Talk:Indian Institute of Management Lucknow

Indian Institute of Management Lucknow has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
October 11, 2012	Good article nominee	Listed

Lucknow Top‑importance

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India: Uttar Pradesh / Education Mid‑importance

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Higher education

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It's "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow"[edit]

... and not "Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow". The word "Lucknow" forms part of the name, and there is no comma that separates it from "Indian Institute of Management".

This is incorrect per Wikipedia:UNIGUIDE#College_and_university_articles. -- DanielKlotz (talk · contribs) 02:06, 31 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Disagree. IIMs are not really part of a university system (unlike the University of California for example), they are all independent institutes which are not affiliated to any common university. Except for the fact that their names are similar and they are all public institutes ultimately run by the HRD Ministry in India, there is no connection. The name of the institute is not dependent on the name of the city - for example, IIM Calcutta's name was not changed to "IIM Kolkata" when the city's name was changed. Aurorion (talk) 09:40, 31 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

OK. This should be changed in the info box, too. But, why does their official website usecthe comma? -- DanielKlotz (talk · contribs) 10:57, 31 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Good question. Maybe Anbu121 can shed some light on this. The websites of most other IIMs do not have the comma: IIM-C, IIM-B, IIM-K.

globalize[edit]

Should we claim that Manfest is one of the best in India or should we rather place it somewhere between the events of the best b schools like harvard, standford etc? Students here are undoubtedly the best in corpo india. how about the world?doles 13:44, 18 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

That question is moot now as someone has NPOV'd the whole thing out of existence. So I've removed the globalize tag. Need to start from scratch now. --Ravikiran 19:23, 4 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Have removed a lot of other NPOV matter like "best infrastructure among the world's B-schools. The page has been marked for speedy deletion. Someone please check my edits and remove the notice if the speedy deletion criteria is no longer met. kapitanniemand 21:34, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:IIML.jpg[edit]

Image:IIML.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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Fair use rationale for Image:FAUNA - 1.JPG[edit]

Image:FAUNA - 1.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 05:28, 5 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:DRAGON IIML2.JPG[edit]

Image:DRAGON IIML2.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 09:34, 5 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Secondary sources[edit]

The article does not contain any secondary reliable sources. Kindly add the same as unreferenced statements can be deleted. Wireless Fidelity Class One (talk 18:59, 11 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have a direct conflict of Interest about having added Amitabh Thakur's name among noted Alumni but I strongly feel that he has enough credentials to deserve a place there. Let someone else make the final decision. nutanthakurlkoNutanthakurlko (talk) 02:51, 3 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Caution; removing copy vio, unreferenced/promotional statements[edit]

I am in the process of searching for reliable sources and placing information only if the same is validated by reliable sources. As my previous request to the editors of the page was not responded to, I have removed all information that is without sourcing. Some of it also had copy violation issues directly from IIM Lucknow blog sites. Kindly do not copy paste material from the net. If there's an exceptional claim, kindly add that only after you have ensured that the claim is backed by reliable sources. Beyond that, you could follow some of the work that I shall initiate on the page and learn how to add reliable sources and how to paraphrase statements. If you require any support whatsoever, please feel free to write to me on my talk page. Kind regards. Wifione _.......^{Leave a message} 16:43, 23 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Neutral Point of View[edit]

I am a student of IIM Lucknow. If you find any of my edits to this article as biased or not written from a neutral point of view, please notify me or make appropriate changes yourself. --Anbu121 (talk me) 09:35, 2 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I don't find anything biased in this article. In fact, I think it's rather well-written. However - since you say you are student at IIM Lucknow - could you verify the first section of this discussion page, i.e., the official name of the institute? From what I know, some other IIMs like Calcutta, Bangalore, etc. are named as "Indian Institute of Management Calcutta", "Indian Institute of Management Bangalore", etc. Is this the case with IIM Lucknow as well? I know that whoever made the section here claims that it is "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow" - but the contact section on IIM Lucknow's website gives the name of the institute as just "Indian Institute of Management", followed by the address with "Lucknow" in it. The logo on the left of the website also says "Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow". So which is correct? "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow" or "Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aurorion (talk • contribs) 20:50, 2 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

All the official documents say "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow". Even the official logo does not contain comma. The website development was outsourced and hence the inconsistency. --Anbu121 (talk me) 22:56, 2 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Reliable sources[edit]

In good faith towards Anbu's self disclosure and his request to me on his talk page, I've removed the COI tag. I suggest we proceed step by step. First the lead section.

