Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Friedrich Wilhelm von Seydlitz/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Sarastro1 via FACBot (talk) 21:59, 23 November 2017 [1].

Friedrich Wilhelm von Seydlitz[edit]

Nominator(s): auntieruth (talk) 15:43, 13 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about... one of Frederick the Great's cavalry generals, usually credited with the training of cavalry and development of cavalry tactics. I've experimented with a different citation template for this, to aid in the review process auntieruth (talk) 15:43, 13 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Image review

  • Captions that aren't complete sentences shouldn't end in periods
  • File:Major_General_von_Seydlitz_pipe_Prussian_cavalry_Battle_of_Rossbach_Richard_Knötel.jpg: When/where was this first published? Nikkimaria (talk) 18:00, 17 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comments Support from Indy beetle[edit]

Not all I have to say, but some observations for now:

  • "Seydlitz emerged as a redoubtable Rittmeister (cavalry captain) in the War of Austrian Succession (1740–1748), also known as the First and Second Silesian Wars." My understanding is that the War of Austrian Succession was a wider conflict that included the Silesian Wars, so I find the "also known as" a bit misleading. If you mean to say that Seydlitz earned his promotion after service in those two wars, I think you should drop the reference to the wider War of Austrian Succession and just say "emerged as a [captain] in the Silesian Wars." Wikilinked, naturally. compromised...:)
  • "He was still not healthy enough to participate in the annual campaigns". What is meant by the phrase "annual campaigns"? Perhaps it would be more clear if it read "front line operations" or similar. removed annual. Campaigning was done annually, and usually not during the winter....too cold for man and beast....So annual campaigns were conducted from March to November, sometimes December. Sieges might occur during the winter, but not usually.
  • You use the title "King" multiple times in the lede but its not directly established that by this you mean Frederick. Might help if you say "King Frederick" the first time or similar. fixed
  • "His future sovereign always addressed him in German." Might be worth mentioning Frederick by name here. done
  • "Major Hans Heinrich Adam Schütz, a notoriously violent man.[11][Note 4]" The footnote explaining Schütz's violent tenancies is WP:UNDUE for this article. left it in and clarified that Seydlitz disapproved of the man's tactics.
  • "A subordinate brought him two healthy Circassian girls" A wikilink to Circassian beauties might give us a better idea of the purpose of their introduction to Seydlitz. ooooh, I didn't see that link. Very good.
  • "after an attack of apoplexy, he completed a couple of stays at Carlsbad to take the waters." Wouldn't hurt to clarify that Carlsbad was a spa town or otherwise state that these were mineral waters he was "taking", as they say. wikilinked, etc.

-Indy beetle (talk) 03:27, 19 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Noting that I'm satisfied with your responses above, my final observations:

  • "Seydlitz's cavalry again saved the day." "Saved the day" is rather colloquial, perhaps "played a decisive role" or similar would be more suitable.
  • 'I couldn't find this, but it may have been edited out.
  • "brought to an end his formerly close friendship" might sound better as "brought an end to his formerly close friendship"
  • fixed. Good call.
  • "The K2169 (a county roadway) passing through Reichertswerben is named von Seydlitz Strasse." Is there any secondary source that can support this?
  • it's on the maps....and cited to google.....and yes, cited to the anniversary brochure published.

-Indy beetle (talk) 21:48, 21 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Indy beetle: Indy, all your comments are addressed. Are there more? If not, do you support? auntieruth (talk) 17:13, 20 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
My apologies for the delay, I thought I had already given my support. Good to see that you have a secondary source for the road. I now gladly support this nomination. -Indy beetle (talk) 20:38, 20 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Sources review[edit]

  • Refs 4, 6, 11, 16, 17, and 18 all show Harvard errors. I can't see immediately what the problems are, but they're most likely minor drafting errors within the source templates.
    • I've gone through and fixed those - it was a problem with how the link was formatted. Parsecboy (talk) 18:35, 20 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref 24: needs publisher details
  • There is inconsistency in the display of publisher locations for books. Either all, or none, should have them.
  • Isbn formats should be regulated in 13-digit format. You can use this to convert 10-digit to 13.

Otherwise, all sources look of appropriate quality and reliability. Brianboulton (talk) 18:06, 19 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Parsecboy[edit]

I came to nominate an article myself and couldn't help but be excited to see this up for FA.

