Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2006 October 30

Welcome to the Wikipedia Help Desk Archives
The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current Help Desk pages.

October 30

Spaces

I edited an article with substantial additions, 8 weeks ago. On doing this, the added section showed up in edit-style type with a dotted box around it. 8 weeks later it remains in the same format. When will my added section appear in regular web text, like other articles in wikipedia?

M.Rodowicz

Wikipedia's software renders something like that when you put a space (or several spaces) before a line. If you delete the extra spaces it will appear properly. Ziggurat 00:20, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

The chart I copied, pasted and inserted new information into shows up only at bottom of page

Hi,

I copied a chart from PEN/Book-of-the-Month Club Translation Prize. Then I pasted it at James Laughlin Award and National Poetry Series. I took out the information from the chart and inserted information for the awards covered on each of those pages. In both cases, everything seemed fine until I looked at where the chart was -- always at the BOTTOM of the page, even though I edited it in the "Winners" section of each article.

I looked over the charts in the editing mode and can't find anything different in these charts that puts them at the bottom of the page, while others stay where I put them. Is there a template somewhere for these things? I'd hate to go through the laborious process of creating new charts, especially if this is going to happen again. Please take a look. Thanks for any help you can give. Noroton 00:47, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Tables (or charts as you say) need to end with "|}". At James Laughlin Award and National Poetry Series the tables ended with "|-}", which made them go to the bottom of the page. I have fixed up the problem (eg). Tables can act strangely like this when there is a minor syntax error, it happens to me all the time :-). Good luck. --Commander Keane 07:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Fifth wheel

I was going to fix Fifth wheel, which for some reason redirects to Semi-trailer truck, but on the discussion page, it says it has been "Transwikied to Wiktionary". "Wik" the heck does that mean? Clarityfiend 03:45, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Transwikied means it has been sent to another Wiki, such as Wiktionary. In this case, it was probably a dictionary definition and was sent to Wiktionary. DoomsDay349 Happy Halloween! 03:50, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

So what do you recommend I do with the article? If it's defined in Wiktionary, it really is a "fifth wheel." Should it be nominated for deletion? Clarityfiend 04:12, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Feel free to replace the redirect with text, if you can create an entry longer than a dictionary definition. The wiktionary entry is completely separate to the one on Wikipedia, so there's no need to nominate it for deletion. GeeJo ^(t)⁄_(c) • 16:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Should image captions end with a full stop (.)?

I'm rather pedantic :) but should image captions end with a full stop (period, '.')? I don't think there's a reference for this anywhere, but I apologize if I'm wrong.

Thanks,

Yuser31415 04:09, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

From Wikipedia:Captions: "Complete sentences in captions should always end in a period (or other appropriate punctuation). If the caption is not a complete sentence, it generally should not have a period at the end". --Commander Keane 05:12, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! Yuser31415 07:25, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

what defines a promotional/ad page?

hi, ive been trying to add articles on indian design firms( after seeing all the western design firms listed) and ive been trying to start with Flip Design, heres what i put in the artical chaitanyak 06:46, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Flip Design Private Limited

Flip Design Pvt. Lmtd. is a design firm based in Bangalore, india, with various partner firms as well as one partner firm in france. According to their web site, they are an experience design firm that provides its clients with fresh ideas. This is achieved through the design of everything from logos and stationary, environments, and web based experiences.

Flip was formed in 2005 by two friends, Abhay Toshniwal and Arvind Prabhakar.

The firm employs approximately 10 people in the disciplines of communication design, textile design, retail design and Interaction Design. chaitanyak 06:47, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

official site

www.flipdesign.in

this article got deleted within 5 minutes

then i tried this:

Flip Design Pvt. Ltd.

Flip Design Pvt. Ltd. is a design firm based in Bangalore, India. The firm was started in early 2005, and provides a range of design services, from print to the web and corporate films. 
Flip design was started by Arvind Prabhakar and Abhay Toshniwal. Arvind has studied communication design at Srishti School of Art Design and Technology. Abhay Toshniwal comes from a much more varied background in various things: from engineering, to theatre as well as film.
Flip has since been joined by various other designers, each with a unique background in various fields of design.

official site:
www.flipdesign.in 

this article got deleted within 10 minutes

heres the sample content of existing approved articles of other design firms:

IDEO From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

IDEO is a design consultancy based in Palo Alto, California, with other offices in San Francisco, Chicago, Boston, London, Munich and Shanghai. According to its web site, it is focused on helping its clients innovate. This is manifested through the design of products, services, environments, and digital experiences.

