), Khelben "Blackstaff" Arunsun, and Elaith Craulnober? BOZ (talk) 18:49, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

October 2020

If you are interested in taking a look, there are two WoD articles up for Good Article nominations: Talk:Victorian Age: Vampire/GA1 and Talk:Fall of London/GA1. BOZ (talk) 06:40, 15 October 2020 (UTC)

Also, do you see any useable sources for game designer Teeuwynn Woodruff? BOZ (talk) 17:10, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
@BOZ: Sorry I haven't found anything for these articles! Sariel Xilo (talk) 02:04, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
No worries. :) BOZ (talk) 02:26, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

November 2020

Chicago by Night is also up for GA now! BOZ (talk) 02:26, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

I noticed that Graz'zt appears on the cover of the Tasha book; if your sources mention him, I would happily restore his article. :) BOZ (talk) 04:19, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

I think the only mention of Graz'zt is by the alt cover artist Wylie Beckert in a Dragon+ interview: "The art brief also called for Graz’zt to be 'looking flirtatious'. I figured the flirtiest he could get would be offering Tasha a uniquely demonic valentine".[1] I can take a second look tomorrow though! Sariel Xilo (talk) 04:25, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
@BOZ: Since I haven't actually fallen asleep yet, I did a quick check. The ScreenRant article is the only Tasha's source that goes in-depth about Graz'zt (versus others are basically just one line mentions).[2] The second second is the other thing that popped up when I dropped Graz'zt into Google News. [3] Not sure if this is enough for you. Sariel Xilo (talk) 05:53, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
Hang on to this; if we come up with more, it would be worth bringing him back. :) BOZ (talk) 06:08, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

@BOZ: What is it about Thanksgiving and AfDs on fictional cities? My time is a bit limited today but I'll see what I can do. Sariel Xilo (talk) 17:20, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

And now Waterdeep is at AFD as well, and Kara-Tur. BOZ (talk) 06:04, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Chapman, Matt (August 26, 2020). "Imagining The Ampersand: Wylie Beckert". Dragon+ (33). Wizards of the Coast.
  2. ^ "Dungeons & Dragons Lore: Who Is Tasha?". ScreenRant. 2020-11-03. Retrieved 2020-11-21.
  3. ^ "Dungeons and Dragons: 10 Of The Most Dangerous & Powerful Demons, Ranked". CBR. 2020-03-26. Retrieved 2020-11-21.{{cite web}}: CS1 maint: url-status (link)

December 2020

An article on David Hecht had been converted to a redirect, but I moved it to Draft space now and I was wondering if you saw anything useful for building that one? BOZ (talk) 09:20, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

@BOZ: Thoughts on the images removed from Dungeons & Dragons–related products? Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dungeons_%26_Dragons%E2%80%93related_products&type=revision&diff=992885291&oldid=990493303 Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:51, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

I'm not as up on image policy as I would like to be, but my guess is that if the fair-use images are not seen as necessary for the page then they are probably considered excessive. BOZ (talk) 19:50, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Excellent additions on Vampire of the Mists - I'm going to make use of that CBR list on other novels articles today, and then later this week I will look into that io9 series to see where they go with that. :) BOZ (talk) 15:47, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

@BOZ: It looks like Rob Bricken has been writing one article a month since June 2020: https://gizmodo.com/tag/dungeons-and-dragons-and-novels Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:04, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
Cool yeah, I saw those! It looks like he has done 6 so far, and all the other novels for that series already have articles, so I am just going to go ahead and add them later today. :) BOZ (talk) 19:10, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
By the way, great work on building up the Strahd article. :) I went ahead and added blurbs to Drizzt and Wulfgar so far; I'm afraid that most of the character articles were long ago redirected, including Bruenor (which was an article a lot more recently[10] than most D&D/FR characters). BOZ (talk) 21:11, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
Thanks! I think I'm done with the Strahd article for now but I would appreciate if you took a look at the bits I tagged as original research. I didn't find any sources for those bits. Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:26, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
No problem; I don't think there's a need to retain any of that, especially now that you have given the page an almost total rewrite, so I just went ahead and removed the parts that are not purely statements of fact. I would say that with your work there and on Iggwilv, those may very well have enough material to join the Drizzt page as "Good Articles" with some more work. :) I tried to do what I could with those reviews on the other character articles, so maybe those can be improved as well. BOZ (talk) 20:20, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
Surprisingly, Vecna has been harder to find sources for than Strahd. Sariel Xilo (talk) 02:26, 31 December 2020 (UTC)
And so I did! I added Reception blurbs to a small handful of existing articles, and I temporarily restored several others to add them and then revert to redirect; if you see any of those for which you can find additional sources, let me know and I will restore them so we can build a proper article. Bruenor and Artemis were redirected due to AFD, so they would need more than just a couple of sources to bring them back. BOZ (talk) 02:35, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

Submissions, AfD, etc

Please pop submissions and other similar notices under here. Thanks! Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:37, 10 November 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Xanathar's Guide to Everything has been accepted

Xanathar's Guide to Everything, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

Chetsford (talk) 05:34, 24 June 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Ghosts of Saltmarsh has been accepted

