The Arts and Entertainment Work Group is a working group of members of the Biography WikiProject dedicated to ensuring quality and coverage of biography articles.
Biography (arts and entertainment) articles by quality and importance
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William Ely Hill (1887-1962) - Illustrator, created artwork for the book covers for F. Scott Fitzgerald and had a regular entry in the New York tribune along with being published on numerous occasions.
The general outline and collection has been started, but if you would like to expand and organize a discipline, here's what you do. Right below the page heading for the discipline insert this: {{subst:Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography/Work groups/Division banner}} and save. This will put a rough outline together for you and then you can edit it to conform to your area. See Writers and critics below for an example. If your project grows large enough where it's taking up a good portion of this page, you should probably move it to a subpage of this page.
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Jubileeclipman (talk·contribs) I am interested in taking on UK celebrities with articles that are stubs or otherwise non-standard. Entirely rewrote Fearne Cotton to raise standard and remove fansite tag. I am working on Holly Willoughby which was merely a list plus trivia. Will also work on musicians, all genre, living or dead.
I have carried out WP:BEFORE on this article about an artist, and not found any references from reliable, independent sources to add. I do not see that he meets WP:GNG, WP:ANYBIO or WP:ARTIST. NB an earlier version of the article says the artist has worked on cover art for sci-fi books, so have sorted this in to that category. Tacyarg (talk) 21:50, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - This illustrator does not meet WP criteria for inclusion per GNG ANYBIO, BASIC nor NARTIST. A "before" search revealed sources for an economist who shares the same name (who actually may be notable per WP guidelines), however this François Vaillancourt is non-notable. Netherzone (talk) 23:41, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Main reason is that the subject fails all 4 criteria of WP:ARTIST and the article reads like a Vanity page with the addition of the website and specific details such as "Agbro focuses on non-verbal communication and the idea that everyone presents themselves within a system" which is taken from non-independent/bias non-reliable references (museum which exposed the work of the subject). The subject fails WP:NBIO with lacking significant coverage WP:SIGCOV. Lekkha Moun (talk) 14:39, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - It is TOOSOON for this artist to have an encyclopedia article because they do not yet have the professional track record of reviews, articles about their work, chapters in art history books, museum or national gallery collections, etc. that is required. The work is beautiful however all of the exhibitions are at non-notable venues, except the Bainbridge Island Museum, which is a small regional museum. Fails both GNG and NARTIST, and does not meet NCREATIVE 4b criteria at this time; perhaps in a few more years after more critical attention is received. A "significant exhibition" would be at a venue like the Venice Bienniale, Whitney Biennial, Documenta, the Carnegie International. In the previous deletion discussion, WomenArtistUpdates provided an excellent source assessment summary table why this does not meet GNG. It does not seem like much changed in the article since then other than formatting. Netherzone (talk) 21:30, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wasn't able to find significant coverage of the subject in reliable sources and what's linked in the article doesn't establish notability. There isn't significant coverage of the group in Freax: The Brief History of the Demoscene, Volume 1 (2005) by Tamás Polgár [hu], only a single mention. One can find mentions elsewhere, like in this Tivi (magazine) [fi]article. According to a licentiate thesis, "Kurki (2002, p.57–62) used Moppi Productions as
a case example when discussing developing visual styles", but I wasn't able to access the work. toweli (talk) 12:33, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NOTDICT, and the term is nearly self-explanatory to anyone who knows what "estate" means. Newly-added references are not about estate jewelry as a distinct concept but different examples of the term being used in different contexts. WeirdNAnnoyed (talk) 01:28, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom, just a (bad) dictdef. The existence of attestations that show that sometimes, jewelry is sold at estate sales, means nothing for notability. The definitions in the sources are different as well. Walsh90210 (talk) 22:33, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was only able to find mentions and brief descriptions (<100 words) of the subject in reliable sources (such as by searching "filetype:pdf "Kosmic Free Music Foundation" " on Google). The article doesn't link to anything that would establish notability. toweli (talk) 08:00, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You must not have been on the internet in the mid 1990s. Back then, "reliable sources" would not be covering what they individuals were doing in the online music community. 75.3.240.177 (talk) 04:55, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Arts and Entertainment Work Group - Writers and critics
The Arts and Entertainment Work Group - Writers and critics is a working group of members of the Biography WikiProject dedicated to ensuring quality and coverage of biography articles.
