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Archive 1Archive 2Archive 3Archive 4Archive 5

Motherland: Fort Salem

Episode names and descriptions were literally added to the shows main page on Google. Directors for each episode were announced every week on the Director's Guild of Canada website. I just kept track. Writers could be seen on the cover of script pages actor would post on stories. Literally no way to source that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 177.220.192.154 (talk) 04:30, 16 May 2021 (UTC)

You need an actual reliable source, not from random Google searches or IMDb. They all need to be reliably sourced because the episodes have not air yet. — YoungForever(talk) 04:34, 16 May 2021 (UTC)

Dopesick

Arischa Conner is a recurring character in 7 episodes. I can use imdb to site that info. Acthedj (talk) 23:30, 18 May 2021 (UTC)

Per WP:IMDb, IMDb is not a reliable source. — YoungForever(talk) 23:32, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
Oh, wow. I apologize. I saw your message about disruptive editing. You don't have to yell at me. I am new at this. I was just trying to make sure she got her credit, that's all. I will review and study up on citations and how they work. I am a nice person...geez Acthedj (talk) 00:03, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Some good examples of reliable source are: Deadline Hollywood, Entertainment Tonight, Entertainment Weekly, The Hollywood Reporter, TV Line, and Variety. — YoungForever(talk) 00:15, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

Single Drunk Female

Hi there, I saw you started Draft:Single Drunk Female a while back and haven't worked on it since. I did a little minor editing on it and would like it to go live but don't know how to do that given the redirect at Single Drunk Female. (I'm still new-ish here.) But it does have sufficient citations to be published to the mainspace, doesn't it? Grn1749 (talk) 01:20, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

@Grn1749: Not enough to move to mainspace yet. Per WP:TVSERIES, when filming for the series begins or there is a set premiere date, is when it can be move to the mainspace. — YoungForever(talk) 01:29, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Ah, thank you for explaining! Grn1749 (talk) 02:12, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

Cruel Summer Episode Summaries Too Long

So I noticed that several of the summaries have been marked by you as too long. Guidance says between 100 and 200 words. Are you using 200 word guideline as a hard ceiling? Or is there actually too much detail about the plots given? I would like to know what I should be attempting to correct.--Mpen320 (talk) 22:39, 22 May 2021 (UTC)

@Mpen320: I use a a script tool on Wikipedia. Any words clocking at 216+ words would be way too long based on the script tool. — YoungForever(talk) 23:09, 22 May 2021 (UTC)
Script tool? Can you elaborate? Also, that doesn't quite answer my question if 200 words is a hard ceiling. I am assuming 199 words or less is my goal?--Mpen320 (talk) 04:55, 23 May 2021 (UTC)
@Mpen320: Not exactly hard ceiling, but it should around 200 words or less ideally per MOS:TVPLOT. This because an episode plot summary should be brief and not a scene-by-scene detailed description of an episode. I don't include too long tags when the episode plot summaries are less than 216 words. — YoungForever(talk) 05:30, 23 May 2021 (UTC)

Girls5eva

Hi, I'm just curious about how my edits weren't constructive. They were efficient, informative, and accurate. Thank you. 67.40.244.166 (talk) 18:56, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

We go by according to credits per MOS:TVCAST. Not how you want them to be or should be (your personal preference). You are clearly going by personal preference. — YoungForever(talk) 19:01, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Green Lantern (TV series)

Hey. Remember how you undid my edits on the Green Lantern tv series draft page? Well, I did a little digging and found that in the Hollywood reporter article for Finn Wittrock’s casting announcement, you will see that it states that, and I quote “ Berlanti, Seth Grahame-Smith (The Lego Batman Movie) and Marc Guggenheim (Arrow, 2011’s Green Lantern feature film) are credited as writers on the series...” So, I found my proof. Can I Please my edits restored now please? FilmLover72 (talk) 17:28, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

Berlanti was added as a writer later then, not when HBO Max gave the series order. — YoungForever(talk) 17:32, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
But, shouldn’t it be added on the page that he’s still going to be writing, despite him not being named a writer when the series was announced to have been given the order. FilmLover72 (talk) 17:33, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
Berlanti wasn't added as a writer when Seth Grahame-Smith and Marc Guggenheim were added to the series as writers. It should added in later, but with the reliable source. — YoungForever(talk) 17:41, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
How is the Hollywood reporter not a reliable source? Not all projects have their entire creative teams revealed all in one report. Do usually revealed and gradually overtime is more and more details are officially revealed to the public. FilmLover72 (talk) 17:51, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
First of all, I never said The Hollywood Reporter is not a reliable source. So, please stop putting words in mouth. BTW, you did not include the The Hollywood Reporter reliable source when you added Berlanti as a writer. — YoungForever(talk) 17:58, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
Sorry, I writing this on my phone, and it autocorrected it. FilmLover72 (talk) 17:58, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
Well, I thought since it was already on the page, I wouldn’t have to. FilmLover72 (talk) 18:27, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
Yet, you did not sourced it on the body under Development when you added him as a writer. As I said before, he wasn't added in as a writer until later, way later than Seth Grahame-Smith and Marc Guggenheim which means you need to add the reliable source in when you add Berlanti as a writer. Otherwise, you will be adding WP:SYNTH a part of WP:OR. — YoungForever(talk) 18:34, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
Very well then. Have a nice day. FilmLover72 (talk) 18:40, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

2020–21 Season rankings

You reverted my edits regarding the series rankings on The Resident, Manifest etc. and you were completely right in doing so. I myself was sceptical about adding the season rankings from Variety as they include cable ratings but because last year Deadline stuck to only the Top 20 and there was no clarity on what they were planning on doing this year, I thought might-as-well add something rather than nothing. Always planned on changing it if a better source came along. Anyway...that doesn't matter anymore. [Deadline] released their list a few hours ago but it includes only the Top 40 and runs only till May 23 (the season ends on the 26th). The Hollywood Reporter usually releases a complete list for all tv shows through the end of the broadcast season, which seems like a best option out of the lot. So are the Deadline rankings acceptable or should we wait till THR releases its list? TheRedDomitor (talk) 04:48, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

