Talk:Ozone Disco fire

Paranormal

The burial grounds of many cultures are often dressed up by folklore. Tales of 'ghostly apparitons' and 'quaking earth' make millions at the box office to this day. I think advertising the idea of alleged 'paranormal sightings' does an insult to the many, different people who lost their lives that day - most of whom could probably care less for such baseless fantasy. When is comes to human tragedy, I think Wikipedia is beyond boogeymen. Instead of contributing hocus pocus to every plane crash site, or burning building we should be looking at ourselves, not unicorns. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Douglas84 (talk • contribs) 11:22, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Coordinate error

{{geodata-check}}

The coordinates need the following fixes:

• Latitude seems OK. Longitude appears to be wrong and puts the disco in the middle of a forest in Quezon Province.

Correct longitude should be approx. 121°02′09″ E

Tom Tomnteena (talk) 09:31, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

 Fixed — TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 20:01, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Paranormal sightings section removed

There having been no response to the {{citation needed}} tag since 5 Dec 2009 and having searched for the high-quality sources required for this exceptional claim, but not having found any, I have removed the section. Best regards, TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 21:00, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Requested move 20 October 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 03:27, 27 October 2022 (UTC)

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• Ozone Disco fire → 1996 Ozone Disco fire
• Study Club fire → 1929 Study Club fire
• Cocoanut Grove fire → 1942 Cocoanut Grove fire
• Karlslust dance hall fire → 1947 Karlslust dance hall fire
• Top Storey Club → 1961 Top Storey Club fire
• Club Cinq-Sept fire → 1970 Club Cinq-Sept fire
• Blue Bird Café fire → 1972 Blue Bird Café fire
• Whiskey Au Go Go fire → 1973 Whiskey Au Go Go fire
• UpStairs Lounge arson attack → 1973 UpStairs Lounge arson attack
• Summerland disaster → 1973 Summerland disaster
• Gulliver's nightclub fire → 1974 Gulliver's nightclub fire
• Puerto Rican Social Club fire → 1976 Puerto Rican Social Club fire
• Beverly Hills Supper Club fire → 1977 Beverly Hills Supper Club fire
• Denmark Place fire → 1980 Denmark Place fire
• Stardust fire → 1981 Stardust fire
• Alcalá 20 nightclub fire → 1983 Alcalá 20 nightclub fire
• Happy Land fire → 1990 Happy Land fire
• Kheyvis fire → 1993 Kheyvis fire
• Gothenburg discothèque fire → 1998 Gothenburg discothèque fire
• Volendam New Year's fire → 2001 Volendam New Year's fire
• Canecão Mineiro nightclub fire → 2001 Canecão Mineiro nightclub fire
• The Station nightclub fire → 2003 The Station nightclub fire
• República Cromañón nightclub fire → 2004 República Cromañón nightclub fire
• Wuwang Club fire → 2008 Wuwang Club fire
• Santika Club fire → 2009 Santika Club fire
• Lame Horse fire → 2009 Lame Horse fire
• Kiss nightclub fire → 2013 Kiss nightclub fire
• Colectiv nightclub fire → 2015 Colectiv nightclub fire
• Ghost Ship warehouse fire → 2016 Ghost Ship warehouse fire
• Yaoundé nightclub fire → 2022 Yaoundé nightclub fire
• Mountain B nightclub fire → 2022 Mountain B nightclub fire

– Requesting a mass move of 31 nightclub fires to include the year. The listed articles above are not in line with the naming convention WP:NCEVENTS, which asks for a year in the majority of cases. The exception, WP:NOYEAR, is only applied when in historic perspective, the event is easily described without it; sadly, nightclub fires are a reoccurring event. Adding the year would make the titles more WP:RECOGNIZABLE (would a person not expert in nightclub fires recognize each fire better or worse with the year in the title?) and WP:CONSISTENT with other events covered under NCEVENTS. Pilaz (talk) 00:26, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

I think NOYEAR handles these sufficiently well. Many of these are sufficiently well-known that they do have that historic perspective you cite above. --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 01:43, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