Related Projects
Since biographies are potentially under the purview of almost all WikiProjects, it is important that we work in tandem with these projects. Also, when seeking collaboration on articles, don't neglect to approach WikiProjects that are part of the geographical region your subject is/was in.
Related Portals
Increase the exposure of our work group by nominating our articles for their Portal FA and DYKs. Of course, don't forget the main portal, Portal:Arts
Keep I have already added more references to this article to show notability. She has been written about in the Australian press with some brief bios in those articles. She advised the Federal Government and argued for innovative labour policies for women long before they were legislated by government such as paid maternity leave, flexible working hours, better access to child care. I will add more to her article later.LPascal (talk) 06:10, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Appears to fail WP:GNG & WP:NAUTHOR. Most sources were either WP:INTERVIEWS or simply do not establish notability. Did not find any independent reliable sources. The article itself is very promotional, and was majorly written by individuals using SPAs with a COI that are closely tied to the subject. If article is kept, it will need a major rewrite. ⁂CountHacker (talk) 08:45, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I disagree. Given that his work with Lockley, controversial as it is in both sides of the Pacific at the moment, is known enough to establish notability as authors of such work, so I suggest we keep this and Thomas Lockley. --Jnglmpera (talk) 13:57, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: In a Newsbank database search (deeper and wider than Google) I found many articles by her but few about her, insufficient to meet WP:ANYBIO,WP:AUTHOR or WP:PROF (in her capacity as a Gladstone regional historian). She seems to be a WP:RTM Gladstone regional journalist. Cabrils (talk) 01:22, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have carried out WP:BEFORE on this article about a writer of speculative fiction. I have found and added one reference, but it is either an interview or an article by a friend (named author who introduces the article, but the bulk of it is by Jessup). The article already references the Encyclopedia of Science Fiction, which I think is a reliable source, but as the only reference which demonstrates notability I don't think it's fully evidenced. The article only needs a couple of reviews from reliable sources to meet WP:NAUTHOR, but I haven't been able to find any. Unless anyone else can, I don't think the article meets WP:GNG, WP:ANYBIO, or WP:NAUTHOR. Tacyarg (talk) 20:31, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
bro what's the problem with this article. Even in bangla Wikipedias many article is hasn't valid references or local news reference. Unfortunately some article delete by national newspapers so I provided local daily newspapers reference so where is the problem? So I reference it Daily kalantor news and they approved as well they make infobox I just edit and upgrade everything properly, that's it. Antu Official (talk) 06:48, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
bro what's the problem with this article. Even in bangla Wikipedias many article is hasn't valid references or local news reference. Unfortunately some article delete by national newspapers so I provided local daily newspapers reference so where is the problem? So I reference it Daily kalantor news and they approved as well they make infobox I just edit and upgrade everything properly, that's it. Antu Official (talk) 06:48, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
if you search "দৈনিক আজকের সাতক্ষীরা পত্রিকার নির্বাহী সম্পাদক জাহাঙ্গীর আলম কবীর " you guys get news references and I agree one or two are national newspapers. But if you are watch deeply so you guys get name 'দৈনিক আজকের সাতক্ষীরা পত্রিকার নির্বাহী সম্পাদক জাহাঙ্গীর আলম কবির or দৈনিক আজকের সাতক্ষীরা পত্রিকার নির্বাহী সম্পাদক জাহাঙ্গীর আলম কবীর' into all article . And the main fact is you guys always delete this article and removing with out using common sense. Antu Official (talk) 06:49, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
bro what's the problem with this article. Even in bangla Wikipedias many article is hasn't valid references or local news reference. Unfortunately some article delete by national newspapers so I provided local daily newspapers reference so where is the problem? So I reference it Daily kalantor news and they approved as well they make infobox I just edit and upgrade everything properly, that's it.