@TheRedDomitor: Given that the some TV series have not ended their seasons yet, I would wait until the broadcast season is actually over. Preliminary ratings are not final ratings. They are subject to change when the broadcast season is not over yet. — YoungForever(talk) 04:59, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
Yup... that's what I thought too. Thanks. TheRedDomitor (talk) 05:01, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

Debris

Hi! Will you look at the episodes for Debris and if the summaries are better, will you remove the tags? Or should I remove the tags? I don't know. I'm new to all this. Thank you!Cheryliz72 (talk) 21:19, 28 May 2021 (UTC)cheryliz72

@Cheryliz72:  Done, however, episode 9 is still way too long. So, episode 9 still has a maintenance tag. — YoungForever(talk) 21:23, 28 May 2021 (UTC)
I think I updated Episode 9 to less than 216 words. And I removed the maintenance tag. I also added summaries for the last two episodes, less than 216 words.Cheryliz72 (talk) 22:47, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

TV Series Finale

Is that website considered reliable? Because it's being used on Black Lightning. LéKashmiriSocialiste (talk) 19:29, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

@LéKashmiriSocialiste: It is a questionable source because sometimes they claimed a TV series is canceled when it is not canceled yet and sometimes they claimed a TV series is renewed when it is not renew yet based on hearsays (they would write I heard from an insider the series is likely to be canceled or renewed). I would say if there are better sources, you should use the better sources. — YoungForever(talk) 19:44, 26 May 2021 (UTC)
Hope you don't mind me adding this. If you see TV Series Finale's staff page [1] they clearly state none of them have any experience in the industry of ratings or working as execs on film or TV or as journalists. One of them Trevor Kimball has worked as an insignificant actor in 2 TV series and 3 documentaries, but that's it asides from being a producer on a YouTube video: [2]. IMDb may not be really reliable itself but it's the only source I can find for the work he has done on camera. Anyway he doesn't appear to be anyone significant in the industry at any point.
Another staff member at most Cindy McLennan wrote recaps of TV shows only for fun and making money for an obscure site, but as you can see from the staff page she had no experience or qualifications as a writer or journalist. Also here is her work: [3] And that's it. All of them are mentioned as having becoming dedicated only as fans. So this website shouldn't be allowed to be used as it's unreliable. I hope you can remove it if you come across it. Thanks. LéKashmiriSocialiste (talk) 21:45, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

ShowBuzz Daily

I think this may be the end for them, see [4]. Any chance you could request that the links for the website be archived like you did for TVBythenumbers? I think going forward people will just have to wait for the Programming Insider DVR finals articles which come a lot later. 81.96.245.175 (talk) 20:19, 24 May 2021 (UTC)

I'll wait until it is the end for them officially. I am not comfortable jumping the gun in requesting to archive them now and then request to change the live links to dead links later. The website still works for now including previous ratings in the past. — YoungForever(talk) 20:49, 24 May 2021 (UTC)
That's fair. It'll be a huge loss and a shame to lose the website. They provided a service for no monetary gain for quite a few years. But I think ultimately they'll probably reach a point where the time and cost to get things back to normal probably wouldn't be worth the effort. But I think for now no news can be a good sign. They've shown a willingness to get the site back up 81.96.245.175 (talk) 23:31, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
They probably don't even have a professional web developer to maintain and take care of the website. Otherwise, they would not have such problems in the first place. — YoungForever(talk) 00:00, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
I think you're right as both Mitch Salem and Metcalf have a long history of working at TV networks in senior roles but by their updates have very little in website management. I do wonder if this may make them place a few ads on the website so they can hire someone if the need arises. 81.96.245.175 (talk) 10:43, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
In addition, as far I know, websites that have a staff usually have a web developer on staff or pay a web development/management company to maintain and take care of their websites. — YoungForever(talk) 17:15, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
End of an era, see [5]. It does make me wonder if they were Nielsen subscribers to begin with or if they just got the numbers via a third party source. They refused all offers of technical help and wouldn't post ratings on social media outlets. To me that suggests they got cut off from their source and could no longer operate. 81.96.245.175 (talk) 20:31, 7 June 2021 (UTC)
Since their final ratings were earlier than others, they were probably Nielsen subscribers. For now, the website is still working alongside past ratings. — YoungForever(talk) 20:41, 7 June 2021 (UTC)
That's true, but it feels like TV ratings sourcing has been set back 100 years with the loss of Showbuzzdaily. I would guess their website will expire whenever their paid hosting does. Which could anyday from now. 81.96.245.175 (talk) 20:46, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

It could be till the end of the month if they pay hosting monthly. — YoungForever(talk) 20:51, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

Locke & Key

Hello. Maybe in the future we will have the article Locke & Key (season I) with references about directors. Terraflorin (talk) 05:22, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

As I said, when episodes of TV series have been released or aired, primary source such watching the episodes cover the directors and writers. They are unnecessary to source when the episodes have been released or aired. — YoungForever(talk) 05:32, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
Ok, it makes sense what you say, but we have various citation formats for episodes, e.g {{Cite episode}}, {{IMDb episode}} or {{Memoryalpha}}. Terraflorin (talk) 05:45, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
It always has be that way for TV series and it is a common practice. I recommend taking a look at good television series or season articles such as House of Cards (season 2), Fringe (season 2), Forever (2014 TV series), Hellcats, and many more. — YoungForever(talk) 05:57, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