IDEO was formed in 1991 by a merger of three established design firms: David Kelley Design (founded by David Kelley, who is also a professor at Stanford University), ID Two (founded by Britain's Bill Moggridge), and Matrix Product Design (founded by Mike Nuttall, also from Britain). The firm is now wholly owned by Steelcase, the world's largest office furniture maker[citation needed]. The founders of two of the three predecessor companies are still involved in the firm. The current CEO is Tim Brown.

The firm employs approximately 450 people in the disciplines of Human factors, Mechanical, Electrical and Software Engineering, Industrial Design, and Interaction Design. IDEO is active in many fields of design. It has worked on thousands of projects for a myriad of clients in the consumer, computer, medical, furniture, toy, office and automotive industries. Notable examples are Apple's first mouse, Microsoft's second mouse, the Palm V PDA, and Steelcase's Leap chair. Major clients (as of 2004) include Procter & Gamble, PepsiCo, Microsoft, Eli Lilly, and Steelcase.

In 1999, the firm was the subject of the "Deep Dive" episode of ABC's Nightline, as they redesigned a shopping cart in five days. In 2001, IDEO's general manager Tom Kelley wrote 'The Art of Innovation,' and more recently, 'The Ten Faces of Innovation.'

IDEO has won more of the BusinessWeek/Industrial Designers Society of America Industrial Design Excellence Awards than any other firm.

[edit] External links IDEO web site Podcast interview with IDEO founder David Kelley (from iinnovate) Business Week's article on IDEO Darwin Magazine's article on IDEO

granted flip design is nowhere as big or as old as IDEo, but still as far as content and "promotional/ad oriented bias" is concerned i don't see the reason for the pages i added to be deleted. i have gone through all the Faqs and help etc. and really don't get what the problem is. anyone? clarify please. is it impossible to have an article about a design firm if they havn't one any awards or don't employ westerners? ( i don't intend to make any accusations of racial bias, but thats the what it looks like to me)

Hi Chaitanya, please go through notability guidelines for companies to decide whether the company meets our notability criteria. Please see the deletion log here. Please dont recreate the article without taking it through our deletion review process.-- Lost^(talk) 07:05, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

thanks, that answers my question for now. chaitanyak 07:14, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It's important to know that at Wikipedia, every article must stand on its own merits. So for good or ill, it doesn't matter how many similar articles have escaped scrutiny, that fact doesn't add to the acceptability of yours (not saying yours is unacceptable). Anchoress 07:31, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Copyright: YouTube?

(First, is there any specialized copyright forum for the English Wikipedia? If there is, I'm glad to take my request there... otherwise:) I've found some info that I wanted to include in an article... but I've found it in an interview that's available from YouTube. Well, YouTube is a) not necessarily completely kosher when it comes to copyright, and can b) potentially delete videos (leading to dead links). So I wonder if references to YouTube videos are generally discouraged? If so, should I simply mention the interview (even though I don't know the date of its screening etc.) without mentioning YouTube? Thanks in advance. --71.232.94.99 08:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia_talk:Copyrights/Can_I_use... would probably be the right place to ask, but I'm not sure how active it is. The copyright should definitely be attributed to its copyright holder rather than YouTube, and you should check to make sure the copyright claimed there is actually genuine; searching for YouTube on Wikipedia gives several results which reference YouTube, so it's possible this is accepted, but I don't know. --ais523 08:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I'll try to figure that out. Just in case I don't get anywhere (i.e. it's illegally on YouTube, I don't find any other reference for the same fact, and I don't find an "authorized" copy or transcript of the original source), would one simply not include the respective fact on Wikipedia? Or should I--knowing that this interview must in fact have taken place, that it was called such-and-such, etc.--simply refer to the interview and leave out the reference to YouTube (even though I actually rely on them)? --71.232.94.99 08:34, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Everything in Wikipedia must be sourced, so avoiding mentioning sources is not an option. However, the source isn't the illegal copy, it's the original broadcast. I think so long as you can identify broadcast details it becomes a source. Notinasnaid 08:49, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