if you search "দৈনিক আজকের সাতক্ষীরা পত্রিকার নির্বাহী সম্পাদক জাহাঙ্গীর আলম কবীর " you guys get news references and I agree one or two are national newspapers. But if you are watch deeply so you guys get name 'দৈনিক আজকের সাতক্ষীরা পত্রিকার নির্বাহী সম্পাদক জাহাঙ্গীর আলম কবির or দৈনিক আজকের সাতক্ষীরা পত্রিকার নির্বাহী সম্পাদক জাহাঙ্গীর আলম কবীর' into all article . And the main fact is you guys always delete this article and removing with out using common sense Antu Official (talk) 06:50, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm nominating this page for deletion again because the initial discussion lacked sufficient engagement and the sources provided were inadequate in both quality and quantity. There's a notable absence of substantial coverage of Imre Vallyon, his work, or his organisation in multiple reliable secondary sources. Meeting notability criteria typically requires presenting at least three such sources. The article from Stuff, while primarily focused on his legal issues, appears to be the only source that meets these criteria. Without it, the page is mostly information sourced by primary sources and a list of his self published books and ebooks.
In terms of Vallyon's notability as a writer, the two book reviews presented by Oaktree b in the previous discussion are clearly poor sources, as they seem to be paid content from freelance writers on unreliable websites. Additionally, Vallyon does not meet the criteria for notability as a criminal according to Wikipedia guidelines on crime perpetrators, despite the only significant coverage of him focusing on his legal issues. His organisation, FHL, does not seem to meet the notability standards either. Ynsfial (talk) 16:55, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment for Ynsfial - it seems pointless making multiple attempts to have this article deleted as the previous Afd covered the arguments in sufficient depth. I suggest you look at the deletion review process if you consider there is an issue. NealeWellington (talk) 10:13, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, deletion review is the wrong avenue here. It was a no consensus close, and closed over 2 months ago. It is perfectly fine to bring it back for another look. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 13:59, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes i created a new account as per the advice of Geoffrey Lane-i was following the instructions step by step from his reply to Wikipedia Volunteer Response Team Re: [Ticket#2024071110029918] Request to delete page about me Jonnybenjamin (talk) 07:07, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I have corrected the link; it previously linked to a non-existent article. Please confirm this is the correct link. --Un assiolo (talk) 19:31, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect and protect so it can’t be undone. We don’t need this amount of sensitive personal information about a living person. Mccapra (talk) 20:51, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fails WP: N. The sourcing on the article is almost entirely primary, and what secondary sources do exist are either not independent or do not cover the subject in depth. I also couldn't find any sources to establish notability either, unfortunately. HyperAccelerated (talk) 15:29, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Weak delete. There are a lot of almost but not quite bits here. I found this on the academic deletion sorting list but he appears not to be primarily an academic and although he has one workshop publication with triple-digit citations [13] the rest do not give him a strong enough citation record for WP:PROF#C1. He has one book, Virtual Body Language, for which I didn't find any reviews; I would need multiple reviews of multiple books to consider notability through WP:AUTHOR. The article as nominated contains no WP:GNG-passing sources. The best I found in my searches was [14], a local newspaper story from 2015 about a startup he founded with some depth of coverage of Ventrella himself. I did also find one group work in MoMA that he contributed to, not enough by itself for WP:ARTIST. We could consider a redirect, if we had a viable redirect target, but neither There (virtual world) nor Gene Pool (software) currently look viable to me. —David Eppstein (talk) 20:19, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: The AfD from 2007 actually got it (mostly) right, there was no coverage about the individual despite hundreds of hits... In the almost 20 yrs since, I can only find primary sourcing or a few social media sites. Source 21 in the article is the only RS, the rest aren't anything we'd use to build an article with. Oaktree b (talk) 22:39, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy delete: The creator and the only contributor has been CU-blocked. The page should have been protected from IPs removing the speedy deletion tag until it would be reviewed. I'm not sure if this was recreated here and merits salt, but in the Simple English Wikipedia, it was deleted for 4 times and salted twice: [15]Aintabli (talk) 10:37, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Aintabli: You may be right, but Ponyo, the CU who made the blocks, did not say what other accounts, if any, had been used, so it's impossible for mere mortals such as you and me to know whether a block was being evaded at the time when the article was created. JBW (talk) 