Cruel Summer

Spolier TV is another reliable ratings site. With Showbuzzdaily gone, they recently had paid for Nielsen Subscription.—2600:1700:FD0:B920:2CA5:412:C08D:37A8 (talk) 07:29, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

No, it is not a reliable source because it is fan-operated website which means it is run by users. — YoungForever(talk) 07:39, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
Anyone can buy a Nielsen subscription, that doesn't make them reputable. Also, like Youngforever mentions, they have no industry staff or paid employees. They rely on other websites for news(which they repost). They're not like Deadline, tvline, variety etc who have industry staff to source their news directly from folk in the industry. 81.96.245.175 (talk) 12:27, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
True, there not like the other sites that with industry staff attached but they still have access to many cable ratings including as Saturday ratings, which are hard to find right now.2600:1700:FD0:B920:D457:741B:F54:C326 (talk) 21:37, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
WP:NORUSH — YoungForever(talk) 21:51, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

Netflix Id's

Hello, I noticed that you are removing Netflix Id's. I made a userscript so that it does not have to be done manually in the source editor. If you are interested it is: User:Terasail/IdMatch.js. It adds a button next to the link in the article. Its not 100% reliable but may help you. Terasail[✉️] 23:45, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

@Terasail: Thank you for letting me know about a userscript that you made that helps with that. — YoungForever(talk) 23:49, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

Legacies

FTR, I don't think edits like this are a good idea. At the very least, that source should be transferred to the 'Broadcast' section to verify when the season #3 finale aired. It's never good to remove valid sourcing for stuff like this, just because an episode has aired. FWIW. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:17, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

@IJBall: The Episode titles and Original air date columns on each of the Episode table are still reliably sourced which pretty much covers the series overview. Also, previous seasons of the TV series on the series overview were removed. It is also common practice to have them removed once the season finale aired on the series overview. — YoungForever(talk) 03:55, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
This is about reliably sourcing at least the air date of the season finale, and also possibly the number of episodes in the season. The former should not just be removed from the article – at the least, it should be maintained, and moved into the 'Broadcast' section. The source you removed was specific to the season finale. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:57, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
@IJBall:  Done: Moved to Broadcast section with reliable sources. — YoungForever(talk) 19:03, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Recent Edit on Tiny Pretty Things page

Hello,

One of my changes was reverted and I wanted to clarify why the change should be published to the page. When Netflix ordered the series they ordered it from Insurrection Media, the company that developed the project from conception to completion. Therefore, saying "Netflix gave the production a series order" is vague and non-specific. The truth, is that they gave Insurrection Media a series order.

Can I submit this clarification change again? When I originally submitted it I included a source from deadline that confirms that Netflix ordered the show from Insurrection. This is an important clarification point because Netflix develops lots of original programming and without this distinction it is unclear that Insurrection Media developed the show before selling it to Netflix.

Thank you and let me know if there is any further information I can provide or how I can re-publish this clarification point![1]

Warmly, EG9732 (talk) 18:28, 2 July 2021 (UTC)EG

@EG9732: As I said, Insurrection Media is not the only production company. There are several production companies. Insurrection Media did not sold Tiny Pretty Things to Netflix nor did ordered the show from Insurrection Media. Please stop add WP:SYNTH. — YoungForever(talk) 18:35, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Petski, Denise (August 6, 2019). "Netflix Orders 'Tiny Pretty Things' Ballet Drama Series Based On Book; Sets Main Cast". Deadline Hollywood. Retrieved November 16, 2020.

Gossip Girl (2021 TV series)

I didn't make an edit, I reverted yours. --Blazing Phoenix (talk) 20:25, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

@Blazing Phoenix: You revert is not warrant and considered to be disruptive as we go by according to credits and not how you think it should be. As I stated, the credits clearly showed Teleplay by: Joshua Safran and not Written by: Joshua Safran. — YoungForever(talk) 20:30, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
Whatever --Blazing Phoenix (talk) 20:32, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

"Again, co-starring are not recurring nor guest starring!"

Firstly, I never said that they were "Guest Starring". You did.

Secondly, Where are you getting this from? I cannot find anything that says such. I'm going to assume that it's your own personal opinions? Can you provide me the proof that it's an official Wikipedia guideline not to list "co-stars" as recurring when they technically are if they appear in more than 4 episodes? --ACase0000 (talk) 02:49, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

@ACase0000:
It is not personal opinion. I have been told by many veteran editors that there is a general consensus on MOS:TV and WP:TV, and it is a common practice that we do not include co-starring actors because their roles are minor. Co-starring is below guest starring. Co-stars have less lines the guest stars. The levels of crediting in order are: main, recurring, guest starring, co-starring, and lastly, featuring. Co-starring and featuring are not recurring as their roles are super minor. Recurring are guest stars who appeared in 4+ episodes. — YoungForever(talk) 03:50, 12 July 2021 (UTC)
Whatever. Do what you want. I'm done. --ACase0000 (talk) 05:46, 12 July 2021 (UTC)

Regarding your reversion of my edit to Big Sky

Greetings and felicitations. I noticed that you reverted my edit to Big Sky (American TV series) with the comment "Unnecessary, please see MOS:NOTES. It is a common practice to just use 'Notes'. Notes are already explanatory.)"

