User talk:Valereee/Archive 36

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Sunshine

		Sunshine!
		Hello Valereee! Interstellarity (talk) has given you a bit of sunshine to brighten your day! Sunshine promotes WikiLove and hopefully it has made your day better. Spread the sunshine by adding `{{subst:User:Meaghan/Sunshine}}` to someone else's talk page, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. In addition, you can spread the sunshine to anyone who visits your userpage and/or talk page by adding {{User:Meaghan/Sunshine icon}}. Happy editing! Interstellarity (talk) 14:30, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Happy first day of summer, Valereee!! Interstellarity (talk) 14:30, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, @Interstellarity! Happy longest day of the year to you, to! —valereee (talk) 14:46, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Sydney Morton

On 21 June 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Sydney Morton, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Sydney Morton's grandfather appeared in Run, Little Chillun (poster pictured), but the musical theatre bug skipped a generation? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Sydney Morton. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Sydney Morton), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 00:02, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Run, Little Chillun

On 21 June 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Run, Little Chillun, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Sydney Morton's grandfather appeared in Run, Little Chillun (poster pictured), but the musical theatre bug skipped a generation? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Sydney Morton. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Run, Little Chillun), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 00:02, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

This week's article for improvement (week 25, 2021)

Hello, Valereee. The article for improvement of the week is: Alida Morberg Please be bold and help improve it! Previous selections: Savoriness • Learned society Get involved with the AFI project: Nominate an article • Review nominations Posted by: MusikBot ^talk 00:05, 21 June 2021 (UTC) using MediaWiki message delivery (talk) on behalf of WikiProject AFI • Opt-out instructions

Hey

I really do appreciate that. Thanks. Drmies (talk) 00:31, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

Any time. —valereee (talk) 00:35, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

Discontent Content Issue 5

Discontent Content Issue #5

Welcome, subscribers, to the fifth Discontent Content newsletter! Discontent Content is a newsletter aiming to collate and improve Wikipedia articles in need of more eyes and hands to get them in shape. Its unique trimodal structure allows editors to work where they feel comfortable -- with stubs and starts needing to be brought to standard, mid-quality articles with Good or Featured potential, or quality-assessed articles needing help to maintain their status.

Category 1

Articles in this category are those that need to be brought up to a minimum quality standard. Some will be stubs; others will be longer articles that nonetheless have significant concerns putting them far below B- or C-class adequacy.

This issue's Category 1 articles are:

Isolar – 1976 Tour: A substantial musical event for one of the most influential albums of its era, but with a rather spindly, table-focused article (I also note no one seems to have given post-inflation numbers for any of the figures).
Occultism (Islam): "Major topic that's a literal stub because it's about something outside the comfort zone of the average editor" of the day. Esotericism in one of the world's major exoteric religions is, of course, something which can be written about extensively.
G & G v Wikimedia Foundation Inc: Going meta for a moment...This is an interesting case, and it's a shame we discuss it only as a paragraph. It would be fascinating to read further on this topic.

Category 2

Articles in this category, while in better current shape than Category 1, are still missing something. They have the potential to be truly high-quality content, and may have been at one point. With work, they can be brought up to dizzying heights.

This issue's Category 2 articles are:

Misophonia: A concept, symptom, or disorder -- no one's quite yet drawn the borderlands -- where people are unusually upset at noises such as chewing sounds. The idea may sound odd, but it does distress people with it and those around them. The subject is very popular, with Half Million Award-tier page views, but the readers are served by a rather weak article.
Sparks (band): This eccentric, creative band was a GA long ago, but delisted in 2010. Though undersourced, the article certainly has potential to return to its old status.
Han Xin: One of the great military leaders of ancient China is graced by a massively undersourced article. Several sections have none at all.

Category 3

Articles in this category have been assessed through a content review process in the past, but may require work to be brought up to current GA/FA standard. Editors can help bring them to a level where the star or plus near their names can once again shine.

This issue's Category 3 articles are:

Wind: This FA is on a huge, important topic, but its star needs some polishing. FAR notice has been given for significant uncited passages. To quote the talk page, the article has good bones, and it can certainly be restored to modern FA status if anyone is able to work on it.
Jeopardy!: The article for perhaps one of the most famous game shows of all time is at GAR for citation issues. Most of the issues brought up can be fixed quite easily, such as locating page numbers.
French fries: Tasty, but needs more sauce. The GAR discusses unsourced sections and unreliable sourcing; I also notice some pretty blatant prose issues and a spindly lead.