How was this set of articles chosen? By membership in Category:Nightclub fires and the subcategory Category:Nightclub fires started by pyrotechnics? Only 3 articles in those categories currently have the year. There are other nightclub fire articles that weren't nominated e.g. Coatzacoalcos nightclub fire and Rhythm Club fire, which I found in Category:Fire disasters involving barricaded escape routes. Most of the nominated articles have the name of a particular nightclub (Denmark Place fire and Yaoundé nightclub fire are exceptions). It doesn't seem likely that fires in a nighclub with a particular name would be a recurring event (following a fire, it isn't likely that a building would be restored to a nightclub with the same name it had before the fire). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Plantdrew (talk • contribs) 03:08, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Template: Club fires, fires subcategory. Pilaz (talk) 15:51, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose as unnecessary per WP:OVERPRECISION and WP:CONCISE and WP:NOYEAR. Adding the year will not make these more recognizable, generally, and might make them less recognizable to those who don't already know the year. And the years are not needed for disambiguation. The proposed names would all be fine as redirects, though. Station1 (talk) 07:43, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose Unnecessary. Brycehughes (talk) 15:45, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose - I reckon years should only be included if there is more than one nightclub fire with the same name as any one of these listed. e.g. if there is to be a Kiss nightclub fire in 2022 at a different place then year would be needed but not now. Iggy (Swan) (Contribs) 18:17, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose. Unnecessary disambiguation. Rreagan007 (talk) 23:09, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Comment - how about including the year in parentheses AFTER the name? (I don't know if naming conventions recommend against this?) This type of info is what I think is usually tried to be included in the "Short description" field to help users disambiguate or better find what they are looking for. ---Avatar317^(talk) 22:56, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

• Comment: I wonder if in many of these cases, the name of the club might not actually be well known, and an article title with the year combined with the city or country might better identify the topic. For example, Mountain B nightclub fire is hardly recognisable, while 2022 Chonburi nightclub fire or 2022 Thailand nightclub fire would be much better. --Paul_012 (talk) 05:40, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

  That's a point that also crossed my mind. When looking through English-language sources, I bet the WP:COMMONNAME is [Location] nightclub fire, with a few exceptions. Pilaz (talk) 12:30, 23 October 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose. WP:COMMONNAME is what determines article names. Not "consistency". Or whatever is being argued here. I personally don't understand the argument against the application of WP:NOYEAR here. (Yes, nightclub fires are depressingly common. But so are mass shootings, terror events, air accidents or similar. They are often notable in their own right and do not need to be grouped or disambiguated on the basis of year. Certainly I don't see the case for overriding WP:COMMONNAME or WP:NOYEAR in the majority of the cases listed. Including Gothenburg discothèque fire or the Stardust fire or similar...) Guliolopez (talk) 12:28, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

  WP:COMMONNAME is what determines article names. Not "consistency". is not a community-agreed policy or guideline. However, WP:AT is, and it clearly lists five WP:CRITERIA which includes consistency. COMMONNAME is a tool to determine WP:NATURALNESS, not a criterion. Pilaz (talk) 12:35, 23 October 2022 (UTC)

And yet your argument seems to be that, in the cases of the articles listed, one of the criteria (WP:CONSISTENT) should be prioritised over effectively all other criteria (WP:NATURALNESS, WP:RECOGNIZABILITY, WP:CONCISE)? To what end? To impart information in the titles themselves? To make the category easier to sort? Not swayed. I don't see the case for adding WP:OVERPRECISION to those titles. Mine remains a recommendation against large-scale renaming of all nightclub fire articles.... Guliolopez (talk) 23:36, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

• Strong support for Yaoundé nightclub fire → 2022 Yaoundé nightclub fire; Gothenburg discothèque fire → 1998 Gothenburg discothèque fire and Volendam New Year's fire → 2001 Volendam New Year's fire. Those are descriptive titles selected by Wikipedians, not any sort of common names. The point of naming conventions is to be recognizable, not the shortest possible: Volendam fire is concise and unique, yet (I hope) nobody wants to move the article there.
  Neutral for the others, since all those club names are unique and others have made a point that WP:NOYEAR may reasonably apply. (And I don't quite agree with that reasoning, but it's not a hill to die on). No such user (talk) 12:34, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
• Support for the three descriptive titles identified by No such user above, and as a general principle any other nightclub fires with descriptive titles rather than common names. Weak Support for the rest; would prefer specific arguments rather than a mass move, but if the common name argument is there but not surpassingly strong, there's little harm in adding a year IMO. SnowFire (talk) 01:25, 27 October 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.