I'm familiar with MOS:NOTES, but disagree with it on this point, and with your starting premise, so in these instances I use common sense and am bold. Please allow me to give examples in which "Notes" is not used in an explanatory fashion, but for inline citations:

I made these changes to disambiguate between the above mentioned two types of "Notes" sections, especially for casual users of Wikipedia (which neither of us are). In light of this, may I please change the edit in question back? —DocWatson42 (talk) 08:37, 19 July 2021 (UTC)

@DocWatson42: The examples you gave above are just Citations. On the TV series, it doesn't need to be disambiguate because there isn't a two different types of Notes on the TV series. The is only one type of Notes on the TV series. — YoungForever(talk) 16:21, 19 July 2021 (UTC)

Sweet Tooth

moviesr.net was first to reveal that Sweet Tooth got renewed for season 2, you should consider reading the article and see what thw website is citing as reference. Also, I check before editing and don't add any rumors — Preceding unsigned comment added by 103.42.157.139 (talk) 10:44, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

As I said and as well as multiple editors, the website is not a reliable source. You need to acknowledge that the website not a reliable source. — YoungForever(talk) 14:04, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

File:Generation (2021 TV series) Title Card.png listed for discussion

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Generation (2021 TV series) Title Card.png, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for discussion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. (CC) Tbhotch™ 20:49, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

Problems with "TV series finale"

Hello. I have problems when i edit articles in the rating section. In the last days, they reverted them to me because they say that "TV series finale is not a reliable source because it is a page made by fans" but at the end of each article it says that the numbers are obtained by The Nielsen Company. Is it a reliable page to use or is it not? I ask you why you have been on Wikipedia for many years and can you remove that doubt from me. Waiting for your answer. PieroArtSot18 (talk) 17:24, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

@PieroArtSot18: It is definitely a very questionable source. It should always be replaced when a better source becomes available. — YoungForever(talk) 17:33, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
Hi, sorry to write you again. At the end of each table you state that the ratings data are obtained by "The Nielsen Company", ¿doesn't that corroborate them as safe and official? PieroArtSot18 (talk) 23:33, 3 August 2021 (UTC)
@PieroArtSot18: Most veteran editors considered the website to be a questionable source because we don't know if they are Nielsen subscribers (pay to get the data) or not. — YoungForever(talk) 23:46, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

For you

Anti-Wikibullying Barnstar
For reminding others to treat editors with respect and kindness. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 18:10, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

Sleptlapps / context

Hi YoungForever, do you recognize Sleptlapps and/or have any idea what their accusation in Special:Diff/1032765547 has been about? It was one of their first edits. Am I looking at sockpuppetry and by whom? Thank you very much in advance, ~ ToBeFree (talk) 14:15, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

@ToBeFree: I am positive Sleptlapps is a sockpuppet. Most likely Nyxaros2, please see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Nyxaros2/Archive. Nyxaros2 was blocked indefinitely on June 8, 2021 while their sockpuppet Jqsemclutrsynvvyyd was blocked indefinitely on July 8, 2021. Notice Sleptlapps started editing on July 9, 2021 (the next day after Jqsemclutrsynvvyyd was blocked indefinitely). In addition, both Jqsemclutrsynvvyyd and Sleptlapps have edited on Alex Rider where I have edited and Jqsemclutrsynvvyyd hounded me. — YoungForever(talk) 18:20, 21 August 2021 (UTC)
@ToBeFree: Thank you for bringing this up to my attention and submitting an official sockpuppet investigation. As it turns out, Sleptlapps is confirmed by a CheckUser as a sockpuppet of Nyxaros2. It was very sneaky of Sleptlapps to personal attack me on another editor's talk. The sockpuppeteer may attempt to make more sockpuppets in order to continue to harass/hound me. — YoungForever(talk) 18:40, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Shaw

That is a very silly amount of over-analysis. It's specified he's playing Carson Shaw's husband. It's common sense at that point, especially in regards to a series taking place in 40's America. I would argue you are employing SYNTH in your judgment that they might have different surnames, despite there being no evidence to support that. Rusted AutoParts 04:35, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

Did the reliable source explicitly said his character name is Charlie Shaw? No, it did not. It just said Charlie, Carson's husband. In fact, Shaw wasn't even mentioned in the reliable source. Adding "Shaw" as his surname is WP:SYNTH as the reliable source never explicitly said that is his surname. Patrick J. Adams as Charlie is not WP:SYNTH because that is what the reliable source clearly said. — YoungForever(talk) 04:50, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
It said Charlie, Carson's husband. Since we have a cite stating her last name is Shaw that's enough to satisfy basic common sense. Did the source say anything about "the coupe do not hold the same last name" to support your edit summary judgment? Rusted AutoParts 04:57, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
Per MOS:TVCAST, All names should be referred to as credited, or by common name supported by a reliable source. As I said, the reliable source clearly stated Patrick J. Adams as Charlie, not as Charlie Shaw. Per WP:SYNTH, Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources. Similarly, do not combine different parts of one source to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by the source. — YoungForever(talk) 05:10, 11 September 2021 (UTC)
Employing so much aggressive analysis over something so common sense. Whatever, I look forward to re-adding it when it's inevitably supported. Rusted AutoParts 05:12, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

File:Snowpiercer (TV series) Title Card.png listed for discussion

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Snowpiercer (TV series) Title Card.png, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for discussion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 03:59, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Hard work at Chuckie TV series article and Virgin River

Hi YoungForever, I wanted to thank you for your hard work keeping the Chuckie article accurate and error-free. We got off on a bumpy road, but I can see you're just passionate and care about the accuracy of articles and I wanted to extend my appreciation to you for all your hard work. :)

The Current Events Barnstar
All your hard work on TV series articles like Virgin River (one of my FAVORITE streaming shows might I add) and the new Chucky series JudgeJudyCourthouse25 (talk) 00:39, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Help With Creating Articles

Hi youngforever i have a couple of questions, could you help me design my userpage? and how should i go about creating a wikipedia page.--Knwanze4real (talk) 15:55, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Go to Wikipedia:Teahouse if you need help and read WP:N. — YoungForever(talk) 16:49, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

your Reversion to Big Sky

hello, i see you removed my edit on Big sky i would like to know why, i see most articles changed before the episode even premiers and the new episode of the series is airing tonight i would not see any reason to not add it,can you Explain more on this, my edit was for sure done in good faith? --Cocopuff2018 (talk) 18:25, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

