Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Washington state symbols/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by The Rambling Man 21:58, 24 February 2010 [1].

List of Washington state symbols[edit]

Nominator(s): Another Believer (Talk) 20:17, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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I am nominating this for featured list because I feel it meets FL critera. I did most of the work with getting List of Oregon state symbols to FL status, so I am familiar with the nomination process for a very similar list. The lists are almost identical in format, except the list for Washington did not require a References column since a General source was used for much of the information, as opposed to multiple sources for the Oregon list. The list should be up to standards as far as sources, alt text, captions, disamb links, etc. go. Thanks so much! --Another Believer (Talk) 20:17, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from bamse (talk) 21:57, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Not familiar with the topic, so please bear with me if comments don't make sense:
  • The intro seems quite boring to me. The first paragraph is just a chronological summary of the list. The second paragraph is fine. I suggest expanding the intro (and maybe removing/shortening the first paragraph). Some questions I had when reading the article might be helpful for the expansion: How are state symbols selected? (Can anybody propose state symbols of arbitrary type?) Is the list of state symbol types fixed or could it be extended (the state beer,...)? What does it mean to be a state symbol? (What is the reason for designating state symbols? Are state animals/plants ... specially protected? Are inhabitants especially proud of their state tree...? Are state symbols used for promoting the state?)
I structured the lead the same as the Oregon list. You raise great questions, but I think the background for each symbol is different, so it is difficult to define the process. As indicated in the lead, the Washington State Legislature officially designates each symbol, but how they are introduced varies. Unfortunately, the Revised Code of Washington does not state what it means to be a state symbol or how the symbols are used. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe you could add a sentence or two saying that there is no fixed procedure how state symbols are chosen. In this context you could give some examples (proposed by individuals or groups of individuals, chosen directly by the state, the state lets individuals or groups of individuals decide,...). How about the "types"? Is there a limited set of types that can be chosen as state symbol? If the law does not mention anything, you could state this in the intro. With Oregon designating a "state hostess" I suppose the range of types is rather broad. Regarding the "meaning", I was not thinking of a meaning as written down in the law. However, I still wonder what the point of designating state symbols is. Is it a way of shaping the image of a state? (I acknowledge it might be difficult to find RS for the latter.) Also, while I can imagine how a state flag and seal are used, I cannot imagine what to do with a state grass. Again, I don't mean a use as laid down in the law; I just wonder where I would see or hear about a "state amphibian, arboretum,..." outside of the official lists.
This source helps. I expanded the first paragraph of the lead to include a sentence about how and why the symbols are chosen. Let me know if anything else should be expanded. --Another Believer (Talk) 19:37, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • What is "RCW"?
Done. Revised Code of Washington. Linked in the table. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks.
  • Can you expand on the "four-year effort" of the students at Windsor Elementary School. What exactly did they do?
Not certain, as the source does not expand. If required, I could do additional research, though I don't think the process of how the symbol came to be is as important as the symbol itself and why it was chosen. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
OK. I agree that the symbol and the reason for choosing it are more important. I just felt that there was something missing in the "effort" sentence.
  • Is there no better picture of an apple on commons? White balance seems a bit off. At first I thought it was a peach.
As a pop-in, I suggest File:Sundown and cross section 2.jpg. KV5 (Talk • Phils) 23:32, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Now, that looks like an apple. Thanks.
  • In "Washington, My Home" was approved unanimously a State Senator from South Bend introduced", there is probably a full stop missing after "unanimously".
Done. Now states "was approved unanimously after a State Senator..." --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks.
  • Is there no picture for Bluebunch Wheatgrass?
There is not, and I am not familiar enough with the image uploading process to add one myself. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Did you try uploading one? It is not that hard. If you have a picture, I could help you with putting it on wikipedia if you wish.
I did not. I am not really familiar with which photos can be uploaded and which ones cannot due to copyright issues. I'm afraid images and licenses are not my strong point. --Another Believer (Talk) 17:43, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
No problem. I thought you already had a suitable picture which just needed to be transferred to wikipedia. I am sure sooner or later somebody will upload a picture.
  • What year was Washington, My Home written?
Done. 1950, as indicated by newly-added source. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks.
  • Since the list is about state symbols, I'd swap the "type" and "symbol" columns.
This is the format used by other state symbols lists. If a user wants to find the state bird, it would be much more difficult to do so without the Type column being first. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Good point, done.
  • I'd remove the first of the navigation templates ("State of Washington") since the cities, regions, etc are not exactly related to this list.
The symbols page is listed and linked under the "Topics" section of the template. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, I see. Done.