Letter from the Editor

This issue's reader suggestion from Sennecaster:

Maasai people: The Vital 4 article for this major East African ethnic group was recently significantly reduced due to copyvio. It needs urgent work to restore cored-out content, but the references are still available in the article to simplify the process.

One topic I've been broadly thinking about lately is the concept of GA sweeps. There hasn't been one in well over a decade; discussion of a new one is traditionally stymied by the sheer number of GAs that would need sweeping, considering there are over ten times as many as there were at the last sweep. Nonetheless, there's no dispute that many GAs don't really count as 99.5th percentile articles, or even decent-quality articles (whether one's own personal reading of WIAGA is closer to the former or the latter, and how different those things are, is an exercise for the reader).

I've been brainstorming ideas, and I've been wondering if we can tackle the problem with limited-scope sweeps. One idea would be sweeping popular or vital articles -- those that get enough views to make up a significant proportion of the "GA experience" to readers. Another would be focusing on shorter GAs, which might trend towards a less in-depth treatment of the topic than could really justify the rating. There may very well be a path here to maintaining GA standards, and either of those would have the benefit that they might be more likely to encourage people to work on rather than simply delist articles -- popular topics with lots of interested parties willing to help, or smaller topics that don't seem like too big a challenge to pick up.
Vaticidalprophet 04:16, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

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July 2021 at Women in Red

Women in Red | July 2021, Volume 7, Issue 7, Numbers 184, 188, 202, 203, 204, 205

Online events:

New: July Julies | Finance, economics & banking | Olympic & Paralympic Games
New contest (Jul/Aug/Sep): Latin America contest
Continuing: Women's rights | #1day1woman
See also: "Mind your elders"

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Freya Dinshah

Isn't this 'Freya Dinshah' article ready to be published to Wikipedia's mainspace? MaynardClark (talk) 15:54, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

I'm not sure. I'll move it to draft, that'll encourage other people to work on it. —valereee (talk) 22:01, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Okay, it's at Draft:Freya Dinshah now. That encourages others to work on it, and any other editor at any point can move it to mainspace if they think it's ready. —valereee (talk) 22:03, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

This week's article for improvement (week 27, 2021)

Hello, Valereee. The article for improvement of the week is:

Organized religion

Please be bold and help improve it!

Previous selections: Christmas ham • Alida Morberg

Get involved with the AFI project: Nominate an article • Review nominations

Posted by: MusikBot ^talk 00:05, 5 July 2021 (UTC) using MediaWiki message delivery (talk) on behalf of WikiProject AFI • Opt-out instructions

This week's article for improvement (week 26, 2021)

A Finnish Christmas ham

Hello, Valereee. The article for improvement of the week is:

Christmas ham

Please be bold and help improve it!

Previous selections: Alida Morberg • Savoriness

Get involved with the AFI project: Nominate an article • Review nominations

Posted by: MusikBot ^talk 00:05, 28 June 2021 (UTC) using MediaWiki message delivery (talk) on behalf of WikiProject AFI • Opt-out instructions

DRV Thanks

First, sorry about that. I'm a little scatterbrained today. I was doing good, but today rolled around and then I wasn't. It's the 6th anniversary of my cat passing away. He was more my best friend than a cat. I miss him dearly. So, I'm hurting today. A little grief came out there and I apologize.

Anyway, I appreciate your time, effort, and help on the DRV discussion. I know that is definitely not what you signed up for and definitely not what I intended, but I appreciate you none-the-less. Hope you have an excellent rest of your weekend and week ahead. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 20:58, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Gosh, I so understand. The best cat EVER died four years ago last month. And I've been lucky enough to have had a lot of really, really good cats. I miss her every day, even though I have a couple very entertaining new young rescues. There'll never be another Rosie. :D Don't even give a thought to that discussion, in my head it's cultural artefact. Interesting primarily for purposes of study. —valereee (talk) 00:10, 28 June 2021 (UTC)

Indeed, there is that one that will always leave a pawprint on your heart a little more than the others do. Flatsky (named after a teddy bear) was mine. You (like I with Flatsky) will see Rosie again one day and she'll walk with you always until then. :)

I like that, "cultural artifact" and "purposes of study", definitely a good idea. Might I add "a good laugh" as well. :D - Neutralhomer • Talk • 00:58, 28 June 2021 (UTC)

Hey

nothing burger? 😜 --Deepfriedokra (talk) 02:28, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

@Deepfriedokra my go-to euphemism when I'm tempted to write "bullshit" but think it will create more heat than light :D —valereee (talk) 10:30, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: Wikipedia policies and guidelines request for comment