You clearly choose to ignore {{Infobox television}}, MOS:TV, WP:TV, and the hidden comments on the article's parameters. It always been should only be incremented when new episodes air. As I said, it falls under WP:NOTCRYSTAL — YoungForever(talk) 18:44, 30 September 2021 (UTC)
Honestly, sorry i did not see any of the messages you posted, none of them were ignored, So what your trying to tell me is it automatically increased once aired? --Cocopuff2018 (talk) 20:33, 30 September 2021 (UTC)
What I am telling you is that once it airs, is when you can update it. Not before, because it falls under WP:NOTCRYSTAL. — YoungForever(talk) 20:36, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

List of Young Sheldon episodes

I never made unconstructive edits. I was adding just more information to List of Young Sheldon episodes. To be honest, I didn't even mean to be disruptive. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.9.132.42 (talk) 00:17, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

You were reverted several times doing the same edits and yet you continue to do them which are considered to be disruptive edits. — YoungForever(talk) 00:26, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
I'm sorry for repeatedly being disruptive. I just wanted to make the page List of Young Sheldon episodes look perfect. Plus, I was excited for Season 5. I won't be disruptive again. Also, If Young Sheldon Season 5 premieres, I will add 2021 to the Season 5 header. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.9.132.42 (talk) 00:47, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
I'm sorry for adding information that wasn't published. I'm never doing it ever again and I'll leave the "List of Young Sheldon episodes" page alone. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.9.132.42 (talk) 03:14, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Chucky

Can you integrate some of this information to the Filming section in the Chucky (TV series) article? That'd help make it more solid. JBOOK17 (talk) 04:03, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

No, the writer just assumed based on Instagram posts. We do not add original research of article writers. — YoungForever(talk) 04:10, 27 October 2021 (UTC)
Ok, but can you help me expand that section somehow? It'd be good to make it more extense than just one line. JBOOK17 (talk) 13:33, 27 October 2021 (UTC)
You will need to find better sources. — YoungForever(talk) 17:13, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

Question

What are the final ratings for Young Sheldon Season 5 Episode 4? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.9.132.42 (talk) 04:18, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

They are not up until Monday according to this. — YoungForever(talk) 05:02, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

List of Legacies episodes

Hi. My edit is not disruptive at all. Your revert is disruptive as it does not reflect the order in the primary source. I just rewatched the episode and the credit order is correct. Producers, executive producers, teleplay story and director. This order is REVERSED, as with every American tv show. So if read backwards the story credit is before the teleplay, just like the season one episodes. I hope this clarifies my edit. TheVampire (talk) 07:12, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

That is absolutely incorrect, I double checked the episodes even the first season episodes. The teleplay credit is BEFORE the story credit for this TV series. Not every single American TV series have story BEFORE teleplay. Some American TV series have teleplay BEFORE story and others vice versa. In fact, some episodes of a TV series even has some episodes have teleplay first and story second while other episodes of the same TV series has story first and teleplay second, please see List of The Thundermans episodes for an example. — YoungForever(talk) 07:20, 5 November 2021 (UTC)
I’m sorry but you don’t understand what I wrote. The opening credits are in reverse order after the cast and that is why the director is credited last and the executive producers are listed from least important to most important with Plec credited as last. So if story is the penultimate credit, that means that it’s credited before teleplay. The order is reversed and that is done with most films: opening credits end with director, closing credits begin with directors. This is basic billing. It’s pretty clear to me. TheVampire (talk) 08:37, 5 November 2021 (UTC)
First all, TV series are separate from films. It really doesn't matter how the other credits such as directors, producers, and executive producers because they are not in the same parameter on the episode table. Producers and executive producers are not even on the episodes table. As I said, teleplay is BEFORE story according to the beginning credits on this TV series. Teleplay and story are in the same parameter because they are alternative to written by. You are clearly making up your own rules here, no rules nor guidelines say anything about reverse order or what not. You can't even change the columns and rows order on the episode table. — YoungForever(talk) 14:48, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Further comments here. FWIW: 1) this discussion should be held at the article talk page not here, and 2) I agree that we should simply follow crediting order. Anything else strikes me as either WP:OR or overthinking it. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:47, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Maid (miniseries) edits

Why did you remove the edits made in the Cast? It was meant to complete the list and their names, not per IMDB but the actual credits on the show. What is your standard for guests or recurring characters because you have either included and/or to exclude too many? I also edited some of your wording because it was too ambiguous. FmlA$ap (talk) 01:40, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

IMDb is not a reliable source, per WP:IMDB. Co-starring cast members are not recurring nor guest starring, co-starring cast members are actors with super minor roles. We do not list co-starring actors on Wikipedia. If you want to add co-starring actors and every guest stars, go to Wikia or IMDb because Wikipedia is not the place for them. The guest stars subsection are only for notable guest stars such as credited as special guest stars/special appearances, are part of the main cast (past or in the present) in another series on the same network, or a famous non-actor such as musician or athlete. You need to read the hidden comments on the Cast and characters section. FYI, mentioned of surnames here and there are not going to cut it because they are only credited with first names only. — YoungForever(talk) 02:00, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

Manifest

If Arcobus13 continues to edit against consensus, feel free to let me know. Also, if you have a draft you'd like moved into your userspace, feel free to let me know. — Ched (talk) 08:18, 15 April 2021 (UTC)