It is also engaged in Research and consultancy work with a focus on socially relevant projects: Please provide valid sources to support this statement. MSN is not a reliable source.
Major festivals organised by the institute includes Manfest (Business Conclave), INDEX (Market Research Fair) and Varchasva (Sports and Cultural Festival).: Please provide reliable sources that confirm these are major festivals. If the sources are given within the article, just mention the links here as I'm proceeding sequentially so have not cross-linked the refs.
Admission to the programs is done through Common Admission Test (CAT): Can you provide a reliable source please? Even an institute's source will do in this case; but the source has to mention which programs exactly use the CAT.

Once we've addressed these issues, I'll move to the next sections. Thanks. Wifione ^Message 06:26, 3 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

References have been added and CAT is moved to separate sub section --Anbu121 (talk me) 09:27, 5 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Anbu, can you please show your reference links here? Please point out which reference are you using to substantiate which statement from the above. For example, your Yahoo link simply shows the opinion of Mr. Devi Singh from IIM Lucknow. That is a self-published statement which should not be used to make a definitive statement. Therefore, till you show such details, I am reformatting the lead. Also, I see no references that support the fact that the festivals being organised are major festivals. If they are festivals, they can be mentioned below in the article, not necessarily in the lead. I'll await your references. Thanks. Wifione ^Message 19:02, 5 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I think its OK to remove the festivals from the lead. There are many sources for the social relevancy statement, but all of them quote the IIML's press release. I am searching for an independent source--Anbu121 (talk me) 11:09, 6 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I couldn't get independent secondary source for that statement. Lets move on. --Anbu121 (talk me) 21:33, 15 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

History section[edit]

I've changed the statements to match exactly what is given in the citations provided. If you feel anything has been missed out, do mention. Thanks. Wifione ^Message 19:20, 5 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have added the missed out part.--Anbu121 (talk me) 11:09, 6 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comments[edit]

I haven't really worked on article assessments, but how about the following:

Try Tony1's redundancy excercises. They'll help you weed out unrequired stuff.

An example of how it will help: During the initial days, due to its remoteness, ~~the~~ students used to walk to the Highway-bypass Junction, which had a milestone saying "IIM Lucknow 3.4 km", to buy amenities and to hang out.
Try to avoid using commas if the sentence is perfectly correct even without them.

Giri institute of developmental studies: shouldn't this be "Giri Institute of Developmental Studies" ?
Maybe add the sanskrit (devanagari) for the building names? (I'm not sure what the policy on this is.)
5 reading halls with seating capacity for 250 people --> each hall has 250 capacity, right? State that.
E-Journals, E-Databases --> check if WP:CAPS says this should be lower or upper case
Check grammar and spelling in general

Done. --Anbu121 (talk me) 11:25, 17 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

Most of the sources are primary sources. The material that is referenced from these sources is not necessarily fact. For example: "is located in an isolated serene area". How can I be sure that the area is "serene"?

Looking at the sources it seems that books have been forgotten. Books are a great source of information and referencing, and people are bound to have written books on IIML. The only job is to find them and use them as references. Google books should be helpful in that.

All in all, this article needs lots of good references (which shouldn't be too tough to find), and some redundancy, spelling, grammar checks.

