Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Liverpool F.C. statistics and records

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by User:The Rambling Man 15:45, 10 September 2008 [1].

List of Liverpool F.C. statistics and records[edit]

previous FLC (22:08, 28 February 2008)

I feel that this list meets the criteria necessary to become a featured list, after a peer review and addressing the issues from the previous nomination. Thanks in advance for your comments. NapHit (talk) 20:42, 30 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

  • I think you mean Liverpool Football Club as the publisher, not plain Liverpool, which would imply that the city is the publisher of the websites.
Done
This is the most reliable site for Liverpool F.C. info, the content is updated regularly and all content is checked by the official Liverpool F.C. historian Eric Doig, which I think makes the site very reliable.
To determine the reliablity of the site, we need to know what sort of fact checking they do. You can establish this by showing news articles that say the site is reliable/noteworthy/etc. or you can show a page on the site that gives their rules for submissions/etc. or you can show they are backed by a media company/university/institute, or you can show that the website gives its sources and methods, or there are some other ways that would work too. It's their reputation for reliabilty that needs to be demonstrated. Please see Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2008-06-26/Dispatches for further detailed information. Ealdgyth - Talk 17:19, 2 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Does http://www.lfchistory.net/aboutus_articles_view.asp?article_Id=112 cover the above?
Works enough for me to leave this out for other reviewers to decide for themselves, hows that work? I think we're in borderline territory, and I'd rather other reviewers be able to see and decide for themselves. Ealdgyth - Talk 18:08, 2 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I think this page would account for the website's reliability. Plenty of sources named there. – PeeJay 12:14, 6 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Current ref 5 and 9, the Liverpool All-Time Greats book, needs to list the author and date of publication as well as page numbers. It also appears that the ISBN is not correct according to Google Books and World Cat.
Changed the book to a better book
  • Current ref 31 needs page numbers
Done
Otherwise sources look okay. Links checked out with the link checker tool. Ealdgyth - Talk 14:10, 31 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Adressed all your comments. Thanks NapHit (talk) 18:44, 31 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Mattythewhite (talk) 15:11, 9 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

  • "Liverpool F.C. are an" - would be better to say "Liverpool Football Club".
  • The lead says the statistics are correct as of 30 August 2008, but the most appearances table says 11 May 2008. I'd say the date should be removed from the table and stick with the one in the lead.
  • I'd consider putting this in italics, to help show that it's not a piece of information relating to the list.
  • Links are available for some Community Shields, e.g. 2001 and 2006.
  • "Ted Doig" links to "Ned Doig", so this should be pipelinked or displayed as Ned.
  • "Oldest debutant" is included, but "Youngest debutant" isn't?
Youngest player is basically youngest debutant
Of course...! Mattythewhite (talk) 20:21, 3 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Footnote [d] doesn't seem to work for me.
  • "32 seconds, against Arsenal" - full stop needed.
  • "Rush also holds" - I'd replace "Rush" with "He", there seems to be a lot of Rushs in those few sentences.
  • "Top scorers" - could be renamed "Top goalscorers" to keep consistent with the "Goalscorers" section.
  • Footnotes [c] and [d] should also be included in this table.
  • Could a few more records be included in the "International" section? Like first capped player, most World Cup appearances etc.
I would include this information but I can't find it so unless someone else can, the section will have to stay the same
This will be able to give the most World Cup appearances. Do you think the Complete Record book will include any details on internationals? Mattythewhite (talk) 19:59, 31 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Added most world cup appearances and goals and added first player to be capped by England from complete record book. NapHit (talk) 15:45, 1 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Should mention who Roger Hunt, Ian Callaghan and Gerry Byrne won the World Cup with.
  • "First manager(s)" - I'd change this to First managers, as we know the club started with two managers.
  • Firsts - "First league match"?
  • Wins - Bit more consistency needed with how the records are presented, e.g. "Record victory" then "Biggest league win" - from "Record" to "Biggest" and "victory" to "win". I'd use "Record" and "win" personally.
  • Defeats - "Heaviest" - I'd use "Record".
  • Goals - Could you include what division the team was in?
  • Attendances - no highest league attendance?
  • "Record lowest attendance" - is this in the league?