@Ched: Will do. The editor was clearly disruptive editing as they repeatedly tried to add few actors/actresses who appeared less than 5 episodes and no reliable source to even confirm to be recurring. The consensus was established and continued to stay that way because the guest starring list was getting way too long. — YoungForever(talk) 15:27, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
information Update: @Ched: It seemed that the same editor continues to do the same disruptive edits including adding a whole guest section few days later which means the editor continues to edit against consensus as shown here. WP:SNEAKY. — YoungForever(talk) 21:39, 23 April 2021 (UTC)
I left a final warning on their talk. That edit was from 5 days ago, and it is a new editor, so I'm trying to be understanding and not WP:BITE them. I'll make sure Manifest is on my watchlist, and if I see anything obvious then I'll do what's needed. The "ping" worked, so feel free to use it again if needed and I miss something. — Ched (talk) 22:24, 23 April 2021 (UTC)

Source for Episode

Is this a good source for Yellowstone episode? https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/yellowstone/s04/e06P3771 (talk) 16:30, 6 December 2021 (UTC)

It is a copyright violation because you copied from there and pasted to Yellowstone. Episode summary are supposed to be in your own words and should only be written after the episode aired. — YoungForever(talk) 17:45, 6 December 2021 (UTC)

Gossip Girl (2021 TV series)

How, exactly, is the edit I made disruptive? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Maxtheewolfe (talk • contribs) 19:36, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

You have repeatedly anyone that appeared in 3 and less to the recurring cast. In addition, putting co-starring actors to the recurring cast and the guest cast when co-starring actors are just actors who have super minor and are not recurring nor guest starring cast. — YoungForever(talk) 19:58, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

Erik King on Dexter: New Blood

Hi YoungForever, I did indeed as Erik King in the cameo appearances of Dexter: New Blood. This is because he appears in a cut scene. Is that ok? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.21.173.185 (talk) 20:16, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

As I said, he wasn't even listed on the end credits of the episode, you need to add a reliable source to confirm his cameo appearance on the episode. — YoungForever(talk) 20:32, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

Merry Christmas

Merry Christmas YoungForever

Hi YoungForever, I wish you and your family a very Merry Christmas
and a very happy and healthy New Year,
Thank you for all your contributions to Wikipedia,
   –Davey2010Talk 17:46, 23 December 2021 (UTC)

Share similar holiday wishes by adding {{subst:User:Davey2010/MerryChristmas}} to your friends' talk pages.

Happy New Year, YoungForever!

Happy New Year!

YoungForever,
Have a prosperous, productive and enjoyable New Year, and thanks for your contributions to Wikipedia.
–Davey2010Talk 00:17, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

   Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks}} to user talk pages.

My apologies, thanks for the catch! Looked, like a blanking case, but I was just about to undo my own edit when I saw that you had done so. Thanks! ♥Th78blue (They/Them/Their • talk)♥ 06:41, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

WP:REDNOT

I think you are using it wrong. If it is the only place where such a link exists, and it is a topic that should receive an article, then it should stay a redlink -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 04:08, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

You are incorrect. Do not create red links to: Articles that are unlikely to be created and retained on Wikipedia, including articles that do not comply with Wikipedia's naming conventions. — YoungForever(talk) 04:48, 13 January 2022 (UTC)
How is it unlikely to be created, if it is an award winning TV show that inspired two different remakes in different countries? That seems like it would be a subject that is suggestive of being a probable creation. -- 65.92.246.142 (talk) 14:37, 13 January 2022 (UTC)
Articles to need pass WP:GNG. Now please go away as I no longer want to continue with this discussion. — YoungForever(talk) 15:47, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

Naomi

Hi. I am curious about this reversion. Since Jill Blankenship is a series writer, wouldn't that be constructive to name her alongside Brian and David? Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tvgeek81 (talk • contribs) 19:45, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Brian Michael Bendis and David F. Walker are comic series writers while Jill Blankenship is the co-creator of the TV series with Ava DuVernay. — YoungForever(talk) 19:49, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Thank you

...for introducing the {{cite Rotten Tomatoes... markup at S&B. I did not know that such yet existed. Brava. As for deleting messages, my message(s) of thanks are more personal and "general good and welfare" than business—I do not give pictorial accolades—but, your page, your call. Cheers. 98.253.16.20 (talk) 21:29, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Your entry on COIN

Please read WP:OUTING and be very careful about posting about off-wiki things. It is a very serious policy. When necessary, there are ways to report this which protects you. Read, if you will, the top of the WP:COIN page. Cheers, --SVTCobra 00:00, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Duly noted, I was not aware that it was considered to be outing when the editor repeatedly self-promoting themselves by adding the same url on the article. — YoungForever(talk) 00:31, 19 January 2022 (UTC)
There was no outing in this case, the editor linked directly to the page in their first edit. You did nothing wrong, but you should be careful about directly linking to material like this if the editor hasn't directly brought it up. Hemiauchenia (talk) 00:58, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Citing the Sources for my edits to the Kung Fu (2021 TV series) page

On January 17, 2022, on the Kung Fu (2021 TV series) page, I added the Chinese name of the main character, Nicky Shen, and also provided its meaning. I also noted that she was a political science major and quoted from the final minute of the pilot episode because it was relevant to her Chinese name. Her Chinese name is a wonderful “Easter egg” that the writers had included.

Less than an hour later, you reverted my edits and noted, “Source? You need to provide a reliable source.”

Here is a link to a screenshot (uploaded to Imgur) from the first minute of the pilot episode, which shows the character’s Chinese name along with the fact that she was a Harvard political science major: Kung Fu (TV S01E01 0:00:33) - Nicky Shen Chinese name I would appreciate your advice on how I should cite this source.

I see that some Wikipedia pages have a Notes section. I can create a Notes section for this page and cite to the screenshot at the 0:00:33-second point of the pilot episode in order to support my edits. Alternatively, I can upload this screenshot from the episode to the Wikipedia page. Also, do I need to upload screenshots from Google Translate to independently confirm the accuracy of the translation of the Chinese name? Thank you for your help.