MBTI

Can i get some information on MBTI Do you have booklet Answer sheet Information leaflets cost if completed on-line

Please see MBTI. You wont get any booklets etc here. This is an encyclopedia. -- Lost^(talk) 11:21, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

If you're really looking for this MBTI, just make sure you know what you're using it for. Quite a part of the theory and methodology are rather questionable, the predictive validity is low, its recognition in the academic (read: critical) field mainly restricted to an acknowledgement of what some people can come up with & what marketing can do to cover up for it. The critical section of the Wikipedia article seems to be a good starting point for a critical view, and there are further free sources on the net (just google it). Generally, if you want a hands-on example for "what is out there", fine, the MBTI is quite good enough for that. If you actually want to use the results, however, you may want to look for a more reliable instrument. --Ibn Battuta 17:02, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

how to put up an FM Radio Station in UAE?

If i want to put up my Radio Station in Dubai, what are the procedures to follow? Who will i talk to initially? thankyou ela —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.42.21.75 (talk • contribs)

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions, and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that's what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. -- Lost^(talk) 11:21, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure this editor doesn't want to create an article about the radio station? Anchoress 11:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes looks to me like he wants to open up a radio station in Dubai and wants info regarding that. Anon: if you want to start an article, please get an account first. Then see: Help:Starting a new page. You might also look at Wikipedia:Your first article and Wikipedia:How to write a great article. -- Lost^(talk) 12:02, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

strange image situation

Hi, I uploaded the image Image:ChannakeshavaSomanathapuraPillars.JPG to Wikimedia commons, but accidentally uploaded the wrong image. I then uploaded the image that I wanted. The image appears correctly at Somanathapura, however, if you click on the image, it shows the old version in the en Wikipedia space. However, clicking on this old version, shows the new version again. I did the upload 16 October, and I would have assumed that any changes taht I had made would have propagated through the system by now. Could someone help me correct this, as I have received complaints. Sincerely, --BostonMA ^talk 11:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

• You need to purge the image and/or the article page. — Dark Shikari ^talk/_contribs 11:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi, thank you for the information on wp:purge. I have performed purge several times in the last half hour, but still no change. Thumbnails appear with the correct version, but clicking on the thumbnail brings up a page with the old version. Any more thoughst about what could be wrong? --BostonMA ^talk 12:43, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi BostonMA, why dont you simply get the older version deleted by an admin? That should take care of the problem -- Lost^(talk) 12:57, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Adding immages from Wikipedia Commons

I've found an image in Commons that I would like to add to an article in Wikipedia, but can't see how its done, as reading the image help files all seem refer to images in Wikipedia itself. Can you tell me what I am doing wrong? Thanks Lyswim 12:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

You add it the same way like you would from en. Just link to it in the normal way. See the question just above this one for an example -- Lost^(talk) 12:13, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I did try that honest (LOL) works now, many thanksLyswim 12:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

PHP Edit File

I'm trying to create a new page, but every time I try, instead of getting to the Edit Page page, I get the option to download or open the Index.PHP file.

I use Mozilla Firefox.

I would really appreciate some help on this.

Thanks

Theoutdoorsman

Go to Special:Preferences. In the Editing section untick "Use external editor by default". -- Lost^(talk) 12:20, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

What did I do?????!!!!!?????

hi, I was adding sources to an article I am working on about James Robert Baker and now my references, external links and categories are gone!!!! All the info is still there is you go into edit--it just doesn't show up after the changes are saved. I don't know what I did wrong, and I don't know how to fix it! Help! A panickyJeffpw 14:40, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I have corrected the syntax for you. Please go to the article history and see what I did -- Lost^(talk) 14:43, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Thank you so much for the fix! I was scared to death! You're a hero!Jeffpw 14:44, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Neutral point of view

I am curious why my addition to the Carmax page was deleted for violating the neutral point of view policies.

This is what I added:

Complaints

Visit http://www.ripoffreport.com and search for Carmax for a list of complaints against CarMax. You may find that the 125-point inspection, or the extended warranty is not always what you think. Reports are generally against the service department of the company, but responsiveness from the managers and corporate offices are a big problem with this company as well.