bamse (talk) 23:16, 11 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for taking the time to offer comments and suggestions. I hope you are pleased with the improvements, and feel free to let me know if you have additional concerns that remain to be addressed. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:09, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for addressing most points. Sorry for my ignorance concerning the state symbols in general, but I still think that the lead could be more interesting than saying: "first A became a state symbol, then B, then C,...". I gave some more suggestions above.bamse (talk) 10:12, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
While I am not familiar with image uploading and licenses, I will see what I can do with the lead. --Another Believer (Talk) 17:43, 12 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The lead is more interesting now, but could be expanded even more ("non-fixed designation procedure",... see above). I'd wait for other reviewers to see if it is really an issue or if it is just me being picky.bamse (talk) 23:31, 13 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I will be sure to expand further if I come across a source indicating how symbols are designated in the state. I have no idea if there are different ways a symbol can be proposed, but I imagine a group (students, lobbyists, etc.) bug a politician long enough that he or she actually submits a bill so that the Legislature can (arguably, waste their time to) vote for or against the symbol. However, I am not certain if there are other ways the proposal can be submitted. --Another Believer (Talk) 02:15, 14 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Support bamse (talk) 21:49, 24 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from The Rambling Man (talk) 11:18, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Comments
  • Could make lead image bigger, up to 300px if I recall MOS properly, as long as the resolution of the image supports it.
Done. Now 250 px.--Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Symbol doesn't sort properly because of the quotation marks.
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • I always thought direct quotes needed direct reference, e.g. when you say "... is a "living museum" that ..." you need to say exactly where you get that quote.
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Seems a little odd to me that tanager isn't capitalised while Song Sparrow is.
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Just a quick glance of fr.wikipedia and the French Wiktionary, I can see no definitive statement that quadrille means square. Any chance of an independent verification of this?
Done. Actually, I went ahead and removed the translation, as different sources seem to have different information about the background of the dance. Besides, I don't think it's literal translation is too relevant. --Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Steelhead Trout (also known as Rainbow Trout)" links to "Redband Trout"... a touch confusing.
Done. Apparently this fish has several names. I went ahead and changed the "also known as" to Redband Trout to avoid confusion. --Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Rambling Man (talk) 21:39, 16 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for taking the time to offer suggestions. --Another Believer (Talk) 04:32, 17 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comments
  • Washington's second symbol was Western Hemlock, selected as the state tree in 1947. - Scientific name? (Same for other species.)
People recognize and understand species by their common name, not their scientific name. I do not think it is necessary to include scientific names in each instance within the prose, but I made sure each species in the table includes its scientific name in parenthesis. --Another Believer (Talk) 20:56, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • The Unofficial symbols section looks kind of lonely; perhaps it could be merged with the lead?
I expanded the section a bit to include unsuccessful proposals, similar to what is over at List of Oregon state symbols. Will expand further if I can track down other proposed symbols. --Another Believer (Talk) 20:56, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • In the table itself, "Endemic Mammal", "Folk Song", and "Marine Mammal" should be decapitalized.
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 20:56, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Looks good otherwise. –Juliancolton | Talk 03:07, 18 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 14:25, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved issues, Dabomb87 (talk)
Comments from Dabomb87 (talk · contribs)
  • "Fourteen additional symbols were added between 1950 and 2000. "additional ... added"; check for redundancy.
Done. Removed "additional" --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • I understand that you've linked it for consistency, but do you think readers won't know what an apple is? I don't think it's a high-value link.
Readers may know what an apple is, but considering this list is about symbols, I think it is important to provide links to those symbols when used so that readers can easily access the article to that symbol (if they wished to do so). I can remove the link from the lead if you feel strongly that is should be removed. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I can live with the link in the table, but the lead already has a lot of blue, so I think delinking apple there would be beneficial. Dabomb87 (talk) 02:36, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 06:02, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Prior to"-->Before (it's simpler)
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • The alt text is very good, by the way.
Thank you. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • "the Legislature never officially adopted either" Can you clarify that you are referring to the Washington legislature?
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • "meaning "bye and bye" in Chinook Jargon" Comma after here.
Of course. Thank you. Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Dabomb87 (talk) 16:28, 1 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! --Another Believer (Talk) 00:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Truco

Comments from Truco (talk · contribs)

General
Alt text, contributors, dabs and external links all check out fine.
Lead
  • While some symbols, including the state flower and state seal were selected before then, they were not adopted by the Legislature until later. - there should be a comma after 'seal'
Done. -02:58, 21 February 2010 (UTC)
  • Its a general that the [overall] summary of the list paragraph is the last one in the lead, so I would switch the second and third paragraphs. It also make it a better read.
Done. --Another Believer (Talk) 02:58, 21 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Table
  • Why not have the image column next to the name column?
Well, for consistency. Nearly all of the other state symbols lists that have a table place the image column last. Perhaps it is because users are also used to seeing images line the right-hand side of the page. --Another Believer (Talk) 02:58, 21 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • The adopted column IMO would look better as the first column, since it would IMO make sense to sort by the adoption date.--Truco 503 22:48, 19 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Again, I would argue that the current format is best for consistency. If you feel strongly about either point, I could work on the table or ask other reviewers if they have a preference. Thanks (as always) for taking the time to review this list, and for your comments and suggestions. --Another Believer (Talk) 02:58, 21 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support--Truco 503 03:31, 24 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]


The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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