Rybashka888 (talk) 22:51, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

A screenshot of the scene is not a reliable source. Please read WP:RS. You need to provide an actual reliable source. We cannot take your word for it as it would be WP:OR. — YoungForever(talk) 23:03, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
Quoting from the link to WP:RS:
“When editors talk about a sources that are being cited on Wikipedia, they might be referring to any one of these three concepts: The piece of work itself (the article, book)...
“[V]ideo, and multimedia materials that have been recorded then broadcast, distributed, or archived by a reputable party may also meet the necessary criteria to be considered reliable sources. . . . Additionally, an archived copy of the media must exist. It is convenient, but by no means necessary, for the archived copy to be accessible via the Internet.”
I refer my fellow editors to the episode itself; there is no need to believe my screenshot is accurate. The entire episode is located on The CW Network's original website for free viewing at https://www.cwtv.com/shows/kung-fu/pilot/?play=705e9452-4156-4f98-8cea-21372097ad05
The time codes for my citations are at approximately 0:00:33 and 0:41:42 in the online pilot episode. None of the character descriptions or episode plot summaries on this page have any Sources, footnotes, or timecodes but I am able to provide footnotes and timecodes for my small contribution to the character description of the main character. I just need to know how to meet the standard for adding my contribution. Should I try to recruit another editor to watch a few minutes of the episode to confirm that I have not done any original research? Rybashka888 (talk) 04:29, 21 January 2022 (UTC)
First of all, this is an American TV series. We do not need know her Chinese characters of her Chinese name and what not because it is considered to be WP:TRIVIA. In addition, per MOS:TVCAST, All names should be referred to as credited, or by common name supported by a reliable source. She is only credited as Nicky Shen. It is considered to be WP:OR when you put her Chinese characters of her Chinese name and then decided to interpret what her Chinese name means. You clearly missing the point here. If you looking for some loophole, there is no loophole for WP:OR. — YoungForever(talk) 04:52, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

Dopesick (miniseries)

Hi, Curtis Wright's character is discussed at length in four episodes, even though the actor appears only in one, and is an important role as its probable that without the wording Wright created for the FDA approval, Purdue would never have been able to market OxyContin so successfully. By contrast Giuliani's name only appears in three episodes. Would a third list of "Single appearance" characters and a better source that IMDb be a reasonable means of adding Wright's role? This isn't about the actor btw, it's about making the previous near complete lack of information on Wright more public. Cheers Rpm bln (talk) 10:24, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Doesn't matter if the character was discussed in several episodes, he only appeared in 1 episode. Single appearances are not enough to be listed on the Cast and characters section. Wikipedia is not IMDb nor Wikia. — YoungForever(talk) 15:30, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

How do I update List of Young Sheldon episodes page with the correct url of the writers and directors?

How do I update List of Young Sheldon episodes page with the correct url of the writers and directors? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.9.132.42 (talk) 03:46, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Go see my edit on there where I added the correct url. — YoungForever(talk) 03:49, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Help with TV title cards

Hi there, I like to work on TV pages and I see you on virtually every page I've ever worked on so I thought I'd ask you for help. I've been working on Creamerie and I thought per MOS:TV there seemed to be a rationale for uploading TV posters, but I attempted that and it got deleted. So then I wanted to do a screen grab of the title card from Hulu, but every way I tried it (print screen, snipping tool, Zoom recordings), Hulu blacked out the screen. How do you get screen grabs of a TV title card? Any help would be so appreciated! Grn1749 (talk) 17:49, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

I don't know what to tell you because people just usually screenshot title cards. Please go ask at WP:TEA if you need help with editing Wikipedia. — YoungForever(talk) 17:57, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
Will do. Thanks. Grn1749 (talk) 00:02, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) @Grn1749: A number of streaming services (Netflix, Hulu, Disney Plus, HBO Max, Paramount Plus, etc.) prevent screenshots and recordings to do their part in adhering to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act. It's the same reason you can't [legally] carry a video camera into a movie theatre and record. These preventative measures typically go across both mobile and desktop devices. Although it is considered fair use on Wikipedia, these services can't confirm what you plan on doing with the content hence the measures, it prevents people from breaking copyright laws by uploading or selling content across the internet.
Most times you'll be able to find what you're looking for elsewhere. For example, I got the Celebrity Big Brother 2 title card from this Twitter post, alternatively you can also look on Google Images, Fandom, or a social media account. I'll also point out though that it doesn't appear your poster got deleted because it was a poster, but because you uploaded non-free content to the Wikimedia Commons. If you uploaded it again, but to Wikipedia instead, with an appropriate Fair Use Rationale it may not get deleted. See Wikipedia:Uploading images and Help:Introduction to images with Wiki Markup for additional information, and let me know if you have any other questions. TheDoctorWho (talk) 01:25, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
@TheDoctorWho: You're amazing. Thank you for all that info! Grn1749 (talk) 03:18, 10 February 2022 (UTC)

Episode cast template

Pretty nifty trick here in this edit: Special:Diff/1075079429. I didn't know about that. Just wanted to say thanks! -2pou (talk) 20:04, 3 March 2022 (UTC)

2pou,
From my understanding whenever each episode have a different starring cast, the episode cast template is used because the starring cast list can be way too long. — YoungForever(talk) 20:11, 3 March 2022 (UTC)

The Fairly Odder cast names

I’m sorry for changing them, I hadn’t seen the source, so I didn’t know which was the actual one, I thought Raskin was the mistake. Bringing the source in was very helpful, so I appreciate that--CreecregofLife (talk) 22:01, 21 March 2022 (UTC)

Rebel (2021 TV series)

There is nothing wrong with the tool. It presented the information correctly.

I am the one that was up too late and should have been in bed.

I looked at the history page in one tab and then opened both the diff of the edit you reverted and the diff of your edit in separate tabs.

And, apparently, after seeing the red links, I apparently mixed it up the two tabs, went back to the history tab and reverted the top change on that list, which was your edit, the WRONG one to revert.