Articles from National newspapers used as secondary sources.Could not find books. --Anbu121 (talk me) 11:25, 17 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

PS:As an exception, "Referred to as 'Hel(L)' by the students,[5] the rigorous lifestyle at IIM Lucknow is packed with academics, extracurriculars and entertainment." seems a clear (student) POV to me.--Siddhartha Ghai (talk) 04:11, 12 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Changed. --Anbu121 (talk me) 11:25, 17 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Anbu, please do not comment between the comments left by another editor. It confuses the reader completely. Right now, it's completely unclear which comments have been left by the previous editor and which by you above. I've tagged the article as being based on self-published sources. I'll suggest that make a good attempt to find reliable sources, otherwise remove the exceptional claims. I'll go through the article tomorrow and give you some suggestions. Thanks. Wifione ^Message 12:05, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Only one third of the references used are self published and they have been used only to support authoritative facts. Wikipedia:UNIGUIDE#Reliable_sources says self published sources are reliable sources in the case of authoritative facts. You have added the tag that self published sources are used inappropriately. Please read the article fully before judging that the references have been used inappropriately. As of now, I am removing the tag as I feel that self published sources have been used as per WP:UNIGUIDE. Please add the tag if you feel otherwise after reading the article fully. --Anbu121 (talk me) 13:43, 22 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the reply Anbu. Pagalguy.com, Indiaprwire.com, lucknow.org, indianmba.com etc are completely unreliable sources as these are not editorially acceptable. Claims about library, social infrastructure, board of governors, etc are exceptional claims completely based on self published iim Lukcnow sources. Same is the case with details within sections like "Administration". These are exceptional and should not be supported by primary sources. Add to this the fact that even statements like "Peacocks dwell on the grounds" etc sound so promotional. And a statement like this "The college is packed with regularly maintained lawns and tree lined pathways. Rooftop lawns have also been developed on the top of academic buildings." does not even have sources. Unfortunately, because you are a student of the institute, I really would like to see secondary sources for all exceptional claims. I'm again placing the tag. Please don't remove it. If you wish, you can have a week to find secondary sources. After a week, I shall proceed to remove all claims that I feel are exceptional and based purely on primary sources. But I shall not remove these claims until I've pointed them out here and given you at least a day to respond. Thanks. Wifione ^Message 06:35, 23 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Response for your concerns on

1)so called 'editorially unacceptable sources':- Please read the source before tagging it as editorially unacceptable. The Pagalguy.com reference is not an editorial source at all. The source is an interview with the director of IIM Lucknow. I have added another reference to support the same statement. Also read the sentence for which the source is used and then give a valid reason why do you think the information in the source could be wrong.

2)Self Published sources for library, board of governors, etc:- Do you expect a Times of India reporter to go to IIM Lucknow Library and count the number of books there? As I already mentioned to you, there are around 20 college/university FAs in Wikipedia and all of them are written with Self Published sources. In most of the FAs, 50% of the references are self published sources. In this article only 35% of the references are self published. Please understand that it is impossible to write an article on a college/university without self published sources. WP:UNIGUIDE says Self published sources are reliable for authoritative facts. If IIM Lucknow website says so and so is the chairman of the board of Governors, it is an authoritative fact and it has to be accepted on the face value.

3)Promotional sounding peacock statement:- I didn't included this statement. An IP did. I have changed it now.

4)Lawns and Trees:- I have included references for them.

--Anbu121 (talk me) 14:24, 8 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Indian Institute of Management Lucknow/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: TheSpecialUser (talk · contribs) 15:30, 20 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Happy to help. TheSpecialUser ^TSU 15:30, 20 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I will be available anytime to respond. --Anbu121 (talk me) 14:16, 25 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Right now, I'm in a hospital (broken leg) so I fear that I won't have more access but will try my best to give the review by tonight. TheSpecialUser ^TSU 02:19, 26 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have addressed some of the points. The institute is going to publish a book in a few days. Will expand the article and address the lack of refs once I get the book. --Anbu121 (talk me) 18:14, 28 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

When you address the issues, please add {{done}} at the end of the line to keep a track or just ~~strike the line which is addressed~~ as I'm unable to know what has been done exactly. TheSpecialUser ^TSU 01:33, 29 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Review

