User talk:WikAndPen

Welcome!

Hello, WikAndPen and Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions to this free encyclopedia. If you decide that you need help, check out Getting Help below, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by using four tildes (~~~~) or by clicking if shown; this will automatically produce your username and the date. Also, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field with your edits. Below are some useful links to facilitate your involvement. Happy editing! XLinkBot (talk) 03:26, 20 November 2011 (UTC) Getting started A tutorial • Our five pillars • Getting mentored How to: Edit a page • Upload and use images • Create your first article Intuitive guide to Wikipedia • Article Creation Wizard Getting help Frequently asked questions • Tips Where to ask questions or make comments Request administrator attention Help desk: A Wiki Styled page to ask questions on Help directory: A comprehensive list-style help contents page Policies and guidelines Neutral point of view • No original research Verifiability • Reliable sources • Citing sources What Wikipedia is not • Biographies of living persons List of policies • Three-revert rule • Sock puppetry Copyrights • Policy for non-free content • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism • List of guidelines Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability The community Build consensus • Resolve disputes Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • No legal threats Community portal • Village pump Signpost • IRC channels • Mailing lists Writing articles Be bold in editing • Develop an article The perfect article • Simplified manual of style Stubs • Categories • Disambiguation Peer review • Featured content Miscellaneous User pages • Talk pages Awards a registered contributor can achieve and award Clean up: General • Spam • Vandalism Join a WikiProject • Translation Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

November 2011

Hello and welcome! I'm a bot created by another editor. I wanted to let you know that I removed a link that you recently added to the page Simon Climie here. I did this because http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMAeMR2cXR8 is probably inappropriate for an encyclopedia. We generally try to avoid linking to external audio or video.

Even though Wikipedia is strict about having appropriate links, we really appreciate your help. If I made a mistake, feel free to undo my edit. If you have any questions, you can ask at the Help desk. --XLinkBot (talk) 03:26, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

Conflict of Interest

I hope you have read Wikipedia:Conflict of interest carefully. You have openly stated a COI on your talk page, which is a good start, but are certainly not following the "best practice" as advocated.

Many people claim they are making sure articles are "correct and up-to-date, but do not infringe personal privacy or security" or similar such phrases. Unfortunately, this frequently (usually) means they are trying to "sanitize" articles:- removing or toning down anything critical, and adding or emphasising positive points, if not puffing them up into something promotional.

I'm not sure how you can "edit on behalf of" Climie Fisher - what say does Rob have in this?. I was on first name terms with Rob, but don't claim to have been a close friend. I started at Bath University the same year as him, and gear shifted for Whitewing on a number of occasions. I was also amused when from being a couple of months older than me, he suddenly became 3 years younger.

Unfortunately your DoB removal appears to be a continuation of the pretence about their ages. If your statement about "security" is genuine, I'm sure you won't mind using at least the correct year - without the rest of the date.

With regard to the use of bold please see MOS:BOLD
Currently, too much information is in the lede (nasty Americanism), i.e. above the table of contents (ToC). The lede should just be a precis of the main article below the ToC. The main article can be subdivided into subsections (3= each side of the title instead of 2= for a main section)

PS please sign your posts on talk pages with 4 tildes ---- which will sign and date your posts.
Arjayay (talk) 09:38, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Hello Arjayay,

I couldn't work out how to reply to you before (hope I am doing it the right way here), and thank you again for your help. Interesting that you were at uni with Rob. Sadly he passed away a few years back.

Yes I did read the COI policy, and all the relevant policies I could find before I started contributing, and Re User Pages it says:

"Significant editing disclosures (voluntary but recommended)

Things other editors may find helpful to understand, such as alternative accounts (if publicly disclosed)

If you are editing for or on behalf of a company, organization, group, product, or person (etc.) which you wish to be open about in order to gain a good working relationship with the editing community.

"(Editing must always be neutral and within encyclopedia norms. Editors tend to distrust concealed conflicts of interest and agendas. Openly disclosing such interests gains respect, invites others to help and shows a desire to edit appropriately.)"