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The Signpost: 27 June 2021

News and notes: Elections, Wikimania, masking and more

In the media: Boris and Joe, reliability, love, and money

Disinformation report: Croatian Wikipedia: capture and release

Recent research: Feminist critique of Wikipedia's epistemology, Black Americans vastly underrepresented among editors, Wiki Workshop report

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... for what you said on User talk:SlimVirgin - missing pictured on my talk, with music full of hope and reformation --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:38, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

GAN Backlog Drive - July 2021

Good article nominations \| July 2021 Backlog Drive
July 2021 Backlog Drive: This Thursday, July 1, a one-month backlog drive for good article nominations will begin. Barnstars will be awarded based on the number, length, and age, of articles reviewed. Interested in taking part? You can sign up here.
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MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:31, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

WikiCup 2021 July newsletter

The third round of the 2021 WikiCup has now come to an end. Each of the sixteen contestants who made it into the fourth round had at least 294 points, and our top six scorers all had over 600 points. They were:

The Rambling Man, with 1825 points from 3 featured articles, 44 featured article reviews, 14 good articles, 30 good article reviews and 10 DYKs. In addition, he completed a 34-article good topic on the EFL Championship play-offs.
Epicgenius, a New York specialist, with 1083 points from 2 featured article reviews, 18 good articles, 30 DYKs and plenty of bonus points.
Bloom6132, with 869 points from 11 DYKs, all with bonus points, and 54 "In the news" items, mostly covering people who had recently died.
Gog the Mild, with 817 points from 3 featured articles on historic battles in Europe, 5 featured article reviews and 3 good articles.
Hog Farm, with 659 points from 2 featured articles and 2 good articles on American Civil War battles, 18 featured article reviews, 2 good articles, 6 good article reviews and 4 DYKs.
BennyOnTheLoose, a snooker specialist and new to the Cup, with 647 points from a featured article, 2 featured article reviews, 6 good articles, 6 good article reviews and 3 DYKs.

In round three, contestants achieved 19 featured articles, 7 featured lists, 106 featured article reviews, 72 good articles, 1 good topic, 62 good article reviews, 165 DYKs and 96 ITN items. We enter the fourth round with scores reset to zero; any content promoted after the end of round 3 but before the start of round 4 can be claimed in round 4. Please also remember that you must claim your points within 14 days of "earning" them (one contestant in round 3 lost out because of this). When doing GARs, please make sure that you check that all the GA criteria are fully met.

If you are concerned that your nomination—whether it is at good article nominations, a featured process, or anything else—will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on Wikipedia:WikiCup/Reviews Needed (remember to remove your listing when no longer required). Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove yourself from Wikipedia:WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. Judges: Sturmvogel 66 (talk) and Cwmhiraeth Cwmhiraeth (talk) MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 09:30, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – July 2021

News and updates for administrators from the past month (June 2021).

Administrator changes

Trialpears

AGK • Eliz81 • Mulad • ThaddeusB • Vianello • Who

Lacrimosus → Ikuzaf

Interface administrator changes

Ragesoss

CheckUser changes

AGK • DGG

Oversighter changes

AGK

Guideline and policy news

Consensus has been reached to delete all books in the book namespace. There was rough consensus that the deleted books should still be available on request at WP:REFUND even after the namespace is removed.
An RfC is open to discuss the next steps following a trial which automatically applied pending changes to TFAs.

Technical news

IP addresses of unregistered users are to be hidden from everyone. There is a rough draft of how IP addresses may be shown to users who need to see them. This currently details allowing administrators, checkusers, stewards and those with a new usergroup to view the full IP address of unregistered users. Editors with at least 500 edits and an account over a year old will be able to see all but the end of the IP address in the proposal. The ability to see the IP addresses hidden behind the mask would be dependent on agreeing to not share the parts of the IP address they can see with those who do not have access to the same information. Accessing part of or the full IP address of a masked editor would also be logged. Comments on the draft are being welcomed at the talk page.

Arbitration

The community authorised COVID-19 general sanctions have been superseded by the COVID-19 discretionary sanctions following a motion at a case request. Alerts given and sanctions placed under the community authorised general sanctions are now considered alerts for and sanctions under the new discretionary sanctions.

Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 11:27, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Current (BusterD) RfA

Hey Valereee. I'm not going to comment there, but i appreciate what you've been doing recently with RfAs and i don't think your questioning the questioner was out of line. Fair play to BusterD who answered it, but i'd like to see more questions challenged (maybe) and more candidates feeling free to ignore what are supposed to be optional (definitely). For what it's worth, thank you; happy days, Lindsay^Hello 17:24, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

@LindsayH, thanks! I'm never quite sure where the line is on clerking there. I just got fed up about six or eight RfAs ago and decided heck with it, I'm going to start calling out the sillier questions in hopes it'll make people more likely to think. I'm probably just wasting my time. —valereee (talk) 18:21, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

I'd encourage everyone to be more vocal about which questions they find useful and which they find not useful. It's good feedback for everyone to have. The questioner may even decide to improve their question in response. Levivich 18:34, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Erick Williams

Hi Valerie, I received your comments in regards to the Erick Williams page that I am editing. We represent him for public relations. I did not think that was a conflict of interest? Also, I saw the request for the page to be deleted because of copyright laws. Some of the information is also included in his biography that was written by me. Is that okay? It's not taken from other sources. Thank you for trying to work with me - this is very important to him.

BettieBomb21 (talk) 15:02, 5 July 2021 (UTC) BettieBomb21 (talk) 15:02, 5 July 2021 (UTC) BettieBomb21 (talk) 15:02, 5 July 2021 (UTC) BettieBomb21 (talk) 15:02, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Hi, BettieBomb21! Yes, Wikipedia considers being paid to create an article about someone, or to edit the article about them, as absolutely a conflict of interest. Probably only his mom has a bigger COI. :) You can read more about it at WP:COI. Thank you for disclosing. You'll need to put a disclosure on your talk page and on the article talk if you recreate the article. There are instructions at WP:COIPAYDISCLOSE; if you need help, I can help you with that.

I do think it's possible this person is notable enough for an article. What we need to see are at least 3 instances of significant coverage -- an article about him, not just mentioning him in passing -- in reliable unaffiliated sources and not just from the local area.

We also need the article itself to be 1. a fresh creation that 2. doesn't sound like it came from his PR firm. :)

Fresh creation: That is, it can't be copied from anywhere else on the web, so it can't be simply the bio he uses on his website or that gets sent out in response to press queries or speaking engagements. We consider that a copyright violation -- that's why I deleted the draft you'd submitted. I tell people never to copy/paste unless you're quoting. Instead, read the source, then summarize in your own words.
Doesn't sound like PR: articles in WP must be neutral and can only summarize what other reliable sources have said. This can be a little difficult for someone who is used to writing PR, but I'm willing to help you through it. The first thing to do is find your three best sources. Those would be the three most WP:reliable sources that have the most WP:significant coverage (and at least two from outside his local area). Then you summarize what is said in those sources -- and only what is said in those sources, nothing added simply because you know it to be true -- to create your initial draft. If you want to come back when you've done that, I'll take a look. —valereee (talk) 15:26, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Thank you so much for sharing this information, Valerie. It is very much appreciated. I am going to start from scratch! BettieBomb21 (talk) 16:34, 6 July 2021 (UTC) BettieBomb21 (talk) 16:34, 6 July 2021 (UTC) BettieBomb21 (talk) 16:34, 6 July 2021 (UTC) BettieBomb21 (talk) 16:34, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

took a whack at the JC campaign button

See if that looks better. BusterD (talk) 18:46, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

I think it looks much better! We'll see if anyone else decides to comment. —valereee (talk) 19:23, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

whoops

I think we edit-conflicted both trying to promote Rosalie Carey at the same time. You got the promo credit, but I put her in Template:Did you know/Preparation area 6. Where should she be? Vaticidalprophet 14:53, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Excuse me, but is not to be used as a means of promotion. E Eng 04:18, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Didn't you know that's all anyone cares about at DYK? —valereee (talk) 11:09, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

I put her into P5 lol...whatever works for you, just move it around! —valereee (talk) 14:56, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Have switched out her P6 spot for Marja Kubašec -- I built most of the current P5, and she does fit well in there :) Vaticidalprophet 14:59, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Sorry if I got in your way! When I realized that an editor who had been very prolific at building sets recently had thought they needed to try to use most images, and then that over half our approved noms were image hooks, I decided to go do some whatever infill I could with images that weren't really crucial to their hooks. —valereee (talk) 15:13, 6 July 2021 (UTC)

Happy Adminship Anniversary!

Have a very happy adminship anniversary on your special day!

Best wishes, CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 08:47, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, CAPTAIN RAJU! —valereee (talk) 11:13, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Articles for Creation July 2021 Backlog Elimination Drive

Hello Valereee:

WikiProject Articles for creation is holding a month long Backlog Drive!
The goal of this drive is to eliminate the backlog of unreviewed articles. The drive is running until 31 July 2021.

Barnstars will be given out as awards at the end of the drive.
There is currently a backlog of over 2300 articles, so start reviewing articles. We're looking forward to your help!

Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) on behalf of Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for Creation at 21:54, 7 July 2021 (UTC). If you do not wish to recieve future notification, please remove your name from the mailing list.

This Month in GLAM: June 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue VI, June 2021
Headlines
AfLIA Wikipedia in African Libraries report: African Librarians Week 2021 Albania report: CEE Spring Campaign in Albania and Kosovo Argentina report: A course on opening cultural collections Belgium report: Edit-a-thons with Wiki Women Design Brazil report: A metadata roundtripping model for museums France report: European Archaeology Days; Edit-a-thon in Romanity Museum Guinea report: GLAM with Harmattan Guinée 15 June 2021 in Conakry Italy report: Festival and edit-a-thon dedicated to the world of archives Netherlands report: Training at Het Nieuwe Instituut in Rotterdam; training for Suriname and the Dutch Caribbean has concluded New Zealand report: Making artists visible Serbia report: Wikidata development and culture of Rudnik and Takovo region Spain report: Museums writing challenge and Viquimarató Carmelina Sánchez-Cutillas Sweden report: Free music; Kulturarv som gymnasiearbete; Statistics Sweden – now as open data; KTH library training Switzerland report: Diversity in GLAM Program Uganda report: Wikipedia for Museums in Uganda UK report: British Library and Khalili Collections Ukraine report: #1Lib1Ref in Ukrainian Wikipedia USA report: Meetup/CCCCWI; Vaccine Safety Wikipedia Edit-a-thon; WikiWednesday Salon; San Diego Wiknic; Black Lunch Table / Black visual artists Special story: Play, experiment and cross borders at Hack4OpenGLAM Structured Data on Wikimedia Commons report: OpenRefine starts Structured Data on Commons development and is searching for two developers WMF GLAM report: Conferences and Structured data modeling Calendar: July's GLAM events
Read this edition in full • Single-page
To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

About This Month in GLAM · Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 05:46, 11 July 2021 (UTC)

This week's article for improvement (week 28, 2021)

Participant countries of the 2019 International Army Games.

Participants

First time participants

Previous games participants, but not this time

Hello, Valereee. The article for improvement of the week is:

International Army Games

Please be bold and help improve it!

Previous selections: Organized religion • Christmas ham

Get involved with the AFI project: Nominate an article • Review nominations

Posted by: MusikBot ^talk 00:05, 12 July 2021 (UTC) using MediaWiki message delivery (talk) on behalf of WikiProject AFI • Opt-out instructions

More silliness...

Started reading a Hebrew translation of Silas Marner (1861), which has Niqqud (what am I, a child?) and letters instead of page numbers (super dumb). So, I notice a passage in the opening page that reads: "remember, in those days there weren't any trains and cars," and was, like, cars, she died in 1880! Naturally, I go to the original (https://gutenberg.org/ebooks/550) as this was quite a WTF moment, and, guess what? Doesn't exist. The translator just made it up!

Obviously, the translation was intended for the young, the fact that it's less than half the length of the original is indicative of that (also, the translator Itzhak Levanon (translator) [he] is preeminent in the area of children books). Granted, this is an old print —the one I have is circa 1965, but it's the 3rd reprint— still, now I'm wandering if many of the translators for the books I read as a kid were also taking such hilarious liberties... //Spam out! El_C 12:54, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

That's pretty funny...apparently the translator thought he needed to provide context for why people would be walking from town to town carrying their goods on their backs? —valereee (talk) 13:10, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

Don't forget about Wildfire (the horse)! Actually, it was context about why people were superstitious due to their relative isolation: In that far-off time superstition clung easily round every person or thing that was at all unwonted, or even intermittent and occasional merely, like the visits of the pedlar or the knife-grinder. So, yeah, had a good chuckle, thought I'd share.

El_C 13:17, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

Onwards to Duncton Wood, which I have in 2 hardcovers (300 and 600 pages, respectively). Because... anthropomorphic moles! Translated by Uriel Ofek, the man, the legend. El_C 22:41, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

I so wish I could turn you on to The Silerian Trilogy, the second and third books of which I think are among the best fantasy I've read, but unfortunately never translated into Hebrew. If you ever decide you'd like to read it in English, I would be happy to send you a copy. —valereee (talk) 01:18, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, I may take you up on that — sounds like something right up my alley. What a drag that it isn't available in Hebrew (paging Emanuel Lotem, we need you, stat!). But White Dragon? That's Anne McCaffrey's thing! Which I actually do have, along with several of the other Dragonriders of Pern books (including one of the novellas). Definite recommend. Also, The Ship Who Sang (just reread a couple of months ago)... //Melting. El_C 08:07, 13 July 2021 (UTC)