10:18, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. (1) I checked the cited sources, with the aid of Google translate, as I can't read Persian. At least one of them is on a site selling Rakan Daqar's work, and at least one of them is on a site which describes itself as a "public relations" site. None of them gives substantially more information about Rakan Daqar than the fact that his books have been published. (2) In case there are good sources out there which haven't been cited in the article, I searched for information on Google, using the Persian form of Rakan Daqar's name. I found more of the same kind of thing, plus the Wikipedia article, Facebook, a blog, etc. In short, I was unable to find any substantial coverage of him anywhere, in any kind of source, reliable or otherwise. JBW (talk) 10:13, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would like to add that the subject has received virtually no coverage in reliable sources. Based on the contents of the article, such as using the subject's personal website as a source numerous times and directing the reader to articles archived on the subject's personal website, it was possibly created as a result of self-promotion. Floralbergamot (talk) 20:39, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Not quite notable activist, coverage is mostly in articles she's written, or stuff about spats she's having with one person or another...[16]. I don't see notability with a lack of sourcing as well. Oaktree b (talk) 00:04, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. I created the prior deletion proposal for this article when I came across it and it was poorly sourced, mostly with links to the subject’s blog, and seemed very likely an act of self-promotion. The deletion proposal was not accepted at that time, and so I have tried to improve the quality of this page with biographical information on her background and education. Even then I have had to rely on primary sources, such as the subject’s answers in interviews for a non-peer reviewed community history project. I still believe the subject falls very short of Wikipedia’s standards of notability for, which are very clear. The closest the subject comes to notability is authoring two chapters in a self-published book with other non-notable individuals. Wikipedia’s notability standard for academics is for those who have made an outstanding contribution. Outside of the academy, none of her activity meets the basic criteria for notable people. QueerRigor (talk) 21:03, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The linked Evergreen Review podcast averages under 100 listens per episode. The episode interviewing the subject has only amassed 550 listens in the three years since it was published.
Both it and the Hypocrite Reader piece are interviews. Such primary sources, per the notability standard, “may be used to support content in an article, but they do not contribute toward proving the notability of a subject.” QueerRigor (talk) 23:48, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No evidence of notability, warning has been in place for over 7 years. I cannot find sources to indicate notability has been attained since the last nomination in 2011, which was closed as no consensus. glman (talk) 18:43, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Weak delete: Rather prolific author and is talked about a ton in the religious media, but a distinct lack of book reviews in "mainstream" media (for lack of a better word). This [17] review in religious media is typical... Some scattered mentions here [18] or [19]. We'd need more of these last two types of sources for this to have a chance to be notable here. Was hoping this would pass AUTHOR. Oaktree b (talk) 00:15, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. I have added another reference which squeezes him over the line on WP:GNG. But the Google scholar citations are actually pretty good, including 98 for Tactics. StAnselm (talk) 23:13, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. His books appear to be self-published but that would be ok if there were reliably published reviews of them. I couldn't find any. The sources in the article now include a book review, but of someone else's book and mentioning Ferris only in passing. The only in-depth source that we have is a local-news obituary, appearing to be a family-written obituary rather than a work of independent journalism. That's not enough. —David Eppstein (talk) 17:33, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Are you telling me that the book Métis and the Medicine Line: Creating a Border and Dividing a People, with the author listed as Michel Hogue on the cover, is really by Kade Ferris? Because that is the book whose review I was referring to. —David Eppstein (talk) 00:20, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@David Eppstein Right. I clocked that the first time I read your comment, but the second time I read it, I read it the other way. I can add the other book reviews (of his book) and also quote from at least one other book I found. Cielquiparle (talk) 05:26, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. I see that the review in American Indian Children's Literature got removed from the article as a source. I am adding it back. While the site itself could be construed as a blog, the reason this particular blog qualifies as a reliable source per WP:BLOGS, is that it is produced by Debbie Reese, who is an established subject-matter expert, whose work in the relevant field has previously been published by reliable, independent publications. Cielquiparle (talk) 05:47, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - I expanded it to include more about the impact of his tribal history preservation work and the impact that has on reservations, ND and MN educational standards and added information about his mapping skills. oncamera (talk page)08:59, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