Since you've linked Indian Institute of Management in the lead, please remove the See also section Done
Per WP:LEAD, the lead of the article should summarize the article which it doesn't right now. Please expand it and at least make it of 2 good paras, each of 4 or 5 lines Done
Images need WP:ALT Done
Captions such are too small in the article. Per WP:CAPTION, please expand them Done
In Organisation, use ===stuff=== instead of ; Done
Same as above with Post graduate education. Done
This doesn't look much reliable. Please get another one. Done
[1] remove this as it hasn't been verified by twitter Done
[2] remove this also as it is maintained by "IIM Lucknow's Media and Communication Cell, and is a student initiative" Done
Please add english translation of "सुप्रबन्धे राष्ट्र समृद्धि" in the motto Done
Add first name of J.J.Irani Done
First name of R.L.Raina? Done
A Sports Committee composed entirely of students organises most of the sporting events in the college. It selects and facilitates the institute sports team. The Intracollege sports event called as Sikander is held throughout the year in a league format. The institute sports team participates in most of the popular college sports meets including the Inter-IIM Meet (Sangharsh) held in the second week of January every year. - ref? Done
Synapse,the committee for IT and Knowledge Management conducts a plethora of events in gaming, quizzing and systems areas and handles the IIML network. - ref? Done
It is recognised as an institution of excellence by the Ministry of Human Resource Development -> It is recognised as "an institution of excellence" by the Ministry of Human Resource Development Done
which houses gymnasium, swimming pool and indoor courts for Table Tennis, Squash and Snooker. The multipurpose utility hall (Samanjasya) is used to host most of the cultural activities in the campus. Bigger Events and Music shows during fests are held in the Open air theatre situated between the academic block and Library. - ref? Done
A Central school (Kendriya Vidyalaya) was established opposite the campus as a community school. - ref? Done
which is regarded as one of the main global accredition bodies in business education. - ref? Done sentence removed
The PGP course was started in 1985-86 - fullform of PGP? Done
All the major buildings in the campus are named in Sanskrit[19] according to the functionality of the building - link sanskrit and what does "functionality of the building" mean? Done Functionality of the building means: The academic block functions for teaching, hence named as Bodhigrih.
academic blocks (Bodhigrih-I and II) - in brackets, add like this academic blocks (Sanskrit: Bodhigrih-I and II) Note:I think this kind of format is used for indic scripts. Here the script is not sanskrit, the words inside the bracket represents official name of the buildings.

According to the article, "All the major buildings in the campus are named in Sanskrit". The names are in sanskrit according to the article as well as I can re-call few of them when I read. Using a template would be a bad option as we do not need sanskrit script. So adding (Sanskrit: ***) would be appropriate as a non-Indian or non-Asian reader might get a bit confused. TheSpecialUser ^TSU 22:56, 10 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

As said in the above bullet, make changes at other places where sanskrit script is written in brackets Note:same as above.
office and FPM classrooms - FPM? fullform? Done
The institute has an incubation centre for supporting the entrepreneurial ventures of its students and alumni - POV. please neutralize Note: I am not sure how to neutralize this. I have added a ref to strengthen it. Please neutralize if you can.
the ABM course - ABM? fullform? Done
Sometimes you've italiced in the brackets and sometimes not. Please be consistent and use italic form Done
The campus which was started in barren lands has been converted into a thriving ecosystem with the plantation of trees - please neutralize Done
The campus consists of Peacocks, monitor lizards, porcupines and a variety of other birds - what? do they even store birds in campus? zoo (=P)? no need of this sentence. or make it look like its an encyclopedic entry. Done
The college is packed with open lawns and tree lined pathways - Needs to be neutralized Done
Jamshed J Irani -> Jamshed J. Irani Done
10 industrialists, 4 Government representatives and 3 -> if the number is below 10, it is written like "nine" per MoS. So change 4 to four and 3 to three Done
The Director of IIM Lucknow, the head of the institution, is appointed by the Ministry of Human Resource Development. The institute has separate deans for Academic affairs and Planning and development. - ref? Done
with a Company or Organisation -> with a company or an organisation Done
3 month term in a foreign university during the period of October to December in their 2nd Year -> three month term in a foreign university during the period of October to December in their second Year Done
Make sure that you use "second" instead of "2nd" and similarly with 1st, 3rd,.... Done
International Programme in Management for Executives(IPMX) - space needed before ( Done
Space also needed before ( at; R.L.Raina(Planning & Development) and Archana Shukla(Noida) Done
IIML was ranked #5 by the Business Today 50 best business schools of 2011 -> IIML was ranked #5 by the Business Today in the list of 50 best business schools of 2011 Done
and #4 by the Hindustan Times India's top 50 business schools of 2011[55] and by the 2012 edition of CNBC-TV18's Top B-Schools in India - clarification needed. what did CNBC rate it? If it is 4, then split the whole sentence into 2. One about 5th rank and the other with two 4 ranks Done
life at IIM Lucknow is filled with academics, extracurriculars and entertainment. All the cultural programmes, competitions and management events are entirely organised by students. - ref? and needs to be neutralized a bit Done
The intranet portal Blondie has - remove italic and use "" Done
Synapse,the -> Synapse, the Done
The 3 day - 3 -> three Done
Students create games and various other simulated environments, to capture consumers’ subconscious thoughts - neutralize it please Done
A variety of opportunities exist for students to get a taste of entrepreneurship. - neutralize please! Done
Just Tea and Gossip and Bite - not italic but "" Done
The Entrepreneurship Cell conducts a competition called Bizness, - rmv italic and use "" Done
As stated above, same with Credence Capital, Aarohan, Synapse, Random Walk, and Abhivyakti Done