  • There's a duplicate link for major in the second section
  • In this note, there's only one citation given - which biography makes the assertion and which one rejects it?
  • "...the victorious meeting at Katholisch-Hennersdorf..." - readers might be a bit thrown seeing a battle described as a "meeting". A link to meeting engagement would be appropriate, I'd think.
  • "...the peace on the 25 December 1748..." - I think the "the" is extraneous (or something is missing).
  • "By the start of the next war..." - piping Seven Years' War to "war" seems a little WP:EGGy to me. Ditto for Raid on Berlin to "raid" below.
  • Shift the link to heavy cavalry up to the first occurrence. Also for syphilis in the Later life section.
  • On the Semi-retirement section - it seems a little odd to split off 2 sentences into their own subsection.
  • On the subject of memorials, there's also German cruiser Seydlitz. Parsecboy (talk) 19:47, 20 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • I couldn't document the Seydlitz cruiser....so I didn't include it.  :) Other stuff to be addressed later today if my wikipedia editing is working now auntieruth (talk) 14:36, 25 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • You can pull a citation from the Seydlitz article - Gröner p. 65 should be sufficient. Parsecboy (talk) 14:29, 27 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yup, happy to support now. Great work, Ruth. Parsecboy (talk) 17:14, 9 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

CommentsSupport from PM[edit]

Just a few from me. I reviewed this at GAN and have been through it again to look through the changes since then:

  • "Frederick's Court" should probably be "Frederick the Great's court", (and link Frederick) as you haven't introduced him in the body at that point. done
  • I assume that Margrave Frederick William of Brandenburg-Schwedt was the same chap as the Cuirassier regiment was named after? If so, it is a bit weird that one is Wilhelm and one is William? done
  • In August, 1744 - drop the comma after August done
  • I suggest introducing and linking the concept of coup d'œil in the preceding para where you state "his ability to see at a glance what needed to be done", alternatively, you need to explain what coup d'œil is, as it is an unfamiliar term

That's me done. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:35, 4 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  • coup d'œil : it is introduced in the lead, and I'm not sure what you mean by introducing it into the paragraph before Rossbach. I can introduce it in the 1740s battles...is that what you mean? auntieruth (talk) 17:41, 5 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I mean it should be introduced as a concept when it is first mentioned in the body. In the preceding para it says "his ability to see at a glance what needed to be done". I suggest adding at the end of that sentence ", a concept known as coup d'œil." Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:42, 6 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
duh. I got it now. auntieruth (talk) 17:42, 6 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by Dudley[edit]

  • I reviewed this at A Class, but I have a few further comments.
  • "and then moved the battlefield to the south of the country" how do you move a battlefield?
  • "Hussars, commanded by Major Hans Heinrich Adam Schütz, a violent man whose conduct of warfare Seydlitz disapproved." This reads as a bit odd. Maybe "Hussars. They were commanded by Major Hans Heinrich Adam Schütz, who was a brutal man, and Seydlitz condemned his conduct in warfare."
  • "cavalry horses were the sturdy warm-blood Trakehner" Trakehners?
  • "In May 1757, regardless of the custom of keeping the heavy cavalry in reserve, Seydlitz brought his regiment forward" I think "in defiance of" would be better than "regardless of".
  • "the Prussian army had defeated the combined armies of two European powers" You have not said which powers (apart from referring to "French/Imperial artillery") It would be helpful to say that the battle was against France and the Holy Roman Empire.
  • "The K2169 (a county roadway) passing through Reichertswerben is named von Seydlitz Strasse." Is there any evidence that it was named after him?
  • @Dudley Miles: well, b attlefield broadly. I fixed it. The bit about Schutz has been rewritten several times, and now it's back to the way it originally was. Trakehner/Trakehners, either way. In cavalry talk, horses are plural or singular as horse. defiance is better. Thanks. I added the different army, and the road in Reichertswerben goes directly through where he regrouped his cavalry. auntieruth (talk) 21:47, 8 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added a link to the article on the 250th anniversary celebration. auntieruth (talk) 22:07, 8 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Closing comment: This is ready for promotion, but just a couple of minor issues to consider. Not all the images have alt text, something in which I always feel, while not an explicit requirement at FA, we should demonstrate best practice. Also, the duplinks need to be checked as we seem to have one or two (which may be argued as being necessary, but I think they should be double checked). This tool will highlight any duplication. But these issues are not enough to delay promotion. Sarastro1 (talk) 21:59, 23 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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