His written work as an author and oral traditions that he embedded within his maps, blogs, and recorded videos for the state of North Dakota established notability. He was a respected tribal historian and elder knowledge keeper and professional work reflects that. oncamera (talk page)21:07, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The article has now been puffed up with some 30 footnotes, most of which do not seem to be the sort of in-depth independent and reliably-published coverage of the subject that could be used to pass WP:GNG. Of the ones that actually mention Ferris or his works in their title, "Kade Ferris's Gift" is an interview (not usually counted as independent), the Red Lake Nation News obituary reads like a family-written obituary (not independent), the Mendoza book review is in a blog (not reliably published), Teachings of Our Elders is by him not about him, and Archaeologist presents has no depth of coverage of Ferris. Perhaps, per WP:THREE, advocates of keeping the article could save us the effort of similarly evaluating all 30 of the footnotes and point us to three sources that are actually in-depth, independent, and reliably-published? I'm looking for a small number of high-quality sources, at most three, not many low-quality sources. —David Eppstein (talk) 23:16, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Strong keep. This article was already extremely well cited, but I added an infobox and a little bit more. His notability stems from his tribal historic preservation work which is interdisciplinary (history, anthropology, archaeology, policy making, language advocacy, etc.) Yuchitown (talk) 16:34, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can you please address the discussion above about lack of high-quality sourcing, rather than merely asserting that "This article was already extremely well cited" when clearly it isn't? It has many sources but that misses the point. We need a small number of high-quality sources, and continuing to add larger numbers of low-quality sources only makes notability harder to discern by hiding the good sources in a big pile of dross. It would be better to remove both the low-quality sources and the material sourced to them so that we can focus on the essentials. The sources you added (his own dissertation and a web page about someone else that mentions him in passing) do not contribute to notability according to Wikipedia's standards for notability, which are not based on the work the subject might have done but rather on the depth of coverage of the subject in sources that are independent of him and meet Wikipedia's standards for reliable publication. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:55, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't appreciate the suggestion that tribal newspapers are "low-quality sources." Like I wrote, his notability is based on being a THPO, so it's interdisciplinary. He was not just a writer. While several pieces (Red Lake Nation News, Minnesota Native News) focus on him specifically, even if these didn't exist, Wikipedia:Notability (people) states: If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability. He has contributed "part of the enduring historical record" of the Métis people. Yuchitown (talk) 02:06, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tribal newspapers are as reliable as any other newspaper. But when a local newspaper (tribal or not) runs an obituary that reads like the sort of obituary written by a family member to announce a death, rather than the kind of obituary that major newspapers write themselves when famous people die, it doesn't count much towards notability. For one thing, if it is indeed written by family, it is not an independent source. —David Eppstein (talk) 06:06, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
.... even if these didn't exist, Wikipedia:Notability (people) states: "If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability". He has contributed "part of the enduring historical record" of the Métis people. Yuchitown (talk) 13:55, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
So much a part of the enduring historical record that the only Wikilink to him from any other article is a an unsourced sentence about him in an article about a village in Lebanon, stating that he is also of Lebanese descent, something that appears nowhere in the Kade Ferris article itself? —David Eppstein (talk) 19:10, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If that's an issue to you, you can help expand topics on Turtle Mountain, the Ojibwe or Metis history and credit/wikilink his article from those edits. Wikipedia needs more editors in that area. oncamera (talk page)10:27, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I definitely think the Métis have an interesting history that deserves to be better-known, but I have no special expertise in that area, and I have even less knowledge of Turtle Mountain or the Ojibwe.