My mistake, not the tool's.

My sincere apologies.

Shortsword (talk) 17:44, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

The Dropout

Thank you for the edit clarification! My mistake for making that edit. Limmidy (talk) 23:41, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

We always go by according to on-screen credits for TV series, miniseries, and films. — YoungForever(talk) 23:44, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

Ratings graph discussion

Hi.

As per our discussion, here is the section. Callmemirela 🍁 talk 21:20, 31 March 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me know. — YoungForever(talk) 21:38, 31 March 2022 (UTC)

Sweet Tooth

Hello, I am a new student editor and I am on a wikipedia project for my class. I recently edited the Sweet Tooth TV series page, but I believe you reverted my edits due to certain standards. I would love to get in touch with you about what I can do differently so I can have something to post for my project. AstariaP (talk) 20:56, 1 May 2022 (UTC)

La Brea

Hi Youngforever, would this make an acceptable source for the Season 2 episode 1 title? [6] 2A00:23C8:5228:1601:78FE:930E:6CF2:1217 (talk) 15:14, 4 May 2022 (UTC)

Yes, it is a reliable source and it is already on the episode table. — YoungForever(talk) 15:29, 4 May 2022 (UTC)

Locke & Key

Sorry... when I went to edit it, the source was "https://www.whats-on-netflix.com/news/locke-key-season-3-netflix-everything-we-know-so-far-06-2022/", which is not great. I think we had an edit conflict: clearly TV Line is fine. —Joeyconnick (talk) 16:59, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

No worries, edit conflict happens. Yes, I aware that What's on Netflix is a questionable source since most of the time they report on speculations or/and get the sources from IMDb. Also, it is an unofficial fansite. — YoungForever(talk) 17:45, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Writer's Barnstar
Thanks for your great work on Devs. It’s a pleasure to read. Viriditas (talk) 08:48, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

"Proper American English"

I think that you might have somehow felt personally offended but that was not my intention. No one is saying that you don't speak American English. I'm just saying that there is legitimately something wrong with the sentence. I have read a lot of articles about TV series on Wikipedia but I have never seen a sentence worded this way and it does not seem correct to me. There are several main problems with it:
1) I did my own research and did a Google search for the phrase "gave a straight-to-series order reboot" and your article was the only hit for it: Google search for "gave a straight-to-series order reboot" So this has never been written by anyone in this way before, making it much less likely that it is proper American English. Due to its complexity, I will break it down even further to examine the details to see whether or not they are proper on their own.
2) I've never heard the term "order reboot" before. I did another Google search for "an order reboot" Google search for "an order reboot" and there were only three hits, none of which had anything to do with TV, so this has never been written by anyone in this way before. This is therefore not the common term or common way to express this idea. That is why I reworded it. Networks can "place an order" for a reboot or maybe even just "order a reboot" but "give an order reboot" doesn't make any sense because an "order reboot" would be a "reboot of an order". Wouldn't they want to place a "reboot order", i.e. "an order for a reboot"? That would make much more sense. There are many ways of rewording this part of the sentence but it doesn't seem like proper American English to me as it stands right now.
3) You have left out the definite article "the" in the phrase "reboot of Picture Perfect film series". That's like saying "I'm going to top of mountain" or "I'm watching until end of film". So I added the missing "the" to the sentence. I figured that this was the least controversial of the changes, so I was very surprised that it was so abruptly rejected with an "undo".
4) Your comment with your "undo" was "No, nothing wrong as before", which is not correct American English either. Where is the verb?
If you can map out your sentence and show how the subject, objects, verb, articles, etc. relate to each other then that would be helpful, but I'm just not convinced right now for the reasons I specified above. There are too many things about the sentence that don't make any sense and appear to be grammatically incorrect. If they seem that way to me then I have to expect that there are others who will find it difficult to understand as well. Can you address the issues I listed above and explain to us exactly how the sentence is grammatically correct? I'm just not seeing it. This has nothing to do with you personally or the series itself. This is a purely grammatical issue. I'm not trying to have an argument so I didn't want to hash out the details with you in the article itself, but rather am speaking to you here where we can hopefully fix the sentence and then you can delete this conversation from your page so no one has to see it. I'm trying to go about this as gently and as privately as possible so please understand my good intentions. This is just about the sentence. Nicholas0 (talk) 14:17, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

gave a straight-to-series order is proper American English. I fixed it now. — YoungForever(talk) 16:19, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

Industry

Hi, the episode summaries do not have the overall details of desks the characters work at (CPS, FX) the as well as series regulars such as Greg, Clement etc. and how they relate to the primary characters. See Westworld (TV series) and Succession (TV series) which have a summary and plot section to at least explain the overall dynamics of the show. If you have any ideas how to present the information, let me know, but the page needs some kind of overview or else it becomes basically just a list of names and then episode info instead of any general information.Pinchofhope (talk) 21:39, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

@Pinchofhope: Characters descriptions belong on Cast section. Overview, Premise, or Plot do not belong on the Cast section. WP:OTHERSTUFF. Per MOS:TVPLOT, If appropriate, these articles could instead include a prose plot summary of no more than 500 words per season (such as Scouted) instead of an episode table, but an article should not have both an episode table with summaries and a prose plot summary. If the plot summaries are moved to a separate list of episodes (such as with The Blacklist) or to individual season articles (such as with Monk), then the plot summary at the series article should be replaced with a simple overview or premise section that allocates around 100 words per season (such as a logline for each season in non-copyrighted language). — YoungForever(talk) 00:44, 9 September 2022 (UTC)

"Brave New World (upcoming TV series)" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Brave New World (upcoming TV series) and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 September 12#Brave New World (upcoming TV series) until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. Steel1943 (talk) 03:36, 12 September 2022 (UTC)

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