Cheers, Mattythewhite (talk) 18:28, 31 August 2008 (UTC) Thanks for the comments Matt, I've dealt with them all NapHit (talk) 19:41, 31 August 2008 (UTC) More comments Few more things I've spotted.[reply]

  • "Most overall appearances" - I'd say "Most appearances in all competitions" is more suitable.
  • "Most League appearances" - "League" doesn't need to be capitalised.
  • "Most consecutive League goals scored at Anfield:" - "League" doesn't need to be capitalised.
  • "Most first-team goals" - probably "Most goals in all competitions".
  • "Most goals in a season" - I'd probably move this after "Most European goals", its current position seems a bit strange.
  • I guess Pead doesn't have Liverpool's first international?
The first player capped for England was the first international
  • I think it would probably make more sense to move "Most World Cup appearances while a Liverpool player" and "Most World Cup goals while a Liverpool player" after "First World Cup winners" - it would make more sense to show the first appearance at a World Cup first.
  • "Dietmar Hamann, (Germany, in 2002)" - should probably do away with the parenthesis to be consistent with the rest of the list.
  • I'd probably change "a friendly" to "a friendly match" to be clearer.
  • Do you have any idea of what the club's first match was, so you could add a "First match" bit?
First match at Anfield was the first match, so changed to first match
  • Was the "First competitive match at Anfield" the club's first match in the Lancashire League? If so, I'd probably display it as that.
  • The "First League Cup match" happened before the "First European match" so should be displayed first.
  • Other lists of this type have a "European statistics" section at the bottom, so what I'd recommend you do is create a section under this title and use the Main template to link to Liverpool F.C. in Europe.
    • Ah, but I see you're well on the way with this.
Yeh but that table is going in the main article not this list, so I think the link to the article should suffice

Mattythewhite (talk) 20:27, 3 September 2008 (UTC) Cheers, Mattythewhite (talk) 20:21, 3 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Dealt with all your comments, Cheers. NapHit (talk) 14:17, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

More comments Nearly there.

  • Beside the divisions that the honours were won, I'd mention what level that was, e.g. "(level 1)".
  • Find it strange that the "UEFA Champions League record win" is included, but there's no "UEFA Champions League record defeat"?
The only reason that record is there is because it represents the biggest win in the Champions League not Liverpool's, I can remove it if you want. just think it's particularly notable that Liverpool hold the record win in the Champions League NapHit (talk) 14:21, 6 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Cool. I'd unlink it, as it seems a bit strange being the only competition wikilinked in this section. And maybe you could also add a footnote saying how it's the highest ever Champions Leauge victory, with a reference? Mattythewhite (talk) 19:39, 8 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'd shorten it down to just "Champions League" too.
  • And why only the Champions League? Why not any other competitions?
  • Wins says "Most league wins in a season" and Defeats says "Most defeats in a season". Is the latter for the league only?
  • "Highest League attendance" - "League" doesn't need to be capitalised.

Cheers, Mattythewhite (talk) 21:11, 5 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Responded to your comments, thanks Matt NapHit (talk) 14:21, 6 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

More comments Last few things.

  • I'd seperate "Intercontinental Cup and FIFA Club World Cup" into seperate sections if they were different competitions.
  • "the records for League and" - "League" doesn't need to be capitalised.
  • "First capped player for England" - I'd be tempted to just label him as being the "First capped player" and mention him appearing for England in the text beside.
  • "UEFA Champions League record win" - should be reworded "Record UEFA Champions League win" for consistency.
  • "Ever-present refers to the player playing every minute of every match in the league and cup competitions" - full stop needed.
Cheers, Mattythewhite (talk) 20:40, 8 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support It's great to finally be able to support this nomination, well done! Mattythewhite (talk) 15:11, 9 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Struway2 (talk) 15:22, 9 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

  • Fastest hat-trick: add date for consistency
  • International: for Hughes and Hamann, take out brackets and say "Laurie Hughes, for England..."
  • The dates in the transfer tables were automatically changed to U.S. format in a slightly premature implementation of changes to the date-sorting templates (you wouldn't have noticed if you have date preferences set). I've added the parameters to restore the day-month year format (while I was there, I also restored the transfer fees for Torres, Crouch and Keane to the sourced values)
  • "Longest serving" manager by matches needs a hyphen
  • Firsts: wikilink "a friendly" to something
  • Rekjavik needs a "y" after the "e"
  • Attendances: Wolves should be spelt out in full
  • Would it be helpful for the league attendances to add the division?
  • Are you sure note G is in the right place?
  • Notes: maybe repeat the reference for note E

hope this helps, cheers, Struway2 (talk) 21:08, 2 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the comments Struway, I've dealt with them all NapHit (talk) 17:26, 3 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also (and having said the same elsewhere, it wouldn't be fair not to): The club article MoS recommends including second places in an honours section, while accepting that For clubs with a large number of major trophies, it may be appropriate to omit second places. So, particularly as Liverpool F.C.#Honours does find room for runners-ups, think you ought to include them here as well. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 18:59, 5 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Done, thanks for your help NapHit (talk) 19:30, 5 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support well done, cheers, Struway2 (talk) 15:22, 9 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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