What do i need to do to this to make it acceptable?

thanks 15:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)15:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)24.55.157.208

Criticisms have their place in an article, if they can be sourced to a reliable quote. However, the writing style must be absolutely neutral and clear about who is saying what. If you can tell the opinion of the person writing, then it violates the neutral point of view policy. Rip-off report seems to be some kind of blog, so it would not be acceptable as a reliable source. You'd need something like a newspaper report, motoring magazine, report of a government committee, etc.

As I see it there are two main problems with your edit. The first is that adding "criticisms" of a topic to an article is generally counterproductive and difficult to justify under the NPOV rules. If CarMax is notable for having a lousy customer service reputation, then you can write about it and cite ripoffreport.com as a source. Which is where I see the second problem - after a cursory reading of the site you linked to, it seems to me that ripoffreport.com is hardly a credible source - anyone can whinge and whine about pretty much any topic, this does not constitute a good source.

In general, try to remember that articles should be about X, not other people's opinion of X. — QuantumEleven 16:24, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Musical notation

Is there any yet? —Bromskloss 15:52, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you are asking about - maybe the article on musical notation is what you're looking for. — QuantumEleven 16:17, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Ah, I'm referring to a possibility to include musical notation in wiki articles, similar to how you enter formulas with latex syntax and have them rendered to images. —Bromskloss 17:38, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I think the only way to do so at the moment is to make an image with the musical notation, as far as I know. Sorry. —Keakealani 18:40, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

For the time being that is the case. There is softwear out there that would allow another solution but it has security issues. Certianly I doubt we will see anything untill the new year.Geni 18:43, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Really? Security issues? So you mean that by specially crafting an input file, I can make Lilypond (if that's what you're referring to) do bad things to the computer it runs on? Wierd. How about a sandbox, then? Well, perhaps it's easier to just resolve those security issues instead. —Bromskloss 09:11, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

need mobile viewing agent

What is a URL for accessing wikipedia on a mobile device?

Please see Wapedia -- Lost^(talk) 17:39, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

There are other methods too, according to Wikipedia:WAP access. --ais523 17:42, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

MEDICAL ATTENTION

SIR, I WISH TO KNOW IF I CAN BE TREATED AS I HAVE EYE PROBLEMS. I AM WRITING FROM CAMEROON. KEVIN

Wikipedia is not for medical advice. —Keakealani 18:39, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

deleted stuff

where can i find articles up for deletion

WP:AFD. --Wooty  Woot? | contribs 21:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Odd tidings of blocking evasion

What happens when you get blocked and you are trying to work around it and somehow your Ip changes with out you trying to change it (as if the time for it to change was that very moment) and you start a new account and continue edit? Also, simply, is it possible to unblock your self if you are not an administ.? Because I think it says you do not have Sysop access. -An Ip User wrote this

I'd wager that user would be deemed a sockpuppet and indefinitely blocked. You cannot unblock yourself. --Wooty  Woot? | contribs 21:30, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Vandalized Page

As I was reading this article, I noticed a racist comment on the page that was not supposed to be there.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecclesiology

Can someone fix it?

~Tania

Anyone can edit Wikipedia; you don't have to have an account. That page has been fixed (see its history), but next time, feel free to be bold. :-) --Tkynerd 20:35, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

tranlating

it´s impossible to find a simple button to save my wrote changes in another language for making a simple transtaltion.

im-pos-si-ble

i´m a portuguese speaker, and i want to translate tons of thing for my fellas, but it seems impossible, it´s easy to edit, and terrible to save without crush the original..

can somebody make a simple button next to "save changes" such as "save in another language" or "save as a new page"...

i thing it will help people worldwide...

can somebody answer it to my email

<email address removed to prevent spamming>

tanx babes andy

Including sophisticated translation software into MediaWiki would be relatively useless, I'd wager. More trouble than it's worth. I'm not exactly what you're asking, but please note translation software is hardly accurate. --Wooty  Woot? | contribs 21:27, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

(after edit conflict) I find your post confusing. By clicking save page you are actually changing the text of the article on Wikipedia. Copying text to your computer's clipboard is an entirely other process that is not governed by our software but yours. On most computers you can highlight material, click ctrl+c to save it (our choose copy from your browser functions under file) and then paste the saved material (ctrl+v) to any type of text document or word processing program for translation and modification at your leisure. If you want to see foreign langauge versions of an article, links are provided on the left hand side of the screen. But I do not undertand how "save as a new page" or "save in another language" would work. Can you clarify?--Fuhghettaboutit 21:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

If you wish to work on translating a page, you may find it useful to create a temporary subpage. Ideally this would be attached to your User Page, but you will need to register to do so. (example User:Myname/Sandbox). This lets you play around without affecting the original article. GeeJo ^(t)⁄_(c) • 21:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

When is it Vandelism?