Incidentally, I can find no evidence that Kade Ferris had any connection to Lebanon, outside of a few unreliable web sources. I have removed the link to him from the Lebanese village article. His mother was from Minnesota and his father was originally from the Turtle Mountain Reservation. I suspect his father, Albert Ferris, may have some notability as an artist. —David Eppstein (talk) 19:14, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - I just came across this AfD and don't entirely feel experienced enough with guidelines to vote either way, but I'd like to note that Ferris' work on map decolonization and geographic technologies (as THPO for the Red Lake Nation) was significant enough that he gave a full-fledged presentation at the Council for Minnesota Archaeology's 2023 annual conference, entitled "Creating a Virtual Database for Regional Tribal Resource Management and Consultation". I don't know if, for example, a program (with an abstract of his talk) from the conference (the most important one on Minnesota archaeology, as far as I know) would count towards GNG, but I do have such a document if uploading it somewhere could prove useful. Thanks. SunTunnels (talk) 21:41, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think that giving a lecture or presentation at a conference is a stand-out event. Doing that is an ordinary part of an academic's job. The only exceptions would be instances where being selected to give the lecture is itself a high honor, like when a national academic society invites someone to do the Annual So-and-so Memorial Lecture. That can be an indication that the field regards the person's work as particularly important. XOR'easter (talk) 21:02, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Please address the question of notability per cited sources. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Owen×☎15:52, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
False. There are still zero WP:GNG-contributing sources: sources that provide in-depth content about Ferris, are written independently of their subjects, and are reliably published. None of the previous keep comments have even attempted to address those requirements of GNG. —David Eppstein (talk) 19:59, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Strong Keep - Kade Ferris was a distinguished archaeologist, anthropologist and historian, one of the first Indigenous archaeologists in the U.S. I've made some improvements, including adding a book review and an obit in an academic journal. He clearly meets criterion #2 of WP:ANYBIO, WP:BASIC and also nows meet GNG. As an aside, I find it really quite odd that the nominator would assume that It seems this page was made by friends of the article's subject especially given the fact that such a new editor, with only 40 total edits (the majority of which were to the article or this AfD) would make such a comment. I guess I'm also a little curious how they learned by their 20th edit how to produce an AfD so quickly. Nominator, do you yourself have a connection to the subject of the article and why would you make such a statement? Netherzone (talk) 17:50, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Reviewed during NPP. No evidence of wp:notability under SNG or GNG. None of the sources are about him. Sources (and much of the content) are about taitrs. Material on him is just resume type material. North8000 (talk) 17:33, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's hard to answer with respect to what you are seeing because there have been 104 edits to the article since I nominated this. But I did evaluate them at the time. North8000 (talk) 18:52, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, a lot was added after you nominated this, including several refs, but much of it was WP:PROMO, fluff, repetition, and stuff about the genre of theatre that, I think, has no direct relevance to D'Lima's career. I tried to reduce the promo, cruft, repetition and tangential stuff, but someone else should review the refs to see if they actually discuss Liima's life or career at all. -- Ssilvers (talk) 23:10, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Relisting to assess new additions to the article since it's nomination. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, LizRead!Talk!23:29, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Article does not meet WP:GNG and WP:JOURNALIST. Subject did receive an award Ramnath Goenka Award for Excellence in Journalism. Source 1 is a book review, source 2 is a blog, source 3 has a passing comment made by the subject himself, source 4 is a review by subject himself, source 5 is a bio written by subject himself, source 6 is more on bio written by subject himself, source 7 is a link to Ramnath Goenka Award and source 8 is a book written by subject himself. Many unreliable and primary sources here. Draftify would be an option to improve the page with secondary independent sources and remove primary sources like the reviews by the subject himself and the interview with the subject.RangersRus (talk) 15:39, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
TOI makes it under WP:NEWSORGINDIA. I still do not find his books a significant monument or been a substantial part of a significant exhibition or won wide significant critical attention by well known peers and critics in secondary independent sources. RangersRus (talk) 18:49, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