TheSpecialUser ^TSU 08:34, 28 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Though inactive, I'll be checking this. TheSpecialUser ^TSU 15:00, 29 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Few more fixes

ref 9 needs to be fixed (format) Done
Unreliable source Done
Unlink Playback singer per WP:OVERLINK. Since the link appears in the first line of the article for the singer, the link is of new use Done
Also see if there were people who can possibly be called "notable" but are without an article here. Adding up red links help to get the idea that which articles are we lacking in. If you can't find any other notable person (who don't have article), then no problem. Note::I couldn't find any

Good to go for GA. I'd still like to have a look for 1a criteria and will give out final issues about the prose by tonight. Cheers! TheSpecialUser ^TSU 22:56, 10 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Last run...

All students are given separate single rooms in hostels. All the hostels have internet connectivity and common TV room. -> All students are given separate single rooms in hostels with internet connectivity and common TV room. Done
Every student gets an institute email id and most of the official communication and notifications are carried out through email. -> Every student gets an institute email id through which most of the official notifications are sent as well as communication are carried out. Done
Samvit, the annual leadership summit of IIM Lucknow witnesses some of the financial leaders and economists of the country and provides opportunity for the students to interact with them. - "and provides opportunity for the students to interact with them" - need to either remove it or re-phrase it. What about -> Samvit, the annual leadership summit of IIM Lucknow witnesses some of the financial leaders and economists of the country with whom the students get opportunity to interact. Done
supporting the entrepreneurial ventures of its students and alumni - "ventures" sound odd. can you suggest any other word instead of it? + this sentence is repeated. Please make sure that it doesn't occur. Done
A variety of entrepreneurial opportunities exist in the institute for the students. - "A variety" -> "Many" Done
are sold to the next batch every year - what do you mean by "the next batch"? Note: : Actually, the restaurants are owned by a group of students. When the students pass out, they sell the restaurant to a group of students in the next batch
INR 2000 -> ₹2000 Done
The mess - mess? any other word? Note::I couldn't find any substitute. 'Canteen' or 'restaurant' will completely change the meaning
Varchasva is the annual Cultural and Sports festival of IIM Lucknow. It is a three-day long event held towards the end of September every year -> Varchasva, a three-day long event held towards the end of September every year is the annual Cultural and Sports festival of IIM Lucknow. Done
Manfest is the flagship management event organized by the institute, while its sports and cultural festival is Varchasva. - it looks as if it is just kept for the mentioning. Remove it please as it breaks up the flow. How about -> Many cultural programmes, competitions and management events are held by various student as well as official committees in the institute. Done

This is it! TheSpecialUser ^TSU 21:22, 11 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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