I have just noticed that an entry I wrote has had an image removed by the bot after it was inappropriately tagged by another user - if you look at that users page, he has done this to many other pages too... the other users are fairly polite but rather angry at this behaviour. He quite correctly talks about removing unecessary images but he has not engaged in any discussion and seems to have randomly remove one of several figures on the page. All had the correct licences as I created them and put them there. So, is this "vandelism" in the wiki sense of the word (it is any other usage) and if so, what should one do about it? Of course, because the image has been deleted by the bot, reverting to an older version is not possible and I would need to upload the image again.

Maybe I should just add that my article was about a chemical compound, was not a userpage, was a line diagram with real data that illustrated an important principle.

smmudge

You could bring the deleted image or the deleted images en masse to Wikipedia: Deletion review where the image(s) can be restored if consensus to do so is reached. I would first contact the deleting administrator and simply ask for particular image to be restored, giving the same rationale you provided here. If you know the exact name of the image that was deleted, go to Special:log/delete and search under its name to find out who deleted it. --Fuhghettaboutit 21:45, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for this - the history page shows me the name of the person who marked the image for removal with a tag and then this happened automatically. How does one contact the deleting administrator?

If you found who the administrator was through the deletion log posted above, go to his or her talk page, and make a new post with an appropriate section header.--Fuhghettaboutit 22:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Looking through your contrbutions, I have found the administrator for you—it was User:Quadell. The deletion log entry is here.--Fuhghettaboutit 22:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

having trouble correcting an entry

After hearing the recent flurry of attention on how Wikipedia is self correcting, I mentioned it in passing to my brother who complained that his own entry was incorrect and could I fix it? Apparently the entry says he was born in 1958, when in fact it was 1959! I tried correcting it and couldn't. Can you help? Thanks. My brother's name is: George Yancopoulos.

Fixed it. That article needs a lot of cleanup. Wonder why you couldn't fix it though? --Wooty  Woot? | contribs 21:41, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

AFD Question

Curious, I'm begginning to get involved in AFD, and can someone please tell me what exactly happens after the discussion? I know the first steps; nom, discuss, but I need to know what happens once the discussion is over. Thanks. DoomsDay349 Happy Halloween! 23:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Generally, an admin will determine if consensus has been met one way or another. They will weigh not only the "votes", but who is giving them and why. They then close it, deleting the article or not, depending on how it went. See Wikipedia:Deletion_process#Articles_for_Deletion_page. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 23:23, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Alright, thanks. I was a bit confused by some comments my peers have made but get the gist of it now. Where I'd be without this help desk, God only knows... DoomsDay349 Happy Halloween! 23:30, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

editing

How do you put pictures on a Wikipedia page?

Eggson 23:40, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It's a fairly easy task, but there are a few key variables to control (size, location, caption). I'd suggest reading up at Wikipedia:Extended image syntax. Hyenaste ^(tell) 01:09, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Images need to be uploaded to the Wikipedia servers before they can be used on a page. If you need help with this, you can read up on it at Wikipedia:Uploading images. Also, Wikipedia:Picture tutorial has a slightly briefer overview of the syntax for inserting images if Hyenaste's link was a bit too complicated for you. — QuantumEleven 07:18, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Attribution for IP edits after creating account

I created an account after contributing to the talk category "Armies". I would like that article to be attributed to me. How can I make this happen?—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Richard D. Turner (talk • contribs) .

Make a section on your userpage for articles you have created/worked on. If you'd like to claim ownership in the article itself under your account name, the next time you make a useful change to the article you can leave an edit summary such as "note: previous edits by ip address 1234556789 were by me." Note though that this does lower your privacy under the new account significantly.--Fuhghettaboutit 23:54, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Also, if you have a dynamic IP address (eg if you access the internet through AOL) then this won't work, as any one IP address will be shared between many different people. — QuantumEleven 07:16, 31 October 2006 (UTC)