So that's what I did. Then other editors can see I am trying to do the right thing in adding accurate updates and information, because the page was very much out of date. And I am trying to follow Wikipedia style, too.

And the statement about security is indeed genuine, following a case of fraud. My personal feeling is that no one's private details should be posted anywhere on the internet, as is the advice given to all of us by respected institutions such as banks. It is far too dangerous.

I will also take your good advice on the correct layout, and try to amend that as soon as I can. I will need to study other pages first to get it clear, and then work out how to do the sections etc.

Thanks, too, for the link to text formatting re use of bold and italics. But I am puzzled why you and others keep telling me to sign my posts with four tildes, when I have been doing so. Is the signature not showing up? I shall use the button here just in case.

Best wishes WikAndPen 06:29, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

I have indented your previous reply - all new posts in the same thread should be indented one colon further

I have also reinstated Simon's Year of birth on both his article and Climie Fisher's. Wikipedia's policy on this is at WP:DOB which acknowledges the security risk of full dates of birth, but states

If the subject complains about the inclusion of the date of birth, or the person is borderline notable, err on the side of caution and simply list the year

I know that 3 years were knocked off Rob Fisher's age, whilst Simon Climie has several dates of birth, depending which site one looks at. Whilst generally willing to Assume good faith, there is a suspicion that the "privacy" card may be being used to hide Simon's true age.
Arjayay (talk) 13:02, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

Dear Arjayay,

The reasons for the removal are for security following a fraud, as previously stated. Because it is such a serious matter I cannot go into it on public message boards. But it is in line with several other parts of BLP :::policy, including in relation to accuracy of sources. The bit about restoring information also relates to that. And regarding Rob, his page was altered by someone eight years after his very sad death, then altered :::again three years after that on someone's say-so, so not by Rob. And is there an easier way to do these reply indentations apart from manually when you need more than one?

--WikAndPen 08:01, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Changes cross-wiki

Hi. You can't do changes on other wikis and refer to a policy that exist here on Wikipedia in English. Every language has different policys when it comes to information on living persons. Before you change on other languages you must check the local policy first. -- Tegel (talk) 03:11, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

Hej Tegel,

Thank you very much for alerting me to this. It took me a while to work out how to reply to you as there was no "Reply" button, and where to reply to you (thanks too for the very helpful tip on your talk page advising me to reply on my page). So I hope I am replying in the right way.

I am a journalist/sub-editor with experience of formatting and posting blogs on the web, etc, but I am new to Wikipedia. I hope to be able to contribute to it on all manner of subjects in the future, so all help is much appreciated.

I did spend a long time reading all kinds of help articles and policies before I started, and as the BLP Policy is clearly so important I thought it must be global, as some policies surely must be? Sites in other countries must have policies similar to BLP, but I don't know how to find and check them as I am not fluent in any other languages, sadly.

However, the reason of security stated still stands as individuals need to be protected against fraud, especially in cases where fraud has already been committed. Should I, and can I, go back to the information about the small changes I have made and remove the reference to BLP Policy, but leave in that it is for reasons of security?

Thanks,

WikAndPen 04:16, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

PS: From the start, I have also been trying to add my signature correctly just by typing the four tildes. I hope I have done that right, too.

WikAndPen 04:16, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

Hello Tegel,

May I ask again how I can find the relevant BLP-style policies regarding private information on the other sites?

Thank you

WikAndPen 08:22, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Your recent edits

Hello. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( ~~~~ ) at the end of your comment. You could also click on the signature button or located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your username or IP address and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. Thank you. --SineBot (talk) 04:24, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

Hello everyone, I don't understand why I keep being told to sign my posts with the four tildes, when that is what I have been doing. And it seems to list my username, date and time when I do - or is it just me who sees that? I keep typing the four tildes and I honestly don't know what else to do. Is it not working? I shall try clicking on the button thing as well this time.

WikAndPen 06:17, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

--WikAndPen 06:17, 4 December 2011 (UTC)