TOI falling under NEWSORGINDIA is an interpretation that I respect but with which I disagree in this case (not great journalism but not simply unreliable). The fact that the author of the book is one of the film critics of the Hindustan Times also indicates the article in the TOI should be rather independent.-- -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank)19:53, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Mushy Yank: The article from TOI doesn't look like a review at all; it seems more like a promotional piece or an announcement. Additionally, the article was published by PTI. I don't think he meets WP:AUTHOR. GrabUp - Talk16:12, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note about the Times of India: The Sources noticeboard says not to use it for political subject matters for example, which the Indian task force clarifies: "Uncontroversial content such as film reviews are usable". Consensus is that concern about retributed coverage exists, but not to the point of making it unreliable. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank)19:50, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed, I should have mentioned that I hapeen to have been the creator of this page many years back. I actually didn't even remember I was the one who created it, as I've created numerous pages for notable Indian film critics. As someone who has worked on Indian cinema-related articles, I can attest to the relevance of his reviews on dozens of film articles, including several FAs. Him being an author as well as the winner of a notable award only consolidates my position. Shahid • Talk2me18:34, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Interviews are considered primary non-independent source. Independent sources helps to fairly portray the subject, without undue attention to the subject's own views. If you use interviews as source for any statement made by the subject then the subject's statements needs to be cited with secondary independent source as well. Wikipedia:Independent sources. RangersRus (talk) 14:19, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: I am not convinced that he meets any notability criteria. He fails WP:ANYBIO, as the award is not exclusive, with more than 20 people receiving it. Receiving the award first or last does not make it exceptional or add to notability. Regarding WP:AUTHOR, The Times of India is not a review, merely a short promotional or announcement piece with no author, published by the Press Trust of India (PTI), therefore, it does not meet WP:AUTHOR criteria. The person does not meet the General Notability Guideline, which is already known. Also, I don't understand how interviews with celebrities establish notability. GrabUp - Talk09:41, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note to Closer. Keep votes are more focused on the subject's notability because of an award (not national award) but there is no argument on the unreliability of the sources on the page that are blogs, interviews with no secondary sources as attribution and self written reviews by the subject himself and part of WP:NEWSORGINDIA. Two keep votes consider him notable but have no argument as to why and the two other keep vote (including the creator of the page) do not have opinion on the argument about the page and the unreliable sources that fails WP:GNG. I think the page is at best Delete but Draftify is also an option if there is any scope of improvement with secondary independent reliable sources. If this page stays a keep, then likely it opens a Pandora box to use unreliable sources like blogs and interviews and self published reviews on other pages or newly generated pages. RangersRus (talk) 22:51, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I really don’t understand why they are not providing good arguments for their Keep votes. It looks like @Atlantic306 is just here to go along with the majority. The question raises because how can he call it a ‘national award’? Additionally, they are posting low effort delete votes and not giving any counterarguments, which raises some questions in my mind. GrabUp - Talk02:08, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In the UK and US a national award means it relates to the scope of a whole country not that it is given by the government. For example the Oscars and Grammy Awards are national awards that are given by private organisations, imv Atlantic306 (talk) 13:21, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The award is not exclusive enough to establish notability. Every year, more than 20 people receive the award. Are they also notable for this award? I don’t think so. GrabUp - Talk16:06, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Zero references to establish notability. After searching, found other people of same name, but no comprehensive, in-depth coverage of this specific person. PROD removed 27 June 2024; PROD reverted 27 October 2022; PROD on 27 October 2022; Created on 27 August 2014. JoeNMLC (talk) 14:59, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Not eligible for Soft Deletion. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, LizRead!Talk!15:53, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment The Azerbajani article gives 1 reference: "Tamxil Ziyəddinoğlu, "Hafiz Baxış-80". Bütöv Azərbaycan qəzeti, №36(168), 17-23 oktyabr 2012-ci il." This appears to be an article in a reasonable news source. I can't find it but I think he may have significant coverage. Mrfoogles (talk) 16:36, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
FA
A
GA