Ghosts of Saltmarsh, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

Hitro talk 12:22, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
Sariel Xilo, it went well with this one, which is the way I expect the others will go, as I think with Xanathar's that was just a fluke because the reviewer is a hardliner on sources. I think most AFC reviewers would rather accept a well-written well-sourced article by a newer user even if there is room for improvement. :) BOZ (talk) 12:46, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
BOZ Thanks! How to I move something into review if the draft doesn't have the button at the top? I think Baldur's Gate: Descent Into Avernus is ready for review. Sariel Xilo (talk) 15:38, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
Sure! You just type {{subst:submit}} and that will automatically update it. :) BOZ (talk) 18:50, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Baldur's Gate: Descent Into Avernus has been accepted

Baldur's Gate: Descent Into Avernus, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

Chetsford (talk) 02:14, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Waterdeep: Dungeon of the Mad Mage has been accepted

Waterdeep: Dungeon of the Mad Mage, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

Chetsford (talk) 01:03, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set has been accepted

Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

Chetsford (talk) 01:25, 2 August 2019 (UTC)

Hi Chetsford! Thanks again for reviewing another one of my articles. With this one, it was almost immediately put up for AfD so if you could comment about why you accepted this article to begin with I think that would be super useful to the ongoing conversation (especially because we're discussing individual articles for each Starter Set versus one article that captures them all together). Here's the link: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:18, 7 August 2019 (UTC)

He may further clarify for that if he wishes, but he has already commented on it here: [11]. BOZ (talk) 20:21, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Thanks for the link BOZ! I don't normally poke into admin discussions. Sariel Xilo (talk) 21:05, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Sariel Xilo - thanks for the ping and sorry for my delayed reply. I think you essentially made the argument for that I would have made and, with the current trajectory of discussion, I'm not sure I'd have much to add that would be useful. However, I'll keep my eyes on it and, if it's extended, will be happy to provide a more detailed rationale as to why I accepted it in the first place. I probably won't formally !vote on it just to avoid muddying the water by creating the appearance of a potential conflict of interest as the AfC reviewer who accepted it, but I can at least describe my thought process. Chetsford (talk) 00:26, 9 August 2019 (UTC)

Nomination of Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 08:53, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Princes of the Apocalypse (September 22)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted because it included copyrighted content, which is not permitted on Wikipedia.
Wikipedia cannot accept material copied from elsewhere, unless it explicitly and verifiably has been released to the world under a suitably-free and compatible copyright license or into the public domain and is written in an acceptable tone—this includes material that you own the copyright to. You should attribute the content of a draft to outside sources, using citations, but copying and pasting or closely paraphrasing sources is not acceptable. The entire draft should be written using your own words and structure. Note to reviewers: do not leave copyright violations sitting in the page history. Please follow the instructions here.
You are welcome to write an article on the subject, but please do not use copyrighted work. Missvain (talk) 09:41, 22 September 2019 (UTC)
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Hello, Sariel Xilo! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Missvain (talk) 09:41, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

Copyright problem: Draft:Princes of the Apocalypse

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia! We welcome and appreciate your contributions, such as Draft:Princes of the Apocalypse, but we regretfully cannot accept copyrighted text or images from either web sites or printed works. This article appears to contain work copied from https://www.slugmag.com/game-reviews/princes-of-the-apocalypse/, and therefore to constitute a violation of Wikipedia's copyright policies. The copyrighted text has been or will soon be deleted. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with our copyright policy. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators are liable to be blocked from editing.

If you believe that the article is not a copyright violation, or if you have permission from the copyright holder to release the content freely under license allowed by Wikipedia, then you should do one of the following:

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See Wikipedia:Declaration of consent for all enquiries for a template of the permissions letter the copyright holder is expected to send.

If you would like to begin working on a new version of the article you may do so at this temporary page. Leave a note at Draft talk:Princes of the Apocalypse saying you have done so and an administrator will move the new article into place once the issue is resolved.

Thank you, and please feel welcome to continue contributing to Wikipedia. Happy editing! Missvain (talk) 09:42, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Waterdeep: Dragon Heist has been accepted

Waterdeep: Dragon Heist, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

Cerebellum (talk) 11:13, 28 September 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Storm King's Thunder has been accepted

Storm King's Thunder, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

AugusteBlanqui (talk) 12:56, 10 October 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Princes of the Apocalypse has been accepted

Princes of the Apocalypse, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

AugusteBlanqui (talk) 13:15, 10 October 2019 (UTC)

Nomination of Waterdeep for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Waterdeep, to which you have significantly contributed, is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or if it should be deleted.

The discussion will take place at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Waterdeep until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

To customise your preferences for automated AfD notifications for articles to which you've significantly contributed (or to opt-out entirely), please visit the configuration page. Delivered by SDZeroBot (talk) 01:02, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Reception sections

Hi, Sariel Xilo! Great work getting those RPG articles up and running! There's some advice at Wikipedia:Copyediting reception sections which you might find helpful. Best of luck. Haukur (talk) 22:28, 7 August 2019 (UTC)

Best wishes

Hey, Sariel Xilo, best wishes back in school or whatever you are up to. :) Your hard work accomplished quite a bit in a short time despite (or perhaps partly because of) a resurgence of deletion activity. You helped save a few important articles from deletion, you helped get Andy Chambers out of draft space, you helped keep Wizards of the Coast as a "Good Article", you helped create and improve many articles on 4th and 5th edition D&D books, and more great stuff! I want to share my appreciation of what you accomplished! If you are able to come back in the future and help out, just pick a spot that needs work, or I suggested a few book articles above, or if you like just ask me what needs doing, but work on whatever makes you happy ultimately, and I am sure it will turn out great. :) BOZ (talk) 12:17, 13 September 2019 (UTC)

Hopefully one day you get a chance to come back and see all this. :) In the meantime, I also want to let you know that thanks to your efforts, Jessica Price was also restored to article space! BOZ (talk) 14:11, 30 October 2019 (UTC)
Hey BOZ! I've been super busy and I haven't checked in here for a while. Awesome to see that a bunch of the articles were approved. If I have a bit more time, I'll take a look at some other articles. Sariel Xilo (talk) 18:25, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
No worries, and good to hear from you!  :) If you do happen to find some time, Faiths and Pantheons and Demihuman Deities are top priorities at the moment. :) BOZ (talk) 19:10, 10 November 2019 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!

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I'm wishing you a Merry Christmas, because that is what I celebrate. If you don't like Christmas or just don't celebrate it in any of its forms, then please accept a generic "Happy Holidays". If you celebrate no holidays at this time of year, then hopefully you will be satisfied with an even more generic "Season's Greetings".  :) BOZ (talk) 21:50, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!

BOZ (talk) is wishing you a Merry Christmas! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Don't eat yellow snow!

Spread the holiday cheer by adding {{subst:User:Flaming/MC2008}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

I'm wishing you a Merry Christmas, because that is what I celebrate. Feel free to take a "Happy Holidays" or "Season's Greetings" if you prefer.  :) BOZ (talk) 05:14, 23 December 2020 (UTC)

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Dear Sariel Xilo - I started making a non-controversial change before this all started on the Career section of Zak Sabbath's - the scope of the discussion regarding Zak Sabbath's guilt moved into that Section after I attempted to make edits to the Career Section - I left the section regarding Zaks Personal Life alone after you have pointed out it was under discussion and started reworking the career section before you decided to move the discussion into that after my edits were made which originally appeared on the 8th of June with the move into Career happening on the 15th of June. I do not feel you are operating in good faith. I just wanted to let people know that Zak's contribution to the OSR movement were important and am amazed you have some issue with that statement. Let me know when you have finished your doing whatever you are doing and I will go back to try and tidy up the career section in regards to the OSR movement - because that is all I am interested in - Have a nice day Cameronmurtagh (talk) 01:06, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

Cameronmurtagh Not only did other editors flag an ongoing discussion, you were one the editors I tagged when the proposed language section shifted to encompass the entire Career section. If you actually went to the talk page, you would see that we have included Smith's work in the OSR movement (specifically his work on the Lamentations of the Flame Princess system). Unfortunately, most of Smith's connections with the OSR movement are recorded on blogs & reddit posts and not in WP:RS (I actually think the Old School Revival article itself needs some help getting more reliable sources). So if you have sources and/or an opinion on how the OSR bit of his RPG career should be worded, please participate in the RfC. Asking you to work together towards consensus is good faith. Sariel Xilo (talk) 01:44, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for your suggestion I have been working on the OSR page - you can even check the talk page on that article before you made that suggestion. And you will notice that the were 5 references on the edit I made in regards to Zak. I figured I would leave the controversy alone and concentrate on the career section which needed help in regards to OSR. But you seem intent on dragging me into that mess. Cameronmurtagh (talk) 02:01, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

Dungeons & Dragons controversies

Hi - I'm not sure what your personal ownership of this page is, but your continued edits to leave the Hickman article in the section are counter-intuitive. The entire page is on "Dungeons & Dragons controversies" - it is not "D&D discussions/viewpoints" and this specific section is about "Religious objections" and again Hickman's article is not one. This page isn't about giving equal time to the other side of the argument, its a list of controversies and an explanation of those. Just because Hickman is a Christian and has a positive opinion of D&D doesn't make his POV relevant in this instance. I'm a Christian and I don't have a problem with D&D, but I understand that it is a "controversy" for some of the faith - it should not be minimized by trotting out a "name" with a counter opinion. So rather than continue to play the revert game, I thought I'd see what your actual objection is. Ckruschke (talk) 18:16, 21 August 2020 (UTC)Ckruschke

Ckruschke I don't claim ownership of that page. In general, I've been doing a lot of cleanup on articles lately rather than article creation so I started a cleanup/reorganization of Dungeons & Dragons controversies after seeing a conversation on the talk page from June (which basically highlighted a bunch of things were under the religious category but didn't seem like religious objections). I don't know what our personal religions have to do with anything but I responded to the meat of your question back on the article's talk page because I think that's the right place for this conversation. Sariel Xilo (talk) 19:24, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

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